# Daz Kaufman Ball Python film



## StuG

Just starting to watch this now on YouTube. 
It seems to have caused a bit of a stir on social media. 
literally ten mins in so far but the ‘in association with Morphmarket, Ozzy Boids etc’ makes me a little nervous. 
So far it seems like a rebuttal to the Royal Python’s are semi arboreal paper and claims so disappointing they are in very different habitat to that cited in the paper. 
Another point being of royals only climb due to the rain seems irrelevant to me-it proves they are able to climb, competent at climbing and this is behaviour that is required on an annual basis, therefore very part of its natural behaviours?


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## Malc

StuG said:


> Just starting to watch this now on YouTube.
> It seems to have caused a bit of a stir on social media.
> literally ten mins in so far but the ‘in association with Morphmarket, Ozzy Boids etc’ makes me a little nervous.
> So far it seems like a rebuttal to the Royal Python’s are semi arboreal paper and claims so disappointing they are in very different habitat to that cited in the paper.
> Another point being of royals only climb due to the rain seems irrelevant to me-it proves they are able to climb, competent at climbing and this is behaviour that is required on an annual basis, therefore very part of its natural behaviours?


Care to provide a link to the video ?


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## Malc

Think I found it - embedded links are blocked by the video creator ... lets try again video


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## colinm

If I was going to drown, I think that I would climb a tree


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## Malc

Around 12 minutes in and the guy says if a royal doesn't feed after two weeks he gives it antibiotics !!!! - I think this is going to do more harm than good !! - and a snake only goes up a tree if its being chased - FFS !!!


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## StuG

colinm said:


> If I was going to drown, I think that I would climb a tree


Me too. However if I can climb a tree when it’s raining I can climb it when it’s dry too


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## ian14

Malc said:


> Around 12 minutes in and the guy says if a royal doesn't feed after two weeks he gives it antibiotics !!!! - I think this is going to do more harm than good !! - and a snake only goes up a tree if its being chased - FFS !!!


Disgusting.


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## colinm

StuG said:


> Me too. However if I can climb a tree when it’s raining I can climb it when it’s dry


My dog climbed a tree to catch some squabs and run around with them but that didn't make her semi arboreal. She only did it to catch the squab.


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## Thrasops

I was wondering how long this would take to come up here haha. And presumably people were wondering how long until I commented 

It’s a great video but sadly a couple of the conclusions and assertions are a bit off. It seems Dav is letting his own biases run away with him a bit, even when we can _see_ a lot from the film. A few things need to be borne in mind by viewers.







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1. He went out during the dry season when females are brooding eggs. I distinctly heard the guide of 35 years say they climb trees in the wet season. Which is what they told me when I was out there in 1998 through 2002 as well. And what they reported in the recent 2021 study where the vast majority of trackers said they found them in forested - rather than farmland or savannah- areas.

Perhaps if somebody went out during the active seasons rather than the brooding seasons- and bothered to look at night rather than by day- they might see something different…

Also... much is made of the guide saying 'it is because the burrows flood' -- frankly I do not think this makes any sense at all, if the burrows flooded they would move to dry ground not up trees. It may be a factor but given we know they hunt up trees in forested areas during the wet season I think it is a bit of a stretch to just say they only climb in other places to escape flooded burrows.




2. I found the assertion that all of Ghana, Togo and Benin are “sub-Saharan savannah” a bit odd too. Especially as he has released other videos from the trip of himself in forested areas. Maybe it has changed in 20 years but I remember plenty of forest (much of it anthropogenically altered such as palm nut). That was also reported in 2021 though… as well as the finding by Luca Luiselli and Godfrey Akani that the pythons reach their highest populations in forested areas NOT savannah or anthropogenically altered areas.

Rather, trackers (especially in Ghana) tend to stick to farmland and savannah areas as they are easier to traverse and find snakes. For this reason, the economic study by Stefan Gorzula limited itself to JUST farmland. This does not mean that Royal pythons are 'only' found on farmland or grassland, just that the trackers questioned in that study hunt them there.

I will concede the vast majority of exported pythons are taken from farmland that probably have few trees though…. It’s just that they’ve adapted to this habitat better than most snakes and are easy to find there (near civilisation). This does not mean they are 'different' to the rest just that they are hardy and adaptable, precisely what makes them good pets. Before the farmland was there, the pythons were there...

Also note not all 'farmland' or anthropogenically altered land is composed of low vegetation or grassland - palm plantations are common too for example and in the 2021 study by Nigel D'Cruze, local trackers specifically stated they were finding snakes in the palm trunks.




3. Another thing I found a bit odd is that he made a lot of emphasis about measuring conditions inside the burrows but very little about the fact the first snake he found was outside a burrow, by day, basking cryptically. (I noted the snakes doing the same thing over twenty years ago as I’ve stated here many times, Stefan Broghammer also found them basking outside the burrow by day, G.S. Cansdale asserts they can often be found sunning themselves, eighty years ago. Obviously none of these observations can be called flukes and he tells us the guides said they come out for several hours in the morning and for several hours in the evening.

I am curious why he did not seem bothered about conditions at the basking spot? Perhaps UV Index and temperature at that spot would also have been useful…

He later finds a python out and about in scrub moving around. Again, he is told this is the daily norm.

I absolutely fail to see how somebody can go out and see this and then assert that sticking them in a small dark tub at constant temperature is indicative of their full habits? Even if the speculation as to _why_ they were doing it was correct (it isn't).


4. It’s irritating to see the him voicing the same notion that pythons in Nigeria or the Ivory Coast are “unique” for climbing and bird eating (presumably he was referencing one of the studies study by Luca Luiselli) yet he seems unaware of ecology studies implying the same thing in Togo, Ghana and Sudan by the likes of Fabien Aubret, Xavier Bonnet, Godfrey Akani, George Sweeney and Nigel D’Cruze.

The subject of a study on how much time the pythons spend in and out of burrows has been brought up elsewhere. It may be of interest to some that Luca Luiselli already radio tracked pythons from 2000-2005. Maybe somebody would find value in those existing results? (Hint - he found they spent 90% of their time spent in holes, but 25% of the active time spent more than a metre above ground). 10% of the time spent foraging and moving at first may sound like not that much, but you have to remember that like all snakes they are efficient animals, nobody denies they are secretive.

Just as an example. 10% of a day is 2.4 hours. Assuming the radio tracking data and the figure Dav keeps mentioning they spend in their burrows (90%) is correct - and there is no reason to say it is not, I trust the radio telemetry of a seasoned ecologist - that means that through the year the pythons would still be moving about on average 2.4 hours a day.

Which it turns out is almost EXACTLY the amount of time they were found to move around, bask, climb every day in enriched enclosures in the German study (144 minutes).

This study last year specifically tested differences in activity, welfare and behavioural traits in pythons kept in enriched enclosures as opposed to small dark tubs that also showed notable differences in welfare, these things cannot be left out of the discussion.

Again, it should also be considered that COACHWHIPS only are active around 4 hours a day and spent the rest of their time in holes too. Based on that, are saying we can rule out larger enclosures for Coachwhips to move around because they only are active for 18.75% of the day?





The rest of the video was very good especially the socioeconomic aspects. Gives the AR lobby something to think about. But one has to remember that as well made as the movie is - it is a video by a guy on holiday for three weeks that found a handful of snakes - one was basking, one was roaming outside its burrow. How many did he find in total? This is not of the same value as the concrete data we already have from field studies, some of which were carried out over two years, and it would be a shame to think some of these possibly offhand remarks (perhaps made without knowing the breadth of research out there aside from that one paper by Luca Luiselli) might be used as just another excuse not to provide a simple branch or overhead heating/ lighting for royals despite the volume of ecology research throughout their range…


Further reading:



Arboreality in Royal pythons in Nigeria and a dietary survey showing birds and arboreal mammals are regularly taken:

Luiselli, Luca, and Francesco Maria Angelici. "Sexual size dimorphism and natural history traits are correlated with intersexual dietary divergence in royal pythons (Python regius) from the rainforests of southeastern Nigeria." Italian Journal of Zoology 65.2 (1998): 183-185.


Further dietary studies of pythons in Nigeria showing birds compose the majority of the diet:

Luiselli, Luca, Godfrey C. Akani, and Dario Capizzi. "Food resource partitioning of a community of snakes in a swamp rainforest of south-eastern Nigeria." Journal of Zoology 246.2 (1998): 125-133.


Different niche preferences in Togo result in different parasite loads between males and females:

Aubret, Fabien, et al. "Sex differences in body size and ectoparasite load in the ball python, Python regius." Journal of Herpetology 39.2 (2005): 315-320.


Difference in habitat use (climbing) results in the difference in parasite loads (and radio tracking data of wild Royals):

Luiselli, Luca. "Why do males and females of Python regius differ in ectoparasite load?." Amphibia-Reptilia 27.3 (2006): 469-471.


Hunters report forest being primary snake habitat and report finding the snakes in trunks and tree boles in Togo:

D’Cruze, Neil, et al. "Searching for snakes: Ball python hunting in southern Togo, West Africa." Nature Conservation 38 (2020): 13-36.


Observations of arboreal hunting by Royal pythons in Sudan:

Cloudsley-Thompson, J. L. "Jebels by Moonlight, by Charles Sweeney. Chatto & Windus,£ 1.75." Oryx 11.2-3 (1971): 195-197


Observations of sun bathing by Royal pythons:

"West African Snakes" by G.S. Casndale.


History and Economic Impact of Python Ranching in Ghana (take very careful note of the study area and notes on the difficulties of sampling wild snakes):

Gorzula, S. et al. "Survey of the status and management of the Royal python (Python regius) in Ghana. 1997


Differences in behaviour and welfare between pythons kept in enriched enclosures vs pythons kept in tubs:

Hollandt, Tina, Markus Baur, and Anna-Caroline Wöhr. "Animal-appropriate housing of ball pythons (Python regius)—Behavior-based evaluation of two types of housing systems." Plos one 16.5 (2021): e0247082.


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## Malc

I think he covered his backside by saying nothing in nature is black and white, and a lot of these "field" studies are really just a snapshot of how things are over the period when they visited the area. As mentioned above, the time the film was recorded was during the breeding season, so naturally you are going to find female underground nesting. Whats really needed is a long term study over the complete range, and to go deep into the habitat and not a few hundred meters from the roadside. The problem is the funding for that study would be virtually impossible.

A lot of his "scientific" measurements can be taken with a pinch of salt, true ambient temperatures should be done in the international agreed format which involves a Stephenson's screen 1m off the ground, not leaving the digital thermometer on the ground in direct sunlight ! Last week when we had temperatures in mid to late 30's I took readings around the garden which averaged 55c and peaked at 64c, and my guess would be the ground temperature there would be of a similar temperature, so naturally the snake is going to be found underground in burrows and tree roots.

The video was interesting and certainly showed just how stunning and varied the "wild" royal can be. He did his best to show the difference between countries and villages where on one hand they are worshiped and protected and the other end up in a meat "murder" market.

I wonder if the thought of importing the morph found at the end of the video crossed his mind....


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## spigotbush

it wasnt the worst thing i have seen but i agree it seemed "coloured in" with his own bias and probably an attempt to not bring down the wrath of trolls from either side. a sensible person would take away that they would benefit from a fair sized viv that accounts for both a burrow and some climbing to account for natural habits. the way it was presented though seemed to put enough down to allow either side to say "see! i told you so" which is a pity. some of his other videos have been much more pointed about things in care that should be altered. probably species he is not heavily invested in though. its kind of wonky to tell people that you should provide varied environments when you have rooms full of basic racks yourself.

i find it annoying how often that the collectors information is seen as environmental data. of course they will say they are always found in burrows, because that is the best way to find them. if i was out there gathering for export i wouldnt spend my days sweeping through grass and poking through shrubs/trees. i would go out on the hotter days when it is most likely to dig out a burrow and find a snake or two. the same way herpers look underneath stuff for reptiles, you could just wait around and maybe see something move around or go look in refugia and massively increase your odds. doesnt mean grass snakes prefer a hot tin sheet and nothing else just because that is the easiest way to find them. 
not going to knock the collectors, they are just trying to earn a living. if they could earn more by walking around watching them then they would do that instead and they would probably say different things about how to find them. its not that these people have no valid observations, but someone who is out there to study the animal and its habits in all conditions would have much more valid data.


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## frogeyed

Malc said:


> Around 12 minutes in and the guy says if a royal doesn't feed after two weeks he gives it antibiotics !!!! - I think this is going to do more harm than good !! - and a snake only goes up a tree if its being chased - FFS !!!


If a snake only climbs when it's being chased, Green Mambas must be constantly harassed.


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## LiasisUK

Dav Kaufman is awful.


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## StuG

LiasisUK said:


> Dav Kaufman is awful.


Id never heard of him before-don’t know anything about his back ground or credentials


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## NickN

I watched a couple of his videos a few months ago and quickly had more than enough of the "look at me" close-up cross-eyed gurning at the camera like so many of the worst YouTubers seem to insist on doing. If I watch a video I prefer to see the subject of the video, not the creator of it.

I did give this documentary a watch as it had less of that in, and it was quite interesting but didn't really shed any light on anything that wasn't already known, I think. And given that plenty of people breed ball/royal pythons perfectly successfully I found the burrow temperature obsession a bit odd.


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## al stotton

AHH Kaufman , the guy who openly admitted he let his unique Pituophis die whilst he saved his royals🤡


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## LiasisUK

al stotton said:


> AHH Kaufman , the guy who openly admitted he let his unique Pituophis die whilst he saved his royals🤡


Oh?


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## al stotton

LiasisUK said:


> Oh?


Yep and the video seems to have disappeared , in short he had a power cut and was saying he'd lost many decades old and unique Pituophis genes. Went on to happily state he'd saved his ball pythons , I called him out in the comments and it had some thumbs up.


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## Saladmander

Where is he getting this information exactly?

As expected from how he keeps his own snakes, he was more interested in colours than behaviour, habitat, activity, diet..... anything else really.
I don't care how much "blushing" or "granite" wild snakes have in their patterns. I'd prefer to see them doing wild snake things.

Seemed like he went out with the intent to justify rack keeping and really just felt like pro import propaganda. Especially considering the video of his immediately prior to this "documentary", where he picks through piles upon piles of baby pythons for fancy colours and takes back up to 1500 of them to sell 

He doesn't care about the animals.
He cares about what he can breed and sell.


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## Malc

Saladmander said:


> where he picks through piles upon piles of baby pythons for fancy colours and takes back up to 1500 of them to sell
> 
> He doesn't care about the animals.
> He cares about what he can breed and sell.


Three listed - between $450 and $600 which is quite a punt for what may turn out to be a nice coloured normal.


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## QWERTYOP

He’s certainly quite fond of himself. He’s done a number of “how such and such animal lives in the wild - are we keeping them correctly?” type videos which I certainly find interesting as a concept. But I did go off him fairly recently when he decided to join the “YouTuber does stupid shiz for views” gang and freehandled a wild Gaboon Viper. Unbelievably reckless. Sooner or later, one of these types is going to die doing this kinda thing for views. Anyway I suppose that’s another subject for another day.


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## LiasisUK

Yes but then he shows wild animals, incorrectly identifies their species and/or gender and imagines behaviors that are 'first recorded' and 'ground-breaking' but also just completely made up or misunderstood. Nonsense.


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## Tarron

I've so far managed about 10 minutes or so of the home video. I got to the point where he was talking to the big breeder guy (You know the bit, straight after the in built advertisement for Ozzy Boids), who is totally only using captive bred animals, and couldn't get over the sheer bias on display.
"oh look, here's this big breeder in Africa that's never seen a Royal up a tree" whilst they traverse nothing but savannah and farmland, completely avoiding the vast swathes of forest and woodland that the snakes also inhabit.

I'll try and finish it, but it is quite obviously just a marketing ploy and attempt to justify their manner of care.


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## Malc

Royals never climb unless the ground is flooded..... 










(oh and look at that lovely golden colour and granulation --- maybe she's a new morph 😉 )



















Nahhh Royals don't climb .......


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## Swindinian

😂🤣😂

It doesn’t count when you are playing ‘the floor is lava’ with them Malc 😉


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## Swindinian

Not watched it yet.

Perhaps leave it to Liam


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## QWERTYOP

Swindinian said:


> Not watched it yet.
> 
> Perhaps leave it to Liam


Proper channel. No sensationalism. No BS.


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## colinm

Some say Dav looks like a young Ron Jeremy 😁


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## wilkinss77

frogeyed said:


> If a snake only climbs when it's being chased, Green Mambas must be constantly harassed.


So must boomslangs, emerald tree boas, Cuban & Amazon tree boas & green tree pythons.


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## wilkinss77

QWERTYOP said:


> He’s certainly quite fond of himself. He’s done a number of “how such and such animal lives in the wild - are we keeping them correctly?” type videos which I certainly find interesting as a concept. But I did go off him fairly recently when he decided to join the “YouTuber does stupid shiz for views” gang and freehandled a wild Gaboon Viper. Unbelievably reckless. *Sooner or later, one of these types is going to die doing this kinda thing for views. *Anyway I suppose that’s another subject for another day.


Or at very least end up on their arse & in hospital, thus wasting a bed for more deserving patients.


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## wilkinss77

Malc said:


> Royals never climb unless the ground is flooded.....
> 
> View attachment 365883
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> (oh and look at that lovely golden colour and granulation --- maybe she's a new morph 😉 )
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> Nahhh Royals don't climb .......


The first pic of a royal I ever saw was of one wrapped around the top of a 5 or 6' high tree stump in the wild.


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## Zincubus

frogeyed said:


> If a snake only climbs when it's being chased, Green Mambas must be constantly harassed.


Well my Royals all climb around the branches in their vivs in the evenings 

Does that count ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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