# any dog breeders?



## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

advice needed on pregnant bitch can any experienced dog breeders on here pm me and i`ll get back to you with my questions? thanks


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## SWsarah (Aug 6, 2005)

I breed chihuahuas (responsibly- before anyone starts) pm me


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## Pimperella (Sep 26, 2006)

I bred large breed dogs (Northern Inuit and used to breed GSD's) However I have 15 years of hands on whelping experience and have advised many others through birthing.


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## temerist (Feb 1, 2009)

been breeding dog for going on 30 years, more than happy to assist with any questions you may have.

Ian


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

hi all thanks for the response,below is the pm i sent to swsarah as she was 1st to respond.i have now put my questions below for advice from anyone else.

i am not stupid and if she needs a vet will get one in the first instance and to be honest i never really thought she had been caught so please no bitching,i just want the best advice possible for my dog!!




hi, thanks for replying, i have a pug bitch whom when i went away for the weekend and left her in what i thought was capable hands of my friend she managed to get caught by my friends japanese chin. we didn`t think anything of it as he is really old and i thought they needed to mate more than once.(duh)

anyhow she last week got a sudden tummy which seemed to come from nowhere,she is now around 8.3 weeks from date she was caught. her vulva is enlarged and she has a creamy/clear discharge. any advice?


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

the discharge is fine she is lubricating the way!!! 

if it changes to hints of blood or green or bascially anything other than clean silvery colour or gets a smell get her to a vets 

my bitch is due xmas day and is discharging already this is her 2nd litter so things happen abit faster

got your dopram ordered???

cheri


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> i am not stupid ....
> 
> i never really thought she had been caught
> 
> we didn`t think anything of it as he is really old and i thought they needed to mate more than once.


:whistling2:
:lol2::lol2::lol2:

sorry. no offence really meant. I simply couldn't resist.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

lol it only takes one time just the same as humans!!! 

really though if you want any help get posting and im sure between the breeders on here youll get a reply!!!

cheri


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

does the discharge indicate how long she has to go? i have bred cats but never dogs and my cats did not have a discharge until before giving birth so all new to me?


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fenwoman said:


> :whistling2:
> :lol2::lol2::lol2:
> 
> sorry. no offence really meant. I simply couldn't resist.


 
no i`m not stupid,i`m no dog breeder either and we all have to learn somehow eh?


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

If it's 8 weeks 3 days since matin, you'd better get your skates on,as a pregnancy lasts approx. 63 days... 

Take her to your vet to be scanned if possible and ask about cesarians, the risk of these is high in Pugs... hope you have lots of spare cash... 

Yes, everyone doe shave ot learn somewhere, but if you own an entire bitch it is your responsibility to find out how their bodies work. You risked your bitch at the mating and you are really risking her at the whelping, pugs are not abreed for the inexperienced to whelp. 

The more I read this forum, I can see why people advoicate blanket neutering. I obviously credit people with intelligence they don't possess...


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

no it doesnt indicate a time as she can do it for 10 to 14 days before 

by this stage you need to be watching her 24/7 that even means taking her in the bathroom? are you prepared if she doesnt know what to do??? 

i do a whelping service and normally when i get a bitch 7 days before her due date she will be discharging so its normal

have you got a whelping area set up and ready towels out etc???

no idea what you do or dont know as my cat did everything herself yet my dogs i do everything for when they whelp

if she wont settle in the whelping bed let her have her first pup where she wants then you move it into the area you want it she will follow her pup

cheri


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

btw just so we are clear i did have a giggle at your expence 

but expect lots of digs and people jumping on you now i got it a while back but if you need any help just keep posting right now the bitch is more important that people complaining- dont know what you plan to do next but if you ever get caught again there is a "morning after pill" for bitches

how old is she?? just wondering if shes fully grown etc?

have you wormed her since being mated or has she had any medication are you feeding her on puppy food??

cheri


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

missmoore said:


> no it doesnt indicate a time as she can do it for 10 to 14 days before
> 
> by this stage you need to be watching her 24/7 that even means taking her in the bathroom? are you prepared if she doesnt know what to do???
> 
> ...


Most bitches show discharge from about 30 days into a pregnancy, if not sooner. 

However, if she was mated 8 weeks 3 days ago, that's a big clue..


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> no i`m not stupid,i`m no dog breeder either and we all have to learn somehow eh?


 I agree. Usually I think you read a book, look at a gestation chart and mark down the date it got mated, then calculate 63 days from that date.You could have had a misalliance jab done too soon after the mating, in order to prevent the pregnancy. It's a bit like the morning after pill.
Learning like this is a bit like taking an electrician apprenticship and wanting to stick a screwdriver into a live socket hehehe.
Is your vet on standby in case of emergency? Since you really haven't a clue, how will you know when she needs help? What if a pup comes breech? How long is too long to strain? When is it time to get vet help and pay for a ceasarian? I've nothing against anyone learning but when a dog's life might be at stake, I don't think she should be the learning tool.
Is there anyone experienced near you who you can call on when it all starts?
I'd offer my services but am too far. Besides, you probably think I'm too blunt and rude to be helpful in an emergency :lol2:


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

i dont know about other breeds but ours tend to discharge about 30 days then it goes again until the week or so before they whelp

we often see the discharge in there wee and thats how we guess if they are in whelp before we go for a scan but it doesnt drop or hang from them at all when we first see it its just in wee or if they have been asleep /laying for a long time

the 2nd time a bitch has a litter it tends to come about 14 days before the due date

this is only what happens with my dogs so cant comment on small dogs or other dogs 

cheri


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

fenwoman said:


> I'd offer my services but am too far. Besides, you probably think I'm too blunt and rude to be helpful in an emergency :lol2:


lol in emergency theres nothing worse than someone trying to be nice
blunt is always best

btw good points to raise 

its surpricing how many matings take place and then people rush there dogs down to me to whelp! have to say i love every bit of it even when im paddling in yuk and placentas or a large litter from a large dog and its everywhere!!!

cheri


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

i have my vet on standby. i have a box ready for her, i have plenty money to pay for a section, i know nothing about the dog as i rescued her from a woman that wanted rid as she is not housetrained,never been walked,had claws so long they were in her pads,fed meat with nothing solid so had bad teeth til the vet sorted them, flinches whenever you move too fast,runs away from her food if you walk past her like she`s going to get hit/kicked. i have given her the best possible home and i`m so sorry i have let her get caught but accidents happen you can all mock and call me whatever i really do not care but what i care about is good genuine advice on the best thing i can do for my dog.....cheers :2thumb:


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Would help if i were closer - do you not know any breeders in your area as that would be the best advice all round?


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

midori said:


> If it's 8 weeks 3 days since matin, you'd better get your skates on,as a pregnancy lasts approx. 63 days...
> 
> Take her to your vet to be scanned if possible and ask about cesarians, the risk of these is high in Pugs... hope you have lots of spare cash...
> 
> ...


 
i`ve had her 10 weeks,rescued from bad conditions and beatings, wasn`t there when she got mated,sorry i dont possess the intelligence you require to breed my dog,really don`t care what you think of me to be honest,i want genuine breeders to help me out...that too much to ask??


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

Gemstone Dragons said:


> Would help if i were closer - do you not know any breeders in your area as that would be the best advice all round?


 
thanks for that. i know a couple of breeders whom i`ve contacted.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

ok well a box is good but can you take the top off so you can see all of her body properly

you will be able to see her back end contracting if she has been really really pushing for more than one hour get her up and moving ( walking around the kitchen in this house!) if that does nothing then get her to the vets id leave it longer but being a pug and you not being sure i wouldnt!!!

if you get a breech and its stuck you need to gently ease it up towards where the bitchs belly button would be and do this while she is having a contraction- feel her tummy and youll know when this is.

i had 4 breeches in the last litter i had all came out on there own - again a different breed though

take note of when each puppy is born and if you get a placenta from each puppy

they all need to be out when shes finished 

i give oxytocin after to clear any after births or bags left inside once the bitch has finished

dont let her eat more than 4 placentas else she will have such a runny tummy ( personal choice again!)
dont forget to talk to her lots of praise !!! 

do you have any clamps for cords??? 

do you have a whelping kit ready??? if so what have you got in it 

cheri


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> i`ve had her 10 weeks,rescued from bad conditions and beatings, wasn`t there when she got mated,sorry i dont possess the intelligence you require to breed my dog,really don`t care what you think of me to be honest,i want genuine breeders to help me out...that too much to ask??


 I think everyone is trying to help even if we are taking the mickey. Not sure if I am a genuine breeder or a fake one.:lol2: Can breeders be like watches? You can always tell a fake cos on the face it says 'Rowlecks' hehe.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

roughly how old is she??? is she fully grown???

dont worry if shes not old enough its far too late but maybe as you know when she took a c section would be better if shes very young

else they may get stuck

cheri


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fenwoman said:


> I think everyone is trying to help even if we are taking the mickey. Not sure if I am a genuine breeder or a fake one.:lol2: Can breeders be like watches? You can always tell a fake cos on the face it says 'Rowlecks' hehe.


 
i dont mind the mickey at the end of the day its my mess eh? i just dont like know it alls that know absolutely nothing about me or the dog and situation she was in before i got her, i got her while she was at the start of her season, it was impulse that i got her due to her cicumstances, i had a weekend planned away and my friend opted to take her but put her dog at her mums, i then got a text to say her dog had caught my dog, i asked if she seen it and she said no so thats why i was not sure she was caught,she said her dad had seen them. i asked why her dog was there and she said because her dad had brought him down with her and they though the 2 of them would be ok if they were watching them....they obviously did not watch close enough!!!! so this is not my doing and yes my friend has had a bollicking but what else can i do other than do the best for my bitch. so all the help is most welcome.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

missmoore said:


> roughly how old is she??? is she fully grown???
> 
> dont worry if shes not old enough its far too late but maybe as you know when she took a c section would be better if shes very young
> 
> ...


 
i was told 2.5 but i think maybe older? vet couldn`t tell due to her teeth being so bad due to bad diet. she had quite large teets before this so not sure if she`s had pups before? this dog had no lead/collar/bed/bowls etc and was put out in a small 3 fot by 3 foot concrete close for her walk,really sad.the previous owners could not get her out the door quick enough and i asked for their e-mail address so i could keep them updated which they said they`d send but i`ve not heard a thing from them even to ask how she is? they have both mine and my husbands phone numbers.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

missmoore said:


> ok well a box is good but can you take the top off so you can see all of her body properly
> 
> you will be able to see her back end contracting if she has been really really pushing for more than one hour get her up and moving ( walking around the kitchen in this house!) if that does nothing then get her to the vets id leave it longer but being a pug and you not being sure i wouldnt!!!
> 
> ...


what is recommended in my whelping kit?


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

im off to bed- georges shift with our bitch now !!!

however any help you need over the night just ring phones by my bed!!!

if you have any more questions just post them we are here to help and your right its too late to go back so now we need to help with your bitch

cheri


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Be prepared that she may not know what to do - which is where someone who knows would help as not everything can be typed for you

She may not deal with/clean the pups - Leave them a couple of seconds long enough to see if she will do it herself (better as more chance of instincts kicking in) or if you will need to break sac and clear mouth/nose asap to prevent suffocation then tie and cut cord (goes without saying sharp sterile scissors or thumb nail in saw like motion and thread) before putting placenters in a mess bag and getting pup feeding off mum asap to encourage bonding and contractions.

She may not want to go near them - you may have to sit and coax/calm her to even get her to feed the pups if she has no idea what to do and is scared, that would be straight away as well as every 2 hours from then onwards.

If she is pushing for an hour or constant pushing without the short panting break beetween contractions take her into your vet or you may lose mum and pups.

Ideally mum will birth, clean up and feed pups herself with you watching closely to help bond and prevent later probs.

You need to be sleeping besides mum from now onwards to be there when labour starts - even if she does everything herself she will want your comfort/support.

If mum needs a section it is also another possibility pups will need to be hand reared so make sure you have everything to do that yourself incase.

Like i said it is impossible to put everything down which is why having someone there who can deal through experiance with most situations that may come up is best.

Good luck


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thank you xx


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

*Whelping kit -*

Scissors - for cutting cord past thread
Thread - for tying aprox 1-2" down cord from tummy
Latex gloves - clean hands for pups and less messy 4 u
Anti bac hand gel - incase things start too quick for gloves!
Rubber bung - to suck/clear airways if needed
Flannels - 1 per pup (to avoid infection risk) to rub/dry/clean them off as they arrive
Hot water bottle - to keep pups warm if mum wont go near them/in a box while mum has the next pup
Scales - to monitor weight/growth/feeding
Old towels - to put under mum to catch as much as poss of mess
Ky jelly - incase pup gets stuck and needs lube/2 fingers to help ease it out (again hard to explain but experianced breeder will know)
Iodine - to dab cord if it bleeds lots


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

ok in mine (excuse my spellings)

sissors
cord clamps (hyperdrug) failing that strong string like what meat is tied with!!! you dont need to tie them unless its really low cut it about 5cm away from the pup

cotton wool 
dopram v
a thing to suck the gunge out of the pups throat ( cant remember its name but hyperdrug again in the whelping section)
milk and bottles
milton tablets 
rubber gloves
pen and paper to write weight, dog or bitch , time born and if you got a placenta, check they are all out by the end

ky jelly - incase a pup starts comming out without a bag around it you may need to help

plenty of hand sized towels at least 2 tea towels for each pup to dry them 

a sponge to mop the bitch up between pups if she will let you

anti bac gel for your hands 

a bin bag near by 
a phone and vets number near by 

make a space in the car with towels etc for emergency moving of the bitch

a seperate box and heat mat or lamp for the pups incase mum wont whelp laying still in bed ( they often dont and she mat squash the pups)

scales for weighing pups

also if your bitch simply delivers the puppies and wont get them out the bag do you know how and where to break the bags?? also do you know not to lift a bag with pup in if the placenta is attached as this could rip the pups belly open- dont cut the cord- crush it after the pup is breathing so where it lands is where you open the bag!!!

theres so muuch to say and to do its crazy that my minds gone blank i just do it auto!!!

also watch what she eats hopefully she will stop eating the day before she whelps to give you a clue

her temp will drop before she whelps would you take her temp every morning and night from now? do it with her laying on her side incase you do it with her standing and she tries to sit:gasp:

cheri


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

They often have a pup while trying to poo/wee in garden so let her toilet on a lead with a torch.

If she births pup and leaves it get it quick, FIRST break sac around head putting finger in mouth and wiping nose til it breaths, leave it a couple more seconds to see if mum shows interest if not life pup in 1 hand and placenter in other out of box, tie cord, then cut it, rub with a dry towel and put back with mum asap to start bonding, if mum is calm maybe get quick weight but dont have pup away from mum any longer than you can help or theres more chance of rejection.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

Gemstone Dragons said:


> You need to be sleeping besides mum from now onwards to be there when labour starts - even if she does everything herself she will want your comfort/support.
> 
> 
> Good luck


we dont sleep a week before due date she will more than likely whelp very quietly and she may be in trouble before you can help

can you do shifts with a partner??? much safer !


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thanks all its appreciated although my brains frozen now!!! she is going in with us from tonight, i am a scarily light sleeper and she snores.....LOUD!! i will hear everything and not sleep at all but she`s worth it. she is bonding with me really well and hopefully after the pups she will be more bonded to me and realise i am not like her previous monster of a an owner,we dont all hit/kick our animal if we dont like what they`re doing. all i need to do is look after her and keep my fingers crossed she is ok and of course the babies.i will keep you all updated.: victory:


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

As she births each pup make sure the 1 before is feeding off her asap, as said before its done on auto-pilot and each breeder will do it differently too so its hard to explain like 4 eg the tearing bag with pup laying where it birthed, some bitches won't do it but insist on getting in the way/wanting a cuddle when your trying to deal with a newly birthed pup so i found it easier once mum wasnt doing it to have a towel on the floor/table next to the box/mum to do this quickly and put back.

Everything must be ready and close to hand plus sterilized in baby sterilizer solution.

I had baby monitors on if i was cooking dinner etc so i could hear mum/panting if she started while my back was turned and had someone sit with her if i did school run etc.

If she goes more than a week over her due date speak to the vet about making an appointment to have her checked over.


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

I was lucky, every bitch i've whelped was noisy digging their newspaper, snoring, huffing and puffing as they moved position like a beached whale few days before they started, i set up a camp bed right next to pen and set alarm to wake me every half hour from 6-7 days before due date.

I also ran temperature checks so know within 24 hours of when it would start so could stay up but that is hard to explain to someone else lol

Going off food is a sign, but some bitches eat til contractions start.

Being sick is a sign, but some bitches do throughout pregnancy and some dont at all.

Discharge is a sign but most bitches have it for week or 2 before.

They also have a show and their waters break but like us you may miss a show or she may not have 1 and her waters could break with contractions.

They pant and dig but again have braxtons and nesting at end anyway.

They often get shakes/shivers and are extra clingy - only you will know if your dogs acting a little strange.


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

poshweiller said:


> i`ve had her 10 weeks,rescued from bad conditions and beatings, wasn`t there when she got mated,sorry i dont possess the intelligence you require to breed my dog,really don`t care what you think of me to be honest,i want genuine breeders to help me out...that too much to ask??


 
I'm not suprised you don't care what I think of you... you haven't exactly 'rescued' her, have you? Pugs are notoriously bad mothers anyway, a pug that is nervous and expects beatings is far more likely to be. 

You have recieved good advice from Gemstone Dragons. However, personally, I think given your inexperience and th ebreed of the bitch, you'd be better off trying to either find a pug breeder near you to come out and help you whelp her, or a vet with experience of whelping that you can take the bitch to when she goes into labour, or even better, that will come out to you.


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Yes my first thought was get an experianced breeder of pugs/bulldogs/chi's/other c-section breed to take her for the birth or if possible not stress her anymore and come out to you when it starts (hoping theres time).

If this isn't possible and you definately know her due date i would also concider speaking to your vet about an elective c-section, it will probably be needed anyway given the breed and experiance of owner and if there is no other choice planning it is much safer than not knowing when it is needed and possibly losing pups and mum.

Start reading up because while this takes away the possible danger of a bitch that can't whelp and an owner who doesnt know if she is birthing or in trouble it starts a whole new lot of advice etc for the aftercare of both bitch and puppies, some of which the vet can give you but alot of it you will need to get reading up on.

The rest of my advice was to help the bitch should you ignore all of the above.


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Oh and realise this will be the most scary experiance of her life and you cant explain to her the outcome like in humans so if she already has experiance of being ill treated you are more likely to be bitten during her labour.


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## Myjb23 (Oct 14, 2009)

I breed labradors, and had my first pug litter this year. My bitch was from a strong, healthy line of self-whelping bitches and she did self-whelp the pups with no complications, but do understand that this is VERY rare, many pugs require caesarians and most vets I have spoken to charge around £1000 for this (and thats not out of hours!) due to the difficulty operating on pugs.

Your poor little bitch is in no way ready to have a litter of pups. Her behavioural issues alone would mean that she should not be bred. but given the fact that you have no idea of her history and have only had her 10 weeks, im sure you can understand why people are rather annoyed that you let the poor little dog get into this situation. If you "rescued" her you should have her spayed and been more responsible when she was in season. Leaving YOUR dog with someone else with an entire male (whatever the age) is stupid and irresponsible. The dog is your responsibility and you shouldnt have taken her on and then left her with someone else less than 2 weeks after having her. Poor dog...

BUT, whats done is done. If you'd come on here when the mating happened i would have recommended getting her to the vet where they could have aborted the litter - best option for everyone. 

Pugs are generally very poor mothers. I have never heard of a pug actually cleaning up pups and chewing through the cord so expect to do that yourself. My bitch was pretty good, within a few days she would voluntarily go into the whelping box to feed the babies, but most never get the hang of it so you have to, as horrible as it sounds, hold the mum down to let the puppies feed. They also dont really understand the concept of cleaning pups and stimulating them to pee/poo so you will have to do this yourself. If you're lucky, like i was, within a few days the mum may get the hang of this herself.

Do not, under ANY circumstances leave the mum alone with the pups. They need 24 hour supervision until the pups are weaned as it is very common for pug mums to kill their pups, either intentionally (i have heard of them eating pups) or accidentally. A good friend of mine lost an entire litter when she was new to breeding pugs, she was away for about 2 mins (i think just answering the phone!!) and when she came back mum was digging up the bedding - and dug through ALL the puppies in the process. They just dont have a maternal instinct.

Pugs are a man made breed and unfortunately do not have the instincts that other breeds have when it comes to raising litters. I know some people will not like that, but its just the facts and if you take on the responsibility of having a litter, as you have, then you must expect to be the main carer for the pups until they are ready to go to their new homes at 10-12 weeks.

I did get rather worried when you said the cross too btw, keeping fingers crossed here for healthy pups!! Pugs can have spinal problems which can leave them paralysed, and chins can have horrific deformities. Crossing the two is a disaster waiting to happen, but hopefully you will get lucky!!


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

midori said:


> You have recieved good advice from Gemstone Dragons. However, personally, I think given your inexperience and th ebreed of the bitch, you'd be better off trying to either find a pug breeder near you to come out and help you whelp her, or a vet with experience of whelping that you can take the bitch to when she goes into labour, or even better, that will come out to you.



I have to totally agree with this.
Things can and do go wrong, very sadly I have seen how wrong it can go with some people who havent even noticed there dog was in labour.
And I personally wouldnt risk it with such a breed as a pug. Unless you are experienced in whelping I would have an experienced person on call to be there to whelp your girl, be it vet or breeder.


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

*c section*

If she was mine I would source a vet asap who was used to delivering bulldogs.I would be taking her temperature approx 5 days before her due date and when the temp dropped I'd be on stand by.As soon as any scratching up and panting began I'd be in touch with the vet and have her there.I wouldn't be waiting to see how she gets on because of the breeds involved.Having put her in this predicament she needs the best medical assistance.I wouldn't try and free whelp her at home if she was mine.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thanks for all the advice its appreciate, i have a well established breeder of small dogs(including pugs) on standby. as for the harsh comments well read the whole thing before jumping down my throat. at the end of the day i WILL pay for her to get medical treatment if i am slightly concerned,you may think i`m some pathetic loser but what i care about is the dog and thats all not what anyone thinks of me and my situation. i could just sit back and not give a damn or maybe just hope for the best but no i seeked advice is that so wrong??? it seems that no matter what the situation there is always someone that comes along and jumps down your throat,on here its seen over and over again and i do recall quite a few people saying they would not ask for help on here again.... i do not blame them. thanks to the genuine advice it is appreciated. i will not be adding anymore to this thread as i have a few reliable people i can now pm if needed. this thread can now be closed by a mod please.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

well i wish you and pug the best of luck

were waiting for our bitch too so lets hope for 2 smooth whelps

cheri xxxx


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

missmoore said:


> well i wish you and pug the best of luck
> 
> were waiting for our bitch too so lets hope for 2 smooth whelps
> 
> cheri xxxx


 
thank you very appreciated and good luck!! xx : victory:


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## ami_j (Jan 6, 2007)

thats a shame  yet again someones been put off asking advice
yes its not the best thing to happen by a long shot but its obvious the owner cares for this little dog and that she thought the male would be away when she left her with her friend.
i hope you reconsider updates, would love to see the pups and hear how she gets on. accidents happen and your taking responsiblity...i hope all goes well


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

ami_j said:


> thats a shame  yet again someones been put off asking advice
> yes its not the best thing to happen by a long shot but its obvious the owner cares for this little dog and that she thought the male would be away when she left her with her friend.
> i hope you reconsider updates, would love to see the pups and hear how she gets on. accidents happen and your taking responsiblity...i hope all goes well


 
thank you so much. all i want is the best for her and all my animals, my animals are priority over everything in my life,my hubby says he`s going to name them on divorce papers lol my vet bills are huge but the vet loves me of course. anyway i will update you, once i know whats happening i`ll send you a wee pm for your kind words. its nice to be nice isn`t it?? :2thumb:


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

dont forget me i want pics:lol2:

best of luck keep us updated!!!


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

ami_j said:


> thats a shame  yet again someones been put off asking advice
> yes its not the best thing to happen by a long shot but its obvious the owner cares for this little dog and that she thought the male would be away when she left her with her friend.
> i hope you reconsider updates, would love to see the pups and hear how she gets on. accidents happen and your taking responsiblity...i hope all goes well


 
Can only echo this, would be lovely hear updated on how whelping goes and the pups. :flrt:


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## ami_j (Jan 6, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> thank you so much. all i want is the best for her and all my animals, my animals are priority over everything in my life,my hubby says he`s going to name them on divorce papers lol my vet bills are huge but the vet loves me of course. anyway i will update you, once i know whats happening i`ll send you a wee pm for your kind words. its nice to be nice isn`t it?? :2thumb:


awww yay  be good to hear how she gets on, and vets bills...ugh dont remind me of those horrid things :lol2:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

missmoore said:


> dont forget me i want pics:lol2:
> 
> best of luck keep us updated!!!


 
of course xx


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

LoveForLizards said:


> Can only echo this, would be lovely hear updated on how whelping goes and the pups. :flrt:


aww thank you so much, i will update you.:flrt:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

ami_j said:


> awww yay  be good to hear how she gets on, and vets bills...ugh dont remind me of those horrid things :lol2:


yeah vet bills just had a nice one well not too bad actually £150 for my horsey he was lame. but if you have pets you have to pay the vet bills.xx


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> at the end of the day i WILL pay for her to get medical treatment if i am slightly concerned,you may think i`m some pathetic loser but what i care about is the dog and thats all not what anyone thinks of me and my situation.


 
What happened to the rott you had? Last I heard you were looking to rehome him as you couldn't afford the veterinary treatment HE required.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> What happened to the rott you had? Last I heard you were looking to rehome him as you couldn't afford the veterinary treatment HE required.


 
was nothing to do with vet treatment costing money he was insured....get your facts right!! not having an argument but sheesh!! his problems were far worse than expected after seeing 3 yes THREE different vets and paying their fees. he was put to sleep by the 3rd.


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> was nothing to do with vet treatment costing money he was insured....get your facts right!! not having an argument but sheesh!! his problems were far worse than expected after seeing 3 yes THREE different vets and paying their fees. he was put to sleep by the 3rd.


:gasp::gasp: All because he needed an ear op. Oh and btw my facts are 100% right. Just remember where you tried to offload him.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> :gasp::gasp: All because he needed an ear op. Oh and btw my facts are 100% right. Just remember where you tried to offload him.


 
i got in touch with you to see if you could help as a "rottie rescue" . was not to be but never mind bite all you want.....seems you only rescue dogs that don`t need money spent on them? as is most rescues nowadays. i didn`t realise he needed more than an ear op until the 3rd vet seen him,that would be wilsons. the 2 other vets just kept treating him with more and more tablets/jags etc but he got no better. anyway not that its any of your business.


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> i got in touch with you to see if you could help as a "rottie rescue" . was not to be but never mind bite all you want.....seems you only rescue dogs that don`t need money spent on them? as is most rescues nowadays. i didn`t realise he needed more than an ear op until the 3rd vet seen him,that would be wilsons. the 2 other vets just kept treating him with more and more tablets/jags etc but he got no better. anyway not that its any of your business.


No we don't only rescue dogs that need no money spent on them. If that was the case we wouldn't vaccinate, microchip and neuter(if old enough) would we. Unfortunately we don't don't have millions of foster homes either or millions of kennels(@ £160 per month) kept free for us for when someone decides "this dog is costing me too much money" We are a small rescue that's only funding is what we raise ourselves doing tombola's, bingo teas etc. 


My boy that has loads of allergies came via the rescue. They took him on, didn't they? His temerament also wasn't the best due to be beaten but they took him on. I adopted him nearly 3 years ago and have paid for any vet bills he has and will do for as long as is needed. Recently vet discussed putting him on a treatment that would cost me £10 a day for his meds. If I have to I will pay it but then to me dogs don't come with an upper price that I am willing to pay for treatment.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> No we don't only rescue dogs that need no money spent on them. If that was the case we wouldn't vaccinate, microchip and neuter(if old enough) would we. Unfortunately we don't don't have millions of foster homes either or millions of kennels kept free for us for when someone decides "this dog is costing me too much money" We are a small rescue that's only funding is what we raise ourselves doing tombola's, bingo teas etc
> 
> 
> My boy that has loads of allergies came via the rescue. They took him on, didn't they? His temerament also wasn't the best due to be beaten but they took him on. I adopted him nearly 3 years ago and have paid for any vet bills he has and will do for as long as is needed. Recently vet discussed putting him on a treatment that would cost me £10 a day for his meds. If I have to I will pay it but then to me dogs don't come with an upper price that I am willing to pay for treatment.


 
point taken.... i paid hundreds on my boy and got to the stage of having no answers from so called vets, i thought he only had an ear problem, i asked for your help because i was at my wits end, i didn`t know who to turn to i thought a rottie rescue would know all about the breed and give me more info and help than the vets. i took him to another vet who said he had underlying problems which would not get better and the kindest thing was to put to sleep. this was the most heartbreaking thing i had to do and would not wish on anyone. but at the end of the day he was not suffering anymore that was for me and probably for him a total relief.


i never expected to offload him as you put it it was a genuine cry for help.i really do not understand why you need to air such a still upsetting time for me.but whatever, i`ve done no wrong.

merry xmas and a happy new year.....to everyone nice and harsh!!


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> i really do not understand why you need to air such a still upsetting time for me


The reason I aired it was because you said you would pay whatever your girl needed but wanted us to take your rott because you couldn't afford his treatment. I had no idea you had put him to sleep though.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> The reason I aired it was because you said you would pay whatever your girl needed but wanted us to take your rott because you couldn't afford his treatment. I had no idea you had put him to sleep though.


his ears were going to cost around £2000 which he was insured for which he then would have been deaf!! me being me couldn`t bring myself to do that to him and thought someone else could,thats why i contacted you. i`m too soft and knew i would not cope. wilsons dicovered problems with his inards and his legs which could not be cured all this on top of an operation which would make him deaf!!! whats worse is that he was the softest most gentle beast ever whom did not deserve the pain he was in.


can i also add when i had my rott i didn`t have a lot of money but due to my dad dying and leaving me some i can afford what ever treatment this wee girl needs. i also have an understanding vet who knows i have a lot of animals and allows me to pay him up if need be.


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> his ears were going to cost around £2000 which he was insured for which he then would have been deaf!! me being me couldn`t bring myself to do that to him and thought someone else could,thats why i contacted you. i`m too soft and knew i would not cope. wilsons dicovered problems with his inards and his legs which could not be cured all this on top of an operation which would make him deaf!!! whats worse is that he was the softest most gentle beast ever whom did not deserve the pain he was in.
> 
> 
> can i also add when i had my rott i didn`t have a lot of money but due to my dad dying and leaving me some i can afford what ever treatment this wee girl needs. i also have an understanding vet who knows i have a lot of animals and allows me to pay him up if need be.


Yeah I knew he was insured and you had reached the limit of your insurance. That was why we had given you other options due to your not having a lot of money. 

I seriously resent you insinuating we only take dogs that don't cost us any money though. We have just received our vet bill. It is over £3000. Our kennel bills are £160 per month per dog. We try our best to keep dogs out of the kennels but sometimes we have no choice if an emergency comes in. I foster and can't remember the last time I didn't have foster. Infact myself and the person that runs the rescue have very recently had more than one foster at a time because we have been so busy. We have an old girl, riddled with arthritis, that was dumped by her previous owner. She ended up in stray kennels so we took her on as we couldn't bear the thought of her last days being in pain and lonely in kennels. She is still with us 2 years later and has recently had an op to remove 2 of her toes. We took on a girl that had to have wart like things removed from her eyeballs. We had another dog come with a broken leg and had to have xrays every week or so to check as they recast it. That just off the top of my head. 

We maybe can't help every dog that needs us but we do the best we can. We are a small rescue run by volunteers. Just because we couldn't take Jay doesn't give you the right to say we only take dogs that don't cost us money


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> Yeah I knew he was insured and you had reached the limit of your insurance. That was why we had given you other options due to your not having a lot of money.
> 
> I seriously resent you insinuating we only take dogs that don't cost us any money though. We have just received our vet bill. It is over £3000. Our kennel bills are £160 per month per dog. We try our best to keep dogs out of the kennels but sometimes we have no choice if an emergency comes in. I foster and can't remember the last time I didn't have foster. Infact myself and the person that runs the rescue have very recently had more than one foster at a time because we have been so busy. We have an old girl, riddled with arthritis, that was dumped by her previous owner. She ended up in stray kennels so we took her on as we couldn't bear the thought of her last days being in pain and lonely in kennels. She is still with us 2 years later and has recently had an op to remove 2 of her toes. We took on a girl that had to have wart like things removed from her eyeballs. We had another dog come with a broken leg and had to have xrays every week or so to check as they recast it. That just off the top of my head.
> 
> We maybe can't help every dog that needs us but we do the best we can. We are a small rescue run by volunteers. Just because we couldn't take Jay doesn't give you the right to say we only take dogs that don't cost us money


ok fair enough..... as said point taken but i still think you had no right to air a very personal subject considering i was plainly asking for advice on a completely different matter? i think we`ll agree to disagree and give each other a wide berth? :2thumb:


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> ok fair enough..... as said point taken but i still think you had no right to air a very personal subject considering i was plainly asking for advice on a completely different matter? i think we`ll agree to disagree and give each other a wide berth? :2thumb:


I've said my piece now. That's it as far as I'm concerned. 



Oh and fingers crossed everything goes ok for your wee girlie. By the sounds of you it you are both likely to have a very difficult time coming up. Let us know how she does: victory:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

fuzzielady said:


> I've said my piece now. That's it as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and fingers crossed everything goes ok for your wee girlie. By the sounds of you it you are both likely to have a very difficult time coming up. Let us know how she does: victory:


 
appreciated!! fingers crossed.


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## mrsfluff (Jul 15, 2007)

Good luck with this little lady, I will keep my fingers crossed that it all goes smoothly.

Jo


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

mrfluff said:


> Good luck with this little lady, I will keep my fingers crossed that it all goes smoothly.
> 
> Jo


 
thank you very much!! means a lot.:2thumb:


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> aww thank you so much, i will update you.:flrt:


Aww awesome :flrt:


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## meanvixen (Apr 8, 2008)

good luck and keep me posted


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## Myjb23 (Oct 14, 2009)

Im sorry if you thought my post was harsh, but reality is that you have left it until whelping is imminent to wait to get advice - when it is much to late to do whats best for the bitch. The correct thing to do would have been to ask for advice as soon as you saw/found out about the mating. You may have had some harsh responses, but hopefully it will encourage people who may find themselves in this awful situation to act sooner for the welfare of their dogs. Pugs can and do (surprisingly often) die whelping and under anaesthetic and it is never something that should be undertaken without giving it a lot of thought.

I am hopeful that everything will work out for the best though. Do remember that insurance will not pay out for any treatment related to breeding so you will have to foot any bills yourself. You could end up with very few bills (general mum/pup health checks and vaccinations) or you could end up with thousands of £'s of bills, its pot luck as much as anything! Do let her try to have them naturally though as she may be fine, but at the first hint of trouble get her to a vet!

I am more than happy to discuss anything with you privately as i have been involved in pugs for several years and have experience of whelping them and, the most difficult part, raising the pups!!!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Do people not think that as the pups wont be full pug the bitch is more likely to self whelp as their heads wont be as big?? Just a thought


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## Myjb23 (Oct 14, 2009)

Shell195 said:


> Do people not think that as the pups wont be full pug the bitch is more likely to self whelp as their heads wont be as big?? Just a thought


Yes, its possible. But chins have a similar shaped head to pugs with very little muzzle so they could well come out looking very pug-like.


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

And have double the problems in all aspects being part 2 diff breeds.


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

Good luck and I hope everything goes smoothly.

Part of me does wonder how handy it is that she accidentally mated with another pedigree just in time for Christmas, though.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

LisaLQ;527802
Part of me does wonder how handy it is that she accidentally mated with another pedigree just in time for Christmas said:


> you cant make a bitch come in saeson at a cirtain time though??? (well you can but lets not go there lol)


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## ami_j (Jan 6, 2007)

missmoore said:


> you cant make a bitch come in saeson at a cirtain time though??? (well you can but lets not go there lol)


and the pups wont be ready til wellll after christmas..


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

missmoore said:


> you cant make a bitch come in saeson at a cirtain time though??? (well you can but lets not go there lol)


Of course not. But you could "visit" your friend and have an "accident" once she was in season.

Not saying that is the case but surely after owning a couple of dogs you know how important it is to neuter and keep them away from other entire dogs...:bash:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

LisaLQ said:


> Of course not. But you could "visit" your friend and have an "accident" once she was in season.
> 
> Not saying that is the case but surely after owning a couple of dogs you know how important it is to neuter and keep them away from other entire dogs...:bash:


 
read the whole thread before jumping on me please. i fully understand how hard it is to home puppies/kittens to "decent" people and how much harder it is at xmas and the fact we are in a recession and people are actually getting rid of there pets to save money. the pups will stay with me for as long as they need to find genuine people..... i may find myself with a lot more dogs than i first thought but hey.... my mistake isn`t it? so up to me to sort it, no one else.


as for thinking it was planned...........give me a break!! i`ve made a mistake and i`m paying for it,so if anyone else feels the urge to have a go at me then nows your chance!! kick me when i`m down and all that eh??:whip:


oh and i will add that i managed to keep her and my entire male pug seperate although they live in the same house, so if i wanted money i would have went for the whole pug would i not????


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> read the whole thread before jumping on me please. i fully understand how hard it is to home puppies/kittens to "decent" people and how much harder it is at xmas and the fact we are in a recession and people are actually getting rid of there pets to save money. the pups will stay with me for as long as they need to find genuine people..... i may find myself with a lot more dogs than i first thought but hey.... my mistake isn`t it? so up to me to sort it, no one else.
> 
> 
> as for thinking it was planned...........give me a break!! i`ve made a mistake and i`m paying for it,so if anyone else feels the urge to have a go at me then nows your chance!! kick me when i`m down and all that eh??:whip:


 
 hun accidents happen dont beat yourself up about it 

you have had some fantastic advice from people on here and some less fantastic too 

Just look forward to the fact your gonna be a granny


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

Emmaj said:


> hun accidents happen dont beat yourself up about it
> 
> you have had some fantastic advice from people on here and some less fantastic too
> 
> Just look forward to the fact your gonna be a granny


 
cheers hun, i have a pretty thick skin and not much phazes me but it does start to get you down when people who do not know me feel they have the right to judge me. i asked for advice i`ve had some great advice, but at the end of the day we ALL make mistakes and we learn from them.

kind words at a worrying time for me helps though, thank you its appreciated. xx


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## mrsfluff (Jul 15, 2007)

Emmaj said:


> hun accidents happen dont beat yourself up about it
> 
> you have had some fantastic advice from people on here and some less fantastic too
> 
> *Just look forward to the fact your gonna be a granny *


Ooh Emma, you've such a way with words :Na_Na_Na_Na: Though I'm sure sleepless nights on puppy duty will turn a girl grey :lol2:

Jo


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> cheers hun, i have a pretty thick skin and not much phazes me but it does start to get you down when people who do not know me feel they have the right to judge me. i asked for advice i`ve had some great advice, but at the end of the day we ALL make mistakes and we learn from them.
> 
> kind words at a worrying time for me helps though, thank you its appreciated. xx


just look forward to whats to come hun and bloomin well enjoy it when they arrive:2thumb:



mrfluff said:


> Ooh Emma, you've such a way with words :Na_Na_Na_Na: Though I'm sure sleepless nights on puppy duty will turn a girl grey :lol2:
> 
> Jo


hee hee jo i didnt mean it in an old granny way i ment in the trendy cool granny way :2thumb:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

lol :2thumb:


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> lol :2thumb:


yay you did a lol so you must have smiled then too:2thumb::lol2:


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## mrsfluff (Jul 15, 2007)

Perhaps we can get a group discount on a purple rinse : victory: :lol2:

Jo


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

mrfluff said:


> Perhaps we can get a group discount on a purple rinse : victory: :lol2:
> 
> Jo


Oooooo can we opt dark please i likes the dark purple :2thumb::lol2:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

i prefer blue :whistling2:


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> i prefer blue :whistling2:


 
Oooo we could add some pink in too :2thumb::lol2:


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## meanvixen (Apr 8, 2008)

how's the little girl doing today, hope everything is well


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

*puppies*

Wonder what they will look like,fluffy pugs ,smoothe chins?I hope it goes well,I bet the babies will be beautiful.


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

poshweiller said:


> read the whole thread before jumping on me please. i fully understand how hard it is to home puppies/kittens to "decent" people and how much harder it is at xmas and the fact we are in a recession and people are actually getting rid of there pets to save money. the pups will stay with me for as long as they need to find genuine people..... i may find myself with a lot more dogs than i first thought but hey.... my mistake isn`t it? so up to me to sort it, no one else.
> 
> 
> as for thinking it was planned...........give me a break!! i`ve made a mistake and i`m paying for it,so if anyone else feels the urge to have a go at me then nows your chance!! kick me when i`m down and all that eh??:whip:
> ...


I did read the whole thread, and it's just one possibility I wondered about - I didn't say it WAS the case, just how it would look to those of us who care very much about responsible ownership, spaying and neutering.

I dont know how you manage two entire opposite sex dogs in the same house, and can only recommend that as soon as it is safe you get one or both neutered for their own safety.

Good luck with the pups, I'm sure they'll be lovely, hope there are no problems and mum makes it through the pregnancy and birth.


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

LisaLQ said:


> I did read the whole thread, and it's just one possibility I wondered about - I didn't say it WAS the case, just how it would look to those of us who care very much about responsible ownership, spaying and neutering.
> 
> I dont know how you manage two entire opposite sex dogs in the same house, and can only recommend that as soon as it is safe you get one or both neutered for their own safety.
> 
> Good luck with the pups, I'm sure they'll be lovely, hope there are no problems and mum makes it through the pregnancy and birth.


 
lisa I dont think she owns the male, the male elderly dog belonged to a friend her dogs where staying with the friend when the accident happened, thats how i have read it


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Emma, the OP said in a post yesterday that she had an entire male pug at home and she'd managed them both when her bitch had had seasons.

I've been following this whole thread since it started, but haven't contributed, because everything the OP _needed_ to know to help her whelp this bitch has been given to her - the rest is just the usual bitching which I've no wish to join in.

I just hope that the whelping goes OK for both the OP and the bitch. If it goes wrong I think the OP will be be upset enough having to deal with that without everything that has been said on here to make her feel worse.


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

feorag said:


> Emma, the OP said in a post yesterday that she had an entire male pug at home and she'd managed them both when her bitch had had seasons.
> 
> I've been following this whole thread since it started, but haven't contributed, because everything the OP _needed_ to know to help her whelp this bitch has been given to her - the rest is just the usual bitching which I've no wish to join in.
> 
> I just hope that the whelping goes OK for both the OP and the bitch. If it goes wrong I think the OP will be be upset enough having to deal with that without everything that has been said on here to make her feel worse.


 
ahhh okies i missed that bit eileen must have been reading with my eyes closed :blush::lol2:

I apologise lisa, you were right :lol2:

i agree eileen i think the O/P has had enough mud slung at her she knows she made a mistake and has all the worry of hoping her bitch is ok........so nopes i dont think she needs anymore shizer thrown at her


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

*mixed sexes*



LisaLQ said:


> I did read the whole thread, and it's just one possibility I wondered about - I didn't say it WAS the case, just how it would look to those of us who care very much about responsible ownership, spaying and neutering.
> 
> I dont know how you manage two entire opposite sex dogs in the same house, .


I agree with you on the neutering of pets but if you show them then you don't neuter usually and its not as difficult as you might think keeping entire dogs apart.Its only for a few weeks a year.Our dog who is not the father of our puppies howls all night for around 4 days and then settles albeit with a long face.Child gates keep everyone apart for the crucial fertile time.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

feorag said:


> Emma, the OP said in a post yesterday that she had an entire male pug at home and she'd managed them both when her bitch had had seasons.
> 
> I've been following this whole thread since it started, but haven't contributed, because everything the OP _needed_ to know to help her whelp this bitch has been given to her - the rest is just the usual bitching which I've no wish to join in.
> 
> I just hope that the whelping goes OK for both the OP and the bitch. If it goes wrong I think the OP will be be upset enough having to deal with that without everything that has been said on here to make her feel worse.


 
thanks for that. i must add though that this was her first season with me, i kept her and my male pug apart and my friend promised she would keep her male dog at her mums while i was away for a weekend i could not get out of, her dad then brought her dog down to her house with him,he then allowed the dogs together in the garden which is when she has been caught. yes i had only had her just over a week but i had no option to go that weekend as it was for a funeral 5 hours drive away.

i am all for neutering animals and my male pug is due for neutering in january as he is only 18 months old and i was adviced to allow him to "mature" before neutering.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Things like that happen and sometimes it's a well meaning relative who causes the problem. I know a friend of mine had kept her cat as a housecat, when her mum came to stay and decided that in her opinion it was cruel to keep a cat indoors and so she let her out! The cat was killed on the road outside the house!! No-one blamed my friend - it was out of her control. 

Just as what happened to your dog was. You trusted your friend and it went wrong, but by the sounds of it it wasn't even your friend who made the fatal mistake!


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

feorag said:


> Things like that happen and sometimes it's a well meaning relative who causes the problem. I know a friend of mine had kept her cat as a housecat, when her mum came to stay and decided that in her opinion it was cruel to keep a cat indoors and so she let her out! The cat was killed on the road outside the house!! No-one blamed my friend - it was out of her control.
> 
> Just as what happened to your dog was. You trusted your friend and it went wrong, but by the sounds of it it wasn't even your friend who made the fatal mistake!


 
yeah well my friend has been phoning and popping in regularly to check she is ok,she is like me very worried. my bitch has had a bit of brown discharge and a little clear water coming from her today and is tucked up in my nice warm bedroom with full birthing kit and phone on standby.

i`ve only popped downstairs for a break(daughter on duty lol) and am heading back up. will update you as soon as something happens xx


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Fingers crossed that she's OK and hope to have some good news soon then!


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

How is she?


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

im wondering how she is aswell:flrt:

cheri xxxxx


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

No news all morning would impy a sleepless night was had so fingers crossed this end : victory:


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

Oooo yeps fingers and paws crossed here too 


hope she is okies :flrt:


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

Hope everything is ok. Hopefully there will be news soon


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

*puppies*

Have they arrived?


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

water like fluid yesterday and she started pushing around 6am this morning she is only pushing every 30-40 minutes and is sleeping in between with no signs of distress so fingers crossed it will be soon as i`ve not slept the last 3 nights with worry.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

if she was mine and has had her waters broke that long then i would get her up and about to help move things along - i walk mine around the kitchen etc

call your vet and let him know that she is near to whelping just so he knows 

wishing you the very best of luck with it all and hope your bitch comes out of it well 

all fingers crossed here for you - dont leave it too long with out a update:lol2:

cheri


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

poshweiller said:


> i`ve not slept the last 3 nights with worry.


id get someone to drop you off some redbull youll be needing it over the next few WEEKS 

if shes huffing and puffing turn on your heat lamp if you havent already and tuck a towel in your trousers so you alwys have at least one to hand!!!:2thumb:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

missmoore said:


> id get someone to drop you off some redbull youll be needing it over the next few WEEKS
> 
> if shes huffing and puffing turn on your heat lamp if you havent already and tuck a towel in your trousers so you alwys have at least one to hand!!!:2thumb:


 
she`s not doing anything just sleeping peacefully without a care in the world.....me i`m demented lol. will update you. she`s not too happy about moving so think not far away.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

dont worry im demented too- ive been waiting for puppies for 3 days now still nothing but lots of huffing!!!

redbull in the fridge
coffee machine on!!!

towel on my shoulder

towel in my belt 

pile of towels in every room 

and matchsticks holding my eyes open!!! 

going from sleepy to wide awake every so often!!!

really hope she does it herself 

get the camera ready youll regret it if you have no piccys after 

cheri


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

*inertia*

bare in mind if their is only one or two pups and because of the breed no more pushing may occur and pups could get into trouble.I'm sure that won't be the case and all will work out.Really looking forward to pics of the babies and hoping you don't need the vet on a Sunday.I had to take my in whelp bitch last Saturday night late.Big bill but all turned out well,hope yours does.


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## brittone05 (Sep 29, 2006)

This forum never ceases to amaze me with the wild accusations and bitchfesting that goes on when someone asks for advice following something beyond thier control!

Posh - do keep us updated on the progress, I hope all goes well with your bitch and that the pups arrive safely and as stress free as possible


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I'm checking in all the time too - just hoping it all goes well for you and the bitch! :2thumb:


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## Schip (Mar 31, 2007)

brittone05 said:


> This forum never ceases to amaze me with the wild accusations and bitchfesting that goes on when someone asks for advice following something beyond thier control!
> 
> Posh - do keep us updated on the progress, I hope all goes well with your bitch and that the pups arrive safely and as stress free as possible


Mismating jab is available from any vets up to day 42 with little risk of pyo unlike the older versions and a full spay can be done anytime to prevent unwanted puppies in a pet bitch who is not for breeding. 

There are always options and human controls in such circumstances, its what you are prepared to do for your animals safety, both pugs and Chins have domed heads I hope all goes well for this bitches sake.


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## brittone05 (Sep 29, 2006)

The OP left the bitch with someone who she deemed responsible - surely that is a situation beyond her control as she wasn't there but attending a funeral.

She is obviously distressed by what has happened and has made it perfectly clear that she will anything within her power to ensure the bitch and the imminent pups receive the best care both veterinarian and personal from herself. 

There is no other issue really - nobody is perfect nor beyond reproach for making a mistake at some point. Difference between Posh and most though is she is willing to put her neck on the line to get the best advice and support she can. That deserves a little respect IMO and I reckon you should all cut her some slack!


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

agree with above- these things shouldnt happen but do! the main thing is the bitch gets through this without too much problems and that her poor owner doesnt go mad in the mean time:lol2:

am still checking in every so often cant wait to hear how its going even thorugh ive got my own pups on the way a happy ending is always nice 

cheri


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Has she been pushing every 20 minutes sinse 6am or just her tummy contracting?
Bare in mind if it is pushing/straining they are lower down in the birth canal (where they would get stuck if they do) so short rests inbeetween would be ok but too much of this without any progression COULD indicate bitch getting too tired to whelp or puppies having trouble coming out any further - again hard to tell without seeing the bitch or having an idea of the difference.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Any news ??????


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

Shell195 said:


> Any news ??????


what shell has asked :flrt::flrt:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I've been following this thread too and dying to know if there's any news and whether she and the pups are ok. Fingers crossed everything is going ok


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

no news all day!

i really hope thats because your busy with mum and pups!!!

cheri


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## brittone05 (Sep 29, 2006)

Agreed - everything going ok Posh xx


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

eeeeeeks 

come on posh we need updates :flrt::flrt:

hope everything is ok with your lil gurl :2thumb:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

well sad news!! no puppies just an infection(starts with p?) so she is in the vets from early hours of this morning and is being neutered. she is doing well though.thanks to all for your help and all that matters is she is ok.:2thumb:


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> well sad news!! no puppies just an infection(starts with p?) so she is in the vets from early hours of this morning and is being neutered. she is doing well though.thanks to all for your help and all that matters is she is ok.:2thumb:


Pyometra?

Hope she gets better soon. :flrt:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Poor girl, I hope she gets well soon


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## bosshogg (Nov 19, 2006)

was just going to post has she been checked for phantome and pyro ... hope she pulls through


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> well sad news!! no puppies just an infection(starts with p?) so she is in the vets from early hours of this morning and is being neutered. she is doing well though.thanks to all for your help and all that matters is she is ok.:2thumb:


 awww hun 

sending healing thoughts to help her through 

hope she is well and home with you soon :flrt::flrt:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thanks all. she is on antibiotics and is being kept in overnight for neutering first thing. vet says she is very comfortable but then she was not acting distressed here or she`d have been to the vets sooner. the vet has said that this can go away but reaccur? just wondering if thats why the previous owners were so keen to get rid? poor wee thing.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

bosshogg said:


> was just going to post has she been checked for phantome and pyro ... hope she pulls through


she has been scanned and x-rayed no puppies.thanks


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> thanks all. she is on antibiotics and is being kept in overnight for neutering first thing. vet says she is very comfortable but then she was not acting distressed here or she`d have been to the vets sooner. the vet has said that this can go away but reaccur? just wondering if thats why the previous owners were so keen to get rid? poor wee thing.


 
a sad thing to think hun but its possibly true.........the real reason for rehoming her 


im so sorry as i know even though it was thought to be an accident how looking forward to have lil bubs 

at least your vets is now aware of this problem and im sure you will both know what to look out for in the future to get it sorted 

wishing you the best of luck with her hun


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Yes if i bitch gets Pyo she is likely to get it again on her next season which is why most vets spay - no more seasons/risk.

Pyo can show little/no signs and kill a bitch which is why if a pet isn't intended for breeding it is recomended their spayed as every season they have is a risk.

Glad she is ok, you now don't have that worry every 6 months and hope she is back to her usual self soon :2thumb:


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thanks all..... i deffo am not put on earth to breed dogs lol that was the most stressful worrying time i`ve ever had, i have had no sleep i feel like a zombie, but worst of all NO ALCOHOL i`m going cold turkey as i wouldn`t touch a drop in case she needed whisked to a vet lol nothing nicer after a hectic day than a nice glass of rose :whistling2:


she now has a forever home where she wont have any worrys other than when her next meal/walk and cuddle is.: victory:


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> thanks all..... i deffo am not put on earth to breed dogs lol that was the most stressful worrying time i`ve ever had, i have had no sleep i feel like a zombie, but worst of all NO ALCOHOL i`m going cold turkey as i wouldn`t touch a drop in case she needed whisked to a vet lol nothing nicer after a hectic day than a nice glass of rose :whistling2:
> 
> 
> *she now has a forever home where she wont have any worrys other than when her next meal/walk and cuddle is*.: victory:


 
:flrt::flrt:she is a lucky pupa dog


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

So sorry to hear the news! :sad:

However, you've both been lucky that it was an open pyo - had it been a closed one she could easily have died by the time you realised she was ill.

Neutering definitely is the best option for her and I'm glad you're having it done.

She'll soon be home safe and sound and that's what matters!


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

Sorry to hear she has pyometra. 

The good news is that if she is spayed, there is next to no chance of it coming back, as it is a womb infection (a very serious one) and so when she is spayed the womb is removed. The only way it can come oback is if the vet leaves a piece of uterine tissue behind during the spay, but that's not very likely at all and pyo in spayed bitches is very rare. 

I'm glad she can have a happy life now being a much loved pet. Best of luck with her. 

As a sligth aside, a book you might want to invest in, is 'Book Of The Bitch' by Evans and White. It tells you all you need to know about a bitch and their reproductive system, and will explain a bit more to you about the pyo and bitches behaviours compared with dogs. It's a good book to have, and one I give to all puppy buyers who are having bitches, as a suprisingly large amoutn of bitch owners have never heard of things like pyometra.


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## kerrie (May 29, 2006)

midori said:


> Sorry to hear she has pyometra.
> 
> The only way it can come oback is if the vet leaves a piece of uterine tissue behind during the spay, but that's not very likely at all and pyo in spayed bitches is very rare.


thats what happened to my german shepherd bitch 11 years ago


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> thanks all. she is on antibiotics and is being kept in overnight for neutering first thing. vet says she is very comfortable but then she was not acting distressed here or she`d have been to the vets sooner. the vet has said that this can go away but reaccur? just wondering if thats why the previous owners were so keen to get rid? poor wee thing.


 You were lucky. Pyometra can kill in 24 hours. Often there is no sign at all other than something isn't quite right. A standard poodle many years ago didn't go to the door to collect the post as she did every morning. That was enough of a sign for me. She was at the vet that afternoon and had a raging closed pyo'. Had I not thought it was odd that she didn't fetch the post which she considered her job, and couldn't have cared less that one of the other dogs did it, I'd not have realised something was wrong as she ate, drank and acted otherwise normal.
She too was spayed to stop it ever happening again.
Glad you caught your girl in time though and although it's a disappointment, it is probably for the best that she wasn't pregnant.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thanks to all the people who sent kind comments....the vet has phoned and once they opened her discovered she was riddled with cancer,she has now been put to sleep! all i can hope for is that we gave her a loving better life in the past few weeks than she had had before. she was a happy wee thing and i`m gutted!!!


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

poshweiller said:


> thanks to all the people who sent kind comments....the vet has phoned and once they opened her discovered she was riddled with cancer,she has now been put to sleep! all i can hope for is that we gave her a loving better life in the past few weeks than she had had before. she was a happy wee thing and i`m gutted!!!


Oh noo that's awful  so sorry to hear. 
Well done for giving her a good life and humane ending. :flrt:

RIP little girl. x


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## mrsfluff (Jul 15, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> thanks to all the people who sent kind comments....the vet has phoned and once they opened her discovered she was riddled with cancer,she has now been put to sleep! all i can hope for is that we gave her a loving better life in the past few weeks than she had had before. she was a happy wee thing and i`m gutted!!!


OMG, how awful! I'm so glad she had those happy weeks with you. Sending Hugs xx

Jo


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

such a sad ending, so sorry at least she is at peace and had a happy last few weeks with you 

cheri


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I am so very, very sorry to hear this!

Poor, poor dog, but at least she knew love for a short time before she died and for that you should be grateful!

You must be so gutted! :grouphug:


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## bosshogg (Nov 19, 2006)

i echo everyone else i am so sorry  RIP little one


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

thank you all,i`m in a daze....!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

That is so sad, Im very sorry for your loss.
Unexpected deaths are the hardest to accept
RIP little girl


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## fuzzielady (May 19, 2008)

Poor wee girlie. If nothing else at least you gave her a short time of her not being kicked etc




RIP Kahla


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

oh that is dreadful. Riddled with cancer at only 2 and a half years old? She must have had it a while too. Poor little girl. So sorry.


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## poshweiller (Nov 17, 2006)

she had a large tumour on her lady parts which was also around her bowels and bladder. they could not treat her as the bowels and bladder would have been affected leading to a life of incontinence. they obviously did not know this until they opened her to be spayed. she will be missed as she was a happy wee thing and my alfie loved her.


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## natasha (Oct 18, 2009)

very very sorry to hear this

rip precious girl


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## Jacs (Jun 7, 2009)

im sorry for your loss you must be devistated 
just remember the time she was with you she was shown what real love is, and im sure she was so greatful to you for caring so much. im sending lots of big hugs your way.

R.I.P. little girl.


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## spirit975 (May 15, 2007)

Aww bless, am really sorry to hear this for such a young girl. I'm surprised the tumours weren't noticed on the scans or x-rays though.
RIP little one.


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## diamondlil (May 7, 2008)

What a sad ending, I'm so asorry. At least she knew love and comfort in the time she spent with you


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## Emmaj (Dec 3, 2007)

poshweiller said:


> thanks to all the people who sent kind comments....the vet has phoned and once they opened her discovered she was riddled with cancer,she has now been put to sleep! all i can hope for is that we gave her a loving better life in the past few weeks than she had had before. she was a happy wee thing and i`m gutted!!!


 
Oh my word  (((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))) to you 

i am so sorry hun 

of course she knew you saw her cry out for help and did something about it hun 

she will never forget you 

RIP lil one


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

RIP little lady x


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## sophs87 (Jan 25, 2009)

O no! poor baby, RIP pup xxx


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