# clear belly on amel



## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

i have an adult amel corn that has a clear belly, i've never seen this before..
anyone know if it means anything?

Emma x


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

Is it a motley? or are the belly checkers still present but more of a ghost look?( ghostly looking checks, rather than the morph ghost lol)


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

shes a normal amel, no chequers. ill try and post a pic in a sec


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

just had a look and there is some orange on the belly, just no chequers.


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

anyone know if this means something? or is this just normal?

Emma x


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## Esarosa (Jul 13, 2007)

When i was trying to get my Heinz 57 corn Tanis ID'd somebody said that the bleeding effect she has on her stomach...sort of like whatyours has, could mean she's 'het for bloodred' now how accurate that is I aint a clue. Just what i got told :?

Anyways hope Jay comes back soon, or some other corny guru!


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## Furrag (Oct 11, 2007)

I'll hazard a guess that it may have something to do with the Diffused trait? All snakes I've seen which have a plain or blotched belly all have the diffused /bloodred trait.


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

could be interesting then.. just trying to decide what to breed her to! any ideas?


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

I Forgot about this thread:lol2:, my honest opinion is it looks like a creamsicle(or similar hybrid), do you have any pics from above?

it looks like itsgot that creamsicle chunkyness to it, especially the head


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## Esarosa (Jul 13, 2007)

oh noo its gonna be one of those 'could be creamsicle , could be amel' jobbies...ahh i'm having flashbacks already 

Jay i got told creamsicles still have the checkers on their stomachs.is this not true then??


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

lol it just gets worse! been trying not to get any crosses, i prefer the pure corns myself!

i'm off home in about an hour and i'll get some pics. Hope she is pure corn!

Emma x


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

Katiexx said:


> oh noo its gonna be one of those 'could be creamsicle , could be amel' jobbies...ahh i'm having flashbacks already
> 
> Jay i got told creamsicles still have the checkers on their stomachs.is this not true then??


 
well ive seen them with and without, its so hard with amels too, as you say some amels you never know, and some are more obvious, cause i had some with really strong checks(well amel checks), and then some like blizzards, which has the same looking belly as a motley eg you couldn't make anything out


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

emma_fyfe said:


> lol it just gets worse! been trying not to get any crosses, i prefer the pure corns myself!
> 
> i'm off home in about an hour and i'll get some pics. Hope she is pure corn!
> 
> Emma x


 
im not saying it is hun, just thats my first gut feeling from one head pic


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

even if she is i think i'll still keep her, shes a lovely looking snake! may need to find another to pair her with though.. lol


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

emma_fyfe said:


> even if she is i think i'll still keep her, shes a lovely looking snake! may need to find another to pair her with though.. lol


 
oh definetely creamsicles(if it is one:lol2 are one of those hybrids that really work


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## sparkle (Mar 21, 2007)

look creamsicle to me.. the head and the glossiness say it all..

pure corns are a bit of a myth anyway surely..


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

sparkle said:


> look creamsicle to me.. the head and the glossiness say it all..
> 
> pure corns are a bit of a myth anyway surely..


 
explain???:lol2:


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## sparkle (Mar 21, 2007)

captaincaveman said:


> explain???:lol2:


gladly... genetically i have no actual test for pure corn blood... so i can only go on semantics and meanings of words here....


when i think of the word pure... to me it means,...


of unmixed blood 


now how far do we go back in corns... 10 years.. 20?? 30?? 40?? 50>>

500 oo:


if they cross in the wild and get mixed in captivity can we be 100% completely positive theres no hint of anything but corn... i dont think thats always possible.. we can know for sure what the breeder knows.. and maybe the one before them.. but how far back before we cant trace something and cant be sure.... at what point do we accept purity can only be proven by science and not viewpoint...


pure means total certainty.. if theres any doubt even a slimely slither.. then its not 100% therefore not pure.. 

theres a lot of debate about rat mixes unlocking genes ( white sided etc) and whilst it may or may not prove to be true how far back do you go in a hatchlings bloodline before they are PURE...

parents grandparents.. 5 , 6, 7 8 generations...

it gets silly to even think about tracing it..

so is anything 100% pure in corns nowadays...

anyway i dont like pure i like dirty LOL


:whip:


PS... i adore corns when mixed with some rat blood .....i love the chunkiness of rats and the head shape... its cheekier and more micheveous looking to me...


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## eeji (Feb 22, 2006)

het diffused???


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

sparkle said:


> gladly... genetically i have no actual test for pure corn blood... so i can only go on semantics and meanings of words here....
> 
> 
> when i think of the word pure... to me it means,...
> ...


yeah, i see what your saying, but that also applies to any other species, boas, pythons, lizards of all sorts etc etc, unless something is isolated from all other species back to single cell animals it cant be classed as pure by the same respects, 

No-one can say any animal is pure to that extent, but its all about the closeness of the crosses, eg a great plains x corn from 50 generations ago into corns for every other generation since is still a hybrid, but the characteristics would be more watered down(in most cases)

No-one on here can make a 100% guarantee that their hogg island is 100% pure, cause its not(by those standards)

Its all down to opinions on whats classed as pure, though that wording isn't probably the best term


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

heres another pic, dont know if it will help? need to know soon what she is so i can find the suitable partner for her! lol


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

to be honest, it does look like an amel there, but theres no guarantee that its not got any great plains in it, so i'd just assume it to be an male for future breeding, well i personally would


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

captaincaveman said:


> to be honest, it does look like an amel there, but theres no guarantee that its not got any great plains in it, so i'd just assume it *to be an male* for future breeding, well i personally would


thanks,

assume it to be a what?


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## SnakeBreeder (Mar 11, 2007)

It is the double of my Amel het Caramel ( butter)

As for corns mixing with other snakes, they do it often in the wild :bash:. 
Mostly with obsolita type rat snakes.
Untill recently Great Plains WAS classed as a corn.
It's only been reclassified as a seperate species recently.
So until a few year ago breeders would happily breed GP's and corns and not think they were producing a hybrid as the two interbreed in the wild.

Stephen


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## SnakeBreeder (Mar 11, 2007)

It is the double of my Amel het Caramel ( butter)

As for corns mixing with other snakes, they do it often in the wild :bash:. 
Mostly with obsolita type rat snakes.
Untill recently Great Plains WAS classed as a corn.
It's only been reclassified as a seperate species recently.
So until a few year ago breeders would happily breed GP's and corns and not think they were producing a hybrid as the two interbreed in the wild.

Stephen


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

so are we all agreed it's most probably an amel and not a creamsicle? would like to breed from her this year and just trying to decide what to put her to

Emma x


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

emma_fyfe said:


> so are we all agreed it's most probably an amel and not a creamsicle? would like to breed from her this year and just trying to decide what to put her to
> 
> Emma x


 
Thats what i was saying, to be honest you'd never know totally, but as stephen says they are closely related and looking at yours it doesn't have the most obvious creamsicle look, Its an amel either way:lol2:, so shouldn't make any difference either way to your breeding plans


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## emma_fyfe (Jan 8, 2006)

captaincaveman said:


> Thats what i was saying, to be honest you'd never know totally, but as stephen says they are closely related and looking at yours it doesn't have the most obvious creamsicle look, Its an amel either way:lol2:, so shouldn't make any difference either way to your breeding plans


thanks, all i needed to know!:lol2: so should i just ignore the clearish belly or could that mean it may have certain hets?


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## kelly41 (Jul 7, 2006)

as amels get older quite a few develope mottled bellies rather than squares ive got 2 here with identical bellies

if you look really close youll probably see it off white squares as aposed to red ones


looks like a nice amel to me


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

kelly41 said:


> as amels get older quite a few develope mottled bellies rather than squares ive got 2 here with identical bellies
> 
> if you look really close youll probably see it off white squares as aposed to red ones
> 
> ...


 
yeah, thats what i was expecting, its hard to tell without seein in the flesh as some are so faint its unreal


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## captaincaveman (Nov 6, 2006)

emma_fyfe said:


> thanks, all i needed to know!:lol2: so should i just ignore the clearish belly or could that mean it may have certain hets?


 
yeah, i dont think thats a sign of hets personally


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