# False Widow?



## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

found this behind a wall planter, it had a messy web with a tube of loose webbing going down the back of the planter, sadly got destroyed when i moved the planter.

there were 3 large ones and a few smaller living there, what do you guys think? normally i know native spiders, this looks to me like some false widow (_Steatoda sp._) but not sure

one ran off the wall so i tubbed it for a better look










oh yeah, size, it was about 1cm long, the background its sat on is a line of mortar between two bricks, so thats grains of sand you can see for comparison


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## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

I think it's the same as this one I found in my back garden










which I was told was Amaurobius similis or A. fenestralis (window spider)


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

Could be, looks more like a _Zygiella x-notata Infact im sure its a Zygiella x-notata._

_Only because of the leg position, I could be wrong...._


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## Sublios_Pixelus (Dec 13, 2008)

looks like an Amaurobius to me as well


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## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

It's an _Amaurobius sp._ 

Definitely not _Zygiella x-notata. _


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## will306 (Jan 26, 2009)

I have seen a few similar tiny spiders in my house.


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

GRB said:


> It's an _Amaurobius sp._
> 
> Definitely not _Zygiella x-notata. _


How Isit definatly not _Zygiella x-notata_

_Look compare this pick with one above... Missing Sector Spider - Zygiella x-notata - UK Safari_

_Im a noob to Spiders though so your probably right_


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## C_Strike (Feb 20, 2007)

Joe1507 said:


> How Isit definatly not _Zygiella x-notata_
> 
> _Look compare this pick with one above... Missing Sector Spider - Zygiella x-notata - UK Safari_
> 
> _Im a noob to Spiders though so your probably right_


Your looking at appearance rather than the physiology. thats a really pointless thing to do to Id inverts.. 
~Second, rather than narrowing it to one species, unless you know all the other species of the genus, and know that none of the others are mistakeable for it then you cant be sure of any Id.. Can you even name how many species there are in the genus?? (no google... can u answer that?)


Alos, maybe im being picky and should stay shtum... 
but...
to the OP... HOw can you say 'normally i know native species'..??

Theyre are too many, and most descriptions are crap and msot genus are in a hell of a mess.. and even the profeessionals dont understand half of the Id characteristics of spiders.. theres just so many, and many are so alike, its neigh on impossible to distiguish between.
You mistaking a whole different family of spiders for another...and tbh, if you did know natives.. then you couldnt have made that mistake.. sorry..
Steatoda sp. are nothing in the slightest like the above... other than ahving 8legs, a big round bum, and a pair of fangs

Why are people saying 'it IS this' 'it IS that' when they dont know themselves??

IM sure even GRB, using a much more accurate approach would try to avoid narrowing to a single species, unless he was certain..
Try distinguishing Tegenaria sp.. for example, i hear thats a real bitch, and like moany, many genus, it requires a microscope, and examination of a single area of the body... im sure often, it would requre the specimen to already be dea.d

TBH, IMO too many times recently am i seing people ID using google, and name it as a definitive species.. how do you know, are you looking at the description papers and examining the key characters? probably not... so dont be over confident


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## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

yeah sorry about that c_strike

i'll rephrase, i roughly know the genus of most native spiders i come across in day to day life, this one i'm not so sure on, though i know its not _Zygiella x-notata_ as it didn'tspin an orb web, i didn't get a good look at the spider to be honest

TBH, i just thought it looked a bit interesting, its a shame i couldn't get a clear pic of the web for you guys



and also, i'm not trying to flame anyone here, but seriously, why do half the sodding board act like petulant children? half the threads here dissolve into petty arguments and know-it-all smartarsery. now i see nothing wrong with that, but people keep doing it like knowing more makes them better people. i know its hard seeing people make the same ignorant statements over and over again, but ffs, just let it lie once in a while, or how about try for some _constructive_ criticism, without the holyer than thou attitude.

none the less, c_strike, you _are_ being picky, but you do have a good point, i mean i'm shit at IDing inverts, i've learned something from your post i.e. a few of the intricacies of it

And finally, thanks for all the replies, very helpful


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## andy07966 (Mar 10, 2009)

Here is an Amaurobius similis i found earlier and a wolf spider i think, i was quite pleased with that find! :lol2:


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## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

nice, like the pic of the wolf spider, tried to get a pic of one on a wall in my garden but it wouldn't stay still long enoug


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## andy07966 (Mar 10, 2009)

Not quite macro junkie yet!! :lol2: I just caught it in a tub then took a photo, was easier than i thought!


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## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

I think the bottom pic looks like a member of the Gnaphosidae, but 've not had time to check. They can look quite similar to Lycosids (wolf spiders).


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## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

Joe1507 said:


> How Isit definatly not _Zygiella x-notata_
> 
> _Look compare this pick with one above... Missing Sector Spider - Zygiella x-notata - UK Safari_
> 
> _Im a noob to Spiders though so your probably right_


 
_Zygiella x-notata:_










Amaurobius (OP spider):










These spiders look completely different. 

For one thing, the abdomens have completely different markings and are of a different shape. The relative proportions of the abdomen to cephalothorax are different too, and the colouration of leg markings is different.


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## Upupa epops (Oct 17, 2008)

Thought I might as well settle this one! The original pic is definitely Amaurobius similis. The markings differ slightly from the snaller A. fenestralis. It's actually in a separate infraorder (Cribellata) from Steatoda and Zygiella which are in the Ecribellata. The wolf spider pic is Trochosa ruricola. Hope that helps!


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## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

it's nice to have somebody here who knows their UK spiders


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## Moosey (Jan 7, 2008)

Hedgewitch said:


> yeah sorry about that c_strike
> 
> i'll rephrase, i roughly know the genus of most native spiders i come across in day to day life, this one i'm not so sure on, though i know its not _Zygiella x-notata_ as it didn'tspin an orb web, i didn't get a good look at the spider to be honest
> 
> ...


If we were straight we'd make the best babies :flrt::flrt::flrt:


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## ceratogyrus (Mar 4, 2008)

Upupa epops said:


> Thought I might as well settle this one! The original pic is definitely Amaurobius similis. The markings differ slightly from the snaller A. fenestralis. It's actually in a separate infraorder (Cribellata) from Steatoda and Zygiella which are in the Ecribellata. The wolf spider pic is Trochosa ruricola. Hope that helps!


i second this


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