# importing dogs ? doberman breeders ?



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

ok so in a few months time I'm going to be looking at getting a doberman  can't wait I've wanted a dog for sooooo longgg and finally decided its going to be a doberman. the only problem now is i really want one with chopped ears and doped tail and before i get flamed no its not becose i want to walk around the streets with it looking hard as if that was the case i would just buy a pit bull as they seem to be a lot easier to get hold of lol. but obi its illegal to do in the uk so i am looking to see how easy it would be to get one from abroad anyone know how easy it is or any doberman breeders abroad I'm not to worried on the cost at all i would rather quality than more money left in my pocket any help or advice for me  ?


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> ok so in a few months time I'm going to be looking at getting a doberman  can't wait I've wanted a dog for sooooo longgg and finally decided its going to be a doberman. the only problem now is i really want one with chopped ears and doped tail and before i get flamed no its not becose i want to walk around the streets with it looking hard as if that was the case i would just buy a pit bull as they seem to be a lot easier to get hold of lol. but obi its illegal to do in the uk so i am looking to see how easy it would be to get one from abroad anyone know how easy it is or any doberman breeders abroad I'm not to worried on the cost at all i would rather quality than more money left in my pocket any help or advice for me  ?


 
Can i ask why it has to have cropped ears then? What purpose would it serve you?


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> Can i ask why it has to have cropped ears then? What purpose would it serve you?


well tbh i just like the look of them more with chopped ears but reading up about them apparently it is better for them as well etc


----------



## Zoo-Man (Apr 12, 2008)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> well tbh i just like the look of them more with chopped ears but reading up about them apparently it is better for them as well etc


How can having their ear flaps cut to shape as puppies & then wired up until they stay firm be better for them?


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Very mis-leading information, the risk of ear infection is greatly increased, You will also find it hard to find a decent breeder who can manage a crop correctly. You may end up buying and importing a pup for a ridiculas amount of money for it to grow up and its ears to naturally fall anyway.

Being a part of a UK based Dobermann rescue, We have yet to come across any cropped ears thankfully as stated it is illegal over it as it serves no purpose and is purely for vanity. Docked tails i dont mind as im niether for or against it i just accept it.


----------



## LarkaDawg (Aug 2, 2011)

I don't think you should 'want' a cut up dog. Maybe they look nicer, but could you actually watch a puppy's tail cut in half and ears cut up? 
It would scream because it's painful. 
It's illegal in the UK for good reasons!! I call it animal cruelty.


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Zoo-Man said:


> How can having their ear flaps cut to shape as puppies & then wired up until they stay firm be better for them?


yer i no what you mean thats why i only said apparently as i expect a lot of people who write that information about it being better are just trying to justify it being done


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

LarkaDawg said:


> I don't think you should 'want' a cut up dog. Maybe they look nicer, but could you actually watch a puppy's tail cut in half and ears cut up?
> It would scream because it's painful.
> It's illegal in the UK for good reasons!! I call it animal cruelty.


no to be honest i couldn't watch it being done or do it myself but then theres a lot of things i couldn't watch or think about to be honest like even killing rats to feed to my snakes but i have not got a problem feeding them to my snakes once there dead


----------



## Postcard (Aug 29, 2010)

You'll really struggle to find somewhere tbh. They look much better with ears imo anyway. Even if it's what you want, actually making it happen will be far more effort than it's worth for a pointless practise!

Here's a list of countries by legal status - 
Docking (dog) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and a website of European breeders -
Dobermann > Page 2

Anyway, you need to be a bit careful about where you pick, too, as different areas of the world breed for different things - I think Americans are meant to be softer and bigger dogs, and the further east you go the harder / more working driven they're meant to be. You'll need to speak to someone who really knows something about the breed (not me!) and they'll be able to recommend to you what they think you could cope with.


----------



## LarkaDawg (Aug 2, 2011)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> no to be honest i couldn't watch it being done or do it myself but then theres a lot of things i couldn't watch or think about to be honest like even killing rats to feed to my snakes but i have not got a problem feeding them to my snakes once there dead


But that's necessary! Snakes need to eat. Whereas dogs do not need their ears or tails cut off for any reason except to be more aesthetically pleasing!

Is this a joke? Have I got the wrong end of the stick?


----------



## em_40 (Sep 29, 2010)

Errg, they cut them while awake and they really do scream and wriggle in pain, it's so disgusting...

I saw a staffordshire bull terrier with 'cropped' ears the other day, they had been bodged and were more than cm thick, all swollen and full of scar tissue, it was horrible.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

You want a nice big English bred dog, The European models are fair more danity looking =D

Skip the ear cropped, you will more than likely only get a docked from a rescue or a private rehome now, and youll have a happy dobe.


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

I saw a doberman a few weeks back with what looked like antlers on his head and a docked tail. Much to my sons horror I asked the man if the dog had his ears cropped and he said yes. He had taken him abroad to have his ears and his tail done as he preferred the look of them like that:bash: Needless to say I saw red and tore a strip of this huge man and told him exactly what I thought of him:devil: I dont think he will be walking his dog near our house again anytime soon!!!!


----------



## SUPER HANS (Jun 18, 2011)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> ok so in a few months time I'm going to be looking at getting a doberman  can't wait I've wanted a dog for sooooo longgg and finally decided its going to be a doberman. the only problem now is i really want one with chopped ears and doped tail and before i get flamed *no its not becose i want to walk around the streets with it looking hard *as if that was the case i would just buy a pit bull as they seem to be a lot easier to get hold of lol. but obi its illegal to do in the uk so i am looking to see how easy it would be to get one from abroad anyone know how easy it is or any doberman breeders abroad I'm not to worried on the cost at all i would rather quality than more money left in my pocket any help or advice for me  ?


Lets be honest, thats exactly what you want.


----------



## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

This is the only way a Dobie should look.









If you want a dog with erect ears and near no tail, 
Can i point you in the way of the Boston bull terrier, And there 100% natural.


----------



## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

Ear docking has been illegal for a long time in the UK, much longer than tail docking, it simply is too barbaric and has never been socially acceptable in the UK. Geez there was even outcry in the UK against the Marmaduke film for featuring an ear docked Great Dane.

If you had it done you may as well kick a kitten down the street as the reaction from others would be the same, and I am not just talking people like Shell and I and I am sure most here who would not be backwards in coming forward to say what level of scum you would have to be to put a dog through that so it looks good for you I am talking large men that would seriously wish to do damage to you for the damage that you have done to that dog.

I do agree you ARE doing it to look hard, but really hard men wouldn't need a dogs help, real hard men could walk chihuahuas and real hard men would kick your ass for walking out with a butchered dog. In prisons people who hurt animals are treated right up there with paedophiles, and the people doing them damage have the same sensibilities when they are released you know! (often after stupidly short sentences I may add)


----------



## Lenor (Jul 24, 2009)

Ear cropping is cruelty. It's all for your own vanity. It has absolutely no benefit to the dog at all. I think you need to research this better. It also has some nasty complications if it goes wrong. And some cropped ears still flop over later, there's no guarantees. It's classed as a mutilation in the UK for good reason.

Not quite sure about all the import laws would depend on where you were looking to import from, I imagine the dog would be at least 4.5-5months old before it could enter the UK even if it came from Europe, by the time it's old enough for rabies vaccinating and the 3 weeks wait post vaccination.

If you love the breed, love it for all it is, floppy ears waggy tail and all:flrt:


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

wow reading everyones post anyone would of thort i asked peoples opions on getting there ears chopped as 90% of people have not even answered any of my questions lol but thanks to the few that have tried to help out even if they don't agree with it. I'm not saying i will only get one with chopped ears I'm just saying that i would rather one with chopped ears but a dopped tail is nearly a must but as far as i am aware from researching it anyone in england selling them with dopped tails has done it illiglay and for that reason i do not want to buy off of them as its irresponsible and if they haven't got a care about the law over here then that tells me they prob haven't been that bothered about there dogs rather. and as for people saying that it hurts them as far as i was aware they were always cut buy a vet with a lazor and put to sleep don't get me wrong afterwords i would agree they would be a little saw but if it was really as bad as its made out the be would it be ligal at all anywhere and why would they allow you to enter them in comps etc


----------



## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> if it was really as bad as its made out the be would it be ligal at all anywhere and why would they allow you to enter them in comps etc


It is as bad as it is made out.

You are very uninformed and naive if you believe being legal equals being OK. Torturing a dog to death for meat is legal in some countries as it is reported the meat tastes better when the animal is scared. Doesn't mean you are a sick bastard for doing it, causing it to occur or in anyway condoning it for your whims.

You would not be able to show your dog in any way in the UK if it was mutated in the ways you desire. As I mentioned before, I am fairly certain you would even be unable to walk it without getting hurt yourself.


----------



## Ameliaxx (Apr 9, 2010)

Why should any of us answer somthing we thing is cruel, i don't understand why you want to have a dog go throught 2 very unnecissary operations and then have to go throught being imported on its own to then arrive at some strangers house, the fact that you would want a living thing to go throught all this just because you want it to look a certain way shows you are not a caring owner. Just because it may be legal in some places does deffently not mean it is okay morally, in some countrys its all right to beat your wife, kill or beat your dog does that make it right to do it at all because well you no 'it is legal in another country', no it certainly dosnt. Cropping is banned in this country for a reason.


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Read these 

CFHS | Ear cropping and tail docking

Myths about Dog Ear Cropping


----------



## Jamiioo (May 8, 2010)

I find it quite worrying that one of them links shows you how to crop your dogs ears on your own, i couldn't watch it. Poor dog


----------



## Ameliaxx (Apr 9, 2010)

i couldnt watch that clip either i just felt so sorry for the dog


----------



## chewy86 (Mar 12, 2009)

I do like dogs with stuck up ears but as already said wouldnt put a dog through that for cosmetic purposes. Dobermans and great danes look nice with their ears down but better up imo. This is one of the reasons I like pitbulls and english bull terriers, as they have a large build and the stuck up ears (I think apbt can be done by wrapping them upwards from young, till a certain age. being smaller ears, I may be wrong?) and of course ebt's ear are naturally pointed upwards. I like tails on dogs though some docked tails make them look silly imo.


----------



## Postcard (Aug 29, 2010)

chewy86 said:


> I do like dogs with stuck up ears but as already said wouldnt put a dog through that for cosmetic purposes. Dobermans and great danes look nice with their ears down but better up imo. This is one of the reasons I like pitbulls and english bull terriers, as they have a large build and the stuck up ears (I think apbt can be done by wrapping them upwards from young, till a certain age. being smaller ears, I may be wrong?) and of course ebt's ear are naturally pointed upwards. I like tails on dogs though some docked tails make them look silly imo.


I like upright ears too as a personal preference, but not at the expense of docking. Anyway, the legal link shows that the vast majority of places where ear cropping still exists are places where quarantine would be an absolute nightmare and probably result in a dog which had psychological problems from so long in kennels.

There are naturally pointy eared smooth coat breeds too but it seems to be a houndy thing -









Pharoah hounds

If you can cope with something smaller, American manchester terriers are often bred with naturally erect ears - 








Would be a hassle to import, mind you, although there is the pet passport scheme which cuts down the hassle.

The mexican hairless / xolo comes in a coated variety which is recessive (I think, as in chinese cresteds) and has standy-up ears -









Also the Ibizan hound -









Basenji -









Belgian shep Malinois -









Dutch shepherd -









etc etc etc

also, in toy breeds -








min pin









English toy terrier









Chihuahua









Russian toy

There's a fair few more, too!

Anyway, sorry for all the pics - got a bit carried away! :lol2:


----------



## Ameliaxx (Apr 9, 2010)

i love ibizan and pharoh hound :flrt:


----------



## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

OP, sorry but i am finding it very hard here to take your posts seriously as i keep laughing every time you post :lol2:. I am trying to picture a dog with "chopped" ears & a "doped" tail :gasp:. The terms used are CROPPED & DOCKED, also it's called a Dobermann Pinscher, spelt with 2 nn's at the end :2thumb:.


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

corny girl said:


> OP, sorry but i am finding it very hard here to take your posts seriously as i keep laughing every time you post :lol2:. I am trying to picture a dog with "chopped" ears & a "doped" tail :gasp:. The terms used are CROPPED & DOCKED, also it's called a Dobermann Pinscher, spelt with 2 nn's at the end :2thumb:.[/QUOTI
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> I always thought it was spelt Doberman ??


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Shell195 said:


> corny girl said:
> 
> 
> > OP, sorry but i am finding it very hard here to take your posts seriously as i keep laughing every time you post :lol2:. I am trying to picture a dog with "chopped" ears & a "doped" tail :gasp:. The terms used are CROPPED & DOCKED, also it's called a Dobermann Pinscher, spelt with 2 nn's at the end :2thumb:.[/QUOTI
> ...


----------



## em_40 (Sep 29, 2010)

Dobermans look *awful *with cropped ears, I really don't get it. They look sooooo much better with floppy ears, even though I like dogs with pointy ears, a dobermans ears when cropped just look so out of place, they stand funny, lanky and mutilated.

Get a dog that you like the look of instead of having someone cut one up to meet your standards.


----------



## Atonks (Nov 1, 2009)

Well i must say i saw this post and thought awesome you dont really see many people around talking about dobey's anymore then i read what you put :/ I obviousky have a dobermann and in there natural form are an absolutely gorgeous dog and if trained correctly again they are just fantastic. I would never imagine putting a dog through anything that is to be honest pointless and un needy. But everyone has there own thoughts and opinions so whatever floats your boat really but if it was a normal dobermann you was wanting then i would of been more than happy to let you know once my brother's litter arrives but not to worry anyway.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Ive always known it to be two n's, I dont think there is much difference between the 3 Doberman, Dobermann and Dobermann Pinscher however i think Dobermann Pinscher refers to tho with cropped ears does it not? to follow that of the standard pinscher?

I may be wrong tho, I would have to ask someone who knows more than i do.


----------



## SUPER HANS (Jun 18, 2011)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> Ive always known it to be two n's, I dont think there is much difference between the 3 Doberman, Dobermann and Dobermann Pinscher however i think Dobermann Pinscher refers to tho with cropped ears does it not? to follow that of the standard pinscher?
> 
> I may be wrong tho, I would have to ask someone who knows more than i do.


Doberman is an amercanism. 


Dobermann pinscher is the correct name.


----------



## JulieNoob (Jul 9, 2008)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> I dont think there is much difference between the 3 Doberman, Dobermann and Dobermann Pinscher however i think Dobermann Pinscher refers to tho with cropped ears does it not? to follow that of the standard pinscher?
> .


It's the same - Just most people refer to them as Dobermann rather than the full name - and some people spell it wrong - the name is nothing to do with ears ....

it's like the correct name for Labradors is Labrador Retriever - but many people call them Labradors or Labs ....


----------



## Atonks (Nov 1, 2009)

If im honest I don't think a name of whatever breed it is matters really all that matters is that he wants to get a dog and cut it up poor bloody thing


----------



## Daisyy (Jan 15, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> afterwords i would agree they would be a little saw


Have your ears cut into points and see if they are "just a little sore" afterwards.


----------



## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

cropping and docking is fine for a doberman... my best dog was a doberman...

his ears were cropped and his tail docked... never a problem... best dog ever...


people think this is cruel... people likely with tattoos and piercings... or think that is fine... but not with a dog...


dobermans look better cropped and docked...

and they don't have any issues if it's done right... by a vet...


----------



## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

SUPER HANS said:


> Doberman is an amercanism.
> 
> 
> Dobermann pinscher is the correct name.


 anal... very anal... i bet your silverware is all matching and sorted...:Na_Na_Na_Na:


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Daisyy said:


> Have your ears cut into points and see if they are "just a little sore" afterwards.


yer well i wouldn't be the first per on i no to have it done


HABU said:


> cropping and docking is fine for a doberman... my best dog was a doberman...
> 
> his ears were cropped and his tail docked... never a problem... best dog ever...
> 
> ...


wow the only person that doest have something bad to say :2thumb:
I've sourced one now anyways no thanks to this thread :2thumb: only thing I'm not that happy with it can't be delivered and till its 16 weeks old because of another stupid law


----------



## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

JulieNoob said:


> It's the same - Just most people refer to them as Dobermann rather than the full name - and some people spell it wrong - the name is nothing to do with ears ....
> 
> it's like the correct name for Labradors is Labrador Retriever - but many people call them Labradors or Labs ....


mine says Retriever ( labrador ) on the kc papers


----------



## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> yer well i wouldn't be the first per on i no to have it done
> 
> 
> wow the only person that doest have something bad to say :2thumb:
> I've sourced one now anyways no thanks to this thread :2thumb: only thing I'm not that happy with it can't be delivered and till its 16 weeks old because of another stupid law


Which stupid law would this be? no doubt it is in place for the welfare of the animal and the diease control in this country that you merely deem stupid because it means you cant have a puppy until 16 weeks old.


----------



## miss_ferret (Feb 4, 2010)

how the hell you can justify having part of a dogs ears cut off for no reason other than you think it looks good il never know.

docking a tail can have a purpose and in some cases can benefit the dog, there is no benefit to a dog from taking away some of its ears. even when done by a vet its an unnecessary risk, every aesthetic carries a risk to the animal.


----------



## SUPER HANS (Jun 18, 2011)

HABU said:


> anal... very anal... i bet your silverware is all matching and sorted...:Na_Na_Na_Na:


I dont own any silverware, but if I did, it would be. :shock:


----------



## em_40 (Sep 29, 2010)

HABU said:


> cropping and docking is fine for a doberman... my best dog was a doberman...
> 
> his ears were cropped and his tail docked... never a problem... best dog ever...
> 
> ...


A person can decide whether they want tattoos or piercings, if my mother decieded I should be tattooed and pierced and I didn't want to be, we would have a very big fall out. I don't want to mutilated permantly for the aesthetic pleasure of others.


----------



## Ameliaxx (Apr 9, 2010)

HABU said:


> cropping and docking is fine for a doberman... my best dog was a doberman...
> 
> his ears were cropped and his tail docked... never a problem... best dog ever...
> 
> ...


I don't think any of us said it would make the dog a bad dog I think were saying its cruel to put an animal throught an non-medical procedure for youe gain. Also a person chooses to have tatoos and piercing a dog certainly does not


----------



## Zoo-Man (Apr 12, 2008)

Ameliaxx said:


> I don't think any of us said it would make the dog a bad dog I think were saying its cruel to put an animal throught an non-medical procedure for youe gain. Also a person chooses to have tatoos and piercing a dog certainly does not


Habu is American. In the US, many breeds are cropped - Great Danes, Boxers, Dobermanns, even some Boston Terriers get cropped, & their ears are naturally erect & pointed!!! :bash:


----------



## Daisyy (Jan 15, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> yer well i wouldn't be the first per on i no to have it done(


Just because other scum bags with no thought towards the dogs well being decided to mutilate their dog, doesn't mean it's okay.

Why would you want to cause pain to your own pet for no reason? I'm sorry but you shouldn't be allowed to own a dog, this is disgusting.

All of this because you want to look like a tough man walking down the street.


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Daisyy said:


> Just because other scum bags with no thought towards the dogs well being decided to mutilate their dog, doesn't mean it's okay.
> 
> Why would you want to cause pain to your own pet for no reason? I'm sorry but you shouldn't be allowed to own a dog, this is disgusting.
> 
> All of this because you want to look like a tough man walking down the street.


pmsl i was on about humans and yep i wanna look really hard because I've got my dogs ears chopped :S glad to see you read my first post well :2thumb:


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> pmsl i was on about humans and yep i wanna look really hard because I've got my dogs ears chopped :S glad to see you read my first post well :2thumb:


I cant think what other reasons you would want a dogs ears cropped!!! It doesnt benefit the dog at all.

What you going to do if the dogs ears dont heal well and one goes floppy, instead of a hard looking dog you would have a comical one:whistling2:


----------



## ryanr1987 (Mar 7, 2009)

I think they look daft in there normal state I really think Dobermans are one of the only dogs who actually suit cropped ears And a Docked tail they look very good looking and elegant in my opinion. Do I think it's cruel hmmm if its done right then no it's not harming the dog if done professionally but if done how many used to do with the dog in pain with infections then it's really nasty. However I do consider it very selfish but I guess we are all selfish in some ways.

I can see why some people would think its a macho thing they look very intimidating but if the op likes it then it's his business.


----------



## Draco (Nov 23, 2005)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> yer well i wouldn't be the first per on i no to have it done
> 
> 
> wow the only person that doest have something bad to say :2thumb:
> I've sourced one now anyways no thanks to this thread :2thumb: only thing I'm not that happy with it can't be delivered and till its 16 weeks old because of another stupid law


:2wallbang: :2wallbang:

there are so manyt thing wrong with all of this, it hard to beleave it is true


----------



## ryanr1987 (Mar 7, 2009)

Draco said:


> :2wallbang: :2wallbang:
> 
> there are so manyt thing wrong with all of this, it hard to beleave it is true


Oh stop being a bloody cry baby. If he wants one then it's upto him. Longs the dog is healthy and looked after then that's all that matters.


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Its illegal in the Uk so I think it should be illegal to either import a dog with cropped ears and tail or to take it out of the country to have it done!


----------



## Draco (Nov 23, 2005)

ryanr1987 said:


> Oh stop being a bloody cry baby. If he wants one then it's upto him. Longs the dog is healthy and looked after then that's all that matters.


Well I was thinking more of, buying a dog from someone in another country he has never met, so will not be seeing the parents, can't check health test results, can't see what enviroment its bralt up in.

Plus it coming at 16 weeks so will miss out on that vital time the dog need to get use to normal home life, not getting a chance to see, smell and hear differant sound.

If he wants a cropped and docked dog fair anothe as long as he understand the prosess fully. Like in some countrys dogs are done by there owners, and not how he seems to think by a vet by a lazer while there asleep.


----------



## adamntitch (Jun 17, 2007)

op does not even by the sounds of him maybe it have the right to own a dog if it /he feels its ok to own a dog that has been tortured to look the way it/he wants 

hope it/he nos he would be done with animal abuse due to the legal laws over here even if he / it imported the dog as he /it has willingly known about the ban and the pain and torture involved


----------



## Postcard (Aug 29, 2010)

Draco said:


> Well I was thinking more of, buying a dog from someone in another country he has never met, so will not be seeing the parents, can't check health test results, can't see what enviroment its bralt up in.
> 
> Plus it coming at 16 weeks so will miss out on that vital time the dog need to get use to normal home life, not getting a chance to see, smell and hear differant sound.
> 
> If he wants a cropped and docked dog fair anothe as long as he understand the prosess fully. Like in some countrys dogs are done by there owners, and not how he seems to think by a vet by a lazer while there asleep.


OR - importing can be an opportunity to get a quality dog from international champion parents with relevant testing and correct temperament that you simply can't get in the UK, and not always more money. Obviously depends on the breeder, eh?

You'd have to trust the breeder to keep up with socialisation but I know of people who've had pups kept 6 months by another breeder before they could import them who came through perfectly balanced - pups are highly adaptable.

It does mean socialisation is more important, for sure.

I don't agree with the ethics of the situation but I can understand the attraction to the appearance - but it's unfair imo to make out as if importing is irresponsible as your post implies.


----------



## popitgoes (Oct 24, 2010)

Shell195 said:


> Its illegal in the Uk so I think it should be illegal to either import a dog with cropped ears and tail or to take it out of the country to have it done!


i think there should be a dislike button for this

yes it is illegal in this country but why should it be illegal to import a dog with cropped ears?

if the dog goes to the right person and will be well looked after shouldnt that be what matters?


----------



## em_40 (Sep 29, 2010)

Apparently while walking your dog you have to carry the import papers or your dog can be seized.





...I really do not get the attraction, they look so ugly with cut, sticky up ears.


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Draco said:


> Well I was thinking more of, buying a dog from someone in another country he has never met, so will not be seeing the parents, can't check health test results, can't see what enviroment its bralt up in.
> 
> Plus it coming at 16 weeks so will miss out on that vital time the dog need to get use to normal home life, not getting a chance to see, smell and hear differant sound.
> 
> If he wants a cropped and docked dog fair anothe as long as he understand the prosess fully. Like in some countrys dogs are done by there owners, and not how he seems to think by a vet by a lazer while there asleep.


well that was the idea of the thread to see if anyone had experience in inporting a dog etc and there views on inporting etc and like you have a good point about the age thing and i have took that on board and would much rather useful posts like this. the idea of the thread was because i wanted to know if anyone knows of good breeders and obi i would rather know that the ears were going to get done proper with a lazor etc instead the threads just turned into how wrong it is to cut a dogs ears witch was nothing to do with why i made this thread at the end of the day i would rather a dog with chopped ears so people can say this that etc but its really not going to help in the long run everyone is intitaled to there own views on the matter but instead of trying to help or advise people just want to knock the fact it has chopped ears only one person has actually helped me on this thread they obi no who they are so not goin to say any names but they actually sent me a nice pm and said they do not agree on having there ears chopped etc but still even with that they helped to point me in the right direction witch i think is nice obi they realise I'm my own person and what ever someone tells me its still down to me if i want the dogs ears chopped or not so why not help me to get a dog witch they know would of had it done proper and from a proper breeder instead of incurageing all these back street breeders who just breed for money and don't have the dogs welfare in mind at any stage


----------



## ryanr1987 (Mar 7, 2009)

Does anyone know how much it cost to import just curious as i imagen it's well expensive?


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

adamntitch said:


> op does not even by the sounds of him maybe it have the right to own a dog if it /he feels its ok to own a dog that has been tortured to look the way it/he wants


pmsl people like this i really find funny because you clearly have not got a clue have you not being funny if you took more than 2 mins to stop and think about you or any other person for this matter that nothing to do with owning a animal or pet in that matter is right as not being funny no animal should be kept as a pet etc its not natural and you can say as much as you want that dogs have been selectively breed to be pets and yes your right but nothing should be selectively breed in the first place tbh and evolution should happen on its own not buy human influence. dogs were originally wolfs and till us humans got are hands on them and started rearing them and selectively breeding them purely for are own safety and to help us survive so not being funny how is that right in the first place we basically used animals for are own gain in one way or another obv everyone has there own views on things and morals on stuff but my view is everyone of us is a parasite and the world is a living organism and one day the world will find a cure to get rid of the parasite i think that saying is so true everyone has done wrong to this world and ruined stuff and not being funny chopping a dogs ears off is way down on the scale of things that are bad


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

ryanr1987 said:


> Does anyone know how much it cost to import just curious as i imagen it's well expensive?


i won't name the breeder but here is a email from the one i have been speaking to

Thank you for your mail, we have been breeding, raising and training high quality dobermans in Hungary since 1989. The price of a ****** puppy is 1000 euro (with ear cropping, export pedigree, EU pass), the shipment cost to the UK is 350-450 euro by car (depending on the location where the puppy should be shipped). Due the new regulation the puppy could enter the UK at the age of 16 weeks.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Those look like very nice small working bloodlines, so prepare yourself for a Dobermann of working lines! Shape is good for thier size and chest isnt too deep either. However i would be concerned at the shortness of their docks and some not nearly long enough.


----------



## UnBOAlievable_Morphs (Feb 9, 2011)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> Those look like very nice small working bloodlines, so prepare yourself for a Dobermann of working lines! Shape is good for thier size and chest isnt too deep either. However i would be concerned at the shortness of their docks and some not nearly long enough.


yer when u looked at them in the photos they looked quite small dogs I'm not really after a working dog at all more a family pet and a fishing companion lol


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> yer when u looked at them in the photos they looked quite small dogs I'm not really after a working dog at all more a family pet and a fishing companion lol


A "active" family pet maybe, if you can cater to a high demand of energy level ( mind you i know someone witht he most lazest Dobermann ive ever come across, she has to bribe it to go for a walk lol ), A Fishing companion maybe not so much you'll probably spend half the time chasing the dog around for being a fool than fishing. I would definatly rethink going for a import if you want a more "relaxed" ( hard to come by ) Dobermann, The majority of overseas/European side of the breed are more than likely to be of working bloodline and will demand more attention.


----------



## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> i want the dogs ears chopped or not so why not help me to get a dog witch they know would of had it done proper and from a proper breeder instead of incurageing all these back street breeders who just breed for money and don't have the dogs welfare in mind at any stage


Why are you acting like you going to a backstreet breeder would be wrong as if you have standards. You do not have the dogs welfare in mind at any stage. If you have the dogs welfare even slightly in mind you would not be mutilating it.

People with the dogs welfare in mind would not be helping you in any way. It would be like me posting here to say I am looking for help and advice on finding a remote cottage as I would like to torture kittens in the back garden and it tends to upset any neighbours, can anyone post if they can help or suggest anywhere. Of course everyone with a brain has not given you what you ask for, because what you ask for is immoral and just plain sick.


----------



## Ameliaxx (Apr 9, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> pmsl people like this i really find funny because you clearly have not got a clue have you not being funny if you took more than 2 mins to stop and think about you or any other person for this matter that nothing to do with owning a animal or pet in that matter is right as not being funny no animal should be kept as a pet etc its not natural and you can say as much as you want that dogs have been selectively breed to be pets and yes your right but nothing should be selectively breed in the first place tbh and evolution should happen on its own not buy human influence. dogs were originally wolfs and till us humans got are hands on them and started rearing them and selectively breeding them purely for are own safety and to help us survive so not being funny how is that right in the first place we basically used animals for are own gain in one way or another obv everyone has there own views on things and morals on stuff but my view is everyone of us is a parasite and the world is a living organism and one day the world will find a cure to get rid of the parasite i think that saying is so true everyone has done wrong to this world and ruined stuff and not being funny chopping a dogs ears off is way down on the scale of things that are bad


this sounds like your making excuses/(trying to) justifing what you are about to do to this puppy .


----------



## Griffsmum (Dec 13, 2011)

I am not going to comment on the ear cropping and docking issue as my views are the same as most other people on this thread, however, to anyone looking to share their lives with a dobe I would say get to know the breed, the health issues they face and then research, research and research some more.

I am currently heartbroken over the recent loss of my dobe to one of the number of common genetic illnesses they face - dilated cardiomyopathy. Although this seems to be affecting so many dogs, it is not easy to find a breeder who regularly health screens and declares the results (or declares the bad results too). If I were looking for a dobe pup I would want to meet the parents and judge their temperaments for myself and research their pedigree thoroughly for longevity, cause of death etc. I would want to see health certificates for myself, not only receive verbal assurances. The final point I would make to you is to get to know the breed. I adore dobes - they are my breed of choice but they are not a great match for everyone. Over the years I have known many dobes, some of which I considered very neurotic and highly strung. Even my own boy who was very laid back and had an amazing temperament I cannot imagine sitting patiently on a river bank for more than five minutes if I'm honest!


----------



## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

the dobermans i had were fine after cropping and docking... i would know if it was cruel...

my dobermans were not "traumatized" by the procedure... they weren't in pain... they healed very fast and problem free... played the next day...

i would never be cruel to a dog... it's done very early... not something where you wait till they're grown or something...

so i ended up with fine looking dogs that were great and never all dinged-up in the head...


----------



## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Griffsmum said:


> I am not going to comment on the ear cropping and docking issue as my views are the same as most other people on this thread, however, to anyone looking to share their lives with a dobe I would say get to know the breed, the health issues they face and then research, research and research some more.
> 
> I am currently heartbroken over the recent loss of my dobe to one of the number of common genetic illnesses they face - dilated cardiomyopathy. Although this seems to be affecting so many dogs, it is not easy to find a breeder who regularly health screens and declares the results (or declares the bad results too). If I were looking for a dobe pup I would want to meet the parents and judge their temperaments for myself and research their pedigree thoroughly for longevity, cause of death etc. I would want to see health certificates for myself, not only receive verbal assurances. The final point I would make to you is to get to know the breed. I adore dobes - they are my breed of choice but they are not a great match for everyone. Over the years I have known many dobes, some of which I considered very neurotic and highly strung. Even my own boy who was very laid back and had an amazing temperament I cannot imagine sitting patiently on a river bank for more than five minutes if I'm honest!


 yes...

you have to raise a doberman right... they are so intelligent... you have to bond well with them and not mistreat them... and they are my favorite breed by far... but in no way a dog for just anyone... you have to be devoted to your doberman... get a great bloodline... and it will be devoted to you and well balanced...

you can make a doberman crazy if you don't raise them right... some are naturally high strung... you don't want one from high strung parents...


you shouldn't really treat a doberman like a family dog... more like just plain family... they are so smart they almost train themselves... or they can go mad if neglected and abused... if they lose trust in you... you have failed...

my big dog "hopers" is half doberman... you can see that in her looks and temperment... clear as day...

she's a big sweetheart that will eat someone up if they mess with me... very mature... a bit high strung sometimes... she hates as most dobies do... chaos...

dobermans don't like screaming and arguing... crazy stuff... chaos... they like order and stability...

not a dog for everyone at all...


----------



## DavieB (Mar 15, 2011)

HABU said:


> the dobermans i had were fine after cropping and docking... i would know if it was cruel...
> 
> my dobermans were not "traumatized" by the procedure... they weren't in pain... they healed very fast and problem free... played the next day...
> 
> ...


I think the problem with this is if it goes wrong is, it worth any dog dying or losing an ear over a botched op or an infection over a cosmetic procedure is not worth it. even if its one in a thousand has issues over a cosmetic procedure that is there to make the owner happy is not good enough. If it was born with floppy ears they should stay floppy if it is born with a tail it should keep its tail. 

The only time any of these procedures should be carried out is for the good of the dog. 

Are we so vain our pets must be cosmetically enhanced to make us happier with them or even want them? 

Get a breed which has the qualities and features you desire don't get one that you have to cosmetically enhance to have those features.

HABU would you have loved your dog's any less had they not had those procedures carried out? If you were getting another Doberman would you demand the procedure is carried out? If it was illegal in the US would it be so important to you that you had to import one and miss out on 8 weeks of its life?


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Just to point out there is a huge difference because a Dobermann and a Dobermann x! Many times have people failed because they have had a Dobe x and thought a Full Dobe would be just the same.


----------



## Daisyy (Jan 15, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> pmsl i was on about humans and yep i wanna look really hard because I've got my dogs ears chopped :S glad to see you read my first post well :2thumb:


Well it's a humans choice to do chop their ears off.. that dog doesn't have a choice does it?

I read your first post, I'm quite clearly calling you a liar.


----------



## Draco (Nov 23, 2005)

annabel said:


> OR - importing can be an opportunity to get a quality dog from international champion parents with relevant testing and correct temperament that you simply can't get in the UK, and not always more money. Obviously depends on the breeder, eh?
> 
> You'd have to trust the breeder to keep up with socialisation but I know of people who've had pups kept 6 months by another breeder before they could import them who came through perfectly balanced - pups are highly adaptable.
> 
> ...


I in not way against inporting. Your right it can be a good thing, but its only a good thing if it is to help with the breed, this is to help with someone ego so in my mind wrong.


EDIT: I just wanted to add, if you think the responce you had here is bad, wait untill you get your dog and take it for a walk, I bet your end up the outcast of you doggie area.


----------



## Zoo-Man (Apr 12, 2008)

HABU said:


> the dobermans i had were fine after cropping and docking... i would know if it was cruel...
> 
> my dobermans were not "traumatized" by the procedure... they weren't in pain... *they healed very fast and problem free*... played the next day...
> 
> ...


They shouldn't have to heal at all! 

By buying cropped puppies from a breeder you are encouraging the cropping to continue. Like by buying battery eggs you are encouraging the cruel method of farming to continue. And it doesn't matter at what age the mutilation is done, have you heard a puppy scream when it has it's tail docked?


----------



## sammy1969 (Jul 21, 2007)

I have to agree with most of the posts on here I find it cruel and disgusting to inflict the pain and suffering that ear cropping and tail docking brings when it is not done properly. I have bred a couple of breeds of dog that should of had docked tails but refused to have it done even before they stopped doing it over here. I was even berated by one potential buyer when they saw I had not had my puppies put through this cruelty consequently they didnt get a puppy from me. I lknow it is personal preference on whether you purchase a dog with cropped ears or tails but to go out of your way to get either or both done just because you find them more pleasing to look out seems so wrong. If they are born with floppy ears they are meant to have floppy ears if they are born with long tails then they should be left with long tails as it was the way they were meant to be. Would you cut off the mane or tail of a horse just because o thought it looked better or remove the tail from a rat just because you dont like the look of it? No I dont think you would but because it is a dog it is acceptable to you I know I am probably stating extremes but i dont see any difference to be honest and I am sure other's will feel the same way


----------



## polecat0303 (Jun 7, 2009)

Wow. I don't even have the words for all the different kinds of wrong in this thread. 

I wish people who don't use punctuation were automatically banned from posting. Trying to read one paragraph long sentence makes my brain hurt.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

About time this was locked, As it plainly either trolling or entertaining. Either way the OP has "found what he was after".


----------



## ale36 (Dec 1, 2010)

I agree that dobermans and other breeds look better with ears and tail chopped. I believe it would be cruel if not done properly,If it's done by a vet with anaesthetics and a course of painkillers then why not. People might say that the dog doesn't get to choose but how about Artificial insemination now days parents can even choose hair,eyes and skin colour is this right??


----------



## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

ale36 said:


> I agree that dobermans and other breeds look better with ears and tail chopped. I believe it would be cruel if not done properly,If it's done by a vet with anaesthetics and a course of painkillers then why not. People might say that the dog doesn't get to choose but how about Artificial insemination now days parents can even choose hair,eyes and skin colour is this right??


How are those two things related at all??


----------



## Skarlet (Nov 8, 2009)

ale36 said:


> I agree that dobermans and other breeds look better with ears and tail chopped. I believe it would be cruel if not done properly,If it's done by a vet with anaesthetics and a course of painkillers then why not. People might say that the dog doesn't get to choose but how about Artificial insemination now days parents can even choose hair,eyes and skin colour is this right??


Unless you could change the genetics of dogs to remove tails and edit ear formation this is not exactly relevant.

Genetically engineering a dog to have the features you want is not the same as cutting the offending parts off.


----------



## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

At the end of the day - the breed of dog you choose is down to you. If you prefer the long tail / floppy ears then that's fine. If you prefer the docked / cropped look then that is fundamentally down to your taste.

We imported our dobe from Greece just over 2 years ago. We wanted a working dobe with good lines, and after many months of research unfortunately none of the UK breeders came close to providing us with what we were looking for. We also preferred the docked / cropped look, and took our search to Europe (despite being banned in many countries, the list of Dobermann breeders who still dock and crop because they feel that THIS is the true representative of the breed, is endless).

We sourced our breeder and went to Greece to meet him. We discussed our requriements. We checked out the kennels and met the males at stud and the bitches which were expecting litters. At the time we were looking for our dog, the 6 month quarantine was still applicable so we wanted to ensure our dog would be well socialized, that the basic training would be undertaken etc.

The wait was long (and expensive) - of course we would have preferred having the dog from a puppy and doing most of the basic training ourselves - however the overall advantages of importing him outweighed any doubts.

We flew him over from Athens at the age of nearly 9 months. He arrived in perfect health. He settled into his home environment and routine within a month - 6 weeks (as does any dog, whether imported or not). He was socialized and has been nothing but a joy to walk with other dogs, and not once has anyone crossed the road to escape the 'scary looking Dobermann with the evil looking ears'. People stop and admire him, and many state they prefer the docked/cropped look.

We wanted a working dog - so the fact we are unable to 'show' him in the UK because of being cropped / docked doesn't bother us at all.

If you cant find the right type of dog you are looking for in the UK, then go abroad. Now that the quarantine laws have changed with regards to importing etc, I cant see what the issue is.


----------



## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

thalie_knights said:


> At the end of the day - the breed of dog you choose is down to you. If you prefer the long tail / floppy ears then that's fine. If you prefer the docked / cropped look then that is fundamentally down to your taste.


And the dogs welfare comes in where? Or does it not matter as long as you get to chop the bits off you like?
I think I fancy my next puppy being a 3 legged one.


----------



## ami_j (Jan 6, 2007)

if the true representation of the breed was to have sticky up ears, Louis Dobermann would of bred them to be so.... and i think its criminal to cut a dogs tail off, nothing better than a lovely waggy tail. much more joyful then a mutilated little stump


----------



## sss_180 (Jan 29, 2010)

ami_j said:


> if the true representation of the breed was to have sticky up ears, Louis Dobermann would of bred them to be so.... and i think its criminal to cut a dogs tail off, nothing better than a lovely waggy tail. much more joyful then a mutilated little stump


But wasnt the point of docking originally intended for a better working dog, not for aesthetics? - so the offender could not grab the dogs tail? I maybe completely wrong, so forgive me if i am, i just remember hearing that. My mother used to breed and show dobermans in the 80s/90s, and we had docked tails but didnt crop ears.


----------



## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

*sigh*

If done by a professional - the procedure is done young under general, and the pup is fine afterwards. It is done early for good reason. The procedure doesn't affect the dogs daily antics and the dog continues to lead a normal and healthy life.
The FCI standard of the Dobermann is cropped and docked. The first images of the earliest Dobermanns are cropped and docked.

If we're talking about welfare - then I would be more worried about the continuous breeding of dogs to Kennel Club 'standards', resulting in breeds such as Spaniels suffering from syringomyelia (where the skull is too small for the brain), chihuahuas which cannot give birth unassisted, pugs with breathing problems etc..

I know which one i'd pick.


----------



## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

thalie_knights said:


> If we're talking about welfare - then I would be more worried about the continuous breeding of dogs to Kennel Club 'standards', resulting in breeds such as Spaniels suffering from syringomyelia (where the skull is too small for the brain), chihuahuas which cannot give birth unassisted, pugs with breathing problems etc..
> 
> I know which one i'd pick.


I actually agree to a point, breeding Pugs is nothing short of cruelty also but what diarrhoea, if you truly cared you would pick none of the above


----------



## miss_ferret (Feb 4, 2010)

sss_180 said:


> But wasnt the point of docking originally intended for a better working dog, not for aesthetics? - so the offender could not grab the dogs tail? I maybe completely wrong, so forgive me if i am, i just remember hearing that. My mother used to breed and show dobermans in the 80s/90s, and we had docked tails but didnt crop ears.


working dogs are usually docked to prevent tail splitting when working in the field/wherever. tail splitting is an extreamly painful condition for the dog, and can result in emergency docking which is more traumatic and requires more healing than it would for a puppy.

there is no benefit to a dog for cutting off parts of there ears. that is done purely because the owners think they look good. completely unnecessary in my opinion.


----------



## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

thalie_knights said:


> *sigh*
> 
> If done by a professional - the procedure is done young under general, and the pup is fine afterwards. It is done early for good reason. The procedure doesn't affect the dogs daily antics and the dog continues to lead a normal and healthy life.


I understand you weren't around for the cropping process but surely you realise that months of having ears in scaffolding affects the dogs daily life? Simply to not knock the equipment off.
Dogs also use ears and tail to express themselves to other dogs and those who can't are frequently targets of aggression due to misunderstanding of body language.
And finally, you are exposing a young pup to amputation of three body parts at once for no good reason. It's just mutilation.


----------



## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

All this discussion goes to prove is how much pain a dog will put up with without complaining and how great dogs are at forgiving their owners no matter what the human puts them through....seems to me a really great example of why your dog deserved to be treated better by you rather than being mutilated!


----------



## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

I wasnt there for the cropping of ours no, but I did witness the cropping of others. If I had seen something horrific and the pup being in clear distress afterwards, my opinion may have changed, but I saw none of this - most likely because it was a 'routine' procedure done by a professional.

Furthermore, the 'scafolding' method is rather old - a lot of breeders find that taping the ears suffices, space is left at the base of the ear to allow the skin to breathe. The dog is not deaf etc - you make it sound like the pups are walking around with a dog collar on for the rest of its life.

Yes a dog uses its tail and ears, but these are by no means the only means of communication between the breed. How a dog carries himself alone is a direct indication of its intentions to the other. If a dog is well socialized early on, then the fact it may be 'targeted' by others is saying something about the dog that does the attacking, not visa versa.


----------



## DavieB (Mar 15, 2011)

Did your dog talking greek not present an issue at 9 months? 

lol


----------



## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

Nope - we were clear in that we would be using German instructions- as usually practised in Schutzhund- so the trainer made sure the basic commands he taught him were also in German.


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

The one I saw by me had scaffolding and was around 10 months old!


----------



## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

Shell195 said:


> The one I saw by me had scaffolding and was around 10 months old!


9 months of scaffolding is usual in american dogs. It looks like this -










Taping can also be performed like this - 










Anyone who has ever tried to put clothes on a puppy can understand how difficult it is to keep these contraptions on. Pup must be kept calm, encouraged not to roll or rough house with other dogs, and preferably kept away from other pups altogether.
It's not a good situation.


----------



## Zoo-Man (Apr 12, 2008)

Devi said:


> 9 months of scaffolding is usual in american dogs. It looks like this -
> 
> image
> 
> ...


In other words, the puppy isn't allowed to be a puppy! :devil:


----------



## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Devi said:


> 9 months of scaffolding is usual in american dogs. It looks like this -
> 
> image
> 
> ...


 
He looked like the second photo but had a bar between his ears. He was taken to an eastern europian country to have the procedure done as I asked his owner


----------



## louise83 (May 10, 2011)

Zoo-Man said:


> In other words, the puppy isn't allowed to be a puppy! :devil:


Seems that way. I cant talk from personal experience but my friend has an adorble dobe, ears, tail and all. I dont know alot about the whole cropping/docking thing but isnt it better to have a dog that you can get from an 8 week pup fully intact, and know that it hasnt been through stressful ops, months healing and I can only imagine that the pup would have to be away from other dogs so its wounds heal the best way they can? TBH I would want a puppy to be as socialised as possible, which cant if they have scaffolding on their ears.


----------



## Kaida (Mar 9, 2006)

And from a completely shallow perspective (which since we're talking about chopping bits off dogs for cosmetic reasons seems appropriate), those "scaffolded" dogs look absolutely ridiculous! :roll2: 
Apart from how sad it makes me that they look like that because of selfish people hurting them for kicks.


----------



## Evilshiddenclaws (May 25, 2010)

UnBOAlievable_Morphs said:


> ok so in a few months time I'm going to be looking at getting a doberman  can't wait I've wanted a dog for sooooo longgg and finally decided its going to be a doberman. the only problem now is i really want one with chopped ears and doped tail and before i get flamed no its not becose i want to walk around the streets with it looking hard as if that was the case i would just buy a pit bull as they seem to be a lot easier to get hold of lol. but obi its illegal to do in the uk so i am looking to see how easy it would be to get one from abroad anyone know how easy it is or any doberman breeders abroad I'm not to worried on the cost at all i would rather quality than more money left in my pocket any help or advice for me  ?


there's a breeder in Ireland expecting pups that are due in a couple of weeks, they'll be docked but not cropped, the father is cropped because he's from France, if you want i can PM you her details and you can give her a call and ask her advice on importing, she imported the mother of these expected puppies from France. I wanted one of her puppies because they'll be docked but i wont have enough pennies in time so i've decided on getting one with a stinkin horrid tail from a breeder down south.

i've always wanted a docked/cropped dobe but i'm too poor


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Evilshiddenclaws said:


> there's a breeder in Ireland expecting pups that are due in a couple of weeks, they'll be docked but not cropped, the father is cropped because he's from France, if you want i can PM you her details and you can give her a call and ask her advice on importing, she imported the mother of these expected puppies from France. I wanted one of her puppies because they'll be docked but i wont have enough pennies in time so i've decided on getting one with a stinkin horrid tail from a breeder down south.
> 
> i've always wanted a docked/cropped dobe but i'm too poor


Whether it has a docked tail or not shouldnt matter with regards to price, Im fumming with that statement.

and if your heart is set on a Dobe with a docked tail then dont bother with the one with the horrid full tail, because that statement as also annoyed me!

I shall be stepping away from this thread now before i get banned...

:censor:


----------



## Evilshiddenclaws (May 25, 2010)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> Whether it has a docked tail or not shouldnt matter with regards to price, Im fumming with that statement.
> 
> and if your heart is set on a Dobe with a docked tail then dont bother with the one with the horrid full tail, because that statement as also annoyed me!
> 
> ...


i replied to the OP's post, i don't give a toss what your thoughts on docking are, keep your small minded opinions to yourself in future, unfortunately if you want a docked dog with or without cropped ears you will have to spend more money because it costs a fair bit to have it imported into this country. If docking was allowed it wouldnt cost extra for one without a tail... idiot...


----------



## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

As above, the only thing 'more expensive' about getting a dobe thats cropped/ docked is the logistics in physically importing the dog.

Mind you, - irrespective of the tails and the ears - our research found the bloodlines to be better abroad so ears/tail aside, it will cost more money either way depending on what you want from the dog.


----------



## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

Evilshiddenclaws said:


> i replied to the OP's post, i don't give a toss what your thoughts on docking are, keep your small minded opinions to yourself in future


Um, do you know what small minded means? It definitely doesn't mean being against unnecessary animal operations.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Evilshiddenclaws said:


> i replied to the OP's post, i don't give a toss what your thoughts on docking are, keep your small minded opinions to yourself in future, unfortunately if you want a docked dog with or without cropped ears you will have to spend more money because it costs a fair bit to have it imported into this country. If docking was allowed it wouldnt cost extra for one without a tail... idiot...


 
And i replied to your post, Freedom to have a opinion much? 

If you could actually learn to read, you would of known i hold no view opinion for or against docking, I understand why its done with regards to working breeds and accept it, However that doesnt mean its necessary.

With the type of attitude you have, I wouldnt be suprised to see a full tailed Dobermann popping up in the classified at 6-8 month old because you now cant cope, the dog is too much and it has a "Horrid" tail, You are the type of person that would fail instantly from a homecheck through me and would be denied a dog.

Such a horrible attitude., not what the Dobermann breed needs at the moment. 

I collected a lovely Dobermann Dog (Docked) from the Scottish Borders, Thankfully i got to him before you did because he was placed for FTGH pretty much everywhere!
Mark


----------



## Evilshiddenclaws (May 25, 2010)

Mischievous_Mark said:


> And i replied to your post, Freedom to have a opinion much?
> 
> If you could actually learn to read, you would of known i hold no view opinion for or against docking, I understand why its done with regards to working breeds and accept it, However that doesnt mean its necessary.
> 
> ...


it's nice to hide behind a computer isnt it... i'll ignore everything you said because you know nothing about me at all.


----------



## Mischievous_Mark (Mar 16, 2008)

Evilshiddenclaws said:


> it's nice to hide behind a computer isnt it... i'll ignore everything you said because you know nothing about me at all.


Was on my phone, I aren't no keyboard warrior either. Granted it may take awhile to wind me up but ill still call it how i see it.

Ignorance is bliss 

Don't like what i type, simple dont read it, dont reply and add me to your ignore list :devil:


----------

