# 150W bulb still not heating vivarium for bearded dragon



## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

I have a 4x2x2feet wooden vivarium for my bearded dragon. I have a 150W light bulb (bought from pet store rather than home store) which is housed in a dome which sit on the top of the vivarium (i cut a hole in the wooden top) therefore the bulb is 2feet away from the vivarium ground. I also have a 100W ceramic heat emitter located next to the light bulb. Even with both these heat sources on, my vivarium is struggling to heat up...I live in scotland and don't put my heating on so my room can range from 12-17°C. I assume that because my room is cold, the vivarium is loosing a lot of heat. I have a large inclined log under the light bulb so at the top of this the temperature is high enough to bask. The issue is my temperatures on the ground are too cold, 20-21°c at cold side and only 24-25°C at the "warmer" side. My bulb is located about a 1/4 of the way down the length of the vivarium. I have a "mezzanine" floor which is about 1foot wide, 2 1/2 feet long and 1 foot high which is situated at the colder half of the vivarium. The temperature on here is a good temperature however the temperature on the ground at the same distance from the bulb is too cold. I appreciate this is due to the hot air rising however I need to increase the temperature on the ground. I am thinking about purchasing a more power ceramic heat emitter, upgrading to 250W. i have a thermostat handy to control it, i basically don't want to upgrade to a 150W for it to still not be powerful enough when i can just control the output of a 250W bulb by limiting cold end temperature to 25°C or so. Anyone think this is a good solution or have you got any other ideas? 

Thanks
Kyle


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

I'm amazed that you're struggling with that amount of heat in a 4x2x2 with a ceramic and a 150W bulb tbh

I have a 4x2x2 myself and when I have all my windows open my room is around 15-16 celcius when the draft is flowing through and I have a single 75W spot heating the viv just fine.

Do you have a stat on your heat sources? How are you reading the temps, i.e IR gun or stick on thermometers?


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

Any chance of a picture of the setup? 

Might help highlight something else that could be an issue


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

As above - I have a 4ft viv and use a 75 watt spot bulb to achieve a basking temp of 40 degrees and cold end at 24.5

Something that may help a bit is to use a piece of slate or stone at the basking point, this will heat up and help to radiate heat out to the rest of the viv


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## tomcannon (Jan 2, 2008)

As corfel has said there's something not right as a 150w bulb should be more than enough on its own in a 4x2x2, let alone with a CHE as well. My guess is they're statted incorrectly so they're not being allowed to heat up enough, as said a picture would help. If they're statted and the stat probe is in the hot end move it in to the cool side and set it to 26ish. your temps elsewhere should offer a decent gradient and you can increase the distance between bulb and basking spot to decrease your basking temp (which will sky rocket if my guess about your setup is correct and you move the probe to the cool end).


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

What thermostat are you using?

Where is the thermostat probe?

What temp is it set to?

What temp are you getting on the basking spot?

What type of thermometer are you using, and where is it?


You should have a Dimming Thermostat with a lamp, Pulse with ceramic, high range, set to 45-46C, with the probe directly below the lamp, the thermometer probe should also be in the same place, measuring the temp of the substrate directly below the lamp - that is your basking temp, which shuld be 45-46C

you shouldnt have any trouble using 150W

dont worry about the cool end temps being too cold, as long as you have correct basking temps, and a good gradient of warmth, then having cooler temps is not a problem at one end


If your thermostat probe is anywhere other than the basking spot, move it, same goes for the thermometer probe, thats the most important temp to control right now - once you have that, then use the thermometer to check the ambient temps occasionaly; or have 2 thermometers


also consider where the Vivarium is, is it on a cold stone floor? or raised up on a table/stand? is it by a drafty window or door?


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## cubone14 (Nov 30, 2013)

a thought, are the joins in the viv all sealed with sealant/glue ?

makes a great deal of difference to heat escaping the viv, allows the heat / temp to build up.


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## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

I've not even got them hooked up to my thermostat...they are on full power :-/ I'm sure the problem is that there is a 20cm diameter hole in the top of the viv which the 150W bulb sits in a metal dome. I never had such problems before this...my room temperature has also dropped the past week or so so it may be a combination of both factors. The dome is slightly smaller than the hole but not much so I'm surprised so much heat is being lost. The image below is not my person vivarium but it shows how my bulb and dome is set up.









I'm measuring with a digital thermometer, I've tried two different thermometers and they both agree. both thermometers are at head height for the beardie, one is a foot away and another 3 foot away (lengthwise). the bottom of the 150W bulb is 2 foot from ground level. Viv is raised on a wooden table. I think I will purchase some sealant to seal the joints. Would anyone recommend purchasing a higher power ceramic heat emitter and hook it to the thermostat at the cold end, setting to 26°C? This can be done until my room heats up as we move into spring. I appreciate this is not an efficient way to fix the issue but the hole is in the vivarium now and I need to heat the wee guy up somehow.

http://imgur.com/TasUVmF


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

I wiould buy a good old fashioned 100 watt spot bulb and try that and see what happens


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

I'm truly lost

I have a hard time with my vivs being too warm with a 75 spot in a room the same temp as yours so how those heat sources are struggling I do not know.

You also want to get yourself a stat. Last thing you want is uncontrollable temperature spikes when you're not around.


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## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

I have a dimming thermostat handy but the reason why I'm not using it is because it wont reach high enough even without it :-/ Corfel is your bulb inside your viv?


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

kylepender said:


> I've not even got them hooked up to my thermostat...they are on full power :-/ I'm sure the problem is that there is a 20cm diameter hole in the top of the viv which the 150W bulb sits in a metal dome. I never had such problems before this...my room temperature has also dropped the past week or so so it may be a combination of both factors. The dome is slightly smaller than the hole but not much so I'm surprised so much heat is being lost. The image below is not my person vivarium but it shows how my bulb and dome is set up. image
> 
> I'm measuring with a digital thermometer, I've tried two different thermometers and they both agree. both thermometers are at head height for the beardie, one is a foot away and another 3 foot away (lengthwise). the bottom of the 150W bulb is 2 foot from ground level. Viv is raised on a wooden table. I think I will purchase some sealant to seal the joints. Would anyone recommend purchasing a higher power ceramic heat emitter and hook it to the thermostat at the cold end, setting to 26°C? This can be done until my room heats up as we move into spring. I appreciate this is not an efficient way to fix the issue but the hole is in the vivarium now and I need to heat the wee guy up somehow.
> 
> Imgur


ok so you are measuring _air_ tempreture, not basking area surface temperture, you need to know the tempreture of the substrate, or the shelf, on the surface of whatever the heater is pointed at - that is the 45-46C you are looking for - not the air temp, if you get the air temp upto 45C you will cook your dragon


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

kylepender said:


> I have a dimming thermostat handy but the reason why I'm not using it is because it wont reach high enough even without it :-/ Corfel is your bulb inside your viv?


My bulb is inside yes

I do appreciate you've got the open top dome but even so with 2 heat sources... I really don't know what to suggest


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

CloudForest said:


> ok so you are measuring _air_ tempreture, not basking area surface temperture, you need to know the tempreture of the substrate, or the shelf, on the surface of whatever the heater is pointed at - that is the 45-46C you are looking for - not the air temp, if you get the air temp upto 45C you will cook your dragon



Also this^


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## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

So my probe has to touch the ground itself? Ive always been told that is incorrect. I don't use these, but surely the analogue dial thermometers that are stuck to the wall wont be reading the substrate temperature? Also my instructions for my thermostat state that the probe must be something like 2-3" above the ground so not to give a falsely high reading. 

My issue is that the temperature drops to low 20Cs even a short distance away from the basking spot, its only hot enough if he is near the top of his branch which is angled below the basking stop. 

Surely if I'm reading a temperature of around 21°C at the cold end (ground level) and on the other side 26°C (ground level) these are too low. My bulb is about a foot away from the RHS wall and im only measuring 26°C with the thermometer at the RHS.


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

kylepender said:


> So my probe has to touch the ground itself? Ive always been told that is incorrect. I don't use these, but surely the analogue dial thermometers that are stuck to the wall wont be reading the substrate temperature? Also my instructions for my thermostat state that the probe must be something like 2-3" above the ground so not to give a falsely high reading.
> 
> My issue is that the temperature drops to low 20Cs even a short distance away from the basking spot, its only hot enough if he is near the top of his branch which is angled below the basking stop.
> 
> Surely if I'm reading a temperature of around 21°C at the cold end (ground level) and on the other side 26°C (ground level) these are too low. My bulb is about a foot away from the RHS wall and im only measuring 26°C with the thermometer at the RHS.


Put your stat probe as close to your basking spot as possible and using a thermostat adjust until the basking temperature is correct - the rest of the viv will sort itself out


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

The probe shouldn't be touching the substrate and the guideline of 2-3" from the surface is fine.

You really need an IR gun to read surface temperatures and then you make adjustments to your stat temps from there.

It's a tedious process and took me weeks lol


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## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

Here are some pictures of my vivarium. I've turned my heating on and the viv is warming up, perhaps it was colder in my room than i thought. ive just hooked the cermic heat emitter to thermostat and no allowing cold end to go above 26°C.

Imgur
Imgur
Imgur
Imgur
Imgur


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## Corfel (Apr 29, 2013)

Your beardies in the cold end

She/He stay there a lot or do they go back/forth from hot to cold?


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

kylepender said:


> Here are some pictures of my vivarium. I've turned my heating on and the viv is warming up, perhaps it was colder in my room than i thought. ive just hooked the cermic heat emitter to thermostat and no allowing cold end to go above 26°C.
> 
> Imgur
> Imgur
> ...


 are you measuring the basking tempreture now? what is it?

where exactly is the thermometer probe exactly, and thermostat probe?


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## JakeBooth (Mar 26, 2015)

_Thats really strange as i have a 4ft tank , i use a 60w bulb and my normal UVB Tube and that heats to 85degrees , then i put heat mat on for 1 hour and its at 110 all day , maybe you have put a bulb in that doesnt produce heat , i use Komodo branded bulbs , and they do just fine.
£3.99 from most pet shops , i suggest you get one , 
hope this helped
*Regards , Jake*_


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## kylepender (May 24, 2014)

It's a Komode branded bulb, the temperatures are fine now since putting my heating on for a few hours in the morning.


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

I thin k you are right to think that the hole in the roof is the problem, ad that to the fact that the bulb is on top of the viv and not inside it...

If you can block the hole and connect the light fitting to the inside of the ceiling then you will probably need to drop to a lower wattage altogether 

If you dont want to modify the set up then you could give a halogen flood light a go which will have more heat output for its wattage either a 50w or 75w should do it.


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