# Beardie seeking cold areas



## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

I'm getting worried. My 3 year old female bearded dragon is actively seeking out the coolest area in her viv and then lying there until she is too cold to move, and I have to lift her back into her basking area.
The temps, (digital thermometers) cool end 26*C, hot end 37*C, basking area 42*C, shaded area where she's been lying 24*C. Beardie temp 28*C at last measure (IR temp gun).
UVB 6 month old Arcadia T5 +D3, basking 60w spot (4 days old).
Viv is 3' x 20" x 20", substrate ceramic tile and playsand.
Eating hoppers, 8 a day, plus 2 waxworms. Greens being eaten include collared, brocolli, sugarsnap peas and beans. Water bowl is always in and washed/refilled daily. Hoppers dusted with Nutrobal every day. 
Pooping every other day with no undigested food apparent and urates look good.
Her name is Susie and her parents are mum and dad.
She has been behaving this way since the weather improved here, but there has been no physical change in her viv or the living room she is in.
Thanks for any help:2thumb:


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## Scrimey (May 12, 2012)

If she's moving to a cool place she is more than likely hot , try leaving the door slightly open to allow some air flow into the viv , but that's all I got : victory:


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

Hi Scrimey and thanks for the reply. She really has got me worried this time. I understand what your saying and normally that would be right, but her temperature is so low, and she's trying to drive it lower, that its almost as though she has a death wish.
As she is a she, I'll try pampering her in a bath when I decide how warm/cool it should be for her to avoid any thermal shock if her core temp is also low.
Onward and upward.
Cheers Reg


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

You've said nothing about her UVb. If this is not up to scratch then she will, despite the temps, think it is winter. How old is your tube and what percentage is it? The other possibility is that your thermometer is not reading properly. You have said it is digital but that still doesn't guarantee that it's accurate.


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## Martin88 (Aug 9, 2009)

jools said:


> You've said nothing about her UVb. If this is not up to scratch then she will, despite the temps, think it is winter. How old is your tube and what percentage is it? The other possibility is that your thermometer is not reading properly. You have said it is digital but that still doesn't guarantee that it's accurate.


You owe an apology. Read again.

Arcadia 12% 6 months old.....


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

Thanks Martin
Hi jools. The digital thermometer has had its battery changed and the temperature reading was double checked with an IR temp gun. Today she has spent most of her time on the coolest area of substrate and away from the UVB tube and basking light. Two hours before lights out she did get on to her basking spot, where she has stayed and is now sleeping. I've left the winter moonlight bulb on (exo terra 15w) which keeps the night-time temp at 28*C on her basking spot, with the cool end dropping to 16*C.
It's strange how she wants the heat before bedtime but not the rest of the day - that's what I am worried about. 
Brain surgery is easier than understanding beardies!
Reg


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## tomcannon (Jan 2, 2008)

Has she had a parasite test recently and has she been on any meds?


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

Hi Tom, No and no. That was easy. Seriously though, this cannot be more brumation as all the indicators are saying fine weather now and ahead. This is very much out of character for her. While not the most active dragon she is generally alert and inquisitive. Ate a little less today and has not pooped for 2 days. (Probably why she's eaten less).


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## vgorst (Sep 27, 2011)

regtuck said:


> Thanks Martin
> Hi jools. The digital thermometer has had its battery changed and the temperature reading was double checked with an IR temp gun. Today she has spent most of her time on the coolest area of substrate and away from the UVB tube and basking light. Two hours before lights out she did get on to her basking spot, where she has stayed and is now sleeping. I've left the winter moonlight bulb on (exo terra 15w) which keeps the night-time temp at 28*C on her basking spot, with the cool end dropping to 16*C.
> It's strange how she wants the heat before bedtime but not the rest of the day - that's what I am worried about.
> Brain surgery is easier than understanding beardies!
> Reg


Hi Reg,
Do you usually give her that night time heating? Have you not tried providing it at all and seeing if that makes a difference?

Also whereabouts is the UVB? (i.e. right at the top of the tank or hanging down?)

It is a weird one, with those temperatures I wouldn't expect that she's too warm during the day.


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

Hi Vgorst - nothing new about Dubai roaches I'm afraid, but still looking.
Re night time heating, I use it because the house has to be kept cool because I'm looking after my daughters Alaskan Malamute which means no heat or heating, and I live in the north of scotland where it can still hit minus temperatures at night.
The Arcadia 12% tube is on the back wall 5" - 10" from the basking area.
The basking spotlight is a 60w, between 5" and 10" from the basking area.
The temps that I have in there now are what has been there for a year with no problems. The only logical answer is that something isn't right with susie as everything else is the same, and there are plenty of options for her to thermoregulate but she is only looking for the coldest possible position.
Not mentioned before, but her colours are normal with no stress marks or black beard,
but she has prickled up when I have moved her from the cold spot to the basking area on several occasions. I hope this is helpful. Reg


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## vgorst (Sep 27, 2011)

regtuck said:


> Hi Vgorst - nothing new about Dubai roaches I'm afraid, but still looking.
> Re night time heating, I use it because the house has to be kept cool because I'm looking after my daughters Alaskan Malamute which means no heat or heating, and I live in the north of scotland where it can still hit minus temperatures at night.
> The Arcadia 12% tube is on the back wall 5" - 10" from the basking area.
> The basking spotlight is a 60w, between 5" and 10" from the basking area.
> ...


Thanks Reg, that piece of work is finished with now but any new info would still be great. Hoping to compile all that data and try and make it into something a little more meaningful for reptile keepers. You've reminded me, I still need to send that work off to Paignton!! Only slightly delayed... :whistling2:

Back on topic! Are you able to lower her night time temperatures at all? Not taking it away completely but lowering the wattage or if it's attached to a thermostat. Oooor, shave the dog and put the heating on 

I'm wondering if it is a reaction to the weather, I know it's been snowing recently in some areas and gales and raining in others. Might be worth checking those dastardly barometric pressures and seeing if they've dipped recently?

It also might be worth decreasing the provision of Nutrobal (maybe to a couple of times a week) and providing calci-dust in a bowl (if you aren't already). As you have a T5 light, dietary intake of D3 shouldn't be too frequent otherwise you risk overdosing her. It may be that she is perhaps trying to avoid the UVB because of the amount of D3 she's getting through her diet?


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## tomcannon (Jan 2, 2008)

I'd also suggest sending off a sample to PALS for a full faecal screen.


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

Hi Vickie, glad that I reminded you.
The dog read your suggestion and is now halfway to Norway, still swimming.
The weather has been right for this time of year, so I don't think that is the cause.
Your last paragraph makes a lot of sense. I was just about to change her supplementation to Repashy calcium +, which seems to be a more appropriate product, with some Superpig mixed in with it. To start with I'll dust livefood only, every other feed. Regarding the UVB exposure, I'll lower basking area / raise the tube, to increase her distance from it, but keep her temps steady.
It's great when other people can think outside of the box!
Reg


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

tomcannon said:


> I'd also suggest sending off a sample to PALS for a full faecal screen.


Hi Tom and thanks for that. She hasn't had a faecal test done for a long time, so it would be a good idea to get that done as well as making the changes that Vgorst has suggested.
Thank you, Reg


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## regtuck (Oct 7, 2012)

A quick update for everyone.
First, I did as vgorst suggested, raising the UVB tube and removing a lot of the furniture that provided a high basking area close to the tube and basking light. This effectively dropped the basking area to the vivarium floor, putting 14" between it and the lights. She still has 2 wood tunnels in if she needs to shelter from UVB or heat.
Second, the basking area temp is now down to 37*C, with the cool end still at 26*C.
Third, the change in her is AMAZING. She is now very active moving all around the viv and cocking her head checking out light sources as she goes. Doubtless she is also finding out where the best temp is for her as well. She has made no attempt to hide in the tunnels or flatten herself on the coldest spot - in fact, she enjoys lounging on the top of the tunnels. It really is as though somebody has found her ON switch.
Thanks ever so much to you all for seeing what I couldn't see. The change to Repashy calcium + will be immediate, and when I collect enough samples PALs will be getting a present from me.
Susie also says thanks and is blowing kisses your way:flrt:
Many thanks again, Reg


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## berbers (May 29, 2010)

Vgorst - thats a really interesting theory regarding uv and calcium, even more interesting to hear its had the desired effect. Many reptile keepers automatically assume higher uv = better


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