# Dogs welcome.. Except staffies!!



## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

FUMING! :whip:

Had a nice day out today visiting family and I took the dogs for a walk through the village and came across the local pet shop. Small, but packed to the rafters with things and I wanted to have a nose inside. A big sign on the door clearly said DOGS WELCOME, so after having a look at the window display, I went to walk inside.

All of the sudden the lady behind the counter started waving her arms around and yelled "STOP!!" I was a bit taken aback to realise that she was looking at me, and found myself stopping, mainly due to my surprise.

She then said "I dont like _those_ dogs - they aren't allowed in." 
:gasp:

Just from standing in the doorway I could see at least 5 other dogs in the shop, their owners all staring at me, a little surprised too it appeared.

I pointed out that the sign on the door says dogs welcome, and she repeated herself once more and said "yes, but not THOSE dogs. They are horrible - I don't like them." As she said this, my dogs were sitting patiently by my side, not taking any notice of the other dogs, as usual, and 2 JRTs were straining at their leads, baring their teeth and growling and yapping and making an awful racket.

I politely and calmly said that seeing as staffies are such a popular dog, I imagine she is losing quite a lot of business with that ridiculous attitude, before I left. It wasn't until I was walking away that I realised how angry I was. I really am fed up of these dogs, and others like them, being discriminated against 

Anybody else had anything similar to this?


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## Mike1 (Feb 10, 2012)

Shes a dog racist!!!


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## Andy (Jul 27, 2005)

That would really annoy me too, I have two staffies and would go apesh*t if they did that.


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## jaykickboxer (Feb 11, 2008)

What a clown I would be fuming too not sure there's anything u can do tho,


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Gotta say, I'm not crazy about staffies at all, and wouldn't choose to have them within my own space/property. There's no point calling people about their own personal preferences though, because I'm sure there are things you don't like too. Everyone has some form of prejudice at some point.....it's human nature. But it's tactless to be so vocal about it when that could upset an individual.

Having said that, she's an utter knob for thinking that anyone can afford to turn down potential business these days!


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## PPVallhunds (May 23, 2010)

guess she will be missing out on a lot if business then. wonder if other staff owners in the area knows that they are not welcome in her pet shop.

A friend was shocked once but peoples attitudes to staffys a few years ago. She lived with a couple who owned a staffy, she owned a pom and Lhasa's and when she walked her dogs she was always stopped by people aking about them and wanting to meet her dogs. Then one day she decided to walk her house mates staff and she couldn't believe the people running across the road and dragging there kids into the road to avoid her and the staff.

I can understand why some people would be afraid of them, my mother was attacked by a GSD when she was a kid (still has the scars around her neck from it) so so doesn't like big dogs and dogs of breeds that look scary which was why I went for a smaller breed as the ones I liked she was afraid of. But for many people they have never had a bad experience with one they just read the papers and believe everything the read and that's the only basis of there dislike. 

When im out with my girl I treat all dogs the same no matter the breed, if I don't know them she goes back on lead until I know there ok. 
Met a right :censor: of an owner the other month who said his dog was friendly so let mine off then his dog went up to mine and snapped at her! he then said how his dog allways bites first and asks questions later and it was nasty as it was abused by its last owner! I even asked my friend if I had miss hurd him and she also hurd him say it was friendly.


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## cloggers (Mar 13, 2010)

I gave up on people when I had my GSD, the people in the park that use to come over when she was a fluffball would run a mile when she grew into her looks. 
Went into the vets with her once and got asked to stand outside because a woman in the waiting room was scared of dogs..

I can understand some peoples issues though, I live in staffy central, every other dog is a staff. If your dog is gonna get attacked round here you can guarantee they're normally the culprit, so people are nervous of them. But thats because of the people as well. They're personally not my kind of dog, but I have no prejudice towards them.


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## Ginapx (Jul 31, 2013)

We have had some similar trouble with our dogs, the most ridiculous being similar to TractorTotty where we were refused entry to a pet shop with our perfectly behaved doberman and dogue de bordeaux whilst there was a yappy little schnauzer terrifying the rabbits and guinea pigs. We did try to reason with the owner/manager/evicter stating that all our dogs are regularly in contact with young defenceless animals due to my bf's family owning farms but our days of shopping there are now over as our pleas were rebuffed. 

The worst thing is when people go out their of their way just to dodge you in when out for walks even though my dogs are always by my side and 100% under control. I understand why but the dogs that want to tear your face off don't wait until you are right beside them.


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## Alex Boswell (Apr 15, 2012)

To be honest I don't particularly like Staffies, however I have got to say that I don't agree with what she did to you. She should either allow all dogs or no dogs in her premises, not just 'discriminate' on the one's she doesn't like the look of... stupid cow


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## spudfarrar (Nov 14, 2012)

TractorTotty said:


> FUMING! :whip:
> 
> Had a nice day out today visiting family and I took the dogs for a walk through the village and came across the local pet shop. Small, but packed to the rafters with things and I wanted to have a nose inside. A big sign on the door clearly said DOGS WELCOME, so after having a look at the window display, I went to walk inside.
> 
> ...


Wow you really dont have much luck with people taking a dislike towards your staffie must say I do feel for you I used to own a staff nd they really do get a bad name through a minority of baduns most of them are fantastic dogs especially with people you dont see people judging labradors or such like.......


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

If I were in the shop, with maxi ( golden doodle ) whilst you were told to leave. I would of fully flipped. 

I'd go to papers.


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Great replies! Thanks guys! 

Spud, you're right, I don't have much luck with dogs haha! It is okay when I am 'home' in Suffolk because we live on a farm and if we dont want to see other dogs or people, we dont have to (how unsociable does that sound, haha :blush but also we are surrounded by tiny little sleepy villages and the majority of people wouldn't even know what a 'staff' is and therefore have no fear and treat my boys the same as any other dog.. It is when I am visiting my parents in Essex or family in surrounding areas that the trouble starts. 
There are an awful lot of staffies around here and you do occasionally hear of a staffy that has caused a row but more often that not if when you go for walks etc that other staffs you meet are perfectly well behaved and friendly.

Gina, my parents own Dogue De Bordeauxs also and Bull Mastiffs, I must say the response that we tend to get to them is completely different to the staffies, people don't show much fear of them at all, which is ridiculous as they are scared of the staffies ~ and no they are not aggressive in the slightest and it is a bit of a sight to see us walking 2 staffies, a bullmastiff and 3 dogue de bordeaux and a tiny little yappy terrier, but people always want to come and fuss all of the dogs apart from my staffs, which makes me mad :devil:

Val, I too hate it when people discriminate against them when they have no actual experience of them and just go by what they read. I have actually had a few people come up to me and say that they are normally scared of staffies but not so much when they see them with a 'decent, respectable looking person' and the dogs are clearly under control and well behaved. Which is nice to know, but it does show that it is the whole image of the tough people and their status dogs that people are afraid of. Fair enough though if, like your mother, she had a bad experience with a certain breed. 

FreekyGeeky, it's nice to know that someone would have stuck up for me!! I would go to the papers but as the media tend to be staffy-hating anyway I doubt they would be on my side. 

_EDIT;_ Just thought I would add that since owning my boys, especially the puppy, they have been attacked a handful of times, all whilst under my control at my side and on the leads.. three times the attackers were labradors, twice were jack russells, and once was a chihuahua! And the chi actually drew quite alot of blood too!! You would never see that in the local paper but if it was a staff that bit another dog it would be everywhere and there would be a local manhunt and people saying the dog should be put down!! :gasp:


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## KanAsBoas (Aug 22, 2012)

Owning 2 large GSDs iv had this esp with my male as he is HUGE and for some reason a verylarge head :lol2: and alot of people say he looks intimidating to look at (sp) iv been refused a house for rent when they found out the 2 dogs was GSDs and not small things one woman said nope sorry dont want cat killers in my house :lol2: 
Been asked to leave shops also that have signs up saying dogs allowed and asked why and got because they dont get on with people they dont know thats why the police have them and because there guard dogs, just wish someone would tell mine that they are guard dogs :lol2:


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## samurai (Sep 9, 2009)

If I was in the shop while the owner told you to leave with your Staffies I would of walked out with you, but not before telling the shop owner how disgusted I felt :devil:


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

KansasBoas.. Gosh, it's ridiculous isn't it!? 
It does make me laugh how all of these people that ban entry to shops etc for all of these absurd reasons actually have little to no knowledge of dogs and certain dog breeds in most cases.. otherwise we wouldn't have such ignorance amongst people. 
As said a little earlier in this thread ~ a lot of people make up their minds based on the media and what others say.. *sheep* springs to mind.



samurai said:


> If I was in the shop while the owner told you to leave with your Staffies I would of walked out with you, but not before telling the shop owner how disgusted I felt :devil:


Aww thankyou Samurai.. why are there no people who live near me who would be willing to stick up for me haha! Come live closer!


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## KanAsBoas (Aug 22, 2012)

TractorTotty said:


> KansasBoas.. Gosh, it's ridiculous isn't it!?
> It does make me laugh how all of these people that ban entry to shops etc for all of these absurd reasons actually have little to no knowledge of dogs and certain dog breeds in most cases.. otherwise we wouldn't have such ignorance amongst people.
> As said a little earlier in this thread ~ a lot of people make up their minds based on the media and what others say.. *sheep* springs to mind.
> 
> ...


I just ignore it now but it does annoy me I just dont let them see it


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## Tops (Apr 26, 2007)

should have gotten a spaniel. Noone holds a grudge against a spaniel.


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## repnanny (Aug 12, 2010)

Have to disagree about spaniels, only time I have ever been bitten was by one when I was about 8 years old. I wasnt even near it, it was off the lead came running up and tried to grab my ice cream and 64 stitches, many years later and a nasty scar I still dont like them!


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## Alex Boswell (Apr 15, 2012)

repnanny said:


> Have to disagree about spaniels, only time I have ever been bitten was by one when I was about 8 years old. I wasnt even near it, it was off the lead came running up and tried to grab my ice cream and 64 stitches, many years later and a nasty scar I still dont like them!


Well I have 3 King Charles spaniels, and I can say they are very placid animals - One of the best breeds to be around children I have heard, so you must have bumped into a very nasty specimen.


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Staffies are also fantastic around children, I personally think of them as one of the best breeds to have around kids. They aren't known as the Nanny Dogs for nothing 

No you're right Tops, no-one has anything against spaniels, labs, terriers, hounds etc.. we have a variety of different working/gundogs also, of different breeds. They're not a problem ~ no-one bats an eyelid at them. Although I trust my staffies far more around kids than I would any of our other dogs.


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## samurai (Sep 9, 2009)

Tops said:


> should have gotten a spaniel. Noone holds a grudge against a spaniel.


 
I don't dislike any breed but I've met far more Spaniels than Staffies who will bite with what would appear very little provocation (I think the breeds proneness to painful ear infections has quite a bit to answer for here; causing some individuals to associate touch with pain). 

People need to be educated on how to read a dog's body language properly as that would significantly reduce the number of bites that occur rather than assuming some breeds are safer than others and shunning the breeds who have been given a bad rep. (This would of course rely on people listening to what the dog is trying to tell them and dealing with the behaviour in a way that makes the dog safer rather than more dangerous).


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

samurai said:


> I don't dislike any breed but I've met far more Spaniels than Staffies who will bite with what would appear very little provocation (I think the breeds proneness to painful ear infections has quite a bit to answer for here; causing some individuals to associate touch with pain).
> 
> People need to be educated on how to read a dog's body language properly as that would significantly reduce the number of bites that occur rather than assuming some breeds are safer than others and shunning the breeds who have been given a bad rep. (This would of course rely on people listening to what the dog is trying to tell them and dealing with the behaviour in a way that makes the dog safer rather than more dangerous).


this ^^^^^^^^


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## Tops (Apr 26, 2007)

noone breeds spaniels as fighting dogs though, they also dont have a reputation as 'status' dogs or a dog for chavs.
I was using spaniel as a generic 'accepted' breed. im sure labrador would have fit just as well. There will always be examples of any breed that have bitten.


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## lisadew24 (Jul 31, 2010)

Tops said:


> should have gotten a spaniel. Noone holds a grudge against a spaniel.


Have you never heard of cocker rage, I work in a pet shop and all dogs are welcome even the breeds I don't like, I wish I could just let dogs in and keep some people tied up outside my shop, my job would be so much easier


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

I hate the whole 'fighting dog' reputation  Staffords were originally and traditionally bred in England to be dual purpose; farm dogs ~ for ratting and foxing, and to be an all-round excellent family dog, hence the nickname the Nanny Dog. Mine do just that ~ excellent farm dogs and excellent family dogs. They are living the exact life that they were bred for.. and no fighting here!

I am sure you can make any dog into a 'fighting dog' if you tried hard enough, with a few exceptions maybe.

A very misunderstood breed  

Edited to add that I *despise* the fact that they are known to some as 'chavs dogs'.. I have had a lot of people voice their surprise upon finding out that I own Staffords.. I have gotten numerous comments such as "YOU have staffs? But you're such a girly girl! And you're a farmer?! People like you don't have dogs like that!!" It makes me sooo mad!!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

you can't take some dogs into certain areas, around certain people...

it goes with the territory...

big, powerful dogs make some folks uneasy... you have to respect that...


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

I respect that some people don't like dogs at all. I also respect that some people have a genuine fear of certain breeds or types, perhaps due to being bitten or something. I do not force any of my dogs on people that do not want them around, be it the staffs, spaniels, terriers, lab or the hound. But what I cannot stand is 'discriminating,' if that is the right word, against one certain breed of dog when all others are 'okay' - for example, the pet shop situation where dogs were allowed except staffies. If you are not going to allow certain breeds in, don't let any breeds in.

And I would hardly call a Stafford a big dog. Mine both only weigh about 20kg each and only stand about 15" off the ground at the very most. They are our smallest dog apart from the jack russells - smaller than all of the spaniels.


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

We have the same issues with our staffie, Ronnie. I've never had such a kind, caring and good natured dog. He's well trained, well mannered, goes to obedience class once a week, and is also scared of his own shadow. But there have been times when were walking him and people cross the road, pick there dogs up to walk past. He's even been kicked when we've been walking up the woods. More education is needed with staffies, there is a reason why the Victorians called them nanny dogs. They're one of the best breeds out there, only in right hands of course. I like them sooooo much, were getting another one. Well done with standing your ground, maybe someone will put her in her place in time


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

i'm all black lab and beagle here...


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## GECKO MICK (Jun 6, 2012)

This would really annoy me to as I have a Staffordshire bull terrier and he's as soft as a brush.


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

HABU said:


> i'm all black lab and beagle here...


I also have the same - 2 labs and one beagle. And as much as I like them, my Staffords are better dogs hands down, in every way.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Dog destroyed after vicious attack on teenage girl near Mylor: WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGE (From Falmouth Packet)

they look and are like a pit bull...

dangerous things...


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Boy, 3, left with horrific facial injuries as Labrador savages him at Poole Harbour | Mail Online

Pitbulls are also great dogs. I shall be getting one at some point too. Lovely animals.


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## lisadew24 (Jul 31, 2010)

I find jack Russell's are the worst breed for biting and even some yorkies mostly all staffs that come in are lovely and the only one that I had that was agressive was a lab cross staff.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

staffies and pits have that head for one reason...



















who's worried about a shih tzu?:lol2::lol2:


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

HABU said:


> image
> 
> Dog destroyed after vicious attack on teenage girl near Mylor: WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGE (From Falmouth Packet)
> 
> ...


Go do one mate


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> Go do one mate


Why should he? Habu's only expressing an opinion on an open forum.....one that many many people share! 

But everytime anyone tries to say this on RFUK, they get shouted down. They're still valid points.

You say that staffs are safe around kids.....I would have thought their strength and boisterousness alone would mean that extra caution is needed to stop kids getting flattened, even if it's in play!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

mrcriss said:


> Why should he? Habu's only expressing an opinion on an open forum.....one that many many people share!
> 
> But everytime anyone tries to say this on RFUK, they get shouted down. They're still valid points.
> 
> You say that staffs are safe around kids.....I would have thought their strength and boisterousness alone would mean that extra caution is needed to stop kids getting flattened, even if it's in play!


 what's, "go do one mean"?:blush:


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

HABU said:


> what's, "go do one mean"?:blush:


It means "p*ss off" in colloquial chav speak:lol2:


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## lisadew24 (Jul 31, 2010)

I don't think a child should be left unattended with any dog from chihuahua to Great Dane as all dogs have teeth designed to chew through meat and bone


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

mrcriss said:


> Why should he? Habu's only expressing an opinion on an open forum.....one that many many people share!
> 
> But everytime anyone tries to say this on RFUK, they get shouted down. They're still valid points.
> 
> You say that staffs are safe around kids.....I would have thought their strength and boisterousness alone would mean that extra caution is needed to stop kids getting flattened, even if it's in play!


Everyone is entitled to there opinion. That's not the problem. It's when you get people on any forum shouting about a topic they know nothing about. Does he own a staff???? Or any dog??? Yeah my staffie is strong, but is also as soft as a brush. He's not boisterous, intact there are times when he's a lazy little sod. I don't believe I said that they're safe around kids either, maybe you should read things a little better before putting words in people's mouths


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

I don't leave children unattended with dogs, no matter what breed they are. And I didn't say they are 'safe' around kids, no dog is, and you should never trust a dog 100%, but I said they are GOOD with kids. Which they are.

Habu, you made a point about staffie's 'head shape' and put a picture up.. what are you getting at? What does their head shape have to do with anything? 
You think that just because they are brachycephalic they are 'dangerous'? Pugs & French Bulldogs (etc) are also brachycephalic along with many others.. your statement has proven nothing.
It is things like this, just random 'facts' and 'statements' from people who are not knowledgeable about dogs and dog breeds, that rile me.


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Double post.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> Everyone is entitled to there opinion. That's not the problem. It's when you get people on any forum shouting about a topic they know nothing about. Does he own a staff???? Or any dog??? Yeah my staffie is strong, but is also as soft as a brush. He's not boisterous, intact there are times when he's a lazy little sod. I don't believe I said that they're safe around kids either, maybe you should read things a little better before putting words in people's mouths


I'm talking about that woman banging on about "nanny dogs". Why are you so sure I'm aiming my comment at you? Guilty conscience?

I don't own a staff or anything like them.....never have and never will. Doesn't mean to say people have no experience of them. I've worked with many at the rscpa, my friends have had them, my street is littered with the flaming things, and you can't move for them in the local park. I won't even go near the one at puppy school. 

Let's face it, there are only a few breeds that make one's pulse quicken as they approach you on the pavement, and staffs are one of them. Yes it may be down to the owner, but the fact is that this breed is becoming a problem in this country, and something needs to be done about it. Lest we forget the recent beheading of another dog by a staff!


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

.....and as such, I can't blame that woman in the shop for being nervous about them. After all, you don't know what kind of experiences they may have had with staffs in that shop. So before you all start shooting your mouths of about the shop owner, maybe you should have asked her for comprehensive reasons why?


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

"That woman?" Well aren't you a charmer. And I was not 'banging on' about nanny dogs - that is something that isn't opinion, that's a fact. Something that seems to be lacking in this thread, actually.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

TractorTotty said:


> I don't leave children unattended with dogs, no matter what breed they are.
> 
> Habu, you made a point about staffie's 'head shape' and put a picture up.. what are you getting at? What does their head shape have to do with anything?
> You think that just because they are brachycephalic they are 'dangerous'? Pugs & French Bulldogs (etc) are also brachycephalic along with many others.. your statement has proven nothing.
> It is things like this, just random 'facts' and 'statements' from people who are not knowledgeable about dogs and dog breeds, that rile me.


"What does their head shape have to do with anything?* "


...* really?:lol2:

what does having long legs and big chest have to do with greyhounds and such?... or long ears and big snout have to do with beagles or blood hounds?

most all breeds were designed for a purpose...


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

TractorTotty said:


> "That woman?" Well aren't you a charmer. And I was not 'banging on' about nanny dogs - that is something that isn't opinion, that's a fact. Something that seems to be lacking in this thread, actually.


Look...you started the thread. You can't expect everyone to instantly agree with you on your rant in some kind of RFUK witch-hunt. If you can't cope with differing opinions, then don't post, lady!


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

mrcriss said:


> I'm talking about that woman banging on about "nanny dogs". Why are you so sure I'm aiming my comment at you? Guilty conscience?
> 
> I don't own a staff or anything like them.....never have and never will. Doesn't mean to say people have no experience of them. I've worked with many at the rscpa, my friends have had them, my street is littered with the flaming things, and you can't move for them in the local park. I won't even go near the one at puppy school.
> 
> Let's face it, there are only a few breeds that make one's pulse quicken as they approach you on the pavement, and staffs are one of them. Yes it may be down to the owner, but the fact is that this breed is becoming a problem in this country, and something needs to be done about it. Lest we forget the recent beheading of another dog by a staff!


I haven't got a guilty conscience, I'm just a bit more educated in the breed than people like yourself. And if a dog that weighs around the same as a small child gets your pulse racing, I'm surprised you make it out the door in the morning, what with the school run and all that. It's not the breed that is the problem, it's the owners. When we go to our local park or to obedience class, he's the only staff there, so I may use Chav language, but I think what your saying says a lot for rochdale


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

the years that i had my doberman, i came to realize that i had a responsibility in keeping that dog... he struck fear into people's souls...

if my dog frightened others then i had a duty to keep my dog away from those folks...

whether they understood the breed never mattered... they had the right not to be worried about a scary dog...


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## diddlydee (May 17, 2012)

mrcriss said:


> It means "p*ss off" in colloquial chav speak:lol2:


misterchris, did you not, on a recent thread regarding whether cross-breed's are worth the monies people are paying for them accuse other members of snobbery?? Tell me, what is 'colloquial chav speak' for 'hypocritical'?

ps it's a mongrel.


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

HABU said:


> the years that i had my doberman, i came to realize that i had a responsibility in keeping that dog... he struck fear into people's souls...
> 
> if my dog frightened others then i had a duty to keep my dog away from those folks...
> 
> whether they understood the breed never mattered... they had the right not to be worried about a scary dog...


You should realise your responsibility of keeping a dog starts the day you pick him/her from the litter. You can't control other people's judgement, as long as you are responsible and accountable, there shouldn't be a problem


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> I haven't got a guilty conscience, I'm just a bit more educated in the breed than people like yourself. And if a dog that weighs around the same as a small child gets your pulse racing, I'm surprised you make it out the door in the morning, what with the school run and all that. It's not the breed that is the problem, it's the owners. When we go to our local park or to obedience class, he's the only staff there, so I may use Chav language, but I think what your saying says a lot for rochdale


Your jibe about Rochdale is oh so hilarious:whistling2:....I know it's a crap-hole, and don't originate from here. I only live here through necessity. So that's dealt with.

A staffie may weigh the same as a child, but it has a hell of a lot more power! And the weaponry to match dear!

I've already stated that I have plenty of experience with the breed through my old job, so I still consider my opinions to be well informed.




diddlydee said:


> misterchris, did you not, on a recent thread regarding whether cross-breed's are worth the monies people are paying for them accuse other members of snobbery?? Tell me, what is 'colloquial chav speak' for 'hypocritical'?


I was explaining the term "do one" to a non-native in a humourous way. I can hardly be accused of hypocrisy on the strength of that darling!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Veeny said:


> You should realise your responsibility of keeping a dog starts the day you pick him/her from the litter. You can't control other people's judgement, _*as long as you are responsible and accountable, there shouldn't be a problem*_



yeah... in a perfect world that would apply to most everything...

... in a perfect world..: victory:


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

:shock:... At what point did I say that everyone has to agree with me..? I am a tad confused. I have also not at any other point said that nobody can have opinions.. but I also have them, and that is what I am putting across. Why is it okay for all the staff-haters to have opinions but no-one else? So people can be against staffs, but not for them?

If I didn't want people to add their opinions, I would not have put this in an open forum. The point was, if you read my original post, to get other peoples' opinions and experiences of the situation that I found myself in.

All I can say is that if you agreed with the pet shop owner for not letting in certain breeds of dog, well it is probably a good thing that you yourself do not own a pet shop too. As you may be able to tell from this thread, discriminating against certain breeds and types tends to rile a lot of people up..

Habu ~ well done, all dogs were bred for a purpose. I stated earlier what staffies were bred for. Actually, not *all* dogs were bred for a specific purpose other than to be pets and look pretty, especially alot of newer breeds, but still a purpose a guess. My dogs are living exactly how they should be, doing exactly what they were bred for, thankyou very much. I wonder if your labrador is a working retriever, flushing or retrieving and I wonder if your beagle is being used as a scent dog in a hunt? 
Again, you are making these 'points' which are actually 'pointless.'

I knew when I took on my first stafford that it may cause a bit of controversy. I didn't however, realise quite how strongly I would feel about it and how defensive & protective I would be of them. 

Luckily, I live in an old village where people don't class dogs as 'good breeds' and 'bad breeds' - dogs are just dogs. That is how I like it.


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

mrcriss said:


> Your jibe about Rochdale is oh so hilarious:whistling2:....I know it's a crap-hole, and don't originate from here. I only live here through necessity. So that's dealt with.
> 
> A staffie may weigh the same as a child, but it has a hell of a lot more power! And the weaponry to match dear!
> 
> ...


In the words of Michael winner "calm down dear, it's only a staffie"


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

TractorTotty said:


> :shock:... At what point did I say that everyone has to agree with me..? I am a tad confused. I have also not at any other point said that nobody can have opinions.. but I also have them, and that is what I am putting across. Why is it okay for all the staff-haters to have opinions but no-one else? So people can be against staffs, but not for them?
> 
> If I didn't want people to add their opinions, I would not have put this in an open forum. The point was, if you read my original post, to get other peoples' opinions and experiences of the situation that I found myself in.
> 
> ...


 so just how many breeds and how many decades have you been at this?

the rarest thing on earth is a dog expert... even vets will tell you about how little they know about the myriad breeds in the world... let alone the mutts and crosses...

so how's you pekingese doing?










just like a mini-staffie eh?:lol2:


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

HABU said:


> so just how many breeds and how many decades have you been at this?
> 
> the rarest thing on earth is a dog expert... even vets will tell you about how little they know about the myriad breeds in the world... let alone the mutts and crosses...
> 
> ...


So if the rarest thing on earth is dog expert, what god given right do you have to lecture somebody else on, wait for it...........dogs!!!!!! You really are a t:censor:t mate. That's colloquial for a total d:censor:k


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

HABU said:


> image
> 
> just like a mini-staffie eh?:lol2:


In your words, yep ~ as they are brachycephalic too! Just like a stafford! One of 'those heads' - and of course we all know that that head shape means one thing!! :gasp:

Shot yourself in the foot there, poppet. 

I never claimed to be a dog expert. Find a quote from me on these whole forums that says that. There is no such thing as a dog expert.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Veeny said:


> So if the rarest thing on earth is dog expert, what god given right do you have to lecture somebody else on, wait for it...........dogs!!!!!! You really are a t:censor:t mate. That's colloquial for a total d:censor:k


i just know that people don't know everything...

at 52, i've learned that i don't know much other that the observation that most others don't know that much either...

we're all just winging it and doing the best we can to sort it all out...

we have wars... domestic violence... animal cruelty ...

name one area where people have their act together...

dogs?... you think the one thing humans have right is dogs?

heck!... if you can figure out dogs and have everyone agree with you then you are wasting your time... run for prime minister and help figure out people as you have dogs...

put that talent to terrorism and save us and the dogs...:notworthy:


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> In the words of Michael winner "calm down dear, it's only a staffie"


Chav speak *and* quoting Michael Winner! WOW...what a catch you must be! I bet you vote Tory and read the Daily Mail too:notworthy::notworthy::notworthy:


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

HABU said:


> i just know that people don't know everything...
> 
> at 52, i've learned that i don't know much other that the observation that most others don't know that much either...
> 
> ...


I never once said that, in your words, that humans have right is dogs. I've never said that I can or figured out dogs. With people like you around who needs sigmund freud


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Veeny said:


> I never once said that, in your words, that humans have right is dogs. I've never said that I can or figured out dogs. With people like you around who needs sigmund freud


wow... and i'm a dog person...

semper fidelis!:2thumb:


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

mrcriss said:


> Chav speak *and* quoting Michael Winner! WOW...what a catch you must be! I bet you vote Tory and read the Daily Mail too:notworthy::notworthy::notworthy:


I don't read the daily mail. It's full of old tosh, but I do vote Tory. It's the only way to keep the north of the country in there houses and on the doll.:lol2:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Veeny said:


> I don't read the daily mail. It's full of old tosh, but I do vote Tory. It's the only way to keep the north of the country in there houses and on the doll.:lol2:


on the doll?


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> I don't read the daily mail. It's full of old tosh, but I do vote Tory. It's the only way to keep the north of the country in there houses and on the *doll*.:lol2:


Seems like the oh so superior folk down south could do with a few more spelling lessons!

I'm not on the DOLE and receive no benefit of any kind, thank you....I have a full time and a part time job.


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## Veeny (May 30, 2013)

mrcriss said:


> Seems like the oh so superior folk down south could do with a few more spelling lessons!
> 
> I'm not on the DOLE....I have a full time and a part time job.


I must apologise. My dyslexia sometimes gets the better of me. Still, I bet your knackerd after a shift in the coal mine, then down to the working mans club for the nightshift.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Veeny said:


> I must apologise. My dyslexia sometimes gets the better of me. Still, I bet your knackerd after a shift in the coal mine, then down to the working mans club for the nightshift.


all my people were coal miners!:2thumb:


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Veeny said:


> I must apologise. My dyslexia sometimes gets the better of me. Still, I bet your knackerd after a shift in the coal mine, then down to the working mans club for the nightshift.


Such wit! Maybe you should ask your beloved Mail for a job?

I'm sure they have spell checker.

There aren't any coal mines....Thatcher closed them all, remember?

You're having a pop at people for stereotyping staffs, but who's the prejudiced hypocrite now?:whistling2:


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## kitkat2 (Jul 18, 2012)

Okay I know its a bit of an extreme comparison but say you had a black friend that you walked into the shop with, would she have a right to say "Oh I dont want a black person in my shop because I got mugged by a black person" or someone with ginger hair and she said "oh I dont want someone with ginger hair in my shop because a ginger person stole something from my shop before"? No. Maybe she has had bad experience with staffs before but looking at the OP's dogs were sitting calmly by her side not even looking at the other dogs then why should there be a problem with them? 

If her dogs were being aggressive then it would be fair enough but her dogs were obviously calm and friendly. 

The only dog that has ever acted aggressively towards me is a small white fluffy dog and the only dog that has ever attacked my staffie x was a small white fluffy dog, but I do not hold grudges against them as they are all individuals.

Yes staffies are a strong breed, but there are lots of other stronger more powerful breeds. Yes their history contains animal baiting and dog fighting but that does not mean they are all vicious, evil, bloodthirsty dogs because it has been a long time since they were used for that and if they are brought up well they are no danger to anyone, surely anyone can see that from the amount of staffies that are loving innocent family pets. They are all individuals, yes some can be prone to dog aggressive, but that doesnt mean they all are and even DA dogs if managed properly they will never be a threat, throughout all their history they have been bred to never be aggressive to humans. 

But then any dog from any breed can be dog aggressive if they have bad experiences or bad socialisation, even small fluffy dogs, any dog of any breed can become human aggressive, any dog of any breed can become aggressive over a whole number of different things. People need to learn to judge the individual rather than judging on looks.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

mrcriss said:


> Such wit! Maybe you should ask your beloved Mail for a job?
> 
> I'm sure they have spell checker.
> 
> ...


well, they're still digging coal out of my family's property in eastern kentucky...










still got dogs too!:lol2:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

big dogs eat big and poop big...


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## diddlydee (May 17, 2012)

mrcriss said:


> I was explaining the term "do one" to a non-native in a humourous way. I can hardly be accused of hypocrisy on the strength of that darling!


You can. You see, you referring to the use of 'go do one mate' as a 'chav colloquialism :lol2:' suggests that you are laughing at people you consider to be chav's. (council housed and violent). This would have been passed-by had you not have referred to a number rfuk members as snobs for suggesting that cross-breed (designer) dogs aren't worth the money that is being paid for them. That is hypocritical. You cant be snobby and accuse other of being snobby, its hypocrisy. Understand??

You, misterchris, are the primary reason I dont use this forum often. It's spoiled by prats who just want to argue. And, as for 'darling'!? WOW! I'll pm you my address, so you can say it to my face


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Oh deary deary me....are we having a little strop sweetie? 

"You're why I don't use this forum!".....I'm genuinely flattered that little moi could have such a profound effect on you:blush:
Nice flouncing
xxx

Back on topic....I wonder how the staffie lovers suggest we cope with the immense problem of irresponsible owners then? The chavs (oops, said it again....slap my cheeky wrists!) that parade around with aggressive trophy dogs? The reckless breeding of more and more dogs which only end up in rescue centres?

You have such a hard time with people viewing you in a certain way....._well how would you solve it?_ (Bearing in mind that the great british public probably wouldn't be too chuffed with spending vast amounts of public money on policing any special licensing effort).


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## diddlydee (May 17, 2012)

mrcriss said:


> Oh deary deary me....are we having a little strop sweetie?
> 
> "You're why I don't use this forum!".....I'm genuinely flattered that little moi could have such a profound effect on you:blush:
> Nice flouncing
> ...


SWEETIE?!?! FLOUNCING?!?!......MOI!?!?! Youre trying to provoke me to insult you, arent you? Youre very clever. Do your classmates normally take the bait?

I'd _solve it_ by engaging in internet conversation with you. I envisage the majority of the more pressing global issues will be resolved this way.

xxx
ps prat
pps mongrel.


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## mrkeda (Nov 6, 2012)

diddlydee said:


> SWEETIE?!?! FLOUNCING?!?!......MOI!?!?! Youre trying to provoke me to insult you, arent you? Youre very clever. Do your classmates normally take the bait?
> 
> I'd _solve it_ by engaging in internet conversation with you. I envisage the majority of the more pressing global issues will be resolved this way.
> 
> ...


You're stinking of butthurt right about now.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

diddlydee said:


> SWEETIE?!?! FLOUNCING?!?!......MOI!?!?! Youre trying to provoke me to insult you, arent you? Youre very clever. Do your classmates normally take the bait?
> 
> I'd _solve it_ by engaging in internet conversation with you. I envisage the majority of the more pressing global issues will be resolved this way.
> 
> ...


I have scant interest in provoking anything in you, love. I couldn't even whip up a froth for you!

"Classmates"???


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

people are people...

dogs are not all dogs...





















dogs are what we created them to be...


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

:whistling2: LOL.


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## Jaydan (Apr 30, 2012)

HABU said:


> people are people...
> 
> dogs are not all dogs...
> 
> ...


works both ways tho....


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## miss_ferret (Feb 4, 2010)

while i certainly dont agree with how the shop owner went about it (being that rude to customers does not give the impression of a well run business), you do have to allow for peoples preferences. regardless of how annoying, 'prejudice' and misinformed they may be.

every time the subject of staffies comes up, you can guarantee someone will say something along the lines of 'staffies are lovely, its those nasty, bitey, yappy jack russells you have to watch'. that drives me insane. jack russells have a bad reputation for the same reasons as staffies: idiotic owners. people get them and dont understand that they're a working breed and need treating/exercising like one. put it this way, the farm i keep my horse on has 4 working jacks. none of them would dream of biting and they bark so rarely that when they do everyone stops and goes to see what the matter is. the dogs are walked for a minimum of 3-4 miles a day, usually more, plus their working duties.

its not just dogs either, try finding a small horse show that will allow stallions on the show ground. the big county shows are usually fine, but not the best place when you've got a 5 year old stallion thats never been shown before.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

yeah I was walking my American Bulldog once and a lady started telling me she was a big nasty staffie and she should be muzzled whilst the whole time her two collies were snarling and barking on their leads whilst Rosie was stood next to me not even acknowledging them, the irony was lost on her even when I pointed it out..


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

I agree also with MissFerret - it isn't just staffies, I know exactly what you mean about jack russells. 
As I mentioned earlier, we own a handful of different breeds, JRTs included, and they all work and do exactly what they are supposed to do. I very much agree with what people say about 'bad owners ~ not bad dogs.' 
My staffords have been attacked a handful of times by labradors, and although that's the last breed people would think of as aggressive, almost all of the owners of said labradors have been absolutely clueless about dog ownership, dog behaviour and body language and dogs in general - I have gauged that just from talking to them briefly in these experiences.


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## danabanana (Sep 16, 2008)

TractorTotty said:


> My staffords have been attacked a handful of times by labradors, and although that's the last breed people would think of as aggressive, almost all of the owners of said labradors have been absolutely clueless about dog ownership, dog behaviour and body language and dogs in general - I have gauged that just from talking to them briefly in these experiences.


Wow this got a little heated...

I have also only ever had problems with labradors (they just don't seem to like my poor boy) - and a dachshund once. 

Not the biggest staff fan in the world but the shop lady was very rude about it and shouldn't have discriminated unless it was the staffs snarling and causing bother. Which, from the original post, I gather it wasn't

Sent from the moon using only the power of my mind


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## sammy1969 (Jul 21, 2007)

I havent read every post on this thread so I dont know if this has been said or not but it truly amazes me the attitude of some ppl when it comes to staffies and other large dog breeds, yet if you look at the true statistics you will find that most bites are given by yorkshire terriers, chihuahuas and other small breed dogs yet you never hear of this in the newspapers or on television. Personally I dont think that any dog breed is completely trustworthy as you wll always find an owner that will not train or treat a dog properly an cause it to bite either in fear or because of the way it has been trained. You dont get a bad dog unless you have a bad owner, yes some dogs do have mental health isssues an di have only ever known of two dogs who despite the best posible care from their owners have, due to what i feel is bad breeding turned when hitting a certain age biting the owner in question neither of whom gave up on the dogs until their was no other option as both had brain health issues. Personally I think it isnt right that the op was descriminated against just because her dogs were staffies and I can honestly say i have never come across a badly behaved one ever and i have known over 30 in my life including ones that were owned by my brother, aunt and my parents who never did anything other than give fantatsic staffies hugs and kisses which are so wonderful and if it werent for the fact that they are such strong and playful i would have one but i am in a wheelchair and find that i could not control one from there even though i have tried. If I were able i would have one trained as my disability dog and prove everyone wrong on their impressions of a staffy


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## wondertuck (Jan 16, 2012)

I'm new to this forum and realise it's a heated subject,, but slagging people off surely isn't the way ahead?

I have a Rescue Staffie and he is lovely. He is no worse or no better than any other breed of dog - he is "himself". He is excellent with adults, children and particularly good with other dogs, both male and female. 3 jack russells, 2 collies, 1 border terrier, 1 westie, 1 chihuahua and one lakeland terrier have all been hostile to him while out for walks while they were offlead and him onlead. Not once has he ever retaliated. I have rabbits which he is lovely with as well as some other small furries. It's sad that people have such low opinions of these dogs, but I can understand to a point as to why. Humans in general have failed this loyal breed immensely and due to their selfishness are the cause of so many being pts on a daily basis. Not everyone who owns a staffie is a chav and a lot of owners of these dogs are very responsible. We have to be as it's been proven just on this thread the prejudice and pressure our dogs are under. One paw wrong and our beloved pets could be pts in an instant because of their breed. 

You can see how dangerous he is here with my son.


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Well said, Wondertuck. 
You said pretty much what I have been trying to get at ~ I am just rubbish with wording things! :blush:
He is absolutely stunning, I love his colours! :flrt:
Congratulations on him and well done for rescuing, and I couldnt agree more whole-heartedly about your bit about *not all stafford owners being chavs*; I most certainly am not one, lol!

Edited to add one last bit ..
the other day a family friend came over with her 3 year old daughter, who adores my Staffords.. they were kept supervised the whole time obviously, as they would be no matter what dog breed they were, but the little girl had a 'tea party' with Tanner, making him pretend cups of tea and pretending to eat slices of cake, and when he got confused and actually did try to eat the plastic slice of cake she yelled "NOO!" at him and he obeyed her straightaway and dropped it.. he sat there for over an hour solid with her, as calm as anything and good as gold, doing everything she told him to, listening with his head on one side and she chattered away to herself.. and I am sure you staffy owners know how hyper they can be! But they just seem to know to be gentle around children. It is always very nice to see, and I do know a lot of children that are growing up with good experiences of staffies and will [hopefully] not turn out to be prejudice against the breed!


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

On the original point made in the thread, that shop owner is being ridiculous.

Having a sign saying dogs allowed then banning 'a dog' is idiotic to say the least.....

I'm not a fan of staffs or many other breed of dogs, but am perfectly aware that they 'can' be soft and loveable. However they also 'can' be snarly and aggressive, just like any breed.

In the same way as people are saying that you get aggressive spaniels/jack Russell's etc, you can get aggressive staffs.

A dog is a dog is a dog. One can be horrible, one can be lovely and another can be somewhere in between.

I currently have a springer and jrt. They are soft as anything. My mum had a golden cocker years back who could be a little git and I wouldn't have trusted him at all with a stranger he didn't know. We've had a GSD who I used to ride on as a toddler, she'd have licked you to death before biting......

It's not the breed that matters, its the individual dog that you need to read and understand. Basically treat all dogs as 'capable' of being aggressive and you won't go far wrong as far as being bitten.

One last point.....

As a dog owner all my life, the one thing I would say with regards to 'big/powerful' breeds. I'd personally never own any dog that myself or my family couldn't overpower if it went off on one for WHATEVER reason.
It could be in pain and willing to attack anything it can, it could develop a mental problem or it could be defensive for whatever reason.

My take is that if my spaniel/jrt or any other 'manageable' dog ever went crazy then I could stop it. I may get bitten but I wouldn't get overpowered and potentially killed. If a large powerful breed did it, that my not be the case, particularly with children or smaller people than me....

It has happened and it will happen again, so for me personally I don't want a pet in my house that could potentially kill or cause massive damage. For the same reason I wouldn't keep venemous snakes! I don't want that sort of risk if it can be avoided - simple.


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## PPVallhunds (May 23, 2010)

Big Red One said:


> As a dog owner all my life, the one thing I would say with regards to 'big/powerful' breeds. I'd personally never own any dog that myself or my family couldn't overpower if it went off on one for WHATEVER reason.
> It could be in pain and willing to attack anything it can, it could develop a mental problem or it could be defensive for whatever reason.


I was at a show a few weeks back and there was a shorter lady with a Newfoundland who couldn't control it, they were stood by the exersize area and the dog was draging her about towards other dogs to jump on them. Don't know if it was just feisty play or not but it was spooking the other dogs it was lunging at, one dog it jumped on growling it made the other dog fall over backwards head over heals in a panic. The poor dog was shaking for hours after.

I said to my friend I don't know why people have dogs they can't physically control. 
There's a few breeds I'd like but I don't think I'd be the right sort of owner they would need so I wouldn't ever have them.


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## x Sarah x (Nov 16, 2007)

Wow, i'd be inclined to write to the local paper and have that story published and name and shame that shop for discrimination against Staffs. Awful.


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## exotic candy (Jun 20, 2012)

well that escalated quickly :lol2:


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## AndyMilts (Oct 30, 2009)

x Sarah x said:


> Wow, i'd be inclined to write to the local paper and have that story published and name and shame that shop for discrimination against Staffs. Awful.


Think that's a good idea, every dog is different, same as every person. 

It's usually not the tattooed skinhead who's the serial killer. but many may avoid contact with them. 

The biggest issue for Staffy owners is press coverage as a lot of dog related incidents in the press are Staffy/ pit bull type dogs. The issue as some else highlight the are determined, powerful and fearless dogs so if they do attack very hard to stop. I would rather be bitten by a spaniel vs a Staff as the damage is likely to be less


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## XOX (Feb 18, 2012)

I must admit i don't really like the staff breed as a whole. I understand why they have the names they do it's because they are powerful, loyal and dominant dogs. However, in saying that they really are great dogs in the right hands. My boxer dog has been attacked on several occasions, by staffs yes, but, mainly by everyone's 'favorite' breed, Labradors. Not only has my dog been attacked by Labs but i have been nipped and growled at by several and human aggression is something i have never seen from a Staff. Again, if you buy a decent blood line (so its not too dominant) and bring it up right Labs can be good dogs too. 
I feel people now days judge dogs by their potential, and Staffs have the potential to kill, much like any other dog. Its wrong, people shouldn't have this prejudice about certain dog breeds, even whilst I walk my dog I do not avoid certain dog breeds, yes i am more aware, but i most defiantly do not avoid a breed, I only avoid individuals...

What that woman did was very wrong and I agree it is defiantly news paper worthy '' The Predjudist Pet Shop '' 
I would read it!! :2thumb:


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

Thankyou for all of your replies.

Just thought I would throw this out there.. Don't think I need to say much to accompany it, just read some of the earlier comments  



HABU said:


> my shihtzu/poodle was vicious as hell when i got her... attacked and bite everyone...
> 
> i turned her into an angel... sweet as pie!
> 
> *it's never the dog... it's the owner who has the problem*...


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

dogs are like guns...

big ones can do damage very fast... small ones less so...

in the wrong hands... gun or dog can murder...

just treat dogs like guns...

food for thought...:whistling2:


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## Kat91 (Sep 19, 2008)

Ignorance. Ignorance, everywhere!


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