# How to Maintain Wild Moss Growth



## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

I guess i've got Stu in mind with this post but i'm sure many others can also contribute.

Last time i picked up a peice of wood from outside, which was covered in lovely green mossy goodness - after a week or two in the viv, all the moss just turned a nasty brown colour and died.
I'm not sure if this was due to the viv conditions or because i soaked the wood in boiling water before i put it in the viv?


So my question is .. how can you maintain the moss in a vivarium? 
do you need to add moss spores to the wood to help maintain it? 
what conditions does moss thrive under? light/shade? wet/dry?


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

Different people will have different ideas, but in this case i would say the boiling water would not have helped. My approach may be slightly different as its lizard and gecko orientated mainly. 

personally all my vivs have wild moss. To keep it growing you need good grow lights and to keep it damp. I soak my moss in rainwater prior to using it and then afix it in the viv, in various places. Native moss, i find will die if it is allowed to dry out for long periods. Some people also say that it needs to cycled as well, with a cool winter period. As my vivs get this anyway I've never tested it by not doing it. 

Even with optimal conditions i find that sometime moss will just die for no real reason, it is a hit and miss game I find. 

Richie, stu and wolfenrook, im sure will be along soon to say how they do it as well. I find growing native moss (not just having it surrive) is one of the hardest things to get right. So many people struggle with it. 

Somone once here said they had great success in mixing up native moss spores with yogurt and pasting it into the viv along with sheet moss, though i havnt tried this myself. 

jay


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Boiling it will definitely kill it, though.


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## detail3r (Jul 13, 2010)

Light, light, light.


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

thanks guys, how could you protect your viv from disease but keep the moss alive? surely microwave/boiling water will both kill the moss?

sorry for probably a stupid question, what's the difference between wild and native moss?


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

Cornish-J said:


> thanks guys, how could you protect your viv from disease but keep the moss alive? surely microwave/boiling water will both kill the moss?
> 
> sorry for probably a stupid question, what's the difference between wild and native moss?


Wild and native moss are the same, its just me using different words. 

I don't treat any of my branches, logs, wood, rocks etc before they are added to the vivs. Some may get a rinse but that's about it. The bugs they contain help add to a successful bio active substrate. All branches are dried out prior to use, to prolong life but thats all i do. 

Just make sure you collect branches from areas where chemicals arnt used and away from water sources (if being used for frogs) to try and minimise the spread of disease. 

There are very few disease that can be spread in the UK to tropical reps. Though for frogs this is considerably higher. (the more froggie guys can elaborate here, richie and wolfenrook are the guys to ask) But overall I personally think the risk is still very low 1-2% (IMO) for lizards and geckos from the reading i have done. 

Hope that helps


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

Spikebrit said:


> Wild and native moss are the same, its just me using different words.
> 
> I don't treat any of my branches, logs, wood, rocks etc before they are added to the vivs. Some may get a rinse but that's about it. The bugs they contain help add to a successful bio active substrate. All branches are dried out prior to use, to prolong life but thats all i do.
> 
> ...


Ah ok .. was getting a bit confused there for a sec!

Thanks for the info - i may give that a try as the areas we get the wood from wont have chemicals etc...this new viv will be planted up and left for probably a couple months before frogs go in so i can try various things quite easily. i.e. adding spores along with wild moss to see if that helps etc.


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## beaniebopps (Oct 4, 2009)

I have soaked branches that I foraged for with moss on in very hot (not quite boiling water) before adding them to my viv and it didn't kill the moss - it survived really well and stayed nice and lush for about a month. The I moved it to a slightly different place in the viv (a brighter and also therefore slightly drier place) and it died within a week. So I would have to disagree with Ron (sorry!) and say that very hot water won't kill the moss. 

Generally I've not been that successful with native moss but the stuff that survived well was kept very damp and was in shade.



Spikebrit said:


> I don't treat any of my branches, logs, wood, rocks etc before they are added to the vivs. Some may get a rinse but that's about it. The bugs they contain help add to a successful bio active substrate. All branches are dried out prior to use, to prolong life but thats all i do.


I don't think all the bugs contribute well - I managed to let in a couple native centipedes (think they were eggs in the moss that then hatched in the viv) and I'm telling you, that had a field day eating all the tropical springtails and woodlice! I actually witnessed one munching on a woodouse!


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

beaniebopps said:


> I don't think all the bugs contribute well - I managed to let in a couple native centipedes (think they were eggs in the moss that then hatched in the viv) and I'm telling you, that had a field day eating all the tropical springtails and woodlice! I actually witnessed one munching on a woodouse!


native centipedes can be a problem. I have some in one of my tanks. Through they may pick off the odd bug i've never had a big problems with them. They are in my woodlice cultures and the woodlice bread like crazy. 

Just while I think of it I have heard of native centipedes and millipedes causing damage to frog eggs/spawn so be careful there. I dont tend to have this problem with geckos. 

jay


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## Wolflore (Mar 3, 2010)

I'm still having problems keeping moss alive but I think it's down to the moss not getting the correct light. Kay has recommended the Arcadia Jungle lights, or was it tropical? Can't quite remember but I'm still trying to find them in a compact format as I need them for a 30x30x45 Exo. Correct light, rather than just light seems to be my issue. The plants grow well, just not the moss. Moss is a great way of introducing beneficial bugs to the tank though. Found a wonderful mini snail the other day!


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

hey J,mate most native mosses will i guess fail in time,as they need the cold dormant preiod,that said ithink there are some that are doers,trouble is identifying them,So really you have to trial and error this yourself.On the subject of sterilisation i think jay is bang on there are risks but maybe not that great as we are lead to beleive,BUT THEY ARE THERE!! ranovirus and chytrid are the obvious but coccidiosis,worms etc may just be lurking for the unlucky.Being practical all i can say is no observed issues here but without a regular fecal programme who knows,that is something i hope to impliment.
I'm thinking that this is for your pums,if I'm right I'll throw this into the melting pot,you really do NOT want either nemerteans or snails in this viv...period.The former will reck your inviv springtail culture the latter will munch your lovely pum eggs,both are best delt with before they get in viv,either by sterilisation or dryig stuff(for nems) or submerging moss in clean water for a week to clobber snails.
Your level that you chose to sterilise everything is your choice,i don't keep oophaga yet,darts are a slight bit different,to alot of other phibs,which will just munch most stuff added by accident and because of inviv rearing oophaga abit different again. I linked about the nems very recently,but god knows what thread.Act slow buddy read much to educate yourself on those pitfalls and then make your choice,i can say this you'll be cheesed off if you get pums get them breeding and no eggs ever hatch because they become snail food:gasp:,nems are just a ruddy pain in the butt,so grafting can overcome them by constantly addiing more springs to the viv
some thoughts init
Stu


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

soundstounite said:


> hey J,mate most native mosses will i guess fail in time,as they need the cold dormant preiod,that said ithink there are some that are doers,trouble is identifying them,So really you have to trial and error this yourself.O
> Stu


yer i know what you mean setting ourselves up to fail really. its the dormant period we dont replicate in captivity which is why most native moss fails like you said stu. However, my viv temps drop quite low during winter for 2-3 months to replicate the cycle and the moss seems to like this, though it is not enough to allow them to become dormant just extent their life. its a lot harder to achieve with most frog species I would have thought. I have found some native moss surrives better then others, Im using european moss at the moment which doesn't seem to have a dormant cycle like ours and is surviving better. Tropical moss is better it's just so expensive lol. 

jay


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

Light, Light, Light, Light, Light, Light.

And get some already attached to wood or it doesn't do well.


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

soundstounite said:


> hey J,mate most native mosses will i guess fail in time,as they need the cold dormant preiod
> Stu


Nu uh!

Two winters now mine has survived.


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## Bluefrogs (Jun 14, 2011)

Native moss is simple to grow provided you have the correct conditions...Bear in mind it doesn't need as much light as you think?...Best way to prepare your moss before you add to your Viv is too soak it in a sealed container literally drowning the stuff for at least a week to remove all the slugs. Getting rid of slugs is a complete pain and if not done they could destroy your planted vids munching away!! Use distilled/filtered water to soak it in. Then you need to acclimatise your Moss... ie taking moss from this time of the year then adding straight to a warm environment can also kill it off...Hope this helps.


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Morgan Freeman said:


> Nu uh!
> 
> Two winters now mine has survived.


LMFAO
then yours will fall into the not quoted "some that are doers" huh:bash:cmon mate however bad my command of English is the info was there,there is no way i have given up on the natives but not all will do,its only right to make J aware of that.
Stu


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## sambridge15 (Nov 22, 2009)

I think to many people like myself when they first try and grow moss simply take it from the outside and then put it in a viv and expect it to spread.It grows alot better when it is firmly attached to something.It grows even better when its attached to something that stays damp/wet.

If I want floor cover I purchase peat plates and tie the moss to these using fishing line.

If I want it on branches I tie sphagnum to the branch first then add the selected moss on top of the sphagnum moss as it holds water well .

backgrounds i dont bother with anymore as they end up covered in ficus after a few months :2thumb:

after this hammer it with some strong lighting but keep it very damp at all times!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

soundstounite said:


> LMFAO
> then yours will fall into the not quoted "some that are doers" huh:bash:cmon mate however bad my command of English is the info was there,there is no way i have given up on the natives but not all will do,its only right to make J aware of that.
> Stu


Type that will work.

The ones I have! : victory:


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

beaniebopps said:


> I have soaked branches that I foraged for with moss on in very hot (not quite boiling water) before adding them to my viv and it didn't kill the moss - it survived really well and stayed nice and lush for about a month. The I moved it to a slightly different place in the viv (a brighter and also therefore slightly drier place) and it died within a week. So I would have to disagree with Ron (sorry!) and say that very hot water won't kill the moss.
> 
> Generally I've not been that successful with native moss but the stuff that survived well was kept very damp and was in shade.
> 
> ...





Morgan Freeman said:


> Type that will work.
> 
> The ones I have! : victory:


I actually deliberately introduced some centipedes into my corn snake tank to control moths that somehow got introduced. The tank still has a very healthy woodlouse population, both native and tropical. On the water front, 'hot' water isn't the same as 'boiling' water! :Na_Na_Na_Na:

@ Morgan: Nobody likes a smartypants...


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

sambridge15 said:


> I think to many people like myself when they first try and grow moss simply take it from the outside and then put it in a viv and expect it to spread.It grows alot better when it is firmly attached to something.It grows even better when its attached to something that stays damp/wet.
> 
> If I want floor cover I purchase peat plates and tie the moss to these using fishing line.
> 
> ...


Thanks mate, good tips!

Does anyone use spores along with native moss to assist growth?


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## beaniebopps (Oct 4, 2009)

I've bought some tropical sheet moss from dartfrog to try in my latest viv - I've only ever used the native stuff before so I'll see how I get on with that. I did have to worm the inhabitants from a viv I was putting native moss into because a faecel parasitology showed that they had oxyurids (worm from the reptile pinworm family). Apparently they are present in a lot of reptiles especially snakes lizards and chelonia but can become a problem when they get out of hand - I suppose they could have become infected via the native moss I brought in.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

just give live moss the same stuff it has where it grows... light... moister... something to grow on that has nutrients...

a rock with live moss still attached is best...


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Cornish-J said:


> Thanks mate, good tips!
> 
> Does anyone use spores along with native moss to assist growth?


yes J i do,we use the epiweb moss mix,difficult to say how good the moss component is when one sows it into moss,but some damn nice frens come out thats for sure.Where we have put this onto cork on its own it is growing but i'm yet to see green sheets of moss arise from it,that may well be my fault for sowing it too thin,interesting comments Beanie !!
Ron ya can't not like Mr smarty pants,even when he takes ones scrawl out of context,he's still a big softy really:2thumb:
Stu


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