# Turkistan Roaches



## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Hello, hello lovely people of RFUK, how you all doooooin'? :2thumb:

Right, here's the low-down:

I'm getting 2 T slings.
I'm wanting to breed turks.
I need help! 

I was thinking of buying the right size turk to feed the slings and then a bigger size that would breed whilst i was feeding off the smaller turks so it would keep a cycle going. Would it work?
Ok, i was thinking of keeping them in one of these:









The reason being is because i want them under my bed away from my mums knowledge :whistling2:
I've got some really fine mesh which i was going to put on the inside of the lid to cover the vents as i've heard they can be great escape artists.
Would this be suitable to keep them in?

My other problem is because i'm only going to have 2 T's (so far!) im worried about over-crowding of them, and i don't want to be overrun by a huge colony of them! 
How would i solve this?

I've heard that keeping them cooler reduces breeding but any other way of keeping numbers down? (other than buying more T's! :lol

I also know they eat most fruit and veg but i obviously want them to be nutritious for the T's, so what really helps to do this? People feed them fish flakes too but i want to try and keep the cost low as i'm saving for more reps and the whole point of breeding them was to save on money.

Now onto moisture, how do you let your turks drink? I don't want to use bug gel, as again, it's going to cost more money to get it delivered. So is there another way? Such as water in a coffee lid with tissue in it to absorb most water and they drink off this?

Thanks for your help, i've probably missed something out but those are the basis of my questions.

I know there are guides but atleast me doing it this way will hopefully mean people will reply quicker than if i PMed everyone asking!

Thanks in advance : victory:


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Right........:lol2:

I cant see the pic of what you want to keep them in but you will need more than just fine mesh - babies are tiny!

Slowing down the breeding you need less heat and less humidity but not none, we turned our stat down when we went away : victory:

They get moisture from their bug gel, if they fall in a coffee jar lid with tissue they will drown, bug gel they walk across so its comp safe for them and when topped up with water gives off humidity from the heat mat being under the tank.

They will not take fish flakes but will koi pellets, then use catfood and greens as a basic diet.


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

can now se your pic, imo that isnt big enough to bred them, i know when overcrowded mine stop breeding and the babies would defo get out of those holes.

My setup is 2ft by 1ft, can you not get a really useful box for under your bed?


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Gemstone Dragons said:


> Right........:lol2:
> 
> I cant see the pic of what you want to keep them in but you will need more than just fine mesh - babies are tiny!
> 
> ...


Damn... it's one of those small fishtank/vivariums as Wikinsons call it! I think it's 11 litres as i only want a small colony.
Oh dear... what do you suggest to use then? Perhaps i could somehow use tights to go over the vented bits?

Cool, thanks for the speedy reply 8)

EDIT: I possibly could, but i know that mum would ask me why i had a box so huge and as she's not entirely thick i think she would work out what i'm trying to do.. i suppose i could argue that keeping them and breeding them is nearly exactly the same?


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Good argument! :2thumb:


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Gemstone Dragons said:


> Good argument! :2thumb:


Haha, yup.. 

RUB (How big do you think? The room under my bed is about 11inches height-wise) 

Where can i get bug gel from online that's cheap-ish? Do you know of any good websites? 

How quickly do the roaches grow?
Do they smell? 
Do they make a noise?
Do you think crickets would be better to keep?

Anything else i should know about roaches? 

Thanks so much, sorry for all the questions : victory::2thumb::notworthy:


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Freakinfreak said:


> Where can i get bug gel from online that's cheap-ish?


Why bother with online? Go to a garden centre and get something like this:

Podington Direct, Online Garden Centre for Watergel 1kg Tub Water Storing Crystals

At a garden centre you'll probably find smaller packs of it too.

Take a small pinch of the dry crystals, then add in enough water to make them expand into big clear jelly chunks. DO NOT take a great big spoonful and stick it in a small container then add water, however, because we did that and wound up with jars and jars and jars of made-up gel. Much easier to store dry and mix up just what you need at a time.

Exactly the same stuff as "bug gel" - I'd add calcium if I were using it for insects that were gutloading reptiles, but I don't know whether spiders need that kind of supplementation.


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Ssthisto said:


> Why bother with online? Go to a garden centre and get something like this:
> 
> Podington Direct, Online Garden Centre for Watergel 1kg Tub Water Storing Crystals
> 
> ...


Great, thanks! And thanks for the heads up on not using loads, i see you learnt the hard way :lol2:
I can get crystals that make 3 litres of the stuff for £5 including delivery. Reason being for ordering the majority of things online is i don't have great access to going places coz i don't drive yet, that's all! 
Thank you very much!

Question:
RUBs have a big gap around the top of the lid, won't this make alot of escapees?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

I keep my Turkistans in a plastic "airtight" food storage box from Wilko that we've cut ventilation in the side and top of and used fine artists metal mesh to prevent escapees. I keep smaller colonies because we're not seriously trying to breed 'em as livefood at this point. 

The Turkistans do grow quite quickly. They only smell if the substrate gets mouldy - which will kill the roaches too - so you do have to keep on top of keeping things clean. 

If you frighten them and you've got lots you'll hear the "rush" of them trying to hide, but that's the only noise they make (not like Madagascan hissers). 

Turkistans are also known as "red runners" and they ARE very fast, but they're not very effective climbers. You can keep them in an open-topped box if the box is smooth-sided plastic or glass.


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Ssthisto said:


> I keep my Turkistans in a plastic "airtight" food storage box from Wilko that we've cut ventilation in the side and top of and used fine artists metal mesh to prevent escapees. I keep smaller colonies because we're not seriously trying to breed 'em as livefood at this point.
> 
> The Turkistans do grow quite quickly. They only smell if the substrate gets mouldy - which will kill the roaches too - so you do have to keep on top of keeping things clean.
> 
> ...


Great, thanks, that's really helpful to know!
So, i could get a large-ish sorage box, cut a hole in the middle of the lid and cover it with mesh and then they will be fine?
Have you ever found they're breeding too quickly for you?


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## imginy (Jun 14, 2009)

Bug gel is a waste of money.
I give mine wet chicken mash. The chicken mash has lots of stuff in to make your roaches grow fast and healthy plus when you mix it in with the water it makes a nice paste that will give your roaches all the moisture they need plus keep the humidity up. 
Then just top up with veg and fruit.

Also I have started using raid cockroach killer around my room to kill any escape artists it lasts for 4 weeks and only needs a little spray. I got mine yesterday and after a little spray 3 dubs turned up and about 10 morios crawled out from under carpet and died on my floor.

Guinea


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

imginy said:


> Bug gel is a waste of money.
> I give mine wet chicken mash. The chicken mash has lots of stuff in to make your roaches grow fast and healthy plus when you mix it in with the water it makes a nice paste that will give your roaches all the moisture they need plus keep the humidity up.
> Then just top up with veg and fruit.
> 
> ...


I think i'll stick with the bug gel for now :lol2:
Easy to order it and it only costs a fiver which will last for ages, i'm going to be feeding them up well but i don't want them growing up really quickly to be honest so the bug gel sounds fine for me! Thanks for the info though, i might try it out at some point if i find the bug gel becoming a hassle!

I'd be worried to spray anything in my room as i've got the snakes and don't even risk spraying deoderant or furniture polish in my room because of them, if i do get any escapees then it's hopefully gonna be easy-ish to catch them as there's no where for them to hide in my room since i sorted it all out  If i get too many escaping then i'll move the snakes out and then spray it though, so thank you


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## pirez (May 3, 2009)

Sorry to butt into your thread but ive been reading up on this too!

How small a colony is possible, as ive read you need a certain ratio of males to female and young to mother, I dont want tonnes of the things in my room! lol Just enough to feed my T's! 
To get an idea of how many I need I usually go through a tub of small crickets every week and a half roughly.


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

pire said:


> Sorry to butt into your thread but ive been reading up on this too!
> 
> How small a colony is possible, as ive read you need a certain ratio of males to female and young to mother, I dont want tonnes of the things in my room! lol Just enough to feed my T's!
> To get an idea of how many I need I usually go through a tub of small crickets every week and a half roughly.


No probs!
You just helped to bump it up too 

Apparently you need 1 male to every 5 females roughly, so you feed off the males (they have wings covering most of their body and are different colours to the females) and then i don't think it matters so much after that.
How many T's do you have to feed? :2thumb:


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## pirez (May 3, 2009)

Freakinfreak said:


> No probs!
> You just helped to bump it up too
> 
> Apparently you need 1 male to every 5 females roughly, so you feed off the males (they have wings covering most of their body and are different colours to the females) and then i don't think it matters so much after that.
> How many T's do you have to feed? :2thumb:


Ah, I see!
Ive got 17, mostly grown on slings/juvies and got 4 adult T's.
Would a medium sized RUB (18x10x10) do?


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

pire said:


> Ah, I see!
> Ive got 17, mostly grown on slings/juvies and got 4 adult T's.
> Would a medium sized RUB (18x10x10) do?


I just went out today and bought this:









10" high, 19" long, 12" wide with a clip lid.
I'm not going to be breeding for a while yet but bought it now as it was only a fiver :2thumb:

I'm gonna cut out the bit on the lid i coloured in, put mesh over it on the inside and the outside so that no creepy buggers can get out :devil: and then i've got 3 coffee lids, one of which will have this in it:
Solidwater 3 x 1litre granules-Live Foods Direct UK

The other will have veg and stuff, and the other will have some type of cat biscuits, bran flakes or weetabix, that kinda thing. 
Then i'm gonna use the egg cases and then, voila! Done :2thumb:

Sorry, editted to add:

I'm not sure, i think it would probably be fine but i guess it depends!
I only got a huge one as it fits under my bed which means it doesn't get in the way of anything


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

You'll want some side ventilation too....


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Ssthisto said:


> You'll want some side ventilation too....


Thanks Ssthisto :lol2:
I thought so, i just don't know what bit to do yet as dad hid the drill from me 

Grrrrrr :devil:

EDIT: Lmao, just found it... mwuhahhahahahahaahahah!


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Ultimate question...

Roaches or crickets? :devil:


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## pirez (May 3, 2009)

I'm going to do the same thing! lol

Roaches definately, crickets stink really bad and ive heard roaches have better nutritional value!


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

pire said:


> I'm going to do the same thing! lol
> 
> Roaches definately, crickets stink really bad and ive heard roaches have better nutritional value!


Haha!
Roaches all the way then, my Mum thinks they have such a big box because "being in a bigger box stops them from dying quicker and making any noise" :whistling2: mwuhahahaha... sometimes i love how little parents know :devil:

I got:

1x Roach Breeding box: £5.00
6x Sling Tubs: £1.00
1x Bug Gel 3ltrs: £5.00

*1x Coco Fibre Sub 8ltr: £2.55*
*1x Piece of 300g Cork Bark: £2.55*
*5x Micro Water Bowls: £4.00*
*2x G.Pulchra S'lings: £16.00*
*Delivery: £10.00*

1x Box of Approx. 50 Turk Roaches P&P included: £10.00

Total: £56

May seem like a lot but when the roaches breed i won't have to buy food anymore.
The tubs will last for ages, if not ever.
Bug gel will last ages, as will the fibre substrate. Can get play sand for £1.00 to mix into it also.
Cork bark will last forever.
Same with the water bowls.

All is good! :2thumb:


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## mrhoyo (Mar 29, 2007)

Ssthisto said:


> You'll want some side ventilation too....


How important are the side vent? Mine are in a 50l RUB and they just have a mesh vent in the lid roughly 10x10. Haven't had any dead yet but loads of roach eggs  I don't want to see if anyone likes the taste of them yet, knowing my luck the roaches will get annoyed at me and stop humping


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

mrhoyo said:


> How important are the side vent? Mine are in a 50l RUB and they just have a mesh vent in the lid roughly 10x10. Haven't had any dead yet but loads of roach eggs  I don't want to see if anyone likes the taste of them yet, knowing my luck the roaches will get annoyed at me and stop humping


Yeah, this was what i was thinking, i'm just gonna keep the top vent and not do any side one's unless they start to smell badly when i open the lid or if there are any fatalities :2thumb:


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## pirez (May 3, 2009)

Got my roaches, all settled in.:2thumb:


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

pire said:


> Got my roaches, all settled in.:2thumb:


Same!
Mine are all laying now... oh dear, Mum's gonna kill me!
:gasp:


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Freakinfreak said:


> Same!
> Mine are all laying now... oh dear, Mum's gonna kill me!
> :gasp:


Dont they look funny walking round with an egg hanging out their bum? lol


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Gemstone Dragons said:


> Dont they look funny walking round with an egg hanging out their bum? lol


It looks like a huge poo!!! :lol2:


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## pirez (May 3, 2009)

I'm having no luck with thee at all, laying eggs but no babies yet!?
Temp: 30 daytime - 25 night
Humidity: above 75%
Is this ok???


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## mrhoyo (Mar 29, 2007)

Why are you giving them a night time drop? They do take a little while to hatch, I thought I had loads of duds until one day loads of babies turned up


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## Jim2109 (Mar 30, 2009)

Turkistans really dont need much ventilation. the only problem then is that when you open the lid they absolutely stink. you just have to clean out the waste and corpses regularly (which is extremely hard to do with a large colony, but easy with a small one).

if you run a heatmat underneath with a stat on it and keep the temp at about 30°C, then use bug gel in jar lids on the floor, and that sorts the humidity (provided you dont over-ventilate them, that hole in the top will be enough on its own, thats more than i give to about 10,000 roaches in a 4ft fish tank! and mine just keep on multiplying). then you just leave them to it. i feed them on lots of cat food and they thrive.

youll struggle to keep the numbers small without hindering the breeding. the easiest way is to give them ideal conditions, get them laying lots of egg cases. and then just destroy egg cases to control the numbers.

youre braver than i am though keeping them under a bed!! if they ever escape then good luck sleeping lol. maybe youre not as squeamish about them as i am though. Dubias dont bother me at all, but Turkistans are just evil looking, i think its because theyre so damned fast. Water Dragons love them though.

one thing to keep in mind - NEVER have any wires or anything inside the plastic tub, they WILL climb them. if youre running a heat mat then use it on the outside underneath. run a band of parcel tape around the top of the tub because they cant climb this to be completely safe. and also dont have your egg boxes stacked too high up, as the males can jump/flutter short distances and ive had them escape by jumping 1-2" high to reach a rough edge that they can then climb out of.


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## Freakinfreak (May 13, 2009)

Jim2109 said:


> Turkistans really dont need much ventilation. the only problem then is that when you open the lid they absolutely stink. you just have to clean out the waste and corpses regularly (which is extremely hard to do with a large colony, but easy with a small one).
> 
> if you run a heatmat underneath with a stat on it and keep the temp at about 30°C, then use bug gel in jar lids on the floor, and that sorts the humidity (provided you dont over-ventilate them, that hole in the top will be enough on its own, thats more than i give to about 10,000 roaches in a 4ft fish tank! and mine just keep on multiplying). then you just leave them to it. i feed them on lots of cat food and they thrive.
> 
> ...


Thanks 
I got told to just leave the dead ones in there and clean them out every 6 months otherwise it will just disturb them. They are SO fast though and I don't have a need for the big ones yet which is all I have atm. I have a feeling that I'm not going to be able to catch the baby ones either. I might just scrap them and buy boxes of crickets when I need them!


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## toad650 (Feb 9, 2009)

Freakinfreak said:


> Thanks
> I got told to just leave the dead ones in there and clean them out every 6 months otherwise it will just disturb them. They are SO fast though and I don't have a need for the big ones yet which is all I have atm. I have a feeling that I'm not going to be able to catch the baby ones either. I might just scrap them and buy boxes of crickets when I need them!


 
its a bit like in karate kid where he catches a fly with chop sticks but it can be done once you get your eye in :lol2:


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## Jim2109 (Mar 30, 2009)

i leave the dead ones in there, they get eaten anyway. i clean mine out about every 6 months too generally because its so difficult to do. however id do it far more regularly if it was easier, because then you dont have to worry about the build up so much. you end up with about 2" of waste on the floor though and it absolutely stinks when you remove the lid. they would be really easy to clean out were it not for the thousands of egg cases. but seperating egg cases from poop is incredibly hard. you basically have to sieve all of the waste, but then youve also got the issue of hatchlings getting scooped up in the waste as well.

as for catching them - buy yourself 2 cheap buckets. in one of the buckets drill holes in the bottom suitable for the size of roach you want to feed. if you want to feed adults only then i find 4mm is about right, then you go progressively smaller for smaller sizes. you put the bucket with holes in inside the bucket without, then you pull out your egg tray from the tank and shake all the roaches off it into the bucket. the smaller ones escape through the holes in the bottom, into the 2nd hole-less bucket. and you are left with whatever sized ones you want to feed (and anything larger) in the holey bucket. then you just scoop them out and feed them off.

this is easiest for adults. however if you want to feed off smaller ones then simply take your feeders out of the lower bucket instead where they will be smaller, and tip the adults back into the tank.

personally i try to only feed adult males where possible. provided you leave enough males in the colony to continue breeding this works best, they are also the least capable escape artists in my experience, and also the most attractive to lizards as they flap their wings about. females and sub-adults are masterful in escaping. but even in my monster sized colony (10,000+) there are never enough adult males to feed exclusively if you feed them off daily.


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