# starter snake



## NBLADE (Apr 11, 2007)

what would you say is the best venomous starter snake, 
i really like the gaboons, or something along those lines, but what would you say would be the best to start of with. 
thanks


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## Rikki (Mar 27, 2007)

well none are great really considering they can all seriously injure you! copperheads are considered "easier" to work with than most others, but really, there's no DWA snake that you can use as a training snake imo.


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## NBLADE (Apr 11, 2007)

Rikki said:


> well none are great really considering they can all seriously injure you! copperheads are considered "easier" to work with than most others, but really, there's no DWA snake that you can use as a training snake imo.


 
thats what i meant, easier to work with ect, i know that they can all do serious damage, i just wanted to know what people thought would be the species that are easier to work with and what others started out with, i wouldn't want to jump in with a species that are known to be hard to work with so i was just looking for ideas, then i would research into them further. 
i do like the look of copper heads and will look into them,

anyone else


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## Eric (Feb 26, 2007)

I really don't think anyone can answer that question for you. Your skill level has to be determine by you. There is no good venomous starter, no snake that is less dangerous than the next, They all have potential to kill you not just seriously injure you. A serious injury would be a blessing compared to what is likely to happen. 

You want us to more or less pick your first venomous snake. So if you want a gaboon and we said copperhead even though you have no real interest in a copperhead you would get one? I personally buy the snake or snakes I love not one that is recommended. I surely wouldn't own or want a snake simply cause it was venomous and recommended. I also wouldn't want to put my life endanger over a snake I really didn't want. 

Rather than asking us to recommend a snake maybe it would be easier for us if you picked a couple snakes you had a real interest in. Then come discuss those snakes with us and decide which one you feel is best suited to your skill level. 

Just some thoughts

Eric G.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

not a gaboon:lol2:


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

Many people recommend Copperheads (_Agkistrodon contortrix)_as a starter snake, mainly because their venom isn't as bad as other Venomous snakes and they're happy to sit on a hook. And they're pretty 

OR ... dare I say a venomoid?

However I wouldn't recommend keeping venomous snakes fullstop (yes I know we have a shed load!). Before thinking about going down that avenue you should have years of experience of different kinds on non venomous snakes, from royals and corns to grumpy old, fast coachwhips, not necessarily because venomous snakes are aggressive, but they do vary in temperament and things like elapids are fast across the ground.


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## serpentkid100 (Mar 7, 2006)

copper heads would be advised as a starter venemous, but there is no hot snake that is deff safe...: victory:


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## NBLADE (Apr 11, 2007)

Eric said:


> I really don't think anyone can answer that question for you. Your skill level has to be determine by you. There is no good venomous starter, no snake that is less dangerous than the next, They all have potential to kill you not just seriously injure you. A serious injury would be a blessing compared to what is likely to happen.
> 
> You want us to more or less pick your first venomous snake. So if you want a gaboon and we said copperhead even though you have no real interest in a copperhead you would get one? I personally buy the snake or snakes I love not one that is recommended. I surely wouldn't own or want a snake simply cause it was venomous and recommended. I also wouldn't want to put my life endanger over a snake I really didn't want.
> 
> ...


 
no, if i did not want or like the look of the snake i wouldn't get it just because people said to, 
i was asking for peoples favourites, then i would look into them in a bit more detail, and go from there,
in the end i would go for the snake that i liked and felt comfortable with. I was just asking for opinions.


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## sami (Oct 23, 2006)

best practive would be somethign fast, very bitey and non venomous.

do you have any "display animals"? Best thing to do is get used to something that is very much look but don't touch. something that would only get "handled" for maintenance and health checks much the same way as a hot would be.

something that doesn't hesitate to bite..and learn to avoid getting bitten, practice with hooks, tubes and the like.

As someone once said to me...

"there are no venomous snake with training wheels"

Mason


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## NBLADE (Apr 11, 2007)

i have worked with aggressive boas, red tailed racers, oriental whip snakes, carpet pythons, tree pythons and tree boas, also alot of the more common species, so have experiance with very bitey, quick snakes,


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

The question was "what would you say was the best venomous starter snake", so that's what we answered! No one is saying you should get a copperhead, we simply answered your question.  However, I would say that it is worth working your way up.

Whereabouts are you NBLADE? We've just done part one of a venomous training course which included alot of talking and amongst other things the handling of an adult neo tropical rattlesnake, maybe if you're interested and not too far away you could come over for the next course so that you can get some idea of the strength and ways of handling different venomous snakes.

Ah ... Essex, miles away!!!


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

glidergirl said:


> Many people recommend Copperheads (_Agkistrodon contortrix)_as a starter snake, mainly because their venom isn't as bad as other Venomous snakes and they're happy to sit on a hook. And they're pretty


for the most part i agree with that but there are as always exceptions my copperhead does not ride a hook well at all


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## carpy (Nov 13, 2007)

am i right in saying that montpellier snakes are on the dwa list.

if i am correct then they would be a good starter dwa because they are quite fast but if you were to get tagged by one there is no real danger.

problem would be getting hold of one, im not really too sure how easy that would be, or how much they would cost.

oh and glider girl, where abouts are you?


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

jaysnakeman said:


> for the most part i agree with that but there are as always exceptions my copperhead does not ride a hook well at all


I have heard a few people say they are not always great on hooks.


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

carpy said:


> am i right in saying that montpellier snakes are on the dwa list.
> 
> if i am correct then they would be a good starter dwa because they are quite fast but if you were to get tagged by one there is no real danger.
> 
> ...


there is a montpellier snake in a rescue centre near me up for rehome


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## carpy (Nov 13, 2007)

they are dwa arent they?

if not, where abouts are you, and where it the snake?!?!


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

yeah they are dwa the rescue centre is in north wales


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

We have three Montpellier's here, what's the rehome centre called, we have a DWAL, so we could be of some help there. We also use the Monpellier as part of the course, that's why I said amongst other things (lol), there was also an adult False water cobra. The 2nd part of the course will deal with elapids mainly.

Your copperheads have obviously not read the manual that says they are good starter snakes!! Lol. Although ... thinking about it, a copperhead that doesn't sit on a hook would be just as good, because they're not as toxic as some of the other venomous snakes, then it would be good practice 

We are in Shropshire


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

*In this thread*

You have input from 1 person that actually keeps hots. Two including me. Forget the rest of it. Starting with a less dangerous snake potentially sets you up for complacency to be the death of you. Treat all venomous snakes as if they can and will kill you. From my perspective, the only help a nonvenomous can be is to practice using the equipment, hooks and grabbers. 
I prefer to use two hooks to better support the snakes weight. Especially with a gaboon. Very heavy snake.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

crotalus said:


> You have input from 1 person that actually keeps hots. Two including me. Forget the rest of it. Starting with a less dangerous snake potentially sets you up for complacency to be the death of you. Treat all venomous snakes as if they can and will kill you. From my perspective, the only help a nonvenomous can be is to practice using the equipment, hooks and grabbers.
> I prefer to use two hooks to better support the snakes weight. Especially with a gaboon. Very heavy snake.


I can see 4 people including you


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

*Fair enough*



SiUK said:


> I can see 4 people including you


Eh, my mistake. I just think viewing any venomous snake as less dangerous is a recipe for disaster. Complacency is a death sentance.

Pick what you personally like. Learn about them. Get the right equipment, hooks, grabbers, and cage locks. Learn how to use them. And go from there. Sound about right?


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

It doesn't lead to complacency at all, everyone has to start somewhere, and to be honest, I think I'd rather start with something that's not as toxic so that you practice and improve your skills, there's a huge difference between making a mistake with a copperhead and making a mistake with a gaboon. Yes, all venomous snakes should be treated as if they can kill you, regardless of what it is! And just for the record we keep around 40 venomous snakes including 5 King Cobra's, guess what we started with? A copperhead :whistling2:


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

glidergirl said:


> It doesn't lead to complacency at all, everyone has to start somewhere, and to be honest, I think I'd rather start with something that's not as toxic so that you practice and improve your skills, there's a huge difference between making a mistake with a copperhead and making a mistake with a gaboon. Yes, all venomous snakes should be treated as if they can kill you, regardless of what it is! And just for the record we keep around 40 venomous snakes including 5 King Cobra's, guess what we started with? A copperhead :whistling2:


I understand your perspective. If this works for you, ok. However without knowing how the snakes venom reacts to your body chemistry in peticular, I feel it best to treat them all as gaboons. Your reaction my be more severe than someone elses. I started off with a southern pacific rattlesnake. 
40 hots? 5 King Cobras? Nice. Are the king cobras full strength or butchered?


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

Full strength!

I understand what you're saying, and I agree all venomous should be treated as venomous regardless of whether they're considered less toxic or not, I mean afterall, who'd have though a bee sting can kill!!


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

glidergirl said:


> Full strength!
> 
> I mean afterall, who'd have though a bee sting can kill!!


that opens a whole new can of worms:lol2:


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

glidergirl said:


> We have three Montpellier's here, what's the rehome centre called, we have a DWAL, so we could be of some help there. We also use the Monpellier as part of the course, that's why I said amongst other things (lol), there was also an adult False water cobra. The 2nd part of the course will deal with elapids mainly.
> 
> Your copperheads have obviously not read the manual that says they are good starter snakes!! Lol. Although ... thinking about it, a copperhead that doesn't sit on a hook would be just as good, because they're not as toxic as some of the other venomous snakes, then it would be good practice
> 
> We are in Shropshire


the centre is called the north wales raptor and reptile sanctuary the website is NorthWales Raptor and Reptile Sanctuary i think drop em an email


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

*Jfc*



glidergirl said:


> Full strength!
> 
> I understand what you're saying, and I agree all venomous should be treated as venomous regardless of whether they're considered less toxic or not, I mean afterall, who'd have though a bee sting can kill!!


 
Fullstrength was in reference to your King Cobras. are they venomoids or not, just curious.


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## glidergirl (Nov 27, 2006)

Lol full strength was the answer, they're NOT venomoids, they're fully loaded, the smallest is a female who is around 9ft, we have 2 indos and 3 malayan golds. 

And here she is:


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## Eric (Feb 26, 2007)

I started with a pygmy rattlers that stent was breif then I went right for the monocled cobra and then the gaboon. I'm still here and have never felt like I was remotely in danger of being bite. I still have the gaboon and now 4 monocled cobras and counting. They are my favorite snake hands down. 

Previous to owning venomous I had no traing or mentoring. I have since met people and got some tips, training, ect. It goes like this only you know what your ready for. 

All of them will kill you!

I wanna know what venomous snake you desire most? Then we can talk cipperheads are not really great starters in my opinon. I can think of better starter snakes than that but it's not what I think or want it's all about you.


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

*Awesome!*



glidergirl said:


> Lol full strength was the answer, they're NOT venomoids, they're fully loaded, the smallest is a female who is around 9ft, we have 2 indos and 3 malayan golds.
> 
> And here she is:


That! is one great snake! Very impressive.


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

Eric said:


> I started with a pygmy rattlers that stent was breif then I went right for the monocled cobra and then the gaboon. I'm still here and have never felt like I was remotely in danger of being bite. I still have the gaboon and now 4 monocled cobras and counting. They are my favorite snake hands down.
> 
> Previous to owning venomous I had no traing or mentoring. I have since met people and got some tips, training, ect. It goes like this only you know what your ready for.
> 
> ...


Same here Eric. But I did some research on Rattlers. Practiced with hooks on non venomous a few times. Did a few extractions from friends yards and released them elsewhere. Finally kept one. The rest is history. Am hooked on hots now and will never relent.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

american copperhead is good to start with IMO. if you can't handle that then you may want to hang it up.:lol2:


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## murinus (Jan 3, 2007)

they guy has asked a genuine question and doesnt seem like an idiot but hes not really got much of an answer has he ? it always seems that this is what happens when the question gets asked  i am far from an expert, and everybody has differing opinions but surely ther must be a few species that could be classed as 'better begginer hots' than others ? at the end of the day yes they are all to be respected and i know it can be swings and roundabouts but still can nobody give a small list of the 'better' beginer snake ? for example as has been said, surely a copperhead would be an easier snake to start with than a 6ft full of beans cobra ? (i expect people will even argue about that :bash: ) but that is not gonna help this guy is it ?


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

I believe no one has ever died from a pygmy rattler bite, that would make them a good first hot venom wise, but theres other factors as well that would come into question like ease to look after, whether they are good to work with, not reknowned problem feeders and other things that I dont know the answers to.


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## Scoffa (Nov 23, 2006)

NBLADE said:


> what would you say is the best venomous starter snake,
> i really like the gaboons, or something along those lines, but what would you say would be the best to start of with.
> thanks


What sort of experience have you had with non venomous ie what have you kept and what temprements have you had in your collection? I do like some of the vipers but have no intention at this moment in time of owning 1. I have kept Bloods and Yellow Anacondas, which I think is a step towards hots, because with that type of agression you really learn to concentrate on what you are doing and the mood of the snake.


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## Eric (Feb 26, 2007)

I think NBlade gave up on this thread hasn't posted since the first page. To bad I thought he was getting some great advice. Far to often our concerns and warnings are taken as criticisms.


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## amy101 (Jul 9, 2007)

i wouldnt get a gab they lure you into a false sence of security, get a rhino viper if you like they gabs. theyre arsey but easy to deal with. or yeah copper heads. personally i prefere rhino vipers theyre my favourite.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

Eric said:


> I think NBlade gave up on this thread hasn't posted since the first page. To bad I thought he was getting some great advice. Far to often our concerns and warnings are taken as criticisms.


what are pigmy rattlers like to keep Eric?


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## Moshpitviper (Oct 21, 2005)

glidergirl said:


> The question was "what would you say was the best venomous starter snake", so that's what we answered! No one is saying you should get a copperhead, we simply answered your question.  However, I would say that it is worth working your way up.
> 
> Whereabouts are you NBLADE? We've just done part one of a venomous training course which included alot of talking and amongst other things the handling of an adult neo tropical rattlesnake, maybe if you're interested and not too far away you could come over for the next course so that you can get some idea of the strength and ways of handling different venomous snakes.
> 
> Ah ... Essex, miles away!!!


No distance is too great for someone who actually does venomous training, too many people have said they would and haven't. i'd be up for a play : victory:


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## Eric (Feb 26, 2007)

SiUK said:


> what are pigmy rattlers like to keep Eric?


Their easy keepers ride a hook pretty decent. I would say they make a decent starter snake.


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## Daredevil (Jul 10, 2007)

Just a quick question to the 'hot' keepers:

Do you feed live or frozen-thawed??


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

frozen


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## Eric (Feb 26, 2007)

I feed P/k or F/T on the rare occasion I feed live as a last resort.


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## weelad (Jul 25, 2006)

i know im far from expirianced but i held my head in my hands when i see the first post... iv heard this q so much and the answers...*search button* :Na_Na_Na_Na: hate me now??? good hehe if not ROAR! forgive me after i type all these threads tonight i remembe rim waaaaaaaaay to drunk to coment on anything soz lmao.. ps yep i keep saying this... i dont wana be hated heh im just stupid when like this:lol2:


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## SWMorelia (May 15, 2007)

I've always been interested in hots, but it's finding a way in that seems the problem.
Waglers vipers? what are they like as a *pet*
MIKE


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## crotalus (Jun 23, 2007)

*We feed live.*

I let them do the killing. I like to time the strike to seizure. Actually we feed all our reps live. Non venomous I wack'em then feed to prevent injury. However, with our hots, we remove the rodent after 15 to 20 minutes if the snake dies not hit it.


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## mleadley (Oct 1, 2007)

Copperhead i would say !!!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

the copper heads that i have caught and kept always fed and took to captivity as if they liked it plus they are very pretty and mellow..... they rely on their cammo so they sit still instead of getting all worked up.....they CAN kill but it's not like they are kraits or something....i love them and feel fortunate to have them around me....very much worth considering.....


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