# overheating problems with 2 stacked vivs



## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

Hi there , I am new to this site I need some help - we have 2 5 months old beardies there was living together but obviously now have decided to house them separately , both vivs are 4ft stacked on top of each other both have uv strip light fitting and heat bulb fitting both heat bulbs are 100 watt which according to our digital thermometer's in both vivs are fine however the problem is that the cooling ends -top viv has the cooling end is on the right side , bottom viv cooling end is on the left side ( the viv is 2nd hand ) so the heat lamps are getting the cooling ends warm ,at the minute the cooling ends are about 31 Celsius which I personally think are too warm I have tried opening viv doors a crack to cool it but still has not lowered ( and not very pratical when we go out either ) we have had bearded dragons before but only 1 at a time so having 2 vivs is a new world to us ! would a lower wattage bulb in top viv help or as I read space the two vivs apart with corner feet we do have a sensor thermostat as well if that helps we used that a while ago for our first beardie but as we got a constant temp we never used it since , hope someone get help as I am worried that there will get too hot at the cooling end temp , many thanks !


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## Zincubus (Sep 6, 2010)

The secret with stacking vivs is to have the warm ends matching then as the heat rises from the lower one it helps to warm the one above - the bonus is the higher viv bulb won’t have to work as hard as the lower viv bulb and you still have two cool ends .


I’d just move the heat bulb to the other end so they’re matching.




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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

hi there , thanks for that I was thinking that myself , I will have to get my hubby to do that if he can do it as we now have both vivs ready , I needed to keep a eye on both beardies and temps - there in bed now 😀 , thank you for the advice hopefully he can swap the bulb fitting over and see what happens


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## Zincubus (Sep 6, 2010)

masterofjedi said:


> hi there , thanks for that I was thinking that myself , I will have to get my hubby to do that if he can do it as we now have both vivs ready , I needed to keep a eye on both beardies and temps - there in bed now  , thank you for the advice hopefully he can swap the bulb fitting over and see what happens


I’ve had loads of stacked vivs that way -works a treat .

If you’re really concerned you can move the heat lamp across to the other end AND put some corner dividers or slats of wood in between as well - to let some air circulate between the two vivs 


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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

That’s good to hear , hopefully it will work , with just the one viv we always had a constant temp with both ends so never needed to worry about it , even without the dimming thermostat ,when this is sorted out out I can stop worrying ha ha


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## RGBeer (Oct 14, 2020)

I just stick a couple of bits of wood between the vivs to give an inch or 2 between each viv but thats with heat panels. The heat panel below heats the floor of the upper viv way more than the animal in it takes but a bit of space sorts it although it doesn't really look as good but the health of the animals is more important.


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

Heat transfer in stacked units can be an issue, but it is essential to have all the heating on the same side. If that is not an option, and these are individual vivs then placing insulating material between them, or place 1" x 2" timber strips between them to give an air gap often helps.


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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

RGBeer said:


> I just stick a couple of bits of wood between the vivs to give an inch or 2 between each viv but thats with heat panels. The heat panel below heats the floor of the upper viv way more than the animal in it takes but a bit of space sorts it although it doesn't really look as good but the health of the animals is more important.


Hi there we have done both as suggested however though the bottom viv is fine it is now the top viv cool end ! I am thinking as the viv was in the corner of our living room just off the living room window but now as it is at the top and more exposed to the window but only the corner of the cooling end , I was thinking of drawing the curtain not so far back for shade or maybe lower the wattage of the heat bulb ? we have a 60 watt heat bulb in our reptile box , I have read that you can also put a thermostat probe in the cooling end at set it to the cool temp that you want , but I am not sure how that would work ?


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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

Malc said:


> Heat transfer in stacked units can be an issue, but it is essential to have all the heating on the same side. If that is not an option, and these are individual vivs then placing insulating material between them, or place 1" x 2" timber strips between them to give an air gap often helps.


Hi thank you for the advice , but still having problems with top viv cooling end !


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

masterofjedi said:


> Hi thank you for the advice , but still having problems with top viv cooling end !


Post up a picture of the stack and state the hot and cold side temps in each...Heat will rise, so it's very common for the cool end in the top viv to be warmer than the cool end on the lowest viv.


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## Zincubus (Sep 6, 2010)

Malc said:


> Post up a picture of the stack and state the hot and cold side temps in each...Heat will rise, so it's very common for the cool end in the top viv to be warmer than the cool end on the lowest viv.


Yes THIS ^

Essentially it really comes down to wether or not the cool end of the top viv is cool enough.

There are ways to solve any issue though 

A photo plus accurate temps for both vivs ... warm / cool ends , surface temps and ambient air temps if possible 


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

Line up all the hot ends, also put something between the vivs, couple of bits of wood one at each end and maybe another in the middle so the top viv is 'floating' the air flow will help stop the heat transfer


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

Malc said:


> Post up a picture of the stack and state the hot and cold side temps in each...Heat will rise, so it's very common for the cool end in the top viv to be warmer than the cool end on the lowest viv.


I really need to stop being so cynical... it seem strange that as soon as we ask for photos from all these newbies the thread goes cold 

Anyway, just to show that it is possible to build a stack unit (or stack multiple vivs) I'll post up this example.

This is my display unit in the lounge (just after I had finished its construction and without all the artificial greenery and branches installed). I have a digital thermometer on the speaker between the desk and the vivs and the ambient air temperature in the room close to the vivs was 24.1c at the time of taking these readings










The readings shown in yellow were taken with an IR Temperature gun. 

I've included a sketch showing the use of 3mm dense cork sandwiched between the dividing panel and a secondary floor panel that covers 1/3rd the floor area at the hot side to reduce the amount of heat that can penetrate through from the heater below. Also notice the placement of the digital probes in order to maintain the temperature set in the pulse proportional controller.

Naturally if you don't have all the heaters in line or at the same end, or you have a large viv on top of two smaller ones that use ceramics you do increase the risk of heat penetration and thus creating multiple hot spots in the larger viv, or the lack of a cool spot.

I've also used the same thermometer that measures the ambient air temps in the room to monitor conditions in the vivs, and the ambient air temps at the hot side match that of the IR readings.


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

Malc said:


> I really need to stop being so cynical... it seem strange that as soon as we ask for photos from all these newbies the thread goes cold
> 
> Anyway, just to show that it is possible to build a stack unit (or stack multiple vivs) I'll post up this example.
> 
> ...


How much of an effect does the dense cork have on the heat transfer? Have you recorded any data using it vs not using it? Just out of interest as I need to do this for some reptile radiators to try and limit the heat movement


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

Yes, to a degree, Before I added the cork and additional wood, I would be hitting 37c-41c with just the single 18mm divider. With the cork sandwich I now get the readings above, with similar ambient air temps. The alternative would be if reflectors were used. The 150w trough ceramics I use in other enclosures have reflectors which do work really well, but these ultra slim radiate as much heat backwards as they do forwards.


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

Hmm that's very interesting thank you, I was going to install some thick melamine between the rads and the viv top but maybe the cork would work better?


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

LiasisUK said:


> Hmm that's very interesting thank you, I was going to install some thick melamine between the rads and the viv top but maybe the cork would work better?


Not sure how it would hold up if placed between the heater and the top of the viv. No idea how fireproof cork is.

Back in the 90's Microclimate made a 50w heat panel that was about the size of an A5 sheet of paper, and 6mm thick. It was a mat ceramic type material with 4 holes in the corner. To fit that to the roof it came with a fibreglass mat the same size, and this was sandwiched between the heat panel and the roof. Even on a pulse stat little heat got through to the surface above, but over time (25 years as I still have it) the centre of the fibreglass mat has got brown with the heat.

If your heat panels fit in direct contact with the top of the viv rather than being suspended, then possibly look at getting a similar fibreglass mat. Plumbers use something similar to protect walls and woodwork when soldering pipes with a blow torch so should easily manage the heat build up from a panel on a decent stat.

The alternative if the panel is suspended would be to protect the cork using strips of aluminium sealing tape that is used by AC engineers. There is very little chance of the foil becoming unstuck, and if inside the guard around the panels (presumably a guard is fitted) then there is no way the reptile can access the tape anyway.


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

Malc said:


> Not sure how it would hold up if placed between the heater and the top of the viv. No idea how fireproof cork is.
> 
> Back in the 90's Microclimate made a 50w heat panel that was about the size of an A5 sheet of paper, and 6mm thick. It was a mat ceramic type material with 4 holes in the corner. To fit that to the roof it came with a fibreglass mat the same size, and this was sandwiched between the heat panel and the roof. Even on a pulse stat little heat got through to the surface above, but over time (25 years as I still have it) the centre of the fibreglass mat has got brown with the heat.
> 
> ...


Thanks that gives me some things to think about. Much appreciated


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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

Zincubus said:


> Yes THIS ^
> 
> Essentially it really comes down to wether or not the cool end of the top viv is cool enough.
> 
> ...


Hi there so sorry for the reply , we have now solved the issue plus we invested in a air temp gun for added safety for our beardie and he's happy enough now there are separated , so I am happy too !


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## masterofjedi (May 24, 2021)

LiasisUK said:


> Line up all the hot ends, also put something between the vivs, couple of bits of wood one at each end and maybe another in the middle so the top viv is 'floating' the air flow will help stop the heat transfer


Hi there , thank you for your help , the issue is solved now x


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