# Thorny Devil



## aiden (Mar 29, 2008)

Can you keep these in the UK legally ?


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## weeminx (Oct 28, 2006)

these are not avalible in the uk pet trade









where as you can get these horned lizards in the uk pet trade although they are quite hard to look after and rear them on crickets


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## Mujician (Mar 7, 2007)

weeminx said:


> these are not avalible in the uk pet trade


Yes they are!


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## aiden (Mar 29, 2008)

mujican how much are they and do yuo know where to get a good caresheet for them


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## Mujician (Mar 7, 2007)

Hi,
I've only ever seen one for sale - they aren't common, but they are available. For some reason I seem to remember the price £45, but that can't be right can it?! I think the eat ants, so they're gonna be fussy feeders. Thats all I know (not sure if that ant thing is correct either!) It was for sale in the Hollybush Garden Centre. (Near Walsall)


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## weeminx (Oct 28, 2006)

Mujician said:


> Yes they are!


:lol2: Moloch horridus is avaliable in the uk pet trade???????

*cough* bollox *cough*


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## weeble (Sep 29, 2007)

Stunning animals, never seem one for sale and wouldnt keeping one be a nightmare because they only eat 1 type of Aussie ant....and thousands of them a day?


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## Mujician (Mar 7, 2007)

In fact - it wasn't for sale - think Mike had it in specially for someone. and Weeminx - I may be wrong as it was ages ago, but I'm 90% sure it was that - as i said, it wasn't for sale. But it was in the shop.


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## Johelian (Nov 25, 2006)

Mujician said:


> In fact - it wasn't for sale - think Mike had it in specially for someone. and Weeminx - I may be wrong as it was ages ago, but I'm 90% sure it was that - as i said, it wasn't for sale. But it was in the shop.


Im pretty sure that what you saw was one of the Phrynosoma, which can look very similar:








Due to the complexity of the diet and the ban on export from Australia I dont even know any zoos here that keep them, much less shops.


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## Dan1992 (Oct 22, 2007)

> Due to the complexity of the diet and the ban on export from Australia I dont even know any zoos here that keep them, much less shops.


I agree, even if you could keep them legally you need to consider whether you would be able to meet the needs of such a demanding diet..


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## Mujician (Mar 7, 2007)

Johelian said:


> Im pretty sure that what you saw was one of the Phrynosoma, which can look very similar:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for clearing that up :no1:


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## Johelian (Nov 25, 2006)

Its the same animal that Weeminx mentioned, just a picture that shows the similarity  Desert horneds are quite cute in their own way, just rumoured to be tough to convert to a diet of crickets if wild-caught.


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## reptilesrock (Jun 3, 2007)

The Horny Devil was featured on David Attenbrughs 'Life in Cold Blood', and was shown to be eating LOADS of ants, so yea, the diet thing would most likely be an absolute nightmare!
Unless a conversion from ants to easily attainable bugs could be done?

I'm sure their was a reason for the ants,.....gonna look this up, was something to do with restrictions placed on the lizard due to the surroundings i think that forced them to eat readily available prey, but may have been choice, cannot remember. :crazy:


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## reptilesrock (Jun 3, 2007)

Wow this little guy is soooooo cute! :mf_dribble:

If i had no job, career plans, no life etc, i'd o keep loads of these!










They eat a specific species of ant mostly, possibly others also, but mainly '_Ochetellus_', and they eat them by the thousands everyday!
That would cost some serious monies!!!!
Also the hydration system is somewhat complex, i'm guessing that the day and night temps would have to be somewhat perfect, and that humidity would have to be near perfect at the exact right times to coinside with the need for condensation when it cools,..

Thorny Devil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Awesome little dude though!

Check the expression on him, bless : victory:

Would love to be able to keep them though!!!


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## weeble (Sep 29, 2007)

reptilesrock said:


> I'm sure their was a reason for the ants,.....gonna look this up


 
Is it the type of acidity in the ants???

Sure it was somerthing along them lines


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## Declan123 (Dec 29, 2007)

Ive never seen them for sale, due to Australia stop its export of its animals....

Also if there is some around, they "Only" eat the outback ants...which are not over here....


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## HadesDragons (Jun 30, 2007)

As far as I'm aware, technically they would be "legal" to keep (you may need papers etc depending on their conservation status), but you won't find any legally-obtained ones around for sale...


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## Dan1992 (Oct 22, 2007)

They require the foamic acid in the ants i think.
Ive heard you can keep ant eating reptiles that require things like foamic acid on a diet of crickets dusted with foamic acid, but getting a WC on to change over to crickets would be a nightmare, not that you would even be able to get a WC one.. It works in theory.. Kinda :crazy:


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## Cyberlizard (Apr 1, 2008)

It's amazing how many times people have asked about keeping Thorny Devils recently. But they really are nigh-on impossible from what I have read.

Re _Phrynosoma_ lizards, there are several species in this genus who vary in the proportion of ants that they take. However Bosch and Werning, after discussing _P. coronatum_, which takes "only" about 50% of its food in the form of ants, go on to say "But here too ants are irreplaceable", and at the beginning of the section on the genus advise against keeping them because of the difficulties and time involved. They say that when ants are absent from the diet, symptoms of gut decomposition followed by death are reported, and that a single lizard can eat over 100 ants a day. That is a lot less than the _Moloch_, but if it is that hard to feed _Phrynosoma_, I wouldn't even begin to contemplate _Moloch_.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Dan1992 said:


> They require the foamic acid in the ants i think.
> Ive heard you can keep ant eating reptiles that require things like foamic acid on a diet of crickets dusted with foamic acid, but getting a WC on to change over to crickets would be a nightmare, not that you would even be able to get a WC one.. It works in theory.. Kinda :crazy:


 ITYM 'formic' acid 
<visons of ants blowing loads of little bubbles>


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## Dan1992 (Oct 22, 2007)

:lol2: i was close!!


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## sparkle (Mar 21, 2007)

Phrynosoma ive seen now and again but never the one in the very first post... certainly NOT legally

the thorny devil i knew someone who did everything possible years back when i lived in northhamtonshire to keep theirs alive... but the food it ate i think the herp vet suggested finally killed it.. he fed it small crix

the diet is so specific that they dont get .. now what was it.. my brains telling me they need ants for folic acid.. ( thats probably wrong )

i could be wrong my memory is pants..


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

sparkle said:


> Phrynosoma ive seen now and again but never the one in the very first post... certainly NOT legally
> 
> the thorny devil i knew someone who did everything possible years back when i lived in northhamtonshire to keep theirs alive... but the food it ate i think the herp vet suggested finally killed it.. he fed it small crix
> 
> ...


 Not foaming acid, nor folic acid (that's iron) but 'formic' acid.


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## sparkle (Mar 21, 2007)

fenwoman said:


> Not foaming acid, nor folic acid (that's iron) but 'formic' acid.


 
OOPS :blush:

i told you i was probably wrong...

thanks for correcting me x


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