# vine snakes ??



## steve2010 (Jun 16, 2010)

granted these as far as my knowledge goes are not dwa but i was wondering does anyone keep these snakes captive bred? if so can u get them to eat mice is it good for them wat else do they eat and are they easy to keep ? many thanks : victory:


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## chondro13 (Aug 18, 2008)

They are definitely not DWA, they have mild venom and are rear fanged : victory: it is very difficult to get captive bred, and therefore WC will unfortunately rarely survive more than a few months in captivity. 

Youll need to feed them lizards or live fish - i had a pair live on mainly guppies for years! 

Very expensive diets, the snakes stress easily and frankly dont make great pets! Just my 2p : victory:


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## 50%man50%biscuit (Mar 17, 2009)

chondro13 said:


> WC will unfortunately rarely survive more than a few months in captivity.
> 
> You'll need to feed them lizards or live fish - i had a pair live on mainly guppies for years!


 Surely this is a contradiction...



> Very expensive diets, the snakes stress easily and frankly dont make great pets! Just my 2p : victory:


 I don't keep pets, I keep snakes :whistling2:: victory: Just my 5p  You are right, they are certainly not a recommended group for most keepers, but they are no more high maintenance than many species, just different. Kidney failure seems to be a big killer of these, fatty rodent diets and too little hydration seems to be the main cause, also low air flow and too high humidity will push most snakes to RI and death, let alone a snake that is known to stress and potentially carry a number of parasites. 

I have to say I am besotted with my pair(WC), amazing animals and the strangest looking creatures. They don't do cuddles or kindness, and yes they can get a little defensive at times, and can sneak up on you without you ever noticing. 
Look but don't touch, and if you do touch, do so very carefully. You get a sense of delicate and breakable but they can strike further than tong + arm and aim for your eyes. :gasp: Stunning species. :flrt:

HMHB


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## nsn89 (Jun 11, 2011)

50%man50%biscuit said:


> Surely this is a contradiction...


No it's not a contradiction, because she said rarely...lol.


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## steve2010 (Jun 16, 2010)

aahh yes i see the issue lil so defnatly stick to the wild diet of fish and lizards are they fussy as to what kind of fish and lizards? how often do u guys feed them ? the very reasons most ppl wouldnt keep them is the very reason i want them haha they look so strange . what kind of set ups to you have size hight water pools (for the fish ) or u tong feed ? ) thanks for all the advice it always seems to be better to ask people who keep them then look online as u can get conflict of info :no1:


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## chondro13 (Aug 18, 2008)

50%man50%biscuit said:


> Surely this is a contradiction...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Of course its not a contradiction... i said they RARELY survive more than a few months - i had 3 die within weeks before finally I came across my pair that survived on live guppies with the occasional anole. I kept them in a planted paludarium, temperatures in the high 70s, extremely well ventilated. As i say - they survived for a few years, but then died within a couple of months of one another. PM report suggests their cause of death was natural, although there was a suggestion that stress could have been a factor. Now, these were kept in a very low traffic environment in an extremely densely planted enclosure, and had a pool of fish to feed from at their own convenience - there was nothing there to stress them and no changes in their husbandry whatsoever. They are gorgeous snakes, but do not make great pets, if that is what the OP was asking. At no point did i mention they require any more maintenance than most snakes - frankly i left them completely alone for 99% of the time - bioactive substrate helps with that  



steve2010 said:


> aahh yes i see the issue lil so defnatly stick to the wild diet of fish and lizards are they fussy as to what kind of fish and lizards? how often do u guys feed them ? the very reasons most ppl wouldnt keep them is the very reason i want them haha they look so strange . what kind of set ups to you have size hight water pools (for the fish ) or u tong feed ? ) thanks for all the advice it always seems to be better to ask people who keep them then look online as u can get conflict of info :no1:


They are fairly small, so really you will be looking at appropriately sized (non toxic..) fish and soft geckos, sometimes soft scaly lizards. Anoles and house geckos do well. I kept mine with a 'half land half water' setup and allowed them as many guppies as they liked (the guppies lived in the filtered water), and occasionally (once or twice a month) put a live house gecko or anole in there. 

Quite honestly the reason why many people wont keep them (and why I wont keep them again) is that it is a real heartache when you do everything absolutely perfectly, and they die on you for no obvious reason. Plus the expensive diet will likely put a few people off. For example, if you keep a pair of vine snakes and want to feed them exclusively on anoles for example, thats £12 a week and only IF you can get a regular supply... 

Theres no denying they are absolutely stunning snakes, and they were a joy to own!


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## KWIBEZEE (Mar 15, 2010)

*issues*

Steve2010 - there is very wise advice given here by a dedicated, experienced lady - Chondro. I've seen a lot of her threads and posts and know the op speaks with a certain authority. What she has described above should tell anyone that this snake species is definately a very specialised species and in my opinion not suited for a hobbyist. I'm sure certain zoological curators etc will not have these in a collection either... THEY ARE JUST TOO NERVOUS a critter. Sense in the story is do yourself a favour - save for something else.

Above all else the wisdom is letting some species be - just let them remain in their native habitat - if we can as a race of intelligent people preserve their natural environment. Let it be - let it be - how sweet and true the tune. 

I've often wanted to keep 'strange' and delicate critters - my Popa kept rattlesnakes in his back garden as a kid - he lived abroad then ( lucky fellow). With over thirty years experience I've learnt the lesson - sometimes it's not about better husbandry - it's just that some are not suitable - plain and simple. Good luck and positiveness through and through. I'm sure you will find something more suitable.


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## steve2010 (Jun 16, 2010)

cheers everyone for the advice as was mentioned these seem like and expensive and costly snake to keep even tho they look so dam awesome  lol i think something a little less sensitive may be in order ! anyone know much about eye lash vipers ? haha : victory:i love my snakes an im sure u all do for many diffrent reasons ! they are awesome happy keeping :no1:


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## CraigMcLean (Nov 8, 2009)

chondro13 said:


> They are definitely not DWA, they have mild venom and are rear fanged /quote
> 
> If you are talking about thelotornis Capensis then they are certainly highly venomous. For years they were thought not to be because so few bites were ever recorded. It is rear fanged but has a potent haemotoxic venom very similar to the boomslang. I believe that only 8 bites have been recorded for this species, the last one I know about was someone packing boxes (if memory serves it was in Durban harbour) and he put a box down on one and got bitten on the hand. All the rest have been handlers. Its a beautiful, Unagressive snake but if it's not dwa then that is a real issue.


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## southwest vipers (Jun 29, 2008)

CraigMcLean said:


> chondro13 said:
> 
> 
> > They are definitely not DWA, they have mild venom and are rear fanged /quote
> ...


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## CraigMcLean (Nov 8, 2009)

southwest vipers said:


> CraigMcLean said:
> 
> 
> > Thelotornis are twig snakes. Vine snakes are Auhetulla
> ...


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## chondro13 (Aug 18, 2008)

CraigMcLean said:


> chondro13 said:
> 
> 
> > They are definitely not DWA, they have mild venom and are rear fanged /quote
> ...


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## chezequerz (Mar 30, 2008)

Good luck getting captive bred specimens friend, I've only ever seen one person breed them successfully. In fact before about 2008 it was widely considered that they were literally impossible to breed in captivity. 

I love the Ahaetulla genus and would love to possess one but frankly they rarely ever survive, don't have a consistent value as there's no market for them, are almost certainly wild caught, are virtually impossible to breed and only a couple good posters here and one or two websites online exist to instruct on their care which is never good considering how delicate they are.

I don't tell you this to disappoint or to antagonise I'm merely pointing out the difficulties involved with acquisition and sustaining them and the reality of the situation in general.


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