# Beginner Hot



## kerrithsoden (Dec 6, 2009)

Hi all,
Ill start by saying in no way am I planning now or ever to get a DWA and its out of pure curiosity that I ask.

What would anyone consider to be a beginners venomous snake? What did you start with? and are there any animals you think should/shouldn't be on the list?


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

hi there are loads of threads just like this have a search and you will find your answer:2thumb:


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## Mujician (Mar 7, 2007)

I have not kept hots, however you would only be able to get a 'beginner' snake if you had your licence in place. So surely if you had a licence then you wouldnt be a beginner and therefore the need for a 'beginner' snake is no longer there. I dont like the idea of a beginner snake. What do people do when they no longer are interested in a beginner snake?


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

Mujician said:


> I have not kept hots, however you would only be able to get a 'beginner' snake if you had your licence in place. So surely if you had a licence then you wouldnt be a beginner and therefore the need for a 'beginner' snake is no longer there. I dont like the idea of a beginner snake. What do people do when they no longer are interested in a beginner snake?


Exactly.

I think that people think that a beginner snake is somewhat of a less deadly one, if thats the case then get something fast, nasty, bitey and rear fanged. If you don't get tagged then you may do alright with a proper DWA snake.

I like the idea of Beadeds and Gila as opposed to snakes but then again there are some awesome looking ones out there.


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## STReptiles (Feb 6, 2009)

Dendroaspis Polylepis are good ones and also Ophiophagus Hannah!


Have fun!:2thumb:


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## nickthebeardedwonder (Oct 8, 2009)

u guys are all [email protected]@@ing dicks! this guy asked a straight forward question about venomous snakes, and what might be a little more even tempered and you guys have been massive wankers about it. i dunno if you have a dwa or not but if you do why not share some info and opinions rather than criticizing the question and recomending king cobras and black mambas. its people like you who ruin the good natured aura of this forum.

i would recomend (and i do not have a dwabut do have a vast knowledge of venomous snakes) to go for a copperhead, however, maybe a hardcore non venomous maybe better, like a mangrove or something. hope im more helpful than the dickheads who answered before me


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## MagicSqueak (Apr 9, 2010)

..........


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## kerrithsoden (Dec 6, 2009)

Mujician said:


> I have not kept hots, however you would only be able to get a 'beginner' snake if you had your licence in place. So surely if you had a licence then you wouldnt be a beginner and therefore the need for a 'beginner' snake is no longer there. I dont like the idea of a beginner snake. What do people do when they no longer are interested in a beginner snake?


But when you finally got a dwa surely you wouldnt go for the fastest most aggressive snake with the most potent venom? 


Does anybody think there are any species that should/shouldnt be on the list?


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> u guys are all [email protected]@@ing dicks! this guy asked a straight forward question about venomous snakes, and what might be a little more even tempered and you guys have been massive wankers about it. i dunno if you have a dwa or not but if you do why not share some info and opinions rather than criticizing the question and recomending king cobras and black mambas. its people like you who ruin the good natured aura of this forum.
> 
> i would recomend (and i do not have a dwabut do have a vast knowledge of venomous snakes) to go for a copperhead, however, maybe a hardcore non venomous maybe better, like a mangrove or something. hope im more helpful than the dickheads who answered before me


 
lol well done mate...lol firstly i said to search the section as this question has been asked many many times before......also you say you have a vast knowledge of venomous then say a copperhead is a good first venomous..........please enlighten me why~?


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## kerrithsoden (Dec 6, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> hi there are loads of threads just like this have a search and you will find your answer:2thumb:


cheers buddy will have a search around



nickthebeardedwonder said:


> u guys are all [email protected]@@ing dicks! this guy asked a straight forward question about venomous snakes, and what might be a little more even tempered and you guys have been massive wankers about it. i dunno if you have a dwa or not but if you do why not share some info and opinions rather than criticizing the question and recomending king cobras and black mambas. its people like you who ruin the good natured aura of this forum.
> 
> i would recomend (and i do not have a dwabut do have a vast knowledge of venomous snakes) to go for a copperhead, however, maybe a hardcore non venomous maybe better, like a mangrove or something. hope im more helpful than the dickheads who answered before me


very helpful cheers :2thumb:


on another note cheers for that but unhelpful posts I just try to ignore and not fuel.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

kerrithsoden said:


> cheers buddy will have a search around
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 mate i said to do a search for a few reasons one is that this question has been asked almost weekly at onw point and as you may imagine this gets a little boring, and before people jump down my throat and say the same questions get asked week in week out on the snake forum for instance, well this is true but also remember there are hundreds if not thousands who can answer those questions but with this section there are a small amount of us that actually have the experience to and if you get asked the same questions over anover again then anyone would get bored of answering it.


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## kerrithsoden (Dec 6, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> lol well done mate...lol firstly i said to search the section as this question has been asked many many times before......also you say you have a vast knowledge of venomous then say a copperhead is a good first venomous..........please enlighten me why~?


Im sure he didnt mean specifically you, lets not let the thread go this way like so many others, 

Upon searching I hve found a few threads similar so cheers : victory:


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## nickthebeardedwonder (Oct 8, 2009)

thats the difference between you and me lol, i let people know when they're being assholes. too many times this dwa section is like a little boys club, 'ive got a venomous snake and will talk to you if you have, but be a pretentious little premadonna to you if you dont'. its bollocks, and the main idea of a forum is to share information not be sarcastic and belittle each other. anyway thats enough from me, good luck searching for your information


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## kerrithsoden (Dec 6, 2009)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> thats the difference between you and me lol, i let people know when they're being assholes. too many times this dwa section is like a little boys club, 'ive got a venomous snake and will talk to you if you have, but be a pretentious little premadonna to you if you dont'. its bollocks, and the main idea of a forum is to share information not be sarcastic and belittle each other. anyway thats enough from me, good luck searching for your information


I find it easier to just not rock the boat, but I do appreciate your support: victory:


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> thats the difference between you and me lol, i let people know when they're being assholes. too many times this dwa section is like a little boys club, 'ive got a venomous snake and will talk to you if you have, but be a pretentious little premadonna to you if you dont'. its bollocks, and the main idea of a forum is to share information not be sarcastic and belittle each other. anyway thats enough from me, good luck searching for your information


That means it's ok to tell you the same. 

Read the forum rules douche, no swearing. Go back to making your gay little pet banner.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

To the OP, as Lee said, a quick search of the forum would've yielded everything you wanted to know, but we've covered that so here goes.
No, there isn't a "beginner" venomous snake. Some have easier husbandry requirements than others, and some are easier to handle, but that's not really relevant. If you're experienced enough to own venomous species you should have the husbandry skills necessary to overcome most challenges and also the handling skills necessary to deal with everything you own.
As for me, first I handled was a red diamond rattlesnake, first I owned was a western gaboon viper.
And no, I don't think that the list of venomous snake species on the current DWA schedule needs revision. Since the licence is there to protect the public, and "the public" is a huge range of people in various states of health, everything on the list can ruin_ SOMEONE'S_ day. Therefore, leave it be. And before anyone tells me there are plenty of species capable of causing harm that aren't on the list, save it. I know. Not my problem.

Now, Nick. Before you jump on people on here, get your facts straight. No one has been rude to the OP, or anyone else, except you. 1 jokey comment was made. 1. We get this question virtually every week, and it always starts "I never want to keep venomous snakes but....". All areas of snake keeping require people to do a bit of homework, but none more so than when venomous snakes are concerned, so it isn't too much to ask that people check what's already been covered before posting. Sadly they don't, so now and again people get annoyed by this, but not to worry, there's always a hero like you ready to jump in and stick up for the oppressed, usually with a barrage of insults and accussations of elitism, just like you did. Always the same ridiculous statements that we think we're better than everyone else. Well no, not true, but what we do know is that we've all put in time, effort, and money to get to the point of being able to work around these animals safely, so yeah, we are pretty good actually. This all leads me to 1 conclusion: That you and every other venomous keeper basher is simply jealous. That we can do something you can't / daren't.
Also, you say you've got a vast knowledge of venomous snakes, but in the very same paragraph state that copperheads make good starter hots, and mangrove snakes are non-venomous. You're certainly hiding that vast knowledge well. It looks a lot less than encyclopaedic from where I'm sitting. Why are you perpetuating this myth that copperheads should be evryone's go-to animal for experience? This is bandied about by people who've never kept them. I assure you they aren't as nice as you think. In fact every copperhead I've ever met has been more keen to bite than the mambas I've handled. So what that the venom isn't that powerful. It's a moot point. The idea is to not get bitten at all. And what good is a viper as a training snake if want to keep cobras? What you should be doing is getting experience with numerous species BEFORE you get your own. That way, the best starter snake is the one you are most comfortable working with, out of the list of species you want to keep.
Please feel free to reply, but try doing so in a civil manner, and make your answer relevant and factually accurate where possible. Many thanks.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Owzy said:


> Go back to making your gay little pet banner.


Hang on a sec....why use the word "gay" when referring to something as if it's a bit naff? Wouldn't want to be accused of homophobia as well as being unhelpful would you?:whistling2:


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

mrcriss said:


> Hang on a sec....why use the word "gay" when referring to something as if it's a bit naff? Wouldn't want to be accused of homophobia as well as being unhelpful would you?:whistling2:


You are correct indeed!

I am sorry for the immature way I replied, I should have structured my reply better.

I am trying to think of a non-swear/non-offensive word... but failing miserably... that says a lot about me unfortunately. Any suggestions are welcome.


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## bloodpython22 (Feb 19, 2010)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> Alright, i suggest you f~~~ off!!!!


With comments like that you wonder why keepers like dave and lee ect are having there say. Do us all a favour grow a brain fill it full of this vast knowledge you have and grow up. There is no wonder why this forums has such a bad rep with people like you who have to bash dwa keepers


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## chondro13 (Aug 18, 2008)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> u guys are all [email protected]@@ing dicks! this guy asked a straight forward question about venomous snakes, and what might be a little more even tempered and you guys have been massive wankers about it. i dunno if you have a dwa or not but if you do why not share some info and opinions rather than criticizing the question and recomending king cobras and black mambas. its people like you who ruin the good natured aura of this forum.
> 
> i would recomend (and i do not have a dwabut do have a *vast knowledge of venomous snakes*) to go for a copperhead, however, maybe a hardcore *non venomous maybe better, like a mangrove *or something. hope im more helpful than the dickheads who answered before me



...... lol........


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

I'm still staggered by the arrogance of this guy. Every venomous snake keeper I've known, from my close friends to those I've sent a couple of PM's to on here, is humble and modest, and would never in a million years claim to have a "vast knowledge" of anything. Simply because they have that most basic of human traits, humility. Without exception they say they are still learning, and these are people who have kept numerous species for many years, and caught and worked with wild animals in the field. 
I've kept snakes for 23 years, venomous for 12, and caught rattlesnakes in Florida and California, but if I ever caught myself saying that my knowledge was vast I'd have to slap myself.


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## MagicSqueak (Apr 9, 2010)

terciopelo_dave said:


> if I ever caught myself saying that my knowledge was vast I'd have to slap myself.


You couldn't guarantee a proper slap...i'd do it for you :whistling2:


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

MagicSqueak said:


> You couldn't guarantee a proper slap...i'd do it for you :whistling2:


Lol. Deal.


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## STReptiles (Feb 6, 2009)

terciopelo_dave said:


> To the OP, as Lee said, a quick search of the forum would've yielded everything you wanted to know, but we've covered that so here goes.
> No, there isn't a "beginner" venomous snake. Some have easier husbandry requirements than others, and some are easier to handle, but that's not really relevant. If you're experienced enough to own venomous species you should have the husbandry skills necessary to overcome most challenges and also the handling skills necessary to deal with everything you own.
> As for me, first I handled was a red diamond rattlesnake, first I owned was a western gaboon viper.
> And no, I don't think that the list of venomous snake species on the current DWA schedule needs revision. Since the licence is there to protect the public, and "the public" is a huge range of people in various states of health, everything on the list can ruin_ SOMEONE'S_ day. Therefore, leave it be. And before anyone tells me there are plenty of species capable of causing harm that aren't on the list, save it. I know. Not my problem.
> ...


:2thumb: smoothly does it.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

STReptiles said:


> :2thumb: smoothly does it.


Lol, cheers mate. Needed saying though didn't it.


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## pk93 (Jan 26, 2010)

terciopelo_dave said:


> To the OP, as Lee said, a quick search of the forum would've yielded everything you wanted to know, but we've covered that so here goes.
> No, there isn't a "beginner" venomous snake. Some have easier husbandry requirements than others, and some are easier to handle, but that's not really relevant. If you're experienced enough to own venomous species you should have the husbandry skills necessary to overcome most challenges and also the handling skills necessary to deal with everything you own.
> As for me, first I handled was a red diamond rattlesnake, first I owned was a western gaboon viper.
> And no, I don't think that the list of venomous snake species on the current DWA schedule needs revision. Since the licence is there to protect the public, and "the public" is a huge range of people in various states of health, everything on the list can ruin_ SOMEONE'S_ day. Therefore, leave it be. And before anyone tells me there are plenty of species capable of causing harm that aren't on the list, save it. I know. Not my problem.
> ...


I guess when people say "what's the best beginner hot?" is like on the snake section when people constantly ask "is this a royal morph?" i know that gets a lot of people's backs up

cheers 

PK


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

pk93 said:


> I guess when people say "what's the best beginner hot?" is like on the snake section when people constantly ask "is this a royal morph?" i know that gets a lot of people's backs up
> 
> cheers
> 
> PK


You're right mate, but as Lee correctly pointed out, on the snake forum there are hundreds of people able to offer an answer. On here, there is a handful of people who keep venomous snakes who are in a position to answer any questions. Sadly that means we get tired of hearing the same thing rather quickly, and don't always want to be helpful if we've said the same thing 3 times this week already.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Just an idea.....if everyone's bored of the same question being asked every week, why not just have a stock answer and leave it at that? Like when people ask for a beginner normal snake, everyone says a corn snake. I'm sure the OP would have been satisfied with a simple answer to what was a simple (although possibly badly worded) question.

It's not as if you have to worry about them rushing out and getting one as they have to pass various inspections etc. Having had a DWA license myself in the past (not for reptiles btw), I know that you have to be pretty dedicated to get one.

Then, hopefully, long drawn out and unnecessary arguments like this one could be avoided. As i said, only a friendly suggestion, please don't shoot me down for it too.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

mrcriss said:


> Just an idea.....if everyone's bored of the same question being asked every week, why not just have a stock answer and leave it at that? Like when people ask for a beginner normal snake, everyone says a corn snake. I'm sure the OP would have been satisfied with a simple answer to what was a simple (although possibly badly worded) question.
> 
> It's not as if you have to worry about them rushing out and getting one as they have to pass various inspections etc. Having had a DWA license myself in the past (not for reptiles btw), I know that you have to be pretty dedicated to get one.
> 
> Then, hopefully, long drawn out and unnecessary arguments like this one could be avoided. As i said, only a friendly suggestion, please don't shoot me down for it too.


There isn't a stock answer though. "Corn snake" is fine for non venomous, but there simply isn't a venomous equivalent. And whether we hate the question or not we want to provide accurate information. We all give jokey answers from time to time, but when push comes to shove we'll answer sensibly, and a default answer that probably isn't true won't satisfy.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

To start with this thread need not have gone past the second post when i posted about doing a search on past posts on the subject of which there a few, incidently the OP PM'd and thanked me for the info and found what he was looking for.
But getting back to a "stock answer" there really isnt one. once you get to the stage where you are looking at getting a dwal and keeping venomous snakes there could be many different answers. for example i started with WDB and copperheads but at the time there were not the availability there is these days. most venomous keepers as in other aspects of the hobby have a preference, ie, arboreal vipers, or rattlers or elapids, in each section of venomous snake keping there are some that are easy'er than others and so may be classed as begginers snakes in the grand scheme of things, what is meant is they are generally better to handle and are calmer tempered. so a good first venomous all depends on what you are looking to keep really, i have kept or worked with a wide veriety and could name proberbly 10 or more snakes and the next keeper could give you another 10. I agree a corn snake is a good stock answer but if you are looking at keeping venomous then you have proberbly kept a wide veriety and you are not starting on the bottom wrung of the ladder unlike someone just getting started.


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## paulds (Mar 17, 2009)

terciopelo_dave said:


> You're right mate, but as Lee correctly pointed out, on the snake forum there are hundreds of people able to offer an answer. On here, there is a handful of people who keep venomous snakes who are in a position to answer any questions. Sadly that means we get tired of hearing the same thing rather quickly, and don't always want to be helpful if we've said the same thing 3 times this week already.


Dave yourself and Lee should really stop getting involved with these wind up merchants :lol2:

I abosolutely love coming on here and looking through the wreckage but you guy's have a lot more to offer than defending yourselves against the habitual wannabees.

I remember being a member on here years ago (possiblty with a different user name) and being texted some awesome gabby pic's ( I won't say who from) but I was also offered the opportunity to come see some hots which I regrettably never took up but it goes to show that the experienced guys on here aren't just w*****s. : victory:


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

paulds said:


> Dave yourself and Lee should really stop getting involved with these wind up merchants :lol2:
> 
> I abosolutely love coming on here and looking through the wreckage but you guy's have a lot more to offer than defending yourselves against the habitual wannabees.
> 
> I remember being a member on here years ago (possiblty with a different user name) and being texted some awesome gabby pic's ( I won't say who from) but I was also offered the opportunity to come see some hots which I regrettably never took up but it goes to show that the experienced guys on here aren't just w*****s. : victory:


You're absolutely right mate, we should just let it go, but it's like a mosquito bite you've just got to scratch.


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## dunny1 (Feb 2, 2009)

*.*

instead of saying such and such would b a great begginer hot. why not state what we started of with and why. my first was a copperhead as it was nice and small with not the worst venom. it was aggresive and wouldnt hesitate to bite u. was also a little tricky to hook at first because of its size. it soon got used to being hooked though. u cant say that its the best begginer hot though. as theres a few species that would be appropriate for starting out. anyway thats why I got a copperhead to begin with. small not the worst venom but def not to be toyed with. it is venomous they have killed and they could seriously ruin ur day.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Ok, then with all due respect, and with a genuine curiosity, may I ask a similar question?

I had a friend, many years ago, that kept DWA snakes. He really knew his stuff and had a couple of puff adders, saw-scaled vipers and i can't remember what else. I always assumed those would be very high maintenance, even for DWA species. I have NO desire to own such creatures as I'm not really a risk taker, and being very OCD about locking doors, I can do without the extra worries. However, a genuine curiosity leads me to wonder (with MASSIVE understanding that no DWA species is easy to keep), what would be a good first DWA snake to start the hobby with assuming that I had passed every test, inspection and had a good handling course? Something quite steady I imagine, and probably not something that can spit venom. Maybe you could share with us what your first DWA snake was?


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

nickthebeardedwonder said:


> but be a pretentious little premadonna to you if you dont'.


And just because I'm feeling particularly touchy tonight, that would be "prima donna" it's Italian for "first lady".
What you said would mean "earlier than a female pop artist who should've quit years ago".


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

mrcriss said:


> Ok, then with all due respect, and with a genuine curiosity, may I ask a similar question?
> 
> I had a friend, many years ago, that kept DWA snakes. He really knew his stuff and had a couple of puff adders, saw-scaled vipers and i can't remember what else. I always assumed those would be very high maintenance, even for DWA species. I have NO desire to own such creatures as I'm not really a risk taker, and being very OCD about locking doors, I can do without the extra worries. However, a genuine curiosity leads me to wonder (with MASSIVE understanding that no DWA species is easy to keep), what would be a good first DWA snake to start the hobby with assuming that I had passed every test, inspection and had a good handling course? Something quite steady I imagine, and probably not something that can spit venom. Maybe you could share with us what your first DWA snake was?


As I said before mate, your ideal first venomous snake is the one you are the most comfortable dealing with. There are far too many variable to be able to give you a cut and dried answer, however for purposes of the question, the species you said your friend kept are pretty low maintenance, and really quite easy to keep.
As I said in a previous post, first hot I handled was a red diamond rattler, first I owned was a western gaboon.


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

terciopelo_dave said:


> As I said before mate, your ideal first venomous snake is the one you are the most comfortable dealing with. There are far too many variable to be able to give you a cut and dried answer, however for purposes of the question, the species you said your friend kept are pretty low maintenance, and really quite easy to keep.
> As I said in a previous post, first hot I handled was a red diamond rattler, first I owned was a western gaboon.


Thank you, then I think we may consider the OP's question answered in a polite civil way without any of the former nastiness from either party. Let's lay the ugly matter to rest, yeah?

(btw, love gaboons, they're stunning!)


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

mrcriss said:


> Thank you, then I think we may consider the OP's question answered in a polite civil way without any of the former nastiness from either party. Let's lay the ugly matter to rest, yeah?
> 
> (btw, love gaboons, they're stunning!)


You're quite right mate, however I must say, neither myself nor Lee made the thread ugly. It was a certain volatile individual with some serious anger issues that need, in my humble opinion, professional intervention.
Your question to me was polite and respectful so I'm only too happy to respond in kind, as I'm sure every other venomous keeper would be.
And yeah, you're right, Gaboons are awesome : victory:


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## paulds (Mar 17, 2009)

In total agreement with Dave, what kills me about the forum these days is people "expect" instead of "respect" opinions. 

If keeping a king snake doesn't mean your ready for an Elapid then the people that "advise"! you otherwise are eliteist w*****s and don't know what their on about?

I'll be honest in the respect that I could probably (as could most) find my way into owning a hot but due to the fact that I would almost certainly bottle the handling, I would find myself desperately seeking the help of these guy's and hope I hadn't burnt my bridges before I needed to use them:whistling2:


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

paulds said:


> In total agreement with Dave, what kills me about the forum these days is people "expect" instead of "respect" opinions.
> 
> If keeping a king snake doesn't mean your ready for an Elapid then the people that "advise"! you otherwise are eliteist w*****s and don't know what their on about?
> 
> I'll be honest in the respect that I could probably (as could most) find my way into owning a hot but due to the fact that I would almost certainly bottle the handling, I would find myself desperately seeking the help of these guy's and hope I hadn't burnt my bridges before I needed to use them:whistling2:


You're right Paul. Everybody wants their question answered, but if they don't like the answer, you're to blame. Magic aint it.
For the record though, this is in no way an attack on the OP. You were polite throughout this heated exchange and that's greatly appreciated.


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## paulds (Mar 17, 2009)

terciopelo_dave said:


> You're right Paul. Everybody wants their question answered, but if they don't like the answer, you're to blame. Magic aint it.
> For the record though, this is in no way an attack on the OP. You were polite throughout this heated exchange and that's greatly appreciated.


Spot on, the OP was gracious to all parties and will undoubtably get the knowledge they need to get where they want to go.

I don't don't see why people try to score points by running down people who are some of the most knowledgable keepers around the forum?


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

paulds said:


> Spot on, the OP was gracious to all parties and will undoubtably get the knowledge they need to get where they want to go.
> 
> I don't don't see why people try to score points by running down people who are some of the most knowledgable keepers around the forum?


Jealousy. That's what i think and I'm sticking to it mate.


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## paulds (Mar 17, 2009)

terciopelo_dave said:


> Jealousy. That's what i think and I'm sticking to it mate.


:2thumb:


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## Elapidae (Jul 7, 2010)

It really helps if you know or can get involved with someone who already has experience with a wide variety of vens, This gives you an opportunity to watch and learn and get to know and understand the behaviours of individual species. For example in Australia a lot of people will say that some Acanthopis ssp make the best beginner Elapid, Although deadly they are a strictly hands of animal they don't need a lot of space they are easy on a hook and following a few basic rules are quite safe to keep, but they can also cause keepers to be complacent, and how do you manage it when it's not feeding or you have to administer oral or injected medications? Good beginner snake? Maybe. but lets then say you become comfortable handling these, and decide you want another species, keeping these guys has done little to prepare you to deal with much larger longer and highly mobile species, so your back at square one again. There are just so many variables and each individual has more confidence with certain species.

I think the best question, any person who is considering the prospect of Keeping dangerously venomous snakes can ask is. Who, How and Where can I gain the knowledge and develop the skills to deal with these animals safely.

The best beginner Elapid or DWA is somebody elses.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

Elapidae said:


> It really helps if you know or can get involved with someone who already has experience with a wide variety of vens, This gives you an opportunity to watch and learn and get to know and understand the behaviours of individual species. For example in Australia a lot of people will say that some Acanthopis ssp make the best beginner Elapid, Although deadly they are a strictly hands of animal they don't need a lot of space they are easy on a hook and following a few basic rules are quite safe to keep, but they can also cause keepers to be complacent, and how do you manage it when it's not feeding or you have to administer oral or injected medications? Good beginner snake? Maybe. but lets then say you become comfortable handling these, and decide you want another species, keeping these guys has done little to prepare you to deal with much larger longer and highly mobile species, so your back at square one again. There are just so many variables and each individual has more confidence with certain species.
> 
> I think the best question, any person who is considering the prospect of Keeping dangerously venomous snakes can ask is. Who, How and Where can I gain the knowledge and develop the skills to deal with these animals safely.
> 
> The best beginner Elapid or DWA is somebody elses.


Spot on mate. Great post and the advice you just gave should be followed by everyone wanting to get into venomous keeping.


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## carl24bpool (Oct 26, 2006)

I'm amazed at how much crap has been thrown about over a simple question.

Either answer the question or don't. Get off your high horses and get a grip. Its a simple question requiring a simple answer.

I've not been on this forum for a long time but it appears to have gone down hill.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

carl24bpool said:


> I'm amazed at how much crap has been thrown about over a simple question.
> 
> Either answer the question or don't. Get off your high horses and get a grip. Its a simple question requiring a simple answer.
> 
> I've not been on this forum for a long time but it appears to have gone down hill.


You haven't actually understood anything that's been said in this thread have you? Go back to page 1. Read it properly. THEN tell me who needs to get off their high horse.
A person asked a question and was given 3 sensible answers, then 1 jokey comment was made and all of a sudden we're everything that's wrong with the world. 
I'm not trying to be funny, but go back and re-read. You'll see exactly what I mean.


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## Dragon Wolf (Oct 27, 2009)

carl24bpool said:


> I'm amazed at how much crap has been thrown about over a simple question.
> 
> Either answer the question or don't. Get off your high horses and get a grip. Its a simple question requiring a simple answer.
> 
> I've not been on this forum for a long time but it appears to have gone down hill.


In my opinion the question was answered in the best way possible, why do some people insist on trying to wind up the DWA section, when from what i've seen they are willing to help when and where they can.

I don't keep DWA [although i won't rule out the possibility in the future], but even i understand that what is is easier to keep for one person, isn't neccasarily the same for everyone.

I've been lurking in this section for a while and feel i've learned a lot from what i've read here, so please don't piss these people off, otherwise we could all lose out.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

Dragon Wolf said:


> In my opinion the question was answered in the best way possible, why do some people insist on trying to wind up the DWA section, when from what i've seen they are willing to help when and where they can.
> 
> I don't keep DWA [although i won't rule out the possibility in the future], but even i understand that what is is easier to keep for one person, isn't neccasarily the same for everyone.
> 
> I've been lurking in this section for a while and feel i've learned a lot from what i've read here, so please don't piss these people off, otherwise we could all lose out.


Cheers dude. Always nice to be appreciated.
And I'm sure if you have any questions in future there will be lots of people willing to help in any way they can.


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## mattykyuss (Oct 12, 2009)

*re*

i feel sorry for the dwa keepers getting the same one braincell questions from numptys ,then getting slated for showing there frustrations ,just because you can come on the dwa section and ask a stupid question ,does not give you the right to complain when you dont get the awsner you might of been looking for ,some of the keepers on here who i know ,southwest vipers ,greenvenom ,are to me the best around ,but they will jump on me or anybody asking crap things ,maybe you should ask yourselfs first ,i think i need to pay these guys for any input from there sometimes 20 years of keeping hotts ,pay for the knowledge and help ,then you might look for yourself before asking pretty much waste of time questions over and over again ,god damn idiots


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

mattykyuss said:


> i feel sorry for the dwa keepers getting the same one braincell questions from numptys ,then getting slated for showing there frustrations ,just because you can come on the dwa section and ask a stupid question ,does not give you the right to complain when you dont get the awsner you might of been looking for ,some of the keepers on here who i know ,southwest vipers ,greenvenom ,are to me the best around ,but they will jump on me or anybody asking crap things ,maybe you should ask yourselfs first ,i think i need to pay these guys for any input from there sometimes 20 years of keeping hotts ,pay for the knowledge and help ,then you might look for yourself before asking pretty much waste of time questions over and over again ,god damn idiots


 
Sadly mate no one's ever going to think that. Some people will think they're owed the answer they want to hear, but more commonly, people just don't think.


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## mattykyuss (Oct 12, 2009)

*re*

i know mate ,but its there attitude like ,they are intiltled because they can ask ,it sucks


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

mattykyuss said:


> i know mate ,but its there attitude like ,they are intiltled because they can ask ,it sucks


Agreed mate.
However, mods, in all seriousness, I think this and the "easy-expert species to keep" threads should be closed now. They've strayed way off topic, no fresh ground is being covered, and I think we can all agree that some people like to hear what venomous snake keepers have to say while, clearly, some don't.
P.S. Please don't accuse me of telling you how to do your jobs, that would really cap my day off.


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## Elapidae (Jul 7, 2010)

Just an observation and I'll probably be flamed but here goes. The lack of respect that is shown To DWA keepers equates to a lack of respect for the animals these people are dealing with. if your not interested in what they have to say then why enter the DWA forum area. It almost seems that due to the lack of naturally occurring deadly species over there, a large number of people fail to realize the enormity of the undertaking one takes when dealing with these animals on a daily basis, where is over here it's quite the opposite.


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## terciopelo_dave (Jun 1, 2007)

Elapidae said:


> Just an observation and I'll probably be flamed but here goes. The lack of respect that is shown To DWA keepers equates to a lack of respect for the animals these people are dealing with. if your not interested in what they have to say then why enter the DWA forum area. It almost seems that due to the lack of naturally occurring deadly species over there, a large number of people fail to realize the enormity of the undertaking one takes when dealing with these animals on a daily basis, where is over here it's quite the opposite.


 
Never a truer word said mate. Seriously, that's it in a nutshell.
It reminds me very much of something my friend once told me. He said "If you shave a tiger it's got stripey skin". My answer was "Think about what you just said. The stripey skin is irrelevant compared to the enormity of shaving a tiger".


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## Elapidae (Jul 7, 2010)

HAHA good one


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## snappingchap (Jul 31, 2010)

i have to agree with numerous opinions on the thread, having read each post from the first to the last, i have to add my two pennies worth.

if (in my opinion) you actually need to ask what snake would be my first hot, then you probably are not actually ready to own them.

please dont come into this forum, or others slating other peoples expertise or advise, yes we all get our backs up, but usually for a reason, when trying to help then getting someone throwing that back in your face, usually then comes up against a brick wall.

i have kept snakes for 20years, hots (on and off) for ten, however, i dont have a vast knowledge of these animals, in a round about way i actually do, my friends on this and other forums will help out whenever needed.

please try to treat them with respect, i certainly try to, if help is needed they will help out ANYTIME they can and will not look down their noses at you for asking what actually may be a simple question.

i repeat the fact though, if you need to ask what hot snake is an ideal starter, please dont have hots, you are not ready, when you are ready, you will know yourself what is suitable to you, please dont go for copperheads though ay, you will get mauled, if you do drop onto a supplier or non venomous mangroves too, there may be a lot of people interested in purchasing them.

:lol2:


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## Athravan (Dec 28, 2006)

Closed on request of the OP.


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