# Fire Salamanders



## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Hi there. I have been looking into getting some fire salamanders and have looked at so many caresheets that it will be any minuet when my head explodes and I ask my mum to let me have one. D:

However, I need your help~

I am a newbie to amphibians, I am more of a reptile guy, with a leopard gecko and a california kingsnake. I know all of the general knowledge for setting up their habitat, but I have a few questions I hope you can answer. =)


How big will the vivarium need to be? I hard 10-20 gallon aquariums work well, but what would be the best size in inches?
Can you post some pictures of setups so I can have a few ideas of what my salamander's setup should look like if I get one?
What subspecies would you recommend?
Where can I buy one?
Thanks, Liam.


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## TheToad888 (Dec 18, 2008)

A 10 gallon for one salamander (18''x12''x15'' I THINK). 
For species... I like salamandra salamandra gigliolii, but there is a wide range of subspecies them for sale. 
Here is a really good place to buy salamanders, Dartfrog - Everything for the Amphibian Keeper
It is a really good site and has really good service.

Good luck


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

24 x 12" upwards is the best size viv.
eco earth best sub.
and buy from most exotic pet shops.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Thanks for your time guys. I'll look into your answers and opinions. =)

Any more suggestions?


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## TheToad888 (Dec 18, 2008)

Just wanted to say, if you are looking for a starter species, that can look similar, then why don't you go for barred tiger salamanders? Tiger Salamanders as Pets - Care and Feeding
They are very friendly, funny and have no toxins. They can be very pretty as well. They are a lot less demanding and simpler to keep than the fire salamander. But it is up to you.


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

TheToad888 said:


> Just wanted to say, if you are looking for a starter species, that can look similar, then why don't you go for barred tiger salamanders? Tiger Salamanders as Pets - Care and Feeding
> They are very friendly, funny and have no toxins. They can be very pretty as well. They are a lot less demanding and simpler to keep than the fire salamander. But it is up to you.


 
I'm not sure it's that easy to find CB though.

Fire sals are awesome btw, I love mine!


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Don't worry Mr. Toad, I have been looking into Tiger Salamanders just in case I can't get my hands on a Fire Salamander. =)

Also, this may sound a bit weird to you, but a Fire salamander is one of my main targets because I want a herp from every sing continent (barring the poles. lol) and the Fire Salamander is European. Already have a North American herp. ;]

Cheeky little Maia. lulz.

Thanks. =)


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Hmm... sorry to ask so many questions, but I have two more. ^^;


Will a 18" x 18" x 18" Exo terra be a nice home for a fire salamander?
Do you have to go to the dartfrog store to buy animals, or do they bring them to you?
Thanks.


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## TheToad888 (Dec 18, 2008)

LiamAndKec said:


> Hmm... sorry to ask so many questions, but I have two more. ^^;
> 
> 
> Will a 18" x 18" x 18" Exo terra be a nice home for a fire salamander?
> ...


Yeah it seems ok. 
And, no dartfrog usually posts to you. Postage is £15. Which, is cheaper compared to other sites. Plus, the animals arrive very quickly.


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## cpiggott22 (Apr 1, 2009)

I personally wouldn't keep a single adult fire salamander in anything smaller than 24"l x 18"d x 15"h. Given the space they love to roam about at night and can be suprisingly active. You may be ok if you set the exo up in a way that creates more floor space though.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

cpiggott22 said:


> I personally wouldn't keep a single adult fire salamander in anything smaller than 24"l x 18"d x 15"h. Given the space they love to roam about at night and can be suprisingly active. You may be ok if you set the exo up in a way that creates more floor space though.


Can't really crea more floorspace in an 18[sup]3[/sup] exo terra.

Only way of changing size I can think of is decreasing it by turning it diamond way or smashing it. D:

Also I asked wether it was good because I know they like to roam. I saw a few in my local exotic shop a while back, and they were quite a big tank. One was in the water and one was chasing dinner. lol.

Thanks. =)


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## cpiggott22 (Apr 1, 2009)

Our guys are due an upgrade as they're fully grown now. We plan on building 2 3'l x 2'd x 18"h vivs with 3 males in one and 4 females in the other. So that's 2 square feet per male and 1.5 square feet per female. The space needed per animal tends to go down as numbers go up as they're happy to share space if you see what I mean- so although our girlies may be happy with 1.5 feet, I'd still recommend minimum 3 square feet for a single adult. Hope that made some sense *scratches head as have lost myself in my own explanation*

Oh, and by creating extra floor space I meant that maybe you could create an additional level or part level some how and have a slope or ramp connecting it


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Ah, the ramp idea sounds brill. I just drew a few AWESOME diagrammes on paint to show you my idea of a ramp I could put at the back of the viv.








From the side.








from the front.

Basically a simple wooden structure I can fix to the back with some screws. There are two ramps on the sides of a back panel that the salamanders can climb onto and one at the front. Won't make it too high, and I'll also put extra spongey moss underneath it so if they jump off they won't get hurt.

They can also hide under it to get away from my ugly mug. 8D


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

in my opinion a 18 x 18 will be absoulutely fine. seems like a watse of height though


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

I don't really mindbuilding a bigger viv. Gonna do so for the snake, so I'll probably get into it afterwords. 

Anyway, I can build a viv for about £30-£50 for the salamanders that i'd have to buy for over £100, so I am happy.

Stupid rip-off shop. :[


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## cpiggott22 (Apr 1, 2009)

I wouldn't say 18" is a waste of height, they benefit from the open space and they do like to perch high up sometimes. The bigger the better really, if you can build one cheap then I personally would go for that option. Good luck with the build, I'd love to see it when it's all finished. Love your diagrams btw  but I'm glad to see my post made some sense and wasn't total rubbish!


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Haha.

Yeah, your post was very helpful. I'm not the most creative of people, so a bit of artistic design is a strain on the mind. lol.

Thannks again.


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## stinglestick (Aug 28, 2008)

TheToad888 said:


> Just wanted to say, if you are looking for a starter species, that can look similar, then why don't you go for barred tiger salamanders? Tiger Salamanders as Pets - Care and Feeding
> They are very friendly, funny and have no toxins. They can be very pretty as well. They are a lot less demanding and simpler to keep than the fire salamander. But it is up to you.


I agree,tiger salamanders are well easy to care for,i had one who grew really large and died when she was 13 and all i did was basically feed her worms dug up from my compost ! ..i now own 2 fire salamanders and they are an altogether more fickle creature,Higher maintenence for sure.Not much difference between the two visually so its an easier option!!


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## stinglestick (Aug 28, 2008)

As for wasting height in tanks get those sticky on foliage thingies or put in your own plants,my two love to climb and often perch up high .Have a mess around with the tank etc before you add them and consider all the layouts.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Haha, brilliant idea. The plants also give the illusion of the space being more compact and doesn't look wasted... snazzy. o:

Also, I always set up the tank a week before I get my chosen pet... just to make sure the temperature and all that jazz is correct. I'll have plenty of time to play about with it! 

Also, tiger salamanders are an option if I can't get fires.


Thanks. =)


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

I fail to see why fires are more maintenance than tigers, tigers produce more faeces than fires for sure depending on what you feed them.

Fires are very easy to get, but dont pay over the odds.

Ben


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Thanks for the reply, Ben. =)


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

Thats ok, 
let me know what you decide on, i cam point you in the right direction for fires.

Ben


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Getting fire's and it's 99.9% confirmed my mum will let me have them!

Dad's encouraged me to look after different species from the start and takes an active part in the care of Kec (buys food specifically for the crickets. What a man. xP).

Now I asked my mum if I could get a Fire Salamander and she said

"oh, can't that be your christmas present?"

Since I asked her if I could have it after the room was done up... which is in a few weeks/month.

So, what subspecies would you recommend? =]


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## cpiggott22 (Apr 1, 2009)

check out Ben W's photo album, he's got a wonderful collection of stunning subspecies and could tell you an awful lot about the behaviours/temperments of each one :notworthy:. I would love some red terrestris or gigiliolli but that's based purely on the fact that they're beautiful!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

They're all pretty cool, just depends on which patterns you prefer really.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

I absolutely love the look of gigliolli. The patterns are stunning, and the high amount of yellow is really nice. =)

Are gigliolli readily available, though? o:


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

Gigliolli are available, i havent any at the moment, but Mark at Dartfrog has some different sizes available, the brightest coloured ones come from an area called serra san bruno in Southern Italy.
Also gigliolli are one of the sub species that really does benefit from extra calcium in its diet in the form of limestone flour.
Good Luck

Ben


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## TheToad888 (Dec 18, 2008)

I adore gigliolii... Definately my fave. If i ever get a fire it would be gigliolii or terrestris... Love 'em both :flrt:


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

TheToad888 said:


> I adore gigliolii... Definately my fave. If i ever get a fire it would be gigliolii or terrestris... Love 'em both :flrt:


Yeah, but you are scared of the toxins:lol2:


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## TheToad888 (Dec 18, 2008)

Ben W said:


> Yeah, but you are scared of the toxins:lol2:


:devil::devil::devil:
Naaah... I like fires... But i wouldn't get something like a california newt. 
Fires are lovely but i prefer tigers


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

TheToad888 said:


> I adore gigliolii... Definately my fave. If i ever get a fire it would be gigliolii or terrestris... Love 'em both :flrt:


 
Haha, great minds think alike. 

And thanks for your help Ben. I will make sure to give it lots of calcium and I'll try and get a hold of that limestone flour you're on about.

Thanks again. =)


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

its real cheap stuff, its for horses really, but if you cant find any give me a shout and i will post you some, i give it to all my sals at some point.

Ben


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

I'm guessing it's just a chalky powder?


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## stinglestick (Aug 28, 2008)

Ben W said:


> I fail to see why fires are more maintenance than tigers, tigers produce more faeces than fires for sure depending on what you feed them.
> 
> Fires are very easy to get, but dont pay over the odds.
> 
> Ben


I dealt with the faecal thingy by creating my own little micro climate inside my tigers tank..She loved earth worms ,so i used potting compost so she could burrow and put in shed loads of worm from my own compost heap to deal with the mess etc and for her to stalk and eat..She lived until she was 13 and was 16 inches nose to toe..so i must have done something right !!


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Tigers look nice. But I'm set on Fires, thanks.


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

their both a great species so i have a way to settle it, get two tanks and have one of each, thats my plan.


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## stinglestick (Aug 28, 2008)

LiamAndKec said:


> Tigers look nice. But I'm set on Fires, thanks.


Fires are cool,my two Tiger and Motley are right little characters !! good choice!


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

stinglestick said:


> I dealt with the faecal thingy by creating my own little micro climate inside my tigers tank..She loved earth worms ,so i used potting compost so she could burrow and put in shed loads of worm from my own compost heap to deal with the mess etc and for her to stalk and eat..She lived until she was 13 and was 16 inches nose to toe..so i must have done something right !!


 
There is no doubt in my mind that you do things right by your animals!!!

I was just saying that fires are no more maintenance than tigers :lol2:


Ben


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

OH MY GOD.

Me and my mum went to the local to buy some crix and some mealworms. We find out that they're selling 09 Fire Salamanders £29.99 each! wow, I was amazed. They had 2 left from a clutch of 4 they got a while back, but nobody wanted them. I got both and a free set up all for £29.99. The price of around £70!

So chuffed. =)

They're about 2" they're sooo small and adorable. I'm feeding them extra small crix. and ones already shown he likes to feed. Don't know the genders because they're so small, so names will just be Bonnie and Clyde for now. lol.

Hoping to get pics up soon to show you, hopefully you can tell me the subspecies. They're in a 7" x 7" x 5.5" box atm... a bit small but they look comfy in it for now. I'll move them into my faunarium when Maia moves out into a big viv! After Faun they'll have a nice custom viv for adulthood! 

Thanks for your help guys. I really, really, really, super duper apreciate it!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

Cool, get some pics up! Mine are a little bit bigger than that and have just moved them out of their lunchboxes!


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Here are some pics. =)









There is 'Bonnie'. Not it's official name, but will do for now. Bonnie was out and about hunting small crix but when I came she rushed into the moss.








'Clyde'. He was under a bit of moss. I lifted it up and snapped a shot. A lot clearer than the last. o:


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## C4VEMAN-5AM (May 30, 2009)

LiamAndKec said:


> Here are some pics. =)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Awesome. : victory:

Congratulations. :no1:


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Thanks. My mum has nicknamed them "the most adorable things ever".

xDD


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## C4VEMAN-5AM (May 30, 2009)

:lol2: Thats pretty much the same thing my mum said when she saw a picture of them from google.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Just a quick question - should I used distilled or mineral bottled water?

RIght now I am using boiled/cooled water.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Please guys? D:


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## ex0tics (Jun 9, 2009)

Bottled water 
I think aged water can work too just fill up a container or bottle and leave the lid off for 3 or so days and the chemicals should have evaporated(Atleast I think.)


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

yeah, leave it on a windowsill.

Nice sal, mine will be here soon


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Any companies you would recommend?

Like volvic, evian... ect.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Anything? D:


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

i personally use rainwater and always have


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## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

what ifit doesnt rain for ages?


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

Thanks Ben. I live in London, so won't pollution be a high risk?


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

Joe1507 said:


> what ifit doesnt rain for ages?


As long as you leave plenty of buckets out in the summer you'll be fine.


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## LiamAndKec (Jan 23, 2009)

ANy recommended bottled water?

I wouldn't want to risk rain because I live in London - lot's of pollution. :c


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## linda.t (Sep 28, 2007)

they are great i brought one from the kiddermister show yesterday.


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## Ben W (Nov 18, 2008)

Hi
Yes i would agree that in London, or indeed any large city, maybe rain may not be the best idea, bottled /spring water would then be the way to go, or just let tap water stand for 24 hrs.
Ben


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