# Oophaga pumilio



## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

hey guys,

i've been thinking about getting darts for ages now and i've decided on Oophaga pumilio! (won't be getting them for a while though)
my quesion is are they that hard to care for and what would be the right size viv?
i've read about them being in 45x45x60 vivs, but is that enough for a pair and would bigger be better?

thanks:2thumb:


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

I've literally just got a 50x50x60 for 2 pairs of bastimentos Pums. They are very much climbers so i'd say your suggestion is spot on for either a pair or a trio.

I'll let one of the other guys answer regarding difficulty as i havent had mine long enough to confidently answer although i think if you get the general stuff right then you should be fine - heating especially.


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

Cornish-J said:


> I've literally just got a 50x50x60 for 2 pairs of bastimentos Pums. They are very much climbers so i'd say your suggestion is spot on for either a pair or a trio.
> 
> I'll let one of the other guys answer regarding difficulty as i havent had mine long enough to confidently answer although i think if you get the general stuff right then you should be fine - heating especially.


thanks for the reply j, 

so your keeping 2 pairs in the one viv?


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

Yea thats right, i only picked the viv up yesterday so around the end of the month it should be occupied by two pairs of basti's


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Hi Martin wow you re a blast from the past,have a dig through recent posts mate,I put some notes down about this last few days. I also have 2 pr in a 50x50x60,but if you can go bigger,then more space for these will always be used by them,see recent posts on my room thread aswell concerning male on male agression

best

Stu


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

45x45x60 is a starting point for viv size.
Bigger is always better but not always necessary.
DO NOT keep two males together with pums, it's a ticket to disaster.

Mike


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

thanks guys, my first thoughts were doing 600mm cubes or will this be overkill for a pair? 
i get the feeling i will want more than one viv in time:whistling2:,. i want to make the right choice now, so my vivs will all be the same size lol!
what would you guys say was the perfect size for a pair of them?


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

my 50x50x60 is suprisingly big, i've got a few size vivs here if you ever want to pop up and have a look. 45x45x60 would be good for a pair but as Stu says, the bigger the better!


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

Cornish-J said:


> my 50x50x60 is suprisingly big, i've got a few size vivs here if you ever want to pop up and have a look. 45x45x60 would be good for a pair but as Stu says, the bigger the better!


that would be awesome mate, thanks. have you got any pics of that viv on here?


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

I havent yet, i'll try and get a pic later on


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Martin if your planning on getting more vivs it might be an idea not to go large or you'll have no room if you want to expand.
I've just set up some new pum vivs and went for height. 
I got them all made 40x40x70 and there's more than enough room for them. 
One viv has 4 BriBri in it with no sign of overcrowding. 
So realistically there is no point in going larger.



Mike


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

frogman955 said:


> Martin if your planning on getting more vivs it might be an idea not to go large or you'll have no room if you want to expand.
> I've just set up some new pum vivs and went for height.
> I got them all made 40x40x70 and there's more than enough room for them.
> One viv has 4 BriBri in it with no sign of overcrowding.
> ...


thanks mike, i really like the sound of those vivs. i bet they look amazing!


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## aberreef (Aug 10, 2010)

I don't think Pumilio are any more difficult than any other Dart frog. Their reputation for being more difficult stems from their breeding habits, otherwise they are pretty easy to care for.

Sort out their food culturing before you get them. Melanogaster fruit flies, aphids and LOADS of springtails is about all the food they will ever need

I keep most of my pairs in 30x45x60 vivs. My Blue jeans are in 50x50x60. The only problem with the smaller viv is the plants make them pretty crowded and I can't see the frogs much (I like this though, it's entertaining playing "spot the frog" lol). Otherwise there's plenty of room for them


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

You can see them here Martin http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/amphibians/1001807-new-dart-frog-build-5.html
I just thought it would be great to have them all looking the same, externally. 
Lots tidier than having them all different as they were before. 

Mike


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## fatlad69 (Oct 22, 2009)

My Pum vivs are 39x45x60 custom built by DMS to fit the rack. I only have a pair of black jeans at the moment but there seems to be plenty of room for them.

Adam


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

You've plenty of room Adam because you've no frogs in there :whistling2:
:2thumb::lol2:


Mike


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## fatlad69 (Oct 22, 2009)

frogman955 said:


> You've plenty of room Adam because you've no frogs in there :whistling2:
> :2thumb::lol2:
> 
> 
> Mike


It may as well be empty because I never see them.:lol2:


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Sorry Adam I couldn't resist that. 
Don't worry they'll do you proud one day. 


Mike


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## fatlad69 (Oct 22, 2009)

I hope so, they are beautiful frogs when they do come out.


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

all your vivs look awesome:notworthy:
can't wait to start building mine now.

i,ve had the tropical woodlice on the go for ages now, so no problem there.
would i need Melanogaster, Hydei and springtails too?


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Wingless mels, Hydei and springs are a definite.
The rest is up to you depending on what you want.

Mike


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

frogman955 said:


> Wingless mels, Hydei and springs are a definite.
> The rest is up to you depending on what you want.
> 
> Mike


LMAO erm wingless mels Hydei and a SHEDLOADA springs:lol2:

Stu


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## Meefloaf (Mar 24, 2013)

we could re-write the twelve days of christmas


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

frogman955 said:


> Wingless mels, Hydei and springs are a definite.
> The rest is up to you depending on what you want.
> 
> Mike


cheers mike, i'll get on that very soon! i guess i'm going to need a fair bit of grub for them lol


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Well Martin that depends on what your going to be keeping.
I`ve got a proper mixture of Pums, Tincs, Terribs and Leucs.
I`ve got the Hydei for the larger frogs and the Mels for the Pums.
When it comes to culturing I always make more Mels as they can be eaten by all the frogs but are also needed for froglets.
So I`d probably be looking at 2 mels to 1 hydei.
Springtails are need for food for froglets, mostly for pums.
Tincs and Leucs etc, well mine anyway, are usually onto mels within a week or so of leaving the water so springs are not what I consider necessary for them.
They will eat them though so always worth putting some in with them.
Pum froglets WILL need springs for a long time after leaving water.
You can also dump a load of springs into your vivs to help keep them clean but your pretty much guaranteed that your frogs will eat them up.
Terribs are the exception as they don`t seem to bother with them, probably because they`re too small.
Woodlice, hmmmm.
My jury is out on them.
I`ve no doubt that they will help clean a viv but they hide all the time and I`m doubtful as to how much value they are as a food item.
They are slow to produce so wouldn`t put out enough numbers in the viv to keep your frogs fed.
So it all comes back tou your main food items being good old Mels and Hydei.
Oh and I almost forgot, I`ve got my trusty bean weevils for the larger frogs.


Mike


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Martin I'll disagree slightly with Mike here on the woodlice,but let it be known although we don't always do the same things we both get results,with pums,so my way or his neither is best,both work. The point is giving you options. 

To me a baby pums is reliant on possibly 3 feeders for a good while before you can get them to flies,one is spring tails,two mites and 3 baby woodlice. The dwarf white kids are so small they can get through .4mm mesh,so can be taken from the off,plus as I load their cultures with Ca,they have that in them. I also use a little fast grey woodlouce,it's a bit more visible- terrestrial than the whites. I think it's really important this one to pums. I know a big breeder stateside ships these with every pum he sells,but that aside they reproduce faster than the white and I know the pums love 'em. So I would add those to any viv I set for pums and all youngsters are seeding with them from the off.

There is another dwarf iso Dwarf striped,but I can't comment on them because I'm still building numbers,but early findings are fast production and very very visible 

good luck with it mate

Stu


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## aberreef (Aug 10, 2010)

Striped are a great feeder  and much easier to collect than the others. Put a twig from an Elderflower bush in with them and they will climb on it unlike the other two species. They also eat the bark


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Damn I'll rob that:lol2: try plum on the other two buddy,tis pay back after all:2thumb: I use lumps of rotten plum for all the iso,works a treat for collection

Stu


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## martin r (Jan 10, 2009)

thanks for all the tips guys! think i'm going to just culture lots of different stuff and see what they like.
my next move will be building the viv


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

did you say you already had a viv Martin? if you dont then i would highly recommend getting an ENT style one ... exo terras need some modding to make suitable


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