# Feeder mice or rats?



## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

Hi,

I want to start breeding my own snake food. I currently have 10 royals on mice who eat a range of small to jumbo mice so will need to move over to rats soon. 
I have a few questions if anyone doesn't mind answering them as best they can based on their experience.

1) the rumour is rats smell more than mice. Is this true? (I know if you keep them clean they shouldnt smell but if does have newborn I've seen it mentioned that they'll turn on them if disturbed?)
2) to feed 10 royals what would the best set up be? I was thinking 2 tubs with 1:3 rats and 2 spare tubs, one for cleaning and one to move the litter into once weaned but to keep them growing until ready to be culled.
3) at what age are rats sexually mature? As I don't want to keep littered together and continue to grow them if theyre gunna unexpectedly be at it Lol.
4) how much would it cost approximately to feed this many rats a week, just so I can work it out cost wise against buying frozen.
5) one last thing, how old would the rats be to reach about 50g? I think it'd be about 4 weeks and be considered top weight weaned rats?

Sorry for all the questions, but i just wanted clarification. Thanks


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## pants125 (Jan 30, 2009)

I have only just started to breed my rats so other people mite be able to give u a better idea, I have 60+ rats from adult to pinky and they don't smell that being said I keeP them in a shed, a rat will have 12 baby's every 3 weeks but a little break should be giving inbetween litters so if u have 6 females u will have 72 +- baby's within 3 weeks this is provided all females can lay.I cant comment on how much it cost to feed as I get my food from wholesaler but they go through alot, there is a good sticky which I think tells u the size of rats/ age
Best way to stop unwanted breeding is to keep males and females separate or kill all males off first and freeze for smallest snake just growing females on


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## pants125 (Jan 30, 2009)

Also i don't know if anyone else does but I go through a lot of water bottles,good Idea to-have some spare


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## steandbecky (Mar 16, 2010)

mice smell so much more than rats imo if rats are kept clean they can be both great pets + clean animals


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## Wolflore (Mar 3, 2010)

Mice only smell because they continually scent mark, whereas a rat will use a latrine area and scent mark less.

I think if a mouse was kept on a good litter and regularly cleaned out it wouldn't smell much at all. The other halves sis kept some which didn't smell.


Anthony


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## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

pants125 said:


> I have only just started to breed my rats so other people mite be able to give u a better idea, I have 60+ rats from adult to pinky and they don't smell that being said I keeP them in a shed, a rat will have 12 baby's every 3 weeks but a little break should be giving inbetween litters so if u have 6 females u will have 72 +- baby's within 3 weeks this is provided all females can lay.I cant comment on how much it cost to feed as I get my food from wholesaler but they go through alot, there is a good sticky which I think tells u the size of rats/ age
> Best way to stop unwanted breeding is to keep males and females separate or kill all males off first and freeze for smallest snake just growing females on





steandbecky said:


> mice smell so much more than rats imo if rats are kept clean they can be both great pets + clean animals





Wolflore said:


> Mice only smell because they continually scent mark, whereas a rat will use a latrine area and scent mark less.
> 
> I think if a mouse was kept on a good litter and regularly cleaned out it wouldn't smell much at all. The other halves sis kept some which didn't smell.
> 
> ...


Ok so rats seem like the better option, size wise and smelling wise.
And thanks for the tip of culling the males smaller. 
Anyone else have any idea of answers to the other questions?


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## trogdorable (Feb 4, 2011)

they can be sexually mature at 5 weeks.
i would also advize against keeping males with females and only putting them together to do dirty. and give them breaks between litters, this will help the mum psychologicly as well as physicly.
do not keep them on sawdust, and give them fruit and veg in their diet as often as possible. it would also be benificail to give the rats toys etc. although they arent pets, all these things will contribute to their health , thus the health of your snakes.


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## eightball (Jan 1, 2011)

Jay--Pee said:


> 1) the rumour is rats smell more than mice. Is this true? (I know if you keep them clean they shouldnt smell but if does have newborn I've seen it mentioned that they'll turn on them if disturbed?)
> mice smell far worse than rats IMO, smell has no ill affect on babies i dont think aslong as the ammonia doesnt build to high
> 
> 2) to feed 10 royals what would the best set up be? I was thinking 2 tubs with 1:3 rats and 2 spare tubs, one for cleaning and one to move the litter into once weaned but to keep them growing until ready to be culled.
> ...


as above


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## trogdorable (Feb 4, 2011)

dog food? do not feed a rat souly on dog food.
try looking for cheaper deals on rat food online. or you could research what a rat needs nutritionaly and make up your own mix. whatever works out more conveneniant/ cheaper for you . feeding them properly will benefit your snakes , just like any other food.


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## eightball (Jan 1, 2011)

trogdorable said:


> dog food? do not feed a rat souly on dog food.
> try looking for cheaper deals on rat food online. or you could research what a rat needs nutritionaly and make up your own mix. whatever works out more conveneniant/ cheaper for you . feeding them properly will benefit your snakes , just like any other food.


why not..ive fed mine for ages of purely dog food and the occasional left over food and seeds and ive never had a problem with rats being overweight or scratching caused by high protein, neither have they had any sickness of any kind such as upset stomachs etc


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## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

eightball said:


> why not..ive fed mine for ages of purely dog food and the occasional left over food and seeds and ive never had a problem with rats being overweight or scratching caused by high protein, neither have they had any sickness of any kind such as upset stomachs etc


I did think that was what most feeder breeders did to be honest. Can i ask how many snakes you have and how many rays you keep to breed food for them?


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## trogdorable (Feb 4, 2011)

its such an inappropriate diet and sorry i dont believe youve never had illness. the best pet rat breeders who are fed top notch food still get uri's, uti' etc.

if you do a little bit of research into it, youl see dog food , unless its expensive and still mixed with other things, is not a reasonable chioce. you want the best food for your snakes? feed their food what is best for it. its not difficult nor bank draining.


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## eightball (Jan 1, 2011)

Jay--Pee said:


> I did think that was what most feeder breeders did to be honest. Can i ask how many snakes you have and how many rays you keep to breed food for them?


quite a lot do and quite alot use sou pelets also, ive never had a problem, the quality of them is far higher than petshop rats so i dont particularly care what anyone says although i know that dog food is fine just some people believe in little fairy tails of all sorts of problems using dog food...



trogdorable said:


> its such an inappropriate diet and sorry i dont believe youve never had illness. the best pet rat breeders who are fed top notch food still get uri's, uti' etc.
> 
> if you do a little bit of research into it, youl see dog food , unless its expensive and still mixed with other things, is not a reasonable chioce. you want the best food for your snakes? feed their food what is best for it. its not difficult nor bank draining.


how can you possibly define the "best pet rat breeders" and my rats arent really classified as pets to me,

and actually ive done research into most illnesses and expecially on more common illnesses such as uris etc and none of mine have EVER i mean EVER had a uri or uti (thats unless theyve been so discrete about it, climbed out of the cages somehow got tissue and cleaned up all odd urine and sprayed the cage down with oust and gotten back in)

also, research into dog food and rat food expecially costs, there is no need to research, it doesnt take a genius to work out that 50p a kilo for dog food is cheaper than a £10 4kilo bag of rat food!

you get me all your ever so good rat food nutritional values and ill get my apparantly poor dog food nutritional values (and quite occasional seed) and i bet no values are far away from each other in comparison and if any are far out in comparison i would like you to prove what illnesses are caused by the lack of whatever super duper extra minerals or whatever is in rat food then please confirm how likely the apparent illness is likely to happen...

none of my rats past the age of 4days old has ever died, i write on each tub how many rats are in there and check every so often A) so i know if any have some how escaped and B) so i know if any have died

i dont see why people like you critise people using dog food and sou pelets as the main part of a rats diet when really there is next to no difference than "a rats proper diet", are you on commision for getting people to buy rat food or something?

after all of that, on the other hand i would hapily confirm that dog food is NOT suitable for mice atall, they are 20times more suseptible of dying from these oh so nutrition deficiencys than rats


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## pants125 (Jan 30, 2009)

£10 for 4 kg Holly [email protected]@t that is some expensive food I only paid £17 for a 20kg sack of mixed rat food just bout some more sacks of rat pellets at £6 for 25 kg but they ain't too keen on that. 
On the dog food wouldn't you have different quality of food some better than others


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## Nomad Gecko (Apr 26, 2012)

Anyone breed multimammate mice?
they grow quite large

are they the compromise between mice and rats?

: victory:


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