# kitten diarrhoea - the sequel...



## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Hello everyone

Well despite things looking up for Maisy since the diagnosis of Giardia (http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/other-pets-exotics/447324-kitten-diarrhoea-update.html) we seem to be having a set back again....

It was all looking so good... but yesterday and today we're back to diarrhoea, stinky cat and bottom smears all over the place :bash:

It's not as bad as it was before - we're talking soft/wet, rather than complete liquid but it's still not normal poop and she's not cleaning herself properly either.

I'm not sure what to do now. The vet wants to wait until next week when I bring in the next round of faecal samples to see if the Giardia has cleared up. She's fine in herself as always, and she's eating and drinking. I've been feeding the normal food and some pro-biotic natural yoghurt now and then.

I really thought we were getting somewhere with this but now I'm worried the Giardia may not have been the full explanation for her problem. Aside from the fact that I'm worried about her, I'm also getting a bit down about the mess everywhere. I'm not the sort of person who gets bothered about that sort of mess - I just clear it up, but it's getting harder and harder when it's happening every day. I can't stop her going on the carpets/furniture, nor would I want to, but I am hoping to have a kitten bottom-smear free life at some point!! 

There's probably not much anyone can advise at this point but just needed to offload about it really. 

ho hum!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Poor you, its a bit of a nightmare situation isnt it. The annoying thing about some of these stomach bugs is that they dont show up on every fecal test which muddies the water. She may be clear of Giardia but she could have another bug running alongside it or maybe she just had a sensitive tum after her previous problems
I really dont know what to suggest at the minute as it cant be pleasant for you or the cat


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> Poor you, its a bit of a nightmare situation isnt it. The annoying thing about some of these stomach bugs is that they dont show up on every fecal test which muddies the water. She may be clear of Giardia but she could have another bug running alongside it or maybe she just had a sensitive tum after her previous problems
> I really dont know what to suggest at the minute as it cant be pleasant for you or the cat



Yeah I wondered if there was something else. She's now had 2 tests for campylobacter which both came back negative. I'm not sure what else they test for. I keep asking if they have tested for TTF and am told "yes they did cultures" but I'm really not satisfied with that response as it's a parasite, not a bacteria. I'm hoping I can get to see my usual vet - he doesn't seem to fob me off the way this other one does. Don't get me wrong, she's nice and is probably a very good vet but....

I wondered if I should put them on dry food only? At the moment they have a sachet of hills wet kitten food between them in the morning and then free access to dry kitten food all day. Does that sound ok? Should I be excluding the wet food (they do seem to love it though!)


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

The wet food is only a very small amount so shouldnt bother them at all


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks - I won't change it then


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## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

i had a cat catch giardia while at stud, it took 6 months for her to recover enough to get neutered, she was on panacur for ages to get rid of it.
i remember the liquid poo too well..........


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

pigglywiggly said:


> i had a cat catch giardia while at stud, it took 6 months for her to recover enough to get neutered, she was on panacur for ages to get rid of it.
> i remember the liquid poo too well..........


Ah ok - thanks!
Well in a weird way I guess that's good to know - at least I know what I might be in for! 

All I can say is, thank god I have hooded litter trays otherwise I dread to think what the place would have been like during the explosive diarrhoea phase :gasp:


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## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

i had to do the big crate thing, family was not too pleased!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Just thought I'd update you all on Maisy.

We've had a 4 days of explosive diarrhoea so I'm now trying a 7 day course of panacur (thanks pigglywiggly) and very much hoping this will work.

I started the course on Friday and she seems a little better today (relatively speaking!). I'm also giving George the 7 day course too.

I'm keeping everything crossed this sorts it out.

I'm trying to keep the house as clean as possible so she can't re-infect herself but it's proving difficult. Obviously hard surfaces are easy - I just bleach them, but carpets and furniture are harder. Where I can see a mark I'm scrubbing it but I'm worried I'm not getting it all. Our carpets are inconveniently coloured so it doesn't show up that well! :bash:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

It all sounds quite horrendous - poor you!

I hope the Panacur works this time! :2thumb:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

If this course of Panacur doesnt work its worth asking your vet for a course of Metronidazole. Have you thought of steam cleaning your carpets? I thought you might like to read this:-
*How is Giardiasis Treated?:*

Giardiasis is often treated with metronidazole (Flagyl), but there are several other oral medications available. According to Dr. Mike Richards, cats show more resistance than dogs to medication for giardiasis, so sometimes it takes several courses of treatment or a switch to another medication to effect a cure. 

Scrupulous scooping, cleaning, and disinfecting of litter boxes will help prevent the spread of giardia to other cats. A 30:1 solution of chlorine bleach may be effective for litter boxes, and some catteries advocate steam cleaning of all surfaces where giardia cysts might be present.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks for that - it's worth considering if panacur doesn't work. 
I know Metronidazole can cause quite unpleasant side effects in humans - I wonder if it's the same for cats?

I have considered steam cleaning - in fact, until last week I was using a steam cleaner I borrowed from my mum, but it's broken now so that plan has been thwarted! I am looking into getting another one but they're fairly pricey


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Thanks for that - it's worth considering if panacur doesn't work.
> I know Metronidazole can cause quite unpleasant side effects in humans - I wonder if it's the same for cats?
> 
> I have considered steam cleaning - in fact, until last week I was using a steam cleaner I borrowed from my mum, but it's broken now so that plan has been thwarted! I am looking into getting another one but they're fairly pricey


 
Weve used Metronidazole many times in the sanctuary and have never had any side effects
Steam Cleaners | compare prices and deals - moneysupermarket.com


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

ukphd said:


> Thanks for that - it's worth considering if panacur doesn't work.
> I know Metronidazole can cause quite unpleasant side effects in humans - I wonder if it's the same for cats?
> 
> I have considered steam cleaning - in fact, until last week I was using a steam cleaner I borrowed from my mum, but it's broken now so that plan has been thwarted! I am looking into getting another one but they're fairly pricey


 Not on ebay they ain't :lol2:
Vax v -steam cleaner 7.8m cord on eBay (end time 08-Feb-10 11:18:13 GMT)


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

fenwoman said:


> Not on ebay they ain't :lol2:
> Vax v -steam cleaner 7.8m cord on eBay (end time 08-Feb-10 11:18:13 GMT)



ooooh well spotted - thanks! :no1:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> Weve used Metronidazole many times in the sanctuary and have never had any side effects
> Steam Cleaners | compare prices and deals - moneysupermarket.com



Thanks. I'd like to find a cleaner that doesn't make the carpet too wet - I don't suppose you've used any of these have you? The one we had was great but it's not made anymore!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Thanks. I'd like to find a cleaner that doesn't make the carpet too wet - I don't suppose you've used any of these have you? The one we had was great but it's not made anymore!


 
No sorry, I dont have carpets in my house, its all down to damage limitation. We have laminate flooring and tiles except in one bedroom and on the stairs, its so much easer to clean:2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> No sorry, I dont have carpets in my house, its all down to damage limitation. We have laminate flooring and tiles except in one bedroom and on the stairs, its so much easer to clean:2thumb:


Sadly most of this house has deep pile carpet :gasp: (not my choice I hasten to add - was like that when we moved in). We've already had it professionally cleaned twice since moving in 18 months ago and looks like I may have to do it again soon! I'm so tempted to just rip the carpet up and leave the floorboards right now!!


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## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

i got one of these basic carpet cleaners, it has no attachments for stairs but its great

Bissell Shop Direct :: Products :: Reconditioned :: Quickwash


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

pigglywiggly said:


> i got one of these basic carpet cleaners, it has no attachments for stairs but its great
> 
> Bissell Shop Direct :: Products :: Reconditioned :: Quickwash


Thanks - that looks like the sort of thing we need! :2thumb:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

We bought a Vax carpet washer a few years ago when cats' pee was at its height :roll: and it's great! It cost us about £110 at Costco. It means he can get it out if we have any problems and just do that particular area in a matter of minutes if necessary.

It's easy to use because it's an upright, so doesn't need loads of elbow grease (many years ago we used to hire one of those industrial cylinder type ones and my husband did the whole house every couple of years. I well remember him on his hands and knees with sweat literally pouring down his face at the exertion!) and it has such a strong suck it sucks out most of the water so doesn't leave the carpets too wet at all!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Brilliant - thanks!
We've just shelled out for a brand new dyson (animal) so hopefully next month we can see about getting a carpet cleaner. I think it will be useful anyway as our front door opens straight into our living room so the carpet tends to get pretty mucky from general dirt (as well as the current cat poop issue!)


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

It certainly made a difference to us. We only have 3 cats now and 2 of them are still sprayers, so we work on "damage limitation" all the time.

Our hall is wooden floored, but our living carpet is sort of mustard coloured. The wood doesn't take all the wet or dirt from people's shoes before they reach the living room, so the entrance often looks 'grubby' and Barry just gets the Vax and just cleans that area and it works great.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I've just got back from the vets.

Maisy finished a 7 day course of panacur but has had liquid/explosive diarrhoea for the whole of that course and since it finished. So I called the vet again this morning and he said to bring her down.

I managed to see my usual vet (phew!) and he's taken her in for at least tonight, maybe longer.

He's going to re-test for Giardia and the other usual problems at the same time (campylobacter, salmonella etc) and I have asked for a TTF test and thankfully he knew what I was talking about (unlike the other vet!) and mentioned that they do it by testing for TTF DNA so he will get that done. 
He's going to try her on Flagyl (Metranidazole) intravenously maybe - depending how she responds during the day to fluids and something to help "re-form her stools". 

He said she looked otherwise ok, though her gut felt "squishy" (his words!)...

I'm worried but pleased she's there now. I was more worried by the amount of liquid she was passing as it was just getting worse and worse. Poor little mite


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

You and your poor kitten have had such a bad time lately. Im sure the vet will be able to sort her out, as sometimes these symptoms are extremely severe(as you have found out) but once on the right treatment they disappear as if by magic.
You have been fantastic during the whole episode as many people wouldnt have been able to cope. Fingers crossed your little girl and you can look forward to a less smelly and messy future. Keep us updated


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

:up: I agree totally!!

You really have had an awful time with this little girl and must be worried sick about her. My friend was there for over 2 years with a lot of her cats and every test came up negative, until she went to a friend's vet in the borders of Scotland who had diagnosed Tri-trich in her cats and he tested and found it!! All her cats have now been treated and are all back to normal.

I hope they can find out what is causing this in your kitten and finally get it sorted for you and for her!!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thank you both - it's been great to have the support on here.
I'll definitely keep you updated.

I'm just hoping we can crack it this time. I'm really glad it was my usual vet today - I feel far more confident with him, particularly as he knew what I was talking about when I mentioned TTF and just seems generally happier to discuss treatment rather than just telling me what he will do. I've got to give him a ring at 6pm to see if there's any update.

I am really worried about her but I know she's in the best place so that's the important thing


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Just a thought, but when you make an appointment at your vets can't you stipulate the vet you want to see?? My present vet is a one-man-show, so no probs there, but the 2 practices I used before had a few permanents (like 2 or 3!) and a lot of 'intinerant' vets mostly newly qualified who eventually moved on to practices where there was more possibility of advancement. So when i made an appointment I specified the vet I wanted to see so that I would get a vet who was familiar with my animal. Even in the days before appointments, when you just went an waited your turn, I would tell the receptionist I wanted to see the senior partner and didn't mind if I missed my 'turn'.

Fingers crossed for 6:00 pm! : victory:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Just a thought, but when you make an appointment at your vets can't you stipulate the vet you want to see?? My present vet is a one-man-show, so no probs there, but the 2 practices I used before had a few permanents (like 2 or 3!) and a lot of 'intinerant' vets mostly newly qualified who eventually moved on to practices where there was more possibility of advancement. So when i made an appointment I specified the vet I wanted to see so that I would get a vet who was familiar with my animal. Even in the days before appointments, when you just went an waited your turn, I would tell the receptionist I wanted to see the senior partner and didn't mind if I missed my 'turn'.
> 
> Fingers crossed for 6:00 pm! : victory:


Yes I always do specify - the problem was the last time I went my vet wasn't doing any surgeries at all that whole week so I couldn't wait and I had to see the other one. There doesn't seem to be a regular pattern to when he's there and when he's not so it's hard to predict. 

I have all my fingers and toes crossed for 6pm :2thumb:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Yes I always do specify - the problem was the last time I went my vet wasn't doing any surgeries at all that whole week so I couldn't wait and I had to see the other one. There doesn't seem to be a regular pattern to when he's there and when he's not so it's hard to predict.
> 
> I have all my fingers and toes crossed for 6pm :2thumb:


I wondered if that might be the case - can't help if it you need to see a vet and yours isn't working. Glad you got him this time though! :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> I wondered if that might be the case - can't help if it you need to see a vet and yours isn't working. Glad you got him this time though! :2thumb:


Yep - what a relief :gasp:
One hour to go until I can call... I don't know what I'm expecting - they won't have much news by then, but I just want to know she's ok in there and nothing untoward has happened since I left her :blush:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

That's understandable - I've been wondering myself and she's not even mine! :lol:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> That's understandable - I've been wondering myself and she's not even mine! :lol:



awww - thanks  well I'll let you know in about 45 mins! :2thumb:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Hopefully your news is of the good sort and shes improved:flrt:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Called the vet - could only speak to the receptionist at the moment, but the vet will call me later when he finishes his surgery (he's running late - as usual!  ).

Maisy is apparently "comfortable" but hasn't pooped! That's all the info I could get until I speak to the vet. Typical - here she's going 5 or 6 times a day at least, and there she's holding it in! Must be the strange surroundings - poor little thing. Hopefully the vet will give me a bit more info on what he's done and how she's doing later! Fingers crossed she poops for them!! :blush:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well they certainly can hold it in if it suits them, but it would be better if she would poop so he could see it and get a fresh sample.

Will wait to hear what he says after you've managed to speak to him.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

If your vet is anything like mine they will hold on to her until she has relieved herself. As Eileen says cats are very clever at holding things in when in strange surroundings but she will have to go eventually and then the vet can get a sample


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Well I spoke to the vet and she's still not given them a sample. I suggested they might like to try covering the litter tray somehow as she's used to a hooded tray here so he's going to try that.

He's not given her any Metranidazole yet as he didn't want to do that before taking the sample. If she produces something overnight then he might give her that tomorrow. He thinks I will be able to get her tomorrow :2thumb: 

She's eaten a little bit there which is good. So I think she will have to go at some point! If she doesn't go tomorrow he's going to send her home anyway with more sample pots! It's a shame as I really wanted him to see how bad she was (if that makes sense) but anyway.

At least she seems ok. I do miss her though and I'll definitely miss her tonight as she always sleeps just next to my pillow (though I may at least get a good nights sleep without her generator-like purring I guess)!


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## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

Shes being a madam lol.

Glad shes ok in herself. Hope her bottom starts working properly soon.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Well I spoke to the vet and she's still not given them a sample. I suggested they might like to try covering the litter tray somehow as she's used to a hooded tray here so he's going to try that.
> 
> He's not given her any Metranidazole yet as he didn't want to do that before taking the sample. If she produces something overnight then he might give her that tomorrow. He thinks I will be able to get her tomorrow :2thumb:
> 
> ...


 
Typical cat. they never perform on demand:lol2: Hopefully she will use the tray overnight and show them her true colours.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I agree with Shell - they have an inbuilt sense of contrariness! :lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks guys!
I can just imagine her - little paws crossed, refusing to poop! :lol2:

I'm lecturing all morning so will be giving them a call at lunch time to see if she's produced!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Just rang the vet. Maisy STILL hasn't pooped! So he's asked me to collect her later today and to try to collect a sample at home. He's not actually given her any treatment as he was waiting for the sample so it was a bit of a waste keeping her in as it turned out.

At least she's ok, but I do wish she'd just poop!
(never thought I'd find myself saying that! :blush


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Just rang the vet. Maisy STILL hasn't pooped! So he's asked me to collect her later today and to try to collect a sample at home. He's not actually given her any treatment as he was waiting for the sample so it was a bit of a waste keeping her in as it turned out.
> 
> At least she's ok, but I do wish she'd just poop!
> (never thought I'd find myself saying that! :blush


 
Flipping cats, they really can hold it in when they want. At least you got a squit free night:lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> Flipping cats, they really can hold it in when they want. At least you got a squit free night:lol2:


very true - and it was bliss! :lol2:

However I'm likely to get a very squitty night tonight after over 24 hrs of no pooping :bash:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> very true - and it was bliss! :lol2:
> 
> However I'm likely to get a very squitty night tonight after over 24 hrs of no pooping :bash:


Letting her bowels rest may have actually helped them recover a bit


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> At least she's ok, but I do wish she'd just poop!
> (never thought I'd find myself saying that! :blush


:lol2: I bet you do!

It just shows though doesn't it? I bet she's been pooing for England in your house and then she holds it in for almost 2 days! :gasp:

I hope she doesn't have an explosion as soon as she walks out her cat carrier! :whistling2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> :lol2: I bet you do!
> 
> It just shows though doesn't it? I bet she's been pooing for England in your house and then she holds it in for almost 2 days! :gasp:
> 
> I hope she doesn't have an explosion as soon as she walks out her cat carrier! :whistling2:



Well we're home now... and she ran straight to the littler tray... but only to pee!
Still no poop!

I'm armed with sample pots so if she does go then I can start collecting the 3-day pooled poop sample for another Giardia test and a fresh one for TTF... that's IF she poops! She's clearly having a no-poop protest at being sent to the vets :lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Just thought I'd update.

We now have poop! but it's liquid and explosive poop - same as before... I'm both pleased and fed up! :whistling2:

I've dropped a sample in for the TTF test and will drop a pooled sample in tomorrow for another Giardia test.... fingers crossed we get somewhere with it this time!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

My God! :gasp: Has she held onto that for 3 days???


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> My God! :gasp: Has she held onto that for 3 days???



She went for the first time yesterday morning so she held on from Monday morning until then :gasp: I was about to take her to the vets but I think she must have realised and she produced for me!!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

After holding on that long you would have thought she was constipated:gasp:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> After holding on that long you would have thought she was constipated:gasp:


I know! little so and so :bash:

I really was hoping that I'd see an improvement and was almost thinking maybe she would start to recover but it's just like it has been all along again so... back to the drawing board! 

I hope the TTF results come back soon so I can at least cross one thing off the list of possible issues!!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

hello everyone

Well I'm back from the in-laws. The cats were both fine at mum's and didn't seem stressed at all which is great as it means they can go there again if they ever need to. In fact I'm going to continue taking them there every now and then so they feel comfortable there.

We got the results back yesterday from the tests. Maisy is now negative for Giardia so either that has cleared up or it wasn't shedding in the 3 days the sample was taken over. She is positive for TTF. I am actually rather annoyed as I asked my other vet specifically to test for that when I took Maisy several weeks ago and was fobbed off about it being cultured for. I then asked again to test for it and gave a sample and was told it had been. It clearly wasn't tested for. If they'd done what I asked Maisy could have been treated weeks ago! grrr :bash:

Anyway - important thing now is we can treat her, and her brother. We're treating with Ronidazole. It's not licensed for cats but is the only treatment recommended so I've signed a disclaimer to say I'm happy to go ahead. They've ordered it in so as soon as it arrives they will call me and I can start treating them!

Phew! Let's hope this really is the answer to her problems!!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Well I'm back from the in-laws. The cats were both fine at mum's and didn't seem stressed at all which is great as it means they can go there again if they ever need to. In fact I'm going to continue taking them there every now and then so they feel comfortable there.


That's very reassuring and it's a good idea to just take them along on visits, so that they don't learn to assume that every car trip ends up at the vets etc etc.



ukphd said:


> She is positive for TTF. I am actually rather annoyed as I asked my other vet specifically to test for that when I took Maisy several weeks ago and was fobbed off about it being cultured for. I then asked again to test for it and gave a sample and was told it had been. It clearly wasn't tested for. If they'd done what I asked Maisy could have been treated weeks ago! grrr :bash:


I'm so pleased you've finally found out what might be the cause of all this. Everything you have said to me about her symptoms ties in with everything my friend told me about her cats' symptoms, which is why I've kept suggesting this might be the problem and told you that sometimes the parasite doesn't show up in a sample if the sample is too old. Good on you for keep on insisting, but i agree with you, that it's not good that it has taken them this long to find out something that you mentioned to them a long time ago :bash:

Once my friend finally got the correct diagnosis and started the treatment everything has settled down and is fine, so hopefully this will sort Maisie out and you and she will be able to get on with enjoying life and each other! :2thumb:

As you have no other cats and your kittens have not been in touch with any other cats, I really think you ought to contact the breeder and tell her that you've got this positive diagnosis for the kittens.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Yeah I let the breeder know as soon as the vet called me. 

I am almost certain the cause of infection is the little male she had which she got from another breeder. He has the same symptoms as Maisy so I'm willing to bet he will also test positive for TTF.

I do hope it hasn't spread to all her cats though - poor lady!

I am so relieved that we have a result for this - I was really worried all the tests would come back negative and we'd be left with no explanation at all. I've asked the vet to treat Maisy and George so fingers crossed we should be able to nail it....

I did tell my usual vet that I was a bit annoyed that my previous requests to his colleague had been basically ignored. He said that TTF is really only just coming into the consciousness of vets in the UK, and particularly his practice so he admitted she probably didn't know about it. It's fair enough to some extent but I had printed out the info you sent me and asked her to read it so she really should have taken the time to find out what it was! hey ho! No point getting too wound up about it - at least we know now and we can deal with it :2thumb: Fingers crossed for a bottom-smear free future!!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Yeah I let the breeder know as soon as the vet called me.
> 
> I am almost certain the cause of infection is the little male she had which she got from another breeder. He has the same symptoms as Maisy so I'm willing to bet he will also test positive for TTF.
> 
> I do hope it hasn't spread to all her cats though - poor lady!


It certainly sounds as if that's the case, cos i remember you telling me that she said none of her cats had shown any symptoms, but this new boy had! I'm wondering if she didn't quarantine him when she got him? I remember when we got Snickles, our oriental black, and we had a litter of kittens only 3 weeks younger than her, we kept her in our bedroom for 3 weeks just in case and if she'd shown any signs of any illness she wouldn't have been allowed to integrate until it had been investigated, just in case.



ukphd said:


> He said that TTF is really only just coming into the consciousness of vets in the UK, and particularly his practice so he admitted she probably didn't know about it. It's fair enough to some extent but I had printed out the info you sent me and asked her to read it so she really should have taken the time to find out what it was! hey ho! No point getting too wound up about it - at least we know now and we can deal with it :2thumb: Fingers crossed for a bottom-smear free future!!


I agree that's no excuse at all! I'm sorry but vets have an obligation to keep appraised of new diseases and parasites that are being found, because they are being found all the time!

And yes indeed, fingers crossed!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> hello everyone
> 
> Well I'm back from the in-laws. The cats were both fine at mum's and didn't seem stressed at all which is great as it means they can go there again if they ever need to. In fact I'm going to continue taking them there every now and then so they feel comfortable there.
> 
> ...


 
Im glad the cats were fine at your Mums:2thumb:

It must be really annoying that the first vet never tested for TTF but Im glad you finally have a proper diagnosis:no1: Hopefully you can now all look forward to a squit free future. Im with Eileen about informing the breeder
You have gone the extra mile with your kitten as many people would have given up alonng the way. Well done:2thumb:


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

ukphd said:


> Yeah I let the breeder know as soon as the vet called me.
> 
> I am almost certain the cause of infection is the little male she had which she got from another breeder. He has the same symptoms as Maisy so I'm willing to bet he will also test positive for TTF.
> 
> ...


Your vet has really no excuse. You took the time to find out and gave her not only all the info, but a print out too and asked her specifical;ly to test for the thing. She only had to read the rprint out and ask the lab about the test and send it off. Instead you paid out for more visits, more treatments and the cats ghad to endure another couple of weeks of it which ciouold have caused lasting damage. I personally would not be fobbed off with any excuses and would be asking the vet to reuimburse me the vet fees anmd perscription charges for the treatments ect that you paid for uneccessarily. Don't be meek about it, you are fully entitled to it. Stand up for yourself or offer to take your custom eslewhere. If this was a car with dodgy brakes and the garage had charged you money to replace a fanbelt, put new tyres on, clean the carburettor etc for week after week despite you telling them there is something wrong with the brakes and asking them to check them, would you simply accept their apology and suck up the costs of all the uneccesary things they'd done? I bet you wouldn't.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

fenwoman said:


> Your vet has really no excuse. You took the time to find out and gave her not only all the info, but a print out too and asked her specifical;ly to test for the thing. She only had to read the rprint out and ask the lab about the test and send it off. Instead you paid out for more visits, more treatments and the cats ghad to endure another couple of weeks of it which ciouold have caused lasting damage. I personally would not be fobbed off with any excuses and would be asking the vet to reuimburse me the vet fees anmd perscription charges for the treatments ect that you paid for uneccessarily. Don't be meek about it, you are fully entitled to it. Stand up for yourself or offer to take your custom eslewhere. If this was a car with dodgy brakes and the garage had charged you money to replace a fanbelt, put new tyres on, clean the carburettor etc for week after week despite you telling them there is something wrong with the brakes and asking them to check them, would you simply accept their apology and suck up the costs of all the uneccesary things they'd done? I bet you wouldn't.


You're right. I'm hoping my insurance will be paying for all this but if they don't then I certainly will be requesting money back. :bash:


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

ukphd said:


> You're right. I'm hoping my insurance will be paying for all this but if they don't then I certainly will be requesting money back. :bash:


 Be sure to tell the insurance company about the wasted money too. I bet the vet would not have wasted it if you had no insurance. They think that because it's an insurance company it doesn't matter.But it does!!! Every pound more that they have to pay out, means higher premiums for everyone. So even if the insurance company do pay for it all, make sure they know. Sadly, a lot of vets will pile on the treatments and costs if they know it's an insurance job and that's theft and fraud in my book. Sadly, too many pet owners will do nothing if it's an insurance company because they think that since it's not actually money out of their pocket, it doesn't matter.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I've just had this response from my friend who I mentioned earlier. 

_hi eileen, very interested in this. So many vets havent a clue how to test for tri-trich. It has to be a dna test from the feaces which looks like what they have done. _

_Yes, that is the right and only drug for this problem now. If the dosage and lenth of time the kittens are on it is right, it should be totally gone. but i know of a girl who had one of mine and she had the medication but not the correct dosage and not for the 21 days and she has tested positive again. She is going down to see the vet in kelso that sorted mine on tuesday to get the right dosage and time from him._

_Its a real shame about this as i know now how widespread this is, but nobody wants to say that they have problems, but its even worse that you cant trust a vet to know how to test for it or the correct dosage etc._

_andy the vet in scotland told me not to accept cats or kittens into my household without the test. Honestly in the last 3 years we have spent 3-4000 to get this identified and even when we told our vet, she said we didnt have it and she would send another sample away . Of course by then i knew from another girl who had one of my kittens how to test and treat it._

_If you look into it on the net it's rapidly spreading all over the world. Its such a shame for breeders selling kittens as [a] some dont know it exists * their vets can't diagnose it correctly and it leaves the breeder in a bad light.*_*

Please let me know what the outcome is as im so interested in it now.

Has the girl told the breeder so she can test BUT not all cats in the same enviroment get it . I had 1 positive result rest neg but andy and i opted for treating the lot as a safe but sure way of getting rid of it, touch wood. my household has changed - no nasty smells from them just nice poos [fancy me saying that haha]. I believe I may have had it for 4-5 years if i look back and it gradualy affected them all.

excuse im not good at grammer etc.


So the treatment that your vet has given you is the correct one, but it might be worth checking that your vet is prescribing a 21 day treatment just in case?*


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thank you so much for that - that's really helpful. I will give the vet a call tomorrow to confirm he's doing a 21 day treatment. Do you know what the dosage is meant to be?

Thanks again for finding this out for me


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I didn't download that e-mail until late last night (as you'll have gathered by the time I posted it! :gasp but I will ask Margaret what the dosage should be and get back to you.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> I didn't download that e-mail until late last night (as you'll have gathered by the time I posted it! :gasp but I will ask Margaret what the dosage should be and get back to you.


Oh gosh, yes, I didn't see the time that you posted :gasp:

Thanks :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I've been doing a bit of research and it seems there's considerable debate over how long to treat with.
Several studies seem to suggest 14 days is the recommended dosage e.g. Efficacy of ronidazole for treatment of feline Tritrichomonas foetus infection. | Gookin, J. L., Copple, C. N., Papich, M. G., Poore, M. F., Stauffer, S. H., Birkenheuer, A. J., Twedt, D. C., Levy, M. G. | Journal of Veterinary Internal Medicine | Am

so I'll be interested to find out more about the dosage your friend recommends as that might explain the difference. I guess as the drug isn't licensed for use in cats it's all still a bit in the air!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Hello again

Bit more news...
The breeder got back to me. Her little boy tested positive for TTF too so it's pretty clear that's where Maisy got it from. She is obviously concerned as hygiene is something she takes seriously (and judging by what I saw I can confirm that) so she's hoping none of the rest of her cats have it. She's at the same vet as me and she's also waiting for the treatment to arrive.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Oh dear, I must admit it sounded as if that was exactly what had happened, so I hope it hasn't spread as she's had the kitten for quite a while now hasn't she?


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Oh dear, I must admit it sounded as if that was exactly what had happened, so I hope it hasn't spread as she's had the kitten for quite a while now hasn't she?


Yes - I think she got him shortly before we took Maisy and George so that's about 3 - 4 months I guess? She's planning on testing them all and testing any breeding animals that come in contact with her cats in the future.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Update:

I heard from the breeder today that she'd got the medication for her little boy with TTF so I called to vet to see if mine was in too. After many phone calls it transpired that it was in. I was about to go pick it up when I thought I'd better call and check how much it was as I'm pretty close to my credit card limit (if it had been too much the OH would have to have called them to pay). So they told me the course would cost £40 and I asked if that was for both Maisy and George.....

... it turns out they didn't bother ordering it for George :bash:

I discussed it with my vet several times, I signed a disclaimer for BOTH cats but for some reason they chose not to order it for him! Apparently because he's " showing no symptoms" - a decision taken by whoever does the ordering :gasp:. Well he is showing symptoms now, and I'd mentioned that to the vet. He lives with Maisy, they share litter trays, he now has symptoms - I'm fairly confident he either has it or certainly is carrying it and the vet agreed!

So after several more calls while they double checked I asked if I could just start them both on Maisy's course and wait for George's to arrive. No I can't because the dosage is different!

So I asked them to order for George immediately but the other vet who was in today (not my usual vet) said that "if it was her cat she'd test him first to be sure". Yes in an ideal world I would, but you know I'm really sick of this now. It's been months. I asked them to test for TTF 6 weeks ago (when they had samples from both) and they didn't. If I test him, it's another £100 quid, and more importantly another 7 - 10 day week for a result, followed by another 7 - 10 day wait for his medication. All the while I can't treat Maisy (as no point treating her if he is not being treated as he may reinfect her). :bash:

So I've refused the test and said I'm happy to treat him blind. I've taken veterinary advice - several times. My usual vet was of the opinion we should treat both so I'm happy it's the right decision. I've now got to wait for his medicine to come in and had to rush him down there today to get an accurate recent weight (in case it had changed since last time).

Meanwhile I have two seriously squity cats now :blowup:


Sorry for the rant but I'm just desperate to get this sorted - for the cats' sake and my own sanity! :blush:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Hmm, could you not use some of your girls tablets to start with as when Georges come through you will then have enough for both of them to have a full course( does that makes sense?)


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I think you want to put a complaint into the senior partner quite honestly.

That's nothing short of ridiculous!


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

ukphd said:


> Update:
> 
> I heard from the breeder today that she'd got the medication for her little boy with TTF so I called to vet to see if mine was in too. After many phone calls it transpired that it was in. I was about to go pick it up when I thought I'd better call and check how much it was as I'm pretty close to my credit card limit (if it had been too much the OH would have to have called them to pay). So they told me the course would cost £40 and I asked if that was for both Maisy and George.....
> 
> ...




Is this the only vet practice in your area? (within say a 20 mile radius). With the amount of wrong diagnosis, mishandling and general inefficiency they have displayed, I would be taking my custom elsewhere. They have not acted in the bnest interests of the cats. In fact, their inefficiency has actually caused suffering to them. I'd write a formal complaint and be firing off a letter to the RCVS. But that's me. If I pay money, I expect nothing less than 100% commitment and efficiency. If I don't get it, they get a verbal complaint, then a written one at the same time as taking my money somewhere else and complaining to the RCVS serves to pull them up sharpish as they get investigated so that changes get made within the practice and someone elses cats don't have to suffer. I would most certainly not simply do or say nothing as it's easier or I was afraid of making a fuss. The delays could have caused irrepairable damage to their innards.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks everyone 




Shell195 said:


> Hmm, could you not use some of your girls tablets to start with as when Georges come through you will then have enough for both of them to have a full course( does that makes sense?)


I thought of that but I can't - Maisy's tablets are a different dosage to George's due to their weight difference. The tablets have been made up specially (she's only 3.5 kg, he's now 4.9kg so there's a big difference in the dosage) 



feorag said:


> I think you want to put a complaint into the senior partner quite honestly.
> 
> That's nothing short of ridiculous!


I think I will. My vet, who I think is the senior partner, is really good - it just seems that the rest are a shambles.



fenwoman said:


> Is this the only vet practice in your area? (within say a 20 mile radius). With the amount of wrong diagnosis, mishandling and general inefficiency they have displayed, I would be taking my custom elsewhere. They have not acted in the bnest interests of the cats. In fact, their inefficiency has actually caused suffering to them. I'd write a formal complaint and be firing off a letter to the RCVS. But that's me. If I pay money, I expect nothing less than 100% commitment and efficiency. If I don't get it, they get a verbal complaint, then a written one at the same time as taking my money somewhere else and complaining to the RCVS serves to pull them up sharpish as they get investigated so that changes get made within the practice and someone elses cats don't have to suffer. I would most certainly not simply do or say nothing as it's easier or I was afraid of making a fuss. The delays could have caused irrepairable damage to their innards.


The other vet's in my area has an awful reputation so I'm not keen to go there. This one, believe it or not, has a really good rep but I think it's the stand-in vets that are the problem. That and whoever did the ordering taking decisions they shouldn't have! 

I'm not afraid to make a fuss and I already had strong words with the Nurse today, I'm calling my vet tomorrow - the senior partner. 

It seems to be a common problem with stand in vets. I drive an hour to get to my tortoises' vet because he's a specialist. The 2 main partners are brilliant, then they had a locum in (who's now permanent) and he didn't even manage to notice that my tortoise was jaundiced (despite the fact that it was obviously on his notes and he was bright yellow!).

I'm just so frustrated and worried about Maisy and George and this kind of ineptitude is not helping :bash:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I probrably shouldn't keep resurrecting this thread but it sort of made more sense to stick with this than start a new one...

STILL not got the medicine for George :bash:
I've been phoning the vet daily for the last 7 days and finally yesterday they agreed to call the lab to chase it up. Apparently it was dispatched yesterday so should arrive today or tomorrow..... if it doesn't I think I'm going to go mad (well madder!).


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Nancy - I just cannot believe your vets!!! That is appalling!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

I totally agree with Eileen


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Nancy - I just cannot believe your vets!!! That is appalling!



I know! :gasp:

Well they did say from the start that because the Ronidazole capsules are made up specially for each cat (according to the weight and hence dosage) that it can take 7 - 10 days to get them in. I'm going there later today and will ask to see the order form to check what date it was ordered. If it was ordered on 5th March as they said they would (this of course was 2 weeks later than they were meant to) then I guess it's the lab that's taking the time but even so........


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Our senior vet makes them up himself


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Really? Well our vets has made a big fuss about it as it's not licensed for cats yet in the uk.
I just got a call saying it had arrived so I went to collect it.
I don't know how I'm going to get this down them - the capsules are enormous! In the states
they use chicken flavoured paste but here it seems to be huge capsules.
The nurse made a big fuss about me wearing gloves to touch it and under no circumstances can
I open the capsules to hide it in food. I don't know what to do. Maisy will probably be ok but George
Is a nightmare and impossible to get things down him - I'm starting to panic a bit


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Really? Well our vets has made a big fuss about it as it's not licensed for cats yet in the uk.
> I just got a call saying it had arrived so I went to collect it.
> I don't know how I'm going to get this down them - the capsules are enormous! In the states
> they use chicken flavoured paste but here it seems to be huge capsules.
> ...


 

When my daughters Devon had a course I just wet the capsule and pinged it down his throat, due to it being wet its goes slippy so they swallow it easily. Try putting a bit of butter on the capsule or chicken or cheese paste as if hes greedy he will probably gobble it down
Our vets never make a fuss about new things, they are very forward looking and always willing to try new things.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I dip big gel capsules in olive oil, then Barry holds the cat upside down in his arms (like a baby) holding it feet with his other hand. I put my index finger and thumb on either side of their upper jaw and open their mouths kinda from the top and then ping it in. Oil, or something similar, on the capsules helps, because if it hits the side of the throat on the way down without any 'lubrication' it ca stick to the saliva on the throat and the cat just coughs it up.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

feorag said:


> I dip big gel capsules in olive oil, then Barry holds the cat upside down in his arms (like a baby) holding it feet with his other hand. I put my index finger and thumb on either side of their upper jaw and open their mouths kinda from the top and then ping it in. Oil, or something similar, on the capsules helps, because if it hits the side of the throat on the way down without any 'lubrication' it ca stick to the saliva on the throat and the cat just coughs it up.


 

Water has the same effect


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

True! I just prefer something a little more 'slippy' so it slides down, so to speak!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thank you both. I think I just let stuff get on top of me yesterday. :blush: Have had a really hard week at work and am exhausted from a cold and many mornings leaving at 5:30 so when I got back and heard the medicine was ready I was so relieved I rushed right there. I was then faced with these huge capsules and the nurse wasn't exactly helpful when I asked for advice about getting them down. I was simply told "you'll have to try"... I asked for tips and was just told to wrap them in a bath towel and "shove it down". It's ok with Maisy - she's much easier to handle but George, who's as soppy as anything most of the time, absolutely hates being restrained and I find it very hard. I think it's something you probably get used to and it's having the confidence to know you're not hurting them but it's hard at the start. So I then asked if I could bring them in for some help if I was struggling and was told they wouldn't help me because the drug was unlicensed and they didn't want to handle it.... (this was the nurses, not the vet).

So by the time I got home I wasn't feeling great.

I tried your suggestions. I didn't have olive oil to hand so I used a little bit of olive spread to make it slippery. With Maisy we managed to get her mouth open and I used one of those pill syringes to pop it down. It took a few attempts but we managed it.

With George we decided to try it in food first. He's a real gobbler (unlike Maisy) so we took your advice and used chicken. We put spread on the pill again so it stuck to a piece of chicken and put it in the bowl with a few other bits. I was worried he'd chomp down on it but he didn't, he gobbled it down without noticing!

Phew!

We're going to try the same with Maisy and tuna tonight - just to see if she will do it as I'd far rather not stress her out, particularly as I'm so cack-handed at it!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I'm not surprised you were a bit down in the dumps yesterday after the struggle you've had with Maisie. To finally get a diagnosis and a treatment and _then_ have to wait weeks to get the tablets because they cocked up, beggars belief, it really does!

I'm glad you managed to get the tablet down anyway and I agree it's always best to try it in food first as it is the most stress free way to tablet. Unfortuately sometimes they cotton on quickly to what is happening and then refused to take it. Sorcha, my too bright for her own good, could detect additives in food from 100 paces, seriously! I never put medicine in her food because I knew she wouldn't touch it! She was a nightmare about it all!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> I'm not surprised you were a bit down in the dumps yesterday after the struggle you've had with Maisie. To finally get a diagnosis and a treatment and _then_ have to wait weeks to get the tablets because they cocked up, beggars belief, it really does!
> 
> I'm glad you managed to get the tablet down anyway and I agree it's always best to try it in food first as it is the most stress free way to tablet. Unfortuately sometimes they cotton on quickly to what is happening and then refused to take it. Sorcha, my too bright for her own good, could detect additives in food from 100 paces, seriously! I never put medicine in her food because I knew she wouldn't touch it! She was a nightmare about it all!


Yeah I suspect Maisy won't take it. She also tends to lick her food and then nibble rather than gobble it down so I doubt it will work. At least Maisy is easier to manhandle that George so I think we can get the tablets down her if she won't eat them.

Such a relief to finally be medicating them though. I just really hope it works. Apparently once the course is finished I wait 14 days then do another faecal test. If it's positive then I guess it's another course of ronidazole, if not then I think they have to be tested again after 3 months? or maybe it's less than that - I need to read up on it again. The vet nurse was really unhelpful yesterday. I think they were also cross with me as I phoned daily, sometimes twice daily to find out if it was in. Frankly though I don't care, if it was their pet I'm sure they would have done the same. :blush:

The receptionist said yesterday that she didn't think petplan would cover this now as it's unlicensed... i guess that's a possibility but I think I'll try anyway. It may be unlicensed but it was administered and recommended by a vet and sold through them so it should be ok, but we'll see. It was very expensive - nearly £100 in total for both of them :gasp:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> The vet nurse was really unhelpful yesterday. I think they were also cross with me as I phoned daily, sometimes twice daily to find out if it was in.


Shame!! *NOT!* 

I think I don't like the sound of your vets from a competence point of view, and now I'm singularly unimpressed with their nurses to be quite honest. Do they know you are a client and they're in a job because of people like you???


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Shame!! *NOT!*
> 
> I think I don't like the sound of your vets from a competence point of view, and now I'm singularly unimpressed with their nurses to be quite honest. Do they know you are a client and they're in a job because of people like you???



I know!
It's crazy that I found myself apologising for bothering them?!? 
It's such a shame as the vet himself is brilliant - great manner, good with the animals, seems very knowledgeable and v sensible. It's just the rest of them. Although having said that one of the nurses is also very good so it's not all of them. 

They don't seem to like the fact that I might have some opinion or knowledge about the subject and I think I also annoyed them by asking that they correct my title on the records from Miss to Dr (not a medical one I hasten to add). I don't usually bother as it really makes no difference, but I was getting fed up with the way they were treating me. I look quite young and often people seem to treat me like I'm a child or don't take me seriously so I thought it might help.... clearly I was wrong! :whistling2:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

:lol2: Maybe they think that makes you more intelligent than them and you're pulling rank! :crazy:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> :lol2: Maybe they think that makes you more intelligent than them and you're pulling rank! :crazy:



well based on their performance so far I fear I may be :whistling2:
:lol2:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

And I would agree!!

It's funny how 'professional' people don't like to think that the plebs might be as well informed as they are on some subjects.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> And I would agree!!
> 
> It's funny how 'professional' people don't like to think that the plebs might be as well informed as they are on some subjects.


I know!
How dare I have done some research about this condition :whip: I'm clearly a complete moron and should be treated thus! :whistling2:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

We used to have a vet practise like yours but once they got above their station we changed and our current vets are brilliant and very open to any ideas their clients may have


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> We used to have a vet practise like yours but once they got above their station we changed and our current vets are brilliant and very open to any ideas their clients may have


I really am considering changing. As I said, if it wasn't for the vet himself I would definitely change without hesitation. It's hard. Other vets in the area don't have very good reputations (from speaking to friends, neighbours and my breeder) so I'm not sure what to do. I guess once this is sorted I'll see how things progress and take it from there


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> I really am considering changing. As I said, if it wasn't for the vet himself I would definitely change without hesitation. It's hard. Other vets in the area don't have very good reputations (from speaking to friends, neighbours and my breeder) so I'm not sure what to do. I guess once this is sorted I'll see how things progress and take it from there


 
The main thing is you get the kittens better so I agree with you. Is Maisie still bad?


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Yeah she is. We have occasional days where she produces almost normal poop (still an unusual colour, and foul smelling, but firmer) and then it's back to just liquid, and sometimes explosive diarrhoea. George has also showed symptoms, though only for a few days at a time.

She's still fine in herself but I really hope this medicine works for her sake, and the sake of my house (and sanity!)


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Well it turns out Maisy is a sucker for Tuna!
She gobbled it down, pill and all! and for the first time in her life she actually butted George out the way to get to his (this was well after he'd already had his capsule - I gave them both a little extra just in case they had the taste of the capsule in their mouths and as a treat). She never does that - not even for chicken! :2thumb:

So day 2 down! 12 more to go... :no1:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Well it turns out Maisy is a sucker for Tuna!
> She gobbled it down, pill and all! and for the first time in her life she actually butted George out the way to get to his (this was well after he'd already had his capsule - I gave them both a little extra just in case they had the taste of the capsule in their mouths and as a treat). She never does that - not even for chicken! :2thumb:
> 
> So day 2 down! 12 more to go... :no1:


 
Thats great news, I love it when they can be bribed by food:2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Shell195 said:


> Thats great news, I love it when they can be bribed by food:2thumb:


I know - thank god for greedy cats :lol2:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Great news so far! :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

a bit of an update...

Well it's been about 10 days now of medicating them and I'm pleased to say we're back to normal, firm poop! :lol2::no1::2thumb:

Maisy is looking great - she's not shedding as much and has started to fill out. She wasn't underweight before but she certainly wasn't filling out as much as she should have been but now she's looking fantastic. They're both taking their capsules with food without problems now and things are looking up! I'm nervous of getting too excited too early but there's been such a dramatic change it's hard not to! The course of ronidazole finishes on weds so then we wait 2 weeks and test again for TTF so I'm just keeping everything crossed. 

:2thumb:


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## boapugh (Jan 25, 2010)

feeding cats boiled rice and plain chicken helps with loose stools. may help. also royal cannin is the best food i have found stool wise.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> a bit of an update...
> 
> Well it's been about 10 days now of medicating them and I'm pleased to say we're back to normal, firm poop! :lol2::no1::2thumb:
> 
> ...


 
That is wonderful news, you have waited so long for this momement Im not surprised you are excited. Im sure that things will continue to improve now you have the correct diagnosis and medication:no1:



boapugh said:


> feeding cats boiled rice and plain chicken helps with loose stools. may help. also royal cannin is the best food i have found stool wise.


Its gone well past the stage of these things helping the cats. If you read the original thread the cats have had many food remedies and tests but now they are on the proper medication for their condition they are on the road to recovery


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## boapugh (Jan 25, 2010)

thank god for that then. well done


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

That's great news - I appreciate you not wanting to get too excited after the trials you've gone through, but it's certainly looking much more optimistic than it did a couple of months ago! :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks everyone :2thumb:

It is SUCH a relief not to be clearing up cat poop all the time and the house (and cats!) smell much nicer! :blush: I didn't realise what a drain it was on me until it stopped and I can only imagine how awful it must have been for Maisy feeling so uncomfortable all the time. Fingers crossed this is the light at the end of a rather long, stinky tunnel now!!
:lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I just thought I'd post a couple of photos of Maisy and George now they're getting better (I hope!)

Here's Maisy 









and here she is with her brother George all snuggled up :flrt:










and mid kicking each other :lol2:


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> I just thought I'd post a couple of photos of Maisy and George now they're getting better (I hope!)
> 
> Here's Maisy
> 
> ...


Beautiful kittens, they are a credit to you:no1:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

They are both really filling out now! Lovely eye colour too!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks :blush: All credit to the breeder and their mum and dad though 

I'm so pleased with them - Maisy is really starting to get a lovely shape now and they're starting to get really chunky :flrt:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Hello 

Sorry for not updating for a while. I went away to Indonesia for work for a couple of weeks and then I got stranded for 7 days in transit on the way home because of the ash cloud so have only just got home.

Since finishing the ronidazole the poop has been ok. Maisy's is a bit soft though - not liquid, but not firm. The faecal samples have gone off again for testing for TTF so I'm just really hoping it comes back negative. I have a nasty feeling it will be positive again though 

Other than that they're fine. Maisy was so pleased to see me when I came back - every time I sit down she jumps on my lap and purrs like crazy. I'm so touched :flrt:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well, there's certainly been an improvement which is great.

Will keep fingers crossed you get a good result from the samples.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Nice to hear from you again, Im glad there is some improvement:2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Well the vet just rang, and Maisy is still positive for TTF 
George's results aren't back yet so he'll call me again later.

So we're going to do a longer course of ronidazole this time.... 
Have to say I'm feeling quite gutted about it. I had a feeling this would be the case but even so. At least she's not back to the really bad diarrhoea this time so that's something.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

So sorry to hear this.

Refresh my memory - didn't they give you a shorter course than I said my friend's vet said was necessary?

I know there was a discrepancy somewhere between what your vet prescribed and what my friend's vet prescribed for hers.

ETA: I saw you weren't on line so I've gone back through the thread and i see you posted "Day 2 - only 12 more to go" so I assume that your vets gave you a 14 day supply?? 

If so, having re-read my friend's e-mail where her vet, who obviously has a greater knowledge than your vet (who appears to have very little) about this problem, said 21 days treatment and your cats have only had 14 days, then it's no wonder she's still positive. I would guess that means you have to repeat the course and I think you should insist on 21 days' supply of tablets.

However, if you mentioned the fact that another vet recommended a 21 day course and your vet decided that wasn't necessary, then I'd be bloody angry that this was going to cost me to repeat the first 14 days again, given how much it has unnecessarily cost you already!!!

I seem to think that they kittens' insurance will be covering this, but that really isn't the point, is it?


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Yes - I mentioned the need for a 21 day course with the vet at the time but he pointed me towards research that recommended 14 days. In fairness to him it was proper published research in veterinary journals (which I've also read) so given there's clearly differences in opinion I didn't push it. I should have done but having had so much trouble with all this I guess I just wasn't forceful enough.

I've told him we'll be having a 21 day course this time and there will be no discussion. He's agreed.

I don't yet know if the insurance will pay. I was waiting until we'd finished everything to put in a claim but there was a chance they may not cover the ronidazole because it's not licensed so we'll see...

Needless to say I'm not happy. :bash:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

On that basis neither would I be!

As my friend said it did take 21 days to clear all her cats, but at least they all cleared. She mentioned in her e-mail that a cat belonging to someone else was prescribed this treatment, but not the correct dose and not for 21 days and it tested positive again, so I think 21days has got to be right.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> On that basis neither would I be!
> 
> As my friend said it did take 21 days to clear all her cats, but at least they all cleared. She mentioned in her e-mail that a cat belonging to someone else was prescribed this treatment, but not the correct dose and not for 21 days and it tested positive again, so I think 21days has got to be right.



Yeah I think you're right. The literature is pretty poor on this though. It's such a shame vet's aren't documenting and sharing this information effectively in this country as it would save so much trouble!

I took both Maisy and George to the vet's today to get them weighed again to ensure they got the correct dose (rather than basing it on their weights last time). They've both gained a bit so I'm glad I did. Still not heard anything back from George's test yet. The samples went in at the same time so I don't know why the lab didn't test them at the same time but hey ho!

I'm about to contact the breeder to see how she got on with her little boy. He was on the same course as mine - it will be interesting to see what happens.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

If you want to give your vet the name of this vet in Kelso who certainly seems to know what he's doing with this parasite, i can get the name from my friend.

It appears that a lot of people in the show world who live in the north of england and south of Scotland are now consulting this vet if they think they have this problem.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> If you want to give your vet the name of this vet in Kelso who certainly seems to know what he's doing with this parasite, i can get the name from my friend.
> 
> It appears that a lot of people in the show world who live in the north of england and south of Scotland are now consulting this vet if they think they have this problem.



Thanks - that might be helpful


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

George's results are back - he's negative :2thumb:

So after a long discussion with the vet we've decided only to re-treat Maisy. George has been treated once and he's not showing any clinical signs and the test is negative, so even though they live together we're not going to to treat him. Maisy's diarrhoea isn't too bad (loose but formed!) so hygiene-wise I can keep on top of it at the moment. This may not be the right thing to do but the treatment is quite "nasty" so I think it's probably for the best. I will re-test both of them after Maisy's treatment though and if George shows even the slightest symptom he will get tested immediately and treated if necessary.

So now I'm waiting for the Ronidazole to be made up for her. I'm glad I took her to be re-weighed as she's put on half a kilo which changes the dosage. It will be a 21 day course this time so fingers crossed (again!)


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

That all sounds very heartening, Nancy! :2thumb:

Of course George may not have been infected, or because he only started to show any signs more recently that his infestation wasn't as severe as Maisie's so the shorter course worked for him.

I'm glad the vet has put her on a 21 day course, though. I'm sure this'll sort it all out!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Yeah fingers crossed it sorts it out properly this time! 

Poor little mite - she's such a sweetheart. She's taken to curling up right next to my pillow and holding on to my hand/arm (whatever is nearest!) with her paws while she sleeps :flrt:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Bless her - I slept like that every night with Sorcha - then Luna and now Harry!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

It's so nice - even though it does wake me up when she joins me at 2 or 3am I wouldn't change it for the world!
I've got to go away for 3 months from mid-june and am really hoping she won't forget me when I'm gone! I hope when I get back in september they'll both be the same with me :?


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Hopefully the next course of medication will cure her once and for all:2thumb:

The cats wont forget you at all. For many years our sanctuary looked after an old cat "Ellie" for 6 months as her owner went to New zealand on business. We used to confine her to our treatment room until she had settled then gave her free roaming time during the day. Ellie was a really bad tempered cat and grooming her was a nightmare as she was longhaired. That cat recognised her owner every year when they came back to collect her and practically threw herself at them, behaviour which we never witnessed at any other time.

Some cats that have been left for a while can actually do the ignore thing with their owners but this only lasts until the cat feels you have been punished enough:lol2:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I totally agree with that.

When we got Sorcha (my foundation queen) Iain had just left school and was 'lounging about' with no career direction, so he was at home with her all day and every night when I came home from work he'd be sitting on the settee with Sorcha upside down on his lap while one hand just gently and routinely stroked her belly. He left home quite a long time after that, but every time he came home within minutes of him sitting down, she was there on his lap in her usual position (which she seldom ever adopted me myself or Barry).

Once about 3 years after he left we went to Blackpool show with her (couldn't show her when she was entire!) and Iain came from Huddersfield to meet us. He found Sorcha's pen before we got there and just opened the door, tipped her upside down and she was like putty in his hands - and that was in a totally strange and very unusual environment.

She never forgot him!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Phew! good! I suspect after being gone for 3 months I may get a telling off when I get back!

My mum's cat, Jimmy, used to go and stare at the wall when she got back from holiday. He'd sit there, staring at the wall for hours, completely ignoring her! Finally after a day or two he would deign to look at her and allow her to stroke him again :lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I know this is an old thread but in the interest of continuity I'll keep updating it.

It's been a while since I posted an update. Maisy and George finished their 3 week course of Ronidazole 10 days ago. Annoyingly the vet was unable to get enough 50mg tablets for George so the last 3 days were 40mg for him which I hope was ok.

They seemed fine on the medicine but 7 days after finishing maisy showed symptoms again. So rather than wait the 2 weeks I rushed a faecal sample to the vet's again. I'm now waiting for the results. I'm really hoping it's just nothing but have a nasty feeling she will still be positive for TTF.

During the last week of the ronidazole I supplemented both of them with a probiotic for cats (on the advice of the breeder who had spoken to the woman in the states that's an expert on TTF) so hopefully that helped restore their gut flora but we'll see.

Everything is now crossed for those results.
I go away for 3 months on Sunday so hoping I get the results before I go so I know where we're at and can talk to the vet. The OH will be fine but I'm naturally anxious to get things set up before I go.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Nancy I spoke to my friend who'd had this problem at our cat show last weekend and her vet advocates *not* testing immediately after treatment!

He says that there could still be dead protoza there that would register a positive on the test. He waits for a while after treatment ends to ensure that all dead protozoa will be evacuated from the bowel before he tests.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

ah well that makes perfect sense - thanks for that  ... my stupid vet clearly didn't know that :bash:

I guess I'll see how the test comes back then and take it from there. If it's positive I'll discuss this with the vet and perhaps re-test before re-treating. The fact that she is showing symptoms though, coupled with a positive result (if it is) might lead us to assume she is re-infected and treat anyway. Given the delays in getting the ronidazole I am nervous of delaying too much.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

If she's still showing symptoms, then I would think that there must still be live protozoa in there, because surely she wouldn't have the symptoms if they were all dead.

My friend who saw the vet in Kelso followed his treatment course and everything was fine thereafter. I really think your vet should have listened to you and put them both on a 21 day course at the very beginning!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> If she's still showing symptoms, then I would think that there must still be live protozoa in there, because surely she wouldn't have the symptoms if they were all dead.
> 
> My friend who saw the vet in Kelso followed his treatment course and everything was fine thereafter. I really think your vet should have listened to you and put them both on a 21 day course at the very beginning!



Me too. I think the fact that it took so long to diagnose didn't help either. I suspect she had a massive infection by the time the first treatment started. I just really really hope the current symptoms are a coincidence and stop soon and that the tests start coming back negative.... wishful thinking!:blush:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well, fingers crossed it will work this time and you can get back to a 'normal' life!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Got the tests back today... both negative!

I have to say I'm shocked. However, I'm not celebrating. Maisy has been showing symptoms for over a week (diarrhoea) which was just like previous times so we all assumed it was TTF. This morning however I came down to find vomit on the kitchen floor. No idea which cat it was so cleared it up, they both seemed ok and were both begging for food so fed them a little.
Maisy then vomited again at about 11am so took her straight to the vet's. They've done blood tests and so far apart from being dehydrated she's otherwise "ok". They've given her fluids and anti-nausea drugs but want to avoid antibiotics unless vital given how many she's had in her short life. If she produces later they will take a faecal sample for testing for other organisms. They're going to keep her in all night and maybe feed her a little of the royal canin sensitivity diet later to see if it stays down. 

Not a great day - was their 1st birthday party today (silly I know but...). They're actually 1 on 15th June but as I'll be away we moved it forward and just had my mum and gran around for lunch and made them a little cake (all of tuna!). Sadly Maisy missed it.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Oh dear Nancy - so sorry to hear this!

Haven't a clue what it could be now then. Of course it's excellent yhat you've got rid of the TTF, but obviously there must be something else there that's causing the problem?? Hope the vet can work it out for you!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Oh dear Nancy - so sorry to hear this!
> 
> Haven't a clue what it could be now then. Of course it's excellent yhat you've got rid of the TTF, but obviously there must be something else there that's causing the problem?? Hope the vet can work it out for you!



Yeah, I'm not sure with TTF whether there is a chance that you can get a false negative. I know they recommend another test 6 weeks after the end of treatment so I guess there's a chance it's not clear yet - I'm just wary of being too excited about it after all we've been through.

I just called the vet for an update and apparently Maisy is "fine and seems happy". She hasn't vomited or had any diarrhoea since she's been in and they're going to start to feed her in about an hour so I won't get another update until the morning.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Fingers crossed this is just a tummy bug and she will be on the mend soon


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Maisy vomited again this morning so the vet is still keeping her in


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## *H* (Jun 17, 2007)

I've been reading your threads and updates from the sidelines , I'm so sorry she's still under the vets and I hope they get her sorted in no time at all.
I've come on just to say I think the way you've stuck by her over these months even though It must have been awful at times, is fantasic! So many owners would have given up by now, re-homed or even not bothered with the vet treatment. You really should be commended on the way you've looked after her, seen to her every need, never giving up and loved her throughout.
I wish there was more like you around, stay positive and well done!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Agreed! :2thumb:

Our first Somali never produced a normal stool in his entire life and if the litter tray was even slightly dirty he would do it on the floor beside the tray. My husband often said to me that most people wouldn't tolerate that and if he'd belonged to anyone else, they'd have probably moved him on, but we take our animals on, "warts and all", as they say and they stay here with us until they're called to cross the bridge, whether they're perfect or a nightmare (and we've had some nightmares!) :lol2:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Thank you both :blush:


Yep - we're the same. We would never dream of giving up on an animal. Our tortoises have cost us a fortune the past few years and one of them, Wurtle, is currently costing several hundred pounds in vet fees a month. Many people suggested I rehome him but I would never do that. I took him on in 2007, and he's my (and the OH's by default :lol2 responsibility now and I couldn't give up on him.


I just want Maisy home and well. At least she's in the best possible place right now. I'm feeling quite gutted as I leave on sunday morning for 3 months and had really wanted to have her home before I go. The vet's have said I can visit tomorrow though to say goodbye before I go, so that's something at least.

I'm leaving detailed instructions with the OH so he can continue to chase things up with the vet's and make sure even after this episode is over that we get to the bottom of her problems (no pun intended!). I just wish I wasn't going away really but it's work so I have to


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

I agree with the others, a lot of people would have given up by now:no1:
Many years ago we took on an older perisan that would never poo in a litter tray, he had already had 5 conirmed homes, rather than him spend the rest of his life in a cattery pen we brought him home, He had 4 happy years with us and until the day he died he still wouldnt poo in a litter tray or outside. My present Persian was advertised free to good on home on Preloved as he had the raging squits and the vet had tested him and he came back as E.coli positive(as most cats are) she panicked and thought he would infect her children so she made him live outside and gave him medication. We travelled many miles to get him and the fat un neutered cat she described that was very timid turned out to be an extremely matted thin cat who loved everybody. The strange thing was that he has never in his life had the squits since we have had him so I do wonder if her children were giving him milk
Well done :no1:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Maisy's Home!! :2thumb:

She started drinking herself overnight so they reduced the drip, and she didn't vomit again so they let her come home  She's still got horrendous diarrhoea but she's drinking lots and seems pretty good in herself. She's not lethargic and she's trotting around quite happily. 

I'm so pleased she's home before I go tomorrow. Test results come back around Tuesday. I also insisted on another TTF test to be sure, so we'll get that next week.

It's been a rather expensive few days but well worth it 

Thanks everyone for your support with all this! If I don't post again then I'll see you all in 3 months when I get back and hopefully by then we may have got her sorted out


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Yes indeed!! Let's hope the vet can sort it out in your absence and you come home to a diarrhoea free house and 2 happy cats! :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Hello everyone

I'm sorry to drag up this old thread again but thought it was easiest to keep updating this one than starting a new one...

Well, I'm just back from 3 months away and..... Maisy is STILL testing positive for TTF! I'm gutted! A summer of further treatment and consultations with experts at Bristol Uni hasn't helped. It appears this TTF may be drug resistant so currently they are recommending a very high dose of Ronidazole plus a 3 day panacur course. I'm still getting up to speed on everything that's happened over the summer (I've been in Indonesia in a really remote location so haven't even been able to phone my OH and it hasn't been easy dealing with all this via the odd text!), so may update again soon but currently Maisy is still squitting all over the place and we're about to start the super high dose of Ronidazole. I am a little nervous as I know this drug can have bad side effects but the vet consulted the veterinary drug advisory something or other (sorry, very jetlagged and can't recall the proper name) so fingers crossed!

Maisy is ok in herself (as always) and it is SOOOOOOO good to see them again (I think I missed them more than I missed the OH :gasp: shhhh don't tell him that :whistling2 but naturally I'm more than a little concerned that this is still ongoing 


Nancy


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## Shellsfeathers&fur (Jan 18, 2009)

Welcome back - sorry to read that nothing really has changed. I know they would both have been as pleased to see you again as you were to see them!

Catch up on the sleep, and take a long deep breath or two - you and them have certainly been through it recently.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Oh Nancy I'm so sorry! :sad:

It really is a nightmare for you all, and poor Maisie, she must be well fed up by now.

Do keep updating us though.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Stephen P said:


> Welcome back - sorry to read that nothing really has changed. I know they would both have been as pleased to see you again as you were to see them!
> 
> Catch up on the sleep, and take a long deep breath or two - you and them have certainly been through it recently.


Thanks. I was just starting to feel human again but now I've come down with a stomach bug so back to square one! doh! I've got to go to Colorado on Saturday for a week to (work trip) so I'm having to leave them again but at least they'll be well on the way to finishing the latest course of medicine when I return.



feorag said:


> Oh Nancy I'm so sorry! :sad:
> 
> It really is a nightmare for you all, and poor Maisie, she must be well fed up by now.
> 
> Do keep updating us though.


Thanks - I will 

We've been told to play with her lots and lots to keep an eye out for any neurological probs from the medicine (slowing reaction times etc). All a bit of a worry really. If this doesn't work I really don't know what we'll try next.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

ukphd said:


> Thanks. I was just starting to feel human again but now I've come down with a stomach bug so back to square one! doh! I've got to go to Colorado on Saturday for a week to (work trip) so I'm having to leave them again but at least they'll be well on the way to finishing the latest course of medicine when I return.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Ive got a cat with IBD who was tested for TTF but came back negative and when he has episodes it is a nightmare so I can imagine your frustration over this.
Fingers crossed she will mend this time.


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## manuetaaz (Aug 23, 2010)

I'm not being funny but have you tried aloe vera? It's natural and it's great for the immune system. My old dobermann when he was about 2 years old had a poo with blood :gasp:
I cut a leaf of aloe vera, took the transparent gel, made it into a paste and gave some to him for 2 days. I don't know what the blood was about, but he was fine after that. Where I come from, aloe vera is all over the place so people tend to use it. 
If all these medicine don't work, why not try something natural that, if it doesn't work, won't do her any harm? (aloe vera won't poison her, believe me).


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

oops sorry *manuetaaz*, I didn't spot this reply before :blush:

Thanks for the tip. I'm certainly willing to try natural remedies - I'll wait to do the next TTF test and see what happens first though. Maisy's finished her final super dose of Ronidazole so we'll be testing next week. I'm crossing everything that this has worked! If not I'll discuss alternatives with the vet as I'm certainly not using anymore Ronidazole as it's just not been working for her.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Nancy, don't forget what the vet at Kelso said about the possibility that they might still test positive, because there could still be dead tri-trich in their system.

I'm sure he now advocates testing a few weeks after completion of the course of Ronadazole before doing a test.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Nancy, don't forget what the vet at Kelso said about the possibility that they might still test positive, because there could still be dead tri-trich in their system.
> 
> I'm sure he now advocates testing a few weeks after completion of the course of Ronadazole before doing a test.



Yeah that's right - I was told at least 14 days after the end of the Ronidazole course. Maisy had her last dose last Tuesday (sorry it probably sounded like I meant she'd just finished) so was thinking of getting a sample next Weds or Thurs or so. If she's not showing symptoms (hope springs eternal!) then I may wait a few extra days too just to be sure.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Yes, that makes sense! :2thumb:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

I have just called the vet's and Maisy's TTF test (which has taken weeks to come back!) is NEGATIVE!! :2thumb::no1::notworthy:

I am absolutely thrilled!

I don't want to get too excited as she has had a negative result once before and then a re-test came back positive. BUT she isn't showing any symptoms at the moment (nice firm little bullets of poop!) so I'm cautiously optimistic!

:2thumb:


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## Shellsfeathers&fur (Jan 18, 2009)

Excellent news! Fingers (in fact everything) crossed for her. As they say..."things can only get better...."


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Im delighted for you, great news:2thumb:

You really are a fantastic owner:no1:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

That is such excellent news after all the trials and tribulations you've gone through! :2thumb:

I'm so glad you didn't give up on her and your perseverance and care has paid off finally.


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Stephen P said:


> Excellent news! Fingers (in fact everything) crossed for her. As they say..."things can only get better...."


Thanks : victory:



Shell195 said:


> Im delighted for you, great news:2thumb:
> 
> You really are a fantastic owner:no1:


Thank you :blush: 



feorag said:


> That is such excellent news after all the trials and tribulations you've gone through! :2thumb:
> 
> I'm so glad you didn't give up on her and your perseverance and care has paid off finally.


Thanks :no1:

I'm so thrilled and Maisy seems pretty pleased too! :flrt:


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Maisy's showing symptoms again :bash:

I am hoping she's just got an upset stomah and it will settle down but it's been nearly 3 days now and it's just liquid again (though frequency is relatively normal, so not an acute upset stomach). It's just like it was before.

I knew I was being too optimistic - doh!

I'm getting a sample to the vet's tomorrow. She's completely fine otherwise - not lethargic, eating, drinking etc.

Desperately hoping Jackson doesn't pick it up from her!


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

Well, Maisy's symptoms have stopped as suddenly as they started! I'm hoping that's a good thing and she just had an upset stomach... I had a long chat with the vet about it today and we're holding off on testing another sample for a few days to see if this respite holds! He doesn't think it's a reaction to Jackson as it happened over 10 days after he arrived, but something may have happened to upset her when I wasn't around. Who knows!

I daren't be optimistic about any of this now - I think until we have a good few months with no symptoms I'll still be jumping for the sample pot everytime she has the squits!

At least Maisy's ok in herself though :flrt:

p.s. sorry I keep updating this old thread, I just thought it was best to keep it all together and this info may be helpful for others in a similar situation :blush:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Hopefully it is just a one-off! *fingers crossed* but I can see exactly where you're coming from. Every time you've seen an improvement and begun to think you've finally sorted it out, you've had a setback, so it's understandable that you're frightened to be too optimistic.

But you've never had negative results on them both at the same time before, so it's questionable that it could be a reoccurrence of the TTF.

Maybe something's just upset her and it's sorted now?


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## ukphd (Mar 29, 2008)

feorag said:


> Hopefully it is just a one-off! *fingers crossed* but I can see exactly where you're coming from. Every time you've seen an improvement and begun to think you've finally sorted it out, you've had a setback, so it's understandable that you're frightened to be too optimistic.
> 
> But you've never had negative results on them both at the same time before, so it's questionable that it could be a reoccurrence of the TTF.
> 
> Maybe something's just upset her and it's sorted now?


Yeah that's what I'm hoping for (obviously not hoping she's been upset but you know what I mean!). It could have been a delayed reaction to Jackson's arrival, or maybe she ate something that I wasn't aware of or something. I'm keeping a close eye on her - she's ok again today which is good!


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