# Fire Bellied toads



## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Hey all, 
I am considering letting my son get a couple of fire bellied toads. I had some many years ago but this was before the internet made info so very easy to come by, and also my memory fails when it comes to the care requirements, so I thought I would ask some people who know rather than just go trawling though sites that offer conflicting information.
My questions (off the top of my head) are :

Do they require heating (conflicting info) ?
Do they require UV?
Do they do better in groups/ pairs/ solo?
Is it possible to sex them when young?
Can they be kept on a bio active substrate?

I am also interested to know how people go about providing the water/ land areas. Large bowl, changed daily ? A gradual slope (would this require a filter?) 

I think that's it for now. Unless anyone has alternative suggestions for an active and simple to keep frog/ toad.
My son is almost 7 and loves to help me look after our lizards. He has had pet mice for the last few years but the last one sadly died a couple of days ago. Obviously I will be supervising the care of anything I let him get (just in case anyone is frowning )


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Have a look at these: Fire-Bellied Toad Caresheet. The Amphibian.co.uk. Fire-Bellied Toad Care, Fire-Bellied Toad breeding, Fire-Bellied Toad housing, Fire-Belllied Toad description and more
Amphibian Care >> Fire-bellied Toad (Bombina orientalis)

To answer your questions:
They require no extra heating, they are a temperate species and are perfectly happy at room temperature.
I'm not sure about UV, but it may be beneficial to the animals.
I've read that they are more active and less shy as pairs/groups
They can only be sexed as adults
I'm pretty sure they'd be fine on a bio active substrate

Have a look here for vivarium/tank ideas: Fire belly toad enclosures gallery!

If you're looking for an easy to care for enclosure the fourth post down has a picture of a good enclosure for that purpose.

Also, speak to Ron Magpie (Reptile Forums - View Profile: Ron Magpie). He really knows his stuff when it comes to Fire bellied toads (and many other species, Of course) 

Hope this helps,
Stuart


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## Arcadiajohn (Jan 30, 2011)

hi

I wrote a full caresheet on this species for PRK. If you call them I expect that they can point you towards a back issue or download

failing that email me at my work address and I will send you the PDF.

john


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Thankyou both. I will check he links out when i get back in


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Ok, I have done a fair bit of reading. I like the idea of creating a slope into the water, but is it necessary to use a filter or will partial water changes be ok ? John I have emailed you about the caresheet (I think)


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Ok, so I have come across a fish tank that is about 2ft long by 8 inches deep. I am thinking of using rocks to cover the ground under the water and creating a bank with them to above water level and then using a substrate (soil and moss?) to cover the land area - would I need to use a membrane to keep the rock and substrate separate? and would a sheet of slate work for holding back the rock slope?
I am able to use a filter for the water if need be (it sounds more practical) and if it will work I would like to put some live plants in there. Any suggestions as to which ones are both hardy and safe?


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Fizz said:


> Ok, so I have come across a fish tank that is about 2ft long by 8 inches deep. I am thinking of using rocks to cover the ground under the water and creating a bank with them to above water level and then using a substrate (soil and moss?) to cover the land area - would I need to use a membrane to keep the rock and substrate separate? and would a sheet of slate work for holding back the rock slope?
> I am able to use a filter for the water if need be (it sounds more practical) and if it will work I would like to put some live plants in there. Any suggestions as to which ones are both hardy and safe?


Hiya, a 2ft tank will house 4-6 toads comfortably. A membrane is a very good idea if you are using a soil-type substrate, otherwise it will get washed into the drainage material. Bear in mind that FBTs are demons for dragging water onto the land and land into the water, so plan accordingly- I find a layer of moss over the land helps. In my main tank I dispense with soil altogether- I have used mounded gravel buttressed by rocks and bogwood, and covered the whole with Java moss. The plants root down through the moss and gravel into the water beneath, and excess water drains away. There are lots of plants that will do well in those conditions, including tradescantia, phiilodendron and various marsh/bog plants- often sold for aquarium use. As Stu mentioned above, they will not need any extra heat- in fact they seem to breed better after a winter cooling. I don't filter mine- they aren't fond of moving water- I find a 25% water change works fine. If you want a bit more detail on all this, check out the link, and follow it through to the FBT care sheet :2thumb:

Hope some of this helps!

http://thereptilerealm.com/
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Thankyou


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Having read that and taking on board your suggestions about plants that dont require the soil, I am going to try those out, if I can avoid the soil then it will definitely save a lot of mess. How often do you do your partial water change without a filter? I actually got a filter with the tank so am thinking of maybe using it to create a bit of a trickle over some rocks before it re-enters the water. 
Un-decided as yet but will post pics when it is ready


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Fizz said:


> Having read that and taking on board your suggestions about plants that dont require the soil, I am going to try those out, if I can avoid the soil then it will definitely save a lot of mess. How often do you do your partial water change without a filter? I actually got a filter with the tank so am thinking of maybe using it to create a bit of a trickle over some rocks before it re-enters the water.
> Un-decided as yet but will post pics when it is ready


I change about 25% every fortnight or so, which seems to suit them. If you *are *going to use a filter, at least direct the outflow against the side of the tank- as I said, they're not keen on torrents. :2thumb:


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

A partial water change once a fortnight is much more manageable that I had expected. In this case I will probably not bother with the filter. Thanks all for your help


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

You're very welcome! :2thumb:


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Hi again, 
Thanks John for the care sheet, it was really helpful 
Ive come back here although I think I know the answer anyway, I thought I would check.
I read about the toxins that the FBT give off being bad news for fish, but then on some care sheets I have seen it suggested that there may be some type of feeder fish that can be offered ? What are you guy's views on this? Is there really a fish that is suitable as an occasional feeder, and if so would it survive in the FBT tank (until it gets eaten) ?

The tank is almost set up now. Will post some pics when I'm done and the frogs are in place


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## Arcadiajohn (Jan 30, 2011)

the toxins build up in the water and cause distress and the breakdown of protective mucus on the fish.

for me this does and I know it sounds rather harsh but it represents a form of cruelty. Putting a live, sentient animal in a confined space with no chance of escape in the "lair" of a predator. It is why live feeding snakes is so dangerous. No escape for either party.

then you have the possible stress of the toxin interaction.....

id say no. At least with invert feeders like daphnia and bloodworm they are very stationary and are gobbled up quickly

just my thoughts

john,



Fizz said:


> Hi again,
> Thanks John for the care sheet, it was really helpful
> Ive come back here although I think I know the answer anyway, I thought I would check.
> I read about the toxins that the FBT give off being bad news for fish, but then on some care sheets I have seen it suggested that there may be some type of feeder fish that can be offered ? What are you guy's views on this? Is there really a fish that is suitable as an occasional feeder, and if so would it survive in the FBT tank (until it gets eaten) ?
> ...


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## creepycrawlies (Dec 2, 2014)

I usually dont agree with keeping fish and amphibians together.

Feeding live vertebrates is also illegal.

If you want to keep different species together consider African dwarf frogs and some small tropical community fish.


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## cherryshrimp (Aug 1, 2012)

I have kept and bred white cloud mountain minnows in the fire-bellies tank for a long time. I removed the adults after spawning and reared the youngsters to adulthood in the tank with the frogs! Never had any of them eaten by the frogs, never lost any due to 'fire belly toxins'. I have also kept other small fish and also cherryshrimps without any problems. I don't know about anyone else but I never see my FBTs eating under water. They will take a wriggling cricket from the surface but never 'hunt' under the surface.

What will kill fish or amphibians is water that becomes polluted by waste (maybe this pollution is mistaken for 'fire belly toxins'). It's a case of either filtering or doing water changes to achieve minimum nitrogenous waste. 

Keeping fish in with the frogs just means the frog eggs will just be eaten. Great if you don't want to rear hundreds of young frogs.


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Thanks guys. It was just a passing thought. Honesly ive never been much of a fish person anyway


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Well the frogs are here and in their temporary accommodation for the next few days. The tank is almost ready (pics coming).

There are 3 of them and they are gorgeous...

Exhibit 1 -


Exhibit 2 - 


and the set up so far


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Looks good! Where did you get the toads from?
Also how big is the tank?
Stuart


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

The toads were ordered in for me by my local shop. The tank is 2ft long although is isnt as deep as i would like. I may get them something larger in the not too distance future but for now i think it is big enough


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## Arcadiajohn (Jan 30, 2011)

nice size and looking bright 

feed up your live food with foods rich in carotenoids or they will lose the red belly. they go sort of cat sick yellow with out it

john


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Ooh. What has those in especially ? I love the red belly


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Nevermind, I just read this properly, I misunderstood lol. I will do


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Ok I fell out wirth the sticky fake rock when it fell off the glass into the water and stopped sticking 
Then I decided I wasnt in the slightest bit happy with my background, and couldnt be bothered to make a new one so I brough an aquarium one which works out better as it can go below water level without getting ruined.
So after gutting the tank and setting it up again I am much happier, the frogs now have more solid land space and I have ditched the silly fake rock. I think I need to get some bottled water as I have no water treatment, I read that using normal tap water to stand makes it safe, for future reference is this right or am I mis informed?

Thanks


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## scottishsany (Nov 5, 2009)

*water*

hi fizz, i put tap water into 2 liter bottles and let sit for 2 days and then use for spraying and in the water dishes and never had a problem hope that helps


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

I have today added the rest of the water. It stands at about 8cm (guessing, will check in the morning) at its deepest. Is this ok ? or is it wiser to have less water with younger frogs ?


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

In their tank finally


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

So today they moved into their permanent tank. They seem to love the space and have been exploring. At least one of them has eaten today and I believe the others have too but I didn't stick around to watch. The crickets seem to be gone anyhow.

My problem is this...

About half an hour after going into the new tank one of them appeared to be darker in colour. I imagined that this would be down to stress or something and left him too it. However I have just been to look again and the other two are starting to look very slightly duller too. 
Could this just be stress or should I be worried that something in the viv is upsetting them ?

The contents of the viv:
-Aquarium stones and slate (new and rinsed before use)
-3 different plants that I have checked and rechecked and found them to be confirmed safe.(acorus, fittonia, and abiscus ?) Forgive me if I have misquoted or misspelt the plant names , but I believe these are somewhat correct )
- Spagnam moss (Im sure this one is spelt wrong)
- A fake plant hanging in the top corner
- Aquarium background brought from the shop made from polystyrene and stuck on with aquarium sealant (which dried last week)
- A mini filter (Low powered and I dont think this is the problem as it was turned on after the first one went dark) The water flow out of it is directed to the tank side so that there is next to no current caused by it 
- Bottled water from Morrison's

I cant put a finger on anything that is out of place so I am hoping that it is just the change of environment. What do you guys think ? 
Thanks


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

They will change colour according to how bright or dark the substrate is. Hope this helps. Merry Christmas,

Stuart


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Hmm, this could be it I guess. Will wait and see how they get on. They seem to be acting normally anyway


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

New enclosure update. They have been in the exo terra for a few weeks. It has a divider so that i can plant the land side. 
I just planted a bromeliad in there which i have read repeatedly is safe for them but i wanted to check with you guys. It looks great so hopefully it can stay in  
Frogs are all doing well. They love food the hungry devils. Thats about all the update i have i guess. Please shout at me if there is a problem with the plant anyway


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)




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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)




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