# Ethical feeding - can I do it?



## KathyM (Jan 17, 2009)

Urgh I hate the word ethical but it sums up the general area of what I need to find out.

I am considering getting our first snake. I have a beardie and breed my own food for her (roaches) because that way I know what she's getting. 

I breed rats for pet and show but am not in a position where I want to breed feeder rats, for various reasons. That is not changeable. 

I really want to avoid feeding rodent farm bred or similarly kept rodents to any potential snake. I want to know that the food I feed him/her has been raised and kept to a decent standard and is therefore healthy to feed to my pet. I don't want to feed rats that have been kept in standards I don't think are fit for pets, if you get me. I _definitely_ don't want to support the big rodent farms like Simons Rodents and the likes. 

Is this going to stop me having a snake or are there people out there that breed feeders ethically for sale to the general public?


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## Issa (Oct 13, 2006)

The news on that score in not all good unfortunately. A lot of the commercially available feeders are raised more in mind with profitability, rather than space and comfort. In truth that and quality issues (How many times my feeders had potentially been thawed and refrozen before I got them) led me to start breeding my own, 5 years down the line and I will still stand by the fact that my feeders are treated and housed like pets and my snakes get a far better meal because of it. I can understand why you couldn't really cull your own (apart from anything else you'd get slaughtered in the fancy world if you ever admitted it!) but short of finding a local feeder/pet breeder who's methods you agree with, pretty much the only options are to buy commercially, or breed your own.


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## KathyM (Jan 17, 2009)

Thanks - it's not all down to sentimentality (although I'd be lying if I said I felt fully comfortable doing rats for feeding). It is more down to having lots of rats here already and not being able to use the specific ones I breed for the purpose, as breeding for pet and show you have to keep extensive health records on your lines - something you just can't have if you're feeding some to snakes. By taking out feeders one would be potentially taking out information. Does that make any sense? I know of lots of breeders that cull who don't use the rats for food, so what other breeders think of me doesn't really come into it. 

I have to be honest, that gives me a good excuse not to have to face the issue of breeding my own. It's stupid too because I intend at some point to raise and deal with my own Chrimbo turkey (not this year sadly) and I'm already breeding another species (the dubia roaches) specifically for feeding. I also don't feed at all sentimental about feeding a rat that had naturally died here. It's not like I can't face it, just that if I can source them without having to I'd be far happier!


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## Issa (Oct 13, 2006)

I think the point will really hit home for you when you look at an average shop bought feeder and think "Jesus, I could do better than this myself".


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## toyah (Aug 24, 2006)

KathyM said:


> I know of lots of breeders that cull who don't use the rats for food


Why not ask them to empty their freezer for you then? Saves them going to waste...


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## KathyM (Jan 17, 2009)

If only they lived up this way I would! Don't know any local breeders who do.


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## KathyM (Jan 17, 2009)

Issa said:


> I think the point will really hit home for you when you look at an average shop bought feeder and think "Jesus, I could do better than this myself".


Yes but I have experience PTS-ing animals and it's a lot different doing it for someone else's pet than my own. There are many reasons why I couldn't breed my own feeder rats here, the attachment side of things is only one of them. They take up a lot of space and finances, and I'm only going to have one snake, it won't be practical at all. 

I was hoping someone would be able to put me in touch with an ethical supplier, it's kindof disappointing to hear there aren't any about and if I can't find one I think that's the end of the idea of having a snake. 

Thanks ever so much for your help though


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## sunnyskeg (Jul 3, 2008)

Issa said:


> The news on that score in not all good unfortunately. A lot of the commercially available feeders are raised more in mind with profitability, rather than space and comfort. In truth that and quality issues (How many times my feeders had potentially been thawed and refrozen before I got them) led me to start breeding my own, 5 years down the line and I will still stand by the fact that my feeders are treated and housed like pets and my snakes get a far better meal because of it. I can understand why you couldn't really cull your own (apart from anything else you'd get slaughtered in the fancy world if you ever admitted it!) but short of finding a local feeder/pet breeder who's methods you agree with, pretty much the only options are to buy commercially, or breed your own.


totally agree and this is why we breed our own :2thumb:


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## Carol (Aug 2, 2007)

I totally agree with you also and this is why I breed my own aswell.

Carol


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## angela__k__84 (Oct 4, 2008)

Kathy, why not get a garter snake - or a rough green? They are insectivarious


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## LFBP-NEIL (Apr 23, 2005)

we raise all our own rodents for sale through our website (see signature) although we fall in to the rodent farm category, I believe we raise our rodents to a very high standard, for example we stock them to the densities required for a pet shop licence and have them vet inspected and they are on our pet shop licence to show they have been inspected, they are fed a premium diet, they get fresh bedding weekly, are given cardboard to chew. newspapers to tear, and the mice even get exercise wheels on their enclosures! we raise mice in rat cages, and have a small number of rats in the largest size rat cages,


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## KathyM (Jan 17, 2009)

Thank you ever so much - just came back to this thread as we have bought two cornsnakes and I had forgotten about this thread. I shall be in touch most likely, thank you! 

I'm not sure whether it's worth breeding my own when I'll only have two snakes, but that's something I'll look into.


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