# Chinese Water Dragon - Nose Rubbing



## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

Like most posters of nose rubbing, I'm new to my Chinese Water Dragon. I went to the pet store, thought it would be great, came home realized I had no idea what I'm doing or what it requires, and am about $600 in the hole already - willing to go deeper.  

Really love the little guy. I don't know if the damage to his nose was from at the pet store or after he got home. After about a week, we started questioning what was wrong with his nose. Originally, I had put him in a little fish tank (I'm dumb), and then started doing reading. We immediately covered all of his glass when we realized that his non-stop nose rubbing was going to potentially kill him and we ordered him the biggest tank we could find afford (36x18x36). 

I'm posting some pictures of his nose. It's not swollen, just pink and he's rubbed all of the skin off. He eats well. Some days, up to 20 crickets - some days just a couple. We estimate that he/she is just under a year old.

Here's stats:
Basking: 90 degrees
10.0 UVB
Turtle filter
fogger
humidity is around 65 degrees - really hard to get it much higher.
Our tank decorations look lame, but we just got the tank yesterday. We're working to build something epic and beautiful. Might take a few weeks - but this got him out of the little tank.
We dust his crickets with a calcium dust, and feed the crickets both calcium and protein cricket food (my husband has fantasies about breeding crickets.. can't wait : | ).

I'm wondering, will his skin grow back? and if so, how long does that take? For the most part, based on his profile, it doesn't look like he's done any structural damage yet - just skin. Would love any insight you all have! I think he's a boy, but who knows.


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

you need to cover the back sides top bottom of that tank , no you need to get a wooden viv like this one


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## James Moore (Jun 6, 2012)

Care of The Chinese Water Dragon lizard (enclosure, diet, health, illness, temp, heat, humidity, cage, vivarium, terrarium) This website should help it is my go to place for Querys on my cwd


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## amazing_gecko (Sep 3, 2009)

From what you've said the initial nose rubbing was likely caused by being put in an enclosure that was too small for him and it was stressing him out. Good to know that he's had an upgrade and hopefully he should now do it less. However, you now have the issue of there being too much bare glass. Any reptile in that type of enclosure will not understand that there is an invisible barrier that surrounds him completely. I can't speak specifically for CWDs but generally speaking you need to dress it up with plants on the sides and back and on the front glass maybe some of those sticky spots. Just enough for him to recognize that the glass exists as a barrier.

As long as he stops rubbing it it will heal. It won't happen overnight and could take a few months. Keep an eye on it though as you don't want it getting infected. Being a good reptile keeper is all about being observant and responding quickly if something appears wrong.

Good luck!

James


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## Rthompson (Feb 19, 2011)

Well then.

First I'm going to say, never get ANY animal without having researched prior to purchase, it is not fair on the animal and will usually create massive costs to correct any mistakes.

The picture is blurry so the damage is hard to see, if the nose rub has removed flesh from the front of the nose it is unlikely this will grow back, it may heal over but will most likely never look normal again.

If it is serious I would suggest taking him to the vet to check for infection, nose rub easily becomes infected and should be checked for it just in case.

Humidity needs increasing, it MUST be in excess of 70% and should actually be above 80%, there are a few methods for this and the first one to start with is sorting that enclosure out.

Get a moisture holding substrate in there to start with, Bark chips are your best option, they hold moisture and increase humidity as well as looking natural. 

Edit: I can already see that you have used the entirety of the enclosure for a water area, that's a great start, so to increase humidity put a filter into it and create some form of fountain, this will kick moisture into the air and increase humidity as well.

You need far more climbable branches, plants and foliage for him to climb in, hide in, as well as spraying these will help with humidity overall.

What are your temperatures?

You should also switch to a sealed wooden vivarium, please be aware that by the time he is adult you will need a minimum of a 4x4x2.

For further assistance, my care sheet is available at http://robsreptilepage.rthompsonit....ive Husbandry of the Chinese Water Dragon.pdf


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Still Rubbing*

Greetings!

Thank you all for your great advice. I appreciate how honest some of you were and the direction others pointed me in. I have since added a lot of vegetation and some other items to his home. For the first few days, his nose actually looked like it was getting better. It was getting dark spots and things looked good. But, in the last 48hours, things have gotten much worse. I think I can see his front teeth. He leaps at the front of the glass from his hammock and smacks it throughout the day. He just won't leave it alone, which is why we have the paper up. Long term, I swear he's going to have to be completely covered in order to prevent him from killing himself. I did find a couple toads that he actually likes. They just look at each other and hang out a lot. Small toads - about 3 inches in diameter and they're doing great in there. The toads actually seem to distract him from the glass often... I just don't know how to break this habit. Here's the new setup. Not what I want in the end, but it's better.

Any advice on helping him is appreciated!


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## muyu0604 (Jun 14, 2012)

I can't speak specifically for CWDs but generally speaking you need to dress it up with plants on the sides and back and on the front glass maybe some of those sticky spots. Just enough for him to recognize that the glass exists as a barrier.


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## winno (Jun 6, 2009)

We had the same issue with one of our girls. we normally keep the humidity around 75% BUT

at early stage of nose rub whilst it is still an open wound drop the humidity right down to allow the wound to heal. It will never go perfect but will allow the wound to heal and prevent infection. Remember cold blooded animals wounds are a lot slower to heal than warm blooded then you got the issue of high humidity prevent the wound to scab and heal/scar.

Tape some paper to the out side ground level of the glass so he can see there's a wall there.

Water dragons do this for a number of reasons from stress to just being social are male will tap the glass so we open the door he has a run round for a bit and taps the glass when he wants to go back in. SOOOO CUTE. Most dragons will grow out running there face against the glass as they get older.

I would recommend a visit to the vets just to be sure it is a clean wound with no sign of infection.

Hope this helps PM me if you need anything I am a very keen on water dragons you can see some of ours all over this thread
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/lizard-pictures/233261-water-dragon-thread-13.html

All the best

Tom


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Thanks for the reply*

We've only had him for about a month, and I feel a little nervous taking him out of his viv. He tends to take off in a bolt and hard to catch. We're afraid he's going to get stuck somewhere where we can't get him. That being said, we still try to take him out a few times a day just to handle him so hopefully eventually he'll mellow out some. I think he really likes the toads we added. He spends a lot of time around them and at one point, rested his chin down on top of the back of one and just kind of laid there.

We've placed paper at the bottom to cover the glass. The problem is he's leaping from his hammock and hitting the glass about half foot from the top, face first with force and then dropping. That's when his nose started getting much worse. Rather than tapping, he's smacking himself fairly hard. I taped a bunch of fake leaves to the top of the glass so he see's that there is something there. I hate to cover up the whole front to protect him, but I can see two of his bottom teeth at this point. He's tearing himself up. I don't see any signs of infection yet and in some ways, the original damage looks like it's healing up. He's just hurting the very tip where his lips come together the most now. I like the little dragon though. I think we're going to make a play pen we can sit in and just let him run around without worrying about him getting lost somewhere, so he can try to acclimate more.

Anyway, loved seeing your dragons. I hope that one day I get the hang of this.

Kind Regards,
Stephanie


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Adding a picture*

This is how bad it's gotten..  

I feel sad... I think I'm doing all the things people suggest.. but for whatever reason.. it's just not good enough..


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## Phoenixn7g (May 26, 2012)

Go to the vet. Now.
No amount of advice from this thread will help you.
Please, for the sake of the animal, take him ASAP


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## henney2280 (Jan 12, 2012)

ok Firstly im going to call you an idiot for buying a reptile that you obviously knew nothing about, this is the reason you should never impulse buy any pet, unfortunatly this happens far to oftern. so anyway first thing you need to do is get him to a vets, they should prescribe something to kill any infection in the nose rot but be aware this will never get better, the damage is done and its mouth is always going to be in that state now, it will heal over but the skin wont come back and you will always be able to see its teeth. the main thing is to get rid of any infection so it dosnt get any worse! GET IT TO THE VET ASAP!


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## henney2280 (Jan 12, 2012)

sorry i had to finish that last post short, dont take offence by me calling you an idiot ur not fully to blame, but this is the reason you should never impulse buy a pet. its good to see that your on here trying to get help for your little guy so please listen to us when we say get him to a vet asap. nose rott is what your lizard seems to have developed to be honest it could of had it before you bought him but if left untreated it will just get worse and worse, nose rott is an infection caused by open wounds in the mouth this could be from him rubbing his face like you have said, the way it gets infected is if your water isnt cleaned daily and as im sure you have noticed they near enough always poo in water, hense the water is full of bacteria and if you get that in the open wound it will easily become infected. when nose rott is left untreated it eats away at the flesh and bone tissue in the effected area leaving you with a very ugly and unhappy reptile. as i have said take him to a vet he should prescribe some antibiotics to fight the infection, when i bought my water dragon she had an early stage of the infection, i had to treat her for two weeks by applying iodine the the area with cotton wool buds, this was not easy for me or her as i had only had her 3 days, but with the right treatment and catching the infection early it healed perfectly. as for humidity go with what people have suggested if it is still low cover some of the vents at the top of the viv, also i dont recommend the all glass tanks as he will just always bang his face into it trying to get out. my water dragon still jumps at the glass the only thing you can really do is cover it up or move away the 'launch pad' as far from the glass as possible, saying that ive done everything i can to stop mine doing it but she will still do it when she wants to come out of the viv. i simply make sure everywere she could get herself stuck is covered up then open the door she comes flying out like a maniac then usually either climbs as high as she can or sits infront of the TV. either way get him to a vet and get him on the mend good luck


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## Rthompson (Feb 19, 2011)

The glass thing is very simple, these are water dwelling lizard, to them see through = water = swimmable and passable.

Partially the rubbing against the glass is an attempt to get into water, another reason why large obvious water supplies are recommended (use a filter to circulate and clean the water).

Additionally with using an all glass tank there is no real distinction between the water area at the bottom and the sides of the tank, so as far as he can tell it's just one big lake with no restrictions. Create some definition between water and land and frost the glass where possible.

Clean the tank fully to prevent further infection and get him to a vet to address the issue, if it's showing front teeth it's doubtful it will ever regenerate to it's former glory but it will heal over.

It is highly important that you don't just provide an adequate setup but that you also understand their behaviours. why they attack the glass and how using that knowledge can help you prevent such things in the future, this is how I have always worked with CWD's and have never had a nose rub issue (Outside of them having already come to me like that). It does pay to research above and beyond the norm as well as paying close attention to the animal itself.


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Thank you*

I do have a very high end turtle filter in the tank to keep it clean and run that 24/7. I also have a fogger and have gotten the humidity up to about 75% when the lights are on.. goes to 90 at night. I am looking for a herp vet in my area, but haven't been successful. Not sure if a general vet will see him.

I can say that I did talk to the pet store at length when I bought him and they assured me that my 18x12x12 tank was enough.. was bigger than what he was in while there by double... and I thought I had a good idea based on my conversations with all the people at the pet store of what I was getting in to.. at this point, that's neither here nor there and i'm fairly disgusted that the pet store doesn't even sell a tank big enough to house the lizards they sell. I had to order mine online because i couldn't find one in a 200 mile radius.

I did tape leaves onto the upper top glass of the front of the tank and he hasn't hit the glass since. He does look at them and acts like he wants to jump, but hasn't yet.. which is a good thing. I'm keeping my eye on him to see what else I need to do to make him stop. His hammock is as far away as it can be. 

In the water, I have larger rocks on the bottom, and aquarium live plants, a platform rock he can get up on and a log that he can also get on. He also has a waterfall.. all of that is hard to see in the picture. 

I'm working to take him somewhere to be looked at this weekend. I know this seems like i'm just naive, but I am trying to do my best for him and I did think and tried to ask all of the right questions at the pet store. 

I'll keep you posted when I find out what the vet says.. and hoping the leaves on the tank will keep him from thinking he's in an open air environment.. which is what I think he perceives.. he can't see the glass and he's just going for it.

All the best,
Stephanie


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## winno (Jun 6, 2009)

Hi Stephanie
What is your area?


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*area*

Cedar Rapids, Iowa - U.S.


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## dramen (May 29, 2012)

I'm from the UK but a google search quickly pulled up lots in Cedar Rapids IA
These are reptile vets as far as i can tell but heres the link to the places hopefully one is nearby you.

Reptile Veterinarians Cedar Rapids IA - Cedar Rapids IA, reptile vets, Cedar Rapids IA veterinarians, Cedar Rapids IA exotic vet


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Vet Appt*

Thank you. I was able to find someone who will see him/her. Appointment isn't until next Tuesday - but the best I could do. Most of the vets on that page didn't feel comfortable enough.

I appreciate the help!
Stephanie


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## Deakam (Jun 5, 2012)

Hope all goes well, mine does it occassionaly but fortunately not too often, seems to do it less when the humidity is in the low 80's but like yourself its sometimes difficult to keep it that high, plenty of misting the the tree bark seems to maintain it, I tend to take him out of the viv for a while if he starts doing it and that also seems to settle him.


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## cujin (Jun 8, 2012)

*Trip to the Vet*

Wanted to update. I was able to get the little guy into the vet a day early and he's fine. He has some damage to his nose and I think the picture I posted of his nose may make it look worse than it actually is. The vet had some background on lizards and reptiles and felt really good about the condition he's/she's in. The nose is damaged from rubbing and face planting on the glass, obviously. The vet said that after a few sheddings that it would be mostly resolved. She also gave me some drops to give him as precautionary, but there was no sign of mouth rot or anything like that. 

So, that's good.. I just got to keep him from hurting himself any more. I did "lizard proof" the room his terrarium is in and have been letting him out at least once a day for about an hour. I am finding, like the last poster, that this settle's him a great deal. Afterward, he's really mellow for a long time and just chill's out.

I don't know when or how often he'll shed his skin...

Anyway, wanted to share the outcome. The leaves on the top of the tank seemed to help too, but more than anything, letting him out so he could climb up my rack of clothes and perch on top made him happiest of all.

All the best to all of you!

Stephanie


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## Deakam (Jun 5, 2012)

I am glad she is ok Stephanie


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## henney2280 (Jan 12, 2012)

cujin said:


> Wanted to update. I was able to get the little guy into the vet a day early and he's fine. He has some damage to his nose and I think the picture I posted of his nose may make it look worse than it actually is. The vet had some background on lizards and reptiles and felt really good about the condition he's/she's in. The nose is damaged from rubbing and face planting on the glass, obviously. The vet said that after a few sheddings that it would be mostly resolved. She also gave me some drops to give him as precautionary, but there was no sign of mouth rot or anything like that.
> 
> So, that's good.. I just got to keep him from hurting himself any more. I did "lizard proof" the room his terrarium is in and have been letting him out at least once a day for about an hour. I am finding, like the last poster, that this settle's him a great deal. Afterward, he's really mellow for a long time and just chill's out.
> 
> ...


hey glad to hear he is ok and there is no infection, i dont understand what he ment by saying after a few sheds it will be resolved because if his face is damaged to the point were you can see his front teeth then it really wont get better, dont want to put a downer on it but the info that vet has given you is false, chinese water dragons cant regenerate like leopard geckos and such this is why it wont go back to normal.

As for shedding ive had mine about 5 months now and she has grown super quick so she has litterally been sheding around every two weeks, so if its quite young u can be assured his first shed with you wont be far away. remember to bath him in slightly warm water when he is shedding everyday this will make him shed better and pay attention to his toes and spikes and tip of tail just make sure once he has finished his shed that no bits remain on thoose areas, if he retains shed on thoose areas after time it will stop blood flow and the toe or spike etc will litterally drop off.

:2thumb:


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