# mangrove rat snake off dwa?



## mr dolittle (Apr 4, 2007)

is this confirmed yet how can i find out thanks


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## jaysnakeman (May 10, 2006)

from october the first they are off i think


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## Fangio (Jun 2, 2007)

mr dolittle said:


> is this confirmed yet how can i find out thanks


Soon to be - from October 1st it becomes legal to own one without a license.

The date for objections has passed


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## SuperTed (Apr 19, 2007)

are you living in the future then ?


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## Fangio (Jun 2, 2007)

SuperTed said:


> are you living in the future then ?


Say what?

You mean me or the OP?


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## SuperTed (Apr 19, 2007)

hmm no i just read your post wrong and couldnt be assed to edit my post.


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## Fangio (Jun 2, 2007)

SuperTed said:


> hmm no i just read your post wrong and couldnt be assed to edit my post.


To be fair i re-read it and decided it needed an edit!


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## Fangio (Jun 2, 2007)

Also just noticed the title.

I believe you mean mangrove snake NOT "Mangrove rat snake"

afterall.....it's a member of the cat-eyed snake group (cat snakes) not a species of ratsnake.


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## ralphee (Aug 9, 2006)

So all Boiga are off DWA? Ive handled a few of these wayyy back, crazy as hell to deal with LOL, i dont think they were even on lists then.
Did they just get doctrined into DWA for a short time, ive been out of reptiles for quite a while now!

lee


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

the only boiga I believe that was on is the mangrove, but someone was saying the other day that boiga irregularis is going on and maybe one other.


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## ralphee (Aug 9, 2006)

Ahh i see so just Dendrophilla was on there, should stay on IMO, not a snake to be taken lightly, they will strike at the slightest movement from what ive seen first hand.
Itll only bring more bad light to herping (reason i stopped keeping for a while) if noobs were to get there hands on them.

lee.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

I dont think people should under estimate them just because they are coming off.


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## ralphee (Aug 9, 2006)

I think its good for guys with experience to take there first steps into hot snakes.
Yet without the DWA there as a stumbling block or deterrent for the newcomer or poser, itll be hard to police the amount of these going around i guess, they do need respect, but damn there beautiful animals!
Not trolling, id just rather see the hot guys doing this with DWA in place and all the years in hot they have, i have a great deal of respect for anybody well versed in keeping and breeding venomous species.

lee


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## Moshpitviper (Oct 21, 2005)

I will say that people should be wary of these. there soon to off the licence is not an excuse to buy this species. i have kept them and they are not for the feint hearted. if you arent confident with whippy bitey snakes then i suggest mangroves are not the snake for you.

really concerned for B. dendrophilla after oct1. more concerned for unprepared keepers.


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## darkdan99 (Dec 28, 2006)

it makes me laugh, it truely does.

B.Dendrophilla have sevral deaths to their name, and are regarded as a potentially dangerous snake. 

Yet B.irregularis has no deaths (to my knowledge) andhas a much lower LD50 count and it is being added.

boiga cynodon is probably the most toxic (IMO, and and from various resources) yet it is not and has never been covered by the DWA. 

Also, the african sand snake. 

These are currently being sold for 99P by a well know supplier, to anyone with a pet shop license, yes UNDER A POUND.

These snakes are regarded to have a dangerous venom but small fangs and thus poor envenomation capability, yet they still are fairly toxic. 

No-one knows what the hell it is. And they feel the need to remove it. 

They are putting on the amazonian false viper, (false lancehead, the latin escapes me) which is also harmless some references saying less so than the false water cobra (brazillian smooth snake)

It seems to me they have done a google search for rear fanged colubrid, printed the names, and pulled various ones out of a hat to decide the changes!!!!!!!!!!


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## biscuitman (Mar 14, 2007)

Are mangrove snakes front or rear fanged? I may be wrong, and I probably am, but I thought all front fanged venomous snakes had to kept with a licence?


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## darkdan99 (Dec 28, 2006)

they are rear fanged, in that they are a colubrid, and not a viper or elapid (cobra family)

However "rear fanged" is a loose term, and the fangs can be anywhere in the mouth, with some species haveing 4 fangs (P.pictus for example)


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## wayakinwolf (Oct 6, 2006)

*mangroves*

Well said. I love the mangrove snakes, but respect them too & as previously said, they are NOT for the faint hearted. if i wasn`t such a coward id love one, but i know my limitations & thats what worries me with them coming off DWA that idiots will get their hands on them & undo sooo much good work that we`ve all done to try to keep our hobby secure.


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## masticophis (Jan 14, 2007)

To be fair apart from the size of a large adult and the attitude then they aren't that bad. There are much worse snakes that you can currently get without a DWA. While I'm not saying you should be too casual around mangroves, I do think that other snakes deserve more caution.
The irregularis and the nigriceps both have better fangs and more potent venom.
Not to mention other species of snakes.
The sand snakes for instance, HUGE fangs and venom glands for the size of snake. 
Look at the size of the fangs in a mangrove (look hard or you will miss them), then look at sand snakes (double set of top fangs, plus enlarged 'fangs' on the bottom for grip)

Mike


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## ralphee (Aug 9, 2006)

All very good and valid points made, a chondro or even some elaphe can really go to town on a hand or finger i learned that the hard way lol, ouchie!
Its just the fact that they are venomous thats disconcerting with them becoming DWA exempt, but as stated there are many that are venomous and not on DWA, cynea for one i think?
In the end its up to the keeper to show the respect needed in what he keeps, but in the end, its always sad to hear of another bad press clipping blighting this hobby ive enjoyed since around 4 years old.

lee


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## Fangio (Jun 2, 2007)

darkdan99 said:


> it makes me laugh, it truely does.
> 
> B.Dendrophilla have sevral deaths to their name, and are regarded as a potentially dangerous snake.


Sorry dan, but I can't find any record of these. As far as I can tell there have been no fatal envenomations of them.




Feel free to link me to any though in case I've missed it somewhere!!


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