# Enigma Syndrome



## Moosmoo (Jul 21, 2008)

Hey, I work in a reptile shop and we had someone dump a leopard gecko on us, he stayed at the shop for a while, and he OBVIOUSLY has enigma syndrome... now someone I work with wanted to ''dispose'' of him (putting it in the nicest terms :devil and I said no I'll take him home, because he eats fine and poos fine... However he CLEARLY has the enigma syndrome, he circles, he deathrolls, and he is showing signs of MBD... 

Now I don't really know what I can do to make his life a bit more comfortable, he is all set up at mine and has been so for nearly a week, eating fine etc etc... he doesn't like being picked up at all unlike my other leopards so I've left him well alone apart from feeding and watering (He's well away from my own collection for quarantine reasons) 

So, any suggestions?? is there anything I can do for little Juno that could help at all apart from try and up his calcium supplements? 

Ta

Hana


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## funky1 (Jun 18, 2008)

Tbh, if it`s at the stage where he`s death rolling (twisting his head so far over his shoulder for no apparent reason, and then flipping onto his back) then there may not be much you can do at all I`m afraid. I`m not doubting you by any means, but if he`s got that bad, then it`s pretty surprising he`s eating, as even with a bowl of mealies the co-ordination to even put his head in a bowl and hope for the best, is nigh on impossible.

The only things that I can suggest with an Enigma at such an advance stage, is to keep him as far away from other leos as possible (they can be explosively aggressive without any provocation - simply because they don`t really know what`s going on etc), keep him in much smaller conditions than for a regular adult (it can help calm them down immensely if they feel secure), make hide entrances as wide as possible as well as finding a very wide mealie dish, and also - as you are - keep the supplements up quite high. Mealies will give him the best chance of feeding for himself, as fast moving live prey - esp crix and locust - as well as being very difficult to catch, can also be very confusing and stressful to a problematic Enigma, leading them to become very distressed.

Probably the main thing at the mo`, would be to keep a very close eye on him (which can be tricky as being as stress free is imperitive) as once they death roll, it can often lead to them being stuck on their backs - totally unable to get back around onto their feet again, whether physically or even have the will to. 

I really do think that the very best, and kindest thing you could possibly do for him, is to take him to a specialist reptile vet - just so they can have a really good look at him. If they say he has every chance of having even the tiniest quality of life, then I`m sure he`ll have a great life with you. If they say it really isn`t fair on him to be in the state he is, and most importantly, if they say he`s suffering physically or mentally with little to no chance of noticable recovery, then leave the decision upto them.

Good on you for taking him on, it`s extremely sad when you see an Enigma with severe problems and the best will in the world is to help as much as you can, but as the saying goes - sometimes you really do have to be cruel to be kind. But get a good vets advice first - you can even enquire over the phone before you book an appointment, whether the vet is familiar with the Enigma syndrome.

Genuinely wish you the best of luck, and apologies if it`s come across as a negative post or advice - that`s the last intention in the world. Hopefully, I may just be thinking he`s worse than he is and the term `death roll` has conjured up the wrong impression.


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## Moosmoo (Jul 21, 2008)

Well he has only done that once, and it was when I startled him, I picked him up gently to move him out the way so I could place his dish of mealies in, and it wasn't really a ''deathroll'' well he flipped himself over in my hand, but then he kinda just freaked out a lot... 

He has been eating mealies and he will eat locusts if I offer them to him by tweezers... 

He is in a RUB well away from my own collection anyway, but he seems happy enough at the moment. I am leaving him well alone and I only really go near him to feed and water.


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## Slurm (Jun 6, 2008)

i have limited experience with enigma issues, but i have some suggestions


increase the calcium provided - i believe the enigma issue could be linked to low calcium
try some uv light as it may aid calcium absorbtion
keep badly effected geckos on their own
a smaller enviroment will help
i believe the enigma issue is linked to the inner ear, and it could be badly formed due to low calcium.


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## tonkaz0 (Apr 25, 2008)

Slurm said:


> i have limited experience with enigma issues, but i have some suggestions
> 
> 
> increase the calcium provided - i believe the enigma issue could be linked to low calcium
> ...


 

Hi Phil,

I totally agree to what you say because I have been treating one of my offspring in exactly the same way as your describing! and have been doing so for about a month, but there is no improvement at all at the moment,
this leo was as sweet as a nut from hatching to about 2 months old and then all the twisting and rolling started, both parents a mack bell albino Dad x mack bell enigma mum have no issues at all either, this young one sadly is not any good for even a pet and to keep it going is i think unfair to the quality of life its going to have so i think drastic measures are needed im sorry to say,

Dave davies and PS geckos along with some university are doing alot of research with this! it may pay you get in touch with them.


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## Slurm (Jun 6, 2008)

i dont think there was a real conclusion to the work they did, 

the post mortums showed fatty livers and low bone calcififcation and not much else.

I wonder if its is damaged/malformed inner ear that it may not be repairable.

I have heard of people who have that have dropped leos or they have fallen and then the enigma effects come apparent.

There is much to learn.


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## lindsaydo (Mar 2, 2010)

Slurm said:


> i dont think there was a real conclusion to the work they did,
> 
> the post mortums showed fatty livers and low bone calcififcation and not much else.
> 
> ...




I have noticed under light, my enigma has a hole in his head, like where his brain is under developed. 
He star gazes and does his little enigma dance, but he is one of the nicest gecko's I have ever known. 
He is sat right now on my laptop drifting off to sleep as I type away. 
I am new to this forum, and I don't know if you can attach pictures in posts, but I do have a picture of the hole. If anyone wants to see it then just send me an email - [email protected]

As for keeping up calcium, my enigma will not eat at the moment. He has MBD, so to get his calcium in I made up some Gecko Gunk (my name for it) which is calcium dust (3 teaspoons) water (2 table spoons) 2 crickets, 4 meal worms, 3 wax worms, 1 pinky. All crushed together into and ugly paste. Strain if you want. Put in dose sizes in to ice cubes trays and freezed, then I can remove a dose a time and the rest will keep. 
Hope this helps people.


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## Nicquita (Mar 14, 2009)

i don't know what to say about anything else, but he doesn't have a hole in his head. if you hold any leo up to light, you can see the light through their ears. i think it'ss due to a lack of colour pigments or something to that effect. either way, i'm almost certain that that's completely normal


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## nuttybabez (Jul 21, 2007)

Some very good advice from funky. I have an enigma who was handed in as a rescue and she has enigma syndrome - she circles, star gazes and has head tilt. She also struggles with co-ordination to eat sometimes and I have to hand feed her. I am happy that she has some quality of life. But last year I also hatched an enigma (totally randomly from a female leo who had retained sperm) who was circling from birth and this progressed til he was doing death rolls and he wasn't eating or growing so at that point I had him PTS.


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## lindsaydo (Mar 2, 2010)

I know light shines through their ears. I have other geckos too, who act normally, which I have compared it too, and if you saw it with your own eyes, you would see it too. It is not around his hear, it is on the top of his head where the hole is, and I have a picture that shows it.


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## Nicquita (Mar 14, 2009)

lindsaydo said:


> I know light shines through their ears. I have other geckos too, who act normally, which I have compared it too, and if you saw it with your own eyes, you would see it too. It is not around his hear, it is on the top of his head where the hole is, and I have a picture that shows it.


no need to get defensive. as you're new, i wasn't aware you had other geckos, and either way, i wasn't being insulting in any way, shape or form. i also did not say that you are wrong, just that if it was through the ears, it's normal


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## lindsaydo (Mar 2, 2010)

Yeh I am new to the forum, I have 4 geckos now, 4 eggs incubating. I'm quite new to the whole enigma thing, I rescued mine, and I have got some friends that are very popular in the gecko world, so I have consulted them with regards to the subject. I have been doing tonnes of research into enigma's. This is how I stumbled across the thread actually. All I am saying is, is that under development of certain lobes in the brain could be a contributing factor towards the star gazing and "enigma dance" as I like to call it. 

One thing that I do see though is that Enigma's are very sought after in the Gecko world, but not many people actually talk about the consequences of mutated genetics, and the effect it is having on the poor little hatchlings.


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## Nicquita (Mar 14, 2009)

i never understand that. people rant and rave about not breeding cresties with 6 toes, but enigmas are actually a morph now, even though that particular morph seems to be more detrimental to the leos health than 6 toes has been seen to be on a crestie


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## lindsaydo (Mar 2, 2010)

Very true. 
I am breeding a chocolate albino with a lavender giant, and a hypo tang with lavender giant. That is as far as I am going with genetics. 
I don't want something to be that isn't meant to.


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## Nicquita (Mar 14, 2009)

i don't think i'll ever even head into breeding. i'm very protective, and i've known people to lose leos to being eggbound etc. i'd never be able to bring myself to risk it.


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## lindsaydo (Mar 2, 2010)

egg binding isn't very common. 
I must say though that you have to have a lot of time and money for it. 
But I sat and watched my gecko lay her eggs, and it was one of the most brilliant things I have ever watched.


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## Nicquita (Mar 14, 2009)

it may not be common, but i know from experience that i have really bad luck, and if there's a 1 in 1000000 chance of something happening, theres a 99999 in 1000000 chance that it'll happen to me. i just wouldn't dare risk my leo's health


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## Forsaken1 (Mar 31, 2010)

Hey there my enigma merlin has this too, stargazes, circles, has a head tilt and occasionally falls over! but he is the happiest and loveliest leo i have had! As for people saying put them to sleep, I have a disorder not unlike this, would you say I should be pts too? I think I do ok even if I do walk into door frames! lol If they are doing ok ie;eating/toileting well, I dont see why they cant just be left alone to get on with their life..It may be a slightly unusual 1 but its a life none the less..:roll2:this is how I see merlin, happy but rolly!!:lol:


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## ccrew (Mar 11, 2009)

*Enigma syndrome*

im going to spend the next months learning about the *Enigma Syndrome* as i have 1 female enigma that has a slight case of it and a young male that has a slight case of it and i have a baby enigma that is coming on friday that has a slight case of it so im going to look into it myslef then i will try to give me opinion of it and i have started my research now ready for this syndrome someone will discover something one day but for now we have to do our best im going to compare the reactions and movement between a baby,juni and an adult Enigma and assess each and every difference between them and the give my conclusion i may be able to add something or help in anyway after i have conducted my research and my own home research is done who knows i might figure something out.... will post back in a couple of weeks or maybe months when i have assessed or when i find somethin new to add


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