# america tree frogs!



## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

can they be kept with any other frog, toad, newt etc!?


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

Please read the posts not so far below this where we have a long debate why not. short answer No.


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

ok thanks.


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

i know of a few people that have kept them successfully with red eye tree frogs. i personally wouldnt risk it, although my red eye contact breeder keeps redeyes, clown tree frogs and fire belly toads together.


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## Guest (May 12, 2007)

ooohhh what are clown tree frogs?


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

do a google, lovelly lookin things


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## Guest (May 13, 2007)

ahhh yeah their sweet!


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

they look like sweets
lol


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

redeyedanny said:


> i know of a few people that have kept them successfully with red eye tree frogs. i personally wouldnt risk it, although my red eye contact breeder keeps redeyes, clown tree frogs and fire belly toads together.


 
wat?? the toxins from the fire bellies will kill the others!!!!!! wat a muppet!!!!:-x


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

Yes i agree. FBTs are one of the most toxic common pet species, and as they spend such a large proportion of their time in the water, the toxins will no doubt affect the water quality drastically. I would never buy animals, esp ones as delicate as RETFs from someone who mixed with such bad species choices! no wonder some of yours died!


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## Guest (May 13, 2007)

Art_Gecko101 said:


> Yes i agree. FBTs are one of the most toxic common pet species, and as they spend such a large proportion of their time in the water, the toxins will no doubt affect the water quality drastically. I would never buy animals, esp ones as delicate as RETFs from someone who mixed with such bad species choices! no wonder some of yours died!


can you safely handle fire bellies?dont know much about them...and what about poison darts?


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

fbt, you can coz i have seen pics of people handleing them, on that pollywog, i think. poison arrow frogs have no poison in captivity, its the food they eat in the wild that gives them the poison. think that right!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

i heard that poison darts lose their toxicity over time. they need the right type of food. fire bellies?


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

i always call the arrow frogs, instead of dart frogs sorry.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

yeah, poison arrow is what i've always used. i've caught the green &blk and strawberries. used my bare hands. no problems. i wouldn't want to lick one. last buzz....


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

Theyre not particularly toxic to humans, i still would wash your hands after handling though. and yes the poison darts do lose the majority of their toxicity in captivity as long as you dont feed them the ants they eat in the wild! They still produce toxins though, all amphibians do, just not strong enough to harm us, but definatly strong enough to harm other amphibians if kept in contact with it


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## Guest (May 13, 2007)

ahhh thanks for clearing that up.
i wouldnt house same species together....same as i wouldnt with snakes or anything


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

arrow/dart frogs can live together though, i think. hve seen it been done a couple times.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

we have a big dendrobates exhibit at the zoo. all kinds in there. great display!


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

yes certain species of dendrobates can be mixed but you still have to reserch which ones as not all are compatible


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

what are part of the dendrobates family?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

use extreme caution, dendrobates may be addicting...:lol2:


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

what are they?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

poison arrow frogs. neat little guys. don't ever breed them. you will be hooked. i've seen the dendrobates addicts at the shows in the past...sad:lol2:


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

so it just poison arrow frogs.?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

that's the genus but "just" doesn't do them justice. whole different aspect of the hobby. they are beautiful, diverse and a challenge


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

Yes dendrobates are poiso dart frogs. you can also get leucomella and mantella which are also very teny tiny frogs. Very cool, id get some if it werent for the fruit flies.


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

just to add, i personally think the mantella are amazing! the orange ones are such nice colours!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

little jewels!


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

yeh i also like mantellas, and same the golds lol
so could a mantella be oused eith a fart frog.?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

never had a "fart frog":lol2: or worse, a "poison fart frog"! are they rare?


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

oops  dart frog*


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## Guest (May 13, 2007)

fart frog:lol2:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Laura-LNV said:


> fart frog:lol2:


 poision fart frog! it's all in the diet!:lol2:


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

loil. you been feeding them too many beans mate!!
as for housing PDFs with mantella, i wouldnt know. i know that some dendros and leuca are compatible with other dendros and leucs but i havent done enough research into whether this can extend to outside of the genus (i.e. i dont know if you can mix dendrobates with leucomella or mantella for example).
If you are serious about poison darts (they are not a good first frog) the you need to visit some of the dartfrog specific forums and ask there. a quick google search will bring up loads.The best are in german though! Doh!


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

told you! they are addicting!: victory:


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## robje29 (Mar 10, 2007)

Darts are great, i have the Oyopoks and have the golden mantella coming soon, as said they are very addictive! did not believe until i got some.


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

are there any toxic plants for mantellas, and dart frogs? thinking of making avery nice planted set up, but these are pretty expensive, are there any toxic plants for american green tree frogs?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

i don't know about toxic but pothos work well for me.


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

google Plants + toxicity and you'll find lots of useful lists of plants that a toxic and nontoxic.Its not really a species specific thing, things that are safe for one are usually safe for all. and visa versa.
Bromeliads, tillandsia and draceana work well and look very nice.


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

sorry forgot to add.. make sure you do LOTS of research on them. Frogs are not like reptiles in alot of ways and arnt cheap either. you gotta do as much research as you would do the 1st time you looked at reptiles. esp for the darts.


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## snakelover (Dec 17, 2006)

how long do tree frogs live for. average!


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

I keep whites tree frogs and they can get up to 21. i do not know about other species, but they are long lived animals


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

there are so many. i worked in a scrap yard in south florida. the dominions live in card board. you guys would have went nuts!


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

Art_Gecko101 said:


> Yes i agree. FBTs are one of the most toxic common pet species, and as they spend such a large proportion of their time in the water, the toxins will no doubt affect the water quality drastically. I would never buy animals, esp ones as delicate as RETFs from someone who mixed with such bad species choices! no wonder some of yours died!


i bought the ones that died from a pet shop. the other five are doing fine, my friend has bred frogs for 20 years and has never had a problem.


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

no offence but ark gecko doesn't seem to realise that books aren't always right. things are being discovered everyday and books aren't written that quickly.


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

id prefer to listen to the sucsessfull breeder of the species for 20yrs then some book


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

look im not getting into this again. 


Just so you know i dont do all my reading from books, the majority is from scientific journals which are published every month or more so are up to date. I appreciate that experiences differ for different people but in my opinon, and i think i speak for the majority of respected breeders, mixing one of the most toxic species (FBT) with one of the most fragile (RETF) is not a sensible mix.


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

well how is it they have been ok for 20 years? and clown tree frogs


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## redeyedanny (Feb 16, 2007)

there is no glass dividers in the jungle artgecko! lol


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## Art_Gecko101 (May 6, 2006)

no but there also a hell of alot more space. and they come from different places


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

i know there are no specific lines drawn as to what species to mix and what not. some say you can, some say you can't. as we've heard from many people on the forum. i normally keep out of it myself. but in this particular situation i feel the need to say that fbt ARE poisonous to other amphibians and that it is a huge risk to mix them with others unless the enclosue is so HUGE that the fbt's never come in contact with the other amphib's. the fact is this discusion could go on for ever like all discusions on mixing. this is just my opinion on this particular situation and i felt the need to make it known :grin1:


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

ps. basky everytime i see your signature i always mean to ask you. whats the diff between fire bellied and yellow bellied, is it literally jus the colour? do they give off the same toxins? do you/can you house them together, thanks, sam:grin1:


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## robje29 (Mar 10, 2007)

i base my decisions on my experience and that of others that have been in the industry for decades, whilst i know you can mix species quite happily although controversially with some, mixing fire bellys is not something i do as as i have water monitoring kits, testing for things like ammonia amongst many others and the levels that build up after a week even with water changes are quite substantial.


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

sam316 said:


> ps. basky everytime i see your signature i always mean to ask you. whats the diff between fire bellied and yellow bellied, is it literally jus the colour? do they give off the same toxins? do you/can you house them together, thanks, sam:grin1:


yeah it is basically there colour the fires are bright green with orange bellies and the yellows are dark green with yellow bellies. ive always kept mine together without any trouble :smile:


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

basky said:


> yeah it is basically there colour the fires are bright green with orange bellies and the yellows are dark green with yellow bellies. ive always kept mine together without any trouble :smile:


 
ok, nice one. i've always wondered lol. i might look into some yellows now then, to keep my fires company. :grin1:


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

yeah i find they don't actually socialise with each other tho, the yellows stay together and the fires stay together. will get a pic of yellow for ya


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)




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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

cheers that would be great. so do they need extra space or should they be ok? :grin1:


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

mine are fine as they have places to hide, ie under the water bowl and in plant pots.


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s84/samlovesjade/P5150028.jpg

this is their tank. reckon it'll be ok if i get a couple of yellows to go with:grin1:


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

hmmmm why did that not upload properly?


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

there we go


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

nice tank! i would have all kinds of ideas for that set up. simple, attractive, utilitarian and versatile!: victory: papa like!


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

what size is the tank?


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

12" wide 13" high and 13" deep. was thinking of makeing a hill of sphagnum moss ?? ant ideas from anyone would be great:grin1:


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

i dont really think it'd be big enough to be honest.


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

ok .................. what would be, cos i can upgrade??


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

ok..................what would be a good size, cos i can always upgrade??


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

woops, x2 posts


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

well i have 4 in a 28inches x 2ft viv but they used to be in a 4x2ft.


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## sam316 (Mar 21, 2007)

ok, fair enough. i'll hold back on geting the yellows then. i should probably upgrade the fires soon anyway. cheers for the help basky :grin1:


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

no probs, good luck :smile:


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## exoticsandtropics (Mar 11, 2007)

well although changing the subject, i would just like to add, my personal opinion if they are from roughly the same area then they'll be fine together. sorry


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## basky (Dec 11, 2006)

exoticsandtropics said:


> well although changing the subject, i would just like to add, my personal opinion if they are from roughly the same area then they'll be fine together. sorry


lol i forgot what this post was about :smile:


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