# Keeping Leos on Large wood chippings



## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

Ok, Ive actually heard enough.

I was in my reptile shop yesterday buying food for my 1 year old leo. This is a *reputable*, *specialist*, *breeding* shop, who specialise in geckos, snakes and inverts. They have many very,very regular customers who have purchased reptiles from them MANY years ago and return for food frequently. Everytime I am in, the woman knows my leo *BY NAME* and asks how she is getting on. So before I continue, I would like to point out that the store are clearly doing something right.

After hearing so much on these forums regarding substrate, I thought I would ask the question while I was in...

I was sold LARGE GUAGE wood chippings with my gecko just over a month ago. I expressed my concern that Id heard on forums about it being deadly and causing impaction. I also mentioned that people say kitchen roll, vinyl and slate.

The reply I got was simple, and unlike the opinions Ive heard in forums, it makes perfect sense.

BABY leos are prone to ingesting anything when feeding. This can lead to serious impaction issues and its a serious no no to use any kind of loose substrate.

ADULT leos live on rock faces where the base substrate is solid, HOWEVER... there are MANY MANY loose objects that a gecko could potentially ingest during feeding, most of which are not digestible. Leos in the wild do not live on kitchen roll.

Providing the wood chips are large enough, a gecko couldnt eat them if it tried. Leopard geckos have superb eyesight and stalk very low to the ground, meaning that they strike in an UPWARD motion. Sand is therefore very likely to be ingested. Pieces of wood that are larger than their head, are not.

Now, All I have to do is sit back and listen to all the "Experts" of the world to come forward and tell me that the rep store are wrong, that theie geckos have dide due to this, and that I should put kitchen roll in the bottom of my viv. The difference is that this time im not going to listen, until my leo shows ANY kind of early sign of impaction.

End of rant. I now feel lots better.


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## 1uk3 (Jun 18, 2010)

I'm with you 100% I have only kept my leos on sand or wood chip never hand a problem 

How many times have you seen a leo in the wild sitting on a bit of lino or kitchen roll its stupid. I love it how people say look at my realistic viv and its lino or newspaper. They will always eat a bit of sand that's normal 


I get fed up to of the it has to be lino or they are gonna die people over react way to much


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## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

how do they strike in an upward motion? do mealworms fly?


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

would hardly call the leo in this thread (http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/lizards/427983-leo-help-update.html) a baby/small leo and the chunks of large woodchip weren't small when passed either :whistling2:

personally I have several points against using woodchip ~ livefood can hide in it, bacterial build-up (like sand bacteria can build up through moisture from feaces as well as livefood poop) unless everything is removed/replaced on a regular basis and is even further away from a 'natural' substrate then tiles or slate :lol2:
pics of natural leo habitat ~ http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/habitat/407571-natural-habitats-4.html#post5884276


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## pinacalada (Jul 21, 2009)

Baby leos should be kept on lino/kitchen roll until it reaches adult size then moved to whatever subtrate you like.
At the end of the day its a view of what people think. I keep mine on sand and have never had problems.
But some people don't want to risk that small percentage of impaction happening.

Just do what you thinks best and not what other peoples opinions are.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

must admit personally woodchip is one substrate i wouldnt touch with a barge pole for any leo no matter what age. at the end of the day if a leo eats a few grains of sand it can pass easy enough but with woodchip theres no danger that is passing easy at all and it would cost an absolute fortune to get it treated through an op or whatever.

a good thing for you to do would be eat a lump of 4x2 then go to the toilet and see how easy thats gonna come out thats if it dosent rip up your insides first.

enjoy your chicken and woodchips for tea tonight mate:whistling2:

and remember the tom sauce


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## pinacalada (Jul 21, 2009)

Woodchip probably isn't the best substrate to go for. I prefer sand.


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

piggly - I keep worms in a feeding dish and dont let them loose in the viv. None have flown to my knowledge

sleepy dee - yawn. you make geckos dull for me.

Kirky - I understand your point, but you have misunderstood mine. If I was eating chips and accidentally got a 4x2 in my mouth, I would spit it out. Also, a 4x2 wouldnt fit it my mouth. It may fit in sleepy dees though as its clearly quite large.

Everyone else, thankyou for your constructive feedback whether it be for or against. At least you are open minded enough to understand my point.


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

The problem with feeding in a dish is.. one or two is guaranteed to get out of the bowl.
I will always find one or two in every viv no matter what bowl I use. 
In wood chips they can bury and hide.

I also wrote a thread on infections in their cloaca caused by plugs as well as foreign bodies from substrates such as sand etc. Although chips may be to big to get into the Cloaca they can be extremely dusty and have sharp broken off pieces. 

I always considered using sand with mine one day, maybe even chips, but I for one now will never risk my animals life in this way after seeing the effects first hand.


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

Gman1980 said:


> piggly - I keep worms in a feeding dish and dont let them loose in the viv. None have flown to my knowledge
> 
> sleepy dee - yawn. you make geckos dull for me.
> 
> ...


What a rude git. We all have our opinions. The object of this forum is to seek the opinions of others and chat about them - not to insult ppl when they give their personally considered opionion. Whether you agree with other ppl or not there is no need to be rude.


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

Gman1980 said:


> sleepy dee - yawn. you make geckos dull for me.


aww what a shame ~ their behavioural patterns, natural habitat and characters make them such charming reptiles well worth actually studying more fully and they clearly under-rated though dangers are posed towards them both in their natural environment and any environment in captivitity ~ at least in captivity we can prevent some of those dangers....... but we are all entitled to voice opinions on habitats



Gman1980 said:


> Also, a 4x2 wouldnt fit it my mouth. It may fit in sleepy dees though as its clearly quite large.


lmfao why thankyou kindly ~ if you wish to resort to more childish insults maybe you would be so kind to send them via pm :lol2:


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## olivine (Feb 5, 2009)

Right, so you attach more weight to the word of a shop whose prime motive is, after all, to make a profit by selling things (like wood chips), than to advice from keepers who have years of experience. Talk about one born every minute....:whistling2:


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## Twiglet (May 6, 2009)

SleepyD said:


> aww what a shame ~ their behavioural patterns, natural habitat and characters make them such charming reptiles well worth actually studying more fully and they clearly under-rated though dangers are posed towards them both in their natural environment and any environment in captivitity ~ at least in captivity we can prevent some of those dangers....... but we are all entitled to voice opinions on habitats
> 
> 
> lmfao why thankyou kindly ~ if you wish to resort to more childish insults maybe you would be so kind to send them via pm :lol2:


Fantastic response!

I have two females living in a viv on sand. The others are all on newspaper/kitchen roll etc. 
I'm paranoid about crypto and similar pathogens and a bit of a hygiene freak. The two leos on sand in a nicely laid out viv went through six months quarantine when I first got them and have already been proven disease free. The others have not been with me quite as long, are breeding or are still in quarantine and I find sand harder to keep scrupulously clean. 
I fail to see how sleepy dees post was boring? 
I DO think that the risk of impaction is a little exagerated BUT especially in babies who have notoriously poor aim (and in my experience, red eyed leos) the risk IS there. 
The main reason for me keeping things sans fancy substrate is for hygiene reasons. 

It's up to the individual to decide if they wish to take the risk or not. Personally I wouldn't use wood chips because if they get damp they go mouldy, I have seen first hand mites come into a collection on wood chips, they can harbor nasty bacteria and live food disappears into it....

I also personally think it looks crap if I'm being totally honest!


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

I can fully understand why a rep shop would want to sell you woodchips - they get repeat sales.
I can't understand why anyone would want to use them. They cost money in repeat sales as they need changing frequently. They can go mouldy. They can smell. They can block the heat from a heatmat. Livefood can hide in them. Even large gauge will contain smaller bits which DO pose an impaction risk. 
Why bother with them when there are far more natural, cheaper and safer substrates available.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Gman1980 said:


> piggly - I keep worms in a feeding dish and dont let them loose in the viv. None have flown to my knowledge
> 
> sleepy dee - yawn. you make geckos dull for me.
> 
> ...


you spitting woodchips out is far easier done than for a gecko like if it gets stuck you can use your hand to take it out,what hand is a gecko gonna use,so all it can do to stop it from choking is swallow it then you get your problems. i just dont get why anyone would use woodchips for anything it surley wouldnt be the most comfortable thing to walk around or lie on. 

and as for your comment about sleepydee i would listen to anything she had to say about leos more than what i would take from any rep shop as im pretty sure she has had far more experience than most rep shops when coming to a certain breeds (in her case leos)


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

kirky1980 said:


> you spitting woodchips out is far easier done than for a gecko like if it gets stuck you can use your hand to take it out,what hand is a gecko gonna use,so all it can do to stop it from choking is swallow it then you get your problems. i just dont get why anyone would use woodchips for anything it surley wouldnt be the most comfortable thing to walk around or lie on.
> 
> and as for your comment about sleepydee i would listen to anything she had to say about leos more than what i would take from any rep shop as im pretty sure she has had far more experience than most rep shops when coming to a certain breeds (in her case leos) so ignore her advice and 1 day when you are really stuck and you really need advice you will need to do some crawling


I totally agree, I have gone to Sleepy Dee on many occasion for help. 
One day you would ask her for help... and if she was anything like me she would tell you were to go!
Fortunatly for most numpties she speaks to, she isnt like me.


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

Sleepy Dee - It wasnt an insult. We have established (as Jools said) that the purpose of these forums is to express opinion. IMO, you always seem to have something to say and Ive never seen you be even semi tolerant of any opinion that differs from your own. Whilst you seem very knowledgable ( which I have respect for) All I have done is state MY opinion, which to me is equally as important as yours or anybody elses.

I agree with what you say about geckos being fascinating, I just find that you make them dull for me. I didnt say I thought they were dull.

Jools - again if you read back over the entire thread, you will find that all I have done is state an opinion and quote some facts and opinions given to me by others. I havent been rude to anybody, I have merely answered their questions, rhetorical and otherwise.

Everyone else - again as I said on my last post, thankyou for taking the time to read and understand, whilst having your own opinions.: victory:


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## luci76 (Jun 22, 2010)

So in Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, do they chop wood chippings up so the Gecko`s can Run around on it???? :lol2:


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

Gman1980 said:


> Jools - again if you read back over the entire thread, you will find that all I have done is state an opinion and quote some facts and opinions given to me by others. I havent been rude to anybody, I have merely answered their questions, rhetorical and otherwise.


Perhaps it was unintended but you certainly did come across as being rude, using an unecessary personal insult.


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## joeyboy (Jul 19, 2008)

meh substrate is your choice in the end, woodchippings... the leo might live it's whole life ok, might die in a few months from impaction. No point discussing if folks minds are made up...


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

PERSONALLY, I wouldn't want to use woodchip in any way shape or form for any leo of any size as there is 'a risk' of impaction.

I prefer not to run that risk and give the nice vet person my hard earned cash if at all possible, or cause unnecessary suffering to an animal, but that is my personal preference.....................

While I know that leos don't live on paper towel/lino etc in the wild, they also don't live in my bedroom in a box of wood,glass and plastic, so that's kind of a moot point.

Also, as 'us guys' can only offer our own experience and knowledge, so can the 'expert' at the shop. Their expertise may be 'better' than mine/Sleepy's/Joolsl' or anyone else's. Or it may not.

Personally (again), I use a mix of common sense/experience/research in my decision making with my animals. I have concluded from that, a loose substrate with leopard gecko's is far from ideal.

I will continue to use 'boring' paper towel for juvies and lino/ceramic tiles for adults............... :2thumb:


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## Slurm (Jun 6, 2008)

dont feed the troll.

it was clearly an intended insult.


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

luci76 said:


> So in Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, do they chop wood chippings up so the Gecko`s can Run around on it???? :lol2:


 
No, they put them on kitchen roll.:Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## 53bird (Sep 30, 2009)

i am shocked any one would put a leo on woodchip big or small, that was my leo in sleepys first post an there were 14 huge (1-2cm square in size) bits of the evil stuff in there :devil:, my vet an me were really shocked how they got out his vent, let alone getting through his body. (the vet had to take the first 6 bits out, an some how the rest got through just) i nearly lost him, an took me months to get him back to health, as a young adult (50g) 11g was a huge loss. i hope the pics from my post will stop any more leos an there owners going through that. it was heartbrakeing all because my local reptile shop told me it was best :devil:

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/lizards/427983-leo-help-update.html


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## 53bird (Sep 30, 2009)

Gman1980 said:


> No, they put them on kitchen roll.:Na_Na_Na_Na:


i dont know why you take the :censor:, my leo at the time was feeding on mealies from a bowl, an never had escaped mealies, why did he eat all that then in two days?????? if i didnt act quickly, i would of lost him. lose substrate really isnt worth it!!!!


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## gecko_steve (May 14, 2008)

What ever you may think impaction from wood chips does happen. 
I purchased my first leo as adult from a local pet store place (before I knew better) and for over a year she was fine. Then she stopped eating. I took her to vets after a few weeks and he x-rayed. There was a piece of wood chip in her stomach that had been there for over year. The vet said it had been going around and around until it had eventually lodged where it could neither move out or around no more causing her to stop eating. He operated and removed the wood chip and she is now fine. I have never kept my leos on anything other than lino/tiles etc and there is no way that she ingested it whilst in my care. 

Often before you realise there's a problem its too late and it will cost you a lot to sort it out (the treatments my leo received cost over £150 and my vet is pretty cheap compared to others).


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

53bird - I wasnt taking the ":censor:" If you read the posts in order you will see that I was merely replying to the idiot that was being sarcastic and said that they dont cut up pieces of wood in the wild and let geckos run around on them. My point being, they dont live on kitchen roll in the wild either.

53bird and geckosteve - Probably the 1st two decent and non insulting opinions I have had on this thread, so thankyou for that. Sorry to hear about both of your stories, I can imagine that must be horrible to go through.

The upshot is this..... I still believe that wood chips under the right circumstances pose a very small risk. However, after reading what has happened to you both I cant risk putting my wee Kima through that. I love her too much. 

I went out this afternoon and bought some vinyl tiles against my better wishes and she is now on them! Its really NOT what I want to put in the bottom of a natural looking viv as I think it ruins the look of the whole setup. However its a small price to pay for ensuring Kimas well being, as the last thing I would ever want is to make an animal unhappy or unwell.: victory:


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## luci76 (Jun 22, 2010)

LOL im getting to like this site. Like it was said they dont live in a wooden box in the wild, the dont have a heat matt or a bulb pumping out heat above there heads & hand picking them up, or live on Paper towel, everyone has got there opinions, BUT in a different enviroment it a total different story, either we stop having these reptiles as pets or we do the best to give them a happy long life, Love & appreciate these creatures. My babies love being handled, & that didnt happen in the wild?? Just my opinion.


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## Komodo king (Aug 24, 2010)

:whistling2: haha owned.


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## 1uk3 (Jun 18, 2010)

luci76 said:


> So in Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, do they chop wood chippings up so the Gecko`s can Run around on it???? :lol2:


It's only cos they have covered the terrian in lino now stops wild geckos getting impacted lol


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## Komodo king (Aug 24, 2010)

and paper towls


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

1uk3 said:


> It's only cos they have covered the terrian in lino now stops wild geckos getting impacted lol


Yeah as they were always suffering from impaction from swallowing all those boulders and rocks, Oh no thats right i forgot they live in deep playsand, silly me.


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## Komodo king (Aug 24, 2010)

:lol2: this forums funny as! im lovin it. :blush: :devil:


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

Komodo king said:


> :lol2: this forums funny as! im lovin it. :blush: :devil:


we aim to please:2thumb:


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

1uk3 said:


> I'm with you 100% I have only kept my leos on sand or wood chip never hand a problem
> 
> How many times have you seen a leo in the wild sitting on a bit of lino or kitchen roll its stupid. I love it how people say look at my realistic viv and its lino or newspaper. They will always eat a bit of sand that's normal
> 
> I get fed up to of the it has to be lino or they are gonna die people over react way to much


Not really 'over reacting' to try and prevent unnecessary suffering though really is it?
As for 'always eat a bit of sand that's normal' - why is it ? As stated before, in the wild they are on a hard rocky surface in the main, with maybe a dusting of sand around. It's unlikely they would 'always eat a bit'. Even assuming they did that in the wild though, there are also snakes, birds of prey, disease, drought, lack of food to contend with, so should we all replicate that in our pets 'captive' set ups too ? 
:bash:



1uk3 said:


> It's only cos they have covered the terrian in lino now stops wild geckos getting impacted lol


Yeah - whereas Afghanistan and Pakistan is littered in 2/3cm chunks of wood too, which was the original substrate mentioned in the thread..............:whistling2:


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

ginnerone said:


> Yeah as they were always suffering from impaction from swallowing all those boulders and rocks, Oh no thats right i forgot they live in deep playsand, silly me.


:2thumb::lol2:


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## 1uk3 (Jun 18, 2010)

ginnerone said:


> Yeah as they were always suffering from impaction from swallowing all those boulders and rocks, Oh no thats right i forgot they live in deep playsand, silly me.


Have you not seen Pakistan recently? The terrain is half sand and half lino ( they eat on the lino side ) and they have clamp lamps placed around and they don't have uv cos that's bad for them 

Just if I had PhotoShop on my phone lol could make a perfect picture lol


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

1uk3 said:


> Have you not seen Pakistan recently? The terrain is half sand and half lino ( they eat on the lino side ) and they have clamp lamps placed around and they don't have uv cos that's bad for them
> 
> Just if I had PhotoShop on my phone lol could make a perfect picture lol


 surley it dangerouse to have all those clamp lamps about during these floods:whistling2:


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

Im genuinely lost. Some geeks clearly take life a little too seriously:whistling2:


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

Gman1980 said:


> Im genuinely lost. Some geeks clearly take life a little too seriously:whistling2:


Care to name the 'Geeks' ? :whistling2:


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## 1uk3 (Jun 18, 2010)

ginnerone said:


> surley it dangerouse to have all those clamp lamps about during these floods:whistling2:


They have covers to keep out the uv light and rain jeez thought you would no this lol


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## swift_wraith (Jan 4, 2009)

Gman1980 said:


> ....I went out this afternoon and bought some vinyl tiles against my better wishes and she is now on them! Its really NOT what I want to put in the bottom of a natural looking viv as I think it ruins the look of the whole setup.


Doesnt have to look unnatural, plenty of stone effect lino & tiles out there. Or even some flint roof slate with play sand in between the joints.

heres one of mine with stone lino...









and I know you said you'd take the shops opinion over anyone here but in my opinion, SleepyDee is one of the most knowledgable people regarding leos on this forum, heck if there was a top 10 in the country, she'd be highly ranked. she lives for her geckos.


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

1uk3 said:


> They have covers to keep out the uv light and rain jeez thought you would no this lol


 My bad


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

ginnerone said:


> Yeah as they were always suffering from impaction from swallowing all those boulders and rocks,


:lol2: like this ~


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

SleepyD said:


> :lol2: like this ~
> 
> image


 Bwahahahahahahahahahaha


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## Gman1980 (Aug 27, 2010)

swift_wraith said:


> Doesnt have to look unnatural, plenty of stone effect lino & tiles out there. Or even some flint roof slate with play sand in between the joints.
> 
> heres one of mine with stone lino...
> image
> ...


Its not so much that Ive taken the shops opinion over and above anyone elses, Its just that as a new member Im becoming increasingly let down by the number of know it alls and supposed experts. I have read several of " sleepy dee" posts, and without meaning any disrespect I find them a little boring and a bit condescending for people new to the hobby like me.

Theres a certain way of sharing knowledge with other people. Maths teachers for example are notoriously bad at conveying information, yet they know everything there is to know about maths....if you see what I mean?

Anyway, Thankyou for your reply! I got the first lino I could get before the shops closed, but Ive been looking at stone effect ones in BandQ and they look better than I thought, so am going to swap to a better one when I get time.


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

Funny enough... 
A pal/local reptile vet and another vet that works with him did a talk on reptiles at our local rep group.
He said the most common issue he has with reptiles is impaction from sand and wood chips! Lately its been more so than MBD.
He actually had a leo who has swallowed a 10p coin and get it pretty much most of the to the last chamber of the stomac!!!
Obviously surgery was required... 
but who said they couldnt eat things like big wood chips? :whistling2:


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

swift_wraith said:


> Doesnt have to look unnatural, plenty of stone effect lino & tiles out there. Or even some flint roof slate with play sand in between the joints.
> 
> heres one of mine with stone lino...
> image
> ...


OMG... that cricket has died from impaction from your substrate too :gasp:


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## swift_wraith (Jan 4, 2009)

Get cheap single ply lino, the stuff with the bonded backing can release vapours when heated.

Yes there are some "know it alls" on here but theres also a wealth of information. My opinion is to read several care sheets etc and then make your own opinion.

And I can see what you mean about sleepy's posts regarding leos but she takes a more scientific approach towards her pets when it comes to studying them. And at the end of the day she's put months/years of study in these posts of hers. If anything, she cares about her animals more than she does her hubby.

ps... sleepy, you can send the cheque to the usual place


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## _Ben_ (Feb 27, 2010)

Gman1980 said:


> I went out this afternoon and bought some vinyl tiles against my better wishes and she is now on them! Its really NOT what I want to put in the bottom of a natural looking viv as I think it ruins the look of the whole setup. However its a small price to pay for ensuring Kimas well being, as the last thing I would ever want is to make an animal unhappy or unwell.: victory:


You kind of just made the point that is the reason behind all loose substrate used, its purely to make it look better for use. The leo doesnt care what its on, aslong as its needs are catered for, heat, hides, food etc

But saying that you can get some pretty nice looking lino, or even better get some sandstone type slabs (added bonus of helipng keep your leo's claws under control).


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

Lino makes a good substrate IMO. It can look very natural - although frankly that is not the most important consideration for me. Click on pic to enlarge


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

swift_wraith said:


> And I can see what you mean about sleepy's posts regarding leos but she takes a more scientific approach towards her pets when it comes to studying them. And at the end of the day she's put months/years of study in these posts of hers. *If anything, she cares about her animals more than she does her hubby.*


LMFAO shhh he pays the electricity bill :lol2:
I know I can come across as abrupt ~ an old fuddyduddy is probably one of the politer descriptions of late ~ however I at least always remain polite and judging by the emails/pm's received I am not all bad 



> ps... sleepy, you can send the cheque to the usual place


what again?! thought you'd been busy bouncing the last one :lol2:


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## daveplymouth (May 26, 2009)

This argument about things not being natural is complete :censor: a leopard gecko does not have a heat mat or a water bowl or dusted mealworms in the wild either. but as we decide to keep them in captivity its up to us to give them what they need the best way we can. Wood chippings for a leo is stupid is probably the furthest substrate away from what a leo has in the wild and as stated it can cause problems it splinters also which can cause cuts and grazes. Sand imo is ok aslong as the leo is kept correctly i.e heat supplements and food etc. the leo will eat bits of sand but if its kept correctly should pass it fine. The best looking substrate imo is slate it holds heat well and is easy to clean plus it looks natural.


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## mjp1pink (May 3, 2008)

I can't get the video to play????

__________________


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## luci76 (Jun 22, 2010)

Wood Chippings
Wood Chippings
Wood Chippings
Yer Yer Yer LOL
Ha makes me laugh, in the end if my Mikka had a splinter in her food, im sure she would love me to pull it out, I have never thought of using wood chippings, but if its fine with the Gecko`s its fine with me, everyone got there own opinion, but gee wizz RFUK we got so firey people here. Chill out & enjoy your reptiles.


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

luci76 said:


> Wood Chippings
> Wood Chippings
> Wood Chippings
> Yer Yer Yer LOL
> Ha makes me laugh, in the end if my Mikka had a splinter in her food, im sure she would love me to pull it out, I have never thought of using wood chippings, but if its fine with the Gecko`s its fine with me, everyone got there own opinion, but gee wizz RFUK we got so firey people here. Chill out & enjoy your reptiles.


Sooooo.... you havent read the thread then :lol2:


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## Kalouda (Sep 1, 2010)

jools said:


> Lino makes a good substrate IMO. It can look very natural - although frankly that is not the most important consideration for me. Click on pic to enlarge
> View attachment 21785


What lino is that? Like colour or whatever pattern, I think it looks natural to what their actual enviroment is like, may not feel natural but who cares it's a safe n happy leo.


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

Kalouda said:


> What lino is that? Like colour or whatever pattern, I think it looks natural to what their actual enviroment is like, may not feel natural but who cares it's a safe n happy leo.


Hiya - I just bought a remnant from my local carpet shop. Sorry, I don't know what the colour is. Cost me £5 and did 8 of my vivs. 
I am sure it feels more natural for my Leos than woodchip does tho


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## Kalouda (Sep 1, 2010)

Ah, well I'd have to have a look for some rocky, beige looking lino's. Yeah it will feel more natural than woodchip lol, who ever heard of wood chips in Afghanistan.


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