# Vets killed my rabbit



## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

I went to the vets yesterday with my rabbit who was limping on one leg so she was given anti inflammatorys and some pain relief and wanted to see her today

went back today and she was given an injection and the vet said she will give her a bit extra to make sure she lasts to monday

20 mins later just after i get home she crawls into the corner and dies and therefore im convinced the injection was an overdose and the vet killed her.

this has really angered me now as if i just ignored the problem she would be in pain but she would be alive! whats the point trying to be a responsible pet owner if this happens.

now what are my rights? im off up there tomorrow to complain as they charged me altogether for the 2 visits £101 and have killed my baby


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## connor 1213 (Apr 6, 2009)

take them to court


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## leo19 (Mar 16, 2008)

well first you need to find out why the rabbit died, it seems that the most likely reason is the vet but you need to be sure! sorry for your loss


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## Darbz (Mar 22, 2009)

Sorry to hear that 

You should go back and ask the vet what he gave your rabbit, and in what dosage, and maybe see if you can get some money back..Sometimes animals don't respond well to drugs, it may have been a complete accident or something beyond the vet's control, or it could be malpractice..but you need to get more details first.


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## saxon (Feb 26, 2007)

I would have a different vet carry a PM and then you would know for certain whether it was the medication that resulted in her death.

What did the vet say was wrong with the rabbit?????

The medication should be on your invoice/receipt.


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

saxon said:


> I would have a different vet carry a PM and then you would know for certain whether it was the medication that resulted in her death.
> 
> What did the vet say was wrong with the rabbit?????
> 
> The medication should be on your invoice/receipt.



no can do with pm, ive buryd her now, others may say i shouldnt have done so however my baby needs to be put to rest.

the vet didnt know what was up with the leg, said she prob kicked out at something and caught her leg wrong, nothing was broken


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## sophs87 (Jan 25, 2009)

I doubt you have a leg to stand on then since you arnt getting a pm done. Sorry for your loss tho! what vets was it? since your near me so i dont ever use it xx
R.I.P bunny xxxxx


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## Marinam2 (Sep 4, 2007)

Was she injected with a pain killer??

Marina


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

Marinam2 said:


> Was she injected with a pain killer??
> 
> Marina


yeah bayrtrill and a pain killer was what she was given when i was there


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## Darbz (Mar 22, 2009)

Not getting a PM done is, of course, your choice. But without one you won't know the COD, so it would be a bit unfair to blame the vet and/or practice. 

not saying you would, just feel I should point it out..


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

Darbz said:


> Not getting a PM done is, of course, your choice. But without one you won't know the COD, so it would be a bit unfair to blame the vet and/or practice.
> 
> not saying you would, just feel I should point it out..


yeah however for a sore leg/limp is not something thats life threatening.

she died soon after the injection at the vets so its sussed.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Sorry for your loss
To be sure how she had died they would need to do a pm. I would ask to see a different vet too and see if the dosage of meds was right for her. Ive never heard of a vet giving a bit extra tbh


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## Darbz (Mar 22, 2009)

Mush said:


> yeah however for a sore leg/limp is not something thats life threatening.
> 
> she died soon after the injection at the vets so its sussed.


 
If there was no break, a sore leg could be secondary to something else, 
So the fact that your rabbit died after an injection _Could _be circumstantial. Or it could not be..


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## bosshogg (Nov 19, 2006)

sorry to here about your rabbit but without a PM you cant blame the vet it could be heat/stress something else, it has been very hot today and with the stress of vets and injections it might have been to much for her.


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

bosshogg said:


> sorry to here about your rabbit but without a PM you cant blame the vet it could be heat/stress something else, it has been very hot today and with the stress of vets and injections it might have been to much for her.



my rabbits are house rabbits and the flat is very cool, so its definatly not heat or stress.

She wont have caught anything from outside and i know for a fact the vets killed her, she was fine at the vets other than her leg and now shes dead


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## Amalthea (Oct 2, 2007)

But there is no way to prove that without a PM.


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## mandi1234 (Mar 13, 2009)

sorry about your rabbit hun. i dont have much faith in vets either, my dog died years ago when it could quite easily have still been here, if the vet had xrayed him. but like most people say, a PM would answer your question.........................


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

oh my god claire im so sorry for your loss!!!! i just cant believe the lovely rabbit we saw yesterday is no longer with us 
unfortunately vets cant get it right all the time, just like doctors. I think you should speak to them and ask about the meds that were given, ask of any risks and ask why they felt it neccessary to give her extra. Im not siding with the vet hun but you did say that the leg was quite a sudden onset and you didnt know what it was so she could have been brewing something that the vets missed or didnt check for. Unfortunately without a necropsy the cause of her death will never truly be known

if you need to pm me for any reason feel free, and you can text my number any time

rip baby


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## 9Red (May 30, 2008)

Mush said:


> my rabbits are house rabbits and the flat is very cool, so its definatly not heat or stress.
> 
> She wont have caught anything from outside and i* know for a fact the vets killed her*, she was fine at the vets other than her leg and now shes dead


I can appreciate you're very upset and want to blame someone for the loss of your rabbit, but to say that the vets 'killed' her implies that they did it deliberately - a premeditated 'murder' if you like, which isn't particularly fair on the vet as clearly they were acting in the rabbits' best interest by administering the pain killer and anti-inflammatory. 

It is possible that the vet made an error that ultimately resulted in your rabbits death - it is equally possible that your rabbit had a fatal reaction to the drug, was suffering from an unseen condition, or was too stressed by her discomfort and the trip to the vets, all of which may have been the reason behind her dying. Unfortunately without a PM you will never know.

I would suggest that if you honestly believe your rabbit died due to malpractice, to let the practice manager and the RCVS know in writing and then switch to another surgery. I would urge you not to go ranting to everyone about vets killing animals as you can't prove it and could end up damaging the reputation of the vet unfoundedly.


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

Mush said:


> my rabbits are house rabbits and the flat is very cool, so its definatly not heat *or stress*.


You simply can NOT rule out stress, even moving to a different room can severely stress a rabbit, let alone going to the vets twice, having 2 injections, different people, smells of different animals etc. It could have well been a heart attack, also.



> She wont have caught anything from outside


How can you be so sure? 



> and i know for a fact the vets killed her,


Erm, without a necropsy, no you don't and never will.



> she was fine at the vets other than her leg and now shes dead


Hmm...
Lets see:
Limping 
Vets = stress
Injection of baytril = stress
Strange animals, smells and people = stress
Home = stress
Vets-2 = stress
Injection of baytril-2 = stress, possible over dose
Strange people, animals and smells = stress
Home = stress

If you have the receipt, it should tell you what she was injected with and how much. Could you post that up along with aprox. weight?

I'm not siding but it's not fair to blame the vet when you have no idea what the COD was...


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

LoveForLizards said:


> You simply can NOT rule out stress, even moving to a different room can severely stress a rabbit, let alone going to the vets twice, having 2 injections, different people, smells of different animals etc. It could have well been a heart attack, also.
> 
> 
> How can you be so sure?
> ...



im sorry but i think your out of order

i have lost my pet, my rabbit who i love very dearly and ur turning things against me

maybe i should be one those selfish arseholes who dont bother taking their animals to vets from now on??? save me some money aye?? but no i gave a shit about my pets and care for them dearly.

you dont have the slightest idea on my animals or how theyre kept so shove off and have some respect.


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

Mush said:


> im sorry but i think your out of order
> 
> i have lost my pet, my rabbit who i love very dearly and ur turning things against me
> 
> ...


Sorry you feel that way, but I was just pointing some thing out. I am truly sorry you lost your pet, but it is annoying me that you blame the vets when you have no idea if it was or not. I am not saying you should be a "selfish arsehole who dont bother taking their animals to vets from now on", all I said was that you don't know what happened and its not fair to blame the vets and I pointed out some possible CODs. I have the utmost respect for anybody who deserves it, but I didn't think I had to sugar-coat it to put my point out there.


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## rach666 (Dec 12, 2006)

im really sorry to hear about your baby hun,it is very strange what has happened dont blame yourself as it isnt your fault you did what you could


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## saxon (Feb 26, 2007)

I've just thought..
Was this the doe who has just had the litter???

If it were maybe there had been something ot do witht he delivery hat affected her.
Rabbits will hide illness to rear their young.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

I've come on here for the first time in Yonks soley to respond to this, I am shocked at you guys.

Nugget was a dearly loved rabbit and we are very sad to see her go - especially in such a manner. For those screaming PM we considered it to be far more important that she should be laid to rest in a dignified manner rather than cut up, prodded and then burned (which, lets face it would be what happened if a PM took place)

Mush came on to ask if she had any rights regarding this situation. We know that COD cannot be determined without the PM, and therefore we cannot actually prove the vet to be at fault, however we are both convinced that the vet is to blame.

Mush was so concerned about this rabbits health that she actually came to my work to get me so that I could take her, and the rabbit to the last emergency vets appointment. Nugget was given a painkiller, anti-biotics and was really doing well again by that evening, although still not quite her cheeky self she was eating and demanding affection. She was almost back to normal this morning and was far more like herself at the vets than yesterday. 20 mins after her injection Nugget was dead - co-incidene? I think not! :bash:

And Lovefor lizards, to answer your point about the outside. Nugget was a house rabbit - she has never been outside in her life with us!

If anyone else feels like shouting their mouth off then this is not the place to do it!!!


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

Oh hun dont take any notice. Of course you are upset, your rabbits just died. Its so easy when you are grief stricken to make quick decisions on burial and its understandable, its your much loved pet

Go to the vets tomorrow and find out whether the dose given was the correct amount and if there could have been any side effects. Set your mind at rest by getting as much info as possible so it can never happen again. Big Hugs ((( )))

If you have a receipt with what was given then google the name of the drug followed by rabbit and see what it brings up. It should tell you the recommended dose and any side effects


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

saxon said:


> I've just thought..
> Was this the doe who has just had the litter???
> 
> If it were maybe there had been something ot do witht he delivery hat affected her.
> Rabbits will hide illness to rear their young.



no tht was the mini rex poppy, nugget is a year old french lop unbred from


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## repkid (Nov 30, 2007)

I know :censor: all about rabbits but you cannot blame the vet without proof. Yes maybe it was his/hers fault but it could just be that that particular rabbit was alergic to whatever it was given. You don't have a leg to stand on without proof.

Sorry for your loss though


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

So basically the OP has come on here to lynch a vet and for everyone to say awww.

Well i`m afraid you are out of order saying a vet has killed your rabbit and if i was the vet in question i would be seeking legal redress against YOU for posting this nonsense on a public forum.

You have no proof whatsoever the vet killed your rabbit .

You profess to care for animals yet keep your rabbits in a HOUSE for all their lives meaning they never get to feel the sun on their backs or the smell of free flowing fresh air.

I think a reality check is in order here.


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

repkid said:


> I know :censor: all about rabbits but you cannot blame the vet without proof. Yes maybe it was his/hers fault but it could just be that that particular rabbit was alergic to whatever it was given. You don't have a leg to stand on without proof.
> 
> Sorry for your loss though


well she had the drugs the day before with no issues so it was an od.



darwengray said:


> So basically the OP has come on here to lynch a vet and for everyone to say awww.
> 
> Well i`m afraid you are out of order saying a vet has killed your rabbit and if i was the vet in question i would be seeking legal redress against YOU for posting this nonsense on a public forum.
> 
> ...


first of all your attitude stinks worse than weeks old roadkill.

id love to see what legal experience you have with respect to your above comment as i have not mentioned the vet whatsoever, i asked where i stand etc so maybe you should actually know what your talking about first before you write it... and before you ask i have 4 years plus legal experience.

so let me get this you i bet are the sort that thinks its fine to have a rabbit stuffed in a hutch on their own all their life aye? like the majority of rabbits are kept? mine have their own room with their own toys and everything they ever need so maybe you should get a reality check at the same time you go and start learning to know what your talking about.

get a grip and jog on


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

darwengray said:


> So basically the OP has come on here to lynch a vet and for everyone to say awww.
> 
> Well i`m afraid you are out of order saying a vet has killed your rabbit and if i was the vet in question i would be seeking legal redress against YOU for posting this nonsense on a public forum.


And which vet would that be? You will note that no vet name has ever been given so no liable/slander



> You have no proof whatsoever the vet killed your rabbit .


Whilst that may be true if you read the above you will see the reasoning we have for believing this to be the case



> You profess to care for animals yet keep your rabbits in a HOUSE for all their lives meaning they never get to feel the sun on their backs or the smell of free flowing fresh air.


So what you are saying is that Animals deserve to be outside in their natural environment, rather than in houses right?

So why do you keep animals then? Surely all your animals should therefore be outside enjoying "the sun on their backs or the smell of free flowing fresh air"



> I think a reality check is in order here.


Yes, Quite right - I think you should take a reality check and realise what utter rubbish you are spouting. A much loved animal has passed away and regardless of how how that occured some respect is due to her memory.

Btw, refer to my previous posting where I said this was not the place to be shooting your mouth off - so unless you have anything constructive to bring then kindly shut up.


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## rach666 (Dec 12, 2006)

this is getting ridiculous ! the poor girl has lost her beloved pet in truley weird circumstances and all you lot can to is rally togeth like a bloody lynch mob.... no she didnt have a pm done,it was her choice yes she will never know what happened maybe it was the vet or maybe it was stress and just a coincedence even so give the girl a break.

p.s bunnies thrive as house rabbits,just becuase there not kept in a damp hutch at the bottom of the garden doesnt mean there any less happier:whistling2:


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## MistressSadako (Jan 17, 2009)

Do you know which drug he "gave a little bit extra" of?


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

hope your ok hun. so sorry about nugget. ignore all the crap on here, people love to chat about stuff they never dealt with :devil:
i had a rabbit with middle ear infection that died same night it went to vet
and its heartbreaking x x


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## drake140990 (Jun 4, 2009)

p.s bunnies thrive as house rabbits,just becuase there not kept in a damp hutch at the bottom of the garden doesnt mean there any less happier:whistling2:[/QUOTE]

but i thought the art of keeping pets was to keep them as happy as possible but provide a safe and natural environment eg a rabbit grass and room to dig or a snake heat mat hidey holes and trees if its a tree snake and heavy substrate if it burrows ?????? agree


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## mmcdermid (Feb 26, 2009)

sayin rabbits cant be kept indoors is just stupid!! if this is the case then everyone, release your rare and endangered 4ft woodenbox lizards back to the wild now


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

*p.s bunnies thrive as house rabbits,just becuase there not kept in a damp hutch at the bottom of the garden doesnt mean there any less happier:whistling2:[/quote]*

i agree half the rabbits in hutches outside get ignored...out of sight out of mind from what ive seen


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

drake140990 said:


> p.s bunnies thrive as house rabbits,just becuase there not kept in a damp hutch at the bottom of the garden doesnt mean there any less happier:whistling2:


but i thought the art of keeping pets was to keep them as happy as possible but provide a safe and natural environment eg a rabbit grass and room to dig or a snake heat mat hidey holes and trees if its a tree snake and heavy substrate if it burrows ?????? agree[/quote]


ah yes i seen some of those wild snake heatmats all the time!!!!

my rabbits get tonnes of greens throughout the day so they can graze, they have a whole room to themselves and in the evenings have the run of the flat, a hell of a lot more room than any damn rabbit run could provide


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## bosshogg (Nov 19, 2006)

lizardloverrach said:


> *p.s bunnies thrive as house rabbits,just becuase there not kept in a damp hutch at the bottom of the garden doesnt mean there any less happier:whistling2:*


i agree half the rabbits in hutches outside get ignored...out of sight out of mind from what ive seen 

[/quote]

but even house rabbits like to go out in the garden and eat grass and sun bathe


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## rach666 (Dec 12, 2006)

bosshogg said:


> i agree half the rabbits in hutches outside get ignored...out of sight out of mind from what ive seen


but even house rabbits like to go out in the garden and eat grass and sun bathe[/quote]


yeh thats true my bunnies loved sitting in the pen outside when the weather is nice:flrt:


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

bosshogg said:


> i agree half the rabbits in hutches outside get ignored...out of sight out of mind from what ive seen


but even house rabbits like to go out in the garden and eat grass and sun bathe[/quote]


bit like all the natural sunlight lizards get aye....


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## drake140990 (Jun 4, 2009)

> ah yes i seen some of those wild snake heatmats all the time!!!!


this is the bit where you use your head and replicate the natural environment

I just think its wrong to keep an animal indoors, when they should be outside digging which they cant do on carpet or laminate flooring. I have had rabbits that have had the full run of the garden which is better for them. 
Was the rabbit house trained as I dont recall seeing any litter trays in the wild

Its just my opinion thats all


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

oh for gods sake give it a rest. her rabbit has just died, shes upset, pissed off and generally angry. bit of support wouldnt go a miss
yeah maybe she's blaming the vet and mayne wasnt vets fault, i know ive looked for someone to blame when shocked and angry


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## Super-Sadist (Jun 10, 2009)

=/ wow, horrible ...I guess there's only one thing for it...
...you're going to have to kill them


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

drake140990 said:


> this is the bit where you use your head and replicate the natural environment
> 
> I just think its wrong to keep an animal indoors, when they should be outside digging which they cant do on carpet or laminate flooring. I have had rabbits that have had the full run of the garden which is better for them.
> Was the rabbit house trained as I dont recall seeing any litter trays in the wild
> ...


and what animals do you keep? we are ALL guilty of keeping animals that should all be wild.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

I'd just point out that for those living in a city without a garden, or a small open garden its far safer to have the critters inside.

Wasn't there someone on her who had to rehome because she kept on finding her animals outside with brutal things done to them?


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## drake140990 (Jun 4, 2009)

i am not saying there is anything wrong with keeping animals, I am saying that if you are going to keep them then you should be responsible enough to try to make their life and habitat as natural as possible
but for the record i have 1 corn snake and 2 tokay geckos

I have worked in a pet shop and left half way through my work experience as i felt the conditions were appalling ie. leaving rabbits in their own faeces is not good and not taking them to the vets when needed was not appropriate

I am not here to argue with anyone and I feel for the women who has lost her rabbit, it is always sad to lose a beloved companion


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## leggy (Jan 18, 2007)

Gosh poor bunny  I hope you get to the bottom of this when you see the vet. RIP bunny Let us know how you get on: victory:


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

Mush said:


> well she had the drugs the day before with no issues so it was an od.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It wouldn`t take much to put two and two together for anyone that lives in your area .
Rabbits don`t need toys they need fresh air and sun when is the last time you saw a toymaster shop in a field .
What you are doing is downright cruel keepig a mammal permanently imprisoned in a house.

This is about you and what you want/need not what your charges needs are.

I`ve no doubt you mean well but you are way off beam when knowing what you animals desire i bet everyone of your rabbits would prefer to live in an outdoor hutch let out occasionally to taste the outdoors than be kept indoors all the time .

I may be wrong but so may you as i know that neither of us speak rabbit.


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

catflea said:


> I'd just point out that for those living in a city without a garden, or a small open garden its far safer to have the critters inside.
> 
> Wasn't there someone on her who had to rehome because she kept on finding her animals outside with brutal things done to them?


 
Well perhaps if no garden is available then rabbits are a bad choice .

Sometimes situations dictate that you can`t alway have what you want.


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## MrsP (Apr 13, 2008)

Mush phoned me earlier to tell me what had happened and to ask for my advice. I've got one rabbit, and know very little about them to be honest, mine was a rescue and he lives outside in a hutch with an attached run. I've known people with indoor rabbits and they've always seemed fine, and I've seen Mush's rabbits and how she keeps them and they are lovely and display happy rabbit behaviour. What she's not said is she does take them outside in a run when the weather is good, she just has to share a garden so can't leave them out there all of the time.

Anyway I suggested to Mush that she should, if she wanted to take up an issue with the vet, get a pm from another vet and take it from there. She chose not to do so and I can understand why really. We lost my beloved African Grey a few months ago and could have had a pm done, but I honestly didn't want to drag myself through it any more. All of my other parrots were (and still are) fine so I knew it wasn't environmental, and really didn't want to drag out the misery of losing Hector so I chose to bury him and move on.

To really make a claim against a vet I think Mush should have had a pm done, I don't think she can do much without that, but she can still go in to the vet and ask the questions.

Give the girl a break.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

darwengray said:


> It wouldn`t take much to put two and two together for anyone that lives in your area .


Oh yeah, thats because theres only two or three vets in the whole of the Southampton area right? :bash:

Theres no clues anywhere in there as to where the vet in question is, what its called etc..


> Rabbits don`t need toys they need fresh air and sun when is the last time you saw a toymaster shop in a field .
> What you are doing is downright cruel keepig a mammal permanently imprisoned in a house.


On that basis its also cruel to keep any animal in the house! All animals are living beings that have needs - the fact that they have their needs met indoors as opposed to outside does not change the fact they have their needs met!



> I`ve no doubt you mean well but you are way off beam when knowing what you animals desire i bet everyone of your rabbits would prefer to live in an outdoor hutch let out occasionally to taste the outdoors than be kept indoors all the time .
> 
> I may be wrong but so may you as i know that neither of us speak rabbit.


So how many years experience of keeping Rabbits do you have? I bet its a whole load less than Mush! In my limited experience of the little blighters they make it pretty damned obvious if they aren't happy.

Now kindly jog on before spouting any more rubbish on this thread


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

rach666 said:


> but even house rabbits like to go out in the garden and eat grass and sun bathe


 
yeh thats true my bunnies loved sitting in the pen outside when the weather is nice:flrt:[/quote]

yes thats great but they have already stated they have never been outside .

just plain wrong in my opinion.


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## R.E.C.S (May 13, 2009)

right then, after reading all this, it would seem you arnt getting the answer to the question you asked in the first place.

as far as your legal rights are concerned, you may not have a case as your not having a PM therefore no cause of death can be established, dont take this wrong but as far as the vet would be concerned you could have killed it or may even be lying about its death as you have since buried the rabbit.

as far as your dealing with the vet in a none legal way you can approach them and tell them what happened, wait for there responce and act upon it accordingly.

if it were me in your current situation, your only power is knowledge.
you will need the following

your rabbits weight.
the drugs that were given. and there quantities.

most drugs especially baytril (sp) is given by weight, baytril is given to boids for respiratory infections (if memory serves) and is given by the weight of the snake.

pain killers will possibly also be gven by weight. 
now if it was the pain killers that he gave extra of you need to work out how much extra he gave and at what point it may become fatal, all this info will be on the net somewhere.

pain killers in small pets can, if given in high enough dose cause the animal to goto sleep and just never wake up.

so my next question here would have to be was there any seizure, or weird behavior or did the rabbit just goto sleep??

rabbits are extremely well adapted to hiding major, illnesses. its how they survive in the wild, survival of the fittest and all that.

i hope you get the answers you are looking for, but like i say without a PM you will be hard pushed to get solid answers.


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

darwengray said:


> It wouldn`t take much to put two and two together for anyone that lives in your area .
> Rabbits don`t need toys they need fresh air and sun when is the last time you saw a toymaster shop in a field .
> What you are doing is downright cruel keepig a mammal permanently imprisoned in a house.
> 
> ...


does your nile monitor get all its requirements met in a natural way? or all your other animals? how many hours of natural sunlight do they get? access to natural water not the shite you get from the tap etc? are your reps surrounded by wood and glass? or do they roam free in your garden? just out of curiousity like


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## gtm (Jan 23, 2008)

The only way the OP is going to be able to take this forward is by getting a PM done by an independent vet. You need evidence before you can go back to the vet & argue he was negligent. It's that simple.

Sorry about the rabbit by the way.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

darwengray said:


> Well perhaps if no garden is available then rabbits are a bad choice .
> 
> Sometimes situations dictate that you can`t alway have what you want.


In that situation any animal that NEEDS outdoor space would be a bad idea. However rabbits don't. They are perfectly happy indoors given the correct environment (which Mush's little critters do)

Besides which, there are a huge amount of risks leaving rabbits outside. Disease (mixy comes to mind) and predators they are much safer inside.


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## mattm (Jul 18, 2008)

A PM would have been the best option, and certainly if you wanted any chance at taking legal action it would have given you more than a leg to stand on if the results came back as it being the medication.

Unfortunately without one I wouldn't be convinced it was the medication that did it (or at least not that alone). Most vets deal with rabbits on a daily basis and have a lot of experience with them, and most wouldn't risk giving an amount that would make a pet ill let alone cause death, because they just have too much to lose.

But there are unfortunately always exceptions.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Mush said:


> yeah however for a sore leg/limp is not something thats life threatening.
> 
> she died soon after the injection at the vets so its sussed.


 how do you know the sore leg didn't have some kind of internal or other cause? Basically since you are unwilling to have a PM done, you have no way of proving whether the vet was or was not negligent and if you have no proof, you have no case. That's basic law.


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

darwengray said:


> It wouldn`t take much to put two and two together for anyone that lives in your area .
> Rabbits don`t need toys they need fresh air and sun when is the last time you saw a toymaster shop in a field .
> What you are doing is downright cruel keepig a mammal permanently imprisoned in a house.
> 
> ...



so in your opinion locked up in a hutch and OCCASIONALY let out is better than having free roam of several rooms????

the toys are rabbit toys u numpty, not from toy master... ever heard of them??? They have play tunnels and tents and the bendy log huts.

Mrsp this rabbit hasnt been out, the smaller ones have however been in the run when i was in.

She was a giant rabbit and therefore was better to keep her indoors where she had more room rather than in a run restricted


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

catflea said:


> Oh yeah, thats because theres only two or three vets in the whole of the Southampton area right? :bash:
> 
> Theres no clues anywhere in there as to where the vet in question is, what its called etc..
> On that basis its also cruel to keep any animal in the house! All animals are living beings that have needs - the fact that they have their needs met indoors as opposed to outside does not change the fact they have their needs met!
> ...


TBH with you mate you are now coming across as a bit of a wet shirt ,a lap dog to the OP i feel she has been banged to rights.

Her rabbit keeping methods are suspect ,i accept they may look happy but have you asked them?

Rabbits belong outdoors ,even if it means in a hutch.


I accept she was upset but her post was out of order .


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## mattm (Jul 18, 2008)

I'm afraid just because the rabbit died soon after the injection that does not mean the situation is sussed at all, hardly conclusive evidence when it could have been a number of things. Perhaps there was an underlying problem and the stress of having an injection tipped the bunny over the edge?? We don't know without an autopsy being carried out...

I think keeping rabbits indoors or outdoors is purely a matter of opinion. They have succesfully been kept in both situations with good results and both have their own pros and cons. Mine are personally outside but that's not because I don't agree with house rabbits!


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## Scaley.Jade (Jun 9, 2008)

And getting personal is achieving what exactly ? 
The OP chose not to have a PM done that was her choice, she was asking what you guys thought of her rights not wether you thought she should of kept her rabbit in a hutch outside!


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## ShaneLuvsMonitors (Sep 27, 2008)

darwengray said:


> TBH with you mate you are now coming across as a bit of a wet shirt ,a lap dog to the OP i feel she has been banged to rights.
> 
> Her rabbit keeping methods are suspect ,i accept they may look happy but have you asked them?
> 
> ...


So was yours mate. Your giving an opinion without any actual facts to base it on & attacking the OP directly. 
When shes had a horrible loss and quite frankly is entitled to rant and rave all she likes. 

We keep an awful lot of rabbits some indoors some outdoors and i have to say the ones that were kept indoors were just as happy as the outdoors. 

We also know a fair few peeps who keep ther rabbits indoors without any adverse affects to there health or happiness in fact a few have lived longer than outside rabbits 

OH yes and one other thing every animal kept in captivity doesnt get anywhere near what it would in the wild you know the freedom to go anywhere to get run over to eat what it wants do what it wants, the freedom to starve to death, to be cold, disease ridden, flea ridden and eaten by god knows what... 



Sorry for the loss of Nugget.


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## MrsP (Apr 13, 2008)

I've known people with lovely indoor rabbits.

Not for me though. I can't be doing with the shit. And the rabbits if I'm honest.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

darwengray said:


> TBH with you mate you are now coming across as a bit of a wet shirt ,a lap dog to the OP i feel she has been banged to rights.
> 
> Her rabbit keeping methods are suspect ,i accept they may look happy but have you asked them?
> 
> ...


I thought it was fairly common knowledge on here that I am the OPs other half? Also, I am not your mate.

I think its bloody rich that from your high tower you can state how Mush looks after her animals whereas I only have to look around to see how well they are looked after (and how happy they are) - I would point out that they are very much HER pets and I feed them occaisionaly but thats about it.

Did you know that Rabbits are actually one of the most neglected pets? no? Theres a suprise then! They tend to be stuck in hutches with the out of sight out of mind mentality in the rain, snow, storms etc. How would you like to live in a box thats about 3 times longer than you are, with a front thats open to the elements? Oh, and you might be let out for an hour or two twice a week (sounds a bit like a prison cell to me)

All of the animals in this house have far more than they could ever need. As many others on this thread have said rabbits thrive indoors and the little guys have areas they can dig about, chew etc without having to worry about the outside nasties.

As for banged to rights, don't make me laugh! Banged to rights for what? Because as far as I can tell you are screaming about how cruel it is to keep animals indoors - whilst you keep your reptiles in what are essentially boxes - while the rabbits have areas of the house to themselves!

Before spouting any more bile about how cruelly these animals are being kept I'd recommend reading up on what they actually need and how to keep them and then seeing how they actually live here before commenting further.


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

Rabbit's have a behaviour known as a binky this is what they do when they are happy. I have an indoor rabbit and he is clearly a very happy bunny as he is always zooming around the living room binky like mad.

As others have said without a PM no way of knowing 100%, but googling the wieght to dosage should give your an idea of whether the rabbit was given too much.

I am very sorry to hear about your rabbit.:grouphug:


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

ShaneLuvsMonitors said:


> So was yours mate. Your giving an opinion without any actual facts to base it on & attacking the OP directly.
> When shes had a horrible loss and quite frankly is entitled to rant and rave all she likes.
> 
> We keep an awful lot of rabbits some indoors some outdoors and i have to say the ones that were kept indoors were just as happy as the outdoors.
> ...


 
She doesn`t have a right to rant and rave at all ,there will be people on here who now know what vets it is .
Running down someones livelihood without any sort of proof is just wrong on any front.


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## Mush (Jan 20, 2008)

darwengray said:


> She doesn`t have a right to rant and rave at all ,there will be people on here who now know what vets it is .
> Running down someones livelihood without any sort of proof is just wrong on any front.



oh id like to know who those are....


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

Thanks for reminding me of that PS.

Nugget was always out and about and quite often "binkying" (for those who don't know the rabbit kinda hops, spins and kicks out its back legs - quite an odd thing to see and blummin hard to describe) she was a very happy bunny.

Personally, I'm taking solace in the face that we took her as a resuce from a house which kept her in a small indoor cage (giant rabbit) with no stimulation and various other environmental problems. She then lived a very happy comfortable life when she was with us.


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

darwengray said:


> She doesn`t have a right to rant and rave at all ,there will be people on here who now know what vets it is .
> Running down someones livelihood without any sort of proof is just wrong on any front.


Clutching at Straws now? 

Neither of us have posted any clues here or told anyone which vet it was! Now, if you are so sure people know which vet it is why not tell us all?


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## ShaneLuvsMonitors (Sep 27, 2008)

darwengray said:


> She doesn`t have a right to rant and rave at all ,there will be people on here who now know what vets it is .
> Running down someones livelihood without any sort of proof is just wrong on any front.


for some people pets are like family much loved missed talked about often with that is a lot of deep seated emotion, and grief is expressed in a lot of ways blaming someone when it may or may not be there fault. 

When my granddad passed away we blamed the nursing home staff almost instantly for giving him a morphine overdose they hadnt of course hed merely succumbed to his various ailments but at the time it made us feel better


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

gtm said:


> The only way the OP is going to be able to take this forward is by getting a PM done by an independent vet. You need evidence before you can go back to the vet & argue he was negligent. It's that simple.
> 
> Sorry about the rabbit by the way.





fenwoman said:


> how do you know the sore leg didn't have some kind of internal or other cause? Basically since you are unwilling to have a PM done, you have no way of proving whether the vet was or was not negligent and if you have no proof, you have no case. That's basic law.


right fair enough, she should have had a pm done but she hasnt. its obvious she has come on here to vent a little and has posted cos she is understandably emotional. i am not sayin mollycoddle her with awwwwww's and so sorry hunny, but people jumpin on sayin she shouldnt be a house rabbit etc is just takin the piss. i find it odd that the rabbit i saw yesterday is now dead, i find it odd that the vet gave her " a little extra" yeah i agree with no proof it was the injection she cant do much but if she thinks its the vet then she thinks its the vet, all people had to say is you dont have a case without results

as for the people harpin on about rabbits need to be outdoors, i dont keep my rabbits outdoors and NEVER will. The amount of horror stories i hear about rabbits bein taken or killed is untrue and im sure my rabbit is much happier indoors than dead. Yes rabbits in the wild dont have toys but these arent wild rabbits! while you try to replicate some of their natural habitat a lot of it is artificial and will always be artificial. i find it laughable some of this stuff comin from people who keep lizards in tanks providin them with heat from a bulb they got from b n q and providin uv ray from a tube plugged into an electricity socket!!!! my rabbits needs are catered for and im sure that they arent unhappy. House rabbits can live long lives and im sure happiness contributes to how long an animal lives for, if they were unhappy then i think they would die younger as unhappiness can have knock on effects to other things


let the bloody girl greive for an animal she has lost, an animal that in my opinion yesterday was NOT on deaths door.....

Claire, if you need me you know where i am

ps darwen, you havent answered by question about your reptiles........


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## Scarlet_Rain (Jan 16, 2009)

Oh for gods sake, every body who is just here to make mush feel worse p**s off. she has lost her pet. House rabbits are perfectly happy, its alright to keep dogs and cats inside but not rabbits right? Its a CAPTIVE bred bunny ffs and she obviously loved it to spend all that money on vets bills and dedicate a whole room etc...
Omg I really am amazed at peoples awfull attitudes to others on here sometimes...

Mush
Im sorry for your loss hun, a post mortem is the best bet but as you have already buried the bunny I suggest going back to the vets and talking to the head/manager and see if you can be compensated in any way. Besides that I guess time will see you through the grief. Im sorry for your loss


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## Scarlet_Rain (Jan 16, 2009)

xXFooFooLaFluffXx said:


> right fair enough, she should have had a pm done but she hasnt. its obvious she has come on here to vent a little and has posted cos she is understandably emotional. i am not sayin mollycoddle her with awwwwww's and so sorry hunny, but people jumpin on sayin she shouldnt be a house rabbit etc is just takin the piss. i find it odd that the rabbit i saw yesterday is now dead, i find it odd that the vet gave her " a little extra" yeah i agree with no proof it was the injection she cant do much but if she thinks its the vet then she thinks its the vet, all people had to say is you dont have a case without results
> 
> as for the people harpin on about rabbits need to be outdoors, i dont keep my rabbits outdoors and NEVER will. The amount of horror stories i hear about rabbits bein taken or killed is untrue and im sure my rabbit is much happier indoors than dead. Yes rabbits in the wild dont have toys but these arent wild rabbits! while you try to replicate some of their natural habitat a lot of it is artificial and will always be artificial. i find it laughable some of this stuff comin from people who keep lizards in tanks providin them with heat from a bulb they got from b n q and providin uv ray from a tube plugged into an electricity socket!!!! my rabbits needs are catered for and im sure that they arent unhappy. House rabbits can live long lives and im sure happiness contributes to how long an animal lives for, if they were unhappy then i think they would die younger as unhappiness can have knock on effects to other things
> 
> ...




*KUDOS TO THAT!!! Exactly what she said. Totally agree.*


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

catflea said:


> I thought it was fairly common knowledge on here that I am the OPs other half? Also, I am not your mate.
> 
> I think its bloody rich that from your high tower you can state how Mush looks after her animals whereas I only have to look around to see how well they are looked after (and how happy they are) - I would point out that they are very much HER pets and I feed them occaisionaly but thats about it.
> 
> ...


Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
Thats what fur is for .
I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .


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## ShaneLuvsMonitors (Sep 27, 2008)

darwengray said:


> Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
> Thats what fur is for .
> I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .


Ok mate your against rabbits inside we get it. Talk about talking to a wall.


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

Scarlet_Rain said:


> Oh for gods sake, every body who is just here to make mush feel worse p**s off. she has lost her pet. House rabbits are perfectly happy, its alright to keep dogs and cats inside but not rabbits right? Its a CAPTIVE bred bunny ffs and she obviously loved it to spend all that money on vets bills and dedicate a whole room etc...
> Omg I really am amazed at peoples awfull attitudes to others on here sometimes...
> 
> Mush
> Im sorry for your loss hun, a post mortem is the best bet but as you have already buried the bunny I suggest going back to the vets and talking to the head/manager and see if you can be compensated in any way. Besides that I guess time will see you through the grief. Im sorry for your loss


yes but dogs and cats get out and about.

i think we would have had more sympathy if she hadn`t tried to blame the vet .

it was out of order.

there is a way of going about things ,this wasn`t it.


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

darwengray said:


> Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
> Thats what fur is for .
> *I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .[/*quote]
> 
> ...


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

Get a life.



darwengray said:


> Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
> Thats what fur is for .
> I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .


In the wild they have burrows, rather difficult to get out of the elements by digging in a wooden hutch!

and as for your assumptions now that we live in a "pokey council flat"

Excuse me whilst I go and piss myself laughing! :lol2:


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

darwengray said:


> Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
> Thats what fur is for .
> I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .


do you not think your snakes and monitors would also experience the elements? and not live in a pokey viv all their lives.........
hypocrite


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## MrsP (Apr 13, 2008)

At the end of the day(which it is being almost midnight) Mush lost a beloved pet.

She looks after her animals in a way nobody could complain about. They are clean, well fed, healthy and lovely. Whatever happened to this rabbit was either a tragic accident, or something that was beyond her control.

As I said before, give the girl a break and stop slagging her off for her animal care. There are, as has been said, hundreds of rabbits that are shoved in hutches and ignored until they die. You can be sure that Mush's rabbits won't suffer that fate. I think it's better to be loved, cared for and given freedom to bounce around happily, than to be shoved in a hutch till you die.


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## Scarlet_Rain (Jan 16, 2009)

MrsP said:


> I've known people with lovely indoor rabbits.
> 
> Not for me though. I can't be doing with the shit. And the rabbits if I'm honest.


That made me lol


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## Scarlet_Rain (Jan 16, 2009)

darwengray said:


> yes but dogs and cats get out and about.
> 
> i think we would have had more sympathy if she hadn`t tried to blame the vet .
> 
> ...


*Aww come on, don't be a grump she was only having a rant, same as anyone would. I have has sick animals in the past and blamed the supplier straight away. We all need someone to blame when we are angry. im sure she won't feel as strongly when shes had a sleep and calmed down. I think we should just give her a break and say no more about it to be honest  lets go on a different thread or something and talk about the things we love lol*


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

lizardloverrach said:


> do you not think your snakes and monitors would also experience the elements? and not live in a pokey viv all their lives.........
> hypocrite


Don`t be an idiot .
Rabbits can live outside in our elements .
My snakes and monitors can`t if they could they would .

I let the iggy out to bask on a sunny day but letting an African Rock python out for a stroll would be irresponsible .

What a dipstick you really are.


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## Graylord (Jul 17, 2007)

Scarlet_Rain said:


> *Aww come on, don't be a grump she was only having a rant, same as anyone would. I have has sick animals in the past and blamed the supplier straight away. We all need someone to blame when we are angry. im sure she won't feel as strongly when shes had a sleep and calmed down. I think we should just give her a break and say no more about it to be honest  lets go on a different thread or something and talk about the things we love lol*


Yeah your right here endeth my posts .


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## Scarlet_Rain (Jan 16, 2009)

darwengray said:


> Don`t be an idiot .
> Rabbits can live outside in our elements .
> My snakes and monitors can`t if they could they would .
> 
> ...


*lol, indeed it would. I don't fancy bumping in to an af rock on a sunny afternoon tbh ours is feisty enough in her viv at times.

Ok seriously off this thread now peeps *


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

Oh,

you've still not told us which Vet it is have you Darwen?

TBH I reckon you are coming dangerously close to initiating Godwins law so you might want to tone it down a bit :whistling2:


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

darwengray said:


> Don`t be an idiot .
> Rabbits can live outside in our elements .
> My snakes and monitors can`t if they could they would .
> 
> ...


dosnt f*cking matter, your the idiot trying to attack someone whos pets just died.
im sick of you high and mighty a**holes on this forum
im off to bed now so you can call me what you like 
its insecure little p*icks who try and make people feel bad


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

darwengray said:


> Don`t be an idiot .
> Rabbits can live outside in our elements .
> My snakes and monitors can`t if they could they would .
> 
> ...


if you dont believe in animals living in anything other than their natural habitat then you shouldnt keep animals period, whether they would be able to survive in our elements or not. if rabbits should be outside then beardies should be in australia etc etc not in your house in a glass tank for your enjoyment!


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## catflea (Sep 1, 2007)

Well Said FooFoo : victory:


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## drake140990 (Jun 4, 2009)

:no1:


Scarlet_Rain said:


> *Aww come on, don't be a grump she was only having a rant, same as anyone would. I have has sick animals in the past and blamed the supplier straight away. We all need someone to blame when we are angry. im sure she won't feel as strongly when shes had a sleep and calmed down. I think we should just give her a break and say no more about it to be honest  lets go on a different thread or something and talk about the things we love lol*


+1:no1:


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## MrsP (Apr 13, 2008)

darwengray said:


> Do you not think that rabbits in the wild experience rain and snow showers .
> Thats what fur is for .
> I still maintain they would prefer the constant fresh air in a hutch and ten minutes of sun a week than living in a pokey council flat all there lives .


I had to live in a pokey council flat for 14 years with three kids. I had no choice. I would bet any pets kept in those places had happier better lives than we did in our damp mouldy unkempt hole.


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## xXFooFooLaFluffXx (Aug 4, 2007)

catflea said:


> Well Said FooFoo : victory:


 
i would totally and utterly respect darwens opinion if he didnt have any pets and was against keepin everything, but he doesnt, he keeps probably the one type of animal that couldnt be further from their natural habitat in his front room


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## clair74 (Feb 20, 2009)

Sadly you cannot say your rabbit was not stressed by the journey to the vets and having a needle put in her and by the injury she had aswell.
Rabbits do give up very easily and they also hide pain very well so there could have been something more going on without you knowing.
I am sorry for your loss but it is unfair to blame the vets when you have no proof of what your rabbit actually died of.
RIP bunny x


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