# Black throat monitor growth?



## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Hello people I have a question or two about my monitor I've had him for about two months and he's only shed once humidity is good I always keep the cage and the hides damp I feed him around 20-25 crickets a day and he will gladly eat most if not all of them the temperature in his basking spot is at least a 100 degrees but he's about 16 inches is that too slow because other reptile lovers say they grow at a very fast rate help would be very loved if any one can help please and thank you !!!


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## philipniceguy (Mar 31, 2008)

Shellshok1994 said:


> Hello people I have a question or two about my monitor I've had him for about two months and he's only shed once humidity is good I always keep the cage and the hides damp I feed him around 20-25 crickets a day and he will gladly eat most if not all of them the temperature in his basking spot is at least a 100 degrees but he's about 16 inches is that too slow because other reptile lovers say they grow at a very fast rate help would be very loved if any one can help please and thank you !!!


some grow fast some do not going by you saying crickets a day this is likely the reason for slower growth. The last clutch of black throats I had in where 8 weeks old 12" long and 1 I kept for a customer for 6 weeks it was already 16" long but they consumed a lot of cut up mice, chicks and insects where always available. on average I found a baby 12" logn would consume 4-10 roaches or locusts etc and 2-4 fuzzes over the course of 3 days. This of course increases as they grow but once over a certain size (say 4.5ft ish) they will want to consume a lot but its best to limit it now before they get fat unless of course its breeding :2thumb:

here is one tong feeding http://youtu.be/ETcOsyHLK74 yet to get the current ones I have tong feeding but will be soon


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I do feed him pinkies and fuzzies a couple days out of the week but where would I get locusts though and sorry if it appears above that it looks like I'm being a smart ass not trying to just should have mentioned that lol


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Where do I get chicks to give him ? Sorry if m bugging you


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## Chunk the tegu (Feb 18, 2015)

Hello, I'm really sorry to gate-crash the conversation, but I was wondering how you are finding your black throat? Personality? Anything you've got to say really, would be much appreciated. 
I take it you've got to set aside a room for when they are bigger? It is just that you are the first active thread I've come across talking about these monitors, and I would love to own one in the future.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Hello and you're fine lol  hmm when I first got him at the expo he was so timid and startled the whole first day he hid in my hoodie but anyway he was mean for a few days but he is OK now and yes I have a ton of room set aside for him his personality is alright but I work with him a lot doing trust builders when I feed him since it's easiest when they are small and I think I read somewhere that they are extremely intelligent but it all depends on the lizard really they have different personalities all you have to do is make time for them and you'll have a good trusting friend


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

You can get chicks fro your local rep shop, only about 20p each if thst.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Oh thanks lol and is that a baby savy ? Its so adorable


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Yes it was my first sav. I now have 3 and a nile.


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

If your basking spot is only around 100 it is much too low. You want to aim for a basking surface temperature of between 130-150F- measured with an IR temperature gun. 
His appetite and growth is probably low due to improper basking temps, which means he is unable to properly digest his food. Once corrected, he should turn into a bottomless bit.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

How would I get the basking spot that high I have two 125 watt basking bulbs just add more? And would feeding him pieces of chicken in calcium powder be good the chicken is organic by the way don't want him getting sick or worse


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

How far away are the bulbs from the basking spot? I use a row of 3 60watt spot bulbs to get my basking temps of between 50c and 60c, at around 14 inches above my basking shelf.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I'd like to say they're about 10 to 15 inches away and he has a log he climbs on to get to the spot he only sits there for about a half hour or so. So maybe it's too hot ?


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

How do I post pictures on here as well I'm using my phone or would I have to use a computer ? I just want to post a picture of him if anyone can see if I'm doing something wrong


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## lozmick (Jun 24, 2013)

I use my phone and use photo bucket


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Hey mitsi I wanted to ask how big your Nile monitor is


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Shellshok1994 said:


> Hey mitsi I wanted to ask how big your Nile monitor is


Shes roughly 4 n half foot, proper narky but lovely with it. Only young though so still lots of growing to do.

how are you measureing basking temps? Do you have an infra red temp gun? You would be better off with a couple of lights at least.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I have a temperature probe with the suction cups on it and I probably could use more lights


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

You really should get an IR temp gun to properly measure the surface temperature. Digital thermometers measure the air temperature, not surface. It's very important that they have sufficient basking temperatures, otherwise it can lead to renal failure and gout.
You don't need to add more wattage (it's actually not recommended as it will suck the humidity out of the air). Get a few low wattage halogen flood lights (40-75 watt) and place them side by side- generally between 10-14 inches from the basking surface.
Posting a photo of the enclosure will let us help you ensure the enclosure is properly set up to keep your guy healthy and happy .


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Shellshok1994 said:


> How would I get the basking spot that high I have two 125 watt basking bulbs just add more? And would feeding him pieces of chicken in calcium powder be good the chicken is organic by the way don't want him getting sick or worse


Feeding pieces of chicken is fine as an occasional treat, but not as a staple diet. They need whole prey items (as in the entire animal- brain, guts, feathers, etc.). Good food items are roaches, crickets, superworms, earthworms, hornworms, mice, crawfish, shrimp, etc.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I'll get one of those over the weekend but he's in a 40 gallon tank right now but I'm building him a tank right now until he gets bigger I'm gonna give him a room and make it nice but where can I get halogen lights the pet store ? And I'll post pictures once I figure out to I'm technology dumb


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Where would I get the crawfish and the shrimp the grocery store and just give him the whole thing like shell and all ?


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## lozmick (Jun 24, 2013)

Yes the shell is an excellent calcium source


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Does the shrimp have to be organic or is any of it good ? And sorry people so many questions let me recap I need halogen lights 40-75 watts an infra red laser temp gun and yeah I think I'll be set ?any more tips would be greatly appreciated and thank you in advance guys  and gals if there are any here ?


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## jarich (Mar 23, 2012)

You have a 16" monitor in a 40 gallon tank with 2 - 125 watt basking lights on it? 

Very glad to have you here then. You have a steep learning curve ahead, my friend. How quickly are you able to provide a new enclosure for it? Honestly I do not want to sound aggressive, its just that there is a great deal for you to learn so that you can care for that amazing lizard you have. Unfortunately, that enclosure you have is a bit of a time bomb, or what monitor keepers often call a jerky machine. There are lots of good people here to help you get it right though, so you can enjoy your monster for years to come.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I know it's small and I can provide the bigger cage next week when I get it built and is 4ft long 3ft wide and 2ft tall no idea how many gallons that is but I just want to build something quick to give me more time for a larger enclosure so I can make it a lot better for him


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## jarich (Mar 23, 2012)

Thats a good start. Any way you can make it taller than that? Youre going to want to have some substrate in there and enough room to hang your lights inside the enclosure. That way the humidity will be trapped inside instead of getting sucked out by the lights. If you can make it 3 or 4 feet high thats at least enough to give you a foot or so of substrate.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Yeah I can get more wood at Lowes and is ply wood good for a bottom for the enclosure or should I just cut half off and put plexiglass for half of the floor ? And thank you I really appreciate the help


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

A solid wooden sealed viv, with glass doors will be fine. The wood will hold heat and humidity in. Ply will be fine as long as its at leadt 8mm thick but id go for 11mm if you can. I use osb board on all my big vivs.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

What's OSB ?


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Shellshok1994 said:


> What's OSB ?


This
Oriented strand board - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia,
its used to put over shop windows when theyve been broken and in new houses when being built etc, cheaper than ply, but 11mm and over usually comes already waterproofed.


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Shellshok1994 said:


> I know it's small and I can provide the bigger cage next week when I get it built and is 4ft long 3ft wide and 2ft tall no idea how many gallons that is but I just want to build something quick to give me more time for a larger enclosure so I can make it a lot better for him


A 4 x 3 is definately much better than a 40 gallon, however this size will not last very long. You'll need the 8 x 4 x 4 within 6 months if it's already 16 inches. 

Just make sure there is no screen or vents on the new wooden viv .


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

How would I make a ceiling then if I don't use a screen ? Sorry this is my first time doing carpentry for a lizard I've done walls and stuff just wood over the top water proof it and drill holes for the lights?


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Yes a solid wood box with glass doors.


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Heres a link to how we did mine
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/habitat/880993-start-bosc-viv-build-pics.html


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## Creed (Apr 2, 2014)

ToothlessSav said:


> A 4 x 3 is definitely much better than a 40 gallon, however this size will not last very long. You'll need the 8 x 4 x 4 within 6 months if it's already 16 inches.


I'd suggest skipping the intermediate (8x4x4) enclosure and skip straight towards the adult sized enclosure. It'll safe you a lot of money and a lot of work.

I wouldn't go smaller than 4x2.5 meter (I think that's about 13x8 feet) and as high as you can make it (this would be the minimal size calculated with the adjusted German animal welfare standard). A mate of mine keeps this species too (hasn't been able to breed them though). He claims they are quite fond of climbing when height and climbing opportunities are provided. 

Good luck.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I have other lizards that I'd put in it when I get them so that would do until I have to get him the big one and thank you for the big dimensions I really appreciate it a lot


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Any good water proofing for this enclosure and lights do I just get some brackets to hold them on ?


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I have all of my materials what is a good wood sealer that will be safe for my Lil buddy ?


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

I use thompsoms waterseal, ppl also use pond paint, and yacht varnish


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Now he's not eating is it because he's depressed or something else my big cage is done what do I do help please  I'm panicking he hasn't eaten for three days


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Is he in the big enclosure now?
If you just moved him, that is probably why he hasn't eaten anything. He's most likely extremely stressed from the move and will settle down with time. 
A few days without eating is nothing to worry about, they can take a while to settle in to new surroundings. As long as it's not skinny, it won't hurt it to go a while without food.


If he's still in the 40 gallon, he's most likely not eating due to improper parameters and stress, which is concerning.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Yeah he's in the big one now so he should eat again soon ? Thank god


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Youve just got to remember that sometimes even the smallest change, that might seem trivial to us, to a lizard can be stressful.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I'm gonna call the vet tomorrow if he doesn't eat today though just to be on the safe side


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Also I haven't changed the temperature or the humidity from what you guys told me he was fine then that's why I worry some reps get that way if those are changed a bit that's why I'm so concerned


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Even the smallest of changes can throw a monitor off. Something as simple as moving an ornament inside the cage from one location to another can put a timid monitor out of wack. 
Unless you are concerned about something else, I don't think a vet visit is waranted (and may actually do more harm than good at this point in time from the extra stress). These guys can die from stress, especially when young. 
I would say if it still hasn't eaten in a few weeks hands off (this means don't touch it), than a vet visit may be waranted. 
For now, leave it be and only do required cage maintenance (changing water, adding food). Don't make eye contact, and leave it be for at least a few weeks before attempting interaction.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

What do I do with food like fuzzies and pinkies just set them in there and crickets and stuff just put them in let them hop around ?


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

That's exactly it . Just toss them in there and he'll find them when he's hungry.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

He likes hunting lol he just got bored of the hand feeding


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I'm starting on another cage and got dryply is that bad for a lizard ?


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Shellshok1994 said:


> He likes hunting lol he just got bored of the hand feeding


Hand feeding is a big no no 
A full grown black throat can cause some major damage if it accidentally gets your hand during feeding. Their food drive is so strong that they can easily miss the prey and get your hand/ fingers. You don't want your hands associated with anything even close to food.
Best to use tongs .


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Quick question I accidentally left my monitors cage open when I fed him and he obviously got out but the weirdest thing happened I took a nap and I woke up and he was laying on top of me sleeping like a cat or a dog would anyone have this happen it was just odd I just wanna know if this has happened to anyone or is this just me ?


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Simple answer: You're warm :lol2:.
Regular house temperatures are much too cool for a monitor. He was probably seeking the closest heat source- which just so happened to be you.


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## russndex (Feb 12, 2011)

it also sounds like your monie is getting more used to the environment for it to be that relaxed about sleeping in the open, my black throat is six months old and wouldn't be seen dead in the open.
Also I'd be relieved if I opened my eyes and saw my black throat on my lap; because if it was my Ornate, it would be because she was trying to eat my lap......


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## jarich (Mar 23, 2012)

Shellshok1994 said:


> Quick question I accidentally left my monitors cage open when I fed him and he obviously got out but the weirdest thing happened I took a nap and I woke up and he was laying on top of me sleeping like a cat or a dog would anyone have this happen it was just odd I just wanna know if this has happened to anyone or is this just me ?


Apparently youre an incredibly lucky person. As mentioned, its very unlikely to happen again if you are that forgetful. What is much more likely is that you will never see it again and it will die a slow painful death as a result of your forgetfulness. Please be more careful. They are escape artists, and if your full grown black throat ever gets out and is seen by someone else, its likely to cause the kind of panic that will mean everyone in your town isnt allowed to keep reptiles anymore.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

I know that this post is old and I got most of the information I needed so thank you guys and or girls that have helped but now I have another question and I need as much info as I can get on this and PS toothlesssav you were right the hand feeding was a no no he's just become so aggressive but I know that's my fault he's been on a fuzzy mouse diet for a few months now and he's just shy of 2 feet he just hisses a lot now and he whips and he thinks my fingers are food I've tried a lot like putting my socks in his hide for my scent I heard that from someone can't remember but it was on a site like this he doesn't run from me he stands his ground like an adult monitor I just want some help I want to be more responsible for his tameness and I want to gain the lizards respect so I can get some trust from him is he bored he has lots of stuff to climb on and hide under or is it the fuzzy mouse diet making him so hostile I also give him eggs once a week that seems to calm him down a little bit so if anyone cares to please help thanks for reading this long message


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## mitsi (Feb 1, 2012)

Sounds to me like hes acting like a monitor should act now. All you can do is take your time dont force the issue and let him learn in his own time that you are not a threat to him. Tong feed do water changes etc etc get him used to your hands bring there without thinking they are food, this will take a while, but most importantly leave him in his home where he feels secure. If you try to force anything on him , you will stress him out and probably end up getting hurt yourself.


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

Alright thank you mitsi he used to be so calm lol


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## ToothlessSav (Aug 5, 2013)

Sounds like a perfectly normal young monitor .
Mine still go through waves every now and then where they want to eat me, but for the most part have settled down over the past few years. 
As already stated, stay within it's comfort level, and within the enclosure until the trust comes back. I used to set myself back in trust gaining all the time (sometimes it was as simple as changing the water).


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## Shellshok1994 (Mar 5, 2015)

That's like the baby savy I have its so mean but that's cause he's so little I'm sure you know lol you know way more than I do :2thumb:


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