# why are all buthids dwa?



## spinnin_tom (Apr 20, 2011)

hey you dangerous bunch 
why does defra think that all buthid scorpions, not to mention hemiscorpidae should be dwa?
i mean, really there are only about 15-20 that could kill you. obvious animals that should be on the list are the likes of L. quin, A. australis, P. trans etc
not the likes of typical bark scorpions etc

any views welcome


----------



## fardilis (Mar 22, 2011)

spinnin_tom said:


> hey you dangerous bunch
> why does defra think that all buthid scorpions, not to mention hemiscorpidae should be dwa?
> i mean, really there are only about 15-20 that could kill you. obvious animals that should be on the list are the likes of L. quin, A. australis, P. trans etc
> not the likes of typical bark scorpions etc
> ...


hiya
they prob said that all buthids (despite being the largest family of scorpions) are dangerous because there r thousends in that family and it would have been easier (seeing as most highly toxic scorpions r in it) to dwal them all rather than specifing each indivinual species (they are lazy)


----------



## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

spinnin_tom said:


> hey you dangerous bunch
> why does defra think that all buthid scorpions, not to mention hemiscorpidae should be dwa?
> i mean, really there are only about 15-20 that could kill you. obvious animals that should be on the list are the likes of L. quin, A. australis, P. trans etc
> not the likes of typical bark scorpions etc
> ...


The reason the entire family was placed upon the DWAA Schedule rather than individual species was due to identification, it was believed that ‘inspectors’ would not be able to identify individual species. Personally I am circumspect that inspectors would be able to distinguish between a Caraboctonidae or a Buthidae, it is one of the fallings of the Act.


----------



## spinnin_tom (Apr 20, 2011)

Chris Newman said:


> The reason the entire family was placed upon the DWAA Schedule rather than individual species was due to identification, it was believed that ‘inspectors’ would not be able to identify individual species. Personally I am circumspect that inspectors would be able to distinguish between a Caraboctonidae or a Buthidae, it is one of the fallings of the Act.


thanks for your view
i completely agree, it is just defra being lazy.
i think if a dwa scorpion keeper sat some of them down and lectured them on basic scorpion id, it would maybe change their minds a bit!!


----------



## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

spinnin_tom said:


> thanks for your view
> i completely agree, it is just defra being lazy.
> i think if a dwa scorpion keeper sat some of them down and lectured them on basic scorpion id, it would maybe change their minds a bit!!


I have, and will continue to argue that the block listing Buthidae is neither reasonable or proportionate, and that only appropriate species should be included on the Schedule. Unfortunately without more support this is unlikely to happen.


----------



## callum b (Sep 8, 2008)

Hi Chris,
I'm all for DEFRA revising the list of scorpions. As I and many other people have stated before it is annoying and unreasonable.
What would be a good way to approach DEFRA on the matter? I know of people sending in letters or emails about what they think of the law but obviously DEFRA have been uninterested and nothing has come from it.

Has anyone ever put a petition together about it and what kind of numbers do you think you would need to get a reaction from DEFRA?


----------



## spinnin_tom (Apr 20, 2011)

callum b said:


> Hi Chris,
> I'm all for DEFRA revising the list of scorpions. As I and many other people have stated before it is annoying and unreasonable.
> What would be a good way to approach DEFRA on the matter? I know of people sending in letters or emails about what they think of the law but obviously DEFRA have been uninterested and nothing has come from it.
> 
> Has anyone ever put a petition together about it and what kind of numbers do you think you would need to get a reaction from DEFRA?


i have send 3 emails about this, which have obviously been ignored

callum, if there is a petition, do they have to look at it or can they just ignore that too?
i think if ya want, you should or we as scorpion keepers in the uk should look into drawing up a petition
or at least a list of obviously dwa scorps


----------



## callum b (Sep 8, 2008)

Yer I reckon if we could get backing from some experts and people who are highly regarded in the scorpion/herp world i.e. Chris Newman lol then maybe they would have a good look at it.
I highly doubt if me or you suggested what should or shouldn't be on the list we would be taken seriously. I'm not saying we wouldn't be able to have a good go at differentiating what is dangerous and what isn't, it's fairly obvious really but abit of help from some top guys or girls would give a petition and/ or letter a lot more weight.
Theres also the problem that scorpion keepers are a minority group within the reptile/exotic animal keeping community. There isn't many of us, so getting a petition with lots of signatures on it could be difficult unless other invert/reptile keepers who know about the issues decide to lend a hand lol. 
Also because scorpions aren't widely kept they may just think whats the point in taking the time and money to change the rules so that the (literal) handful of specialist scorpion keepers can keep some different species.

It would be good to see if we could get them to listen and maybe think about how silly this particular part of the list is.


----------

