# Leo morph's ID please



## kapla (Sep 5, 2010)

Hey

Just wondering if someone can ID these leo's for me?

I THINK I know what they are but I'd like some reassurance so thanks for any help.

Bells albino ?










Hypo?









Hypo ?










Thanks again


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## Emma30 (Apr 18, 2008)

I would say...

1 Mack snow tremper albino
2 Super hypo
3 Hypo


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## kapla (Sep 5, 2010)

Sounds good.

Why mack snow tremper? 
Would it help if I got more pictures of him? Eye ect?


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Tremper
Super Hypo
Hypo
:2thumb:


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## Emma30 (Apr 18, 2008)

kapla said:


> Sounds good.
> 
> Why mack snow tremper?
> Would it help if I got more pictures of him? Eye ect?


 
Not sure really lol just ive had a few of these and hatched a few and they look just like this!! lol might be wrong tho. 

Bell albinos have a red tinge to the whole eye, and the colours of the leo are more vivid on bells, but thats just my opinion others might dissagree with that.

Do you know what the parents are?

sam12345 is most likely correct, they are much better at morphs then me!! :lol2:


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

1 bell but would need to see the eyes to 100% but i say it need to have more white to be a tremper 
2 shctb again not 100% to much black to be a sunglow so no albino in it but could be a shtctb
3 hypo if it loses that group of spots could be a super 


Paul


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## kapla (Sep 5, 2010)

Here he is

Sorry I dont know what his parents were.











Thanks again


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## Salamanda (May 28, 2008)

Looks like a tremper


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

for me its a Bell 

here a eye shot


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## kapla (Sep 5, 2010)

Cool soooooooo it's still inconclusive


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

no i would say 100% bell myself that eye shot look the same to me


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

here my bell male 









Paul


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

Tremper for me. Too washed out to be a Bell IMO

But this points out why eyes can't be relied upon to ID an albino strain....

:whistling2:


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## Emma30 (Apr 18, 2008)

Big Red One said:


> Tremper for me. Too washed out to be a Bell IMO
> 
> But this points out why eyes can't be relied upon to ID an albino strain....
> 
> :whistling2:


Yeah thats what i was saying about the colours being more vivid on a bell 

(monty is great by the way!!)


I Thought the iris has to be pinky/red to be an albino aswell not a black iris and red veins or am i being thick lol


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

well look like were never find out then i say bell you say tremper and the eyes is the only way you can tell albino apart they are very different so i don't see were you get that from , its on every morph page everyone that look at albinos ask for eye shot and the color could be washed out as low temp incubation does this to get red eyes in a albino you need eclipse in it for that.


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Still a Tremper.
BRO is right, the eyes may be the most accurate way of determining Albino strains, however it is not fool proof and you need to look at the overall picture and the other identifiable traits.


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## Madhouse5 (Jun 6, 2011)

so dont the two eye shots look the same they do to me could be a cool male as low temps are known to dull the color as some breeders have been trying incubation at 82 for 21 day to fix the sex to female then putting the eggs in another incubator at 90 to fix the color , anyway this does not relay help the OP i just going by the facts 
1 eyes look like a bell 
2 color is more violet than white in a tremper 

so only way is to test breed to both albino strains and see what you get to be a 100% it one or the other 

Paul


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## Beeva (Aug 24, 2012)

for what its worth I would have gone with

1. Bell Albino
2. Super Hypo (no real evidence of carrot tail) unless the top of the tail is more orange than the pic suggests
3. Hypo

Trevor


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

Madhouse5 said:


> well look like were never find out then i say bell you say tremper and the eyes is the only way you can tell albino apart they are very different so i don't see were you get that from , its on every morph page everyone that look at albinos ask for eye shot and the color could be washed out as low temp incubation does this to get red eyes in a albino you need eclipse in it for that.


I get that from owning a large number of Bells and Trempers and seeing that there are subtle differences but it's certainly not definitive. I've said before that I have seen both strains that are 100 percent genetically proven and from known lines that 'look' (certainly from a photo) that they may be another strain.

Thanks for passing on the info about 'every morph page' showing the difference,!but I already knew that. However these are pointers not definitive statements - the different strains 'look' a certain way, but may 'look' different on some light or in photos. 

You simply should not label an albino as one thing or another without having proof. Colour of eyes is not proof - its guesswork.

As for red in the eye, all albinos show red as they can't show black as they lack the pigmentation.
They may 'look' black but they will be deeper red, it's actually a part of the pointers to try and ID albino eyes......

Eclipse only shows more of the red colour due the effect on the eyes, showing a greater percentage from 100 to 10 percent 'solid' eye.


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## Emma30 (Apr 18, 2008)

Wow!! sorry to the op for this drawn out debate :lol2:

I have a leo that looks exactly like yours OP same eye shots and everything, was told by the lady I bought him from that she didnt know what he was and someone told her he is a bell albino, I dont believe he is a bell but for me and you to prove exactly what our leos are then we are just going to have to test breed!!

I will let you know next breeding season :lol2::lol2:


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## funky1 (Jun 18, 2008)

Can`t add much more to what Sam and Bro have said tbh - tbh, it could be a Tremper or RW...becoming less and less definitive the differences between them.

What I have to add though, is that it`s always worth remembering to anyone looking, is that all `morph guides`, `gene lists` or `reference sites` etc are always only written by a person - each and every one has their own opinion and can actually be added randomly, and wrongly, in a heck of a lot of cases. The biggest `morph guide` out there is littered with mistakes tbh......


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## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

Emma30 said:


> I Thought the iris has to be pinky/red to be an albino aswell not a black iris and red veins or am i being thick lol


All three strains of albino leo's Talbino,Balbino,Ralbino are what's called Tyrosinase-Positive albinos. 
Tyrosinase-Positive albinos appear to exhibit an inability to complete the synthesis of melanin, 
So can produce other melanin related pigments such as various shades of browns greys & reds. 
So though the eyes appear black they are infact dark brown/dark maroon red.

IMO leo is Talbino normal, Though if you had a guN to my head, I wouldn't stake my life of it. As they tend to all look very much alike these days.

The others a Super hypo and a Hypo.


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## funky1 (Jun 18, 2008)

gazz said:


> All three strains of albino leo's Talbino,Balbino,Ralbino are what's called Tyrosinase-Positive albinos.
> Tyrosinase-Positive albinos appear to exhibit an inability to complete the synthesis of melanin,
> So can produce other melanin related pigments such as various shades of browns greys & reds.
> So though the eyes appear black they are infact dark brown/dark maroon red.
> ...


Bloody hell Gazz - missed your in depth analysis mate!!! Where did you slope off to?! :whistling2: Good to see you posting pal, hope it`s not a fleeting appearence as your knowledge is always top notch pal and very much appreciated: seriously = hope everything`s ok.......: victory:


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## Rvreps (Mar 18, 2012)

I also call tremper on this 1!


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## Dave23 (Sep 2, 2008)

The top I would say by the body colour could be a tremp but the eye says bell lol


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## Spider Call (Mar 23, 2007)

Have to agree to the eyes being wrong a fair ammount of the time now. If I put up a picture of my RW's eyes and my Talbino BB's eyes you would swear they were both the same strain of albino. However I know 100% that they aren't. Eyes really can't be relied upon as the only factor. I'm currently waiting for one of my littleuns to grow up so I can test her out, the place I got her from has got Bell and Tremper mixed up a fair few times now. I personally think/hope she is Tremper, however I can't be 100% by the eyes. 
I then have a girl who has VERY pale silver eyes. Where would you go there? Bevause they aren't fixed under any morph, yet there they are.


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