# Product promo - NEW Snake Vivariums



## Ace

Ever wished for an alternative to Faunariums and RUBS for housing young snakes?
Ever wanted a smart looking snake set up but couldn’t afford a full vivarium?
Well here is the answer............









Here at Global Geckos we have been lucky enough to be given a pre-release exclusive of the new MN snake box, due for general release in a few weeks time. This is the finished article but some minor modifications may still take place before it hits the shops (to clarify we are not the manufacturers of this product, we are just looking to see how well recieved it will be). 
The new Snake boxes are manufactured from high quality melamine and toughened glass while being packed with a host of design features surely making this the number 1 choice for captive snake housing. When released the MN snake box will come in a variety of sizes the smallest of which being approximately 18in x 12in x 6in high (we rate them highly and hope you will too)









Let’s start with the general concept. The new MN snake box represents a top access vivarium at just 6 inches high with both top and side viewing windows.

















The use of melamine over an entirely glass or plastic enclosure provides excellent thermal insulation properties meaning the enclosure can be adequately heated with just a 7in x 12in heat-mat (and thermostat).
The top securely clips down with a catch on each side ensuring that there are no unwanted escapees.









Here is a view of the rear of the enclosure showing the concealed hinge for the lid









Now for the exciting stuff, the base of the enclosure is where the magic really happens and what sets this enclosure apart from all others. The base is made of a sandwich of two pieces of toughened glass between which you slide the heat-mat, below the glass is a sheet of polystyrene to insulate the base and ensure heat is reflected up into the enclosure. Finally the base is secured with a sheet of hardboard to protect the polystyrene layer and finish the enclosure off neatly.









The use of the glass base layer ensures heat is evenly distributed into the enclosure above the heat-mat while eliminating the fire risk (and risk of surface damage) when placing a heat-mat in contact with melamine. As well as the polystyrene insulating the enclosure it also protects whatever surface you decide to set the enclosure down on (protects worktops etc).
















View of the installed heat-mat through the first glass base layer 

















Pre drilled hole for fitting a thermostat probe, the unique fastener on the inside of the enclosure screws closed to secure the probe and seal the hole after the probe has been inserted
















The functionality of this design also means that the time taken to set up an enclosure of this design requires no DIY or drilling to pass cables through. It is as simple as slotting the heat-mat in and securing the thermostat probe, from wooden box to perfect snake habitat in under 5 minutes.








Here you can see the finished article housing a baby royal python, these enclosures have been in testing for over 3 months with a flawless record for animal care. There is more info on our website.








Cheers, Will


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## white

prices?


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## Whosthedaddy

Does look good, like the floor.


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## Ace

This enclosure isn’t due for release yet the manufacturer is still doing some final modifications :whistling2: so I can only go on ball park figures (may be slightly more may be slightly less) as I haven’t been given the prices myself. Expect to pay around £45-£50 for the smaller enclosure and around £60-70 for the larger versions. As soon as I know ill let others know:2thumb:.
Regards, Will


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## chewy86

i think these will be great for small snakes and young snakes. But for larger vivs im not sure if a heat mat would cut it. Although i could be wrong. I think for those who hate rubs these will be great especially in low ambiant temp rooms. but i fear most would opt for the cheaper and life long use option of a rub sat on mat and keep room temps in the 70's, also not having to replace after urine seeps in joints and makes them stink and swell. Again that being said your prices might compete with rubs, only time will tell when you release your pricings. Quality design and build, i hope these do well and give people the option of a nice looking viv over rub equivelant well done.


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## chewy86

prices arnt that bad but they can be copied for less as 50quid gets you a 3x2x2 atleast so with less materials im sure they could be an undercut with a bulk buyer of melamine.


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## Ace

chewy86 said:


> i think these will be great for small snakes and young snakes. But for larger vivs im not sure if a heat mat would cut it. Although i could be wrong. I think for those who hate rubs these will be great especially in low ambiant temp rooms. but i fear most would opt for the cheaper and life long use option of a rub sat on mat and keep room temps in the 70's, also not having to replace after urine seeps in joints and makes them stink and swell. Again that being said your prices might compete with rubs, only time will tell when you release your pricings. Quality design and build, i hope these do well and give people the option of a nice looking viv over rub equivelant well done.


Thank you for the feedback, ill be sure to pass this on to the manufacturer. I am in a position to answer some of the concerns you raised but only to the degree that we have had one set up since monday so only time will tell in the long run:notworthy:.
The viv comes pre built and fully sealed (also the glass base should lessen the impact of urine seepage), these are well made products where the glass is fully routered in and siliconed, I stock standard vivariums in this range as well due the build quality more then anything else. As for definative prices I really dont know, I have covered my back a bit by voicing the high end of estimated prices as I dont want to have to tell people in a few weeks when they are released that I was wrong and they are gonna be more then I initially stated.
One thing I would say though is I was dumbfounded at the ability to hold heat in the enclosure, It took about an hour for the temperature to stabilise but has been very consistent since with no signs of struggling to maintain it.

Once again I wish I could take the credit for this product but I am simply looking for feedback before we start stocking them (dont want to order in loads if im the only person that rates them:blush.

Thanks for the constructive feedback, Will


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## chewy86

i think they will sell well, aslong as priced accordingly. They look great, and you say they work great so should be a good product its nice for people to have alternatives. If they could make 4x2x2 and 6x2x2 with same design and have to mats heation on one stat and they dont soak in urine/liquids too quickly again well priced. i think they are on to a winner mate.


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## Ace

chewy86 said:


> i think they will sell well, aslong as priced accordingly. They look great, and you say they work great so should be a good product its nice for people to have alternatives. If they could make 4x2x2 and 6x2x2 with same design and have to mats heation on one stat and they dont soak in urine/liquids too quickly again well priced. i think they are on to a winner mate.


Ill put it to the manufacturer but i dont think they have plans for ones that big (not that im aware of anyway): victory:.

Regards, Will


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## Wills

personally a few things spring to mind, with the lid lifting up like that makes them impossible to stack which is a shame, the hardboard is also starting to sag all ready, price wise i think most collectors/ breeders will find it to steep 

it reminds me of the shop setup at aquasplash which are built to be 50l rubs with glass fronts look very good as well imo


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## chewy86

when you open the lid, hot air will rise so everytime you open the lid it will take an hour or so to reach temps again like it did on setup? Not as good as front opening vivs for that reason. Maybe he should seal the lid and have the front window hinged? Meanin they are stackable and let less head escape when opening?


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## Ace

Wills said:


> personally a few things spring to mind, with the lid lifting up like that makes them impossible to stack which is a shame, the hardboard is also starting to sag all ready, price wise i think most collectors/ breeders will find it to steep
> 
> it reminds me of the shop setup at aquasplash which are built to be 50l rubs with glass fronts look very good as well imo


I agree with you about the stacking aspect, you would have to lift one off the next in order to open the one underneath, this is the same as with the RUBS though as these arnt front opening either. I dont think this is really targeted at the hardcore collector as most people with a very large volume of snakes will have some form of racking system. As previously stated the pricing is simply a ballpark figure but we will do our best to put them out at the lowest price possible (whatever that may be). As far as the hardboard goes this may simply be due to this being a promo version and the tacking on the base was one of the final tweaks I believe they have planned only time will tell if they iron out this factor. Reading is only about 30 mins from us, why not pop down and see it in the flesh you seem to have some great constructive comments which would be highly valued:notworthy:.

Regards, Will


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## Wills

Ace said:


> I agree with you about the stacking aspect, you would have to lift one off the next in order to open the one underneath, this is the same as with the RUBS though as these arnt front opening either. I dont think this is really targeted at the hardcore collector as most people with a very large volume of snakes will have some form of racking system. As previously stated the pricing is simply a ballpark figure but we will do our best to put them out at the lowest price possible (whatever that may be). As far as the hardboard goes this may simply be due to this being a promo version and the tacking on the base was one of the final tweaks I believe they have planned only time will tell if they iron out this factor. Reading is only about 30 mins from us, why not pop down and see it in the flesh you seem to have some great constructive comments which would be highly valued:notworthy:.
> 
> Regards, Will


may well do at some point :2thumb:


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## Ace

chewy86 said:


> when you open the lid, hot air will rise so everytime you open the lid it will take an hour or so to reach temps again like it did on setup? Not as good as front opening vivs for that reason. Maybe he should seal the lid and have the front window hinged? Meanin they are stackable and let less head escape when opening?


The main reason it took so long to heat up initially is because it had come out of the boot of my car after a 3 hour drive at night so the heatmat took ages to to take the chill out of it before it begun warming. I did wonder about the front opening aspect myself but I guess if it had been front opening it would make it pretty difficult to get animals out and perform daily maintenance from the front as its so shallow. Afterall a RUB is opened from the top and the thermal insulating properties of a 15mm melamine board are considerably better then the plastic walls of a RUB. What i can do for you tomorrow is test out a few theories on the rate of cooling and see how it performs when opened and closed over set intervals.

Regards, Will: victory:


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## chewy86

like you say the joy with rubs is you can make cheap lidless racks. Save money, space, easier to clean and never need replacing still think for the keeper will 1 or 2 snakes these work great and look nice in any room. Allot of thought gone into design i really like the probe idea. Although stat probes seen to work best taped to the mat direcly which from photos is possible. Making the build quicker/easier and cheaper to make and there for sell.


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## quizicalkat

Looks very smart but I do have a few point that you may want to consider.

1) some sort of interlocking would be good for stacking - rubber feet or male/female meeting? I could see on sliding of the top of a stack..

2) The hinge looks pretty cheap and nasty and will probably die quite quickly.

3) As metioned the probe should be on the mat as it the mat teamperature, not the air temperature that matters when preventing burns - especially if it's top opening.

and personally I would be prepared to lose that top window for the sake of price if I was stacking anyway 

Just my thoughts of course


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## courseithurts

good idea and i expect they will sell well however i wont be buying one lol


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## bothrops

For me, they have alot of the disadvantages of a RUB (size being the main one)without many of the advantages (cheap, stackable, lightweight, flexible, 'disposable' i.e. cheap to upgrade, can be used lidless etc.)


I love the probe holder and double bottom for heat mats and I reckon that the manufacturer should patent that and develop it for the larger vivs as the real USP - i'd certainly buy them in preference to 'normal viv'.

I'm sure you'll sell a few, but the fact that you can get 2x1x1 vivs for around the predicted price of the smallest unit is the real issue.

Not for big breeders as they don't stack or lend themselves to a rack and if you only hve one or two snakes surely you'd buy RUBs whilst small (for cheapness) and a 'proper viv' when it grows?

Nice looking with some nice touches but I won't be investing. I'm out: victory:


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## Ace

chewy86 said:


> like you say the joy with rubs is you can make cheap lidless racks. Save money, space, easier to clean and never need replacing still think for the keeper will 1 or 2 snakes these work great and look nice in any room. Allot of thought gone into design i really like the probe idea. Although stat probes seen to work best taped to the mat direcly which from photos is possible. Making the build quicker/easier and cheaper to make and there for sell.


I dont think these are really geared towards stacking, hence the window on the top, more towards a smarter alternative to a standalone RUB for people with one or two snakes. the stat probe can be placed wherever you feel best the beauty of the locking device for the stat probe is that you can have the probe as far in as you want.



quizicalkat said:


> Looks very smart but I do have a few point that you may want to consider.
> 
> 1) some sort of interlocking would be good for stacking - rubber feet or male/female meeting? I could see on sliding of the top of a stack..
> 
> 2) The hinge looks pretty cheap and nasty and will probably die quite quickly.
> 
> 3) As metioned the probe should be on the mat as it the mat teamperature, not the air temperature that matters when preventing burns - especially if it's top opening.
> 
> and personally I would be prepared to lose that top window for the sake of price if I was stacking anyway
> 
> Just my thoughts of course


As stated i dont think the intention was for a stacking unit (ill ask the manufacturer if there are plans for a stacking version or a racking system to hold them).Once again let me stress that I am not the person that designed or built these I dont get any say in how they are made I am simply testing the waters before I start stocking them. There are small non slip feet on the underside of the unit but I still wouldnt want to rely on them in a racking scenario.
Agreed about the hinge not being the most aesthetically pleasing bit, hence why its positioned on the rear of the unit rather then visible in the join when you open it, if you think about it this sort of unit is likely to be on a worktop of some description against a wall so the chances of seeing the hinge are minimal. As far as the integrity of the hinge goes i was just happy to see they used one continuos hinge rather then a couple of small hinges at either end, i would guess that this will be a more substantial means of improving the longevity of the opening mechanism.
As far as probe positioning goes this is up to the individual and not fixed (you can position it wherever you feel most appropriate), i tend to follow for the manufacturer's user guide, in this instance I was using a Ministat 100 so suspended the probe end in air rather then in contact with the mat but I dare say I set my thermostat a lot lower then most as all our temps are checked with an IR temp gun rather then relying on the thermostat dial or thermometers.

Thanks for the comments,Will

PS (I cant believe no one has bothered to go to the website yet considering you can win one of these in exchange for your comments:whistling2


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## Ace

bothrops said:


> For me, they have alot of the disadvantages of a RUB (size being the main one)without many of the advantages (cheap, stackable, lightweight, flexible, 'disposable' i.e. cheap to upgrade, can be used lidless etc.)
> 
> 
> I love the probe holder and double bottom for heat mats and I reckon that the manufacturer should patent that and develop it for the larger vivs as the real USP - i'd certainly buy them in preference to 'normal viv'.
> 
> I'm sure you'll sell a few, but the fact that you can get 2x1x1 vivs for around the predicted price of the smallest unit is the real issue.
> 
> Not for big breeders as they don't stack or lend themselves to a rack and if you only hve one or two snakes surely you'd buy RUBs whilst small (for cheapness) and a 'proper viv' when it grows?
> 
> Nice looking with some nice touches but I won't be investing. I'm out: victory:


I think the main considerations behind the development of this was a plug and play design for first time keepers and improved aesthetics without compromising functionality. When the full size range is launched there will definately be larger sizes. As far as price goes I Cant stress enough that these prices are figures that have been banded around they may come in considerably less then this I really dont know as they havent been officially launched.

As price appears to be a real sticking point here what would people want to see something like this priced at? this would be really helpfull to know.

Thank you very much, these are just the sort of comments I was looking for.

Regards, Will


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## chewy86

not much good for a retic mate :2thumb:


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## Ace

I dunno they are fully sealed maybe you could use one as a waterbowl:lol2:


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## blood and guts

Its good to see it encurages the use of stats but i feel the stat prob hole needs to be closer to the surface, glass can get extremely hot with a mat and if the probe is not in direct contact 120+ degrees is possible! 
Great concept but it certently is not for me as the cons out weigh any pros it may have..


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## blood and guts

Infact thinking about it maybe a much bigger version with taller sides and no mats with mesh in the lid may get intrest from tort keepers? like a tort table with more security. just a thought..


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## SilverSteno

If they did one that was 12 inches tall I'd get one for my sand geckos! lol Would need a bit of work on vents to stop escapee crickets but the idea of the glass bit for the heatmat is a really good idea, plus as my geckos are kept on sand it would stop it damaging the bottom of the vivarium as they dig around. The proble thing is also a very, very good idea and a secure-looking way to plug the hole. It looks really nice but for a snake which would soon outgrow it, I'd just stick with a faunarium or tub to be honest as it is quite a bit of money for something that, for someone who is only keeping one or two snakes which is what from reading the thread it seems to be aimed at, would probably not be used for that long.


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## Meko

With the stacking issue, all they'd need to do would be a small modification to allow the insides to slide forward like a drawer.


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## Ace

blood and guts said:


> Its good to see it encurages the use of stats but i feel the stat prob hole needs to be closer to the surface, glass can get extremely hot with a mat and if the probe is not in direct contact 120+ degrees is possible!
> Great concept but it certently is not for me as the cons out weigh any pros it may have..


As the postioning of the probe appears to be a major concern for a number of people I will move the probe and re-post a photo, the beauty of the locking device is that you can have as much or as little of the probe cable in the viv, whichever you want. It must be stated that the positioning of the probe is 'of my doing' and is not fixed by the design of the enclosure.



blood and guts said:


> Infact thinking about it maybe a much bigger version with taller sides and no mats with mesh in the lid may get intrest from tort keepers? like a tort table with more security. just a thought..


Maybe look at the Zoo-med tortoise house if you want a tortoise table with a mesh lid this product has already been created.



SilverSteno said:


> If they did one that was 12 inches tall I'd get one for my sand geckos! lol Would need a bit of work on vents to stop escapee crickets but the idea of the glass bit for the heatmat is a really good idea, plus as my geckos are kept on sand it would stop it damaging the bottom of the vivarium as they dig around. The proble thing is also a very, very good idea and a secure-looking way to plug the hole. It looks really nice but for a snake which would soon outgrow it, I'd just stick with a faunarium or tub to be honest as it is quite a bit of money for something that, for someone who is only keeping one or two snakes which is what from reading the thread it seems to be aimed at, would probably not be used for that long.


I believe the larger size is 9inches high but only saw the prototype for this one rather then have one myself so cant say for certain, I have seen them being tested with baby leo's so no reason why they wouldnt work with smaller geckos. The vents are on both sides of the melamine but you would probably have to put pinmesh inbetween to be sure to stop escapee's. As far as the snake outgrowing it goes thats pretty much the same with whatever you house them in initially but i can understand that people wouldnt want to shell out for something expensive only to upgrade 6months to a year down the line. A lot of people when they first start keeping snakes dont want it living in a box where they cant see it properly, i guess that is who i was thinking would like this.



Meko said:


> With the stacking issue, all they'd need to do would be a small modification to allow the insides to slide forward like a drawer.


Great idea.

Thanks for the comments, Will


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## SilverSteno

Ace said:


> I believe the larger size is 9inches high but only saw the prototype for this one rather then have one myself so cant say for certain, I have seen them being tested with baby leo's so no reason why they wouldnt work with smaller geckos. The vents are on both sides of the melamine but you would probably have to put pinmesh inbetween to be sure to stop escapee's. As far as the snake outgrowing it goes thats pretty much the same with whatever you house them in initially but i can understand that people wouldnt want to shell out for something expensive only to upgrade 6months to a year down the line. A lot of people when they first start keeping snakes dont want it living in a box where they cant see it properly, i guess that is who i was thinking would like this.
> 
> 
> Thanks for the comments, Will


Trouble is people can get faunariums which you can see the snakes inside and as many beginner kits are with faunariums rather than rubs there could be a bit of a competition there. For young snakes the usable life is probably going to be pretty low, personally I think they'd be better marketed as an alternative option for smaller species rather than temporary housing for young snakes because at the moment all the options for smaller species are glass tanks. However, the market for that is probably going to be pretty low. I know I'd like something like it for my geckos but I don't know how many others would!

Is the larger one also longer? I'm wanting something that is 18 inches long (width doesn't really matter) so if the larger one is also longer it wouldn't be much good unfortunately!


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## Ace

SilverSteno said:


> Trouble is people can get faunariums which you can see the snakes inside and as many beginner kits are with faunariums rather than rubs there could be a bit of a competition there. For young snakes the usable life is probably going to be pretty low, personally I think they'd be better marketed as an alternative option for smaller species rather than temporary housing for young snakes because at the moment all the options for smaller species are glass tanks. However, the market for that is probably going to be pretty low. I know I'd like something like it for my geckos but I don't know how many others would!
> 
> Is the larger one also longer? I'm wanting something that is 18 inches long (width doesn't really matter) so if the larger one is also longer it wouldn't be much good unfortunately!


Indeed most of the starter kits for snakes are based around a faunarium (here at the shop our current one is at the moment) I have just been on the look out for an alternative that was a bit better looking and more substantial. I guess that is why this product appeals to me. As well as a nice looking animal I like to have a nice looking enclosure and for people that feel the same, I would imagine that this may be an appealing option. Yes I have seen a larger one that is longer around the 30-36in mark so may not be what your looking for.

As far as competition between rubs,faunariums and these snake boxes goes, there will be a lot that is for sure and as this is going to be the most expensive of the three options I guess what I am looking to find out is would people be prepared to buy one either as a better looking alternative to a rub/faunarium or in the case of the larger sizes as a cheaper alternative to a standard vivarium.

Regards, Will


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## clown8

Just seen one of these. There great looking vivs. Would deff have one over a fauniriam. They really are well thought out and made.


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## s6t6nic6l

it looks like something MFI would have sold. if this is the example they gave you to showcase it does'nt say much for the next batch you'll be TRYING to sell. the pre-drilled hole is a work of art innit :whistling2:
why use hardboard for the base when that part needs to be more solid than the rest of it!!!. you say the base glass is siliconed, where?. obviously it's not sealed where it is most needed :whistling2: 

P.S. that concealed hinge, i can see it :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## snakeeyes21

Not to take anything away from yours / your mates invention, but it rather looks like something someone would have an ant farm or worm farm in :lol2:


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## Ace

s6t6nic6l said:


> it looks like something MFI would have sold. if this is the example they gave you to showcase it does'nt say much for the next batch you'll be TRYING to sell. the pre-drilled hole is a work of art innit :whistling2:
> why use hardboard for the base when that part needs to be more solid than the rest of it!!!. you say the base glass is siliconed, where?. obviously it's not sealed where it is most needed :whistling2:
> 
> P.S. that concealed hinge, i can see it :Na_Na_Na_Na:


MFI Were the melamine masters of the world dunno why they never went into reptile enclosures:lol2:

The pre drilled hole is a bit scuffed on the rear of the enclosure as initially I was trying to put the probe fastener in the wrong side:blush:. Still its handy for a plug and play kit where no drilling is neccesary for those that are a little less handy at the DIY. The hardboard base is only supporting the weight of the polystyrene yeah this stuff is heavy but i think the hardboard should be able to cut it:lol2:. But seriously the base is supported by the double glass layer this glass is routered in as well so ive no issues with the weight it can support, as for where the base is sealed it is in the routered groove to conceal it, I may suggest that they seal the inside as well though just to make double sure:notworthy:. As for the hinge where would you suggest it was mounted, earlier prototypes had the hinge mounted underneath the the lid but you could see it when you lifted up the lid so they moved it to the back to 'conceal it' when its being opened. Dunno about you but I dont often look at the back of my vivs I tend to be looking in them:lol2:. Good points raised though.




snakeeyes21 said:


> Not to take anything away from yours / your mates invention, but it rather looks like something someone would have an ant farm or worm farm in :lol2:


If you want to keep ants in it im sure it would look really nice, just be carefull they dont escape out the vents:lol2:.

Just to clarify yet again ...... I have had nothing to do with the manufacturing of this enclosure they are made by one of the largest UK viv manufacturers, I managed to secure a prototype in exchange for getting a bit of feedback about them and to trial one in store. I like the design personally which is why I am trying to answer peoples questions and address any useage issues. I am nothing more then a middleman here and people that like them can look forward to seeing them in stores up and down the country next month:no1: (Just to clarify im not involved with the distribution either).

Thanks for your comments, Will


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## rmy

And the manufacturer is???????


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## bikenut

I would be interested in a few for babies, however tey dont seem stackable?


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## rmy

bikenut said:


> I would be interested in a few for babies, however tey dont seem stackable?


 Thats cos there not


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## eddygecko

Looks to be like you've over complicated a problem to be honest. You've taken away the 2 best things about using RUBs. 
The main thing is that baby snakes don't stay baby for long. Both Rubs and faunariums are cheap. Much cheaper than £45. This means you can use one for a while while your snakes a hatchling, then upgrade as soon as it grows and dispose of the old one. 

Also the other best thing about Rubs is that they can stack, meaning you can keep a large number in a compact space, these being top opening you couldn't stack them. 

My only other thought is that with a glass top, you will really struggle with keeping an ambient temperature, just the same as with a Rub. 

Its a shame really because the product does look good, with a few tweaks it would probably work well. If it was me i'd have a full wooden top and then a front hinged from the bottom. This solves the insulation and stacking problem. 

But then you've basically got a front opening viv with nothing to really seperate it from the rest of the market :/


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## Lee Warren

Well if there is anyone who wishes to buy one of these Terrainiums then I have them in stock for immediate dispatch. www.millrep.co.uk. Look in New Products. Personally I think they look cool and ideal for people who just want a pet gecko. They cant be stacked so that rules out people who keep large amounts of reptiles.


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## SilverSteno

Lee Warren said:


> Well if there is anyone who wishes to buy one of these Terrainiums then I have them in stock for immediate dispatch. www.millrep.co.uk. Look in New Products. Personally I think they look cool and ideal for people who just want a pet gecko. They cant be stacked so that rules out people who keep large amounts of reptiles.


Do you have any photos of them actually been used?


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## dizzee

I like these but i wouldn't use them they way they are being shown.

I personaly would only have there lid opening 3/4 of the lid so the back 1/4 was sealed.

Then i woud have a wooded housing made for lets sat 10 to be stacked in but with 5mm gap inbetween the top of one and the bottom of another.

Then i would get 2 draw runner set for each enclosure and attach them to the housing and the single enclosures, 2 runners on each side to account for the weight of the enclosure + snakey.

so it turned them all into what appered to be a viv stack but each viv pulled out like a draw and the lid opend from above, that why you would need the last 1/4 of the top sealed so you can allow for not pulling the enclosure off the draw runners when you upened the lid.

i would even give the front a fasia plate so it hid all the locks and runners down the side and nice smart stainless handle for the front 


Anyone else think that would solve the stacking problem.

plus i rekon that would look SWEET!!!!! but alot of work and 2x the money of a rub stack, but really would look alot better for the private collector that takes care on housing as i personly think rub do look ugly but love there useability and cleanliness, but would be willing to pay for something that looks better.

Hope that helps

Callam


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## Nightfirez

hmm other than totally over complicating the best things about rubs 

at £35 for a small one 

that’s what i pay for 2ft vivs at the moment 

but saying that i do in a round about way like the glass concept 

though that’s a lot of glass to be sent out with clumsy parcle farce
never mind the weight of shipping it 



neat idea tho


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## Emmabeth

I think these are kinda missing the market on several points really.

Price - similarly priced to budget range vivs. Much more costly than RUBS.

All the same problems of a RUB regarding stacking, but now with the added downside that you are stuck to JUST using mats, whereas at least with a RUB you have the option of heat cables.

I appreciate these are not marketed at multi-keepers, thats fine, but the kind of people who keep just one or two, and thus would fit the target for this item, are likely to have the vertical space for a proper viv. Its only us nutters with tons of snakes that need to sacrifice height by stacking things - but these don't stack...

So.. in all honesty these have got to come down in price to a level similar to RUBS or plastic faunariums before they present a real advantage.

Or - open up the options and make them stackable and have the option to use a mat OR a heatcable.

As far as I can see, the keeper with few snakes is not the keeper looking to reallly save a lot of money, so these being a similar price to similar quality but larger 'proper vivs' is no real selling point. Most of these keepers will have the space for a proper viv anyway (and if they dont, they wouldnt likely have the space for this either as teh top is 'dead space' because of the lid).... so why pay roughly the same for 'less' product.

Nice idea and there are things to like, but I personally wouldnt be buying a lot of these in the hopes of shifting them.


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## billsy

I really like the look of these, are these available yet?

: victory:


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## bothrops

billsy said:


> I really like the look of these, are these available yet?
> 
> : victory:


 
They are for sale in my Local Pets at Home, so I would imagine they are present in most/all of them?


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## billsy

bothrops said:


> They are for sale in my Local Pets at Home, so I would imagine they are present in most/all of them?


Thanks very much!


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## krome187

i have two of these (30ins) to house corns with a little modification these are great, no problems at all, plus i only paid £90 for the two at doncaster, much cheaper than what pets at home sell them for


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## My_SnAkE_rUlEs

i just ordered one of these, the 30" ones are £54.99 on bluelizardreptiles.com (where i got mine from)
pets at home there £97.99


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## Danul

*I want one*

to be fair I'm seraching hi and low for an alternative to my gekos tank and this looks perfect, if you get some in I really want one let me kno

[email protected]:no1:


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## GazzaB85

a little bit more thought should've went into these and they would make a gd idea for people with leos as pets only, i.e. a single leo keeper etc but i would buy one if they were taller, like the idea of a 30" long viv as a 3ft imo is too long for a single gecko, they prefer to be kept solitary(that is if leos a pet and no intention of breeding or keeping a group)


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## philipniceguy

dizzee said:


> I like these but i wouldn't use them they way they are being shown.
> 
> I personaly would only have there lid opening 3/4 of the lid so the back 1/4 was sealed.
> 
> Then i woud have a wooded housing made for lets sat 10 to be stacked in but with 5mm gap inbetween the top of one and the bottom of another.
> 
> Then i would get 2 draw runner set for each enclosure and attach them to the housing and the single enclosures, 2 runners on each side to account for the weight of the enclosure + snakey.
> 
> so it turned them all into what appered to be a viv stack but each viv pulled out like a draw and the lid opend from above, that why you would need the last 1/4 of the top sealed so you can allow for not pulling the enclosure off the draw runners when you upened the lid.
> 
> i would even give the front a fasia plate so it hid all the locks and runners down the side and nice smart stainless handle for the front
> 
> 
> Anyone else think that would solve the stacking problem.
> 
> plus i rekon that would look SWEET!!!!! but alot of work and 2x the money of a rub stack, but really would look alot better for the private collector that takes care on housing as i personly think rub do look ugly but love there useability and cleanliness, but would be willing to pay for something that looks better.
> 
> Hope that helps
> 
> Callam


i agree with this post may take more time/cost but IF its right and made like you say it would benafit alot more people, I use rubs on a rack but if i could find something that does the job just as well but looks nicer i would pay abit extra for it


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