# hognose eating fish



## yargnits

with the recent information about feeding snakes a whole or partial diet of fish i thought i would take it a step further and offer my norm hoggy a uk minnow. 

i put a pinkie and a minnow of about the same diameter in the enclosure but the minnow was about three times longer and there for bigger. i dropped them both in the enclosure at the same time after being soaked in warm water [as they were both frozen previously]. 

as it turns out the minnow was the prey item was eaten and the pinkie was left.

relevant comments appreciated 

yargnits


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## Alfonzo

It's interesting for sure, and possibly a cheap food source (?), but I would be cautious. Personally I wouldn't want to risk the snake refusing rodents now it's had a taste of something else. Also, I don't know if minnows are 'white fish' but if they are they could contain thiaminase - an enzyme which breaks down thiamine (vitamin B1), a deficiency of which can be very serious. If you wanted to continue feeding fish containing thiaminase it can be denatured by cooking gently at approx 80*c, but it seems like a lot of faff when rodents are usually so straightforward.

This isn't meant to be a typical RFUK piss on a parade, just advice to proceed with caution : victory:

alternate food sources are probably always a good thing providing they are readily available and nutritionally useful of course


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## Stan193

I gave mine a small piece of trout once and she scoffed it down then she tried to eat the floor that it had been on lol.


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## yargnits

the snake mentioned has eaten pinkies since and after reading other threads im aware of the thiaminase thiamine issues in some fish but as part of a varied diet where the snake will still get its share of vit b1 i dont think it should be a problem. 

i have no evidence but its possible that a mixed diet of whole fish and rodents could provide more benefits than rodents alone as the fish should contain less fat and more calcium as well as oils and different vitamin and mineral contents than rodents alone. 

the thiaminase / thiamine seems to be just about the only reasonable issue ive come accross for not feeding whole fish as the primary food source but ive not come accross any sort of list that tells us which of the aparently few fish it is that containe thiaminase [so if anyone knows where it is id like to know]

i would also like to point out that im not planning to feed any of my other snakes fish and have a good stock of rodents as well as rodent breeding facilities but i think the subject is interesting all the same.


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## thetong6969

they also like poached or boiled egg: victory:


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## yargnits

thetong6969 said:


> they also like poached or boiled egg: victory:


i had read that but forgotten. i would imagine thats something quite dificult to feed as it would break up ?

i did manage to find a list of what seems to be mainly american species of fish here ; Nutrient Requirements of Mink and Foxes, Second Revised Edition, 1982

but doesnt help much with uk species and ornimentals such as uk minnows, ornimental guppies , mollies etc


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## Demonique

thetong6969 said:


> they also like poached or boiled egg: victory:


Wait, hoggies like boiled egg?


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## xoneringx

Demonique said:


> Wait, hoggies like boiled egg?


Yeah, there's a pretty sweet Youtube video of one attacking an egg.


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## storm

boiled egg is great for scenting for fussy/non feeders, never failed on me yet  i also know rainbow trout is a thiaminase free fish and is ok to feed, i use it for my garters with added supplements.


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## Khonsu

My hoggies like boiled egg but complain if the yolk's not runny or I use margarine instead of butter on thier soldiers :blush:


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## AilsaM

Can you only give your hoggie boiled egg if there are feeding problems? I seen that you tube video too with the hoggie scoffing the egg lol


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## Marcia

xoneringx said:


> Yeah, there's a pretty sweet Youtube video of one attacking an egg.


Not this one by any chance?

Nom Nom Nom: Hognose vs. Egg - YouTube


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## xoneringx

Marcia said:


> Not this one by any chance?
> 
> Nom Nom Nom: Hognose vs. Egg - YouTube


Indeed.


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## yargnits

storm said:


> boiled egg is great for scenting for fussy/non feeders, never failed on me yet  i also know rainbow trout is a thiaminase free fish and is ok to feed, i use it for my garters with added supplements.


the link above lists several trout as being thiaminase free along with several others just a shame it doesnt list the fish i wanted to know about lol. still im sure its useful.

what supplements are you adding to the fish ?

reposted thiaminase link ; http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=1114&page=64


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## sidewinder

mine love boiled quail eggs.


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## nessa76

storm said:


> boiled egg is great for scenting for fussy/non feeders, never failed on me yet  i also know rainbow trout is a thiaminase free fish and is ok to feed, i use it for my garters with added supplements.


I'm glad i've read this post as i've a chequered garter myself. I've just ordered some frozen rainbow trout over the internet.

Thanks for mentioning that its thiaminise free :2thumb:


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## AilsaM

nessa76 said:


> I'm glad i've read this post as i've a chequered garter myself. I've just ordered some frozen rainbow trout over the internet.
> 
> Thanks for mentioning that its thiaminise free :2thumb:


Why did you order it over the internet? Fish counter at super markets, simples


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## nessa76

AilsaM said:


> Why did you order it over the internet? Fish counter at super markets, simples


I haven't come across it in my local supermarket, and the market in my area is cr*p : victory:


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## AilsaM

nessa76 said:


> I haven't come across it in my local supermarket, and the market in my area is cr*p : victory:


Ah right, am lucky as got some great local super markets and lots of local produce markets too


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## yargnits

you should be able to find rainbow trout local. bit dismal if you cant. theres plenty of places round me to catch your own but brownies are more common. 

check the link there are loads of fish listed there that are thiaminise free. 

had to check twice myself but at the top it shows fish containing thiaminise and further down the list it lists the fish that dont contain it. 

i would imagine that people feeding trout are feeding trout peices that dont contain bones as apposed to whole small fish that contain everything so you might want to think about calcium. im trying to find a small whole fish that doesnt contain thiaminise in the uk but details seem to be quite poor


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## nessa76

yargnits said:


> you should be able to find rainbow trout local. bit dismal if you cant. theres plenty of places round me to catch your own but brownies are more common.
> 
> check the link there are loads of fish listed there that are thiaminise free.
> 
> had to check twice myself but at the top it shows fish containing thiaminise and further down the list it lists the fish that dont contain it.
> 
> i would imagine that people feeding trout are feeding trout peices that dont contain bones as apposed to whole small fish that contain everything so you might want to think about calcium. im trying to find a small whole fish that doesnt contain thiaminise in the uk but details seem to be quite poor


Well i might not have looked far enough, but i do live in a small town :lol2:


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## storm

nessa76 said:


> I'm glad i've read this post as i've a chequered garter myself. I've just ordered some frozen rainbow trout over the internet.
> 
> Thanks for mentioning that its thiaminise free :2thumb:



no problem  most major supermarkest stock fresh rainbow trout on the fish counter  x


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## williamleakhome

How about lancefish? These are easy to buy at a fish shop, are small enough to eat whole, and from what I can see, are thiamine free


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