# Super Mack Snow Albino Question



## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

I have done threads regarding Albino Mack Snow Genetics before on this forum.
To date I have only hatched 2 Supers from my breeding of my Albino Mack Trio, the first I incubated for male but unfortunately looks more female at the moment.
So now possibly haveing 2 females and further eggs being incubated for female I have started looking to purchase a male Super.

I think my stock are Albino Tremper line but do not know how too tell ??
Secondly if I paired a Bell Line Albino Super male to my Tremper Albino Supers what would the outcome be??








The male Albino Mack Snow is shown above, does this photo give any clues as to its Albino Line or is the eyes that will tell its line.

Thanks 
Baz


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

1: Your male is probably a Tremper. Eyes don't give it away completely, markings don't always give it away... but Bells tend to have finer, more speckled markings (and are often darker marked) and have eyes that tend more to the pink/red side of the tan spectrum; yours looks like a pretty typical Tremper to me. Almost certainly NOT a Rainwater/Las Vegas albino, since there are very few over here at all.

2: The only way to tell for sure is to breed them to a KNOWN Tremper albino (Mack or otherwise). If you get ALL visual albino offspring, you've got Tremper albino macks. If you get any normal offspring, you don't have Tremper albino macks.

3: Breeding a Tremper to a Bell will get you normals, normal macks and normal super macks who are het for Tremper AND Bell albino. And recovering the albinos in the second generation would be a pain - you'd find it hard going to decide whether you've got your 3/16ths chance Tremper, a 3/16ths chance Bell, or a 1/16th chance Tremper-Bell albino.


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

*A Few Photos for confirmation*



Ssthisto said:


> 1: Your male is probably a Tremper. Eyes don't give it away completely, markings don't always give it away... but Bells tend to have finer, more speckled markings (and are often darker marked) and have eyes that tend more to the pink/red side of the tan spectrum; yours looks like a pretty typical Tremper to me. Almost certainly NOT a Rainwater/Las Vegas albino, since there are very few over here at all.
> 
> 2: The only way to tell for sure is to breed them to a KNOWN Tremper albino (Mack or otherwise). If you get ALL visual albino offspring, you've got Tremper albino macks. If you get any normal offspring, you don't have Tremper albino macks.
> 
> 3: Breeding a Tremper to a Bell will get you normals, normal macks and normal super macks who are het for Tremper AND Bell albino. And recovering the albinos in the second generation would be a pain - you'd find it hard going to decide whether you've got your 3/16ths chance Tremper, a 3/16ths chance Bell, or a 1/16th chance Tremper-Bell albino.


 

Thanks for your reply,
I have attached a few photos (more upto date of some geckos) of both offspring and the parents eye detail for confirmation.
I am surprised with the variety of apparent different morphs that my trio are produceing. Mainly being the double snake eyed daughter (which was mentioned on an earlier thread)
Have a look at the photos attached and see what you think about there Albino line.
If by normals you mean normal non Albino off spring I have non hatched. Although I have had a higher percentage of either Albinos or Albino Macks?
Again further photos attached.
I have found a Bell Albino Super Mack male for sale in the US which I was going to buy and collect from Ham in September. So follwing your reply I shall continue my search.
Please have a look at the photos and give me your views








This is a close up of the adult males eye, any clearer?








I have had quite a few young like this Albinos or Albino Macks? CJ gave me a usefull link on a earlier thread showing the differences but these offspring are certainly different to the other one below








Now this Hopefully a Super Giant(Tremper) Albino well the parents are bought as so, should be!!
The reason for this photo is to show a true Albino (above) against the off spring of the Mack Snow Albinos.









Another type of off spring, I have got this one down as Jungle Albino 
would I be correct?

















Finally the double snake eyed morph I know that both you and CJ gave explanations of the eyes but I am still a bit lost how to describe this gecko, and how best to use her in future breeding plans any ideas??

Basically being new to breeding geckos I am surprised to the number of varieties a morph can produce.








The latest addition and the older sister on the next post



Thans Baz


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

*The older sister*

Just an update on the older sisters colour change








Hous after hatching








and now


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## cjreptiles (Nov 13, 2006)

Very nice and definitely Trempers I'd say (the snows that is).

Think you are right about the jungle albino.

I'd probably call the other one a snake-eyed jungle albino.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

The older sister looks like a lovely Super Snow Albino. 

From a Mack albino to a Mack albino, you'd really expect:

25% Albino (not mack)
50% Mack Albino (single copy of Mack snow gene)
25% Super Snow Albino

So it does make sense that you're getting lots of albinos/mack albinos. 

Your paler babies look like Mack albinos; the more tangerine one looks like a definite not-Mack albino.


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

cjreptiles said:


> Very nice and definitely Trempers I'd say (the snows that is).
> 
> Think you are right about the jungle albino.
> 
> I'd probably call the other one a snake-eyed jungle albino.


 
Thanks
Any thoughts on the 2 Albino Macks or Albino Siblings still not 100% sure on there morph?








clearly different from the Super Giant Albino below in colour?











Regarding the Snake Eyed Jungle Albino would you pair it back to the father, Raptor or any other ideas? I feel that it is un common and would like to know how best to use its genetics next year.
Baz


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## cjreptiles (Nov 13, 2006)

baz said:


> Thanks
> Any thoughts on the 2 Albino Macks or Albino Siblings still not 100% sure on there morph?
> 
> clearly different from the Super Giant Albino below in colour?
> ...


With regards to the albino Macks/non-Macks, personally I would say they may not be Macks if the photo is taken straight after hatching. If they are a few days old then they may well be Macks, although it is hard to say really. This thread might help a little Albino or Snow Albino??? - GeckoForums.net

As for the snake-eye, you could pair it to a RAPTOR or possibly a red-eyed banded albino, of which there are a few available.


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

cjreptiles said:


> With regards to the albino Macks/non-Macks, personally I would say they may not be Macks if the photo is taken straight after hatching. If they are a few days old then they may well be Macks, although it is hard to say really. This thread might help a little Albino or Snow Albino??? - GeckoForums.net
> 
> As for the snake-eye, you could pair it to a RAPTOR or possibly a red-eyed banded albino, of which there are a few available.


 
I will probably pair the Mack Albinos ? back to the father next year? unless I can source or produce a (Tremper ) Super Albino Mack Snow.
Any Links?
Thanks
Baz


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

baz said:


> I will probably pair the Mack Albinos ? back to the father next year? unless I can source or produce a (Tremper ) Super Albino Mack Snow.
> Any Links?
> Thanks
> Baz


 
I forgot the youngsters are are about 4 weeks old


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## cjreptiles (Nov 13, 2006)

baz said:


> I forgot the youngsters are are about 4 weeks old


Hmm..I think probably Macks then. Did they hatch more white?


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

cjreptiles said:


> Hmm..I think probably Macks then. Did they hatch more white?


Yes I think they did.
The snake eyed jungle albino of a similar age was a lot brighter in colour to add further confusion


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

Ssthisto said:


> The older sister looks like a lovely Super Snow Albino.
> 
> From a Mack albino to a Mack albino, you'd really expect:
> 
> ...


Thanks
Here are another 2 siblings from the same trio

















There is a definate difference, in particular in the shoulder stripe. But this is certainly not as clear cut at the link CJ had provided on an earlier linlk.


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

*Quick update on Albino Mack Snows and another Question*



baz said:


> I have done threads regarding Albino Mack Snow Genetics before on this forum.
> To date I have only hatched 2 Supers from my breeding of my Albino Mack Trio, the first I incubated for male but unfortunately looks more female at the moment.
> So now possibly haveing 2 females and further eggs being incubated for female I have started looking to purchase a male Super.
> 
> ...


 

Just had my first true Albino Mack Hatch showing the very clear white bands. Thought people might be interested in a couple of photos for clarity. If any shared my confusion

















Pleased it taken on the parents Jungle pattern

Another youngster hatched from a pairing of the Male Mack Albino to a normal Albino.
I know you can not produce Supers from the pairing but the hatchling has an unusual appearance.
Further the eyes do appear to be unusual any ideas on this morph.
Photos below
Hatchling








Thought it was a Super at first, looking at the eye colour. Although there was colouration on the body and markings on the tail
4-5 weeks old








closeup on the eye which is slightly coloured red??









Any ideas on this morph???

Baz


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## monkeygirl (Mar 4, 2007)

when you say albino mack do you mean a true albino mack (like the one you hatched , that hatch pure white and pink) or a mack het albino? 

iv no idea what that hiatchling is but i dont not much about this particular genetic combination yet, im trying to understand it myself... very interesting though!


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

baz said:


> Any ideas on this morph???
> 
> Baz


It's probably one of two things, but I couldn't tell you for sure.

1. It's a Mack Patternless Albino (and your male is het patternless, and your female's het patternless)

2. It's a Mack Blazing Blizzard (and your male is het blizzard, and your female is het blizzard).

What's weird is that there's some patterning on the tail. Which makes me go "Huh?" That wouldn't be usual for either morph...

What's the history/lineage of the two animals in question?

By the way, the more yellow Mack albino offspring also make sense if you used a "tangerine" albino to breed them off of. Tangerines are bred for more and enhanced orange colouring, and that'll carry over to the Macks too. If you want really white Mack Albinos, I'd use the LEAST orangey-yellow albinos you can find.


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## baz (Feb 7, 2007)

I am told by the seller that the Mack Albinos were bought from AM Gecko. The male that was used is the one in the photo on link 14 of this thread.
The female Albino used appears to be no different to any of the other Albinos that I have, unknown history regarding her breeding.
I will certainly be keeping hold of the new one, and will see how it changes through its sheds. Its eye colour has changed from hatching.
Thanks for your comments.

Baz


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