# Royal Morphs: What would you pair up and why?



## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Ok, another theoretical question to see what people would produce if they had access to the same animals we do... granted, this'll be in two to three years time as all our morphs are youngsters, but...

Of these, what would you combine and why?

*Males:*
Standard Normal Captive-Farmed *Theo*
Light-coloured Normal CF *Johnny Mo*
Pewter (heterozygous cinnamon and heterozygous pastel, both traits codominant) *Alloy*
Pinstripe (at least heterozygous pinstripe, trait is dominant) *Tulip*
Lesser Platinum (heterozygous lesser, trait is codominant and allelic to mojave and butter) *Catalyst*
Fire (heterozygous fire, trait is codominant and "het black-eyed-leucistic") *Dante*
Pied (homozygous, recessive trait) *Piper*
Albino (homozygous, recessive trait) *Sherbert*
Ghost (homozygous, recessive trait) *Jacob*

*Females:*
Light-Coloured Normal *Miriel*
Standard Normal *Gogo*
Standard Normal *Elizabeth*
Dark-ish Normal *Mary*
Dark-ish Normal *Victoria*
Dark-ish Normal 100% het Pied *Lovett*
Butter (heterozygous butter, trait is codominant and allelic to mojave and lesser) *Butterscotch*
Mojave (heterozygous mojave, trait is codominant and allelic to butter and lesser) *Nevada*
Pastel (heterozygous pastel, codominant trait) *Rowntree*
Albino (homozygous, recessive trait) *Sorbet*
Ghost (homozygous, recessive trait) *Marley*

Also:

Miriel, Elizabeth, Mary and Victoria are all adult females over 1800 grams. They'll be ready to breed next winter, as will most if not all of the morph males. Which males would you breed to which of those four females, and why?


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

Well, not sure I am 'qualified' to answer this, but I will anyway... 

I would do: 

Pinstripe (Tulip) x Butter (Butterscotch) 

Fire (Dante) x Pastel (Rowntree) 

Pied (Piper) x Normal Het Pied (Lovett) 

Pewter (alloy) x Ghost(Marley) (eventually get pewter ghosts) 

Ghost (Jacob) x Mojave (Nevada) (eventualy get Mojave Ghosts) 

All of the above as I personally want the potential offspring, but couldn't justify the price tag! 

Not all of what you asked, and not very imaginitive either, sorry! :blush:


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## HadesDragons (Jun 30, 2007)

Bearing in mind I'm not really into Royals, so these are what I'd do from an "interest" point of view. This assumes that all are suitably distantly-related (you're probably as good a judge of that as anyone ):


_Next Winter_:

Johnny Mo x Miriel - see whether or not you can get any interesting, even paler babies OR Alloy x Miriel - see whether Miriel's paleness has any impact on the Pastel babies produced. (I'm sure other's would disagree and go for a more "money spinning" pairing - I'd be interested to try one of those though though just to see what happens...)

Dante x Elizabeth, Dante x Mary - I'd feel much happier crossing half-sibs to go for Black Eyed Leucys long term, so hold back a couple of Fire offspring from each pair.

Tulip x Victoria - Prove out whether het or ****, and get some nice Pinstriped babies while you're at it. Knowing het / **** would be useful for the future.


_Longer Term_:

Piper x Sorbet - DH Pied Albino; might be a nice one for the future if you can hold back a female and get hold of a (cheaper) male Albino het Pied or if you see a female available sooner and can afford it. Pied Albinos would be a nice little future project.

Piper x Lovett - 50% Pied.

Alloy x Rowntree - should be a nice combo.

Catalyst x Butterscotch, probably Catalyst x Nevada as well - Blue eyed Leucys.

(Dante x Elizabeth) x (Dante x Mary) - Given that the only way to produce Black Eyed Leucys (as far as I can see) from your collection is to breed your own female, you may as well go that step further and get some half-sib males to make the babies a bit less related, rather than breeding females back to Dante. As it's the females who take the time to mature, it wouldn't add any time to the project, it would just require an extra tub and be another mouth to feed.

Sherbert x Sorbet - Assuming that albino x albino pairings in Royals aren't prone to problems? Not sure on that one... If they are, then Sherbert x Victoria next winter to get a het male (rather than proving out the pinstripe), then het male x Sorbet when she's up to weight.

Jacob x Marley (as above).

Tulip x Rowntree - should get a diverse selection of visuals.

For the rest of the normal girls, I'd probably put either a high-end, visual recessive male to them to get some 100% hets, or one of the co-dom males (Alloy would be in there somewhere etc) to get a mix of visuals, depending on what's most appealing to you, and which lines you want more of...


Sorry if I've missed any out or missed a blatant combo - like I said I'm not that into Royal genetics...


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

midori said:


> Well, not sure I am 'qualified' to answer this, but I will anyway...
> Pinstripe (Tulip) x Butter (Butterscotch)
> Fire (Dante) x Pastel (Rowntree)
> Pied (Piper) x Normal Het Pied (Lovett)
> ...


Butter Pinstripe is definitely one of our plans - and Pewter/Mojo ghosts are a possible "long term" project too. I like where you're going with your ideas 



HadesDragons said:


> Bearing in mind I'm not really into Royals, so these are what I'd do from an "interest" point of view. This assumes that all are suitably distantly-related (you're probably as good a judge of that as anyone ):


As far as I'm aware, the majority of our animals are unrelated enough to pose no problems.



> Johnny Mo x Miriel - see whether or not you can get any interesting, even paler babies OR Alloy x Miriel - see whether Miriel's paleness has any impact on the Pastel babies produced. (I'm sure other's would disagree and go for a more "money spinning" pairing - I'd be interested to try one of those though though just to see what happens...)


My temptation with next winter is actually Miriel X Dante - Miriel is pale enough that I can't help but have a few suspicions (although if we saw a little white nose I'd be amazed) - but at any rate, it would produce nice pale fires! But I do have plans to put Alloy across her at some point as well for pale pewters and pastels (although I don't think it's an amazingly good cross to get "good" Cinnamons).



> Tulip x Victoria - Prove out whether het or ****, and get some nice Pinstriped babies while you're at it. Knowing het / **** would be useful for the future.


Indeed.



> Catalyst x Butterscotch, probably Catalyst x Nevada as well - Blue eyed Leucys.


That's why we've bought that particular trio


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## repkid (Nov 30, 2007)

Pinstripe x mojave!




























Only if you give me a jigsaw for free!!!


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

We do plan on making Jigsaws - but I'll be keeping the first one of the right sex (not sure yet whether we'll want a male in the long run or a female; probably a female since we don't have a female pinstripe yet) ... but that will be waiting until after Nevada has visited with Catalyst to make us a Blue-Eyed Leucistic.


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## Issa (Oct 13, 2006)

Alloy X Elizabeth - The double gene may carry over, it may not, either way you'll end up with some stunners, and possibly very nice longer term holdbacks

Dante x Miriel - Pretty fire babies!! 

Tulip x Mary - Should prove out whether or not he's het or homogenious, and you'd likely get a female holdback if he's not anyway to breed back to him.

Catalyst x Victoria - More lesser platty babies to either breed back or trade for different bloodline.

Longer term it looks like you are going have a lot of fun in a few years time, 1 idea if you had the patience of a saint. Make a truly "High Contrast Alibino", cross pastel to it and breed the hets back to each other.


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## repkid (Nov 30, 2007)

Ssthisto said:


> We do plan on making Jigsaws - but I'll be keeping the first one of the right sex (not sure yet whether we'll want a male in the long run or a female; probably a female since we don't have a female pinstripe yet) ... but that will be waiting until after Nevada has visited with Catalyst to make us a Blue-Eyed Leucistic.


How much are jigsaws currently going for?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Issa said:


> Longer term it looks like you are going have a lot of fun in a few years time, 1 idea if you had the patience of a saint. Make a truly "High Contrast Alibino", cross pastel to it and breed the hets back to each other.


I'm not sure that'd be the best way to go high-contrast albino - the pastel albinos I've seen seem to have faded-washy white areas.

The highest-contrast albinos I've seen are Cinnamon or Black Pastel albinos 



repkid said:


> How much are jigsaws currently going for?


No idea!


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

Ssthisto said:


> I'm not sure that'd be the best way to go high-contrast albino - the pastel albinos I've seen seem to have faded-washy white areas.
> 
> The highest-contrast albinos I've seen are Cinnamon or Black Pastel albinos
> 
> ...


I have to admit, I am not really keen on albinos, but Cinnamon albinos I like a lot. 

I have never seen a 'jigsaw' for sale, and have been wondering what a mojave x pin would look like for ages, since I considering buying a female pin and have a mojave male. (well nearly, he's not here yet) So now I know.... :blush: They aren't quite as nice as the butter pins, IMO, but still very nice and I really wouldn't mind one... :lol2:


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## Akua_Ko_Nalu (Feb 15, 2007)

Ssthisto said:


> Ok, another theoretical question to see what people would produce if they had access to the same animals we do... granted, this'll be in two to three years time as all our morphs are youngsters, but...
> 
> Of these, what would you combine and why?
> 
> ...



First of all, I'd breed your Male Albino to Normal Females with good contrast, rich black background and good golden markings. This will help you consistently produce High Contrast Albinos in the future.

I tend to breed Mojaves etc. with Females with a busy pattern (if Normal). It's amazing what pops out.

The rest is pretty straight forward, Ghost x Ghost etc.


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## Savanna (Nov 27, 2007)

Pewter in all sorts of forms lol. I love em :flrt: Bit out of my price range at the moemnt. Will see what this years breeding brings.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Well, we've got some updates to the list above - does that change what you'd choose to pair up?

*New Males:*
"normal" black-back looking with strong "tramline" markers *Dinker*
Yellowbelly *Irving*

*New Females:*
"normal" Clean, bright *Tabby*
Yellowbelly *Caitiff*
Fire *Randal*


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