# Time to open my breeding facility?



## G.R/Trooper (Feb 20, 2011)

Hai all and thanks in advance for advice. Ive been dealing with reptiles for the last 6 years and, whilst being fairly new to it i feel ive learnt a lot during my time. However this has only been in keeping them as pets, although i have been doing frantic research on breeding for the past 1 & 1/2 years. 

I now feel that it is time to put my plan into action, and i have managed to save up enough cash to allow me to start out. Im only going to start small and not get myself caught up in it too much that i have to quit my job, which is obviously what funded this in the first place.

In my garden we have a large brick shed thats been there for years and only really been used as my workshop when i build viv's and various other things. I am concidering utilising this space as ONE breeding facility, and also buying a garden shed/workshop for around £400 (the one i looked at was 6ft wide and 12ft long. Securing both of these would not be a problem as i am in that sort of trade. 

My concerns are insulating the buildings and ensuring that everything looks neat and tidy, after all i will (hopefully) be expanding and use more of my garden space to open a shop which would be accessible to the public. I will focus on breeding lizards, as im no fan of snakes, spiders, frogs etc. The only addition to the lizard breeding will be locust's for live food which, once again i have done extensive research in.

This is what i plan to breed at the start, and what i will go on to breeding as & when finance allows me. The * next to the names are the ones i shall be starting with at the very early stages, while the others are planned for much later when i have much more (hands on) experience.

Bearded Dragons*
Chinese Water Dragons*
Australian Water Dragons*
Leopard Geckos*
Argentine Tegu's
Bosc Monitors
Iguanas
Uro's*
Blue Tongued Skinks
Red Eye & Muddy Eye Croc Skinks*
Green / Brown Basilisk's*
Frilled Dragons
Rhinoceros Iguana's

My question is, or more to the point i would like some advice. Is there money in breeding these types? I know beardies dont pay too well lately. Is it far too time consuming for somebody that already works 8-11 hrs a day? Would it be rewarding enough?

Let me know what you think guys, as i said earlier i know enough but anything you can share with me is an added bonus. Your thoughts please.


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## fowlers (May 25, 2009)

what ever money is made from selling babies or offspring will only be spent on feeders, uv tubes and electric bills etc. i have around 50 animals at the moments and i work 5 days a week, its very hard, i dont really have any spare time. yesterday i was cleaning a few vivs, feeding all animals and setting up 2 cresty vivs, today setting up a bigger baby tank, transferring bigger babies to their new enclosure and transferring small babies to their new bigger enclosure, these have taken all my weekend, and last weekend i spent in the reptile room,i am also in my reptile room after i finish work, i also clean 12 adult chameleon vivs every thursday after work. i also more or less run the bodyshop i work for so not much time for myself.

your idea sounds great, until you actually start doing it, my reptile room has been set up for 1.5 years and it takes alot of work. the money in reptiles are in the rare species and new morphs. now i have all the reptiles i wish i bought a pair of blue tree monitors.

rob


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## G.R/Trooper (Feb 20, 2011)

*hhm*

I was afraid somebody would say that. I like my "me" time and dont want this project to feel like a chore, but rather a passion. Maybe ill narrow it down to beardies and water dragons untill i can get enough experience and money to take a dip into the rare breeding. Thanks Rob, appreciate your honesty.


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## vetdebbie (Jan 4, 2008)

Hmmm

We had about 300 corn hatchlings last year. I work 10 hours a day. Was spending half an hour in the morning checking feeding, then 2-3 hours every evening cleaning babies, feeding babies, checking eggs, etc. The adults would get a brief inspection mid week, and be cleaned at the weekend only. That was about 6-8 weeks worth, it did calm down after that, but I still spend an hour every evening with the animals, even during brumation. And that is a species which require feeding once a week, therefore poos once a week. Thank god the yemens hatched earlier is all I can say! I think this year I will have corns and panthers hatching the same time. If you like me time (and don't count that as cleaning time, which actually I do  ), then yes I would downgrade your plans.


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## G.R/Trooper (Feb 20, 2011)

*Ta*

Thanks Debbie, has begun to open my eyes. I doubt i could make enough money to do it as a full time occupation and therefore i must rethink this as i dont want to be spending hours on end dealing with these after work in the minimalistic free time i have already. Im afraid if i didnt have any time left it would take the enjoyment out of it. Thanks for your advice.


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## MP reptiles (Dec 30, 2010)

Well all i can say is one thing as im very interested in business and such as i do it at school. To make money you need to either be producinh new morphs(or morphs that are relatively new so that they still have their novelty value) or you need to mass produce like hundreds of babies. This is to do with leos. Another way is line breeding less new morphs and getting the best colour and pattern. All of this takes time a lot of effort. Im sure it is very rewarding and this is my view and im not a breeder so choose to agree or disagree. These are my views from my research.


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## alan1 (Nov 11, 2008)

as already said - tis better to be producing 5x £1000 animals, than 1000x £5 animals
will give you a little more 'spare' time too! : victory:


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## G.R/Trooper (Feb 20, 2011)

What sells for £1000 or anywhere around that though? PS: I hate snakes and terrified of spiders. Don't judge me its a past time thing =P


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## blood and guts (May 30, 2007)

Some of what your planning on breeding already has a massive over supplie, shops and rescues are full of beardies and leos.


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## MP reptiles (Dec 30, 2010)

I genuanly think that blue and green tree moniters have the novelty value just now i think they cost around £300 and they sell fast correct me on the price if im wrong but they do need big enclosures


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## Metal_face (Oct 2, 2008)

I work a 60 week at work on top of that I have around 150
leopard geckos. Basically I have no life lol i would say I get about 4 or 5 hours a week to myself! Don't get me wrong I really enjoy what I do and I make a nice chunk of money but it's something I'm passionate about. One thing you must to is determine who you are going to sell to. I have most of my lower end geckos presold to shops around the country. This basically covers the cost of food, equipment lecy costs etc then I sell the higher end geckos privately or at shows and this is where I earn my money. 

In terms of opening up your garden as a reptile shop :whistling2: I think your local council might have something to say about that.


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## MP reptiles (Dec 30, 2010)

Metal_face said:


> I work a 60 week at work on top of that I have around 150
> leopard geckos. Basically I have no life lol i would say I get about 4 or 5 hours a week to myself! Don't get me wrong I really enjoy what I do and I make a nice chunk of money but it's something I'm passionate about. One thing you must to is determine who you are going to sell to. I have most of my lower end geckos presold to shops around the country. This basically covers the cost of food, equipment lecy costs etc then I sell the higher end geckos privately or at shows and this is where I earn my money.
> 
> In terms of opening up your garden as a reptile shop :whistling2: I think your local council might have something to say about that.


 agree with the local council bit and my pet shop said that any morphs i produce this year that are either not holdbacks or not worth selling here ie normal het hypo het mack snow or hypo they will buy off me for a reduced price which is still more than i could fetch onhere for a hypo as they sell them for £75


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## LSReptiles (Oct 4, 2009)

MP reptiles said:


> agree with the local council bit and my pet shop said that any morphs i produce this year that are either not holdbacks or not worth selling here ie normal het hypo het mack snow or hypo they will buy off me for a reduced price which is still more than i could fetch onhere for a hypo as they sell them for £75


mack snows are co-dom, therfore a het mack snow doesn't exist.

Fiji iguanas are expensive to buy and high in demand to give you an idea, I sometimes see them in the classifieds fo usually about 800-900 pounds each :no1:


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## BenjaminBoaz (Jan 6, 2006)

Have you or are you going to be applying for a pet shop leicence if your planning on breeding in such a large way ?

Seems to me you still have a lot of thinking and planning to do. 
By the time you've bought something expensive, got it up to size for breeding and got offspring the babies could have dropped loads in value. (know you don't like snakes but morph prices there have dropped loads very quickly)


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## cornmorphs (Jan 28, 2005)

As far as I remember, you only need the pet shop licence if you sell animals that you dont produce, and/or are looking to make a good living.
I looked into it a few years back, and decided there was no way on this planet I would be able to live off of corns. Only the top few guys who produce all the new morphs really can do that.
similar with most things I would imagine.
but anyway.. my story quickly.
I try to plan to produce new morphs that havent been made yet, or at least not be too far behind the 1st people that have done so.
I have dropped my working hours down to 48-60 now, 48 most weeks. On top of that I have 4 daughters, 2 at school and one at nurssery due to go to school in sept.
My job just about pays my bills, and the snakes generally pay for themselves. sometimes it costs me, sometimes I have a bit spare... but the majority of the time It just rolls along paying for itself. 
I certainly wouldnt be able to keep the amount of snakes I do otherwise. I guess I have a little over 100 corns that I plan to keep, with the odd ones left to be sold, then about 10-12 non corns that will all be sold in time.
For me, its a case of do it as a hobby, all go all out and attempt to live off of it. I have spoken to a few people on here who do live off of it, but I just cant see how they do really.


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## MP reptiles (Dec 30, 2010)

LSReptiles said:


> mack snows are co-dom, therfore a het mack snow doesn't exist.
> 
> Fiji iguanas are expensive to buy and high in demand to give you an idea, I sometimes see them in the classifieds fo usually about 800-900 pounds each :no1:


 it was an example


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## BenjaminBoaz (Jan 6, 2006)

You said your opening a breeding facility which sounds your planning on breeding a lot. Therefore you would have to run it as a business and declare income. Really you should do this even if your nit making enough. There's only a set amount you can earn before paying tax. You have to be careful if your advertising loads if high priced reps to the public as in essence your a shop. Don't think the tax man doesnt get involved with breeders - it does happen. Your best keeping records of what you've bought and spent and made. 
You said you wanted people to come to u so that sounds just like a shop to me and a facility sounds like your in it for the money rather than a hobbiest selling some surplus stock. 
If you went out and bought high end morphs and took two years to raise them they will have dropped so much you wouldn't get much for them.

(motley boas dropped from over £1000 to less than £350 in 12 months. Salmons dropped from £300 to £75) 
Boscs aren't worth breeding in my eyes. Large amounts of food and space required for what ? £15 trade? 
Basic bearded dragons and Yemen £5 -£7.50 trade? All eat lots. 
Why not keep something you like rather that try to keep lots, especially when you say you haven't got the time to spend.


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## BenjaminBoaz (Jan 6, 2006)

Don't think you've thought this through well at all. Have you ever been to a reptile show? If you had you will have seen loads of cresties, leopards, beardies, panther, yemen for sale and many that buy think they are going to breed and make money. Some people are beginning to find it hard selling there stock or having to lower their prices that they aren't manking any money. All fine getting something more rare but again who's going to buy them? Is there a market for said animal? 
There are many out there that are years ahead of you and struggling to sell offspring. 
You better keeping something you like and if you breed great. 
Many shops breed there own animals and when it come to you trying to sell your stock to pet shops you may find that they have bred enough themselves and change there minds. Even if you spent £2000 on fuji's do you think they will still be that price in two years? I doubt they will even be half that price.


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