# Another Royal genetics questions...



## jayjay_dannii23 (Mar 16, 2010)

Well I've been playing this through my mind over and over again and I'm still a little confused :bash:
We just bought ourselves a Lesser and Mojave and I know the potential outcome would be a Blue Eyed Leusistic but would it actually be a Dominant or co-Dominant Gene?
I know if you put 2 Lessers, then the BEL would be dominant and also same with the Mojave but is it the same with Mojave Lessser cross?
Thanks in advance guys :notworthy:
Jay


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Any offspring from Co-dom will always be Co-dom (they don't switch over to Dom), so a BeL from a Lesser x Mojave will also be Co-dom :2thumb:.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

jayjay_dannii23 said:


> I know if you put 2 Lessers, then the BEL would be dominant


No, the BluEL would not suddenly make Lesser "dominant".

Dominant genes look exactly the same in homozygous (two-copies) form as they do in heterozygous (single-copy) form.

A(homozygous lesser) BluEL doesn't look like a Lesser (heterozygous lesser), therefore Lesser is not dominant, no matter whether there's one copy of it or two.

If you have a Mojave/Lesser BluEL, then the offspring of that animal will EITHER be Lessers OR they will be Mojaves - the two genes are different "flavours" that fit on the same gene pair.


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## paulh (Sep 19, 2007)

jayjay_dannii23 said:


> Well I've been playing this through my mind over and over again and I'm still a little confused :bash:
> We just bought ourselves a Lesser and Mojave and I know the potential outcome would be a Blue Eyed Leusistic but would it actually be a Dominant or co-Dominant Gene?
> I know if you put 2 Lessers, then the BEL would be dominant and also same with the Mojave but is it the same with Mojave Lessser cross?
> Thanks in advance guys :notworthy:
> Jay


The herper genetics sites have you confused because most are confused about definitions of genetics jargon. Particularly the definitions of dominant and codominant. I sometimes think the closest many have come to a genetics textbook is to use it as a pillow. 

Lets start with the actual genes. 

A lesser platinum royal has a lesser platinum mutant gene paired with a normal gene. A mojave royal has a mojave mutant gene paired with a normal gene.

lesser platinum royal x mojave royal -->
1/4 normal (2 normal genes)
1/4 mojave (mojave mutant gene and normal gene)
1/4 lesser platinum (lesser platinum mutant gene and normal gene)
1/4 BEL (lesser platinum mutant gene paired with mojave mutant gene)
(Fractions are odds per egg, not per clutch.)

Here are definitions to apply to the snakes above.

A normal-looking snake looks like most of the snakes in the wild. A normal gene is the gene that is the most common in a given location in the cell chromosomes in the wild snakes. A mutant gene is a gene that is NOT the most common in a given location in the cell chromosomes in the wild snakes. 

There are two genes in a gene pair. All gene pairs are either homozygous or heterozygous (slang = het). A homozygous snake has a homozygous gene pair. A heterozygous snake has a heterozygous gene pair.

The two genes in a homozygous gene pair are the same. Either two copies of the same mutant gene or two copies of the normal gene.

The two genes in a heterozygous gene pair are NOT the same. The gene pair may have either two different mutant genes or a mutant gene and a normal gene. If a mutant gene and a normal gene, the mutant gene can be dominant, codominant or recessive to the normal gene. If two different mutant genes, one mutant gene can be dominant, codominant or recessive to the other mutant.

Among the babies in the lesser platinum x mojave mating, the normal snake has two normal genes in the gene pair. This gene pair is homozygous.

Among the babies in the lesser platinum x mojave mating, the lesser platinums have a lesser platinum gene and a normal gene. These genes are not the same, so the gene pair is heterozygous. And the mojave babies have a mojave gene and a normal gene. These genes are not the same, so this gene pair is heterozygous, too. Neither of these heterozygous snakes look normal, but that is all right. There is nothing in the definition of heterozygous that requires the snakes to look normal.

The BEL babies have a lesser platinum mutant gene paired with a mojave mutant gene. These genes are not the same, so this gene pair is heterozygous.

If both genes in the gene pair are normal, then the snake is normal and looks like most of the wild snakes. If both genes in the gene pair are mutant, then the snake shows the full expression of the mutant genes. The next question is, what does the heterozygous snake look like.

The heterozygous snake could look like a snake with two normal genes and not like the snake with two mutant genes. The mutant gene is recessive to the normal gene.

The heterozygous snake could look like a snake with two mutant genes and not like the snake with two normal genes. The mutant gene is dominant to the normal gene.

The heterozygous snake could look like neither a snake with two normal genes nor the snake with two mutant genes. The mutant gene is codominant to the normal gene.

If the heterozygous snakes do not exactly fit one of these three categories, then the category with the best fit is chosen.

A lesser platinum royal python has a lesser platinum mutant gene paired with a normal gene. It does not look like a royal python with two normal genes, and it does not look like a BEL royal with two lesser platinum genes. Therefore, the lesser platinum mutant gene is codominant to the normal gene. 

A mojave royal python has a mojave mutant gene paired with a normal gene. It does not look like a royal python with two normal genes, and it does not look like a super mojave royal with two mojave genes. Therefore, the mojave mutant gene is codominant to the normal gene. 

A super mojave royal has two mojave mutant genes. It has a little pigment, mostly on the head. A BEL with two lesser platinum genes does not have any pigment on the head. A BEL with a lesser platinum gene and a mojave gene looks like a BEL with two lesser platinum genes. Therefore, the lesser platinum gene is dominant to the mojave gene, and the mojave gene is recessive to the lesser platinum gene.

This is equal to about half a chapter in a genetics text. It is very likely to take several readings to absorb it.


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## jayjay_dannii23 (Mar 16, 2010)

Thank you Paul for that very detailed answer, which as you said would take a couple reads for it to absorb but it now has.
Thank you for clearing that question for me as reading a lot of books confused me a little. I shall now be able to rest without something like this going through my mind :lol2:
Thanks again:notworthy:

Jay


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## RubbleUK (Apr 12, 2007)

Hi Jay,

Just saw your thread so thought I'd post a couple of comments.

Mojave x Lesser = 25% chance per egg of a Blue Eyed Leucistic. If you remember when you came round, I showed you a Super Mojave with the purple head markings and a Super Butter (Butter/Lesser are pretty much the same gene) which was pure white. Mojave x Lesser BELs are normally clean white with no silver/purple head markings and visually are almost identical to a Super Lesser/Super Butter.

However, when a Mojave x Lesser BEL is paired with a normal, the offspring have a 50% chance per egg of being Mojave and a 50% chance per egg of being Lesser. As it's 50/50 per egg, it's still possible for the offspring to be all Mojave or all Lesser but as you have one of each already, you'll know the difference. 

The BEL complex (complex meaning group of genes that produce BELs) is interesting because despite being a mixture of 2 different genes, it behaves like a super i.e. no normal offspring are produced from a BEL x normal pairing but no BELs are produced either. 

One advantage of a Mojave x Lesser BEL is that you can get a wider variation of offspring compared to say a Lesser x Lesser BEL. For example:

Mojave/Lesser BEL x Spider:

25% Mojave
25% Lesser
25% Spimo (Mojave Spider)
25% Lesser Bee (Lesser Spider)

Lesser/Lesser BEL x Spider:

50% Lesser
50% Lesser Bee

Hope that helps but if you get stuck, shout!


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Hi Chris,

If a Lesser/Mojave BeL was mated to a Cinny what would that produce please? Will be a pairing i'd like to do when i breed a BeL, providing it's a male :2thumb:. I know Mojave x Cinny is a Savannah but was is a Lesser x Cinny?


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## jnr (Jan 1, 2009)

corny girl said:


> Hi Chris,
> 
> If a Lesser/Mojave BeL was mated to a Cinny what would that produce please? Will be a pairing i'd like to do when i breed a BeL, providing it's a male :2thumb:. I know Mojave x Cinny is a Savannah but was is a Lesser x Cinny?


Mojave
Lesser
Cinny mojave
Cinny lesser


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

jnr said:


> Mojave
> Lesser
> Cinny mojave
> Cinny lesser


Thanks Bruce :2thumb:. Is there a name for the Lesser Cinny? Like the Mojave Cinny is called a Savannah :2thumb:.


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## jnr (Jan 1, 2009)

corny girl said:


> Thanks Bruce :2thumb:. Is there a name for the Lesser Cinny? Like the Mojave Cinny is called a Savannah :2thumb:.


Not that I know of..planning the same with a bel but using the black pastel over the cinny..: victory:

Black magic..black pastel mojo


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

jnr said:


> Not that I know of..planning the same with a bel but using the black pastel over the cinny..: victory:
> 
> Black magic..black pastel mojo
> image
> ...



The Black Magic is awesome :mf_dribble::mf_dribble::mf_dribble:. Sadly i don't have a Black Pastel so will have to make do with Cinny :2thumb:.


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## RubbleUK (Apr 12, 2007)

Lesser/Butter x Cinny = Lithium


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

RubbleUK said:


> Lesser/Butter x Cinny = Lithium



Thanks Chris :2thumb:.


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## jnr (Jan 1, 2009)

RubbleUK said:


> Lesser/Butter x Cinny = Lithium


Thats intresting Chris..is their a name for the bp version, would it still be a lithium or called something else?


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