# Breeding Hyla Arborea



## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I should be getting some adult _Hyla Arborea_ in the spring after they come out of hibernation and I'm wondering what the best way to breed them is. And what male to female ratio would be the best for breeding. I'm also wondering, Is there much of a market for juveniles? As I don't want to raise loads and end up with nobody wanting any.
It would also help to know how best to raise tadpoles. Any tips/advice would be appreciated.

Stuart


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

They are easy to breed in vivaria. put them in a tall aquarium with branches and plants, with water on the bottom to a level of a couple of inches. Heat the water to about 75F and leave in a sunny place. Make sure that they cannot overheat though and you should get eggs within a few days. I would have a ratio of 2.1 but dont have the aquarium in the house as the males are very noisy.

The young are salable if you pitch them at the right price, I would think about £5 each.

Rearing the tadpoles is easy , much like Common Frogs or Common Toads. The only thing I have found is that they lie the water temperature warmer , 70F . They will climb out of the water as soon as they have front legs so its best to put them uin a covered vivarium then.


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## frogworlduk (Mar 27, 2009)

if you do raise alot try the wholesalers. they sell like hot cakes but their buying price would be a little lower


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Thanks for your advice.
How can I get hold of wholesalers?

Stuart


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

colinm said:


> They are easy to breed in vivaria. put them in a tall aquarium with branches and plants, with water on the bottom to a level of a couple of inches. Heat the water to about 75F and leave in a sunny place. Make sure that they cannot overheat though and you should get eggs within a few days. I would have a ratio of 2.1 but dont have the aquarium in the house as the males are very noisy.
> 
> The young are salable if you pitch them at the right price, I would think about £5 each.
> 
> Rearing the tadpoles is easy , much like Common Frogs or Common Toads. The only thing I have found is that they lie the water temperature warmer , 70F . They will climb out of the water as soon as they have front legs so its best to put them uin a covered vivarium then.


Roughly how many weeks do they take to metamorphose?
£5 sounds like a good price to sell them at.

Stuart


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Its a long time since I have bred them but I would say six to eight weeks. Sometimes you see them more expensive than £5 but it really depends on the size and age. If you can breed them and get them to metamorphose in time you would probably be better selling them at a show, Doncaster in June or September, or Kempton Park in August.


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## Arcadiajohn (Jan 30, 2011)

I know that our good friend Neil at livefoodsbypost on the IOW really drilled down the process to get good numbers.

He is always willing to chat 

may offer you some insight also.

john,


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Arcadiajohn said:


> I know that our good friend Neil at livefoodsbypost on the IOW really drilled down the process to get good numbers.
> 
> He is always willing to chat
> 
> ...


How could I contact him?

What would the the best way to raise about 1,000-2,000 to juveniles?

Stuart


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

I believe he bred the North American Hyla cinerea. But they are similar in habits.



I wouldn`t try to raise that many unless you have lots of water tanks and lots of time. To do that you need lots of space otherwise you will end up with tiny metamorphs that need raising on before selling.Its best to raise a couple of hundred at 1cm long than thousands at 0.5cm long.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I have the funds set aside to raise that many, how best should I raise them? I do have a lot of time so that shouldn't be a problem.

Stuart


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

When I raised them I raised between twenty and thirty in a 60 x 30 x 30 cm aquarium in a sunny spot in the garden . Plasterers baths are fairly cheap at about £35 each. I would raise fifty or sixty in each and then you would have good size youngsters. thats why I say that its not worth raising thousands.

Also I dont think that there are that many people around who would buy that number.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I know people all have different experiences, but roughly how many eggs do they lay? I'm asking everyone just so I get a general idea.

Stuart


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Stupot1610 said:


> I have the funds set aside to raise that many, how best should I raise them? I do have a lot of time so that shouldn't be a problem.
> 
> Stuart


My concern is that your set on raising these frogs just for the money.
Not for their well being.
I`m getting the impression that your not really taking on board what Colin is trying to tell you.
Can you sell 100 of them ?
I know someone who had 300 milk frogs and has been trying to sell them for about 6 months.
So what make you think you`ll sell 2000 of these easily ?


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Don't worry it's not about the money, me and Colin have been talking a lot on PM and I am definitely taking on board what he's saying. I'm trying to raise so many because I've been speaking to a wholesaler who says if I can raise enough froglets for him he will stock them instead of wild caught hyla cinerea. I am only being offered £2 per frog maximum, this is not for the money. It's a project for myself, and it might be hard work but I enjoy having a project that challenges me, as well as being a good learning experience and an attempt to lower the numbers of wild caught hyla cinerea being sold, he tells me he sells 1-1,400 every year and if I can replace them with healthy captive bred hyla arborea then I can see it as nothing but a good thing. So if I have the space, time and savings to do this then I dont see why I shouldnt. I know it's going to make very little difference over all to the amount of wild caught hyla cinerea being brought into the UK but at least it's something. 
I hope I didn't come accross negatively because I really do appreciate your concern. And if at any point I feel that their well being is affected then it will be quickly resolved. I wouldn't raise any more than I could find homes for. I really am thinking this through, I have three or four months before they start breeding and in that time I can easily get everything sorted out.
Regards,
Stuart


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

I`m glad you`ve not taken my comments wrongly.
They are a nice wee frog and we have some here but not had much luck with them.
From what I`ve read they roam wild in some parts of the UK but have not been very successful in the wild.
If I had a thousand youngsters I must admit I`d be very tempted to let them loose and see if they could expand their population a bit.
So I`ll just add good luck with them.
Where abouts are you Stuart ?


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Thanks, I could completely see where you were coming from and I would have been the same as you. I've heard of populations around London and the new forest but I think the locations were published and the populations very quickly disappeared after that, so I really don't know about their current status. I'm in East coast Fife.
I'm planning on raising the tadpoles in 130 litre containers, fed on regular tadpole food that I would use when raising common frogs then after metamorphosis I'll feed them and grow them on slightly for a month and then if all goes well up until then, they should go off to the wholesalers quite quickly after that. You don't happen to know roughly how many eggs they usually lay? I've read so many articles all saying different amounts and it's got me a bit puzzled.
Thanks,
Stuart


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Ah your down St Andrews way, cool.
I forget now the locations where I`d read they were to be found.
Hopefully one day they will get a proper foothold.


Mike


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

Stupot1610 said:


> Don't worry it's not about the money, me and Colin have been talking a lot on PM and I am definitely taking on board what he's saying. I'm trying to raise so many because I've been speaking to a wholesaler who says if I can raise enough froglets for him he will stock them instead of wild caught hyla cinerea. I am only being offered £2 per frog maximum, this is not for the money. It's a project for myself, and it might be hard work but I enjoy having a project that challenges me, as well as being a good learning experience and an attempt to lower the numbers of wild caught hyla cinerea being sold, he tells me he sells 1-1,400 every year and if I can replace them with healthy captive bred hyla arborea then I can see it as nothing but a good thing. So if I have the space, time and savings to do this then I dont see why I shouldnt. I know it's going to make very little difference over all to the amount of wild caught hyla cinerea being brought into the UK but at least it's something.
> I hope I didn't come accross negatively because I really do appreciate your concern. And if at any point I feel that their well being is affected then it will be quickly resolved. I wouldn't raise any more than I could find homes for. I really am thinking this through, I have three or four months before they start breeding and in that time I can easily get everything sorted out.
> Regards,
> Stuart



Hi Stuart,

H.arborea are seasonal breeders which means you will, if successful in your endeavours, have 2000 little mouths to feed in a relatively close period of time. Now, your wholesaler sells say 1400 ADULT H.cinerea every YEAR. Right there is your problem - despite what you've been told, no wholesaler in the country is going to pay £4000 for your 2000 4 week OOW's in one hit, I don't mean to be blunt but that is just a nonsense. There is simply not the demand in this country for that quantity at any one time, it is not commercially viable business sense - your wholesaler is importing 1400 cinerea over a whole year not a couple of months, and shifting them in smaller numbers. Your wholesaler will not want to be lumbered with, feeding, trying to clean out 2000 agile baby tree frogs either - have you ever tried it? Time consuming and a pain in the backside is not the word - and I talk from experience of only ever having to clean out a maximum of 250 or so frogs at once, not 2000!. Plus do bear in mind these are experienced businessmen - knowing you have 2000 little mouths to feed plays very much into their hands and they will know they hold the aces when you need to shift them - you may find that the £2 offered quickly becomes more like 20p. The trade in WC cinerea will continue for as long as it will because they're extremely cheap to buy, an industry favourite, and a ready made reasonably sized attractive little green frog that retail anywhere from as little as £7 upwards - and that my friend is the harsh reality. But all that being said, there is a small market for arborea - and if you breed say 50 to a 100 a season and have the facilities to hold them over the course of a year and the means to sell them then you should be able to easily get a much better price than £2 each for them.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I can see where you're coming from, thanks for the input. But, I have spoken a lot with the wholesaler and we have it all sorted out. They will be going as two or three shipments. Besides, It's not just one wholesaler that's been interested in them, I have spoken to three and they all would be very interested in "large quantities". But thanks for the concern.

Stuart


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

frogman955 said:


> Ah your down St Andrews way, cool.
> I forget now the locations where I`d read they were to be found.
> Hopefully one day they will get a proper foothold.
> 
> ...


I have read that they could actually be a native species that has been overlooked. It's a very interesting, yet controversial, topic. Personally, I think they should be classed as native, but I know many people will disagree with me. I've only read of populations in England, do you know of any further north?

Stuart


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## creepycrawlies (Dec 2, 2014)

Feeding that many babies after the morph will be the biggest challenge I think. If I were you, id build small aviary type cages in the garden. I'd use mesh that is small enough for flies and insects to slip through but not baby frogs. I would then bait the inside of the cage with rotten fruit, meat and rotten logs and leaves. This will attract in tons of wild livefood.

You should start practising some fruitfly and springtail cultures now also so that you can perfect rearing the quantities you will need.

To make this viable you will have to do it as cost effectively as possible.

I disagree with the comments above, I think there is most certainly a market in the UK for that many and more arborea.

I think that if your stuck with some at the end of the season, take them over to hamm and you will sell them no problem!

Good luck with it. I am glad to see such initiative


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Not wishing to pour cold water on the plans, they are a hell of a lot of tadpoles to rear. I agree with Alex . The market in American Greens is a cheap market in adult frogs . These will be small frogs that not all hobbyists will want. The people who rear Red Eyes, Whites and even Pacmans do not do it on that scale and these are far more saleable frogs. I think that you are better off raising a couple of hundred and selling them directly to the hooyists rather than wholesalers. You will get a higher price for each individual and I don't think that there's the market here ( or Hamm) for a couple of thousand European Treefrogs.

It really is a labour of love to rear vast quantities of young. The food bill itself will be extortionate because if you rear the tadpoles correctly they will be taking size two or three crickets when they metamorphose.


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Stupot1610 said:


> I have read that they could actually be a native species that has been overlooked. It's a very interesting, yet controversial, topic. Personally, I think they should be classed as native, but I know many people will disagree with me. I've only read of populations in England, *do you know of any further north*?
> 
> Stuart


 
Unfortunately I don`t know of any Stuart.


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I actually don't think there are any, or if there are the people who know about them won't say:lol2:

I think it would be nice if they became an established species in the UK.

Stuart


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## LFBP-NEIL (Apr 23, 2005)

I am a bit late spotting this thread sorry..

First of all if you want to breed hundreds of these type of species treat it as a labour of love as you are unlikely to break even on the venture, if you follow this link you will see a video of how i reared the tadpoles, basically lots of large really usuefull boxes with air stone driven undergravel filtration, effectively a lot of mini ponds..

the tadpoles were transferred into these once the spawn had hatched and become free swimming, you keep them in these and feed them algae tabs, bloodworm and fish flake until they start to metamorph at which point you need to attach a top half to the "pond" to catch the emerging froglets that can then be transferred into a rearing terrarium. 

Sadly when we moved premises (downsized) i had to scale back the green tree frogs and now just have one colony of them. 

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=128431247306384


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## creepycrawlies (Dec 2, 2014)

That's an amazing project. I'd love to hear more about it.... How did you condition the adults? What type of enclosures did you spawn them in? Etc. Well done on taking the initiative and having the fore sight to start such a project. Keep up the great work. Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Yeah I'd like to hear more about your hyla cinerea project too!

Thanks.
Stuart


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## LFBP-NEIL (Apr 23, 2005)

Nothing too exciting really, Buy a group of wild caught american green tree frogs, fatten them up in a large glass terrarium, when they all look fat and healthy in the spring, warm them up a bit more, put a rain system on 24/7, flood the bottom of the tank, put a sponge filter in the bottom and wait for the spawn.. once they spawn remove it into an aquarium with sponge filter.. when the tadpoles become free swimming.. move them into large really usefull boxes full of water with undergravel filters... when they start to morph put a top on the tubs to catch the froglets and place them into their own glass terrariums in batches and et voila lots of little froggys. 

tips i learnt was plenty of water, if the tads are overcrowded you get cannibalism and slow growth, plenty of food.. bloodworms, frozen aquatic blocks, algae tabs, fish flake etc..


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Hi Stuart.
Any updates on how your getting on with your project ?


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

frogman955 said:


> Hi Stuart.
> Any updates on how your getting on with your project ?
> 
> 
> Mike


Nothing much to tell yet. Just waiting for my first group to spawn, I should be getting another couple of pairs from a friend in about a month. Expecting the first lot of eggs in about 2-3 weeks once the weather gets better again - we had amazing (24c) weather for a few weeks about a month ago, and then its been like that on and off till now. Also, though a bit off topic, Im hoping to get some pairs of B. viridis and B. calamita (legal with paperwork from a european line) in about a month too. And then I was thinking of trying some H. cinerea later in the summer just for the fun of it! My newts have all started laying, but they don't take much stimulation, the frogs can take a bit more effort but it's worth it in the end.

Stuart


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Ha it sounds like you could end up being very busy Stuart.
Keep me updated on the Hyla Arborea though as if at all possible I`d like a few off you for my wife.


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

frogman955 said:


> Ha it sounds like you could end up being very busy Stuart.
> Keep me updated on the Hyla Arborea though as if at all possible I`d like a few off you for my wife.
> 
> 
> Mike


Yeah no problem. Should have plenty to give away in the autumn. Also lots of other species, if you want some you can have them free - I'm not in the hobby for a profit :2thumb:


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

That's very generous Stuart thanks.
But I`d give something for them as the hobby needs to be supported.
Can sort that out later though.


Mike


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

The arborea season is up and running here in the south, I've had spawnings from multiple pairs since last Sunday, and the first batches are developing nicely.

Cheers
Al


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Alex M said:


> The arborea season is up and running here in the south, I've had spawnings from multiple pairs since last Sunday, and the first batches are developing nicely.
> 
> Cheers
> Al


That's good. How many pairs have you got, Alex?
It seems to take a couple of weeks longer for things to start breeding up here.


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

Stupot1610 said:


> That's good. How many pairs have you got, Alex?
> It seems to take a couple of weeks longer for things to start breeding up here.


Hi Stuart, 

I've got around 12+, but believe me - you pay for it with the noise! 

Cheers
Al


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Alex M said:


> Hi Stuart,
> 
> I've got around 12+, but believe me - you pay for it with the noise!
> 
> ...


Haha. Yeah, I can imagine the noise! Do you breed them in a greenhouse?

Stuart.


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

And there was me at one time thinking about setting a tank up in the house lol.
Looks like the noise issue that everyone keeps on about might be a problem.
We have only the one here as we lost the others last year.
We did in fact keep them in the house originally, but couldn`t understand why we were losing them.
So I bit the bullet and put the last 3 outside in the summerhouse and although we lost 2 of them the last and oldest one changed dramatically.
It started putting weight on and it changed almost overnight to being constantly bright green as it should have been rather than looking dull and sort of brown.
So I`m now of the opinion that these frogs are not suitable for indoors.
I am now discussing with my wife about building an outdoor enclosure for them to see if we can have more success with them.
We have a nice sheltered bit outside where they can miss the sun during the hottest part of the day and get it later in the day when it should be a bit cooler.
One concern I have is that I have a pond which is full of common frogs so I have the issue of possible contamination from them.
I`m not aware of there being any chytrid up here ... yet, but you can never tell.


Mike


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

Nope, but I do keep them outdoors - I have, touch wood, understanding neighbours either side and behind, and in the summer when the many species are all calling in unison the level of noise can be something else - the villagers call it Jurassic Park...


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Seriously, are they that loud ?
The frogs in the pond at least are not too noisy even when I`ve counted 30 odd of them going at it.


Mike


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

I'm afraid so Mike, if you're referring to our native temporaria then there's absolutely no contest in volume whatsoever - temporaria are quiet. Groups of arborea have been recorded at 87 decibels so that'll give you an idea of what you're up against if you do decide to keep them in numbers. Re keeping them in the garden - no need to not keep them in the sunniest spot, like many other European anurans they appreciate being able to bask in full sun, so the answer is to just provide a fully ventilated enclosure with appropriate cover should they wish to retreat from the heat of the midday rays. As a side note, in the wilds of mainland Europe, they're particularly fond of bramble bushes so if you don't mind the odd scratch or two you may want to plant some in their enclosure as I have done in pots.

Cheers
Al


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

87 is loud lol.
But thanks for that info as it gives a lot of food for thought.


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Alex M said:


> Nope, but I do keep them outdoors - I have, touch wood, understanding neighbours either side and behind, and in the summer when the many species are all calling in unison the level of noise can be something else - the villagers call it Jurassic Park...


Ah ok. So what kind of stimulation do they need?


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

frogman955 said:


> 87 is loud lol.
> But thanks for that info as it gives a lot of food for thought.
> 
> 
> Mike


Someone in our street has a dog/dogs that bark at night. So, if they're alowed dogs that bark at night I'm allowed frogs that bark at night!! :lol2:


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

frogman955 said:


> 87 is loud lol.
> But thanks for that info as it gives a lot of food for thought.
> 
> 
> Mike


By the way, if you do end up getting some from me, my stock are from Dresden in Germany so they are very, very tough.

Stuart


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Stupot1610 said:


> Someone in our street has a dog/dogs that bark at night. So, if they're alowed dogs that bark at night I'm allowed frogs that bark at night!! :lol2:


That sounds fair to me lol.
I`ll hang fire and see how you get on Stuart.
It`s not like there is anyone up here who has any, that I know of.
But in the meantime I`ll talk to my wife and see what she wants to do re setting up an outside enclosure for them.
As it stand there is room in the viv for several more with our lonely soul so at least we have plenty time to sort something out.


Mike


Mike


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Alex M said:


> I'm afraid so Mike, if you're referring to our native temporaria then there's absolutely no contest in volume whatsoever - temporaria are quiet. Groups of arborea have been recorded at 87 decibels so that'll give you an idea of what you're up against if you do decide to keep them in numbers. Re keeping them in the garden - no need to not keep them in the sunniest spot, like many other European anurans they appreciate being able to bask in full sun, so the answer is to just provide a fully ventilated enclosure with appropriate cover should they wish to retreat from the heat of the midday rays. As a side note, in the wilds of mainland Europe, they're particularly fond of bramble bushes so if you don't mind the odd scratch or two you may want to plant some in their enclosure as I have done in pots.
> 
> Cheers
> Al


 Al,there is a post from Ben years back mate that has me smiling on the brambles, and where your post took my brain:I best not go there,:Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2: 

But suffice to say,there are cultivars of thornless bramble out there,for those not so damn hard as the villagers of Dorset. But brambles and aborea are a new one to me:2thumb: cheers for this.

Lads I'll declare a deep interest here if I haven't already,always had a soft spot for these,which goes way back,a very special little frog I always yearned for as a child. Best of luck to all three of you with your challenges to breed and keep

Stu


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Hi Stu
There is actually a video lurking on youtube showing them hunkering down on a thorny bramble.
So it`s certainly something to think about.


Mike


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I have seen a lot of pictures and reports of arborea enjoying bramble for climbing about and resting on leaves. I bought a clematis for my enclosure today (nothing special, just one with pink flowers I saw in morrisons tonight!) which I'm hoping will fill out a bit and the frogs will enjoy it. I'm going to go and dig up a bramble from behind my hedge next weekend too. I've also been told by a friend, who has seen them wild many times, that they like to bask on reeds in the sun when it gets hot - plants like Bullrush and flag iris, which can be bought cheaply.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

I like this video, really shows off the noise from the males; http://youtu.be/wFljaj0ybG0


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Guys bramble propagates by tip layering ,so simply placing a tip in a pot and anchoring it ,should if things pan out produce a new plant. I think there is wisdom in ol Al's post about putting them in a pot. Strong plants the humble blackberry ya gotta admire them. Me, ok we know soft,I'd have some thornless please ( not for me...for the frogs.... bloody heck!:Na_Na_Na_Na and Stu I might just know a man who has one. Got a small plant on the allotment mate rooted last year let me see if I can get the bugger out of our clay mate organic last 4 years maybe 5).Oh buddy shoot me a pm,I won;t derail further,:bash: I'll have forgot in the morn

Stu


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

soundstounite said:


> Al,there is a post from Ben years back mate that has me smiling on the brambles, and where your post took my brain:I best not go there,:Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2:
> 
> But suffice to say,there are cultivars of thornless bramble out there,for those not so damn hard as the villagers of Dorset. But brambles and aborea are a new one to me:2thumb: cheers for this.
> 
> ...


Stu, 

Would you like some arborea? I have plenty of developing spawn, I'll sort you out a decent sized colony when they metamorphose if you like?

Hope you and Shaz keeping well buddy
Best
Al


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

Alex M said:


> Stu,
> 
> Would you like some arborea? I have plenty of developing spawn, I'll sort you out a decent sized colony when they metamorphose if you like?
> 
> ...


Al,mate, you are such a cool guy...thanks bro what a kind offer. Mate I'd love some,but I simply couldn't at this time. I'm up to me eyeballs in work and god knows what else mate dartwise,plus allotment. I'd want a proper gaff outside for them too,so I simply couldn't give them the time i'd want to devote to them mate. Plus I really need to be disciplined and stay with the darts,I have much to catch up on there Al: we had a crap and shall we say,absorbing winter,which has put us behind somewhat on my overal plans. We are ok bro thanks for asking obviously back at ya:2thumb:. The froggy side is probably as good as it could possibly get ,if i'm honest,utterly fabulous,some of what's been happening of late buddy. 

But it is lovely of ya kiddo, don't think for a second it isn't appreciated. We must catch up this year mate,I just need this conveyor belt to let up a while :lol2:

take care bro

Stu


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

Good to hear things are going well with your frogs and everything in general bud, the offer will of course remain open should you ever want any or if anything changes in future. Mine are making a terrific noise as I type now, it always sounds to me like a cross between a machine gun and ducks quacking - still, give me that over One Direction any day. Cheers bro, Al


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## frogman955 (Feb 7, 2010)

Who`s one direction lol.
I think I`ve heard that name before but I always thought it was someone who is heading along a road to nowhere.

I`ve found a small greenhouse which I think might be good for keeping the frogs in and it has a hinged door rather than a sliding one which should be a lot better as well.
So we`ll be making a proper decision soon.
Alex, what foods do you use for your frogs ?


Mike


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

frogman955 said:


> Who`s one direction lol.
> I think I`ve heard that name before but I always thought it was someone who is heading along a road to nowhere.
> 
> I`ve found a small greenhouse which I think might be good for keeping the frogs in and it has a hinged door rather than a sliding one which should be a lot better as well.
> ...



Just the usual insect fare, Mike - arborea are particularly fond of winged insects, I give mine crickets, roaches and greenbottles etc etc.


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Slightly off topic but does anyone keep the blue variant ?


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

colinm said:


> Slightly off topic but does anyone keep the blue variant ?


I don't. But I'd love to get hold of some blue (or het) juveniles this year.


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## Alex M (May 28, 2008)

colinm said:


> Slightly off topic but does anyone keep the blue variant ?


I had some many many years ago Colin, back in the late 80's when I was a lad and they came from Ron Wills at Ron's Reptiles in Norwich (sadly he's no longer with us) but I don't keep them now, I think if anyone's after any then contact Toby on here (Phelsumafarmer) - he breeds that variant (or did from memory).


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Alex M said:


> I had some many many years ago Colin, back in the late 80's when I was a lad and they came from Ron Wills at Ron's Reptiles in Norwich (sadly he's no longer with us) but I don't keep them now, I think if anyone's after any then contact Toby on here (Phelsumafarmer) - he breeds that variant (or did from memory).


Phelsumafarmer has recently changed owners so unfortunately doesn't have the blue variant. As it turns out, the frogs that I am breeding come from a line of arborea that regularly throw out BRIGHT blue frogs. I only have 2.1 at the moment but I'm hoping to add another 2.2 this year and by next year my group should be about 15.15. The female I am keeping currently, has a lovely turquoise colour.


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Is the blue colouration a genetic mutation though or environmental ? They do change colour to some extent. Can you post some photos please ?


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Yes I know that and I did query it but it is genetic. Here are some pictures of my normal coloured ones:




And here is a picture of a wild blue animal from the location they come from (there are a large number of blue ones I believe): 


Picture is not mine, it belongs to the person who gave me the frogs. Please don't use it for anything.


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

That certainly seems a proper blue. Some of the ones that I have seen are more a blue green and I would not really called them blue. But good luck with them. 

Do you really need fifteen pairs , thats a lot of Treefrogs ?


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

colinm said:


> That certainly seems a proper blue. Some of the ones that I have seen are more a blue green and I would not really called them blue. But good luck with them.
> 
> Do you really need fifteen pairs , thats a lot of Treefrogs ?


I don't _need_ 15 pairs, but I'd _like_ 15 pairs :lol2:
I think they're lovely animals and I'd really like to have a nice sized colony, but it all depends what I choose to use my space for, I may get other species.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Trying to upload some pictures...


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)




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## creepycrawlies (Dec 2, 2014)

They are looking good Stu. 

Alex have you any pictures of your enclosure?

Id like to have them in the Passion flower vine in my greenhouse but Im am sure they would find a gap and escape. I am thinking a mini aviary type enclosure in there and train the passion flower in through the mesh.

I attract fruitflies into my outdoor amphibian enclosures with little dishes of rotten fruit. I am sure the Hyla would appreciate that!


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Mine are currently in a Reptibreeze type enclosure as I am sure than they benefit from natural sunlight. 

They will escape from any small gaps in the glass of a greenhouse. also bear in mind if the greenhouse is one with a sliding door they will hide in the door runner. The result will be squashed frogs.


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

Well I thought I should probably update this:

Things haven't gone 100% to plan, however I should be back on track very soon. Basically, the female had some sort of hormonal problem which must have made her think she was male, because she was regularly trying to croak (and doing a very good job of it!!) and this wasn't just like a release call, this is almost as loud as the males but the sound was different seeing as she was in fact female. So, she's gone back to live in my friend's greenhouse where she can be male or female, whichever she chooses! There was some suggestion that she was an underdeveloped male, but this was quickly ruled out because she is about 6cm long and has no proper vocal sac or any yellow under the chin.
So now my friend is sending me another female (which knows it is female!) to replace her, and he's also giving me another pair. When I get these I'll have to see what the females are looking like, but I think they'll probably need a month or so to put a bit of weight on for breeding. Hopefully my first spawning will be in the first half of July, but you can never really know for sure! If they do spawn in July I'll try and get another spawning in August, but that may not happen this year. 
I'm also being given some spadefoot toads with the treefrogs, which I'm going to try spawning, if anyone has bred this species I'd very much appreciate some advice on how to spawn them. (They may have already spawned by the time I get them but at least I'll know for next year).


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## marcuswinner1 (Sep 24, 2009)

Interesting.....I was sat watching my two fat Female Yellow Bellied Toads in the greenhouse tonight who are sadly without a Male (He died last spring), when one of them grabbed the other and called a couple of times like a Male. Think they are getting frustrated at the lack of Male attention!!


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

marcuswinner1 said:


> Interesting.....I was sat watching my two fat Female Yellow Bellied Toads in the greenhouse tonight who are sadly without a Male (He died last spring), when one of them grabbed the other and called a couple of times like a Male. Think they are getting frustrated at the lack of Male attention!!


I've sent you a pm :2thumb:


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## Stupot1610 (Jul 6, 2013)

After a bit of confusion with a friend it turns out the tree frogs I had were the Turkish tree frog, Hyla savignyi! I don't have any H. arborea but I don't mind. 
I wasn't successful breeding the H. savignyi last year, but I was given a few tadpoles (also of the Hyla savignyi). I won't try breeding them this year either, as I won't have time to invest in raising tadpoles.


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