# pouched rats: sociability?



## evilherbivore (Jan 6, 2011)

What are people's experiences with keeping pouched rats singly, in pairs or in groups? Which options appear best? If they are kept together, do same-sex or opposite sex pairs work best, and if the males fight, does castration seem to help avoid this problem? feel free to message me off list if easiest.
Richard


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## Pouchie (Feb 9, 2008)

Hi there. I have kept Emins and Gambian Pouched Rats singly, in pairs and in groups of 3 adults (plus pups).

They are naturally colony animals so in my opinion are best kept in as large a group as possible with a dominant pair. However most people like to maintain a bond with their pouched rats so keep them singly or in pairs.

Males can live together if neutered, not safely if entire. They can disband at any time though and decide to fight.

I think lone pouched rats most often suffer from some level of stress and depression. They display a wider range of settled and well adjusted behaviour in pairs and groups. 

Also worth a mention, they can be bred in groups in captivity but its a little complicated as if a subordinate female gives birth the pups can be killed so only dominant females should be allowed to stay with a group when pregnant (in my opinion).

I think their behaviour and relationships with each other are fascinating.


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## evilherbivore (Jan 6, 2011)

Thats extremely helpful, thanks for your reply!


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## Ratatouille (Sep 5, 2008)

Yes, I agree with pouchie on this one :2thumb:


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## sugarkane (Aug 31, 2009)

I just have one, she lives by herself. If you keep one by themselves, you have to spend time with them. I spend minimum of half an hour with my rat every day. She's has days when she can't be bothered to come out, but has never seemed depressed or stressed. She is very friendly with people. My boss also keeps a male by himself, again he spends a lot of time with him. We let them run around in safe areas, and play with them. 
As long as you have the time to spend with them I think it's fine to keep one by themselves.
I should add that when I go on holiday my female stays with my boss, she's still kept seperate from his male but they're let out together and they really don't seem fussed by each other, chase each other occasionally, my boss says it's easier to get his rat out when mines around because he likes to sniff where she's been. Good enrichment.


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## Pouchie (Feb 9, 2008)

sugarkane said:


> I just have one, she lives by herself. If you keep one by themselves, you have to spend time with them. I spend minimum of half an hour with my rat every day.


I agree. In my experience you have to spend time interacting every day to keep a bond otherwise it seems to weaken with each day spent apart with no interaction. Letting the rat out for exercise and change of scenery is alright but you need that physical interaction aswell each day.

One thing we have come to realise though is that it's possible to keep a bond with a pouched rat who has a mate of their own kind (under the right circumstances). Which is good to know as you can get the best of both worlds :2thumb:

When I had my first female it was the best experience ever but then some time later when we started keeping more, then started keeping pairs, we realised how much we were missing out on! They are different animals when kept in pairs. Very vocal !!! We started hearing a massive range of sounds from animals we had previously known to be very quiet and aloof.

Anyway I'll pipe down now because I could go on forever waffling about pouched rats :blush:


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## sugarkane (Aug 31, 2009)

Quiet and aloof? I could not describe my female like that, she is very vocal, sometimes she won't stop squealing! She has a squeal (not the best way to describe the noise but easiest) for when she's got an exciting treat, or is doing something fun, a whiny squeal for shut up, I'm sleeping, and a squeak for what's going on? this is done when sticking her head out of her nestbox to see what's happening, usually with her eyes shut!
Are there more noises between pairs?


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## Pouchie (Feb 9, 2008)

If we have had a singleton but they have had a bond with us, they talk to us. If we have not been able to form a bond with a single rat and they live alone for whatever reason, they are silent. Only if they came into contact with another would they 'speak'.

Two rats together - especially opposite sex, have a wider range of vocalisations including courtship and mating ones which sound like they are killing each other. 

It would be great if all pouchie keepers could get together at some point and record the range of sounds then perhaps try to put some 'emotions' or reasons/circumstances to them. Would be very interesting!


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## Ratatouille (Sep 5, 2008)

Well all my pouchies are individuals and make lots of sounds. Arianne makes sound like a 'duck' when she is talking to us, but once she actually said 'Hello' back to us. We both could not believe our ears. They may be more similar to African Greys than we originally thought :2thumb:


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## mackaskie (Jan 29, 2009)

Our Bobby was introduced to a young male, they got on well, grooming each other, sharing food, a bed, everything both were neutered but Bob started to be very aggressive to his friend and my husband, he was offered a female for company but decided No to that also, we have always assumed that its jealousy,he is now a singleton, he will only interact with me, he snoozes on my lap, he follows me around like a little dog, comes when called, he grooms me & I groom him, in fact I don't think he is missing out on anything it was his choice to live alone, so if he is happy then I am, I much prefer the one to one, as it keeps him well bonded to me.
On a lighter note I just read about Ratatouilles Arrianne, which I already knew about. Months ago I told Marie that Bobby was talking to me not his usual whistles, chirps & growls but words I could make out, ''She laughed'' but then Arrianne did it soo now believed.
it is quite plainly heard, my teenage daughter near fell off couch when she heard distinctly him say ''Thankyou'' he also says ''Yiss''(means yes) ''Bugger off'' mutters when told off, and his latest is kissing noises when I say kiss and make the noises, I know its all mimickery, but he does do it. he also seems to understand most of what I say, I can actually make him do things just using my voice.


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## Pouchie (Feb 9, 2008)

I haven't heard anything of the sounding like they are speaking human words thing. Thats a new one on me.

My Halftail is the same as Bobby. Has been offered GPR mates and hated them. 

I had a strong bond with Toby and I believe he was bonded more strongly to me than his fancy rat friends (which surprised me).

Ratatouille & Droopal have both bonded to an individual and successfully introduced a mate aswell.

There's plenty of good info about different circumstances that have happened. 

Personally I feel my singletons are missing out, not having a bond to their own kind. They appear to be very happy alone because they don't know any diffeent, if that makes sense (unless they have lost a rat they were once bonded with).

So its a bit like the argument of captivity. They might be happier in the wild with a whole forest to explore as opposed to just the inside of a house. BUT if they were born in captivity you can argue they don't know any different.

Same with pairing them up. If they have only known a bond with a human they (at least in rats like Bobby and Halftail's case) perhaps fail to bond with another GPR. Doesn't mean they aren't happy - its more a case of what they don't know they can't miss.

If they've lost a mate - well Marie will tell you how Morgana was when she lost Merlin. 

Anyway I feel more comfortable keeping pouched rats in pairs or groups. 

All of this is just my opinion. Its not like we can ask the rats their true opinion, we can only interpret their behaviour how we will and that is a subjective thing so there will always be plenty of different opinions.


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## Ratatouille (Sep 5, 2008)

Morgana was so depressed when she lost Merlin, and she could not understand why he had suddenly turned on her before he died, but he did not know what he was doing. He even started to bite me, and he had always been my baby before that.

When I let Morgana out for freerange she climbed onto the highest wardrobe and just stayed there. It was awful to see her like this, but luckily we found a solution as Pouchie had a single pup 'Mouse' who was Merlin's younger brother. She brought him up to us and we put him in with Morgana. She treated him as if he were her own baby, and now they have a very strong bond. They are still a bit shy of humans, but at least they are happy with each other.

Their first meeting:









I also did not believe Shirley at first about Bobby 'talking', but when we heard Morgana say 'Hello' back to us, it did seem possible. They do have a wide range of sounds, some have been captured on youtube by different owners, so I suppose that mimicking their owners may be possible I suppose.

Here are a few videos I found on Youtube:

YouTube - Anders whining
YouTube - Gambian pouched rat
YouTube - Baby Emins pouched rats play fighting.
YouTube - The Giant Pounched Rats mystic sounds


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## seska (Feb 16, 2010)

Fern purr's when she greats me at the bars to come out and squeals really loudly when asleep if i make too much noise but can't say i've ever heard her speak recognisable words. 

Would have to change her name to Polly if she did that:lol2:


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