# Megaray 70watt Metal Halide Setup Review



## jaf2212

Over the last few weeks I have been building 2 new vivs 4x2x2, one off which has been fitted with the new Megaray MH bulbs. I wanted a way to provide uv without having a uv tube hanging in the middle of the viv, I was also worried that a MV bulb would produce far too much heat in a small viv.

I have run the bulb for a few days now, with an empty viv and noticed a big difference in the light out put from these bulbs over any uv bulbs prevously used. I have not been able to monitor the temps all day due to work and other stuff. I have tested the viv without a basking rock and at 14inches I'm getting a basking temp between 100-110F, hoping this will increase to 105-120F once I've added the rocks

The kit was very easy to wire up and fit, it was all fitted with plugs ready to plug straight in. I have removed these.


























As you can see, I have wired both vivs together so they will be easier to control. I have installed a second bulb next to the MH one for early morning/evening lighting and will only be running the MH light for 7 hours a day.


















The normal basking bulb will be on for around 12 hours a day, which will let the beardie have a period without high levels of uv, similar to the desert.

The light produced from one of the MH Bulbs against a standard B&Q 60w bulb is 10 times better


















I am hoping to see an improvement in my Beardie over the next few weeks, I will be introducing Houdini in to the new viv in the morning and will take a picture every week to monitor the colour. I hoping to see a change in the feeding habits as he has became very lazy over the last few weeks and will not hunt.


















I will post an update on here and keep everyone upto speed on how good these bulbs are , as I'm expecting alot from the MH bulb, so I'm hoping to see a big change in Houdini.

These are not a cheap bulb and retail at £110.00 each from [email protected], but when you price up uv tubes and fittings, within 18 months these bulbs will have made a saving

If any one is looking at getting a MV, I would suggest speaking to Darren about the MH first.


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## Rencey

am i right in thinking that with the bulb in its holder your 24"gap is down to around 14-18" if so please take some reading of how intense te light is there and how much radiation there is as i recently saw a beardie blinded with catteracts under a 60w megaray.
just being cautious my friend


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## Rencey

jaf2212 said:


> This would be the same with MV bulbs which everyone rates, which is why i'm looking at the MH bulbs esp as the tubes only seem to produce around 20-30uw/cm2.
> 
> Surely only a few hours under the MH at 280uw/cm2 is better than using the tubes, just need someone to confirm


i had a similar discusion with a friend of te lady who runs uv guide and the outcome was esentially not to look at things this way but to look at it as exposing the beardie to 10x its normal sunlight :whistling2:talking nuclear power here my friend lol cancer city


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## jaf2212

Rencey said:


> am i right in thinking that with the bulb in its holder your 24"gap is down to around 14-18" if so please take some reading of how intense te light is there and how much radiation there is as i recently saw a beardie blinded with catteracts under a 60w megaray.
> just being cautious my friend


I know these bulbs are being used by other people with no problems and are different to the 60W eb MV bulbs.



Rencey said:


> i had a similar discusion with a friend of te lady who runs uv guide and the outcome was esentially not to look at things this way but to look at it as exposing the beardie to 10x its normal sunlight :whistling2:talking nuclear power here my friend lol cancer city


 
At the right distances these produce the same uw/cm2 as the desert which is not 10x more than a beardie would be use to. I have spoken to Frances from the uv guide in lenght about these Metal Halide bulbs, so not sure where you got your information from


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## Rencey

me being a male chicken then i am just a tad panicy about these things afterseeing this beardie soz son :2thumb:


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## jaf2212

Rencey said:


> me being a male chicken then i am just a tad panicy about these things afterseeing this beardie soz son :2thumb:


I just find it confussing on how people can slate a product which was tested for a year before its release and has only just been released. The normal reason for the problems with the MV bulbs is people not following the manufactors guidelines and putting the bulb to close.


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## Rencey

sorted:2thumb:


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## Bosscat

Looking good Jamie, worth the wait... keep us updated on how you & Houdini are getting on with it


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## kimbosreptileworld

Rencey said:


> i had a similar discusion with a friend of te lady who runs uv guide and the outcome was esentially not to look at things this way but to look at it as exposing the beardie to 10x its normal sunlight :whistling2:talking nuclear power here my friend lol cancer city


LOL - spoke to a freind of a friend !!

Please contact me privately with your concerns over this bulb - we have had proto-type models out for a year now and some of the top reptile people in the world have been using them and reporting good results. 

Now - yes they are powerful bulbs - and no you would'nt see 50,000 lux at 6am in the morning which is why we recommend they only be used for 6 - 8 hours a day. the 6 - 8 hours needs to be covered with other forms of heat and light. My halides come on after my other lights, and go off before the other lights !

Its all about creating the right habitat for your animal - i am using them on my animals, they have large enough enclosures, and a choice of basking sites which they use extensivly both UVB sites and non UVB sites. The Metal Halide is not suitable for small poorly designed habitats - much thought needs to go into the design - but i would gladly talk to anyone who is interetsed in setting up an halide bulb for their animals. 

Darren


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## kimbosreptileworld

Rencey said:


> am i right in thinking that with the bulb in its holder your 24"gap is down to around 14-18" if so please take some reading of how intense te light is there and how much radiation there is as i recently saw a beardie blinded with catteracts under a 60w megaray.
> just being cautious my friend


Can you also mail me details of this animal or how i can contact the owner i would like to research this further ?

we take situations like this VERY seriously....

darren


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## jaf2212

Bosscat said:


> Looking good Jamie, worth the wait... keep us updated on how you & Houdini are getting on with it


 
Beleive I will, the improvement from just today is great, Houdini would normally be getting ready to sleep about now. He is running around everywhere, head bobbing and hunting more, so a good result so far.


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## Toeboe

Interesting thread. Great news about Houdini, whatever the reasons behind it.


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## jaf2212

Toeboe said:


> Interesting thread. Great news about Houdini, whatever the reasons behind it.


Thanks, when I looked into the bulbs there is nothing about the MH ones on the web, so I thought I help spread the word, yes they are expensive but well worth it.

I've had a few problems over the last few weeks as Houdini was housed in the same viv as speedy, meant to be m/f but turns out to be m/m. It seems over the last 2 weeks, Houdini was bullied, stopped eating, even biten by Speedy whilst holding last night. I think a lot off this has lead to current issue which I'm hoping the new viv will help improve, seems to be working so far.


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## Toeboe

Its reassuring to read an informative thread, even better when an issue is being understood as much as being acted upon. Its good to see the thought process, because so often a kneejerk reaction is applied and this is sometimes to the detriment to the animals.
I do think though that a lot of exotics are more robust than the scare mongers would have you believe (uv is a different matter, granted). I also maintain that a lot of items sold specifically for reptiles can be obtained more econimically from sources, substrates and ceramics just two.
Anyway,,just saying,,,,:lol2:


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## jaf2212

I have this weekend watched Houdini in his new viv, there is a big change in his activity levels. He has been running around, jumping everywhere and bobbing at the female across the room.

Here a few pictures taken over the last few days

Friday, when first out into the viv (basking lamp only)









Friday Lunch, popped home to check on Houdini (basking rock still to be added)









Sunday Lunch

































I have been getting temps around 98-100f for the 1st few hours then increasing when the MH come on to 109-112f during the midday and the afternoon, and slowing cooling back down to 95f in to the evening.

When the MH is on, Houdini will bask for short periods directky under the light before moving to a rock away from the lamp in the warm side.


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## jaf2212

I've been closely monitoring Houdini this week and am more than inpressed with the improvement, the colours seem more defined and he's eating more.

More pictures taken today


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## Toeboe

Is it lighting or is Houdinis lemon coming through more?


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## jaf2212

Toeboe said:


> Is it lighting or is Houdinis lemon coming through more?


Its the colour coming through, it looks far better in person


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## Toeboe

Well if it is so different in real life from the 1st pics to latest, then you're doing something right. Well done for a good, noticeable result.:notworthy:


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## The Roach Hut

*re*

if u want the colours to look a lot better on him then install a dayglow bulb used for fishtanks as this would put te end of the spectrun in not coverd by the MH and balance out the lighting whilst still giving the couple hundred uW/cm2 that is required.

Tony


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## jaf2212

FireDragon said:


> if u want the colours to look a lot better on him then install a dayglow bulb used for fishtanks as this would put te end of the spectrun in not coverd by the MH and balance out the lighting whilst still giving the couple hundred uW/cm2 that is required.
> 
> Tony


Cheers Tony, already been speaking with Darren about additional lighting


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## jaf2212

Well after a very busy month last month, I decided I best update everyone with the progress.

Houdini seems to be at his best colours now and eating really well. He is slowing a lot off mating behaviour and enjoys sitting on a branch watching over the room.

I took these over the weekend whilst he was out


























And a few off feeding time today


















I have also changed the second basking lamp from a B&Q bulb to a Halogen spot bulb which has helpped with the temp and see's Houdini basking more


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## beardochris

Ive just purchased the 60w Mega ray EBs for my 4'x2'x2' vivs as my vet recommended them for my ill beardie. Is there much difference in spectrum and output levels between them and the 70w metal halide? regards, chris


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## jaf2212

beardochris said:


> Ive just purchased the 60w Mega ray EBs for my 4'x2'x2' vivs as my vet recommended them for my ill beardie. Is there much difference in spectrum and output levels between them and the 70w metal halide? regards, chris


Hi I haven't used the 60W EB bulb, but I do know the MH are a brighter light.


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## philipniceguy

i like the idea of a all in one bulb like mega rays i just contacted www.kimbosreptileworld.co.uk see what they say about using it with my monitors as i dont like the look of strip light uvb bulbs and heat bulbs all in 1 viv alot of cables/plus so on


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## jaf2212

philipniceguy said:


> i like the idea of a all in one bulb like mega rays i just contacted www.kimbosreptileworld.co.uk see what they say about using it with my monitors as i dont like the look of strip light uvb bulbs and heat bulbs all in 1 viv alot of cables/plus so on


If you go for a MH bulb you will still need a second heat source and even with the all in ones it is advised not to run them for more than 8 hours a day using a second source of light and heat


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## beardochris

Ive just done what was suggested on the website, and use the old strip light as a lead in/out to 8 hours of the MV bulb. It looks really good. chris


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## jaf2212

beardochris said:


> Ive just done what was suggested on the website, and use the old strip light as a lead in/out to 8 hours of the MV bulb. It looks really good. chris


It does look good that way and you should see a big change in the reptile too. I currently use just to bulbs with different on/off times and will be adding a 2% tube in the next few weeks. By doing this I have seen some really big changes with the behaviour of the BD


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## philipniceguy

jaf2212 said:


> If you go for a MH bulb you will still need a second heat source and even with the all in ones it is advised not to run them for more than 8 hours a day using a second source of light and heat


 thats a shame i was hoping to use less wires plugs so there was less clutter but guess il stick to what i have then for now


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## Caz

kimbosreptileworld said:


> LOL - spoke to a freind of a friend !!
> 
> Please contact me privately with your concerns over this bulb - we have had proto-type models out for a year now and some of the top reptile people in the world have been using them and reporting good results.
> 
> Now - yes they are powerful bulbs - and no you would'nt see 50,000 lux at 6am in the morning which is why we recommend they only be used for 6 - 8 hours a day. the 6 - 8 hours needs to be covered with other forms of heat and light. My halides come on after my other lights, and go off before the other lights !
> 
> Its all about creating the right habitat for your animal - i am using them on my animals, they have large enough enclosures, and a choice of basking sites which they use extensivly both UVB sites and non UVB sites. The Metal Halide is not suitable for small poorly designed habitats - much thought needs to go into the design - but i would gladly talk to anyone who is interetsed in setting up an halide bulb for their animals.
> 
> Darren


What are the PAR readings of these bulbs?


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## jaf2212

I have this week ordered another MH bulb from Darren, I will then be moving Speedy into the other 4ft viv and hoping to see the same improvements.

Since Houdini has been under the MV I have noticed a big change, eats move food and doesn't even give me chance to put the food in the viv. Launched himself almost 2ft out of the viv at me last week whilst after the locust.

Darren has been a big help with every question I have had, I have noticed as with the MV bulbs the vivs need to be well vented in the hot weather and I will be controlling this via a small fan.


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## arthur cooke

If your light is producing too much heat, have you thought of one of these,

Greenfields Hydroponics UK - Aerowing Pro - Air Cooled Reflector With IEC Cord Set

Hydroponic people have been using MH for a long time now and they have solved most of the problems with MH.

cheers arthur


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## DaveAnscombe

I will be using the mega ray self ballast 120 watt .....along with one 10%uvb tube from reptisun and a 2.0 full spectrum.....as well as a bog standard heat blub100 wat .Also a ceramic heater 100 watt just to keep a constant temp with in my viv......


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## Pendragon

DaveAnscombe said:


> I will be using the mega ray self ballast 120 watt .....along with one 10%uvb tube from reptisun and a 2.0 full spectrum.....as well as a bog standard heat blub100 wat .Also a ceramic heater 100 watt just to keep a constant temp with in my viv......


 
:lol2:

Jay


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## Pendragon

jaf2212 said:


> I have this week ordered another MH bulb from Darren, I will then be moving Speedy into the other 4ft viv and hoping to see the same improvements.
> 
> Since Houdini has been under the MV I have noticed a big change, eats move food and doesn't even give me chance to put the food in the viv. Launched himself almost 2ft out of the viv at me last week whilst after the locust.
> 
> Darren has been a big help with every question I have had, I have noticed as with the MV bulbs the vivs need to be well vented in the hot weather and I will be controlling this via a small fan.


Hi Jaf, Have you got any furniture in those vivs yet?

Jay


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## jaf2212

jabba1967 said:


> Hi Jaf, Have you got any furniture in those vivs yet?
> 
> Jay


I have added more to the viv, the second one is still empty as waiting on the bulb.

I'll post a pic, but I have to watch what P ut in the viv and houdini is crazy and believes he can fly, hes always jumping and launching himself around the viv


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## jaf2212

Not the best pics due to the Megaray being so damm bright


















I know the basking area looks bare, but there is a peice of slate there, I can't raise it due to the fact the bask spot is 11inches away. If I'd planned better I should have made the vivs 2.5 ft high or even 3 ft.

If he clams down I'll add more for him to climb on, but until then safety first with houdini


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## jaf2212

DaveAnscombe said:


> I will be using the mega ray self ballast 120 watt .....along with one 10%uvb tube from reptisun and a 2.0 full spectrum.....as well as a bog standard heat blub100 wat .Also a ceramic heater 100 watt just to keep a constant temp with in my viv......


 
:lol2:

Are you trying to cook or blind them with all that?


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## CWD

DaveAnscombe said:


> I will be using the mega ray self ballast 120 watt .....along with one 10%uvb tube from reptisun and a 2.0 full spectrum.....as well as a bog standard heat blub100 wat .Also a ceramic heater 100 watt just to keep a constant temp with in my viv......






Bloody HELL you wont need all that pal :gasp::gasp::gasp:


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## Jim2109

CWD said:


> Bloody HELL you wont need all that pal :gasp::gasp::gasp:


very similar to what im going to be running, with a smaller viv (Daves viv is a foot longer and 2 feet deeper than mine)

its deceptive as to how much there is in that list. the natural daylight and UV tubes are there for low light conditions (e.g. early morning and evening), the Megaray bulb is there for 6-8 hours of the day to replicate the sun during its most intense periods. if you had the Megaray on 12 hours a day then that would be way too much exposure. then you need the ceramics and incandescents for basking spots.

it looks overkill, but its really not. especially not in a 6' x 5' x 7' viv!!! mine is only 5' x 3' x 7' but i wish id made it deeper in hindsight. il probably build another one after a year or 2 lol.


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## DaveAnscombe

Far from over kill .When your viv is 6 long 4 deep and 7 high...

I have been looking in to uv for some 4/5 months now..IF IT WAS NOT A GOOD SET UP.....zoo's and darren at mega ray would advise me not to use it all....darren @megaray said god its nice to know people out there care about their reptiles as much as you...Witch i do !
id never use all theese unless i thought it was nesesary (spell check)


This is about as close as i can get to providing nature to their enviroment.....light and heat wise..

a 10% uvb tube only produces uvb in the shade in the wild. that will be on for 12 hrsa day
full spectrum (light spectrum) to enhance colour /alertness/ activity/ breeding.10 hrs a day

MEGA RAY 120 SB...for the best uvb and uva output even .6 hrs a day

Normal basking lamp to provide heat but no uva/uvb 11 hrs a day

CHE for ambient temps. all day every day

Noooo i think thats sounds about right : victory:

So basking lamp comes on first in the morning.
then uvb and full spectrum 
then the mega ray....

then mega ray goes off 6 hrs later

then uvb and full spectum go off
then heat blub.

Dont worry im not a newb when it comes to reptiles.......although recently ive learnt alot more about the uva and uvb and the spectrum ..


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## DaveAnscombe

jaf2212 said:


> :lol2:
> 
> Are you trying to cook or blind them with all that?


Not at all...im giving them the best im reptile lighting and heating


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## jaf2212

DaveAnscombe said:


> Not at all...im giving them the best im reptile lighting and heating


Cool, well now we now the viv size it makes more sense


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## DaveAnscombe

hahahahahaha glad it makes more sence...Once the wd viv is finished.....Ive got a shed for an iguana......just needs insulation and protection


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## Pendragon

Looking good,

I will be using M.H in my viv build when time/space/money permits.

But getting back to yours, apart from your chaps desire to fly, couldn't you put in a higher basking rock under the Mega-ray, I know that the animal should not get to close to these bulbs, but it is my understanding that if you keep an animal within 12" of the bulb it would be dangerous, but this is only if it can't get away. It is believed that a lot of lizards, (beardies being one of them), can see uvb rays, and they have the ability to determin how much, and how little they need.

So with this in mind, if you had rocks getting to within, lets say, 8"s of the bulb, as long as he can move away when he has had enough, there should be no harm? I mean, beardies aren't daft, in the outback there are not reptile keepers out there running around covering up sunburnt beardies.

What's your view on this?

Jay


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## Pendragon

DaveAnscombe said:


> Not at all...im giving them the best im reptile lighting and heating


:lol2:, ok that's us told, some pics would be nice :2thumb:


Jay


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## jaf2212

jabba1967 said:


> Looking good,
> 
> I will be using M.H in my viv build when time/space/money permits.
> 
> But getting back to yours, apart from your chaps desire to fly, couldn't you put in a higher basking rock under the Mega-ray, I know that the animal should not get to close to these bulbs, but it is my understanding that if you keep an animal within 12" of the bulb it would be dangerous, but this is only if it can't get away. It is believed that a lot of lizards, (beardies being one of them), can see uvb rays, and they have the ability to determin how much, and how little they need.
> 
> So with this in mind, if you had rocks getting to within, lets say, 8"s of the bulb, as long as he can move away when he has had enough, there should be no harm? I mean, beardies aren't daft, in the outback there are not reptile keepers out there running around covering up sunburnt beardies.
> 
> What's your view on this?
> 
> Jay


 
I have spoke to both Darren @ Kimbos and Frances @ uv guide about the MH and how close and safe distances. Until more is fully known about these bulbs I'm not sure I would be willing to risk the life and health of my beardies.

However, I'm more than will to discuss this with you off forum and your thoughts on these using the bulbs and the uv levels compared to the natural habbit, I use the bulb @ 13 inches and when basking this can be reduced to as little as 11 inches when basking


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## Pendragon

jaf2212 said:


> I have spoke to both Darren @ Kimbos and Frances @ uv guide about the MH and how close and safe distances. Until more is fully known about these bulbs I'm not sure I would be willing to risk the life and health of my beardies.
> 
> However, I'm more than will to discuss this with you off forum and your thoughts on these using the bulbs and the uv levels compared to the natural habbit, I use the bulb @ 13 inches and when basking this can be reduced to as little as 11 inches when basking


Sounds good, I will have to arm myself with more info, I will pop over to the local wildlife trust tomorrow, and check out some of the exhibits, the girlfriend has just told me they bought 200 of these bulbs last year, so they should be well tested :2thumb:


Jay


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## Jim2109

DaveAnscombe said:


> Not at all...im giving them the best im reptile lighting and heating


i had a long chat with Darren today about setups for larger vivariums. yours is similar in height to mine so the same principles probably still apply. so in case you or anyone else is interested the general consensus seems to be...

a single Megaray UV bulb, power depending on the size. the 60W external ballast is the best they offer and within the same sort of price range. it has a longer guarantee, longer lifespan, less UVB degradation over time, and obviously less power consumption! it also gives off much less heat than the higher power self ballasted units, however at 12" it can sometimes still get up over 30 degsC at the basking site. the equivalent self ballasted bulb is probably more like 120W, so much more heat (meaning its harder to keep it closer unless youre talking about beardies or other desert reps), more power consumption, and they have a shorter life and shorter guarantee.

then you need supplementary bulbs to deal with simulating daylight hours and to create basking sites. Darrens personal suggestion is that you run various par 38 wide flood halogens to create seperate basking spots around the viv. most lizards self regulate their UVB and in an ideal world you want them to shuttle between UVB, heat basking and resting in the shade throughout the day. this means having one basking spot directly under the UV bulb, then seperate spots outside of the UV more shaded from it. the Halogen bulbs create light and heat, the light is closer to daylight than an incandescent bulb, and you probably only need 75W bulbs to replicate a 100W incandescent spot. personally im going to use 2 or 3 as well as the UV bulb as i have 3 water dragons and i want them to be able to bask by themselves if they want to.

you also then have a couple of flourescent tubes, either daylight tubes or low UVB tubes. im going to run an Arcadia 6.0 D3 and an Arcadia 2.0 daylight on a light cycle unit.

with regards switching order, this one is probably up for some debate, or at least some experimentation. Darren says that on his torts he fires the Halogen bulbs up first thing in the morning, then a few hours later brings in the Megaray, then brings in the flourescent tubes last. these stay on for the peak of the day, then switch back off again in that order. in terms of actual light output it would probably look better to bring the flourescent tubes in first, but im not sure that reptiles see light in the same way that we do, i think they are much more sensitive to UVB levels, which would explain the reasoning for flourescent tubes last. also the Halogens will work to bring the temperatures in slowly around the whole viv, then the UVB lamp will boost them up to peak levels when it kicks in later. this could potentially eliminate the need for additional heating from ceramics. its something that needs experimentation first. another thought on the bulb order is that early in the morning light levels rise slowly, then accelerate after an hour, then towards midday the increase gets less and less, and this reverses in the afternoon. the UV lamp is the most powerful light source of the 3, so it makes sense for that to come in 2nd, and the flourescents will just add a small amount of extra light and UVB at the height of the day.

another thing he mentioned which i hadnt really considered before, but it makes perfect sense, is angled bulbs. if you angle the bulb too much at a basking site then to a basking lizard it is effectively like us trying to drive near sunset. the sun is low and in your eyes the whole time, and that can get uncomfortable. if there are multiple basking sites reptiles have been observed to simply avoid the one that has the low angle, which makes it pointless. with only one basking site youre then forcing the lizard to sit there, and i wouldnt be surprised if this is a factor in the few cases of photokeratoconjunctivitis that have occurred in reptiles (even in so much as people positioning UVB tubes low down in the viv to get the UVB levels higher, and them actually ending up near to eye level).

im going to have my basking sites scattered at various heights in and out of the UV, with plenty of shade for the water dragons to completely escape if they so wish. mine already shuttle around all day, in and out of the UV and heat. they have access to areas that arent as hot but have high UV exposure (within a few inches of the bulb), areas that are hot without UV, areas that are both, and then lots of places to hide in the shade, hot or cold. it seems to work pretty well, they are all very active and healthy thus far. this is only with tubes though, so nowhere near the kind of UVB exposure theyll get once i have the Megaray in the new viv.

i also have a Solarmeter 6.2 UVB meter on order though, and personally i think anyone using a Megaray or similar MVB or metal halide bulb should seriously considering purchasing one. £125 is probably what the vets bills will cost if you end up seriously burning a reptile, plus you can save yourself a fortune in replacing bulbs if you know exactly when they have worn out. if you replace every 6 months and they are actually good for 12 then youre doubling your expenditure every year! if i owned marine fish a refractometer would be an absolute MUST. the same as pH testing kits are a MUST. if you own reptiles then a temperature gun and a UVB meter should be considered a must have tool IMO. otherwise youre just guessing about possibly the single most important, and single most complex aspect of keeping reptiles in captivity. there are also a few online shops that rent them out for a much smaller fee than purchasing one. once i have mine if anyone within a fairly local distance wants to do some testing i could possibly pop around and let them use mine though.


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## jaf2212

Hi Jim, Glad to see more people agreeing with the whole angled light being an issue. I run my lights on slowly on and then off pattern, tho the megarays are the last on and the first off as the viv's end up too dark.

Keep us post with how you get on with your lighting

Jamie


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## DaveAnscombe

Jim2109 said:


> i had a long chat with Darren today about setups for larger vivariums. yours is similar in height to mine so the same principles probably still apply. so in case you or anyone else is interested the general consensus seems to be...
> 
> a single Megaray UV bulb, power depending on the size. the 60W external ballast is the best they offer and within the same sort of price range. it has a longer guarantee, longer lifespan, less UVB degradation over time, and obviously less power consumption! it also gives off much less heat than the higher power self ballasted units, however at 12" it can sometimes still get up over 30 degsC at the basking site. the equivalent self ballasted bulb is probably more like 120W, so much more heat (meaning its harder to keep it closer unless youre talking about beardies or other desert reps), more power consumption, and they have a shorter life and shorter guarantee.
> 
> then you need supplementary bulbs to deal with simulating daylight hours and to create basking sites. Darrens personal suggestion is that you run various par 38 wide flood halogens to create seperate basking spots around the viv. most lizards self regulate their UVB and in an ideal world you want them to shuttle between UVB, heat basking and resting in the shade throughout the day. this means having one basking spot directly under the UV bulb, then seperate spots outside of the UV more shaded from it. the Halogen bulbs create light and heat, the light is closer to daylight than an incandescent bulb, and you probably only need 75W bulbs to replicate a 100W incandescent spot. personally im going to use 2 or 3 as well as the UV bulb as i have 3 water dragons and i want them to be able to bask by themselves if they want to.
> 
> you also then have a couple of flourescent tubes, either daylight tubes or low UVB tubes. im going to run an Arcadia 6.0 D3 and an Arcadia 2.0 daylight on a light cycle unit.
> 
> with regards switching order, this one is probably up for some debate, or at least some experimentation. Darren says that on his torts he fires the Halogen bulbs up first thing in the morning, then a few hours later brings in the Megaray, then brings in the flourescent tubes last. these stay on for the peak of the day, then switch back off again in that order. in terms of actual light output it would probably look better to bring the flourescent tubes in first, but im not sure that reptiles see light in the same way that we do, i think they are much more sensitive to UVB levels, which would explain the reasoning for flourescent tubes last. also the Halogens will work to bring the temperatures in slowly around the whole viv, then the UVB lamp will boost them up to peak levels when it kicks in later. this could potentially eliminate the need for additional heating from ceramics. its something that needs experimentation first. another thought on the bulb order is that early in the morning light levels rise slowly, then accelerate after an hour, then towards midday the increase gets less and less, and this reverses in the afternoon. the UV lamp is the most powerful light source of the 3, so it makes sense for that to come in 2nd, and the flourescents will just add a small amount of extra light and UVB at the height of the day.
> 
> another thing he mentioned which i hadnt really considered before, but it makes perfect sense, is angled bulbs. if you angle the bulb too much at a basking site then to a basking lizard it is effectively like us trying to drive near sunset. the sun is low and in your eyes the whole time, and that can get uncomfortable. if there are multiple basking sites reptiles have been observed to simply avoid the one that has the low angle, which makes it pointless. with only one basking site youre then forcing the lizard to sit there, and i wouldnt be surprised if this is a factor in the few cases of photokeratoconjunctivitis that have occurred in reptiles (even in so much as people positioning UVB tubes low down in the viv to get the UVB levels higher, and them actually ending up near to eye level).
> 
> im going to have my basking sites scattered at various heights in and out of the UV, with plenty of shade for the water dragons to completely escape if they so wish. mine already shuttle around all day, in and out of the UV and heat. they have access to areas that arent as hot but have high UV exposure (within a few inches of the bulb), areas that are hot without UV, areas that are both, and then lots of places to hide in the shade, hot or cold. it seems to work pretty well, they are all very active and healthy thus far. this is only with tubes though, so nowhere near the kind of UVB exposure theyll get once i have the Megaray in the new viv.
> 
> i also have a Solarmeter 6.2 UVB meter on order though, and personally i think anyone using a Megaray or similar MVB or metal halide bulb should seriously considering purchasing one. £125 is probably what the vets bills will cost if you end up seriously burning a reptile, plus you can save yourself a fortune in replacing bulbs if you know exactly when they have worn out. if you replace every 6 months and they are actually good for 12 then youre doubling your expenditure every year! if i owned marine fish a refractometer would be an absolute MUST. the same as pH testing kits are a MUST. if you own reptiles then a temperature gun and a UVB meter should be considered a must have tool IMO. otherwise youre just guessing about possibly the single most important, and single most complex aspect of keeping reptiles in captivity. there are also a few online shops that rent them out for a much smaller fee than purchasing one. once i have mine if anyone within a fairly local distance wants to do some testing i could possibly pop around and let them use mine though.


 
Its good to see others on here who are didicated to give their herps the best.........Like me you have a uvb flurecent and a 2.o full spectrum.....place the uvb flurecent at one end of the length of the viv and the full spectrum at the other....on the uvb side place the mega ray and at the other place the normal basking blub......this way you will be able to monitor witch dragon needs more uvb witch could indicate a preggi female. ..

Provinding space out of uv is a must....


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## arthur cooke

Sounds pretty good to me. I use a high pressure sodium as my main light in my walk in viv, plus a 4ft 10% uv florescent aided by a couple of mercury vapour lamps to get the intensity of light.
HPS give out a lot of red, so mimics early morning and evening light quite well.
In my 8ft x 8ft x 3ft viv I had a total of 700 watts of light but because it was a forest viv with many of the reptiles being able to climb all lights had to have a cage and I would lose at least 10% if not more.

Earlier some one was talking about a fan, an ordinary fan just blows air about and it does cool a bit, an extractor fan is better in that it replaces the air, brings in fresh, bit harder to keep humidity up but with a beardy you won't need a high humidity. If someone did need a higher humidity just spray more.

I even played with the Idea of a light rail, which means your lights actually move from one end of the viv to the other, simulating the movement of the sun.

Great thread :2thumb:
cheers arthur.


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## jaf2212

arthur cooke said:


> Earlier some one was talking about a fan, an ordinary fan just blows air about and it does cool a bit, an extractor fan is better in that it replaces the air, brings in fresh, bit harder to keep humidity up but with a beardy you won't need a high humidity. If someone did need a higher humidity just spray more.


That would have been me, I am use a 92mm 230v fan to suck air out off the viv, over the last week my cool end has been running @ 77-83f instead of the usual 84-90f which is what i needed it to do


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## Tehanu

Well!

I'd heard that these lamps were coming on the market and had been waiting for a little more information on how they perform;

http://www.reptileuv.com/docs/MegaRayPrototypeMetalHalidesOct2008.pdf

It's almost too good to be true really! But with knowledgeable people investing in and exploring new ideas and technology, things could only get better.
Especially exciting are the slower rates of decay and UVIndex readings within an acceptable range coupled with a good level of UVB exposure  Marvellous.

We've been happily using a range of the Megaray MVBs, but this is certainly food for thought... just need to find the budget now:lol2:


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## jaf2212

Saedcantas said:


> Well!
> 
> I'd heard that these lamps were coming on the market and had been waiting for a little more information on how they perform;
> 
> http://www.reptileuv.com/docs/MegaRayPrototypeMetalHalidesOct2008.pdf
> 
> It's almost too good to be true really! But with knowledgeable people investing in and exploring new ideas and technology, things could only get better.
> Especially exciting are the slower rates of decay and UVIndex readings within an acceptable range coupled with a good level of UVB exposure  Marvellous.
> 
> We've been happily using a range of the Megaray MVBs, but this is certainly food for thought... just need to find the budget now:lol2:


That makes a great read, all interesting to see how 3 bulbs can vary so much as well.

I must say these bulbs are worth the money, I certainly don't regret buying them.


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## fantapants

does anybody off his thread use these in a shed / super large viv type set up? basicaly at the moment i use a 160mvb in my 4x4x3 outdoor shed and that maintains the temps at 40c basking fine. will the 70w MH do the same in an enclosed area? will it create a basking tempertaure in an OPEN mesh topped viv? i keep hearing that the 70w can only produce the same sort of heat as a 125w MVB and that alot of keepers have to add a statted ceramic aswell.........i would appreciate any more info as i am looking at replacing ALL of my MVBs with MHs and that is one hell of an expense with a group like mine. i dont want to make the wrong choice and have to spend twice the amount on stats and heaters too.


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## jaf2212

fantapants said:


> does anybody off his thread use these in a shed / super large viv type set up? basicaly at the moment i use a 160mvb in my 4x4x3 outdoor shed and that maintains the temps at 40c basking fine. will the 70w MH do the same in an enclosed area? will it create a basking tempertaure in an OPEN mesh topped viv? i keep hearing that the 70w can only produce the same sort of heat as a 125w MVB and that alot of keepers have to add a statted ceramic aswell.........i would appreciate any more info as i am looking at replacing ALL of my MVBs with MHs and that is one hell of an expense with a group like mine. i dont want to make the wrong choice and have to spend twice the amount on stats and heaters too.


I use the MH in a 4x2x2 and it runs along side a 40/60w spot lamp for 2 reasons. The 1st, the bulb only produces 90-100f basking @ 12 inches, in a warm room, the 2nd, these bulbs can only be used for a max of 8 hours a day


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## Pendragon

fantapants said:


> does anybody off his thread use these in a shed / super large viv type set up? basicaly at the moment i use a 160mvb in my 4x4x3 outdoor shed and that maintains the temps at 40c basking fine. will the 70w MH do the same in an enclosed area? will it create a basking tempertaure in an OPEN mesh topped viv? i keep hearing that the 70w can only produce the same sort of heat as a 125w MVB and that alot of keepers have to add a statted ceramic aswell.........i would appreciate any more info as i am looking at replacing ALL of my MVBs with MHs and that is one hell of an expense with a group like mine. i dont want to make the wrong choice and have to spend twice the amount on stats and heaters too.


Hi, An externaly balasted light will not emit the same amount of heat as a self balasted, these new 70watt M.H.s are E.B.s, I'm not sure if they are doing a S.B. version.

Jamie, Any ideas?

Jay


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## jaf2212

jabba1967 said:


> Hi, An externaly balasted light will not emit the same amount of heat as a self balasted, these new 70watt M.H.s are E.B.s, I'm not sure if they are doing a S.B. version.
> 
> Jamie, Any ideas?
> 
> Jay


 
Yeah, I posted about the temps on a differnt post, forgot to add them here, http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/lizards/203671-metal-halide-lights-bd-3.html#post2784711, this as from the orginal testing before the BD was added to the viv



jaf2212 said:


> Well due to not getting the glass on Saturday I have been unable to finish the viv for this bulb, but i have had it running to test the light and heat output.
> 
> To my surprise these bulbs are very bright, these pictures was taken with no flash in a room with a 60 bulb.
> 
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> 
> it seems to produce a very good hot spot at well, with just 15 minutes of use with no viv doors it had reached a basking spot of 98.2 and still climbing
> 
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> Hopefully I'll get the glass in the morning and will be able to start testing the temps and the lighting ready for my bd to move in.


As you can see, during testing in a warm room i was able to get basking temps off 98.2f, however as these bulbs are EB and second heat source is always advised. 

I am running a 120w SB MV in a 6ft viv and get temps of 105f from the MV so when comparing the MH does produce a fair amount off heat compared to the smaller MV.

As always, when trying new bulbs, ensure basking temps are checked, double checked and then checked again


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## jaf2212

Just to update everyone, the final product is now fully on the market and Darren currently has these on offer - Mega-Ray 70w Metal Halide by: Kimbos, well worth every penny

I have just recieved my 2nd bulb today and looking forward to seeing the results with my blood red/yellow phase male beardie.


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## jaf2212

Speedy has been under his new bulb now since Sunday with big improvements he has gone into a full shed within 2 days and seems much more colourful.

This is how he looked when I first moved him










Since he has started shedding, he has gone a lovely lime/yellow colour (will post pics one he's finished shedding)


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## jaf2212

Just a quick update, will put more pics up soon. Speedy has gone into another shed already and eating me out of house and home, upto 2 bowls of salad a day some days.

The lamp has shown a big improvement in the activity and feeding habbits. I have found that these also need good connection and if in an extension lead would suggest they are in the 1st socket as they require a big charge to fire up. I did wire both MH to the same plug which caused a few issues, flickering and dullness, now wired to sperate plugs and working with no flickering


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## jaf2212

A quick update, not had the chance to get any upto date pics as Speedy has only just finished shedding for the second time in 8 weeks and I've been busy with work. When he gets fired up he is going a lovely lime/yellow colour and is far more active and eating loads (i have to hide anything yellow now as he see's it as food).

Atfer putting all my BD under Mega Rays, i will not be going back to normal uv tubes.

Will post new pics ASAP


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## jaf2212

Just a quick update, the test bulb and ballast packed up this month, I already have a replacement bulb and ballast fitted. The test bulb lasted around 17 months, however the newer bulbs seem a lot brighter than the 1st 2 batches of bulbs sold.


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## BuzzzKilllington

Is there an initial burn-in period needed for these metal halide bulbs? Is is possible to safely use one in an Ex48 Vivexotic (only 20" high)?


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## Alon93

How does the light intensity of this bulb compares to that of the 160W Megaray?


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## jaf2212

BuzzzKilllington said:


> Is there an initial burn-in period needed for these metal halide bulbs? Is is possible to safely use one in an Ex48 Vivexotic (only 20" high)?


There is no burn in period with these bulbs. It needs to be a min height of 2ft to use at the safe min distance anything smaller and it would not fit unless mounted on top of the viv



Alon93 said:


> How does the light intensity of this bulb compares to that of the 160W Megaray?


The light is much brighter as these bulbs produce a higher lux outout



UV Guide Review said:


> At 12 inches, BMH11 is emitting approximately 70,000 lux and the two new lamps are emitting 110,000 – 120,000 lux.
> For comparison, direct solar readings (the meter sensor pointing directly at the sun) five minutes after sunrise reach 3 – 5,000 lux.
> Levels of 50,000 are reached within half an hour, and 100,000 lux is often recorded 2-3 hours later. In clear weather, mid-day direct
> solar readings of 120,000 to 150,000 lux are often seen. Hence, these metal halide lamps produce the equivalent of full morning
> sunlight at 12 inches distance.
> In contrast, a typical 18-20watt UVB fluorescent tube produces around 500 lux at 12 inches distance, and a typical MegaRay 100watt
> mercury vapour lamp produces between 12,000 – 16,000 lux at 12 inches.


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## BuzzzKilllington

jaf2212 said:


> There is no burn in period with these bulbs. It needs to be a min height of 2ft to use at the safe min distance anything smaller and it would not fit unless mounted on top of the viv


Oh, is it a very tall bulb?


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## jaf2212

BuzzzKilllington said:


> Oh, is it a very tall bulb?


The bulb an holder are about 7inches in height


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## BuzzzKilllington

jaf2212 said:


> The bulb an holder are about 7inches in height


Wow, that's pretty tall... I just hope they can cancel that viv order :whistling2:


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