# Planning Vivarium inspiration



## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

Ok, so I've been thinking. I originally said I was going to put Hiss (the corn Snake) in a rub when he gets bigger, but what with the hell I went through with his original set up for him to come home in, I decided on getting him a vivarium. 
I've not got many ideas at the moment but will add to them over time. I'm in no rush as his still diddy 

Ok so it'll be a 3ft vivarium (not sure if it will be a wooden or a glass yet... may end up being wooden.... me and glass things do not get on), and planning on something down the naturalistic road. Obviously heating is key, so if I go for wooden is it heating in the vivarium. If that's the case if I use aspen bedding do I need to put something over the heat mat to create a barrier to stop |Hiss burning himself???

So ideas I had were using cocoa fibre bedding but then thought that it holds damp really well wich isn't good for snakey. I was thinking about growing some grass for Hiss to hide in. Maby I could grow some grass in a shallow tub so I could take it out to water it and tend it and so on??? So If I do that, instead of using aspen bedding, what else could I use, or would aspen be the best thing??? I'm cool with aspen, I just want something a bit more pleasing and more natural for Hiss.
So I was also thinking about creating a shallow pond sorta thing for him to bath in and drink. I was thinking about creating it out of air dying clay or something like that. Not sure what yet though so I can take it in and out easily to clean it out. What do you think???

So I was also thinking about if I go for the naturalistic look would getting a clean up crew be worth it???


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## Paul112 (Apr 6, 2007)

Hi,

It isn't possible to heat a wooden viv from outside, so heatpads have to be fitted inside, with the cable running through a hole in the back of the viv (some may have this, others you might have to drill yourself). I would personally fit the heatpad to the bottom of the viv, and cover with a flat ceramic tile to distribute the heat. This tile may need to be lightly glued down or siliconed to prevent the snake squirming its way underneath.

Cocofibre isn't a good idea for a corn. It holds a lot of water, and will be too humid and wet for a species like corns, and if you let it dry out it turns into a pretty dusty mess.

Grass and live plants are a bit tricky with snakes. Since corns require a relatively dry substrate, planting things directly into the viv doesn't really work. You could add plants to pots, and put them in the tank, but your corn will likely dig into the soil, spill the plants out, and crush them. It's nothing personal, it's just snakes don't like horticulture 

Your pond idea sounds interesting, but clay, even if kiln fired, will not hold water, and you will need to varnish it with a good polyurethane or yacht varnish.

Lastly, a clean up crew (by that I think you mean creepy crawlies in the substrate) won't work unless its soil or something akin to a soil/sand mix. It unfortunately won't happen in aspen, and for snakes might be a bit redundant. Snakes produce large volumes of waste infrequently, rather than small amounts of waste daily, like lizards, which will overpower a bioactive substrate, meaning you will still have to clean it out.

Best,
Paul


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## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

Right, I thought that was the case with the wooden viv's. Just wanted to double check. The viv I have my eye on has a cable hole (I think there was one each side actually). Heat pad would go on bottom, but with the tilewould it give out enough heat??? I've used tiles with the leo and tiles didn't feel warm at all... even with the right temp....
Yeah I didn't think cocofibre would be any good.... so Aspen is the best bet then. I don't mind aspen bedding at all, but if the natural look won't work then I can comprimise with the substrate. Hiss's welfare is right there at the top of the list.
Right soi plants are a no-no then.... I think I'll stick to the fakes then. Me and plants don't get on at the best of times any way lol
Yeah I was interested in the pond idea, but think if I'm going for the aspen route, I'll have to replan it, even if I use that foamy tile stuff as making a background etc could be quite fun... and grouting, etc it (inc varnishing) would be really fun to do... and I have ages to do it all as well..... Hiss is only 6 weeks at the max 2-3 weeks at the min. And his still diddy (grow quite fast I imagine though???)
Right think I'll leave the clean up crew, and maby go for it with the Leo thern as he needs a good rearangement with his viv... maby even an upgrade lol.

Thanks for your help Paul, much appreciated


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## OrigamiB (Feb 19, 2008)

Plants are fine, and external heating methods can be used in a wooden vivarium 

To heat with a bulb or ceramic just cut a hole in the top of the viv. I use a komodo dome reflector 









With a mesh guard aswell









I make the hole in the vivarium slightly smaller then the mesh guard and then staple the mesh down, this gives a secure fitting for the reflector dome and makes bulb changes easy aswell!

The pool area may be a problem though, cleaning will be difficult and filtration of snake poo isn't easy either. The planted area is more then possible though, if you use a ceramic bulb to heat it brings the humidity right down so this isn't an issue. You can also use custodians and these will be more then able to deal with the snake poo. A first they may struggle but you can still spot clean. Once the soil is established it will take down anything you throw at it.

As for plants, don't use grass! you will be constantly trimming it and is a surprisingly fast grower

EDIT: to add, if you go down the planted route for a corn snake alot of people will tell you it's not possible, but a the end of the day they didn't evolve to live in a box  Every planted vivarium is different though and you will find there is alot of trial and error until you get the perfect conditions for your snake


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## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

OrigamiB said:


> Plants are fine, and external heating methods can be used in a wooden vivarium
> 
> To heat with a bulb or ceramic just cut a hole in the top of the viv. I use a komodo dome reflector
> image
> ...


Thanks so much for that. Answered a lot of questions.
The pool/pond thing is gonna be removable.. just think of it as a sort of bath/water bowl for Hiss. Take it out every day to empty, clean and refil with fresh.


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## Willz0r2010 (Oct 6, 2010)

I'd personally never use a heatmat in a wooden viv, purely because it doesn't work very well. A ceramic (guarded as above of course) on a pulse or dimmer stat is far more effective inside a wooden viv.

In terms of making it natural, corns in the wild aren't really grass snakes, nor would they live on aspen or orchid bark.

There are a couple of good exhibits in London Zoo's reptile house which are designed around the inside of a barn for a single snake. Wooden panels around the 3 walls, hanging bags and satchels and boots as hides and various hammers, rope and so on as stimuli. This is where a corn snake would often be found.

They're even more commonly found outside in dry or rotting leaf litter or under bushes or fences. You can get leaf litter at places like Dartfrog.co.uk or just grab some from the garden and chuck it in (perfectly safe, although many people will disagree - but then some people still think feeding on the substrate is bad :lol2


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## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

Willz0r2010 said:


> I'd personally never use a heatmat in a wooden viv, purely because it doesn't work very well. A ceramic (guarded as above of course) on a pulse or dimmer stat is far more effective inside a wooden viv.
> 
> In terms of making it natural, corns in the wild aren't really grass snakes, nor would they live on aspen or orchid bark.
> 
> ...


I've never been to london zoo... but I love the sound of the barn... may do something around that.... thanks for that. So the lighting... the ceramic bulb, how do you know they are working??? Sorry if it's obvious but never used one and never seen one working either.


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## Willz0r2010 (Oct 6, 2010)

PeanutButterJellyTime said:


> So the lighting... the ceramic bulb, how do you know they are working???


Cos it's bloody hot!

Did you mean lighting or heating? You won't need lighting for a corn snake, really. Not unless it's in a really dark room anyway.


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## OrigamiB (Feb 19, 2008)

Ceramic bulbs.... probably one of the most efficient heating methods to instantly burn all your fingertips off! If unstatted they'l easily reach 100+c

There expensive but i've never had one break on me in the 4 years i've kept reps, there also the only bulb which you can use for both day and night as they don't emit light. As for lighting, you will only need a viewing light which can be any bulb of your choice, be it strip bulb, LED's, compact flourescent. If you plan to go down the planted route you will however need specific lighting


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## Willz0r2010 (Oct 6, 2010)

OrigamiB said:


> Ceramic bulbs.... probably one of the most efficient heating methods to instantly burn all your fingertips off! If unstatted they'l easily reach 100+c
> 
> There expensive but i've never had one break on me in the 4 years i've kept reps, there also the only bulb which you can use for both day and night as they don't emit light. As for lighting, you will only need a viewing light which can be any bulb of your choice, be it strip bulb, LED's, compact flourescent. If you plan to go down the planted route you will however need specific lighting


They're only expensive if you get the grossly overpriced branded ones. They're dirt cheap while still being incredibly reliable if you shop around a bit. Same with stats really.


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## OrigamiB (Feb 19, 2008)

Even if you get unbranded ceramics there still £10+, which for a lightbulb i guess you could say is expensive. I wouldn't really compare cheap stats to cheap bulbs though... The design and manufacture of a ceramic bulb is extremely basic. I have a few komodo branded ceramic bulbs which have lasted me years, but the same could never be said for a komodo stat for example


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## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

Well that was dim of me. So the ceramic bulbs are alot better. 
Think I'll have a look into them. I'll look on ebay to see if I can get them cheaper, and just shop around.

Thanks for your help guys... and scuse my at times... idioticness


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## Willz0r2010 (Oct 6, 2010)

OrigamiB said:


> Even if you get unbranded ceramics there still £10+


Shop around a bit more : victory:

You can get them from £5-£9 if you know where to look.


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## my_shed (Jan 5, 2011)

Willz0r2010 said:


> Shop around a bit more : victory:
> 
> You can get them from £5-£9 if you know where to look.


Oooh telld me where  tired of daft prices


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Ok, lots of good ideas here, so I'll just tell you what I do- feel free to use or not any bits. Blue is coming up for 3 now, and seems pretty healthy, at nearly 4ft long. He's in a standard 3ft Clearseal tank, with one of their viv lids- the one with the glass slide and the vent at one end. I use a halogen desk light for light- he really doesn't seem bothered either way, but I like to see him- on a timer. Standard heatmat set-up, although I usually turn this off completely in the summer. The substrate is a mix of orchid bark and 'live' leafmould, from a clean mixed beech and sweet chesnut wood on the North Downs, with additional leaf litter chucked on top occasionally. It naturally tends to be dryer at the 'hot end' and more moist at the 'cool end'- which gives all the native woodlice, springtails and other bugs a choice of habitat- as it does Blue. In addition, I've added tropical woodlice, springtails and ordinary compost worms- which on the whole, even cope with snake dung! I have noticed that the 'enrichment' (buzzword!) of the smell of new dead leaves definitely keeps him interested, as well. Decor is a mix of cork, rotted wood and branches, with a standard dog bowl for water. I generally have a serial ivy in a pot in there, but he always wrecks them over time, so I am seriously considering a fake. There are some fairly rubbish pics on my profile. Hope that's interesting, even if it doesn't help! :lol2:


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## Willz0r2010 (Oct 6, 2010)

my_shed said:


> Oooh telld me where  tired of daft prices


eBay, for one. I personally get all my equipment such as stats, heatmats, ceramics, heat cable and thermometers from Forttex - ridiculous prices but incredible quality.


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## PeanutButterJellyTime (Mar 19, 2012)

Ron Magpie said:


> Ok, lots of good ideas here, so I'll just tell you what I do- feel free to use or not any bits. Blue is coming up for 3 now, and seems pretty healthy, at nearly 4ft long. He's in a standard 3ft Clearseal tank, with one of their viv lids- the one with the glass slide and the vent at one end. I use a halogen desk light for light- he really doesn't seem bothered either way, but I like to see him- on a timer. Standard heatmat set-up, although I usually turn this off completely in the summer. The substrate is a mix of orchid bark and 'live' leafmould, from a clean mixed beech and sweet chesnut wood on the North Downs, with additional leaf litter chucked on top occasionally. It naturally tends to be dryer at the 'hot end' and more moist at the 'cool end'- which gives all the native woodlice, springtails and other bugs a choice of habitat- as it does Blue. In addition, I've added tropical woodlice, springtails and ordinary compost worms- which on the whole, even cope with snake dung! I have noticed that the 'enrichment' (buzzword!) of the smell of new dead leaves definitely keeps him interested, as well. Decor is a mix of cork, rotted wood and branches, with a standard dog bowl for water. I generally have a serial ivy in a pot in there, but he always wrecks them over time, so I am seriously considering a fake. There are some fairly rubbish pics on my profile. Hope that's interesting, even if it doesn't help! :lol2:


That sounds really interesting. I have no idea where I'd get the rotted wood, etc from.... they use pesticides around here, so no thank you 
WOuld I be able to buy it online?
I'll have a look at your pics... thanks dude


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