# urgent Advice needed on female beaded dragon pls



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

Hi all, i need some help, 
Last weekend i was given 2 adult bearded dragons, one male (oscar) one female ( olivia) now the bloke who had them before had them in the same viv as a breading pair. We moved them into our home and made them a new viv ( the one before was a bad make shift and looked awful) whilst trasfering the femal over, we noticed 2 eggs, Since them shes laid 5 more eggs, but one or two every day not a whole bunch like a couple of website have suggested they do.
Shes pale in colour and baggy/skinny not eating, unlike the male he wont stop eating!!, 
Ive taken her out to try and encourage her to eat some cuecumber and she just dont seem intrested, im also spraying them both daily like web sites have suggested.
The reptile shop says shes proberly due to shed is this possible?? and how long does this take? 
The temperture of the viv in the basking lamp is 94f and 82 in the cool area. 
I know alot of this could be the stress of the move so weve left her well alone. im just a bit worried that shes not eating/drinking and her egg laying seems random 
Any help/advice very much appreciated
Thanks


----------



## -Austin (Apr 25, 2009)

_I'd try encourage her to eat constantly it takes alot of nutrients and energy to lay and has probably worn her down hopefully she'll finish laying with some energy in her if needed process some insects or veg with a little calcium into a sort of 'slurry' and syring feed if she won't eat._

_I'd definitely stop spraying as the heat will burn them as the water dries on them you can spray around the viv just not on your dragons try bathing them once a day or once every other day in luke-warm water just covering the vent(small slit, at the top of the tail on the underside)_

_How are you measuring your temperatures? is it with a digital probe thermometer or an analog(dial) therm? the temps sound fine but it depends how your measuring them because stick on and dial therms can be off up to 20F!_


_What do you feed them on insect wise, do you gutload your insects and what do you supplement feedings with, pure calcium carbonate etc._

_Here's a list of the things good and bad to feed: __http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutrition.html__ try the prepared salads available in supermarkets for things on the list like escarole, endive they always have good things in._

_PM me for more help or I'll keep an eye on here!_


----------



## mrspebro (Mar 6, 2008)

you will find that while she is laying she willnot eat ,if you can seperate them, then that would be better for them, as the male will still harass her which will stress her out,


----------



## AuntyLizard (Feb 7, 2007)

There is obviously something wrong if she has not laid in one go. Could possibley be that she was moved so close to laying and it unsettled her. 

As said in above posts she wont eat while she is in laying mode.. She may well be dehydrated.. I would try bathing her in some warm water and see if she drinks.

After she has finished laying she will hopefully go back to eating well. She will need her food calcium dusted everyday for a good few weeks after to replace what she has lost. 

Just keep an eye on her over the next couple of days and try and get her to see a vet the last thing you need is for her to be egg bound.

Liz


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

Thank you both

Cant really seperate them we havent got another viv, Ive just looked over and shes laid her 5th egg of the day so far.
Weve built an incubator that we found how to do off here
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/breeding/132157-home-made-incubators.html
We did the 2nd one and were putting the eggs into there


ill defo go and have a look at the website, is it possible for her to be shedding as well as laying? is that why shes pale and dry??

Do i mash all her food down and feed her today or shall i leave it ? if so how long for?

Sorry for the questions im a newie :lol2:


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

sorry forgot to say, were feeding them on loctus, the male will eat 4-5 at a time, then vegetation the day after then 2 days off then back to locusts, but again she dont eat anything, weve taken him out to allow her a chance to eat the loctus ( incase his being greedy and leaving her out) and again still not eating.

The temp were measuring with a dial thermometer, Temperture seems fine to be honest.


----------



## grumpyoldtrout (May 19, 2008)

Basking temp seems low, we have ours at about 105 to 110 in the basking area and 85 in the cool end.

Have you got a source of UV light in the viv? Is their food being dusted with Cacium and Vitamins?

: victory:


----------



## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

Olivia_Oscar said:


> sorry forgot to say, were feeding them on loctus, the male will eat 4-5 at a time, then vegetation the day after then 2 days off then back to locusts, but again she dont eat anything, weve taken him out to allow her a chance to eat the loctus ( incase his being greedy and leaving her out) and again still not eating.
> 
> The temp were measuring with a dial thermometer, Temperture seems fine to be honest.


ok dial thermometers can be way out so try and get a digital one...aim for a basking spot of 105 ish.........offer veg every day..there is a list of veg in the lizard section, i offer adults dusted live food every other day, dust with calcium in the week and nutrabol at the weekend........what size viv are they in ? tbh does sound like she is stressed out and could be wise to try and get hold of another setup so she can have a break from the male
what substrate are they on and has she got a lay box in with her 
sorry for all the questions but to figure it out more info is needed


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

mask-of-sanity said:


> ok dial thermometers can be way out so try and get a digital one...aim for a basking spot of 105 ish.........offer veg every day..there is a list of veg in the lizard section, i offer adults dusted live food every other day, dust with calcium in the week and nutrabol at the weekend........what size viv are they in ? tbh does sound like she is stressed out and could be wise to try and get hold of another setup so she can have a break from the male
> what substrate are they on and has she got a lay box in with her
> sorry for all the questions but to figure it out more info is needed


 
Thanks for ur reply, ill get a digital thermomter tomorrow, tbh i havent given any calcuim as of yet i didnt know i had to, like i said im a learner but now i know this ill also get some of that tomorrow. 
There on sand/vericumite( spelling! sorry) which is what they came to me in so i just carried on with it. 
Is that wrong??

Ive also found out since we got them that the bloke before was feeding them on maggots, and yes maggots not meal worms, i havent come across this on any site before, again is that wrong??? and could that be the problem, shes used to maggots instead on loctus???

Ive given her a bath like suggested and she lapped up the water, didnt want to know the bayleaf,cuecumber,dandylion leaf mix, so i put her back in the basking spot ( after she had dried out of course)

The viv the're in is 3ft by 3 1/2 footish, weve screwed logs up so they can climb nearer the basking lamp onto a wooden shelf which they climb up onto all the time, as well as run about along the bottom of the viv.

we havent put a tray for her to lay eggs into, but what we have done is get damp sand/vericulmite and piled up the corner, to encourage her to lay.
I dont think shes egg bound shes laid 5 today, surely if she was she wouldnt lay any right??


ive read loads of websites and theres so many different things to try/do, i cant see were we're going wrong. please help me save her! im really hoping its coz shes laying eggs and is ready to shed ( Fingers crossed)


----------



## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

have asked a friend to come and reply she has more knowledge than me.....but think your gonna need to find a reptile vet in your area for a check up


----------



## AuntyLizard (Feb 7, 2007)

Olivia_Oscar said:


> Thanks for ur reply, ill get a digital thermomter tomorrow, tbh i havent given any calcuim as of yet i didnt know i had to, like i said im a learner but now i know this ill also get some of that tomorrow.
> There on sand/vericumite( spelling! sorry) which is what they came to me in so i just carried on with it.
> Is that wrong??
> 
> ...





mask-of-sanity said:


> have asked a friend to come and reply she has more knowledge than me.....but think your gonna need to find a reptile vet in your area for a check up


Thanks mask-of- sanity will do my best.

Ok I think there is a problem with olivia.. The problem being is that she really has not had enough calcium or been cared for properley (not by you by previous owner). 

When mine lay eggs they lay what they have in about 30 minutes, that can be anything up to 27/28 eggs, so to lay 5 a day is really not normal. 

She was obviously really dehydrated if she drank like you say she did. I am glad to see you are prepared to do your best to keep her going. I think you will need to take her to see a reptile vet as, she may well have problems passing these eggs due to poor diet and lack of calcium. I am not sure as I have not seen her if she has passed all her eggs yet but, like I said to be sure she is not egg bound she will need to see a vet. The way she has laid these eggs is definately not normal at all.

I am shocked that she was only fed maggots by previous owner. I am sure you are aware from reading sites that they need a varied diet that being both live food and fruit and veg. I think once you get her feeding again she will need to be fed both live food (crickets, locusts or roaches) everyday dusted with calcium.. Once a week I would also recommend that instead of using calcium you use nutrobol. This is a suppliment of vitamins and calcium. You can feed veg daily such as raw butternut squash (grated or chop finely) rocket, dandylion leaves and flower, romaine lettuce and cress. They can occasionally have things like blueberries, raspberries, kiwi fruit, carrots, beetroot (not in vinegar) and kale. Avoid spiniach.

Please, please try and get to a vet and keep us up to date with her progress. If you need any help at all please dont hesitate to pm me.

Liz


----------



## Paul B (Apr 16, 2008)

keep up the good work and suggest increasing basking temp to 105. Give her daily warm baths if she is drinking and it may also encourage the rest of the eggs.
As all above she isnt likely to feelike eating while she is in laying mode but dont stop offering. keep the mound of digging material damp.

This may all be about being in a strange environment and ........ oh all sorts.

keep the feeding regime as above and dust loads once she has started eating.
Try some wax worms to get her going but vary the diet as they are quite addictive and not the best long term food.


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

thank you thank you!!

i have a vet near me but not sure if its reptile based, ill get the yellow pages and look for my local one.

Ive got the calcuim powder and started dusting there food, live as well as veggies etc.

She hasnt laid anymore eggs today, just laying there basking. the basking temp i cant seem to get above 90f im using 100watt heat bulb, was thinking of lowering that to 60 and getting 2 basking bulbs to make 120watt, do you think that will help??

many thanks for your help folks i didnt know where else to go!!


----------



## AuntyLizard (Feb 7, 2007)

No problem at all.

If you are having problems getting your basking spot up try making your basking spot a little higher to the light. I would have thought having a 100w bulb in there would work. I have 60watt bulbs in my 4 x 2 x 2 vivs and have a basking spot of 110 - 113. If you dont know how to make it higher use a breeze block or something like that. I will take a pic of some of my vivs and post them later so you can see what I mean.

liz x


----------



## grumpyoldtrout (May 19, 2008)

If you move the thermostat probe further towards the cool end of the viv, it may help keep the temps up.  

BUT keep an eye on the basking spot temps as it could get too high. :2thumb:


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

hmmmmm well i found a number for our nearest reptile vet *Over 2 hours away!!* but rung them for advice they said sounds like the stress of the move as well as her possible shedding may have made her egg bound.
Shes laided another 2 eggs today, ive placed a birthing tray in the viv to see if she prefers that but she laided them other end of the tank, she seems to bask then comes down the log lays ONE then back up for basking again, 
Surely if she carrys on doing this the problem will eventually go, right??

Im not sure if its her 1st batch of eggs or not, the person we got them off didnt really lay much info with them, just there so caled age of 18 months and feed them maggots ( which i now know is totally wrong) 

im going to get her some meal worms tomorrow and see if she prefers those. she might be a fussy eater i dunno lol
ill carry on giving her luke warm baths and see if that will help her


OH!! also forgot to ask, i was thinking of exercise for them, now this is gonna sound mad BUT if i was to buy the largest hamster type ball for them to run around the front room in, that way they wont escape anywhere as well as getting daily exercise. Is that a good idea??? :lol2:


----------



## luvcats22 (Apr 24, 2009)

sorry to jump in on this thread, but you shouldnt feed meal-worms to a healthy dragon, never mind one that is clearly unwell, they cant digest the outer shell properly. locusts or crickets (gutloaded) are the best thing for her, or even butterworms as these are high in calcium.
i wouldnt put mine in a ball to run round, i just let him out and he has a wander round,then he goes back to his viv when he is tired,or wants to warm up a bit. all i do is make sure the door is closed,and keep an eye on him to make sure he doesnt get stuck anywhere.
like i said sorry to jump in on the thread. xx


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

Hi me again sorry, i found this picture online This is the colour shes gone, compared to the green/browny orange tinge of the male shes really pale, is this the colour they go before a shed??

sorry for the questions!!


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

luvcats22 said:


> sorry to jump in on this thread, but you shouldnt feed meal-worms to a healthy dragon, never mind one that is clearly unwell, they cant digest the outer shell properly. locusts or crickets (gutloaded) are the best thing for her, or even butterworms as these are high in calcium.
> i wouldnt put mine in a ball to run round, i just let him out and he has a wander round,then he goes back to his viv when he is tired,or wants to warm up a bit. all i do is make sure the door is closed,and keep an eye on him to make sure he doesnt get stuck anywhere.
> like i said sorry to jump in on the thread. xx


 
No no dont be sorry any advice i really appreciate, Thanks for the advice, ill get her butterworms instead, she dont seem intrested on the locusts, even when i hold them infront of her face EWWW!!
i thought the ball idea was good, as i have alot of nooks and crannys lol


----------



## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

meal worms and morio worms can be fed as a treat, as can wax worms.....she will see worms as her stable fd as thats all she has been given.....so i would lay off any type of worm until she will eat crickets or locust...........meal worms are ok for adult beardies just not in huge amounts............as for the ball i wouldnt....just close the door on the room and let them run about


----------



## AuntyLizard (Feb 7, 2007)

I like above I would try and avoid feeding any kind of worms until she will eat something like locust, crickets or roaches. If you dont like the thought of hopper (locust) jumping around the viv try dubia roaches if you put them in a bowl they wont climb out.. I can send you some if you pm your address for her to try.

Liz


----------



## JOE08 (Jul 19, 2008)

Hi, you could try her with a pinky ,we have given them to our female after she has laid.


----------



## grumpyoldtrout (May 19, 2008)

Any news on your little girl???

Hope she is improving. : victory:

Neil


----------



## Olivia_Oscar (May 17, 2009)

HI all, just thought ild keep u updated on Olivia, shes still not eating, its 2 weeks today and is looking very fragile, she moves about the viv and seems to have stopped laying, last one she laided was thursday and it was huge!! We had 10 in total over a few days.
This morning i gave her another luke warm bath and she drank some water too, i also crushed down a millworm mixed it with calcium powder and fed her, she didnt seem to keen but with a little persistance she took it. i'm gonna do this every day and see if it builds her strength up.
My nearest reptile vet i 2+ hours away and if im honest i cant afford to take her there and they poss keep her in and have to go get her a day or two later 

oh yea the 10 eggs we got in a viv that were controlling the temp with a habistat and heat mat they have collapsed. Does that mean they werent fertilised?


----------

