# Soil sand mix for beardie



## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

I'm thinking of giving my dragon a new substrate of soil and sand, so she can dig and make her own burrows. 

Does anyone have advice on going about this? 

Also how easy is it to clean poop? She has a knack for stepping in it and I'm worried I wouldn't notice if she had trekked it around the viv. 

I may make it bioactive in the future but for the time being it wouldn't be


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

A 60/40 mix of graded topsoil/sand, will provide a substrate suitable for burrowing

however! first you need to wet the substrate and pack it down, and the humidity will be very high for some weeks - putting in extra basking lamps at full power will dry it out quicker, but you'll need to wait for the substrate to dry out I suspect, before the beardie can be added (and def while the extra lamps are in there)


unless beardies are acclimatised to wet seasons? not sure if they are or not? if they are...then a few weeks high humidity, as long as the enclosure is_ very_ well ventilated, wont be an issue...something to investigate for yourself, i no longer keep beardies; interesting topic tho

as for cleaning, well its no more difficult than any other substrate

a bioactive substrate would do the job for you, but it needs to be moist, which would lead to humidity levels outside the range which is healthy for beardies


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> I'm thinking of giving my dragon a new substrate of soil and sand, so she can dig and make her own burrows.
> 
> Does anyone have advice on going about this?
> 
> ...


I've used that excavator stuff from zoomed and it has worked out fine for years. However if the beardie is still a baby, paper towels, tiles or newspaper is better as they tend to taste their environment more, can be clumsy and the risk of impaction is higher. Don't wet it too much, you don't want that cement feel to it just that little hardiness.

It's not that difficult to clean either. You do have to watch out for pee though and make sure to dig that out and 1inch in diameter and replace it with more excavator.

I've talked with a couple of Australian friends and they tell me that wild beardies love to go in their gardens and bask on their patios and plant pots so they are not restricted 100% to "desert/arid" environments.

As with humidity my enclosures reach 40-50% during the night and during the day it goes down 30%. I came to found out that they do benefit from this and I never kept a water bowl in their enclosure for the past 3 years. Bathing them one or twice a week is enough. They get the rest of their moisture from plants, insects and the humidity at night.

Hope this helped!


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> I've used that excavator stuff from zoomed and it has worked out fine for years. However if the beardie is still a baby, paper towels, tiles or newspaper is better as they tend to taste their environment more, can be clumsy and the risk of impaction is higher. Don't wet it too much, you don't want that cement feel to it just that little hardiness.
> 
> It's not that difficult to clean either. You do have to watch out for pee though and make sure to dig that out and 1inch in diameter and replace it with more excavator.
> 
> ...



Thanks, I've really been tempted by this before. I have made a custom background for her with polystyrene and grout so it's just the floor I'm interested in. Does it allow them to dig or does it set solid?


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> Thanks, I've really been tempted by this before. I have made a custom background for her with polystyrene and grout so it's just the floor I'm interested in. Does it allow them to dig or does it set solid?


It depends on how much you wet it. This is why I told you to not wet it too much. A little less than the instructions provide should give a good crumbly texture to it. If you wet it as per instructions than yeah, it will be pretty solid and difficult for them dig.

If you are going to use soil make sure it has some clay in it otherwise it will just crumble and the burrows would not hold


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

So if I put less water in they can dig and it will hold? How often does it need replacing?


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> So if I put less water in they can dig and it will hold? How often does it need replacing?


It should hold better than soil/sand mix. This is my experience after all so the outcome can be different with yours. Just experiment a bit.

I usually replace where the dragon has pooped and peed. I remove that and about 1inch in diameter and replace it with new excavator.


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> It should hold better than soil/sand mix. This is my experience after all so the outcome can be different with yours. Just experiment a bit.
> 
> I usually replace where the dragon has pooped and peed. I remove that and about 1inch in diameter and replace it with new excavator.



OK great thanks. So you don't do a full clean out, just spot clean?


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> OK great thanks. So you don't do a full clean out, just spot clean?


Yes. A bearded dragon environment in captivity is usually very hot and you get little to no pests within the substrate. I just dig out where the mess is every day and replace it. It helps to avoid pests like flies, mosquitos..etc


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

Pyrite said:


> It should hold better than soil/sand mix.


 what do you mean hold better? soil/sand mix will hold an extensive burrow, covering vast distances, with varying size holes, chambers and tunnels...that to me, seems pretty effective.


damn sight cheaper to :whistling2:


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> Yes. A bearded dragon environment in captivity is usually very hot and you get little to no pests within the substrate. I just dig out where the mess is every day and replace it. It helps to avoid pests like flies, mosquitos..etc



Perfect, I'll give this a try when she finishes brumation. Where do you buy it?


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## herper147 (Feb 7, 2009)

CloudForest said:


> what do you mean hold better? soil/sand mix will hold an extensive burrow, covering vast distances, with varying size holes, chambers and tunnels...that to me, seems pretty effective.
> 
> 
> damn sight cheaper to :whistling2:


The soil/sand mix can often just crumble and collaspe under such high heat. Like the other guy said soil with a bit more clay in it holds a bit nicer and firmer than standard, they are both good just a bit of clay hold better I swapped the soil in one of my Uro vivs for that reason, under such high heat it would go hard then just crumble when he tried to burrow.


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## CloudForest (Nov 27, 2013)

herper147 said:


> The soil/sand mix can often just crumble and collaspe under such high heat. Like the other guy said soil with a bit more clay in it holds a bit nicer and firmer than standard, they are both good just a bit of clay hold better I swapped the soil in one of my Uro vivs for that reason, under such high heat it would go hard then just crumble when he tried to burrow.


gotta get the ratio right, Loam top soils can dry rock hard


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> It depends on how much you wet it. This is why I told you to not wet it too much. A little less than the instructions provide should give a good crumbly texture to it. If you wet it as per instructions than yeah, it will be pretty solid and difficult for them dig.
> 
> If you are going to use soil make sure it has some clay in it otherwise it will just crumble and the burrows would not hold



How much clay do you use and how much water do you add to it?


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

CloudForest said:


> what do you mean hold better? soil/sand mix will hold an extensive burrow, covering vast distances, with varying size holes, chambers and tunnels...that to me, seems pretty effective.
> 
> 
> damn sight cheaper to :whistling2:


I gave my opinion. 

Seeing as you didn't specify what type of soil I went and assumed that you were talking about standard garden soil. That stuff does not hold, especially in a dry environment for beardies.

I tried soil/sand and did not work for me. It crumbled and never held for an extensive period of time. Excavator worked a lot better for me so I suggested that.

The only soil that would hold for me is the type that has clay in it and if you read again, I suggested that stuff too.


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> Perfect, I'll give this a try when she finishes brumation. Where do you buy it?


Standard reptile shops would have it under the zoomed sections. 



richwhite said:


> How much clay do you use and how much water do you add to it?


I don't know exactly. In my country our soils are naturally full of clay but I gave up on soils and also did not trust it even after sterilization. I am sure a quick google search will give you some good results though.



CloudForest said:


> gotta get the ratio right, Loam top soils can dry rock hard


If it's THAT hard it kinda defeats the purpose for burrows now doesn't it :whistling2::whistling2:


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> Standard reptile shops would have it under the zoomed sections.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Do you have any photos of your excavator setup?


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> Do you have any photos of your excavator setup?


Unfortunately I do not. It wasn't much to look at anyway I only used it as a small layer for ground and not deep enough to burrow. I used to construct hides out of rock that I found outside, setrilizing them and than bind them together with silicone and grout.

My two beardies were never the burrowing type. Even when introducing hides they never used them :lol2:


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> Unfortunately I do not. It wasn't much to look at anyway I only used it as a small layer for ground and not deep enough to burrow. I used to construct hides out of rock that I found outside, setrilizing them and than bind them together with silicone and grout.
> 
> My two beardies were never the burrowing type. Even when introducing hides they never used them :lol2:


Ah ok. I'm still undecided about soil instead. If I went that route what's the best way to do it? Alternatively I might just do excavator around the back and some of the floor, as she poops predominately in one spot, which I could leave clear


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> Ah ok. I'm still undecided about soil instead. If I went that route what's the best way to do it? Alternatively I might just do excavator around the back and some of the floor, as she poops predominately in one spot, which I could leave clear


Honestly man I would forget soils and just stick with tiling instead. It's a lot better due to it being easiest to clean, disinfect, 100% safe for beardies, easily accessible, easy to find and it helps to wear down the nails on your beardie as well.

I found this type of substrate the most efficient for a beardie setup but of course this is all depends on how natural you want your setup to look.

When I dealt with excavator clay I just poured all the contents in a bucket and mixed water in it. I halved the amount of water suggested on the packet and mixed it in and then layed it down by hand. I didn't spend much time fiddling with it as I was going for a natural setup but in the long run I just went with tiles instead.


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## Shrimps (Mar 20, 2014)

I've not tried the excavator stuff but I use sand/soil, I'm still not clear if the excavator dries solid or not?

I like the dirt though. It's great for burrows if I can keep it moist enough but it does get crumbly when dry, the deeper the better it seems. I am still perfecting the when and how much water to add. I don't find in my house/setup that the humidity spikes last too long, got lots of ventilation and a dry house though.


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

Pyrite said:


> Honestly man I would forget soils and just stick with tiling instead. It's a lot better due to it being easiest to clean, disinfect, 100% safe for beardies, easily accessible, easy to find and it helps to wear down the nails on your beardie as well.
> 
> I found this type of substrate the most efficient for a beardie setup but of course this is all depends on how natural you want your setup to look.
> 
> When I dealt with excavator clay I just poured all the contents in a bucket and mixed water in it. I halved the amount of water suggested on the packet and mixed it in and then layed it down by hand. I didn't spend much time fiddling with it as I was going for a natural setup but in the long run I just went with tiles instead.


She's already on lino, but I want to give a loose substrate as I think it benefits them more. It also will allow her to use her natural instinct to dig. What I might do though is just largely keep it to one side - although she will inevitably kick it around, the majority will be on one side of the viv and i could try and partition it with small rocks, which basically gives me the best of both worlds


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## Pyrite (Oct 13, 2012)

richwhite said:


> She's already on lino, but I want to give a loose substrate as I think it benefits them more. It also will allow her to use her natural instinct to dig. What I might do though is just largely keep it to one side - although she will inevitably kick it around, the majority will be on one side of the viv and i could try and partition it with small rocks, which basically gives me the best of both worlds


You could perhaps split the vivarium in half? One part with the clay and the other half with tilings?

I remember I had tried that method and it worked great but I got rid of it cause my beardie start to lick stuff and I got paranoid :lol2::lol2:



Shrimps said:


> I've not tried the excavator stuff but I use sand/soil, I'm still not clear if the excavator dries solid or not?


It dries pretty solid when mixed as per instruction on the back of the pack. However since the keeper in this instance wants to leave the option for digging open I suggested he uses less water


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## jarich (Mar 23, 2012)

Please do not forget about soils. I have to run to a meeting but will elaborate more when I get back. They are the most natural and best substrate you can give your dragon, and very easy to maintain once it is set up. Far superior to any other substrate you can give them.


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## richwhite (Jun 5, 2012)

jarich said:


> Please do not forget about soils. I have to run to a meeting but will elaborate more when I get back. They are the most natural and best substrate you can give your dragon, and very easy to maintain once it is set up. Far superior to any other substrate you can give them.



What about lucky reptile desert bedding? I will only need a relatively small so buying a big bag of soil and sand will mean lots sitting unused


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## jarich (Mar 23, 2012)

A bioactive soil substrate does a number of things that no other substrate allows for. While burrowing is a very important one, in that it allows for more natural behaviours, exercise, a more varied and enriched use of the enclosure, moisture retention, more controlled thermo- and chemical regulation and others, it is not the only advantage. A healthy bioactive soil also cleans itself. This is done through bacterial means mostly, and it is some of these same bacteria and nematodes that actually control parasitic reinfection also. As well, a bioactive soil has microfauna that aid in immune function and disease prevention, air quality, and quite frankly looks great. Much like adding variety to their diet makes you more aware of their nutritional needs, adding soil as a substrate makes you much more aware of their environment and keeping it healthy. As a side note, humidity is not an issue, as these animals are quite used to 50-60% humidity across parts of their range, as well as seasonally wet periods. Convinced yet? 

While excavator clay may make a solid substrate, and does allow for some burrowing, it does not foster anything other than anaerobic bacteria and does not allow for any kind of nitrogen cycle like bioactive soil does. So you are getting one benefit, but losing all the others. 

Tile is easy, but again there is no benefit from tile gained by the animal. Its just easy to keep clean for the owner. Not that this is a bad thing, just that there are many other positive things your substrate could be doing for your animal that tile doesnt do.

As for the LR Desert bedding, I have no experience with it, so cant say too much about it. I just looked it up and it sounds like its just soil with clay added to it, but they dont list any ingredients so its hard to tell.


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