# gorillas



## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

is there any private gorilla keeps in europe?
how much do they sell for??

(im not buying 1 im just curious)


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## shane 08 (Dec 31, 2009)

Lmao if u could I bet 100s off thousands


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## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

Ok, ill take the lack of replys to mean no1 is aware of any privatly kepy gorrillas


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## Herptileeditor (Sep 9, 2012)

Are you for real!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

Herptileeditor said:


> Are you for real!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Yes. Very real
Tigers, lions, retics, croc monitors and many many other very dangerous animals are kept in private collections. 

Im courious if gorillas are??? 

Is it wrong to wonder???


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Depends what you call a private collection? Aspinall's lot are privately owned.

But do I think that there are any in a back garden in S****horpe? No


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

BTW….the forum must have detected the C-word in the town of S****horpe, and deleted it out!!!:2thumb::2thumb::2thumb::2thumb::2thumb:


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## naja-naja (Aug 26, 2009)

people privately own all types of big cats, bears, wolves, chimps, venomous snakes, crocs and all sorts of animals, i don't see how a gorilla would be impossible, albeit unlikely, they used to have them in circuses back in the day and like chimps and orang utans the babies would be taken when a troupe was killed and sold into the pet trade. having said that the legality around keeping them is probably a bureaucratic nightmare given the amount of protections they have.


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## zimzee (Jan 23, 2010)

gorillas are endangered so i highly doubt anyone will be able to get one as a pet unless they are highly specialised in the field of keeping gorillas or something, but if you are interested for yourself try looking at a capuchin monkey or something of the same size.


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## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

zimzee said:


> gorillas are endangered so i highly doubt anyone will be able to get one as a pet unless they are highly specialised in the field of keeping gorillas or something, but if you are interested for yourself try looking at a capuchin monkey or something of the same size.


Im not interested in getting one atall mate.

Many many endangered animals are availble for private sale so that no reason why they couldnt be got.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

I think sourcing a Gorilla would be your issue. Its relatively easy to source a big cat, for surprisingly little money. (not taking into account the set up you would need). As someone said because Gorillas are protected I cant imagine them changing hands between private keepers very regularly, someone somewhere in the world will have one.


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

Pierre and Elianne Thivillon don’t have any children. But they do have a 265-pound gorilla. 
The couple, both zookeepers, took in Digit 13 years ago, when her biological mother refused to breastfeed. They already had experience working with gorillas, but acknowledge that it’s not an easy job.
New Zealand’s News 3 reports that the couple compares raising Digit to raising a child, in terms of the impact on their social life. There are no more nights out to the movies or restaurants, but they don’t seem to mind.
BBC News reports that during the day, Digit spends her time at the Saint Martin la Plaine Zoo in France. In the evenings, she returns home to her adopted parents, where she enjoys sleeping in their bed.
According to New Zealand’s News 3, the couple also once cared for Digit’s brother, Ginko, but he became aggressive and they had to return him to the zoo. "Life was very difficult a few days after Ginko left. We got used to seeing him everyday. He slept near us, we had breakfast together, we had a good time together and it was a real pleasure. It was very hard to see him go," Pierre told the news organization.
But Digit’s relationship to the couple appears to be quite loving, and video captures Digit hugging Pierre and even planting a kiss on him. As Pierre says, “It’s going very well. We have a 13-year-old relationship with Digit, so obviously we’ve created a very strong bond with each other.”
Although Digit’s story is a unique situation, keeping wild animals in human households can be frowned upon. 17-year-old Felicia Frisco sleeps with a Bengal tiger in her bed, and questions were raised over whether or not the animal should be kept in captivity. Unfortunately though, a handler explained, "There's nowhere for a tiger to live in the wild anymore."
As for gorillas, many are endangered or threatened. For example, mountain gorillas in Central Africa are threatened by the Human Metapneumovirus which causes deadly respiratory diseases in humans and can be passed on to mountain gorillas.


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## Malagasy (Nov 27, 2011)

Seeing as most zoos cant afford to keep them properly i doubt many people would keep them privately..


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

Malagasy said:


> Seeing as most zoos cant afford to keep them properly i doubt many people would keep them privately..


never underestimate the frivilous wealth of some folks.


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

SiUK said:


> never underestimate the frivilous wealth of some folks.


 I agree. 

I would question why someone would want to own one though. With them being endangered, having one kept as nothing more than a pet seems very hard to justify to me.


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

I am going to be a bit radical and say that I dont think that anyone should be allowed to keep any primates unless they are a part of a breeding programme designed at maintaining a species and where possible releasing into the wild


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## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

The word "endangered" has been used a few times now as a reason why people shouldnt own 1. There are many many other endangered animals being keep privitly.


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

MontyPython said:


> The word "endangered" has been used a few times now as a reason why people shouldnt own 1. There are many many other endangered animals being keep privitly.


That doesn't necessarily mean that this is also acceptable though. 

Although, you need to judge each and every case on it's own merits.


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## MontyPython (Jan 3, 2008)

Mynki said:


> That doesn't necessarily mean that this is also acceptable though.
> 
> Although, you need to judge each and every case on it's own merits.


Both points are very true but if someone had the time, money and space needed then why should they not be allowed to keep any captive breed animal??


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

MontyPython said:


> Both points are very true but if someone had the time, money and space needed then why should they not be allowed to keep any captive breed animal??


I agree, I have seen private keepers with setups that rival zoos


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

MontyPython said:


> Both points are very true but if someone had the time, money and space needed then why should they not be allowed to keep any captive breed animal??


 I think it depends on the individual situation. Keeping a CB corn snake is one thing, but do you not think that keeping an example of an endangered species with breeding potential is selfish and irresponsible when being kept as nothing more than a pet?

Do you not think it makes more sense for the animal to be part of a captive breeding programme?


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

I'm slightly amazed that no-one has raised the usual (and true!) point that comes up when captive primates are mentioned; *one* is no good at all. Unless people can afford a group, as the Aspinalls do, it's a non-starter with a highly-intelligent, highly social animal, and I doubt there are many even pretty rich people who can afford the facilities needed, let alone the actual animals.


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## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

Anything can be kept if you have enough cash, heythrop has a polar bear! But it'd be a lot of cash for a baby gorilla, maybe if you set up a large enclosure like Monkey World you could offer to take unwanted males, which would still be available in the studbook when needed, that's how monkey worlds nursery works.
If you really wanted to do it, then you could.


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## Zak (Jan 7, 2008)

There were privately held gorillas in the 60's and 70's without a shadow of a doubt. Animal dealers in mainland Europe would sell animals to whoever could pay for it, zoo, circus and private keeper. ~£600 bought a gorilla back in the mid 60's.

Now would be an entirely different matter, gorillas are one of the most managed species within European zoos so even with enough cash to sink a ship its unlikely you could buy your way into the club. 

Anyway who'd want one, they utterly stink.


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## Devi (Jan 9, 2011)

Zak said:


> There were privately held gorillas in the 60's and 70's without a shadow of a doubt. Animal dealers in mainland Europe would sell animals to whoever could pay for it, zoo, circus and private keeper. ~£600 bought a gorilla back in the mid 60's.
> 
> Now would be an entirely different matter, gorillas are one of the most managed species within European zoos so even with enough cash to sink a ship its unlikely you could buy your way into the club.
> 
> Anyway who'd want one, they utterly stink.


Pretty sure that you're not 100% there, people have an idea that zoos are some high and mighty that control import, yet one of the most controlled species (at least in the UK), polar bears are in private hands. Monkey world set up with little trouble and little experience, yet brought in tons of chimps, they had the right people and got it going, equally Benjamin Mee bought a bunch of protected animals almost on a whim. 
You can get whatever if you have the money, knowledge, or both.


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

so what size viv would you need


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## Zak (Jan 7, 2008)

Devi said:


> Pretty sure that you're not 100% there, people have an idea that zoos are some high and mighty that control import, yet one of the most controlled species (at least in the UK), polar bears are in private hands. Monkey world set up with little trouble and little experience, yet brought in tons of chimps, they had the right people and got it going, equally Benjamin Mee bought a bunch of protected animals almost on a whim.
> You can get whatever if you have the money, knowledge, or both.


Sorry realise now my post wasn't particularly clear. I meant obtaining gorillas from the studbook wouldn't be feasible regardless of money. 

Polar bears are not as controlled for imports as gorillas, they're CITES listing 2/B for a start. Also the way that the UK has adopted EU health legislation means that primates can only come from approved sources of which none currently exist outside of the EU.


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## Ryanbrown89 (Aug 10, 2013)

zimzee said:


> gorillas are endangered so i highly doubt anyone will be able to get one as a pet unless they are highly specialised in the field of keeping gorillas or something, but if you are interested for yourself try looking at a capuchin monkey or something of the same size.


Not all gorillas are endangered


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## mrcriss (Nov 2, 2010)

Ryanbrown89 said:


> Not all gorillas are endangered


Yes they are


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

Going off on a tangent why are the ones in zoos the lowland whilst the ones in the documentaries are highland ? I have never seen a highland one in a zoo.


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## bothrops (Jan 7, 2007)

Almost all gorilla in captivity are Western Lowland Gorilla _Gorilla gorilla gorilla_.

Only four confirmed Mountain gorilla (_Gorilla beringei beringei_) are known to have left Africa:

1. 'Miss Congo' went to Bronx Zoo in New York in 1920's
2. 'Reuben' (male) sent to London Zoo circa 1961, died soon after. (He had been found by a tracker near the body of an adult male that had died naturally, and seemed to have wandered away from his group by mistake)
3. Coco & Pucker (females) sent to Cologne Zoo in Germany. Big row about them being sent as a political gift from Rwanda to Germany. They both died in 1978.

..though there are reports of a number of other hunts and removals of young to attempt breeding groups, not much information is available but none were successful.

There have been a few Eastern Lowland Gorilla (_Gorilla beringei graueri_) that were claimed as Mountains (including Chester's group in the 70's (though to be fair, the differences between the subspecies wasn't as well understood back then.))



It is unclear why _G.b. beringei_ failed to thrive in captivity (apart from the obvious fact that the four confirmed animals were never going to breed!), and I don't think there are enough left to 'try again' even with modern husbandry techniques.




Sad fact is that there are more Western Lowlands in captivity in zoos (875ish) than there are Mountains estimated to be left in the wild (less than 800).


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## Zak (Jan 7, 2008)

colinm said:


> Going off on a tangent why are the ones in zoos the lowland whilst the ones in the documentaries are highland ? I have never seen a highland one in a zoo.


There have been a handful of Mountain gorillas in European zoos, the last was in the late 70's at Koln Zoo i believe. There's also two female Eastern lowland gorilla at Antwerp zoo otherwise all captive gorillas are Western lowlands, _Gorilla gorilla gorilla._ 

It may be the case that the lowland gorillas were easier to come across, for a start they inhabit relatively more accessible habitat than their Mountain counterparts . They also have the largest distribution of any gorilla species so again you would be more likely to come across them. I think the lesson here is if you want to avoid exploitation by humans go live up mountains.

Oh also worthy of note is that Dian Fossey bought Mountain gorillas into the limelight which could be another factor why so many documentaries are centred around them.


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## RhianB87 (Oct 25, 2009)

They are very scary animals to work with! 
I was lucky enough when I did work experience at a zoo to spend time working with their 2 groups but seeing a fully grown silver back having a strop a few feet away is terrifying! 

Another problem I would guess with having them privately is the difficult group dynamics. If you have a troop but one doesnt get along you have to move it out or it may end up in death! This is why the zoo I was at had two groups. If you dont have space for another group or somewhere to sent them it may not end well.


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