# APA attack shows – again



## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

The Animal Protection Agency is taking the opportunity to attack shows under the review by the Environmental Audit Committee of Wildlife Crime. 

The APA submission can be viewed here. 

If you are a keeper that breeds disposes of surplus animals at shows, advertises them on the internet or to dealers then you should take the time to read the submission and see if you agree with what they have to say. This is a government select committee that like all select committees is very influential. 

REPTA/FBH has made a joint submission see here.

We shall in due course be submitting a corrective memorandum to that of the APA drawing the committee’s attention to some of the inaccurate and misleading information contained in their submission.


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

This post has just 34 views. Perhaps it should be duplicated in the snake, lizard and shelled section to further raise awareness, seeing as those sub forums are more popular than this one. Especially as you raise a very important issue. 

Just a thought.


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

Mynki said:


> This post has just 34 views. Perhaps it should be duplicated in the snake, lizard and shelled section to further raise awareness, seeing as those sub forums are more popular than this one. Especially as you raise a very important issue.
> 
> Just a thought.


Aggreed, points like this need to be raised in locations of high traffic. 

jay


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

Mynki said:


> This post has just 34 views. Perhaps it should be duplicated in the snake, lizard and shelled section to further raise awareness, seeing as those sub forums are more popular than this one. Especially as you raise a very important issue.
> 
> Just a thought.


I think you are absolutely right but when ever I have done so I get told off by the moderators and the post removed. Personally I think as many people as possible should know what is going on!


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

Chris Newman said:


> I think you are absolutely right but when ever I have done so I get told off by the moderators and the post removed. Personally I think as many people as possible should know what is going on!


http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...eness-truly-important-issues.html#post9793531

I'd like to see that change, but it's all upto the admin / mod team...


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

Mynki said:


> http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...eness-truly-important-issues.html#post9793531
> 
> I'd like to see that change, but it's all upto the admin / mod team...


Your efforts are greatly appreciated, thank you….


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## blood and guts (May 30, 2007)

Chris Newman said:


> I think you are absolutely right but when ever I have done so I get told off by the moderators and the post removed. Personally I think as many people as possible should know what is going on!


if thats the case its the mods and admins that need the telling off, any info like this needs to be passed on as much as possible!


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

blood and guts said:


> if thats the case its the mods and admins that need the telling off, any info like this needs to be passed on as much as possible!


Whilst I absolutely agree with you there is a prevalence of “it will never happen” and this is all scaremongering [the exact purpose of the latter eludes me] Nevertheless the ostrich position is very popular!! Personally I don’t advocate this, if someone is going to insert something sharp up my posterior I think I would prefer to see it coming so I could brace myself rather than it coming as a complete shock! Then again perhaps that’s just me - now where is that bucket of sand!!!!!!!


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## blood and guts (May 30, 2007)

mate you need to get the old cview forums going again, can do all the scare mungering you want then:2thumb:


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## kingcobra (Jul 27, 2005)

while we should ALL regard fair and humane treatment of animals as sacrosanct, we should nevertheless be wary of power hungry individuals who propose far-reaching,and draconian policy in order to achieve short term fame and influence within the framework of their own organisation,the inference from that should be obvious,ALL ideas are the original creation of an INDIVIDUAL MIND,the exposure of warped ambition and possible other hidden agendas from that source should be regarded as within the public interest to be exposed.: victory:


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## Athravan (Dec 28, 2006)

The rules are there for good reason, and we can't have everyone who thinks they have an important issue to raise breaking them.

HOWEVER I would like to point out that I have not been contacted at all in regards to making this a sticky or an announcement. All it takes is asking politely and starting a conversation and keeping moderators/admin informed. It does make me unhappy to see people having a go at the moderators about issues we have not been informed about.

In the past, Chris Newman, your posts HAVE been stickied (and some still are) and made announcements where necessary myself and by the previous admin T-Bo.

If you were told off by a moderator for duplication then it's probably because our moderators follow a set of rules and if you want to be an exception to the rule you just need to work with us so we understand what's going on. I'm quite happy to discuss this via PM, I'd really appreciate it if you could do so in future if you want to duplicate posts/make announcements across multiple forums.


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

Tell me to bugger off and mind my own business if you like but why not discuss an FBH / RFUK campaign. Give it a suitable name and have relevant post stickied and locked so that the message can get across and then link it to a relevant discussion thread. 

Therefore newbies are more likely to see the announcement and can then choose to follow the discussion until it dies off. 

On a releated note, Chris Newman, have you ever got hold of a copy of APA's accounts from companies house?


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

Athravan said:


> The rules are there for good reason, and we can't have everyone who thinks they have an important issue to raise breaking them.
> 
> HOWEVER I would like to point out that I have not been contacted at all in regards to making this a sticky or an announcement. All it takes is asking politely and starting a conversation and keeping moderators/admin informed. It does make me unhappy to see people having a go at the moderators about issues we have not been informed about.
> 
> ...


I simply pointed out that when I have tried to make mutable posting in the passed I have been rebuked for doing so. Historically RFUK has not been hugely helpful in disseminating information to its membership which as always struck me as curious considering the bulk of member are keepers. As we have some dark times ahead perhaps we can look forward to a new era of cooperation.


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

Mynki said:


> Tell me to bugger off and mind my own business if you like but why not discuss an FBH / RFUK campaign. Give it a suitable name and have relevant post stickied and locked so that the message can get across and then link it to a relevant discussion thread.
> 
> Therefore newbies are more likely to see the announcement and can then choose to follow the discussion until it dies off.
> 
> On a releated note, Chris Newman, have you ever got hold of a copy of APA's accounts from companies house?


Periodically I look at the accounts of the accounts of the top ten or so Animal Rights organisations [which included the Animal Protection Agency] just to see how they are getting along. They are doing pretty well as you can see from the figures below!

*2009*
Charitable income: £191,761,484.00
Non-charitable income: £ 25,704,738.00
*Total income: £217,466,200.00*

*2011*
Charitable income: £287,612,204.00
Non-charitable income: £5,996,319.00
*Total income: £293,608,523.00*


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

Do you have figures from APA themselves?

I'm curius as to where their income comes from? Is Ms Tollands salary detailed in their accounts?


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## Chris Newman (Apr 23, 2007)

Mynki said:


> Do you have figures from APA themselves?
> 
> I'm curius as to where their income comes from? Is Ms Tollands salary detailed in their accounts?


Anyone interested in the Accounts for the APA can acquire them from Companies House, although they are not particularly interesting.


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