# Foaming at the mouth



## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

Hi peeps , i got my euathlus truculentus sa through the post today and when i got her out i realised she had white stuff in her mouth but i cant get a close enough look

is it just dehydration ? or is it something worse

i thought it may have bin a bit of tissue but i cant see close enough

any ideas ??

( and please no jokes about white in her mouth lol)


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## Dan99 (Aug 5, 2009)

Could just be left overs of her last meal ? Now I could have made a sarcastic comment but I was good and didnt


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

oh dear... remove the spider away from any other spiders asap. it maybe nematodes... if it is not a food item it has in its mouth then you need to put this spider into Q asap...


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

cobe said:


> oh dear... remove the spider away from any other spiders asap. it maybe nematodes... if it is not a food item it has in its mouth then you need to put this spider into Q asap...


Ok you got me worried now , what is nematodes and what does it do and can i do anything about it


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

im sorry to worry you... i would do some research on the net about it. any spider i have seen with this have sadly not survived :/ .... i would put it into Q just to be safe...


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

cobe said:


> im sorry to worry you... i would do some research on the net about it. any spider i have seen with this have sadly not survived :/ .... i would put it into Q just to be safe...


How would you Quarentine a T , i mean obviously she's in her seperate viv but what else, is it a disease then ?

what do you know about it ?


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## Dan99 (Aug 5, 2009)

Personly I would ask for a refund mate, getting sent a T that possibly will not make it is a bit dodgy.


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> How would you Quarentine a T , i mean obviously she's in her seperate viv but what else, is it a disease then ?
> 
> what do you know about it ?


when i say Q i mean remove it away from the rest of your T collection... i am not saying it is this but i would like to be safe rather than sorry...


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

dan99 said:


> personly i would ask for a refund mate, getting sent a t that possibly will not make it is a bit dodgy.


^^deffo this^^


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

again without seeing the spider i cant say it is this problem... 

Nematode worms and tarantulas

have a read of this. in the photo is a close up of what the mouth of the spider looks like. when i have seen it with my own eyes it looks foamy and wet around the spiders mouth...


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## darkdan99 (Dec 28, 2006)

Quarantine is a must, until you know better. Move the spider and its tank into a separate room and make sure you wash your hands thoroughly and sterilise equipment before dealing with other animals (any other animal)

There are many things it could be, and to get a better diagnosis, you should either inspect the spider (either hands on or by containing it in a clear pot so you can see underside clearly) Better still take a picture to allow others to speculate discuss and diagnose for you!


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

Dan99 said:


> Personly I would ask for a refund mate, getting sent a T that possibly will not make it is a bit dodgy.


I had to phone them last week coz there was a DOA on my last order, they replaced it for me but after trying to get me to have it on my next order to save on postage

now there just gonna think i'm after a free spider, i'll just phone them and ask there advice and see if they tell me its nematodes or not 

i hate being the complaining customer but i suppose i need to step up


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

*Dilemmas and diseases*

{GRB}: For some reason after I merged this post with this thread it has inserted it here rather than at the end of the thread. I feel it is better off keeping this to one topic rather than starting several where relevent information might be easily missed.



Ok after posting my last thread i have learbed that my new T may have nematodes
She has a white pastey globual at the bottom of her mouth
after reading some articles i about checking the paste in water under a bright light to look for worms i found there was nothing there , the water turned slightly cloudy but was clear of anything

i got the spider off a seller who i have bought a few off now and last week i had a DOA (which they quickly replaced)

so i'm worried noe that there gonna think i'm taking the :censor: to try and get a free spider, i cant really post it back as if it does have nematodes there not gonna want it anywhere near the rest of there stock

so what should i do and whats your opinion on the spider and the suspect white residue

I'm NOT going to names the source of this spider as i'm sure its an isolated incident and i've just been unfortunate
i do not wish to give and false bad reviews 

i am going to phone the supplier and see what they say but i'd also like other opinions


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> I had to phone them last week coz there was a DOA on my last order, they replaced it for me but after trying to get me to have it on my next order to save on postage
> 
> now there just gonna think i'm after a free spider, i'll just phone them and ask there advice and see if they tell me its nematodes or not
> 
> i hate being the complaining customer but i suppose i need to step up


your not complaining at all. i would send the spider back and i wouldnt even ask for a refund tbh if it is nematodes its best away from your collection all together...


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

:gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp: I jst remembered , i rehomed my 3 new avic versi slings after the possble infected spider which where delivered at the same time, i didnt physically touch them but i did touch there new tubs on the outside

omg i hope they dont get infected




cobe said:


> your not complaining at all. i would send the spider back and i wouldnt even ask for a refund tbh if it is nematodes its best away from your collection all together...


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> :gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp::gasp: I jst remembered , i rehomed my 3 new avic versi slings after the possble infected spider which where delivered at the same time, i didnt physically touch them but i did touch there new tubs on the outside
> 
> omg i hope they dont get infected


should be ok mate... i had nematodes in a chile rose someone gave me. it was next to my spider collection about 200 at the time i think and i had no fatalities other than the chile... really dont worry about things until they happen...


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

cobe said:


> should be ok mate... i had nematodes in a chile rose someone gave me. it was next to my spider collection about 200 at the time i think and i had no fatalities other than the chile... really dont worry about things until they happen...


WELL TO LATE , it may be just a coinsedence but i just checked them and one is dead :gasp::gasp::gasp:mg:mg:mg:mg:

What the hell !!!!

so not happy right now


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## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

Without seeing a picture, none of you can ID this as nematodes.

So quit it! :devil:

I have seen various wite substances reported from tarantulas. If it looks a bit like white yeasty stuff then that is usually a bad sign. Not nematodes, but nonetheless a problem. 

The best anyone has come up with so far is that it's a reflux caused by feeding the tarantula too close to moulting or perhaps being posted. The stress of either of these things can cause then to 'puke' basically. Sometimes it's fatal, sometimes it's not. I have a suspicion that the fatal occurences are pre-moulting and to do with problems in the sucking stomach.


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## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

If the spider is active and moving around normally, I would put it next to a bowl of fresh water, it may well just need a drink.

Even if it is nematodes, they wouldn't have spread to and killed your versi in a matter of hours. Versi slings are very fragile and can keel over for no apparent reason - of course there is a reason but it's not always apparent. Even the stress of rehousing might've been enough.


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## spicewwfc (Aug 26, 2009)

GRB said:


> Without seeing a picture, none of you can ID this as nematodes.
> 
> So quit it! :devil:
> 
> ...





garlicpickle said:


> If the spider is active and moving around normally, I would put it next to a bowl of fresh water, it may well just need a drink.
> 
> Even if it is nematodes, they wouldn't have spread to and killed your versi in a matter of hours. Versi slings are very fragile and can keel over for no apparent reason - of course there is a reason but it's not always apparent. Even the stress of rehousing might've been enough.


Why has no one said this already, instead of fear mongering about nematodes.
I have had T's arrive who have had a bad time in the post, and attacked the tissue, and it was all in their mouth, have a good look before you jump to conclusions.


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## Lucybug (May 10, 2011)

And here is why i belive a restraint grab is an art that must be learnt... Its ok to take a pic through a screen, but even better when held and pic took 

As GRB said, take a picture, it could be a number of things, nemotodes is just as easy to diognose here, as well as a clumsy spider toppling over being diognosed with DKS. Neither are accurate, and just causes huge problems for concerns, then in turn, you could pottentially be told the wrong information, potentially causing the spider to die (ok its rare granted, but wrong info is passed, human nature and all that)

I think a picture would be a good start, most of the time its somthing simple, then at other times it turns out to be somwhat a difficult issue, and heart breaking for the owner. Dont panic on the nemotodes, just keep her seperate from the rest, plenty of water, a picture, and then somone im sure can further help you on the case


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## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

spicewwfc said:


> Why has no one said this already, instead of fear mongering about nematodes.
> I have had T's arrive who have had a bad time in the post, and attacked the tissue, and it was all in their mouth, have a good look before you jump to conclusions.


Those Euathlus from TSS are wild caught - it will have been caught in Chile, stuck in a box, flown over and put up for sale, for all you know it hasn't had a drink for months.

I'm by no means a spider expert but I've been keeping for a few years and have never seen a case of nematodes, or "DKS" for that matter.


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## Colosseum (Aug 8, 2008)

I had a Trunky and it ate like a pig, had it 3 months and went to check on it one day and it was dead not in a death curl mind best way I can describe it was like frozen stiff, it put me off them and have not had one since.


Has anyone on here had one of these for a good length of time?


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## spicewwfc (Aug 26, 2009)

garlicpickle said:


> Those Euathlus from TSS are wild caught - it will have been caught in Chile, stuck in a box, flown over and put up for sale, for all you know it hasn't had a drink for months.
> 
> I'm by no means a spider expert but I've been keeping for a few years and have never seen a case of nematodes, or "DKS" for that matter.


Good point.
I have never seen nematodes in the flesh either, I had a juvie genic with DKS, but that could have been due to anything, probably dehydration, I only had it for a day, and it started showing signs, put it in an ICU, and it was dead in a few hours.


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## mcluskyisms (Jan 24, 2010)

I think you will find its probably just been eating its own excrement.


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## Lucky Eddie (Oct 7, 2009)

Colosseum said:


> Has anyone on here had one of these for a good length of time?


 
Nope.

Wild caught, three months, ate once, died once.

Never again!


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## mcluskyisms (Jan 24, 2010)

Ive had three for about four months now (WC) and all are doing well.


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## Kamike (Aug 3, 2009)

mcluskyisms said:


> I think you will find its probably just been eating its own excrement.


This

I have had one or two Ts that have pooped on the side of their enclosure and walked over it before I got round to cleaning it off. I got a syringe filled with tepid water and gently squeezed the water out over the mouth area. The Ts then spent a good hour or so cleaning and all was well from then on.


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

ok as i said hopefully it isnt nematodes, BUT it is important to remove the spider away from the collection INCASE it is... better to say i lost the one spider than oh i lost several spiders... i have seen nematodes several times. i was sent some photos too from other T breeders showing the wet patch around the mouth, never saw any nematodes comming out the mouth though. the first time a came across nematodes was at one of the bts shows a few years ago. a french breeder brought infected stock over with him and a few mates bought livestock off him. it is said that it is spread by the compost flies, though this is not conclusive... i had a chile rose with it and thankfully i knew the tell tale signs and removed it to Q as soon as i saw it, it died a few days later. a very good mate of mine lost about 8 Ts in his breeding room from an infected spider comming in from europe. 

avic slings have a habbit of just dropping dead so i wouldnt say it died from anything other than stress/dehydration...


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

*Update on possible nematodes*

I've bin in contact with the seller and one of them said that i should keep it quarentined and keep her warm(30dc) and a bowl of water and change a few times a day

apparantely nematodes cant survive at that temp but the spider can for a short period of time

although i'm hesitant to do this as if it is just something simple then i'm stressing the T out big time for no reason

o and she isnt eating , shows no interest in food what so ever but she's moving around like any other other T and shows no aggresive/defensive behaviour when picked up

anyway what do you guys think about the temp suggestion

to the mods-

i do apologise for the fear mongering but i needed advice and i didnt know nematodes would be suggested


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> I've bin in contact with the seller and one of them said that i should keep it quarentined and keep her warm(30dc) and a bowl of water and change a few times a day
> 
> apparantely nematodes cant survive at that temp but the spider can for a short period of time
> 
> ...


you are not fear mongering? you asked for advice and people gave it to you. i have never heard of the heat treatment before? Romain Pizzi has done some tests using mild wormer doses and other treatments from, what i know, but it could not tell you the outcome of this. i have not been with the bts or any spider forums so sadly the information i have is based on mine and others experiences of nematodes. i wish you all the best with this specimen. if you have any questions please feel free to pm me and i will do all i can to help,
Regards
Andy


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## mcluskyisms (Jan 24, 2010)

Not being funny, but why not post a photo so people can have a look? I think you're over worrying over nothing TBH.


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

mcluskyisms said:


> not being funny, but why not *post a photo so people can have a look? I think you're over worrying over nothing* tbh.


^^this^^


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## kris74 (May 10, 2011)

How is the spider acting? Most of the replies regarding possible nematodes have hinted at the T not lasting long after discovery and your's appears to be doing well so far and this has to be 24 hours after receiving it as special delivery is usually there prior to one pm. How big is it and have you tried feeding it yet? Personally I would try it with a food item to see what the reaction is if it isn't acting spooked or in anyway out of sorts and just see how things go. That and a picture if you can get one....


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## kris74 (May 10, 2011)

cobe said:


> ^^this^^


I'm not being funny mate but you were the first one in with a knee jerk reaction.....




cobe said:


> oh dear... remove the spider away from any other spiders asap. it maybe nematodes... if it is not a food item it has in its mouth then you need to put this spider into Q asap...



And now you think he's worrying over nothing? Personally I think it's either poo or bog roll.


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

kris74 said:


> I'm not being funny mate but you were the first one in with a knee jerk reaction.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


and what if it is??? ring any of the big T breeders in the uk and say my spider is foaming at the mouth and see what their responce is? i've seen nematodes first hand. i said what i thought.


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## spicewwfc (Aug 26, 2009)

kris74 said:


> I'm not being funny mate but you were the first one in with a knee jerk reaction.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Agreed.

Have you had a close look?
Is it a thick gloopy yeasty substance? Or is it someting else?

And seriously just post a pic, it would save loads of guess work from a poor description.

Are they sending you a replacment?
I think I would be having some serious words with them, is they have sent you a T with nematodes.


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

kris74 said:


> How is the spider acting? Most of the replies regarding possible nematodes have hinted at the T not lasting long after discovery and your's appears to be doing well so far and this has to be 24 hours after receiving it as special delivery is usually there prior to one pm. How big is it and have you tried feeding it yet? Personally I would try it with a food item to see what the reaction is if it isn't acting spooked or in anyway out of sorts and just see how things go. That and a picture if you can get one....


Hi Kris how ya doin , your right that i'm worrying and probably over nothing but in retrospect this has bin educational for me and i'm sure some other people have learnt a few things 

non the less i'm :censor: it right now , i feel like the babysitter that dropped the baby

as for a pic i've tried and i learnt that she does not like being pinch grabbed , after a couple of attemps she went into a defensive posture


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## mcluskyisms (Jan 24, 2010)

You don't have to pick the tarantula up to take a photo of its underneath, just try manipulating it onto the side of the enclosure with a paintbrush and then grab a photo.


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## kris74 (May 10, 2011)

septicrazorwire said:


> Hi Kris how ya doin , your right that i'm worrying and probably over nothing but in retrospect this has bin educational for me and i'm sure some other people have learnt a few things
> 
> non the less i'm :censor: it right now , i feel like the babysitter that dropped the baby
> 
> as for a pic i've tried and i learnt that she does not like being pinch grabbed , after a couple of attemps she went into a defensive posture



Alright mate, I can understand the concern but as stated, nematodes are pretty rare and if it was TSS it's unlikely they would send an infected spider out. Of course sometimes these things can happen. Anyhoo....

I found this for ye, it's magnified but will give you some idea of what you could be dealing with if worst comes to worst.

Tarantula Spider Infested with Nematode Worms [ Nematodes ] - YouTube

and this....

http://atshq.org/boards/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14442

Not the clearest pictures but might be similar to yours


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

I just notced after she was sat in her water bowl for a few seconds that the suspect white stuff has pretty much gone so now all i gotta do is watch if it comes back

i really hope it doesnt


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## cobe (Nov 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> I just notced after she was sat in her water bowl for a few seconds that the suspect white stuff has pretty much gone so now all i gotta do is watch if it comes back
> 
> i really hope it doesnt


a photo would be a massive help to determin what this is. a photo of the whole spider too.


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## mcluskyisms (Jan 24, 2010)

septicrazorwire said:


> I just notced after she was sat in her water bowl for a few seconds that the suspect white stuff has pretty much gone so now all i gotta do is watch if it comes back
> 
> i really hope it doesnt


As mentioned before, most likely excrement.


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## septicrazorwire (Aug 2, 2011)

cobe said:


> a photo would be a massive help to determin what this is. a photo of the whole spider too.


I know it would be better with a pic but she's bin messed with alot in the last 48 hours, if you think she's bin posted and rehoused, inspected and swabbed and moved around a few times and i've attempted to take pics but she's not happy and i'm not suprised


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## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

septicrazorwire said:


> I know it would be better with a pic but she's bin messed with alot in the last 48 hours, if you think she's bin posted and rehoused, inspected and swabbed and moved around a few times and i've attempted to take pics but she's not happy and i'm not suprised


That's why you should wait to hear the input of a few first. 

I personally cannot see the logic in an ICu for the exact reasons above - you stress them with a rehouse, change in temperature rapidly and then change in humidity too.


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