# Got me some giant waxy monkey frogs p bicolor



## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

I have wanted these for aaaaaaaaages and then when I saw some for sale I got excited and was let down because they were all sold out :censor: and weren't getting anymore anytime soon.

So because these are so rare and sell really quickly... desperate times caused for some desperate measures :whistling2: and lets just say I put a lot of effort into getting them... Anyway... I have had them almost a week I have 2 girls 1 of which is exceptionally HUGE the other isn't far behind and I have 2 boys as well they are a lot smaller. I keep them in an exo terra 90x45x90. They are pretty shy and sleep a lot during the night too. Some nights I don't even think they wake up... It's all down to them settling in I would imagine. I haven't even tried to feed them yet and because they are WC they are all pretty beat up  I am medicating them so fingers crossed they heal and look pretty!
Here they are the 2 girls are in the middle. 










I haven't thought of any names yet! Any suggestions?


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## Basin79 (Apr 1, 2014)

You're probably better blocking off the sides on the exo terra Amd adding a lot more cover inside for them to help them feel a bit more secure. Great frogs.


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## Dark Valentino (Mar 15, 2013)

Awesome, I too have wanted some of these for a long time :mf_dribble:


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## debsandpets (May 26, 2012)

Beautiful froggies.

Eenie, Meenie, Mynie and Moe ??


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

Their tank wasn't finished in the other pic heres an updated one










I got their names too! Because they are giants... Fee, Fi, Fo, Fum haha


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## deadsea60 (Apr 20, 2011)

Although I have never kept them I would still suggest adding more cover etc to make them more secure as was said before, especially as they are WC so probably are very stressed atm.


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## SilverSky (Oct 2, 2010)

your viv is faaaaaaaar too empty for wild caught froggies, they'll be sat their crapping their little pants bless them.


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## Dark Valentino (Mar 15, 2013)

I agree a little bit more cover at the sides would be good, but from what I believe these guys like to bask right out in the open, so the set-up is pretty much spot on.


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## TIMOTHY AND MATILDA (Oct 31, 2008)

wow they are lush

call them steak and kidney and meat and potato :flrt::flrt::flrt:


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

TIMOTHY AND MATILDA said:


> wow they are lush
> 
> call them steak and kidney and meat and potato :flrt::flrt::flrt:


They are so big and heavy you would love them and they really grip hard to perch on to your finger
I already said I named them Fee, Fi, Fo, Fum because they are Giants :flrt:

As for their tank, I'm adding a bit more greenery in the middle and covering the sides more. I also added thinner branches as they like a variety. 
As to crapping their pants comment... these frogs bask out in the open high up in the rainforest canopy they are pretty chill and don't hide away like most other tree frogs. I had a more busy looking tank when I first put them in but I think they felt a bit cramped in it because it was too much and they would just climb the glass all night. Now it's more open they are actually climbing on the things inside the tank instead of the glass.


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## deadsea60 (Apr 20, 2011)

As I said I haven't kept them but I was merely trying to help!


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

Hey there.

Its good to see you got some Giant Waxies!!! 
I got to be honest though, for the sake of the frogs, id put them in something Bigger Vivarium wise.
These frogs need a ALOT! and i mean ALOT of room!. They will just become stressed and damage their nose and other parts of the body if they get active on a night. They have a habit of travelling really long distance in the wild, and if they are wild caught, which i can see they are, i guarantee it wont be long until they get fed up.

These frogs are a pain in the ass, if not kept to the exact requirements they need. They can look in perfect condition one minute, then just die the next, and you just dont know why.
Personally id get something much larger, i can see its too small for them already. For a group of 4 wild caught Giant Waxies, id have them in something upto 5-6 feet high, 4-5 feet wide, 2-3-4 feet deep, with lots and lots of cover!!! You need Hugge leaves as they like to hide away from UV and the other frogs, but also need to be kept warm while in the shade. Its hard to get it just right, and it took me awhile.

Please dont get offended by anything iv said, i just got to be honest about what i see. There hard as hell to get hold of, and if anything happens to them, it will be hard to get anymore, which is why you want to get everything spot on!.
Get them into a greenhouse of some sort, that will do the trick something great for them. 

:2thumb:


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

bobo10 said:


> Hey there.
> 
> Its good to see you got some Giant Waxies!!!
> I got to be honest though, for the sake of the frogs, id put them in something Bigger Vivarium wise.
> ...


I can't really put a big green house in the middle of my apartment... but thanks for the suggestion :whistling2:

The exo terra they are in is the biggest one they make it is 3ft tall by 3ft wide (90x45x90cm) i spent a fortune on the setup... I even private messaged you over a month ago about these guys and u never responded to any of my questions and now you come on here once I already have them... :bash:

I got advice from a breeder of them in the USA probably one of the only known breeders of these frogs and even he said "1-5 adult frogs = 55 gallon (at a minimum) " 
my tank is almost double that 101 gallons. 

They die from injuries getting infected mostly and I am treating them all with the recommended triple antibiotic ointment and they are starting to heal nicely after a week. Also I am treating them for parasites too another reason why they could die suddenly. 

I have not seen them to be any more active than my other frogs to be honest. The frog size to tank size ratio is the same as my 5 whites in a 60x45x60.

I will see how they go I do have a spare 175 gallon reptarium/flexarium for my sugar gliders. They are in a 260 gallon flexarium and use every inch of it running around all night and people keep them in small bird cages! :gasp: so I really don't think a slow moving lazy frog needs as much room.


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## Liam Yule (Feb 16, 2012)

Always wanted these....:mf_dribble:
very nice


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> I can't really put a big green house in the middle of my apartment... but thanks for the suggestion :whistling2:
> 
> The exo terra they are in is the biggest one they make it is 3ft tall by 3ft wide (90x45x90cm) i spent a fortune on the setup... I even private messaged you over a month ago about these guys and u never responded to any of my questions and now you come on here once I already have them... :bash:
> 
> ...


First off i do apologize for not getting back intouch with you.
Im telling you they need a larger space!!! They are wild caught right? Think about it, they have just come from the rainforest and put into a small vivarium..... I cant stress how much room they truely need.
People will tell you anything nowadays just to make a buck or whatever, and i learnt from experience that these frogs need ALOT! of space. 

Im not being disrespectful, but honest for the sake of the frogs. Iv kept loads of these guys, and i learnt the hard way on how to get it right.
The bigger room they have then the better off they will be...

I apologize once again for not getting back intouch.

:2thumb:


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

bobo10 said:


> First off i do apologize for not getting back intouch with you.
> Im telling you they need a larger space!!! They are wild caught right? Think about it, they have just come from the rainforest and put into a small vivarium..... I cant stress how much room they truely need.
> People will tell you anything nowadays just to make a buck or whatever, and i learnt from experience that these frogs need ALOT! of space.
> 
> ...


How long did you have yours for? The breeder didn't make any money of me or anyone by saying they need 55 gallons he posted his own caresheet on another forum as he obviously has alot of experience with them as he is one of the only people to ever breed in captivity. Yes they are WC I didn't get them from that breeder. You can say that about any animal though that's kept in a cage that in the wild they had the whole run of the rainforest or desert or whatever etc etc. I have spoke with someone else who has kept them for a while now in regards to my tank size and they said that it's perfectly fine. Like I said I have a spare 175 gallon flexarium should I have any problems


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> How long did you have yours for? The breeder didn't make any money of me or anyone by saying they need 55 gallons he posted his own caresheet on another forum as he obviously has alot of experience with them as he is one of the only people to ever breed in captivity. Yes they are WC I didn't get them from that breeder. You can say that about any animal though that's kept in a cage that in the wild they had the whole run of the rainforest or desert or whatever etc etc. I have spoke with someone else who has kept them for a while now in regards to my tank size and they said that it's perfectly fine. Like I said I have a spare 175 gallon flexarium should I have any problems


Dont listen to care sheets on these frogs (Bicolors) half of them are bull!!
I know the breeder your talking about in the USA. There is plenty of people that have bred these frogs, just some people dont make such a big deal about it. I have two articles on successful Bicolor breeding projects, which have a care sheet of their own, and their Enclosures are way way bigger than 55gallon! and the articles describe why....
The size vivarium, you keep the 4 in at the moment, is exactly the same size i had a group of mine in. It took just 2 months for problems to start.

They seem lazy through the day, yes... But on a night WC go crazy and just start wandering all over the place, and getting stressed. 
And your right about any animal in a cage etc etc... But these frogs are more stressy than most, trust me iv kept alot of frogs/toads, and these were by far the toughest to keep..

I got to be honest but not many people know anything about Giant Waxie frogs, i know 2 people that actually make sense of what they are talking about. Why do you think people dont keep them as commonly as other frogs? its because they require huuggeee amounts of space, much much larger than a 3ft high vivarium:lol2:.
To answer your question, i kept this species for 6 years, and completely dedicated every bit of my free time towards them.
But like i said, im not being disrespectful, just dont want you to lose them thats all. 

:2thumb:


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## Patto96 (Apr 18, 2013)

Perhaps a well ventilated plastic greenhouse could be used. 
You could either get a really large one.
Or attach multiple small ones together using a glue gun and the cut-out plastic from the sides. 

It may help with giving them more space. Plus you could tier it, so that you can rearrange it around your furniture e.g. around your bookcases.

Wild caught animals of any kind are much more stressful than captive bred counterparts. Captive bred animals have always been within a constraint (vivarium in this case). Wild individuals don't know they are safe from predators, or that there are restrictions. So giving them a large space will help them since they can move around and get away from the 'predators'.

I have not kept Waxes. But I have seen problems regarding size with captive and wild caught clownfish (I know fish, not frogs, but you the same key ideas remain). With wild caught ones never calming down in a 150L and captive bred being fine in the same tank. I had to move the wild caught ones to a 400L for them to calm down.


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

bobo10 said:


> Dont listen to care sheets on these frogs (Bicolors) half of them are bull!!
> I know the breeder your talking about in the USA. There is plenty of people that have bred these frogs, just some people dont make such a big deal about it. I have two articles on successful Bicolor breeding projects, which have a care sheet of their own, and their Enclosures are way way bigger than 55gallon! and the articles describe why....
> The size vivarium, you keep the 4 in at the moment, is exactly the same size i had a group of mine in. It took just 2 months for problems to start.
> 
> ...


6 years? That's funny looking through your old posts you didn't get them until the end of 2012 then you got rid of them all around january of this year so you had them just over 1 year... why would you lie about that? AND you kept them in a 90 gallon until you tried breeding them in that plastic green house... so... not sure how you can say that I'm keeping them in something too small when you kept yours in something even smaller than what I have. 
I've watched them every night for over a week, they are in my living room area. I stay up late to around 3-4am and see what they get up to. 
The females usually wake up first they crawl down to the water dish and soak for an hour or so then they crawl up the glass for a bit and across the floor then they climb the wood and perch in the middle. The boys wake up a bit later and do the same thing, maybe a bit less glass climbing than the girls do. So I have yet to see this display of high level activity that you are talking about... They are all eating...
They all sleep up high on the branches too so I think they have settled in now. Not sure how long they were in captivity for before I got them. Maybe I'll just open up the tank at night I have 9ft ceilings and 800 sq ft of apartment space :2thumb:


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

and on 25th Feb 2011 you said 



bobo10 said:


> well i will be in honest with you, iv never kept frogs at all, but there is something about the giant waxy that i like.
> only problem i have is tank size, they require a huge tank, which i cant fit anywhere haha, so was thinking of putting them in a slightly smaller tank something like 60x60x45, would this be okay for the giant waxys.
> 
> thankyou for your help.


http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...giant-waxy-monkey-tree-frogs.html#post7848887

so if you have kept alot of frogs/toads and 6 years experience with bicolors doesn't really add up with you saying 3 years ago you had never kept any amphibian and hadn't even got the bicolors yet which you claimed to have kept for the last 6 years..:lol2:: victory:


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> and on 25th Feb 2011 you said
> 
> 
> http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...giant-waxy-monkey-tree-frogs.html#post7848887
> ...


Nothing like sounding ever so slighly butt hurt :lol2:
The Bicolor kept in the greenhouse, yes i had that group 1 year, but iv had upto 20 groups of the Giant waxie since the age of 18!!! Im 24 now!
And yes i did keep them in a 90gallon, and them moved them to something bigger, then even bigger again, until i decided the greenhouse was the best option. Iv kept amphibians since being a youngster. Just because i dont date and post every single amphibian on RFUK doesnt mean i havent had or kept them:bash:.

Dont take the advice or help people are trying give you, just do what your doing. But ill warm you once a problem starts thats normally the end. the idea is to not let them get to having problems!. They will infact have problems in that vivarium you keep them in at present.

Good luck :2thumb:


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## ConnorTrussell (Apr 5, 2012)

I think they're extremely cool.

I don't want any or want to be rude but how much did you pay per frog? 
Very interested


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

I paid 80 quid a frog. 





bobo10 said:


> Nothing like sounding ever so slighly butt hurt :lol2:
> The Bicolor kept in the greenhouse, yes i had that group 1 year, but iv had upto 20 groups of the Giant waxie since the age of 18!!! Im 24 now!
> And yes i did keep them in a 90gallon, and them moved them to something bigger, then even bigger again, until i decided the greenhouse was the best option. Iv kept amphibians since being a youngster. Just because i dont date and post every single amphibian on RFUK doesnt mean i havent had or kept them:bash:.
> 
> ...


What are you even talking about I'm not hurt about anything lol... i was just saying its weird how in february 2011 you basically stated that YOU HAVE NEVER KEPT FROGS BEFORE but you wanted some giant waxies and asked what size tank to keep them in. Now your retracting that saying you have all this experience and have kept so many of them and kept all kinds of frogs... :lol2:


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

I'm rather more interested in the frogs than the debate... :whistling2:


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## Meefloaf (Mar 24, 2013)

Lol !


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> I paid 80 quid a frog.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Listen i was only trying to be helpful :lol2: I too made the same mistake with the size vivarium to keep these frogs in. Iv had loads of giant Waxies and it took a awhile until i figured out exactly what is needed to get it right for them. Yes i do have a fair amount of experience with this species, regardless of what it says on my profile. All i was saying was to put them in something bigger IF you dont want issues!!! Only trying to help!
Once an issue starts, then its downhill Quick time!! 

Do what you will though:2thumb:

They are a decent looking group thats for sure.


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

Ron Magpie said:


> I'm rather more interested in the frogs than the debate... :whistling2:


Sorry man haha.
Was just trying to be helpful thats all.


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

I appreciate that but i REALLY wish you had answered my PM before i went and spent almost a grand on this setup! You must understand my frustration! I added a lot more plants and have completely covered the sides and front with black bin bags so they can't see out from anywhere, I even covered the mesh lid with leaves in hopes that helps them feel more secure and they settle. If not the 175 gallon flexarium is the best I can do i think thats 3ftx3ftx4ft and the whites'll get the massive exo terra :lol2:


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> I appreciate that but i REALLY wish you had answered my PM before i went and spent almost a grand on this setup! You must understand my frustration! I added a lot more plants and have completely covered the sides and front with black bin bags so they can't see out from anywhere, I even covered the mesh lid with leaves in hopes that helps them feel more secure and they settle. If not the 175 gallon flexarium is the best I can do i think thats 3ftx3ftx4ft and the whites'll get the massive exo terra :lol2:
> 
> image


I did apologize for that, i just forgot thats all, and im sorry about that, i really am. Do they tend to stay on the ground of the vivarium alot??
If you notice them constantly sitting at the bottom and not at the top, that is a problem straight away. Or you find they are always in the water bowl all day and night. At the moment just keep an eye on them staying on the ground alot, and sitting in the water bowl for large amounts of time, because that can be a sign they are stressed or something is wrong. What have you been treating them with? if you dont mind me asking?.

From what i can see, they dont look like they need much treatment. You have got a healthy group. If they are all eating, and pooing, bathing, climbing to branch to sit under the light etc etc, then dont treat them at all. Alot of the time if they are eating and bathing then they dont usually need treatment.

When i had a group of 10 sent from Germany, i wondered wether to treat them, but was strongly advised not too, as they were all eating like pigs, and were healthy enough to not have problems. But i have infact treated a couple before in the past, and i believe the treatment only made them worse. 

I do like the look of them though, really good group there:2thumb:


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

bobo10 said:


> I did apologize for that, i just forgot thats all, and im sorry about that, i really am. Do they tend to stay on the ground of the vivarium alot??
> If you notice them constantly sitting at the bottom and not at the top, that is a problem straight away. Or you find they are always in the water bowl all day and night. At the moment just keep an eye on them staying on the ground alot, and sitting in the water bowl for large amounts of time, because that can be a sign they are stressed or something is wrong. What have you been treating them with? if you dont mind me asking?.
> 
> From what i can see, they dont look like they need much treatment. You have got a healthy group. If they are all eating, and pooing, bathing, climbing to branch to sit under the light etc etc, then dont treat them at all. Alot of the time if they are eating and bathing then they dont usually need treatment.
> ...


Neosporin triple antibiotic ointment on nose rub and wounds. 
Flagyl for parasites (diluted and the correct amount for its weight put onto the frogs back once a night for 3 nights) 
Both have worked for my other frogs, I got a red eyed tree frog that had runny stools for over 3 months in quarantine, I gave her the flagyl treatment and she has not had a runny stool since! 

One of the males pooed after the 3 day treatment but no one else, it was a healthy looking one. They all sleep high apart from one of the females who has the most wounds (bad nose rub wound, wound on her knee and wound on her lower stomach and also some wounds on her back.) She sometimes sleeps high and sometimes sleeps on the floor. None spend all day and night soaking. Covering the front and sides with bin bags I think helped because they all woke up a lot earlier than when they didn't have that there.


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> Neosporin triple antibiotic ointment on nose rub and wounds.
> Flagyl for parasites (diluted and the correct amount for its weight put onto the frogs back once a night for 3 nights)
> Both have worked for my other frogs, I got a red eyed tree frog that had runny stools for over 3 months in quarantine, I gave her the flagyl treatment and she has not had a runny stool since!
> 
> One of the males pooed after the 3 day treatment but no one else, it was a healthy looking one. They all sleep high apart from one of the females who has the most wounds (bad nose rub wound, wound on her knee and wound on her lower stomach and also some wounds on her back.) She sometimes sleeps high and sometimes sleeps on the floor. None spend all day and night soaking. Covering the front and sides with bin bags I think helped because they all woke up a lot earlier than when they didn't have that there.


Just keep a close eye on them then. 
Id throw in loads of large brown crickets when the lights go off, and watch who decides to eat and who doesnt. It could take a awhile until they are all fully upto health. Have you checked under their feet for Ulcers or bleeding?? They always have a way to cut under their feet, and once that gets infected, they just go downhill.

If you do have 100% females, then it wont be long until the males start to piss them off lol. For some reason the females always get stressed quicker than the males. they sleep longer, eat more. The female should always be higher up than the male too, Females need to get high up, and they just tend to stay their and sleep until its breeding time, or they really need to soak up water. My females used to perch right at the top and they would never move unless a male got a hold of them. 

: victory:


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## micky0 (Jul 25, 2012)

Hi great frogs hope their doing well, didn't you know you have to explain your life history and every tiny detail on here lol, enjoy your guys I love these frogs.


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## andaroo (Nov 14, 2008)

bobo10 said:


> Just keep a close eye on them then.
> Id throw in loads of large brown crickets when the lights go off, and watch who decides to eat and who doesnt. It could take a awhile until they are all fully upto health. Have you checked under their feet for Ulcers or bleeding?? They always have a way to cut under their feet, and once that gets infected, they just go downhill.
> 
> If you do have 100% females, then it wont be long until the males start to piss them off lol. For some reason the females always get stressed quicker than the males. they sleep longer, eat more. The female should always be higher up than the male too, Females need to get high up, and they just tend to stay their and sleep until its breeding time, or they really need to soak up water. My females used to perch right at the top and they would never move unless a male got a hold of them.
> ...


Thanks for the info. The biggest female was pushing on the mesh one night with her hands nose and side of head and she injured herself just as the noserub was starting to heal. So i ordered a replacement screen top and nylon mesh so i can switch the abrasive metal to soft stretchy nylon. While i'm waiting for that to come in I sewed fleece fabric around the outside of the mesh area where they can reach so they can't hurt themselves. So you were right the cage isn't right for them but with my modifications it should be ok now. In the plastic greenhouse how did you get airflow?


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## bobo10 (Sep 10, 2010)

andaroo said:


> Thanks for the info. The biggest female was pushing on the mesh one night with her hands nose and side of head and she injured herself just as the noserub was starting to heal. So i ordered a replacement screen top and nylon mesh so i can switch the abrasive metal to soft stretchy nylon. While i'm waiting for that to come in I sewed fleece fabric around the outside of the mesh area where they can reach so they can't hurt themselves. So you were right the cage isn't right for them but with my modifications it should be ok now. In the plastic greenhouse how did you get airflow?


Hi.

Thats a sign you need a larger vivarium/greenhouse, that should stop the frog rubbing herself.
I cut a hole in the top and basically just taped bug mesh over the hole to create air flow, took about 2 minutes to do.
I just used duck tape to stick the mesh down...Worked a treat.
How are the frogs settling in at the moment???

Tom


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## Patto96 (Apr 18, 2013)

Although not for frogs, I have added a mesh to a green house. I did something similar to bobo, but used cable ties (since the duct tape I used got damp and fell off)

Air flow works well if you have two patches on each side panel (You have 2 sides, a back and a front). Place one lower than the other, e.g. left just above the substrate and right at the top. This means that air rises from the colder floor on the left, through the green house and up to the right, so fresh air is in the whole of the viv and not just the top.


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