# Ball Python Question (Caramel Albino / Normal Albino)



## oakelm (Jan 14, 2009)

Ball Python Genetics this time.

I understand the albino being a simple recessive and I take it the caramel albino is too. So my question is what do you get in the following combos

Albino x Caramel Albino
Het Albino x Caramel Albino
Albino x Het Caramel Albino
Het Albino x Het Caramel Albino

Trying to get my head around this colour as I have seen a pair of het caramel albinos for sale at crystal palace reptiles and like the colour so might get a couple but until I understand it better I am not sure if to go for a visual or a het.

Thanks in advance, again.


----------



## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

would they be compatible? Caramel is a T+ Albino


----------



## Blackecho (Jun 30, 2008)

You would get Normals het in all cases.


----------



## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

thats what I thought. is it possibel to be het for both traits? If not, you would have no idea which normal was het for which albino strain?


----------



## paulh (Sep 19, 2007)

Nobody has tested albino royal pythons for tyrosinase activity. So we don't know whether the albino mutant gene is T-positive or T-negative. But it doesn't matter particularly because a T-negative albino mutant gene may or may not be compatible with a T-positive albino mutant gene. 

I googled around a bit but could not find any mention of anybody crossing an albino and a caramel albino. It would be interesting to do, but don't count on getting anything by normal babies.


----------



## oakelm (Jan 14, 2009)

Still be interesting to do just to prove. Will go on my general to do list as I plan on expanding into albinos this year (was going into pieds but think they are not so pretty once you have seen a few) but saw the caramel albinos and loved them so hopefully I will breed some over the couple of years so will eventually be able to test. By which time someone will have beaten me to it and saved me a job.


----------



## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

i think u will find them to be different morphs and produce hets only.


----------



## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Albino and "Caramel Albino" are two separate traits. Breeding one to the other will produce normals het for both; I suspect a double homozygous Albino/Caramel Albino would be very similar in appearance to a standard Albino simply because Albino seems to break MORE of the pigment process (produces a white and yellow snake) than Caramel Albino does (producing snakes that CAN look nearly-normal).


----------



## Rain (Oct 9, 2007)

Albino is T- caramel is T+, and they are not compatable, so you'd produce double hets for both, I doubt the combo of both would look much different to a normal T- albino, maybe a little dirty if anything. Interesting to put to the test though


Albino x Caramel Albino
= 100% DH Albino/caramel albino

Het Albino x Caramel Albino
= 100% Het Caramel albino 50%het albino

Albino x Het Caramel Albino
= 100% het albino 50% het caramel albino

Het Albino x Het Caramel Albino
= 1/4 DH albino/caramel albino 
1/4 Het Albino
1/4 Het Caramel Albino
1/4 normal
so 50% DH albino/ caramel albino(I believe, someone confirm please?)


----------



## oakelm (Jan 14, 2009)

Its still interesting with both albinos being recessive as to what you would get from the double het caramel albino/albino. Because it either means one of the two is more of a dominant recessive than the other depending on results. Or if you got a dirty wash but still very light albino then it is a gene that can be combined, sort of, might even mean you can vary the pigment levels from the very light to the dark, doubt it but you never know. I doubt any of that makes sense but it does in my head.

Loving all the morphs, been out of ball pythons for a few years and now im back it seems like there are a million morphs with loads of potential. Have loads of bizarre ideas, half of which will be proven to be wrong but what you never try you never know. But give me about ten years to prove any of it.


----------



## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

it is basically the same if the caramel albino was a pied and the albino just being the albino same outcome


----------



## Bexie (Dec 20, 2007)

ralph did a caramel x albino and resulted in 100% slugs i think, i think he also did lav x albino and managed to get some male dbl hets i think.


----------



## paulh (Sep 19, 2007)

Rain said:


> Albino is T- caramel is T+, and they are not compatable, ....


Nobody has tested albino royals for tyrosinase activity, so nobody knows whether albino royals are T- or T+.

What web site has posted results from an albino X caramel mating? I'd like to get the results straight from the horse's mouth without having to do a time-consuming search.


----------



## Rain (Oct 9, 2007)

paulh said:


> Nobody has tested albino royals for tyrosinase activity, so nobody knows whether albino royals are T- or T+.


Ah, I was under the impression that they were T- due to Kevins "complete ball python", but looking on his site he says;


> Albino ball pythons are beautiful snakes that embody the classic traits of tyrosinase-negative
> *Glossary: tyrosinase-negative*
> Close
> 
> A form of albinism caused by the lack of tyrosinase, the amino acid required to produce melanin. Tyrosinase-negative albinos (AKA T-) are often referred to as "amelanistic".


----------

