# Quick question: amelistic/ultra and motley/stripe



## intravenous (Dec 20, 2006)

Are amelistic and ultra different alleles of the same gene? And are motley and stripe different alleles of the same gene?


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## cornmorphs (Jan 28, 2005)

i would usually answer this and then ssisithisco comes on and does it better.. so i'll save my time getting it wrong and let her do it anyway lol


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## intravenous (Dec 20, 2006)

It is a complicated answer? I was looking for a yes or no :razz:.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Yes, Amelanistic and Ultra are both alleles on the same gene locus - individually they're recessive to normal, but when combined they produce Ultramel (intermediate form, true codominance).

Motley and Stripe are also alleles on the same gene locus, but Motley is dominant to Stripe (and not all motley het stripe animals will display the ribbon motley pattern.)


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## intravenous (Dec 20, 2006)

Thank you :smile:.



> Motley and Stripe are also alleles on the same gene locus, but Motley is dominant to Stripe (and not all motley het stripe animals will display the ribbon motley pattern.)


Do you mean that when both are present, even though the motley is dominant, the stripe still affects the appearance? Doesn't that make is slightly co-dominant?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

intravenous said:


> Thank you :smile:.
> 
> Do you mean that when both are present, even though the motley is dominant, the stripe still affects the appearance? Doesn't that make is slightly co-dominant?


Nope - what I'm saying is that a motley het stripe animal WON'T always display the ribbon motley patterning - you can get motley het stripes who you would never in a hundred years guess were carrying the stripe gene, because they're completely typical motleys... and conversely you can get homozygous motleys who look like they SHOULD be carrying stripe but aren't.

Some lines of motley het stripe, however, DO show the ribbon motley pattern more often than not - this is probably largely down to selective breeding on the part of the producers, who may have chosen to match a ribbon motley to a stripe in the first place.


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## intravenous (Dec 20, 2006)

Ssthisto said:


> Nope - what I'm saying is that a motley het stripe animal WON'T always display the ribbon motley patterning - you can get motley het stripes who you would never in a hundred years guess were carrying the stripe gene, because they're completely typical motleys... and conversely you can get homozygous motleys who look like they SHOULD be carrying stripe but aren't.
> 
> Some lines of motley het stripe, however, DO show the ribbon motley pattern more often than not - this is probably largely down to selective breeding on the part of the producers, who chose to match a ribbon motley to a stripe in the first place.


Ah, ok...that does make sense :smile:. Thanks again.


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

I have a motley/stripe who I was planning on breeding to a het stripe. I want to concentrate on the stripe though so should I put the het stripe to a stripe male instead? I dont know the lines of either the motley/stripe or the striped males unfortunately.
Oh lordy i think I have just confused myself. Sorry to hijack the thread just thought Id post as Im in it!


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Layla said:


> I have a motley/stripe who I was planning on breeding to a het stripe. I want to concentrate on the stripe though so should I put the het stripe to a stripe male instead? I dont know the lines of either the motley/stripe or the striped males unfortunately.
> Oh lordy i think I have just confused myself. Sorry to hijack the thread just thought Id post as Im in it!


If you want to produce definite stripes, breed your het stripe to a stripe.

Is your motley/stripe a "ribbon/pinstripe motley" (which could be homozygous motley) or is it a motley het for stripe? 

Since you don't know the lines of the motley, in my breeding group I would assume it could be homozygous motley - in which case breeding it to a het stripe will produce normals or motleys and is unlikely to give me stripes. And since I too want to breed stripes, I'm just going to have to keep the Motley gene out of my group entirely, no matter how nice some of the ribbons look.


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

He was sold to me as a pastel ghost stripe *roll eyes* by the place where I work. Tis what the breeder told him they were so not entirley his fault. I was told later he is a motley/stripe. 









Hope the pic helps. Looks like my snow stripe will get some action next year then lol!


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## cornmorphs (Jan 28, 2005)

looks motley stripe to me too


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

The only thing you can guarantee he is would be "motley" - and that's the pattern I'm referring to as "Ribbon" motley.

He's definitely NOT homozygous stripe - and that particular pattern does NOT necessarily mean he's het stripe


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

Nope Im aware he isnt def a het stripe. I have a female corn from LEXCORN who IS het stripe. Her daddy is a sunglow stripe and boooootiful! Its who Im gonna pair her with next year that is my undecided mind going. Poss the snow stripe now. I can maybe try them with her on different years and see what the outcome is. With both males history's being a mystery Im sure it will be great to see what comes from any breeding. Heck Id be happy with one normal baby they are all achievments!


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## LEXCORN (Feb 9, 2007)

Sorry to go a little 'off topic' here Intravenous............however, I would suggest that you go with the Snow Stripe male Layla.

The Ghost Motley is a fine individual, but, you will not breed Stripe hatchlings from the Amel het. Stripe pairing. Not in the f1 anyway & even if you retain some hatchlings on the 'chance' that they have inherited the Stripe trait from the mother, it's a long distance project which will be made easier by using Sprite.

Of course, IF the Ghost Motley HAS a Stripe parent in his background.......then I shall 'hush my mouth' :|


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

Hiya Al, 
no no I dont want you to hush at all lol, we dont know his parentage as you know, serves me right for getting him from the shop:bash: ! Wont know about him till I 'try him out' with Rusty at some point. Im definately swaying to breeding her with Sprite now though. 

So with Rusty bein a het. stripe I thought there was a chance Id *poss* get a striped baby in her clutch is this right...or have I got my genetic wires crossed again.
Its frustrating me how I cannot grasp the genetics. :-x 

Layla


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Layla said:


> So with Rusty bein a het. stripe I thought there was a chance Id *poss* get a striped baby in her clutch is this right...or have I got my genetic wires crossed again.
> Its frustrating me how I cannot grasp the genetics. :-x
> 
> Layla


If Rusty is het stripe and you breed her to a visual stripe, you're actually expecting to see about 50% stripe offspring.


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

Thats what I originally thought, not confused completely then! phew


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## cornmorphs (Jan 28, 2005)

Ssthisto said:


> Nope - what I'm saying is that a motley het stripe animal WON'T always display the ribbon motley patterning - you can get motley het stripes who you would never in a hundred years guess were carrying the stripe gene, because they're completely typical motleys... and conversely you can get homozygous motleys who look like they SHOULD be carrying stripe but aren't.
> 
> Some lines of motley het stripe, however, DO show the ribbon motley pattern more often than not - this is probably largely down to selective breeding on the part of the producers, who may have chosen to match a ribbon motley to a stripe in the first place.


i have quite a few motleys het stripe and you would never know.


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

why wouldnt you know if you bred them? Inquisitive mind sorry.


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## cornmorphs (Jan 28, 2005)

you [robably would, i just ment to look at you would never know.


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## Layla (Feb 12, 2007)

Ooh sorry blonde moment.


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