# A Dog Walking Question, What Do You Do?



## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

Your in a field with your offlead dog, your dog doesnt have great recall and is very interested in meeting and greeting other dogs.

You see someone enter the park with an onlead Bull Breed, they are sticking to the path that runs along the edge of the field and seem to be walking straight through.

What do you do?

As I am interested in what the normal dog walker would do/think in this situation.


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## Kerriebaby (May 12, 2009)

if your dog doesnt have a good recall, then why is he or she off lead?


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## Crownan (Jan 6, 2007)

I wouldnt be walking a poorly trained dog off the lead...


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## worrep (Jul 14, 2008)

IMO if the dog won't recall it shouldn't be off the lead!


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## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

as above..mine is 'ok' on recall until something better comes along and he is still of the ''i want to say hi to everyone' mode..the only place he is ever let off the lead is on an enclosed football pitch when no-one else is there..on all walks he is on the lead..


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

That would be the obvious one. But unfortunatly allot of people think dog walking means going somewhere and letting your dog offlead wether it has recall or not. 

So just for the purpose of this question can you pretend your dog is offlead and either doesnt have good recall or your just not paying attention to what its doing or who is coming into the field? lol

I'm trying to work out how many of you would allow your dog to approach the onlead Bull Breed.


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## laura88 (Jun 20, 2009)

well what i would do and i have done is use treats while the dog is on the lead i.e call him when he is on his lead then give him a treat he then know's when you call him he gets a nice treat and then try it in your back garden when the dog is off his lead do it also when your telling him to sit at kerb side and then slowly wean him off them so give him a treat every other time and so on and so on you get the idea lol hope this helps


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## Tillies reptile rescue (Aug 22, 2009)

Dont let it off the lead, Monty is pretty good at recall but sometimes his just too interested in whats in the tree etc(have to say his prob only ever done this twice) so he only ever gets let off in enclosed area of woods near us where pretty much no one else goes, miley is fantastic at recall but we still dont let her off unless its somewhere enclosed/ no one else goes........BUT have to say main reason we dont let them off in parks/more public walking areas isnt because of them it is because of how other people are (both our dogs are staffie crosses) around them. :sad:


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## Crownan (Jan 6, 2007)

marthaMoo said:


> That would be the obvious one. But unfortunatly allot of people think dog walking means going somewhere and letting your dog offlead wether it has recall or not.
> 
> So just for the purpose of this question can you pretend your dog is offlead and either doesnt have good recall or your just not paying attention to what its doing or who is coming into the field? lol
> 
> I'm trying to work out how many of you would allow your dog to approach the onlead Bull Breed.



If you havent got it on a lead then I dont think you have the choice of 'allowing' it to approach the other dog. As anything you do or say wont stop it.

So in my view, I would walk briskly in the direction of the dogs and if anything bad started to occur, start running!! :lol2:


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## Kerriebaby (May 12, 2009)

Put it this way, as a dog owner and professional dog walker, im fed up with people who cant/wont keep their dogs under control. 
Whether or not my dog is off lead, shouldnt make an iota of difference as to whether or not other people keep their dogs on leads.
If Im out training/bonding with a/my dogs, then I do not want to be pestered by an over friendly Lab, nor do the dogs im working with appreciate having others dogs noses inserted up their arses when they are trying to concentrate on their lesson


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

I wouldn't have a dog with no recall off lead.

But if I had, I'm presuming I'm a pretty cack owner or short of a few brain cells, in which case I'd no doubt let my dog bound over to the other dog (why does it make any difference what breed it is, the owner is clearly more responsible as it is on lead?), causing potential embarrassment or even damage to the other dog.

Obviously a good owner would have their dog on the lead, if the dog slipped the lead I'd shout over to the other owner and run after the loose dog pronto and get him under control.

Nothing worse than poorly trained dogs being allowed to bound over to other dogs, kids etc.


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## lilworm (Aug 11, 2007)

for me I would not have my dog off lead unless my recall was spot on and even if it was spot on I would still pop my dog on lead and let the person pass through if thats his intention after all we all have the right to be left in peace, my dog may be happy to meet and greet others, but the dog he may be wanting to greet may not be happy to say hello, and the owner not in proper control. I would always put my dogs safety first regardless of what breed they wanted to meet, If i want them to say hi, i approach only when my dog and the other persons dog are calm and start up a convo.

I find nothing worse than when i am out with my 4 on lead and someones dog come tearing right at us, the dogs and me do not always have time to read the other dogs intentions,it can also excite the dogs on lead thus leading to excited confrontations and a possible fight, then you have the owner 12 miles back screeching ITS OKAY HE IS FRIENDLYYYYYYYYY!!!! yeah me may be friendly but theres always that chance he may try his luck and come worse off for it. 
I am fortuante my lot are very tolerant even with those more agressive in their greetings, but i do not expect for a moment they will sit there if a loose dog attempts to have a chew on them. : victory:


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I wouldn't have my dog off the lead if it didn't come when called either, but to answer your question I wouldn't allow my dog to approach any other dog, whether it be a bull breed or a labrador, for the want of a better choice of breed. 

If i _did_ have my dog off the lead and it didn't recall well, I'd be trying my hardest to get it to come back to me as soon as I saw _any _other dog approaching or in the distance, whether it was on the lead or off it regardless of breed.


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## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

I use the approach a dog is on a lead for a reason. This may be a) the dog is dog aggressive b) the dog itself is like mine and does not have recall established c) both of the above d) all of the above *and *the owner, knowing their dog and a mutual respect for others has chosen to put theirs on a lead. 
I would never let me dog near another if the other dog was on a lead - its disrespectful to those who put theirs on a lead, and speaking as someone who keeps her dog on the lead, there is nothing more irritating than spending weeks trying to establish a ''you do not need to sniff other dogs butts/introduce yourself'' mentality whilst on a walk, than have another dog come bounding over and for it all to go T*ts up!!
At the end of the day, if yours doesnt have good recall - chances are the art of distraction wont work too well when faced with a more interesting prospect. So..if all else fails, peg it after your dog and try to get him back as soon as possible...!


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## SilverSteno (Feb 12, 2006)

When my dog had poor recall she was put on the lead regardless of breed unless I knew the owner and dog.


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## dazza197910 (May 18, 2009)

*dog walking just wondering why*

im just wondering why you have used a bull breed as and example of the other dog it doesnt matter what the other dog is does it if your dog doesnt recall then it needs training i have a perfectly trained staffy and he is as gentle as u like i just get fed up with people painting these as dogs u need to avoid


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## Marinam2 (Sep 4, 2007)

Your just courting danger coz your going to end up looking like a gump and your the owner thats stood there shouting and shouting at their dog and its not paying a blind bit of attention the kind of owner that i cannot stand!!!

If your dog doesn't come back when called don't let it off SIMPLES.

My dogs are off lead but we always pay attention to whats going on about us, if anyone appears then they are recalled put on the lead led past person/dog and then allowed off again.

Marina


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## rach666 (Dec 12, 2006)

i have a 10 month old rottie has a great recall and walks to heel off lead,she loves meeting other dogs and other people,but when im on an open feild if i see somebody on that field with a dog on a lead regardless of what breed i would lead my dog again. if i had an agressive dog,or nervous dog or not a very well trained dog i would keep it on a lead so the last thing i would want is a big dopey rotti galloping over, i used to have a little agressive dog only towards other dogs and lots of people used to let there dogs bound over and it really annoyed me as he was on a lead for a reason? 
thats just mt two pence worth!


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## Athravan (Dec 28, 2006)

I recall my dog and put her back on the lead if she's distracted when there is another dog in close proximity often even if they are off the lead and if she didn't recall I wouldn't walk her where other dogs could be found. 

If I imagine this scenario where somehow I was walking a dog off the lead that had bad recall I would have to make every effort to get that dog back if another dog was on the lead and my dog was heading their way. A situation I wouldn't put myself in so it's really hard to imagine what I'd do. I always carry a ball and treats and this helps me recall my dog even if her attention is caught by something else. If I had to chase my dog over a field to stop her getting into trouble then I guess I'd start running!

If I'm out walking my dog on public walking land and I recall her I'm doing it for her safety and my peace of mind, not for the other dogs convenience. I don't want her going up to strange dogs and I don't want the responsibility of allowing her to free roam near dogs that could easily be excessively nervous or aggressive. If another dog comes up to us displaying the right body language then I'm willing to let her greet it and ideally have a play as well but I do think any owner that allows their dog to approach another dog is taking a risk, and it's not a risk that I personally like to take.

People often think this is silly, but ironically although my dog is a german shepherd she has been snapped at by quite a number of smaller dogs who decide to approach us, especially terriers who walk up to her and then snap at her for no reason, and I'd be more wary of a terrier around her than a big dog who seem to accept her size and get over it quick. Some smaller dogs can be quite to take offense at a larger dog for no reason!


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## mrcarlxx (May 1, 2009)

Crownan said:


> I wouldnt be walking a poorly trained dog off the lead...


 
just what i thought, but my dog is a bull breed, and she is alloud off the lead at all times...even when i am walking near roads...i i go to cross the road then she will sit on the kerb untill i say she can cross


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

dazza197910 said:


> im just wondering why you have used a bull breed as and example of the other dog it doesnt matter what the other dog is does it if your dog doesnt recall then it needs training i have a perfectly trained staffy and he is as gentle as u like i just get fed up with people painting these as dogs u need to avoid


If it's a hypothetical question then it doesn't matter what breed the OP has chosen, but maybe it was a particular scenario and the fact that it's a bull breed is relevant???

I'll be interested though to find out why the question is being asked, which I'm sure we all will find out, once the OP has had sufficient answers.


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

I will allow my dogs to play with other dogs on the park in the right circumstances. I don't let them go near another dog which is on the lead. If they did look like they were going to approach a dog on a lead, I would do everything I could to get them back under control. The breed wouldn't influence my decision, although I would be more worried if they went over to a tiny little dog on a lead because I suspect that the owner of the dog might be really worried. If they were to get bitten by a dog on a lead, well I would accept full responsibility. They don't fight and would be highly unlikely to go anywhere near a dog displaying aggressive body language.


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## sophs87 (Jan 25, 2009)

I suppose you would call and call if that didnt work....start running!!
I would like to know why youve used 'bull breed' as an example, ive met far more snappy poodles, small breeds than i have snappy bullys!in fact theyve all been very friendly : victory:


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

marthaMoo said:


> Your in a field with your offlead dog, your dog doesnt have great recall and is very interested in meeting and greeting other dogs.
> 
> You see someone enter the park with an onlead Bull Breed, they are sticking to the path that runs along the edge of the field and seem to be walking straight through.
> 
> ...



if I didn't have 'great recall' my dog would not be offlead.


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## Crownan (Jan 6, 2007)

fenwoman said:


> if I didn't have 'great recall' my dog would not be offlead.


You've emphasised the wrong word :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

I'm asking as I'm the person with the onlead Staffie who trys to get through the field everyday but is constantly being bothered by offlead dogs running up to us. Male, entire, grumpy, snappy offlead dogs whos owners dont seem to be too bothered about there dogs behaviour. A couple of the dogs have then actually got a little grumpy with me when I have put myself between them and Jacob.

My dog has some behavioural issues due to him being handreared and suffering from lack of oxygen to his brain, which basically means he is simple. He also has dysplasia and arthritis in both of his front legs which can and does cause him pain.
Which basically means he doesnt like other dogs coming up to him and bothering him, and he will react if they try bouncing on him. He is happy to say hello, but then thats enough for him and he wants them to go away. 
I keep him onlead at all times when there are other dogs and people around. That is me being a responsable dog owner.

So I was just wondering how many people would actually let there dogs run up to an onlead Bull Breed without finding out if it was ok to do so first.

Because there seems to be hell of allot of people that seem to think its fine around here.


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## luvcats22 (Apr 24, 2009)

this is a problem i and my friend face all the time, she has a gorgeous collie called lily,6 yrs old. well trained. comes back when called etc, however lily is scared of other dogs,she is not agressive when she sees one,she will run back to us and wait to be put on the lead.
the problem we have is other people dont see that we have put lily on a lead,and their dog (regardless of breed) comes bounding over to lily. we shout *can you call your dog back please*
and the usual response is *its ok its friendly*
*yes im sure yours is but ours isnt so please get yours back before ours eats it for lunch*
by this time the unknown dog has approached lily,and she is growling,and snarling. then the owners look at us like we are in the wrong!!! we put our dog on a lead,we do the right thing,and still we end up looking bad.!!!
xx


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

Crownan said:


> You've emphasised the wrong word :Na_Na_Na_Na:


Oh no she didn't. :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

thalie_knights said:


> *I use the approach a dog is on a lead for a reason.* This may be a) the dog is dog aggressive b) the dog itself is like mine and does not have recall established c) both of the above d) all of the above *and *the owner, knowing their dog and a mutual respect for others has chosen to put theirs on a lead.
> I would never let me dog near another if the other dog was on a lead - its disrespectful to those who put theirs on a lead, and speaking as someone who keeps her dog on the lead, there is nothing more irritating than spending weeks trying to establish a ''you do not need to sniff other dogs butts/introduce yourself'' mentality whilst on a walk, than have another dog come bounding over and for it all to go T*ts up!!
> At the end of the day, if yours doesnt have good recall - chances are the art of distraction wont work too well when faced with a more interesting prospect. So..if all else fails, peg it after your dog and try to get him back as soon as possible...!


Well said. An unwritten dog walkers rule .. just a shame more people dont follow it :bash:


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

luvcats22 said:


> this is a problem i and my friend face all the time, she has a gorgeous collie called lily,6 yrs old. well trained. comes back when called etc, however lily is scared of other dogs,she is not agressive when she sees one,she will run back to us and wait to be put on the lead.
> the problem we have is other people dont see that we have put lily on a lead,and their dog (regardless of breed) comes bounding over to lily. we shout *can you call your dog back please*
> and the usual response is *its ok its friendly*
> *yes im sure yours is but ours isnt so please get yours back before ours eats it for lunch*
> ...


Put her in the down position and if need be place your foot on the lead nice and close to her collar (just to give you more control) ... and then shout at the other owners :2thumb:

Actually putting her in a down position generally stops the offending dog in its tracks if its bounding over ... this gives you a few valuable seconds to decide if your going to shout at the owner or stand between you are your dog ready for the 'launch' back to its owner, tail between legs and a nice high pitched yelp :whistling2:


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

My dogs were invade by a little staffy pup the other day. Carrick went over to the owner and peed up her leg :whistling2:


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## butterfingersbimbo (Jan 26, 2008)

At the moment we are training Bean to come back to us when she's off the lead, if she were to run up to a dog on a lead before we could get her to come to us then any harm that she came to would be my responsibility and no-one else's. In the house she comes straight away when we call her but out in the field she doesn't always get it as there are so many things to smell. We never let her get very far away, I'm always carrying treats for her to reward her when she gets it right. 

I can understand where you are coming from, but if I was in your situation I would have to think about walking him where hardly any other dogs go, if possible.


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## Marinam2 (Sep 4, 2007)

Shout very loudly at the owner that your dog has a very contagious disease!!
You wont gain any friends but it might make then think twice.
Marina


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## deerhound (Jul 19, 2009)

My dog is always on the lead unless we are in a quiet field. I always get little dogs running up to him even though he must seam like a giant to the little snappers looking up to him. This has made him think now that all dogs are going to snap at him and the owners find it hillarious that thier dog is trying to attack such a big dog. :devil: More annoying than that on a walk tho are people ! . Hearing things like "why dont you sadlle him" and "I wouldnt like to feed him" really does my head in now. Worse still are the stares and points like you are invisable. Mostly i avoid anywhere which is populated and go for runs in the fields and mountains. Street walks are mainly done late at night.


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## thalie_knights (Jan 19, 2007)

lol i had to use the 'launch' back technique a couple of weeks ago..walking on lead,minding our own business..my dog has his head merrily burrowed in a bush - and there is a couple walking towards us with one dog on lead, and another whippet cross off lead..all seems fine until our paths cross (by saying cross - there is still a 10metre parallel distance between us)..before I have time to blink, the whippet cross has come pounding up to mine (whos head is still in the bush!), teeth blaring, heckles up and launches itself at his upper body..Luckily, id twigged that my dog had no idea what was going on and i was able to step in, give it a firm boot up the a*se, to which it retreated..the owner came up to me with the usual ''did you just touch me dog'' attitude to which i replied ''absolutely. Some of us have the decency to put our dogs on the leads to specifically _avoid _confrontational dogs such as yours...if you choose not to put yours on the lead next time, ill boot it twice as hard if it comes near mine again.''...

I saw the couple walking last week..both dogs were on the lead..:whistling2:

My worst nightmare would be for my dog to become one of those with the mentality ''ill attack before i get attacked''..he is (fortunately) still of the ''hello everyone is my friend'' attitude, and I intend to keep it that way for as much as is in my power to do so.

*rant over*:lol2:


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## butterfingersbimbo (Jan 26, 2008)

Bean's like that, she's very submissive, bless her she's only tiny. If she was snappy I doubt I'd ever let her off. I remember now that when we had Boogie, other dogs would come up and have a go at him because he was a big lad.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Crownan said:


> You've emphasised the wrong word :Na_Na_Na_Na:



er actually, no I didn't. The emphasis was on the word 'be'.
You seem to be under the misapprehension that everyone talks the same as you do.


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

A few years ago I was out with my standard poodle. She believed herself to be VERY important. She was mincing along slightly ahead of me like the queen of sheba, when all of a sudden she nearly shot out of her skin when a couple of wolfhounds came round a blind bend in the path. I've never seen a dog trying to look invisible before - she slunk past them and her little bubble was completely burst bless her :lol2:

I have to say I like it when my dogs meet their pals in the park. I am always happy for other dogs to come over and say hi to mine although I have been in the other position when I had George - he wouldn't tollerate other dogs sniffing him. He was always on the lead. I suppose I had a duty to muzzle him really, although I never did.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

marthaMoo said:


> I'm asking as I'm the person with the onlead Staffie who trys to get through the field everyday but is constantly being bothered by offlead dogs running up to us. Male, entire, grumpy, snappy offlead dogs whos owners dont seem to be too bothered about there dogs behaviour. A couple of the dogs have then actually got a little grumpy with me when I have put myself between them and Jacob.
> 
> My dog has some behavioural issues due to him being handreared and suffering from lack of oxygen to his brain, which basically means he is simple. He also has dysplasia and arthritis in both of his front legs which can and does cause him pain.
> Which basically means he doesnt like other dogs coming up to him and bothering him, and he will react if they try bouncing on him. He is happy to say hello, but then thats enough for him and he wants them to go away.
> ...


 Carry one of those ultrasonic dog repeller things or a hand held citronella spray such as postmen carry. Call out one warning to the owner then let the loose dog have it.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> Put her in the down position and if need be place your foot on the lead nice and close to her collar (just to give you more control) ... and then shout at the other owners :2thumb:
> 
> Actually putting her in a down position generally stops the offending dog in its tracks if its bounding over ... this gives you a few valuable seconds to decide if your going to shout at the owner or stand between you are your dog ready for the 'launch' back to its owner, tail between legs and a nice high pitched yelp :whistling2:



There is no way I would put an already scared dog into the 'down' position in front of a strange dog.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

thalie_knights said:


> lol i had to use the 'launch' back technique a couple of weeks ago..walking on lead,minding our own business..my dog has his head merrily burrowed in a bush - and there is a couple walking towards us with one dog on lead, and another whippet cross off lead..all seems fine until our paths cross (by saying cross - there is still a 10metre parallel distance between us)..before I have time to blink, the whippet cross has come pounding up to mine (whos head is still in the bush!), teeth blaring, heckles up and launches itself at his upper body..Luckily, id twigged that my dog had no idea what was going on and i was able to step in, give it a firm boot up the a*se, to which it retreated..the owner came up to me with the usual ''did you just touch me dog'' attitude to which i replied ''absolutely. Some of us have the decency to put our dogs on the leads to specifically _avoid _confrontational dogs such as yours...if you choose not to put yours on the lead next time, ill boot it twice as hard if it comes near mine again.''...
> 
> I saw the couple walking last week..both dogs were on the lead..:whistling2:
> 
> ...


Pst!! It's 'hackles'. Hackles are the longer hairs on the back of the neck. Heckling/to heckle means to shout out derogatory remarks to someone who is speaking.So a heckler, heckles a speaker.The speaker might then get his hackles up.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> Put her in the down position and if need be place your foot on the lead nice and close to her collar (just to give you more control) ... and then shout at the other owners :2thumb:
> 
> Actually putting her in a down position generally stops the offending dog in its tracks if its bounding over ... this gives you a few valuable seconds to decide if your going to shout at the owner or stand between you are your dog ready for the 'launch' back to its owner, tail between legs and a nice high pitched yelp :whistling2:


 Hmmm what a nice lot of dog lovers we have on here telling people that they kick, hurt and possibly injure other people's dogs. It isn't the dog's fault it's owned by a moron. It is actually illegal to kick any animal and should internel or other injuries be caused by the kicking, you would rightly be prosecuted and be liable for vet bills. Then of course if one of my little dogs accidentally slipped it's lead and lost it's memory or been scared by something and gone running to the first human it sees , thinking that all humans are good and will help them, then get kicked instead of helped, the owner might be someone like me who would likely go completely and unreasonably crazy and end up giving you the kicking.
So be very careful about kicking other people's dogs.You might just kick the person who has serious aggression issues and gets the 'red mist' as I do when my animals are harmed.


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

fenwoman said:


> There is no way I would put an already scared dog into the 'down' position in front of a strange dog.


I thought the same thing.


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

My dogs all have an excellent recall, but I still always put them back on a lead if I see an on lead dog approaching, because at the end of the day, they are dogs, and whilst they have always come back to date, you can pretty much guarantee the first time they don't would be when they really needed to. We have security dogs here 9army amp) and they are not at all good with other dogs, so it is only good manners and common sense to make absolute certain that my dog can not approach them.


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## Ruthy (Dec 10, 2007)

mrcarlxx said:


> just what i thought, but my dog is a bull breed, and she is alloud off the lead at all times...even when i am walking near roads...i i go to cross the road then she will sit on the kerb untill i say she can cross


Even if your dog has a great recall and is very obedient, why oh why do you still walk her near roads without a lead?
Personall i think its very irresponsible (sp?), even if your dog is obedient, on the off chance it sees something it wants, and i mean really wants, then you have no way of stopping it if it even if it is well trained.

Back to the subject though, i have three dogs, 2 of which arent very good with strange dogs, and one of which has absolutely no recall obedience even though we have tried and tried. The one who doesnt do recall and is aggressive with strange dogs is kept on a lead at all times, he doesnt even get the chance, the other two are let off in area's where there are no other dogs, and if another dog is seen then then they are put on the lead just as a precaution. I am forever berrating people for letting their dogs run up to mine, and then they wonder why their dogs get snapped at by my older lab!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

marthaMoo said:


> I'm asking as I'm the person with the onlead Staffie who trys to get through the field everyday but is constantly being bothered by offlead dogs running up to us. Male, entire, grumpy, snappy offlead dogs whos owners dont seem to be too bothered about there dogs behaviour. A couple of the dogs have then actually got a little grumpy with me when I have put myself between them and Jacob.


Having 'spoken' to you on other threads, I kind of guessed that was the scenario and I know exactly how you feel.

When we had the GSDs we only let them off their leads when there was no-one about. If anyone appeared, they were called back and put on leads as a courtesy to the other owners. And it really p*ssed me off how many other owners didn't make any attempt to call their dog back and shouted stuff like "it's OK he won't touch your dogs, he's very friendly"! I used to say to my husband "how do they know our dogs won't attack theirs" - they didn't and that was the point!! 

Why are people so indulgent with their animals that they think because they love them and pander to them, that everyone else should too!!!


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

butterfingersbimbo said:


> I can understand where you are coming from, but if I was in your situation I would have to think about walking him where hardly any other dogs go, if possible.


I do, I live in a small seaside town. The beach is one side of me and the countryside the other. But I have to go through this field to get to the lanes.

Funny thing is this field is owned by the church and it has two signs up clearly stating that all dogs should be kept onlead and on the path. I'm the only one doing that...lol



fenwoman said:


> Carry one of those ultrasonic dog repeller things or a hand held citronella spray such as postmen carry. Call out one warning to the owner then let the loose dog have it.


Thank you! I will definatly have a look at them.

We are planning on moving in the next year and I am seriously considering buying some cheap woodland so that my dogs and I can have nice stress free walks without other dogs about. Then all I have to worry about is the badgers..lol


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## stephenie191 (May 29, 2007)

I've had many off lead dogs come up to mine to have a go at them

I just kick them, i'm sorry but if they can't keep control of them, they shouldn't be of the lead, - SIMPLE!

I had to kick the :censor: out of a staffy the other week, it was biting the hell out of this girls jack russel.

Got it off within 5 seconds, lucky i was there really. She was only 14 and the staffy owner was a right wierdo, we need dog wardens like they use to have years ago :bash:


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## butterfingersbimbo (Jan 26, 2008)

I'm glad you didn't take it the wrong way : victory: I wouldn't blame you buying a bit of woodland if you are able to, then at least you will have stress free dog walks. I'd never have a dog off lead without permission.


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## Athravan (Dec 28, 2006)

marthaMoo said:


> Funny thing is this field is owned by the church and it has two signs up clearly stating that all dogs should be kept onlead and on the path. I'm the only one doing that...lol


Can you contact the owner or council / property agent that owns the land and put the signs up?

I do think dog owners should be respectful of signs - if parents see a sign about dogs being kept on a lead they may think their children are safe to play and not expect dogs bounding up, and the same for other dog owners so it really annoys me when people disrespect signs and just ignore them.


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

fenwoman said:


> There is no way I would put an already scared dog into the 'down' position in front of a strange dog.


You wouldnt put a frightened dog into a submissive position so it shows it isnt any threat to the oncoming dog? I find that most bizarre and a little irresponsible to be honest. What would you do with the dog on the other end of your lead if it was jumping all over the place, scared, trying to escape? Having a dog acting like that is putting it and the owner in danger and its more likely to panic and easily mistake a caring owner trying to comfort it with a dog trying to bite it .. an accident waiting to happen do you not think?



fenwoman said:


> *Hmmm what a nice lot of dog lovers we have on here telling people that they kick, hurt and possibly injure other people's dogs.* It isn't the dog's fault it's owned by a moron. It is actually illegal to kick any animal and should internel or other injuries be caused by the kicking, you would rightly be prosecuted and be liable for vet bills. Then of course if one of my little dogs accidentally slipped it's lead and *lost it's memory or been scared by something and gone running to the first human it sees , thinking that all humans are good and will help them, then get kicked instead of helped*, the owner might be someone like me who would likely go completely and unreasonably crazy and end up giving you the kicking.
> So be very careful about kicking other people's dogs.You might just kick the person who has serious aggression issues and gets the 'red mist' as I do when my animals are harmed.


This isnt what the OP is on about. IMO if an agressive dog is coming your way im going to be inbetween my dog and that dog .. and im certainly not going to put my hand out and wave 'shoo' ... I would do whatever it takes to keep my dog (which is on the lead) out of the way.

If a small dog came running over obviously looking scared because its slipped its lead because the owner cant put it on properly then clearly thats different and you wouldnt be trying to defend your dog!


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## Tillies reptile rescue (Aug 22, 2009)

We was recently walking monty and miley through woods and they was both off lead and we saw someone coming up with 2 small shitzus so we put both of them on leads and walked off into the woods away from the shitzus, my OH was walking ahead with monty and I was walking with miley when all of a sudden one of the shitzus comes flying through the trees at miley, no owner in site, then the other one come flying at miley into her (we think she may have been nipped as she let out the most god awful scream as he hit her side), the 2 children (yes children) came strolling through to get the shitzus whilst their mum just stood on the path (not wanting to get her shoes muddy), my other half and monty came running back through the woods asking what the hell had gone on and monty instantly shot over to see if miley was ok, to which point as soon as mum saw monty (staffy x bullmastiff) she run through the woods grabbed her dogs and said "ooo sorry about that he can be abit nippy" and walked off with them(didnt even ask if miley was ok)
We stood in shock that this woman had let her 2 young daughters come over to what could have errupted into a dog fight, and that she was walking a dog that she knew was "nippy" off the lead. :censor::censor::censor::censor: to say i was peed off was a understatement but more upsetting miley is now sh&t scarred of all other dogs, all because this bloody woman felt it was fine to walk her dogs off leads when they are known to be nippy and she couldnt recall. 
Anyway my point is after this huge long rant is that we had the common sense that as soon as we saw other people around we put our two on leads, WHY cant other people do it !!! esp if like this women your dogs had no recall sense what so ever **RANT OVER**


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

stephenie191 said:


> I've had many off lead dogs come up to mine to have a go at them
> 
> I just kick them, i'm sorry but if they can't keep control of them, they shouldn't be of the lead, - SIMPLE!
> 
> ...


Kicking the staff could have wound it up more as the pain would cause adrenalin to flow meaning it got even more fired up. It could easily have resulted in a dead dog or even the staff turning on you. There are dog wardens like there were years ago. Phone the council and ask to speak to him.
Hopefully the girl with the jack russell has asked the staffy owner to pay al the vet bills which occurred.
If an off lead dog is owned by a moron, why should it be the one to suffer by another moron kicking it?


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

My vet told me years ago that if you kick a dog hard enough in the right place on it's left side you can kill it. I wouldn't want to do that to any dog - their owner, yes, but not the dog!


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## Berber King (Dec 29, 2007)

I certainly see your point,and obviously as a dog lover myself,i wouldnt dream of hurting an animal,BUT-if a large aggressive dog was really tearing into my defenceless puppy,i would certainly use any force neccesary to protect him,without a shadow of doubt.


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## animal addict (Jun 1, 2008)

Ruthy said:


> E I am forever berrating people for letting their dogs run up to mine, and then they wonder why their dogs get snapped at by my older lab!


:no1: thank god I'm not the only one!! It absolutely does my head in when people allow their off lead dogs to go upto ones on leads - my dog HATES every other dog on sight - I do muzzle her when dogs come up to us as I know what coming but she goes into panic mode - she goes into panic mode both ways actually - biting and snapping and snarling if not muzzled and cowering on the floor, whining if muzzled and wont move - many a time I have had to shout at people esp if they can see me starting to muzzle her - like call your bloody dogs back??? I wouldnt kick a dog though - I have been caught out on times without my muzzle if I have whipped her round the block late at night and have ended up picking my dog up whilst shes snarling and me being attacked by the other dog and my dog is blinking heavy for me to be trying to lug her over my shoulder lol


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

feorag said:


> My vet told me years ago that if you kick a dog hard enough in the right place on it's left side you can kill it. *I wouldn't want to do that to any dog - their owner, yes, but not the dog*!


This is something we definitley agree on. I would hate to be put in that position (although it has happened but without the 'kick') but if its there dog or mine its going to be there dog im afraid.

I could put my collie in the down position ANYWHERE in the park by voice and hand signal and i always say its one of THE BEST things you can EVER teach a dog IMO

To the poster who said about great dog/ perfect recall ... off lead even on the roadside ... Sorry but my collie competed in trials, agility, obedience and flyball and i would never walk her next to any road without her having a lead on.


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> You wouldnt put a frightened dog into a submissive position so it shows it isnt any threat to the oncoming dog? I find that most bizarre and a little irresponsible to be honest.


 I would never force an already insecure and submissive dog to adopt a sumissive position in front of a strange dog. That will only make the feelings of fear worse. Please don't call me irresponsible. As the owner of 25 dogs, the last thing I am is irresponsible. I do actually know a little about dog behaviour and training.



> What would you do with the dog on the other end of your lead if it was jumping all over the place, scared, trying to escape?


If the dog was so terrified, I would not even be walking it in a public place until I had some kind of control over it and the dog had learned that as I am the boss, I am to be trusted to protect it no matter what.



> Having a dog acting like that is putting it and the owner in danger and its more likely to panic and easily mistake a caring owner trying to comfort it with a dog trying to bite it .. an accident waiting to happen do you not think?


 PLease don't try to teach me to suck eggs. Why do you assume that I know nothing and would try to 'comfort' a scared dog? Read some of my previous posts on dogs.



> This isnt what the OP is on about. IMO if an agressive dog is coming your way im going to be inbetween my dog and that dog .. and im certainly not going to put my hand out and wave 'shoo' ... I would do whatever it takes to keep my dog (which is on the lead) out of the way.


 The OP never mentioned an aggressive dog being off lead. In fact she clarifies that her own dog is on lead and the usual playful, over friendly off lead dogs cause a nuisance by bounding over to her and her leashed dog.
I have had exactly the same problem myself in the past when walking half a dozen or so of my lot along the riverbank. Upon spotting another dog, all of mine get called back and are put onto leads. One time, the 3 uncontrollable loose dogs belonging to a local chap came running up to mine as he leapt about and screamed for them to come back. All my dogs stood still calmly as I yelled him to get his bloody dogs back. He yelled the usual "it's ok, they are perfectly friendly" to which I replied "so was the last one my big dog killed". Ursa is a 65kg rottie X Newfoundland and hasn't a bad bone in his body but he wasn't to know that. It caused me to giggle for days afterwards as I remembered the horror and panic on his face as he ran faster than he'd run in the last 40 years, to dive on the nearest dog and clip the lead on, and watched the other 2 gallop off across the field into the distance when they saw him do so.I heard through the grapevine that it took the loose dogs 2 days to find their way home.



> If a small dog came running over obviously looking scared because its slipped its lead because the owner cant put it on properly then clearly thats different and you wouldnt be trying to defend your dog!


What difference would it make what size the loose dog was? While you are trying to control your terror stricken dog, how would you be able to tell at a glance that the loose dog was aggressive, scared or just wanting to be with a human?


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> if its there dog or mine its going to be there dog im afraid.


I'm sorry, but IMO, this is an awful attitude to have. :bash:


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

Berber King said:


> I certainly see your point,and obviously as a dog lover myself,i wouldnt dream of hurting an animal,BUT-if a large aggressive dog was really tearing into my defenceless puppy,i would certainly use any force neccesary to protect him,without a shadow of doubt.


 And the worst thing you could possibly do is inflict pain on a dog already fired up. It releases adrenalin and fires it up more, possibly turning on you.
If a large and aggressive dog is loose, don't walk your puppy in the vicinity and call the dog warden.


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## animal addict (Jun 1, 2008)

fenwoman said:


> One time, the 3 uncontrollable loose dogs belonging to a local chap came running up to mine as he leapt about and screamed for them to come back. All my dogs stood still calmly as I yelled him to get his bloody dogs back. He yelled the usual "it's ok, they are perfectly friendly" to which I replied "so was the last one my big dog killed".


ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That would have amused me for a few days too!!!


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> You wouldnt put a frightened dog into a submissive position so it shows it isnt any threat to the oncoming dog?


A few years ago I was out with my collie, he was about 6 months old. I was just putting him back on his lead to leave the park when a bloody huge Neopolitan Mastiff came lumbering across towards us. There was no hesitation in its stride, it was an adult male which wasn't giving off good signals. I put my dog behind me and used my other hand to shoo (yep - who shoos a mastiff :bash. It didnt have any effect and it dived on my pup and got his whole back end in its mouth. It wasn't looking for submissive signals or messing around. I grabbed its collar, pulled it off and held it at arms length. It hadn't taken the bite home - probably because half its dewlap was in its mouth. The brain dead owner came over, apologised and then grabbed the dog by the tail and dragged it away effin and jeffin at it. I let it lie at that point but as he walked away, and had the dog by the collar, he let go thinking it would follow him - it didn't, it came back for another go. I grabbed its collar again and held it away from my dog who was still beind me. At this point I told the owner what a prat he was - he ended up threatening to stab me and id degenerated into an argument. I can't imagine how the scenario might have turned out if I had kicked is dog. The dog might have attacked me or he might have stabbed me. As it was, apart from a few choice words there was no real harm done. The guy was a moron and the dog - well I'm not sure - if it had really wanted to attack there's no way I could have held it off. My main concern was controlling the other dog, not messing around worrying what position my pup was in.


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## daikenkai (May 24, 2007)

Recently a little boy let his staffie go to attack my cousins staffie. It attacked her, attacked her pregnant daughter then latched onto her dog. In the all the panic my cousin grabbed the offending dogs collar and tried to pull it off. She actually choked it to death. I dont think for one second she was in the wrong. Her and her daughter both needed hospital treatment and her dog needed vet treatment and had a badly broken leg. 
When it comes down to it, it might not be the dogs fault that its attacking but you do what you need to do to protect your own dog and family.


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## Evie (Jan 28, 2008)

daikenkai said:


> Recently a little boy let his staffie go to attack my cousins staffie. It attacked her, attacked her pregnant daughter then latched onto her dog. In the all the panic my cousin grabbed the offending dogs collar and tried to pull it off. She actually choked it to death. I dont think for one second she was in the wrong. Her and her daughter both needed hospital treatment and her dog needed vet treatment and had a badly broken leg.
> When it comes down to it, it might not be the dogs fault that its attacking but you do what you need to do to protect your own dog and family.


 That must have been awful!
I don't think anyone can judge a person for reacting in a scary and dangerous situation. This scenario is completely different than simply kicking a dog for coming too close.


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## daikenkai (May 24, 2007)

Oh yes but if someone thinks theres a danger in that dog getting too close they may react in a defensive manner. 
I for one never felt the need to kick any of the MANY dogs that people used to let run at my Great Dane. Id just warn them that he was NOT friendly and if they didnt try and get their dog back there wasnt a huge amount i could do except try and restrain Blue.


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## animal addict (Jun 1, 2008)

oh thats so sad Daikenkai - I dont think anyon should judge circumstances like that - theres no malice there just a very unfortunate ending for all concerned for some persons stupidity (owner of the aggressive dog) :-(


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## butterfingersbimbo (Jan 26, 2008)

That's something else I hate, kids walking dogs!!!! :censor:


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## daikenkai (May 24, 2007)

The childs father actually came running over afterwards, grabbed the dog and left. So maybe its not dead, no-ones quite sure at the moment. 
Sad thing is this guy has a rottie pup now too, guess how thatll turn out.


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## SpiderGirl33 (Sep 2, 2007)

butterfingersbimbo said:


> That's something else I hate, kids walking dogs!!!! :censor:


 I know a hell of a lot of adults that shouldnt be walking dogs, its not about age yanno


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## daikenkai (May 24, 2007)

i see little girls, maybe about 7 or 8 walking BIG male staffies around here all the time. It makes you very uneasy as unfortunately a lot of staffies around here are very aggressive with other dogs. 
Saying that my mum once had to stop 2 Labradors attacking a staffie. The staffie was being walked by a teenage girl and was a show dog, was on the lead and didnt even look at the other dogs, the labs were being walked by some stuck up old bint who just grabbed the dogs and scarpered leaving the girl in tears and the staffie with one ear. 
Its bloody awful here for loose aggressive dogs.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

One of my Dogs hates other Dogs, he's ok with Lurchers & Greyhounds (he's a Greyhound & due to the fact that they know no other Dogs but Greyhounds some do have issues with other breeds. Most are ok though). He is kept on the lead at all times, i used to muzzle him too but not now. If an off lead Dog comes up to him (bare in mind that he is usually leaping about being an absolute prat growling & barking which should give the other owner an idea that he doesn't like their Dog) i do everything in my power to keep him away from it. If the off lead Dog gets bitten then in the eyes of the Law the owner of that Dog is in the wrong as they didn't have proper control of their Dog. My Dog is on a lead so therefore under control, even if he is leaping about :2thumb::2thumb::2thumb:.


Also to the person who has their Dog off the lead when on a main road. This is an offence & you can be prosecuted for it. Dogs must be on a lead at all times near busy main roads.


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

butterfingersbimbo said:


> That's something else I hate, kids walking dogs!!!! :censor:


I think this is unfair. I can understand little kids but mature kids who know how to properly control the dog and know their responsibilities I see as fine. What does annoy me is when adults leave young (as in, 6-9 year olds) kids outside a shop by a main road with an aggressive Rottweiler/Doberman/Labrador/Retriever/Staffordshire bull terrier etc that could easily have the kids over and in the road within seconds should another dog walk along. :bash:

I see far more adults walking dogs that shouldn't then I do kids, and I live in a very dog-busy area with walking fields and woods 150yds from our doorstep!


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

Just out of interest, if a dog was attacking you or your dog (or both), no owner in sight, and you couldn't get away - what would you do?

Seems to be a lot of comments about what folks wouldn't do, and no decent advice as to what you SHOULD do.

I'm half with the kickers I'm afraid. In more of a shove kind of way. Rather a jeaned leg or booted foot got bit than try to bend down and seperate and lose half your face.


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## butterfingersbimbo (Jan 26, 2008)

SpiderGirl33 said:


> I know a hell of a lot of adults that shouldnt be walking dogs, its not about age yanno


I'm not talking about teenagers I'm talking about young kids!



daikenkai said:


> *i see little girls, maybe about 7 or 8 walking BIG male staffies around here all the time. It makes you very uneasy as unfortunately a lot of staffies around here are very aggressive with other dogs. *
> Saying that my mum once had to stop 2 Labradors attacking a staffie. The staffie was being walked by a teenage girl and was a show dog, was on the lead and didnt even look at the other dogs, the labs were being walked by some stuck up old bint who just grabbed the dogs and scarpered leaving the girl in tears and the staffie with one ear.
> Its bloody awful here for loose aggressive dogs.


That's what I mean! some dog owners round here let their kids walk their dogs without going with them, i think it's very irresponsible, how's the kid supposed to deal with another dog if it's aggressive? Who picks up the poo?


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## daikenkai (May 24, 2007)

I started walking my first dog when i was 13 and she was a German Shepherd. I was 17 when i got Blue. So i dont have anything against teenagers walking dogs at all but children shouldnt be walking ANY breed of dog.


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

daikenkai said:


> I started walking my first dog when i was 13 and she was a German Shepherd. I was 17 when i got Blue. So i dont have anything against teenagers walking dogs at all but children shouldnt be walking ANY breed of dog.


:no1:


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

fenwoman said:


> I would never force an already insecure and submissive dog to adopt a sumissive position in front of a strange dog. That will only make the feelings of fear worse. Please don't call me irresponsible. As the owner of 25 dogs, the last thing I am is irresponsible. I do actually know a little about dog behaviour and training.
> 
> 
> If the dog was so terrified, I would not even be walking it in a public place until I had some kind of control over it and the dog had learned that as I am the boss, I am to be trusted to protect it no matter what.
> ...


You can pick my post apart as much as you want. The fact remains your really not the be all and end all regardless of how many dogs you have had. This is a forum after all and its all about discussion.



LoveForLizards said:


> I'm sorry, but IMO, this is an awful attitude to have. :bash:


I feel sorry for your dog. If its own owner cant stick up for it then i find that very sad ... very sad indeed.


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

you shouldnt have your dog off lead if it has bad re-call.
secondly i think the use of 'bull breed' is very negative, ANY breed can be nasty and attack. 
My dog will try to go see other dogs, but if i tell her LEAVE she will stop immediately. 
when she was a pup she was attacked (on her lead)(will not say by which breed as its pointless to me) the owner s-l-o-w-l-y came across the field
calling her dog very gently :whip: all the time its virtually mauling my puppy. i also had a baby in buggy with me!. 
the t*at eventually got to her dog, called it off, but didnt put it on its lead!!!! so a minute later it came running back and started again, by this point i told her she was a f*cking idiot, amongst other things. and she was the type of owner that gives this breed a bad name. 
its not the breed if dog, my dogs a bull breed and she is good as gold, its the stupid :censor: owners


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## Kerriebaby (May 12, 2009)

FWIW

Mine are all trained to "down" as soon as another dog appears on the scene, if the other owner gives permission for play, and I am sure that the dog is a suitable play mate, then I give the release cue. However if for whatever reason ( be it, unsuitable playmates, we are training etc ) then they will all remain in the down, and mostly focussed on me, not the other dogs. I try to ensure that I always have a spare lead with me, so that if another (unwanted/out of control dog) approaches, I can capture said dog and return to owner.

I am also aware that some dogs can approach mine aggressively, in that case, (through training) they are trained to come and stand behind me, and stay behind me, whilst i deal with the situation. If said dog is being dangerously aggressive, and I am in fear for my dogs or for myself, I will not hesitate to protect my dogs or myself and will give that dog a boot up the butt. I have three very sociable, friendly dogs, and I will not have our years of training flushed down the bog, because there are morons in the world who cant or wont control their animals. If need be, I will also report any aggression to the dog warden ( as I have done this morning )


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

LisaLQ said:


> Just out of interest, if a dog was attacking you or your dog (or both), no owner in sight, and you couldn't get away - what would you do?
> 
> Seems to be a lot of comments about what folks wouldn't do, and no decent advice as to what you SHOULD do.
> 
> I'm half with the kickers I'm afraid. In more of a shove kind of way. Rather a jeaned leg or booted foot got bit than try to bend down and seperate and lose half your face.



That did happen to Jacob and I the other week.

There is a terrier x whippet that is a total nightmare, he has no manners around other dogs or people. He constantly bothers other dogs even when they tell him off and will quite happily jump all over you.

He was offlead with no owner in sight and came running up to us, due to Jacobs reaction towards him he got very funny and started to growl and snap, I put myself in between them and he was still having a go at me, with that I shouted at him and stuck my foot out to keep him back, I did make contact, but I didnt kick him. I think he knew I wasnt going to back down and he ran off.

But I would do whatever it takes to protect my dogs.


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

Kerriebaby said:


> FWIW
> 
> Mine are all trained to "down" as soon as another dog appears on the scene, if the other owner gives permission for play, and I am sure that the dog is a suitable play mate, then I give the release cue. However if for whatever reason ( be it, unsuitable playmates, we are training etc ) then they will all remain in the down, and mostly focussed on me, not the other dogs. I try to ensure that I always have a spare lead with me, so that if another (unwanted/out of control dog) approaches, I can capture said dog and return to owner.
> 
> I am also aware that some dogs can approach mine aggressively, in that case, (through training) they are trained to come and stand behind me, and stay behind me, whilst i deal with the situation. If said dog is being dangerously aggressive, and I am in fear for my dogs or for myself, I will not hesitate to protect my dogs or myself and will give that dog a boot up the butt. I have three very sociable, friendly dogs, and I will not have our years of training flushed down the bog, because there are morons in the world who cant or wont control their animals. If need be, I will also report any aggression to the dog warden ( as I have done this morning )


:no1::flrt: Totally agree :notworthy:


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## lizardloverrach (Dec 1, 2008)

i agree i would do whatever it takes to protect my dogs. 
when i had my rottweiler who was very aggressive (my fault not his!)
i always had him muzzled when out, but some numpty young lads sent their dog over to attack him! i tried to walk away calmly hoping he'd go away, he didnt, they kept kicking their ball directly at my dog, even hitting it at one point, so i un-muzzled him. their dog went away squealing. :bash::bash::bash:
there was nothing else i could do. he was biting my dogs legs chest and head. they saw the big rottie and thought ooh this will be fun he's muzzled lets send ours to attack. 
sadly everyone in that park probably thought it was me that was the problem:bash:


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

LisaLQ said:


> Just out of interest, if a dog was attacking you or your dog (or both), no owner in sight, and you couldn't get away - what would you do?
> 
> Seems to be a lot of comments about what folks wouldn't do, and no decent advice as to what you SHOULD do.
> 
> I'm half with the kickers I'm afraid. In more of a shove kind of way. Rather a jeaned leg or booted foot got bit than try to bend down and seperate and lose half your face.


 
Thats a reall interesting comment LisaQ and well pointed out. Shove over kick any day of the week for me as well.

If i was in that situation of not being able to get away i 'think' (because i dont think anyone would really know until it happens) i would put my dog in the down (all my dogs go into the down regardless of where/ what or who is happening) and then tackle the dog using the lead and basically my feet. If i could get hold of that dog by either the scruff or using the lead i would floor it and try to get a lead on it and then i would keep it pinned to the floor using my foot on the lead to pin it down until it had calmed down or an owner had been found. 

Thats what i think i would do.


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

lizardloverrach said:


> i agree i would do whatever it takes to protect my dogs.
> when i had my rottweiler who was very aggressive (my fault not his!)
> i always had him muzzled when out, but some numpty young lads sent their dog over to attack him! i tried to walk away calmly hoping he'd go away, he didnt, they kept kicking their ball directly at my dog, even hitting it at one point, so i un-muzzled him. their dog went away squealing. :bash::bash::bash:
> there was nothing else i could do. he was biting my dogs legs chest and head. they saw the big rottie and thought ooh this will be fun he's muzzled lets send ours to attack.
> sadly everyone in that park probably thought it was me that was the problem:bash:


That is just awful, im so sorry to hear that. It makes me very angry there are such worthless pieces of sh*t out there :devil:


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

Antw23uk said:


> You can pick my post apart as much as you want. *The fact remains your really not the be all and end all regardless of how many dogs you have had.* This is a forum after all and its all about discussion.
> 
> 
> 
> I feel sorry for your dog. If its own owner cant stick up for it then i find that very sad ... very sad indeed.


 
I have seen you mention you follow the almighty ceaser's advice what exactly makes him the be all and end all? Why is his advice better than someone with alot of years experience working with dogs? Just because he has a television show doesnt mean he is the be all and end all.


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## Mrs dirtydozen (Sep 5, 2008)

whatever people would do 2 protect there dog is there choice, but i think the spray meantioned is probably the best way to go. 

if proper good laws were around making it the law that all dogs had 2 be on a lead at all times, it would make it easier for everyone (i know there are signs up etc but no one round us follows them). however i also think it is good 2 let ur dog have a good run off the lead, which an extension cant let bigger dogs do, so if real laws were in place they would have 2 be backed up with fenced safe areas for people 2 run there dogs, however this will probably never happen (would be nice if there was tho). there is a park near my mums with some unused old tennis courts n the fences have fallen down, my mum wrote 2 the council asking if they could be made into dog excerise areas but they replied basically saying it would cost 2 much, wouldnt be succesful n would have 2 employ someone 2 man it so they couldnt make any money, they didnt say this direct but might as well have. they also said they had plans for the old tennis courts but nearly 2 years later n they are still as bad as they were.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I agree that I would always put my dog's safety above any other and if me standing between my dog/dogs and the approaching dog didn't work and the dog still came aggressively, then I would use whatever means were to hand to protect my dogs. So yes, I would use my feet, but I would attempt to use them as a 'shover' not a kicker and if kicking was the only option I would be trying to avoid the side of the dog.

However, in the heat of the moment and in fear for your dog;s safety, I would assume that anyone would just kick where they could to get the dog off!


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

purpleskyes said:


> I have seen you mention you follow the almighty ceaser's advice what exactly makes him the be all and end all? Why is his advice better than someone with alot of years experience working with dogs? Just because he has a television show doesnt mean he is the be all and end all.


I dont think ive ever said he is the be all and end all to be honest.

I really dont understand your question and what relevance (sp) it has!


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

Antw23uk said:


> I dont think ive ever said he is the be all and end all to be honest.
> 
> I really dont understand your question and what relevance (sp) it has!


I was just wondering really why you choose to follow Ceaser method and and not listen to fenwoman's advice when she has 25 years experience working with dogs.: victory:

Regarding the actual topic we had a staffy attack a puppy we had years ago and one of the neighbours hit the staff on the head with a hammer to get it off the puppy. The staff was left unattended in the street so it was the owners fault for not supervising the dog.


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## funky1 (Jun 18, 2008)

I have a big, gentle giant adult GSD, he is as tame, obedient and friendly as the day is long. The unfortunate thing though is that I`ve grown to HATE taking him for a walk. On the streets he`s always on a lead, and when we get to `our` field I let him off, he is well trained with good recall. I am responsible, constantly knowing where he is, a if being honest, prob too paranoid about where other ppl and their dogs are - meaning I try to keep him in very close range to me at all times, so as I can either control him well, or stick him back on the lead if need be.
The thing is, we live in a pretty `rough` area - rammed packed full of little idiots who think it`s fantastic, hard or what have you, to roam around with their rotties, staffies - and genuine bona fide APB`s with them NEVER on the lead. They walk up and down the street thinking it`s great that dog owners walk near the privets, or cross the road - they think WE are actually scared of them, we`re not. We just don`t want to see out dog involved in an unnecessary fight for the sake of it, and we have to cross the road to avoid a fight. We want to take our dog for a simple walk to make him happy and healthy - not put up with this constantly. It isn`t even as if my dog couldn`t handle himself in a fight, he could, but seeings as mine has a lead and a `kind of` muzzle on, I don`t think the fight would be fair - 1 or 2 free dogs jumping on a GSD that was still attatched to a lead, collar and muzzle.
Anyway, my dog is great - BUT he has a big thing against Staffies - if he sees one his heckles go up and he gets defensive, wants to get in their first. Now someone will prob say that`s my dog`s problems BUT it isn`t his problem. He is like that because, as an 8 week old puppy, having a little pickle in OUR FRONT GARDEN, some idiot little off lead Staffie, zoomed down the road, headbutted my TIED UP front gate oped and savaged him to pieces in front of me and my children reiterated - IN MY FRONT GARDEN, where my little puppy should have been safe and secure. Anyroad, after struggling for a while to get the staffie off, the owner bounded down and got it - not much I could do about it, as they were never seen again. I would love to spend 10 mins in a locked room with the owner now, at the time though, I was 2 interested in stopping the blood that was flowing from my dog`s neck. 

Anyroad, IMO, there are such things as bad and demented dogs out there, just as there are irresponsible owners (plant pots) - anyone would think that an 8 week puppy would have been safe, as after all, it`s against nature for an adult dog to try and savage an unthreatening, puppy half to death in it`s own garden isn`t ir?. Or was that coz my dog was a threat, or because the staffie was just playing/doing what comes naturally?. The Staffie was `playing football` in the street with it`s owner, and had no reason on the planet to go out of it`s way to make a point of forcing my gate open just to attack.


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## LoveForLizards (Apr 20, 2008)

Antw23uk said:


> I feel sorry for your dog. If its own owner cant stick up for it then i find that very sad ... very sad indeed.


Well for starters I no longer have a dog :whistling2:
Though I have been in the position of having a strange dog come up and start attacking dogs I was walking. I fail to see how one of my animals is any more significant then somebody else', they are both relatively defenceless so why should I pick favourites? What makes my animal more worthy then somebody else's? Why should the dog be punished because its owner is a moron? Both dogs health and wellbeing was of concern.

Luckily the dogs we were walking were not very big (Staffordshire X, short JRT and a GSD), the Staffordshire X and JRT were both swimming when out of nowhere over comes a Collie and starts 'tackling' the GSD and grabbing/ripping the skin down the GSD's side and leg, the GSD was putting in a fair old fight also so we grabbed the scruff of both dogs and pulled them away, pushed the Collie to the floor, leashed them both up, called the other two dogs to heel, leashed them up and carried on walking to find the idiot owner. The GSD had 26 stitches down her side, had her jowl and ear glued back and had stitches down her leg. After the Collie's owner had a gob full off of us and we threatened legal action and calling the RSPCA and police the dog is kept safely on a long training leash at all times and is walked in the back lanes to avoid as much contact as possible with other people and dogs and also has a basket muzzle on if somebody else happens to be walking their dogs on the same track.

Needless to say the GSD's owner was happy neither dogs come to life-threatening harm.

ETA: Before anybody has a go, we carried on walking the GSD because we had to walk back that way to get home anyway. and there was very very little blood anyway.


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

purpleskyes said:


> I was just wondering really why you choose to follow Ceaser method and and not listen to fenwoman's advice when she has 25 years experience working with dogs.: victory:
> 
> Regarding the actual topic we had a staffy attack a puppy we had years ago and one of the neighbours hit the staff on the head with a hammer to get it off the puppy. The staff was left unattended in the street so it was the owners fault for not supervising the dog.


#

Erm because i dont really agree with all she said. 25 years or 25 dogs? either way i agree with some of her comments but i dont agree with others. : victory:


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## cpiggott22 (Apr 1, 2009)

Stuff like this really hacks me off...our girl really isn't good with other dogs but we can pass by them with minimal fuss as long as they don't come up to her. She is ALWAYS on lead, nomatter where we are (which suits her just fine as she's old and lazy!) which to me means she is under control. I always put myself between her and other dogs and if needs be I will take hold of her collar and lift her front feet off the ground so she can't grab anything. I refuse to muzzle her because she doesn't bark or snap and loves carrying her toy around. Now, someone had the cheek to tell me that if an offlead dog runs up to her and gets nipped it's MY fault for not having her muzzled! What the hell??! I could see their point if she was completely horrific with absolutely everything but she is by no means uncontrollable and can quite easily pass within a meter or so of another dog. So why do I get treated like scum because my dog is being correctly restrained and controlled whilst theirs is totally out of control and approaching a dog which is clearly not friendly?? To be fair to our old lady though, her aggression is clearly based on a lack of socialisation (I'm fairly sure her original owner used an extreme version of pack theory to train her which meant very little contact with other people or dogs) and on the couple of occassions this has happened she's been very accommodating and relatively calm(ish!).

Fortunately we live in a very small community so everyone round here knows she has erm....'issues' with other dogs lol. As a side effect though we're treated as lepers (sp??) because we're a young couple with a big dog who doesn't like other dogs!!!....despite the fact that she's totally fine with people and excellently behaved. Grrr, rant over, sorry guys :blush:


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

LisaLQ said:


> Just out of interest, if a dog was attacking you or your dog (or both), no owner in sight, and you couldn't get away - what would you do?
> 
> Seems to be a lot of comments about what folks wouldn't do, and no decent advice as to what you SHOULD do.
> 
> I'm half with the kickers I'm afraid. In more of a shove kind of way. Rather a jeaned leg or booted foot got bit than try to bend down and seperate and lose half your face.


 For a start if a dog is running loose with no owner in sight, I would calmly and quickly walk away from it.
If I had one of my little dogs with me, I would pick it up and put it inside my coat or jacket so as to minimise dog on dog aggression. If the dog came towards me looking unfriendly, I personally would stand square and say firmly "sit". If this elicited no response or seemed to antagonise the dog, I would sing quietly to myself and slowly walk backwards, keeping an eye on the dog but not maintaining eye contact.The singing quietly often calms a scared or aggressive animals. The 'sit' command if given confidently and not loud or aggressively, will often have the desired effect as most dogs will have been taught the command at some stage in their lives.
A direct attack would be handled differently depending on the scale of aggression and size of dog. There is no 'one way suits every occasion' and a lot will depend on the confidence of the person and level of experience in reading body language.
I have only ever once in all my years been bitten in aggression and that was entirely my own fault. I have however, come across many aggressive dogs and been able to manage the situation.


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

Thanks for the suggestions - especially FW as I appreciate there are other options for owners of smaller dogs.

I would however struggle to pick up Blu (having said this - it's theoretical as I dont walk him any more - Mick does, but even he would struggle) being a dane.

I think it works both ways too - if Blu attacked another dog I would try and seperate them also, and he may end up on the end of the shove - depending on the circumstances. Obviously, if I ever thought that was going to happen, I wouldn't walk him without a muzzle - but it's worth thinking about all eventualities.

It's been really interesting reading - thanks


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## Seira (Apr 13, 2009)

I tell the owner of the other dog that mine has a bad flea infestation. I also tell this to small children that come up to us and try to pester him. And when I can't do that, I'm lucky that he's small enough to just scoop him up and walk off. c:


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## Marinam2 (Sep 4, 2007)

I was caught in scenario once, i was walking my rottweiler and a jack russel and a boxer ran up behind me, i didnt see them, they didnt bark. The russel met us first in a sniff sniff attack mode and the boxer who had been slower to approach joined in and both were attacking my rottie. 

My rottie was half escaping half biting back but we ended up entangled and panicked. The owners were ages away and unable to see around the corner what was going on!!

i fell to my bum and was then stood on by my own dog as he was retreating whilst facing them. i was shaking so much i couldn't stand.

Marina


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## xautomaticflowersx (Sep 7, 2009)

I haven't read the whole thread, only the first two pages. But when I'm out walking and have my two off-lead I always call them back and put them on a lead if somebody is walking nearby with an on-lead dog. It's just common courtesy in my opinion. Any dog, no matter how friendly, is going to feel a little insecure when they are on a lead and a free-roaming dog comes running over. The on-lead dog can't run away or move freely and it is close to it's owner and may feel a responsibilty to defend. So it's really unfair to put the on-lead dog (and it's owner) in that position where it is forced to make a decision on how to react very quickly. Of course it may all go perfectly smoothly and 9 times out of 10 it would, but why risk that 1 in 10 case where the encounter may not be positive?
I'm absolutely sick of going out for walks and having a large dog come bounding over to mine, smacking them in the flanks with their heads and slobbering all over them. How is that appropriate/friendly behaviour? It's over the top behaviour and is dominant. And as has been previously mentioned, screeching out "He's very friendly!" or "He's only a pup!" is NOT an excuse! If he's friendly, the dog he's approaching may NOT BE so the owner is being negligent. Also, it is easy to confuse over-enthusiastic dominant behaviour with playfulness, which is what most people who shout out "He's very friendly!" seem to do. And if he's a pup then you should be making an extra effort to maintain control to set the standard for the rest of his life.
My dogs are whippets and as such they are a little sensitive and can be easily injured (they have virtually no coat to protect them, very thin skin and not much fat) so I feel a little uneasy when something comes bounding out of nowhere looking for a confrontation.:whip:
Back to the OP's initial post... in my experience the nuisance dogs tend to be labradors and not bull breeds. Which is unfortunate because if people make the effort to train them and curb some of their over-enthusiastic behaviour they really are a fantastic breed. And before anyone has a go I'm genuinely not prejudiced towards labs or their owners, we used to have a lab x retriever when I was growing up and I've known a lot of labradors over the years. It's just that _in my experience_ the labradors that I tend to meet off-lead when out on a walk are overly-boistrous and their owners make no attempts to control them.


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## eve2611 (Jul 28, 2009)

ok i admit to only reading the first few pages n skipping, to be honest that sounds like situation i am the owner with a bullbreed who is walking on lead nicely along the edge praying that the off lead dog doesnt come running over as usually the owner is so far away they cant do anything, I even tried to tempt other dogs with stella's treats to get them away from her while the owners are shouting febally come here....... good boy/girl and im shouting take control of your dog!!!

stella is quite dog aggressive, she will pass another dog ok but if one gets to close or in her space its not good, we have had a couple of incidents where off lead dogs come bounding up and onto her and there has been sum snarling and snapping not good and she gets the blame when she is on a lead and harness under control and is usally sat between my legs, i make her sit for dogs to passand keep her focus on me. 

grrrrr sorry rant over!


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

xautomaticflowersx said:


> I haven't read the whole thread, only the first two pages. But when I'm out walking and have my two off-lead I always call them back and put them on a lead if somebody is walking nearby with an on-lead dog. It's just common courtesy in my opinion. Any dog, no matter how friendly, is going to feel a little insecure when they are on a lead and a free-roaming dog comes running over. The on-lead dog can't run away or move freely and it is close to it's owner and may feel a responsibilty to defend. So it's really unfair to put the on-lead dog (and it's owner) in that position where it is forced to make a decision on how to react very quickly. Of course it may all go perfectly smoothly and 9 times out of 10 it would, but why risk that 1 in 10 case where the encounter may not be positive?
> I'm absolutely sick of going out for walks and having a large dog come bounding over to mine, smacking them in the flanks with their heads and slobbering all over them. How is that appropriate/friendly behaviour? It's over the top behaviour and is dominant. And as has been previously mentioned, screeching out "He's very friendly!" or "He's only a pup!" is NOT an excuse! If he's friendly, the dog he's approaching may NOT BE so the owner is being negligent. Also, it is easy to confuse over-enthusiastic dominant behaviour with playfulness, which is what most people who shout out "He's very friendly!" seem to do. And if he's a pup then you should be making an extra effort to maintain control to set the standard for the rest of his life.
> My dogs are whippets and as such they are a little sensitive and can be easily injured (they have virtually no coat to protect them, very thin skin and not much fat) so I feel a little uneasy when something comes bounding out of nowhere looking for a confrontation.:whip:
> Back to the OP's initial post... in my experience the nuisance dogs tend to be labradors and not bull breeds. Which is unfortunate because if people make the effort to train them and curb some of their over-enthusiastic behaviour they really are a fantastic breed. And before anyone has a go I'm genuinely not prejudiced towards labs or their owners, we used to have a lab x retriever when I was growing up and I've known a lot of labradors over the years. It's just that _in my experience_ the labradors that I tend to meet off-lead when out on a walk are overly-boistrous and their owners make no attempts to control them.


I totally agree :2thumb:
I find it odd how some dog owners just dont have the first clue about owning a dog, and appropriate dog behaviour.

I do also have to point out I do own a lab and a lab cross as well as bull breeds :lol2: But yes my main problems tend to come from entire male labs who have no manners around other dogs at all.



eve2611 said:


> ok i admit to only reading the first few pages n skipping, to be honest that sounds like situation i am the owner with a bullbreed who is walking on lead nicely along the edge praying that the off lead dog doesnt come running over as usually the owner is so far away they cant do anything, I even tried to tempt other dogs with stella's treats to get them away from her while the owners are shouting febally come here....... good boy/girl and im shouting take control of your dog!!!
> 
> stella is quite dog aggressive, she will pass another dog ok but if one gets to close or in her space its not good, we have had a couple of incidents where off lead dogs come bounding up and onto her and there has been sum snarling and snapping not good and she gets the blame when she is on a lead and harness under control and is usally sat between my legs, i make her sit for dogs to passand keep her focus on me.
> 
> grrrrr sorry rant over!


Rant away! See the problem is these dog walkers see us and our dogs as a problem because they then have to be bothered to try and recall there dogs and get them on lead. As far as there concerned walking your dog means going to a park and letting your dog off to do what it wants.
They dont see how hard it is for us and our dogs, we just want to give them a normal life even if they arent great with other dogs, but there making sure we cant and making life for us and our dogs very difficult.

I've now taking up walking Jay down the back lanes of the houses, which isnt great, but we dont get bothered by other dogs.
So thats how it will have to be untill I move and buy some woodland for them to play in.


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## zoeu (Apr 8, 2008)

If I see a dog on lead to me that says stay away. My dog would never be off lead if it didn't have perfect recall, but a lot of dog owners don't seem to care how badly behaved their dogs are, they just let them off lead then stand yelling at them to come back while saying "ooh, he/she's never been like that before" after their dog has tried to pick a fight!
My parents have 2 greyhounds and a lurcher and they are always kept on lead and walked muzzled. Not because they are aggressive to other dogs but they could be dangerous to cats/wildlife and they have no recall. Yet other dog owners happily let their off lead, out of control dogs come bounding up, sometimes in a friendly way, but more often it will be an entire male that starts posturing. The owner shouts from too far away to do anything "don't worry he's friendly" while the dogs body language shows they are anything but. One of the greyhounds was attacked by other dogs while in racing kennels and gets frightened if a dog comes up behind her. This sometimes leads to her screaming the place down if she gets too upset at which point the boys feel the need to protect the damsel in distress. It's noise and no intent, just warning the other dog off, but then we get told that our dogs are aggressive and shouldn't be walked near other dogs! It's taken a long time to get the girl to where she is now, she's improved so much since we got her and I think she should be able to go for a walk without any rover, sam or ben sticking his nose up her bum uninvited!


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

Kerriebaby said:


> if your dog doesnt have a good recall, then why is he or she off lead?


Ditto. If my dog didnt have recall, they'd be walked on lead. Full stop.


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## LisaLQ (Jan 29, 2009)

LOL I just realised I already answered this one. Teach me to read first page and post...


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## xemx (Jan 13, 2008)

i also wouldnt have it off lead if it doesnt recall 100% of the time.
I have a bull breed always onlead and he hates strange dogs running at him, he becomes anxious and upset which leads to aggression.

Please train your dog before allowing him to be off lead -there are lots of ways to do this please try them all


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## xemx (Jan 13, 2008)

cpiggott22 said:


> Stuff like this really hacks me off...our girl really isn't good with other dogs but we can pass by them with minimal fuss as long as they don't come up to her. She is ALWAYS on lead, nomatter where we are (which suits her just fine as she's old and lazy!) which to me means she is under control. I always put myself between her and other dogs and if needs be I will take hold of her collar and lift her front feet off the ground so she can't grab anything. I refuse to muzzle her because she doesn't bark or snap and loves carrying her toy around. Now, someone had the cheek to tell me that if an offlead dog runs up to her and gets nipped it's MY fault for not having her muzzled! What the hell??! I could see their point if she was completely horrific with absolutely everything but she is by no means uncontrollable and can quite easily pass within a meter or so of another dog. So why do I get treated like scum because my dog is being correctly restrained and controlled whilst theirs is totally out of control and approaching a dog which is clearly not friendly?? To be fair to our old lady though, her aggression is clearly based on a lack of socialisation (I'm fairly sure her original owner used an extreme version of pack theory to train her which meant very little contact with other people or dogs) and on the couple of occassions this has happened she's been very accommodating and relatively calm(ish!).
> 
> Fortunately we live in a very small community so everyone round here knows she has erm....'issues' with other dogs lol. As a side effect though we're treated as lepers (sp??) because we're a young couple with a big dog who doesn't like other dogs!!!....despite the fact that she's totally fine with people and excellently behaved. Grrr, rant over, sorry guys :blush:


 
i have the same problem its so frustrating, altho my dog is rescue, only 5/6 years old, well trained in the house and lovely with our new pug puppy and other dogs when introduced off lead in our house, he doesnt like being approached outside and although i have full control over him and use my body to block sometimes other dogs just dont give in which resuts in a fight which i get blamed for!!! but my dog is under control and ON LEAD!!!!


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## eve2611 (Jul 28, 2009)

zoeu said:


> but then we get told that our dogs are aggressive and shouldn't be walked near other dogs! It's taken a long time to get the girl to where she is now, she's improved so much since we got her and I think she should be able to go for a walk without any rover, sam or ben sticking his nose up her bum uninvited!


 
:2thumb::2thumb: i 100% agree with u on this!!


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## natsuko (Jan 3, 2009)

Ok havent read all the replies just yet but before reading I'm going to add what I do as Ty doesnt have the greatest of recalls.

In this situation I call my dog to me whilst other dog is still a good distance away and keep him onlead until the other dog is gone. If there are already dogs where I am then he stays on the lead. That is more because I no longer feel confident in being able to control him rather than not trusting him, as he used to generally be really good off lead with other dogs.


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