# Feeder Rat Initial Set Up Help



## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

Hi,

I am looking at starting up my own feeder rat colonies to feed my snakes on so that I know the quality of the rats my snakes are feding on and to cut down costs.
I was wondering if anyone could look at my plan below and tell me if it looks okay or if anything needs tweaking, as I have read so many posts on the subject that I may have confused myself somewhere along the way lol...
Here goes...

I have 10 Royals...
Am thinking about getting 2 colonies of 1 male 4 females and keeping the two colonies in seperate rubs, and always having one spare rub for cleaning out so I can move all the rats straight over and properly clean out the used one...(no real need for a rack as only breeding on a small scale)...
Will have dog bowl full of food in the rub and a water bottle regularly topped up...
Hopefully once the colony is established the females will breed every 21-28 days producing on average 10 babies (I know it should be more but more isn't a bad thing) meaning I should get upwards of 80 babies per month...
With the 10 snakes eating once a week it'll be about 40 per month, with some extra as surplus just in case...
Cost should be about £10 for large bag of dog food which should last a couple of months (I think?) and bedding which can just use same as I use for snakes now...so say £10 per month is still better than 40 store bought rats at 60p a pop for smalls making about £24 a month (and will only increase as the snakes get bigger)...

So from initial set up...50 days until ready to breed...3 weeks gestation...3 weeks weaning...so I'm looking at about 13 weeks until the first lot will be ready for culling and feeding (again I think this is correct?)

The only adjustment I may make is moving the pregnant females to a seperate tub when pregnant to lay and wean the babies away from the male but not sure...any suggestions?

Just to clarify are my estimated costs and estimate offspring realistic or not?

Also...do rats smell a lot more than mice and would mice be a better option? The reason I went for rats is due to the rate at which they grow to where I need them for culling and feeding (currently about 2 weeks for rats instead of 3 weeks for mice)

Sorry for all the questions but want to make sure I have it right  any suggestions are welcome...thanks


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## jack_rep (Sep 11, 2008)

I did the exact same thing as you a year ago.

In a nut shell.... dont lol. Its not cheaper or easier by any stretch of the imagination. But if you are keen...

Rats smell lots, so only do it if you can keep them in a shed or out building. That number of rats is going to make ur house really smelly.

The work load of maintaining them is actually easy i found! Once a week i would top up food in a hopper i made from wire mesh from top of the rub lid, and also two big water bottles also changed once a week. Cleaning of the rub was dead easy, straight over a bin and wallpaper scraper to clear it out. Fresh sawdust, rats back in, lid on, done.

Wire mesh has to be decent stuff with rats, the amount u will need makes it more than i expected. and the time and effort to fit it to a rub lid to a high enough quality to keep a rat in was also above expected.

I had a 5 tub stack. 2 with 3 x female. 1 with 2 x male. and 1 was a nursery tub for once they were weaned. 1 spare for when one was mid clean.

Kulling them humanly is another big issue. anything from medium rat down is is easy. It doesnt take much force for these to be out like a light. however when you get into adult size, especially adult males you really need a CO2 system to do a fair job with the welfare of the rat in mind. And this isnt cheap. 

Another problem i didnt anticipate is that i expected to be able to flog my spare produce to local shops, apparently because i didnt have some sort of licence (pet shop licence?) it was a bit risky for them to buy them off me. Whether this was just hot air i dont know, but i did struggle to flog what i didnt use.

Unless you really really want to keep rats as pets, dont do it. Its not worth it simply to try and keep a healthy source of snake food. I recon you would have to do it on an industrial scale to be economical too.

One discover i found just as i packed it in though, if you can find a few adult rats with hairless genes in them, the sale of the hairless babies to rat fanciers did provide some subsidy. This isnt a reliable sale source though, as many people who are into rats as pets wont like the way you keep them.

Hope some of that info helps!


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## jack_rep (Sep 11, 2008)

Best source of sawdust i found... my local pet shop would buy big bails of it on the cheap. then the shop breaks these up into smaller bags and sells on to small rodent keepers. If you can get friendly and have him get one in. They were something like 4ft x 2ft x 2ft of sawdust, compacted and £12.

A rack may be needed f you want to stack them....

Dont scrimp on the cost of food. U want something high protien for better results. Dog food i researched in the big bags is usually for older dogs.... low protien needs. I found the best protien to cost ratio was some generic guinie pig food my local pet shop stocked. Big bags of the stuff. Research what ur source stocks. Food is going to be ur biggest cost though, pregnant females and babies demolish it.

Time wise... factor in your females are going to need to rest between pregnancies. you will get lower results if you abuse the as baby machines.

Housing pregnant females..... I kept females in a permanent tub. Left to mate then removed males before birth. I found better results when i let a female nurse in her own tub, but i think they will share the litter if you let them? Not too sure on this though.

Mice i found infinitely more difficult. You so much as look at the nursing female a bit funny and she goes cannibalistic on her young. Nightmare. I gave up and focused on the rats which were much more reliable producers.


And thats all i can think of to say at the minute


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## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

Well that's given me some food for thought (if you'll pardon the pun)

It seems the smell is going to be the major issue...reckon I could just febreeze them occassionally? (I'm joking honestly but I'm sure I could find a solution...I hope...research will be done lol)
As for feeding I just based it on what the majority of established breeders on the forums seem to use, as it works for them so cant be too bad can it?
I know the females need to rest which is why I put 21-28 days between breeds, as I know they can pretty much have babies and then get pregnant again just by brushing past a male :bash: lol which was why I asked if the moving of pregnant female out of the colonies would be better until babies were weaned, the rest and then back to the males...

But thank you so much for your response...can't beat replies from people who have been there and done it :2thumb:


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## Jay--Pee (Aug 31, 2011)

jack_rep said:


> I did the exact same thing as you a year ago.
> 
> In a nut shell.... dont lol. Its not cheaper or easier by any stretch of the imagination. But if you are keen...
> 
> ...


Also does that mean you don't think my costings are realistic? As from what I can tell it seems loads cheaper than store bought frozen?


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## eightball (Jan 1, 2011)

Jay--Pee said:


> Also does that mean you don't think my costings are realistic? As from what I can tell it seems loads cheaper than store bought frozen?


it is loads cheaper to do it yourself, i wouldnt bother though unless you had about 10 snakes or more :2thumb:


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## blobby (Nov 6, 2006)

*breeder feeder rats*

i have 50 +breeders and some young haired and hairless, i have been breeding for 3 years now, and spend no more than £10 on wagg rabbit food a week, and never had any trouble with rats or mice eating babies, if they get food every day and enough of it they wont eat babies,they did not produce many in the winter untill i put a small heater in there shed for realy cold nights,i have 16 tanks ,as i find them easy to clean and they keep the drafts out so warmer in winter, but what you dont use in summer freeze for winter, i never ran out even when i had 27 snakes a bail of wood shavings cost £8 if you shop around, 16 tanks give me about 2 litter every week of approx 10 pups nearly continully= 80 too 90 a month,.then a months rest for all of them use up some overflow then back to the job,.and they dont smell if you keep them cleaned out every 5 days,i have some times have 100 in my sheds and they only just let you know they are there with thier smell if you are interested 
:no1:i am selling all my breeding stock ,and thier young HAIRED AND HAIRLESS ,due to unforseen ill health, there is 8 racks, with 2 tanks on each rack,with 2 female and a male in each tank,so one complete rack concists of,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 1 rack 2 tanks,4 female and 2 male rats=£50, two tanks are 5 foot they will be £65 the pair with rack, as they will be 3 fem one male in,each tank, IF YOU WANT A BARGAIN BUY THE LOT FOR £250 :no1: PS HAVE MADE A FORTUNE WITH THE HAIRLESS AND SPECIAL HAIRED ONES IN THE LAST 18 MONTHS:flrt:


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