# Horned/Pacman Frog



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Hello, I've never posted on this section before, I'm more of an invert girl. :Na_Na_Na_Na: But recently I was on holiday in Florida and was looking at one of the frog/toad sections of the parks and fell in love with the horned frogs, whenever I buy a new pet, I like to be big. (I must have some kind of complex :whistling2 

Any who I've been reading up on the horned frog (ceratophrys cranwelli and ornata). I'm thinking of maybe getting one at Kempton if they have any (if anyone knows if someone sells them there that would be awesome), that gives me plenty of time to research and get everything I need. I was just wondering if you could clear up a few queries I have. 

For the heat mat, does that need to go under the tank, or on the side. Or would it be better to get one of those light things (yeah need to read up a bit more on these!). When I've been reading up some say at the bottom, some on the side. 

Also do they need cleaning out, and how often? Some care sheets don't mention this and another said they need cleaning out every week. Then I read another saying they can't be handled as it stresses them out. So how do you clean them out every week without getting the frog out? Work round him without getting bitten? 

Thanks for reading and any help or tips you can give me would be fantastic! :2thumb:


----------



## TIMOTHY AND MATILDA (Oct 31, 2008)

Heat mat on the side and I spot clean daily and the whole tank every 2-3 weeks
They are fab frogs,I have a real beasty called Isabella Custard :2thumb:


----------



## Blissfullsilence (May 7, 2010)

I am new to this species myself but from my research,

The heatmat should go on the side of the tank, horned frogs like to dig down in the substrate and so a mat underneath could potentially cause over heating.

as for cleaning I spot clean the tank each day removing any poop or dead insects I can see, but these frogs sometimes poop while they are buried so you do need to sift through the substrate from time to time. I do this with my cranwelli still in the tank and he doesn't seem to mind. When I am cleaning out the tank totally I remove him, I gently scoop him up from behind, this doesn't seem to phase him at all, infact when I put him back afterwards he doesn't jump off my hand right away he just sits there


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Thanks for replying. :notworthy:



TIMOTHY AND MATILDA said:


> Heat mat on the side and I spot clean daily and the whole tank every 2-3 weeks
> They are fab frogs,I have a real beasty called Isabella Custard :2thumb:


Ah ok then, that doesn't sound so bad, I was thinking cleaning everything every week is a bit to much effort for me, but every 2-3 weeks is more reasonable. :lol2: That's a really cute name. :flrt:



Blissfullsilence said:


> I am new to this species myself but from my research,
> 
> The heatmat should go on the side of the tank, horned frogs like to dig down in the substrate and so a mat underneath could potentially cause over heating.
> 
> as for cleaning I spot clean the tank each day removing any poop or dead insects I can see, but these frogs sometimes poop while they are buried so you do need to sift through the substrate from time to time. I do this with my cranwelli still in the tank and he doesn't seem to mind. When I am cleaning out the tank totally I remove him, I gently scoop him up from behind, this doesn't seem to phase him at all, infact when I put him back afterwards he doesn't jump off my hand right away he just sits there


Oh right, sounds easy enough to move them about, I like that idea as well. :lol2: Yeah I read about them pooping under the substrate, and also in their water dishes but spot cleaning daily is ok. :2thumb: It's just the whole changing all the substrate weekly that put me off a little, but every few weeks is better. 

I also have another couple of questions, does it matter if I get a male or female, like does one grow bigger than the other, or live longer? 

Also do I need to monitor the humidity and temperature with those gauge things? I brought some once and they never seemed to move, no matter what I did. :lol2:


----------



## Blissfullsilence (May 7, 2010)

Females get larger than males, although I have no idea how to tell the sex, not even sure what mine is yet :lol2:
I am not sure if the sex makes a difference in life span but they generally live 6-7 years, up to 10 years.

you will definitely need a thermometer and hygrometer, they need quite high temps and humidity 

Temps, 24-28°C (75- 82°F) although care sheets seem to vary slightly
Humidity:70% plus 

They don't move a lot from what I have read, mine is just starting to perk up he was hibernating pretty much since I got him at the end of last year but I have upped the humidity recently and am keeping it over 80% (had to put a towel over the top of my exo terra to keep it high enough) and he is now more active but still he pretty much just moves to a different spot in the tank each day and sits there 

EDIT: did you mean you brought some gauges and they didn't move? I thought you ment frogs at first lol 
If you brought the ones that are round and stick on with a little needle in, they arn't that good for getting an accurate reading, you are better off with digital ones there is a guy on here who sells combined thermometer/hygrometers for about £8 each


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Blissfullsilence said:


> Females get larger than males, although I have no idea how to tell the sex, not even sure what mine is yet :lol2:
> I am not sure if the sex makes a difference in life span but they generally live 6-7 years, up to 10 years.
> 
> you will definitely need a thermometer and hygrometer, they need quite high temps and humidity
> ...


Oh right, well that's ok then guess it doesn't matter if I get male or female.  I'd prefer a baby one though, I like watching things grow.  Oh right, so hibernating is normal? I thought they would only do that if you lowered the temps or something. Yeah I have a fish tank that I'll keep him in, should hopefully keep the humidity and temps up.  Haha no, the gauges, well ok, I'll look into buying some of those, and I'm guessing I'll need a thermostat to control the temp?


----------



## spencerburgo (Dec 1, 2010)

vivalabam said:


> Hello, I've never posted on this section before, I'm more of an invert girl. :Na_Na_Na_Na: But recently I was on holiday in Florida and was looking at one of the frog/toad sections of the parks and fell in love with the horned frogs, whenever I buy a new pet, I like to be big. (I must have some kind of complex :whistling2
> 
> Any who I've been reading up on the horned frog (ceratophrys cranwelli and ornata). I'm thinking of maybe getting one at Kempton if they have any (if anyone knows if someone sells them there that would be awesome), that gives me plenty of time to research and get everything I need. I was just wondering if you could clear up a few queries I have.
> 
> ...


keep it simple at first, if you get a baby and give it a large tank with substrate it will bury itself, if you dont get the tempratures and humidity right it will stay burried, as i find horned frogs can be a bit huffy when moved, keep it in a small tank when you first get it on some damp kitchen roll heat mat underneath half of it that way when your feeding there is no chance of the frog swallowing substrate or any thing, and when there young they need there food and vitamins, its no good if your frog is burried for weeks on end, as i think horned frogs are prone to mbd, once the frog has started to bulk up and is feeding well you can put him in bigger housing with false plants and what not,

cheers spencer...........


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

spencerburgo said:


> keep it simple at first, if you get a baby and give it a large tank with substrate it will bury itself, if you dont get the tempratures and humidity right it will stay burried, as i find horned frogs can be a bit huffy when moved, keep it in a small tank when you first get it on some damp kitchen roll heat mat underneath half of it that way when your feeding there is no chance of the frog swallowing substrate or any thing, and when there young they need there food and vitamins, its no good if your frog is burried for weeks on end, as i think horned frogs are prone to mbd, once the frog has started to bulk up and is feeding well you can put him in bigger housing with false plants and what not,
> 
> cheers spencer...........


Right ok, small tank it is then. I go to wilkinsons for mine, will just a plastic tub be ok, I'll put some air holes and stuff in. 
Oh, so no substrate and just kitchen roll? Or could I not put like a little bit on soil in? 
What kind of vitamins do they need? I have I think calcium that I use for my millipedes. 
What is mbd? :blush:


----------



## spencerburgo (Dec 1, 2010)

vivalabam said:


> Right ok, small tank it is then. I go to wilkinsons for mine, will just a plastic tub be ok, I'll put some air holes and stuff in.
> Oh, so no substrate and just kitchen roll? Or could I not put like a little bit on soil in?
> What kind of vitamins do they need? I have I think calcium that I use for my millipedes.
> What is mbd? :blush:


:blush: no need i should of explained if your new to frogs,<metabolic bone disease> lack of calcium and vitamins can make the frog get all sorts of problems mostly to do with there bones not forming properly,as for the tub an rub would be fine make sure that it is ventilated but not so that the heat and humidity escapes and just kitchen roll there are two ways damp kitchen roll with a bath inside, or no kitchen roll and just water with a bit of foam that the frog can sit on if he wants out the water, get it set up and running long before you get your frog then you no your sorted when it arives this is a very simple system for cleaning and feeding your frog,
nutrobal or something similar dont over dust,: victory:here is my young albino housed as described,








cheers spencer.........


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

spencerburgo said:


> :blush: no need i should of explained if your new to frogs,<metabolic bone disease> lack of calcium and vitamins can make the frog get all sorts of problems mostly to do with there bones not forming properly,as for the tub an rub would be fine make sure that it is ventilated but not so that the heat and humidity escapes and just kitchen roll there are two ways damp kitchen roll with a bath inside, or no kitchen roll and just water with a bit of foam that the frog can sit on if he wants out the water, get it set up and running long before you get your frog then you no your sorted when it arives this is a very simple system for cleaning and feeding your frog,
> nutrobal or something similar dont over dust,: victory:here is my young albino housed as described,
> image
> cheers spencer.........


Ah right ok then, so just the calcium and nutrobal? Or are they the same? 
Right yeah that makes sense.  Do you know any where that sells these? I don't have much means of travel at the moment so can't pick up from a member on here unless they are pretty close. 

Aww, such a cute frog. :flrt:


----------



## spencerburgo (Dec 1, 2010)

vivalabam said:


> Ah right ok then, so just the calcium and nutrobal? Or are they the same?
> Right yeah that makes sense.  Do you know any where that sells these? I don't have much means of travel at the moment so can't pick up from a member on here unless they are pretty close.
> 
> Aww, such a cute frog. :flrt:


lots of places online but you will have to pay for courier and that can make the frog expensive, or your local reptile shop should have one in maybe there not the hardest things to come by ive just given two away you can get some really nice colours in horned frogs if you shop around,

cheers spencer..........


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

spencerburgo said:


> lots of places online but you will have to pay for courier and that can make the frog expensive, or your local reptile shop should have one in maybe there not the hardest things to come by ive just given two away you can get some really nice colours in horned frogs if you shop around,
> 
> cheers spencer..........


Ah right ok, do reptile shows often have them for sale? I know last time I went to Kempton and there was a amphibian stall, I didn't really have a look as I didn't know anything about frogs. :blush:


----------



## TIMOTHY AND MATILDA (Oct 31, 2008)

I do know that I started with one frog 3 years ago and I now have 28 :lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2:


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

TIMOTHY AND MATILDA said:


> I do know that I started with one frog 3 years ago and I now have 28 :lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2:


:lol2: Same with me and my tarantulas, I was only getting one, 22 later. :whistling2:


----------



## TIMOTHY AND MATILDA (Oct 31, 2008)

:lol2::lol2:


vivalabam said:


> :lol2: Same with me and my tarantulas, I was only getting one, 22 later. :whistling2:


Oh gosh :lol2::lol2:


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Another question I have: 

I've been reading and it says to dust the food with calcium and D3 once a week, is this right? 

There's a little baby in the pet shop and I might have to go buy him/her tomorrow. :flrt:


----------



## RhianB87 (Oct 25, 2009)

If you can get to it PRAS had some horned frogs last year, I know Pollywog had a stand at Kempton but for the life of me I cant remember if he had horned frogs.

I only spot clean mine when he has been for a poo. 

They start off nice and cute..



















And then something happens and they turn into one hell of a grumpy looking frog!!


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

FallenAngel said:


> If you can get to it PRAS had some horned frogs last year, I know Pollywog had a stand at Kempton but for the life of me I cant remember if he had horned frogs.
> 
> I only spot clean mine when he has been for a poo.
> 
> ...


The pet shop has an albino one for £27.99, it's only like an inch and a half so it's still tiny. I'm going for a better look tomorrow, but I've fallen ion love. :blush: I've been researching for ages, I was going to see what they had at Kempton but this little fellow has popped up. :flrt:


----------



## manda88 (Nov 27, 2009)

vivalabam said:


> The pet shop has an albino one for £27.99, it's only like an inch and a half so it's still tiny. I'm going for a better look tomorrow, but I've fallen ion love. :blush: I've been researching for ages, I was going to see what they had at Kempton but this little fellow has popped up. :flrt:


You can always just buy another one at Kempton 

As for the calcium and vits, when mine was a baby I'd dust his crickets with calcium at least 3 times a week, and vitamins once a week. As an adult I'd say to carry on once a week with the vitamins, and then once or twice a week with calcium.


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

manda88 said:


> You can always just buy another one at Kempton
> 
> As for the calcium and vits, when mine was a baby I'd dust his crickets with calcium at least 3 times a week, and vitamins once a week. As an adult I'd say to carry on once a week with the vitamins, and then once or twice a week with calcium.


Ah right, and I can just get this from a pet shop? I already have calcium for my millipedes, I'll just check it;s the right stuff. 

Is there a pot that just says 'vitamins' or is there anything in particular I'm looking for. Sorry if that's a stupid question, I can be a bit thick at times. :blush:


----------



## manda88 (Nov 27, 2009)

vivalabam said:


> Ah right, and I can just get this from a pet shop? I already have calcium for my millipedes, I'll just check it;s the right stuff.
> 
> Is there a pot that just says 'vitamins' or is there anything in particular I'm looking for. Sorry if that's a stupid question, I can be a bit thick at times. :blush:


Yeah even places like Pets at Home do them, best place to get them though would probably be Surrey Pet Supplies or similar.
The tub of vitamins I have is by EuroRep and is called Repton Insect Dusting Supplement, it's a black tub with a pic of a chameleon on it, and the calcium I use is Komodo Cricket Dust, it's a white plastic jar with a pic of a cricket on it : victory: There's quite a few different brands out there, personally I find it more difficult finding vitamins than calcium, but I'm just dumb and don't look properly :lol2:


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

manda88 said:


> Yeah even places like Pets at Home do them, best place to get them though would probably be Surrey Pet Supplies or similar.
> The tub of vitamins I have is by EuroRep and is called Repton Insect Dusting Supplement, it's a black tub with a pic of a chameleon on it, and the calcium I use is Komodo Cricket Dust, it's a white plastic jar with a pic of a cricket on it : victory: There's quite a few different brands out there, personally I find it more difficult finding vitamins than calcium, but I'm just dumb and don't look properly :lol2:


Ah right ok then, thanks. :no1: If I can't see any in the pet shop tomorrow I'll order some online. I'm hopefully putting a deposit on him/her tomorrow, then I'll just have to get the stuff. :lol2:

I have most of it, or know where to get it from, it's just a matter of buying it all.:flrt:


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Here's what I have at the moment, a cheap plastic tank from the pound shop, it's not ideal but it's cheap and I don't have the space for a bigger one at the moment, I will do in a month when I'm home.  

I have a flower pot as a hide and a water dish. 










I was wondering about ventilation, how much will I need? I've made 3 holes down each side and 4 on top, I wasn't sure the right balance as too much ventilation will lower the humidity. Does anyone think I'll need more?


----------



## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Maybe a few more holes, but it's not critical.

On the substrate/cleaning issue, have you thought about a 'bioactive/live' substrate? There are various commercial ones available, but you can make your own by mixing 'live' leafmould (from a clean wood) with orchid bark or similar. This mix is to a large extent 'self-cleaning', as all the woodlice, springtails and other bugs clean up the waste. It takes *much* less cleaning than other methods, and if you have living plants, can be considered semi-permanent. just a thought...:whistling2:


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Ron Magpie said:


> Maybe a few more holes, but it's not critical.
> 
> On the substrate/cleaning issue, have you thought about a 'bioactive/live' substrate? There are various commercial ones available, but you can make your own by mixing 'live' leafmould (from a clean wood) with orchid bark or similar. This mix is to a large extent 'self-cleaning', as all the woodlice, springtails and other bugs clean up the waste. It takes *much* less cleaning than other methods, and if you have living plants, can be considered semi-permanent. just a thought...:whistling2:


Where would I get that from? It sounds pretty good! I have a coir block soaking at the moment, I'm going to leave that in for a few days, see how the ventilation is, if it stays damp for too long a few more holes will be in order. :lol2:


----------



## jaykickboxer (Feb 11, 2008)

vivalabam said:


> Where would I get that from? It sounds pretty good! I have a coir block soaking at the moment, I'm going to leave that in for a few days, see how the ventilation is, if it stays damp for too long a few more holes will be in order. :lol2:


u can buy insects and dendrosoil from dartfrog.co.UK or just go get some woodlice from the woods


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

jaykickboxer said:


> u can buy insects and dendrosoil from dartfrog.co.UK or just go get some woodlice from the woods


Wouldn't the frog eat them? It's only going to be a baby, as long as they still have that one in. They were being morons, they said I had to pick it up by Wednesday if I put a deposit down. I don't want to be rushed. :bash:

So what just pick up stuff from the woods and use that? I'd be worried about things that could kill it. 

Edit: Also what live plants can I use? I've seen people use them and they look so amazing. I'm going to stick one behind the flower pot, so he can't dig it up.


----------



## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

jaykickboxer said:


> u can buy insects and dendrosoil from dartfrog.co.UK or just go get some woodlice from the woods


Hey Jay! good to see you back, mate!


@Vivalabam: Yep, as he said, you can either buy or just collect. In the wood (usually a beech/sweet chesnut wood on the North Downs, for me), I sweep away the surface leaves and collect the partly broken-down stuff underneath. This has lots of useful beasties, some of which seem to manage the higher viv temps fine, and help clean up. Any larger ones provide the occasional snack, too!:2thumb: I mix this up roughly half-and-half with orchid bark. If you are planning plants in your final set-up, it's worth thinking about a drainage layer underneath (check out any number of threads on here and the Planted Viv section of Habitat), but for your initial tub set-up, you shouldn't need it.


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Ron Magpie said:


> Hey Jay! good to see you back, mate!
> 
> 
> @Vivalabam: Yep, as he said, you can either buy or just collect. In the wood (usually a beech/sweet chesnut wood on the North Downs, for me), I sweep away the surface leaves and collect the partly broken-down stuff underneath. This has lots of useful beasties, some of which seem to manage the higher viv temps fine, and help clean up. Any larger ones provide the occasional snack, too!:2thumb: I mix this up roughly half-and-half with orchid bark. If you are planning plants in your final set-up, it's worth thinking about a drainage layer underneath (check out any number of threads on here and the Planted Viv section of Habitat), but for your initial tub set-up, you shouldn't need it.


Yeah this is just a small basic set up to get me started, I don't want to make a really expensive massive tank to realise I'm rubbish at keeping frogs. :blush: Ok thanks I'll go and look at the planted section, I never knew that existed haha! I'll go look at my local park for those trees, we normally go fly hunting so it will give me something else to do. :lol2:

I think I have some orchid bark somewhere... The OH brought me some by accident, I can't use it for my spiders. I'll have to find out what he did with it.


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Iv have some aqua safe for goldfish which gets chlorine our of the water, would this be safe to use or should I get some proper amphibian stuff? 

Also if I leave the water for a few days, will this get rid of it on it's own? 

I used normal tap water to soak my eco block about 3 days ago, it's all set up, just checking it will be chlorine free by now. 

Also is there any brands of water I can buy from the shop which are ready to go now. 

There's so many conflicting ideas, I don't know what to do!


----------

