# Injured frog. Any suggestions?



## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Ok so about three days ago I heard a lot of squealing from the garden. Went out and the neighbours cat had a frog. Got the cat off the frog. When I got to the frog however its back legs were missing. He (can tell it’s a male as it has swollen nuptial pads) its got its back legs up to the knee (one is slightly above the knee) I stopped the bleeding and have put it in a cricket tub with damp kitchen towelling. It is eating wax worms by its self and is able to “walk” though it can “run” quite fast but only if it’s really scared as it would obviously be hurting. Before people say put it down! It’s not going to have a good quality of life and that stuff I have experience with similar injures with another frog in the past and the frog to me had a good life.
When I was six (about nine years ago when I was in my old home) there was a group of kids around this very small frog (like an inch or so) I had a look and saw they had some flint and had hacked off one if its back legs at the knee and was in the proses of hacking of the other (don’t ask me why their just evil in my mind) anyway I tried to stop them but they didn’t and one thing lead to another and we got in a fight. I managed to get the frog and run home with it. I stopped the bleeding and kept it on damp kitchen toweling. After a week it was not eating or healing so I assisted fed it a worm and forced a load of calcium powder down its throat. The next day I put a bit of food in and it ate it all. After about two weeks (once a week force feeding it calcium powder) it was all healed up and so I put it in a tank with no lid (it couldn’t hop out for obvious reasons) and it settled down. It could walk by its self, climb over small branches/rocks, swim (not very fast but could swim never less) and dig. He made himself a borrow and would come out every day for a walk about and a soak and to me seemed quite happy. Would eat anything I put in (crickets where hand fed but everything else he got himself)
He died two years ago when there was a minor gas leak which killed all of the small animals (amphibians and fish)
Does anyone else have any ideas/suggestions about this one? Its seemed to calm down and I was wondering whether to give it some calcium supplements or is it too soon and might get stressed out and die?
If he gets a bad infection that won’t clear up or his losses the ability to walk/use his back legs I will kill him quickly but I want to give it a good chance.
I’ll try to get some pics up though I don’t know if it will work properly.
cheers


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

the shorter side


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## Drayvan (Jul 7, 2010)

To be honest I'm not sure what to suggest, if he can move around still and has a decent chance of a good quality life then I say go for it. Right now though your main worry is infection, cats mouths carry a lot of bacteria and there's a good chance of it becoming infected. I suppose you'll have to balance keeping the wound clean and not stressing the poor thing. Silver sulfadiazine creams are popularly used with amphibians I believe, might help kill off any bacteria and help the wound heal, no guarentee it will work though but it's worth a try.


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

the longer side


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Drayvan said:


> To be honest I'm not sure what to suggest, if he can move around still and has a decent chance of a good quality life then I say go for it. Right now though your main worry is infection, cats mouths carry a lot of bacteria and there's a good chance of it becoming infected. I suppose you'll have to balance keeping the wound clean and not stressing the poor thing. Silver sulfadiazine creams are popularly used with amphibians I believe, might help kill off any bacteria and help the wound heal, no guarentee it will work though but it's worth a try.


 so it wont have any chemicals that could affect the thing?


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)




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## cobra148 (May 13, 2013)

I'm amazed that the little guy is still alive with such injuries. I can't offer any useful advice, but good luck with him.


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## Drayvan (Jul 7, 2010)

Not that I know of, it might be slightly irritating maybe. In all honesty I've never had to deal with an open wound in a phib before. I'm only going off what I've read on here and various books. Unfortunately there aren't many amphibian savvy vets around  although I believe baytril (quite a commonly prescribed antibiotic) can be used. There was quite a good discussion on here a while back about medication etc but irritatingly I can't find it! Edit, just seen the pics and I'm not sure how well the wounds will heal mind you what with the skin being taken so far back from the end of the muscle and bone


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

This is why i hate my neighbour’s cat. It think its owns the place it even has the cheek to urinate on our window and poo on the window ledge. but after what I did in the the frog incident it's never been back and when it sees me in the car park it runs for hills lol PS the cats all right/not injured


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Drayvan said:


> Not that I know of, it might be slightly irritating maybe. In all honesty I've never had to deal with an open wound in a phib before. I'm only going off what I've read on here and various books. Unfortunately there aren't many amphibian savvy vets around  although I believe baytril (quite a commonly prescribed antibiotic) can be used. There was quite a good discussion on here a while back about medication etc but irritatingly I can't find it! Edit, just seen the pics and I'm not sure how well the wounds will heal mind you what with the skin being taken so far back from the end of the muscle and bone


yeah that's my main concern. but still worth a shot. the other frog i talked about wounds where a lot worst. the skin was still attached but shredded up with chunks of bone in it. R.I.P Mr Stumpy (that was what I'm named him) too this day I don't know why those kids felt the need to do something so cruel and will probably never know. 
Thanks for the advice. I'll look into it more before trying it


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

he has just eaten two wax worms


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## Drayvan (Jul 7, 2010)

Kids can be cruel, it's human nature to some I guess  Good luck with the little chap though, sorry I couldn't be much more help. Eatings got to be a good sign though


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

if there is any news e.g. it die's, gets worst or if there are signs its healing i'll let you guys know


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

ouch! poor little guy 

no advice here but best of luck with him.

See if oscar has any suggestions!


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Cornish-J said:


> ouch! poor little guy
> 
> no advice here but best of luck with him.
> 
> See if oscar has any suggestions!


Who's Oscar?


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## Cornish-J (Sep 4, 2011)

....sorry


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Cornish-J said:


> image
> 
> ....sorry


 oh ok


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## marie_k (Apr 21, 2006)

I would get that poor thing to a vet immediately - I would hate to have had both my legs chewed off and not even be given any pain relief. Plus septicaemia following cat bite injuries is incredibly common and will lead to a slow and very unpleasant death.
Maire


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Could try an Iodine solution. I've had good results using it on wounds on monitor lizards. Check on the bottle though, as you know Amphibians cab be a lot more sensitive than lizards.
Personally if you can keep it infection free until it heals & also get the frog feeding by itself. I would keep it in captivity, dont think it would do well if released tbh, but will depend how mobile it is.

Good luck keep us updated.


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

I wonder if your best bet is talking to your local animal wildlife charity/hospital,phib vets are hard to find,but injuries like these must be seen at these places. This one for me is incredibly difficult,I care deeply about these guys,sometimes it's kinder to put them to sleep,sometimes,they do go on to lead a decent quality of life.The injuries are very severe,I'm concerned keeping him going is kindest for him. Mate, hard this one really hard,and I realise that this part of my post isn't what you want to hear,but you need to think of him. what ever choice you make,know that I admire you for trying to do what's best and for what you have done,very sad this

good luck

Stu


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

I don't know if there are any wildlife charity’s near where I live though from what I see (I do admire their dedication to these animals) If it can't be released then its put down straight away. I really don't want that as from my experience from the other one if he recovers he will have a good life in captivity as the only thing he won't be able to do is jump. And my other ones only jump if they are scared or if there is a branch or something they want to get to but can’t reach it from climbing. He is able to swim (not very fast) but can swim and not be panicking.
If it gets an infection (which he hasn’t at the moment) that won’t clear up or he losses the ability to use his back legs I will not hesitate to end his life. I have got the chopping board and knife in standby. I think a quick stab to the brain will do it though if there is a better way then let me know (though hopefully I won’t need to do it).
I will look into the iodine solution.
PS he has done a poo and the red is not so bright. And he has also eaten a meal worm by himself (its head was cut off just to be safe)


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Don't like the sound of the knife in brain myself (doubt the frog would either :lol2 
If you do need to euthanize it, give a vet a ring & explain situation. For the amount of drug required, hopefully they would do it foc.


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

johne.ev said:


> Don't like the sound of the knife in brain myself (doubt the frog would either :lol2
> If you do need to euthanize it, give a vet a ring & explain situation. For the amount of drug required, hopefully they would do it foc.


This will sound horrible but if I do need to euthanize it to get the vet to do it will be a bit expensive for something I found in the garden. Sounds harsh but its true. You see what I mean?


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Try Savlon antiseptic cream- I've had minor success with it with 'phibs before. It may not be enough, but worth a try.


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## miss_ferret (Feb 4, 2010)

give these a call, they're usually excellent with advice Welcome to Tiggywinkles Wildlife Hospital


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Ron Magpie said:


> Try Savlon antiseptic cream- I've had minor success with it with 'phibs before. It may not be enough, but worth a try.


I have put some on. He was quite calm which for putting it on was good. But it could potentially be a bad sign but still going to give him a chance. Is it once a day I should put it on or say once every two days? The red side is looking a lot better from yesterday.: victory:


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

That guy said:


> This will sound horrible but if I do need to euthanize it to get the vet to do it will be a bit expensive for something I found in the garden. Sounds harsh but its true. You see what I mean?


Of course, which is why i said phone & explain the situation. For the amount of drug it will req, to put the animal to sleep, maybe they'll do it for free. Got to be worth a phone call, at worst like miss ferret said, they might be able to advise best thing to do.

Regards the Savlon, i'd apply it at least once per day, maybe even twice a day.


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## soundstounite (Sep 6, 2009)

If you do have to euthinase alcohol is effective if blunt trauma is too hard for you
see here: Dart Den • View topic - Euthanasia for Amphibians

Stu


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

johne.ev said:


> Of course, which is why i said phone & explain the situation. For the amount of drug it will req, to put the animal to sleep, maybe they'll do it for free. Got to be worth a phone call, at worst like miss ferret said, they might be able to advise best thing to do.
> *
> Regards the Savlon, i'd apply it at least once per day, maybe even twice a day*.


Yep, and obviously keep the frog in as sterile conditions as you can manage till the wounds heal- if they do. I have to be honest, I've dealt with frogs after losing one limb successfully - but two at once may be too much. Well done for trying, though! :2thumb:


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## marie_k (Apr 21, 2006)

Vets will generally perform first aid on wildlife for free (this only applies to genuine wild casualties, not pet pigeons/long-term captives etc) so you should have no trouble finding a vet to assess it and give pain relief, though as already suggested above euthanasia (also classed as a first aid measure so no charge) may well be the kindest thing for this animal.


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## REDDEV1L (Nov 27, 2008)

Reminded me of http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/amphibians/685137-deformed-toad.html
A common toad found without back legs.
Obviously being a toad he wouldn't use his legs for jumping like a frog would but still.


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

update on frog. The really bad red side is now re growing muscle, looks cleaner. the other side looks cleaner two and looks like its re growing surface skin. I’ll try to get some photos for tomorrow


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

That guy said:


> update on frog. The really bad red side is now re growing muscle, looks cleaner. the other side looks cleaner two and looks like its re growing surface skin. I’ll try to get some photos for tomorrow


Looks as if your efforts may be paying off! :2thumb:


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## Meefloaf (Mar 24, 2013)

hoep the guy pulls through fella


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

as you can see skin and I think muscle is growing back over the bone.


bone still poking out but muscle is starting to grow down the leg


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Some of my friends said I should give him a name. The guys said Joe Swanson. One of my friends said Squishy (a girl said that one unsurprisingly) and another said Hopper. She said it would be funny as he can't jump lol. I'm just calling him stumpy frog and will only give him a name once/if he heals completely. But as it looks like he will should I go with Joe Swanson or Hopper? Or anyone got a better name?


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## Meefloaf (Mar 24, 2013)

robofrog


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Stumpy!


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## my_shed (Jan 5, 2011)

I think Oscar, r.e.the earlier posts that made me laugh so hard i nearly snotted!

Dave


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Any updates mate? How's it doing now?


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

johne.ev said:


> Any updates mate? How's it doing now?


I have left him alone for a good two days as the other day I went to put the savlon on him and ha panicked and ran. The stump that still has the knee on started to bleed. What it looks like is that muscle is growing around the knee cap which is very sensitive. I put some savlon on it about ten mins ago and that was enough to make it bleed a little. The other one looks really good though. The skin is slowly starting to spread down to the stump covering muscle. On both the flaps are healthy and have completely fused back to the legs. I’m going to do the other leg later today as he was getting stressed. He is constantly shedding his skin now. Is that a good thing? I also hand fed him two median black crickets this morning. He is losing a little weight though not to dramatically and he is eating by himself just needs someone to hold it in place before it runs away :lol2:


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Nice one mate, sounds to me like you've done a great job. If he's eating it can only be a good sign. Had to laugh regards the food running away though. Try him on some wax worms, should keep his weight up & even Stumpy should be able to catch them :lol2:


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

johne.ev said:


> Nice one mate, sounds to me like you've done a great job. If he's eating it can only be a good sign. Had to laugh regards the food running away though. Try him on some wax worms, should keep his weight up & even Stumpy should be able to catch them :lol2:


He was on wax worms but have ran out recently and haven't been able to get any yet. Planning on getting some for monday though


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## Raych (Mar 1, 2010)

Must have been fate that out of all the people's gardens for it to happen in, it happened in yours. I wish you the best of luck with this little fella and hope to hear he has a full recovery and lives just as well as the last frog who was lucky to have you.


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Something I am considering is if he does not get too stressed is a couple hours a day should I put a UV light above him? Would that help? My other ones (which are the same species) love to bask under the light. So i'm wondering if he does not get too stressed then would it help him? Cheers


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

Pics taken yesterday


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## That guy (Jul 22, 2013)

so was just reading through this again. I'm just amazed how well he has done. Remembering how unsure everyone (including me) was on if he would make it to now seeing him now makes me proud. Probably the first thing i have actuary been proud of.
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/amphibians/1004731-stumpy-his-new-home.html


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## johne.ev (Sep 14, 2008)

Fantastic job mate. Just read your thread & seen pics of him in his new home.
Definitely something to be proud about mate. Many people would have given up on him i suspect. :2thumb:


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