# Poop! Worms or mango fibres? *warning - pics!!*



## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

Splat (my male crestie) provided me with a nice big poop tonight but straight away I noticed 4 or 5 white string like things on it. Never seen anything like this before and my first thought was worms. However, on closer inspection the white things don't move and he also ate mango puree on Friday so I was thinking it was mango fibres rather than worms? I am taking the poop to the vets for testing tomorrow, but thought I'd post pics on here in the meantime. I opened the poop and there was nothing else inside it either.

This first pic I used the flash and you can clearly see several other smaller white strings on the poop.










The poop looks a lot like congealed mango puree, like when it sets in the viv.










This last pic is a close up of one of the 'things'.


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## Tombo46 (Aug 5, 2010)

I would say definitely worms. Doesn't look like fruit fibres to me! Let us know how you get on at the vets.


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## bothrops (Jan 7, 2007)

worms.


100%.


:2thumb:


Easy to treat. Take the sample to the vets (keep them wet/in water) and they will be able to give you the correct formula and dose (probably best mixed with baby food and 'hand fed' - if she'he is happy to do the 'licky off the finger' thing!


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## fardilis (Mar 22, 2011)

hiya
yep def worms m8 sorry


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## Jazzy B Bunny (Jun 21, 2007)

Looks like a pin worm?


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## trudib (Jul 24, 2011)

Without a doubt id say worms


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## sue59 (Oct 31, 2010)

If it were a human I would say worms, un I have seen a few sorry to say


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## gary1621 (Apr 28, 2009)

Oh no, poor Splat 

I hope the vet tells you otherwise *hug*


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## ectothermic (Jun 24, 2011)

without doubt 100% worms - visit to reptile vet...


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

I took the poop sample to the vet this morning and also emailed the photos and he called this afternoon to confirm that Splat does indeed have worms. Although the adult worms were no longer alive, the vet said he'd never seen so many worm eggs in such a small sample before. mg: 

Splat has been prescribed Panacur - one drop a week for 3 weeks followed by a repeat fecal test a week after that. I just hope my boy makes it through this ok. He is such a sweetie!

My question now is - how could he have got them in the first place? Buffie seems ok, but I will now get her poop checked to just to be sure. The only thing I can think of is both their vivs were second hand although I did clean them thoroughly before I used them.


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## Guest (Aug 16, 2011)

Miss Lily said:


> My question now is - how could he have got them in the first place? Buffie seems ok, but I will now get her poop checked to just to be sure. The only thing I can think of is both their vivs were second hand although I did clean them thoroughly before I used them.


They have most likely come in from another infected rep, or from livefood. Good on you for getting him treated asap


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## JamesJ (Apr 12, 2008)

Personally id worm Buffie with the panacure too. As for where it came from livefood maybe? Or transmitted off other animals youve been in contact with?

Edit: Oh and I probably dont need to tell you this but make sure your extra hot on gelling/washing your hands between handling the animals or you could pass it on to the chams etc


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## Ophexis (Feb 19, 2010)

James_and_Hana said:


> As for where it came from livefood maybe?


It's not unheard of! I've had a dodgy batch of crickets before... they weren't carrying worms, but they did make Panya feel a bit poo for a few days, she just wasn't her usual self and was acting a bit 'down'!


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## mikeeerogersss (Aug 4, 2011)

Miss Lily said:


> I took the poop sample to the vet this morning and also emailed the photos and he called this afternoon to confirm that Splat does indeed have worms. Although the adult worms were no longer alive, the vet said he'd never seen so many worm eggs in such a small sample before. mg:
> 
> Splat has been prescribed Panacur - one drop a week for 3 weeks followed by a repeat fecal test a week after that. I just hope my boy makes it through this ok. He is such a sweetie!
> 
> My question now is - how could he have got them in the first place? Buffie seems ok, but I will now get her poop checked to just to be sure. The only thing I can think of is both their vivs were second hand although I did clean them thoroughly before I used them.


just wondering mate, as im knew to this all, how expensive isit to visit the vets with ur lizards ? or are you insured ??? was just wondering would be good info to know


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## Charlottie (Oct 4, 2008)

Sorry to hear that your lizard has worms, but at least he is getting treatment for it. 
It might be odd for me to say this but the pickjs were interesting I have never seen worms before. So thanks for that, thankfully I wasn't having my tea ha. 
Hope your other lizard is okay to and that Splat makes a speedy recovery x


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

mikeeerogersss said:


> just wondering mate, as im knew to this all, how expensive isit to visit the vets with ur lizards ? or are you insured ??? was just wondering would be good info to know


Vets vary a great deal in what they charge. There are things that aren't covered with insurances - I have never bothered apart from the kitten as she was a bit mental! Generally my new vet isn't too bad - a small bottle of Panacur and a syringe cost me £6.52. I have had xrays taken of my male cham and taht came to about £100 iirc.



Charlottie said:


> Sorry to hear that your lizard has worms, but at least he is getting treatment for it.
> It might be odd for me to say this but the pickjs were interesting I have never seen worms before. So thanks for that, thankfully I wasn't having my tea ha.
> Hope your other lizard is okay to and that Splat makes a speedy recovery x


I had never seen any worms before either, but I just knew instantly deep down what they were. They weren't even moving either - you would think they would be squirming but they didn't move at all, that's why I thought that maybe they were mango fibres! Sadly not though. Those photos are zoomed in and cropped - the worms are quite small, but not that small in comparison to the size of the poop (if you see what I mean). They are obviously adults - the eggs can be sen under a microscope and not the naked eye.


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## Charlottie (Oct 4, 2008)

Yes I can understand what you mean! I would have thought that they would be moving around to. Well keep us updated on how your lizards are doing.


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## CornSnakeLover (Mar 8, 2008)

I was about to say "Its probally fruit pieces - You dont tend to see worms in stools" 

Thats before I saw the photos. The photos defo look like some type of worm within the stools and nothing like fruit pieces within the poo. 

Hows the reptile(s) been in general - healthy ? Weight loss? Eating fine ?

Defo get some samples done and than a vet trip for the treatment. As far as i know worms is easy to cure, good luck and let us know how it goes


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## bothrops (Jan 7, 2007)

CornSnakeLover said:


> I was about to say "Its probally fruit pieces - You dont tend to see worms in stools"
> 
> Thats before I saw the photos. The photos defo look like some type of worm within the stools and nothing like fruit pieces within the poo.
> 
> ...


I take it you posted without actually reading the thread? :whistling2:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

CornSnakeLover said:


> I was about to say "Its probally fruit pieces - You dont tend to see worms in stools"
> 
> Thats before I saw the photos. The photos defo look like some type of worm within the stools and nothing like fruit pieces within the poo.
> 
> ...


My post - post #10 states that worms have been confirmed and Splat has started his treatment last night!


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## CornSnakeLover (Mar 8, 2008)

Oh thats good news... sorry skiped a few. What treatment is the crestie on ?
and did you have any idea where they came from ?


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## jmack (Jul 6, 2011)

Miss Lily said:


> Vets vary a great deal in what they charge. There are things that aren't covered with insurances - I have never bothered apart from the kitten as she was a bit mental! Generally my new vet isn't too bad - a small bottle of Panacur and a syringe cost me £6.52. I have had xrays taken of my male cham and taht came to about £100 iirc.
> 
> 
> I had never seen any worms before either, but I just knew instantly deep down what they were. They weren't even moving either - you would think they would be squirming but they didn't move at all, that's why I thought that maybe they were mango fibres! Sadly not though. Those photos are zoomed in and cropped - the worms are quite small, but not that small in comparison to the size of the poop (if you see what I mean). They are obviously adults - the eggs can be sen under a microscope and not the naked eye.


the reason they arent moving is that only dead ones or pieces of live ones and eggs poo out, the live ones stay inside(used to work for a vet) if the animal is pooing live ones its almost overflowing with worms.

good for catching that as lots might not, and good luck on the treatment:no1:
cheers


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Im surprised no one has mentioned environmental cleaning. It is necessary to completely strip and disinfect the animals enclosure daily to eradicate eggs or the gecko will simply reinfect itself. Panacur alone will not fix the problem.

For the worms to have come from livefood the crix etc would have had to have munched on infested poops. Pinworm have a direct life cycle and do not colonise an intermediary host.


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## Mozart (Jan 10, 2011)

Mal said:


> Im surprised no one has mentioned environmental cleaning. It is necessary to completely strip and disinfect the animals enclosure daily to eradicate eggs or the gecko will simply reinfect itself. Panacur alone will not fix the problem.
> 
> For the worms to have come from livefood the crix etc would have had to have munched on infested poops. Pinworm have a direct life cycle and do not colonise an intermediary host.


Beat me to it!!

Sound bit of advise there!


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## Sweetcorn (Aug 2, 2008)

Mal said:


> Im surprised no one has mentioned environmental cleaning. It is necessary to completely strip and disinfect the animals enclosure daily to eradicate eggs or the gecko will simply reinfect itself. Panacur alone will not fix the problem.
> 
> For the worms to have come from livefood the crix etc would have had to have munched on infested poops. Pinworm have a direct life cycle and do not colonise an intermediary host.


I have spoken to Tiff about this Mal via pm so she is aware of the cleaning that needs to be done and also advised to keep his set up as simple as possible until he is all clear.


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Sweetcorn said:


> I have spoken to Tiff about this Mal via pm so she is aware of the cleaning that needs to be done and also advised to keep his set up as simple as possible until he is all clear.


Great stuff. I would have hated for her to go to all the effort and put the little critter through the rigours of panacur only to find that it hadnt worked because the need for disinfecting had been missed. Im sure with your advice, Tiffs diligence and a healthy dose of panacur the little crestie will soon be back in full health. Pinworm etc sounds like a nightmare problem and really puts the heebijeebes in some people. In reality, its a simple (but very significant)problem to manage especially if tackled early. Good luck with things Tiff, Im sure all will be fine.


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## Omerov1986 (Feb 11, 2009)

EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!

good luck.


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

A few things I would like to add - firstly I didn't know that only dead worms and eggs are passed. I have some f10 on order and also some Avipro. Could I use a sterilising solution in the meantime? He had his first dose last night.

I also discovered earlier this evening that Buffie now has worms in her poop too although not so many as Splat. She has been given treatment in her food too - Panacur is what the vet gave me. As for where they came from I have absolutely no idea. I hand fed each and every locust or cricket in a separate faunarium - I never leave any live food in any of my vivs. 

I am feeling quite overwhelmed by all this tonight. Do I have to clean both vivs every day? I won't be able to get their branches and logs, etc dry every night! How on earth do you tackle something like this? I have never encountered worms before - it all seems a bit much to take in so suddenly. I want to replace their vines and coconut hides, etc, but do I chuck those things out now and buy new then chuck it all out again and replace when they are clear of worms? How difficult is it to eradicate these things? Can anyone else share their stories please?


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

I will try to reply properly later when I get on the comp. For now though Im afraid yes you need to disinfect everything. The geckos get the eggs on their feet and body and spread them all over the viv. Then with a flick of their tongue reingest them. Im afraid everything needs stripping out and disinfecting. While treatment is in progress use an absolute minimal amount of decor and furnishings. Kitchrn roll as substrate. F10 is superb. You can however boil some bits, bake wood etc to kill the eggs. If you can get your hands on a steam cleaner they are very effective. Im afraid there are no shortcuts to this. When you see the threads ehere peoples geckos have worms again several weeks after treatment it is likely to be because all the eggs in the viv / tank hadnt been eradicated in the first instance. I dont know the size of your geckos but would it be worth putting them in lightly furnished faunariums during the treatment period.

One thing I would like to stress is that your geckos having pinworm does not make you a bad keeper or one with low standard of care and hygiene. Thousands of geckos have pinworm. Its just that they havent been detected and at low levels tend not to.harm or stress the gecko. Please dont panic or blame yourself over this. Your doing all the right things, have been very quick in getting treatment. Your geckos will be fine. Sorry about typos. Thumb typed on my phone.


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## jmack (Jul 6, 2011)

Mal said:


> I will try to reply properly later when I get on the comp. For now though Im afraid yes you need to disinfect everything. The geckos get the eggs on their feet and body and spread them all over the viv. Then with a flick of their tongue reingest them. Im afraid everything needs stripping out and disinfecting. While treatment is in progress use an absolute minimal amount of decor and furnishings. Kitchrn roll as substrate. F10 is superb. You can however boil some bits, bake wood etc to kill the eggs. If you can get your hands on a steam cleaner they are very effective. Im afraid there are no shortcuts to this. When you see the threads ehere peoples geckos have worms again several weeks after treatment it is likely to be because all the eggs in the viv / tank hadnt been eradicated in the first instance. I dont know the size of your geckos but would it be worth putting them in lightly furnished faunariums during the treatment period.
> 
> One thing I would like to stress is that your geckos having pinworm does not make you a bad keeper or one with low standard of care and hygiene. Thousands of geckos have pinworm. Its just that they havent been detected and at low levels tend not to.harm or stress the gecko. Please dont panic or blame yourself over this. Your doing all the right things, have been very quick in getting treatment. Your geckos will be fine. Sorry about typos. Thumb typed on my phone.


^^^ this x2:no1:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

Thanks for all the support and advice! I was on holiday last week and came back to what must be one of the busiest weeks ever in my job, so this couldn't have come at a worse time for me! But, these things can't really be planed for unfortunately, and now both geckos have worms I have to go out and replace all their stuff as I'd rather buy new for when they are better. I am going to buy them one new set of plastic leaves for their faunariums for now so that I can clean every day. 

I am having a tough time trying to get hold of the larger fauns. though so I may have to get rubs and hot glue mesh to the lids. Am off to B&Q this evening to see what I can get. At least rubs will be easier to move about to clean thoroughly than the exos that they are currently in. f10 has been ordered and should be here tomorrow so everything will get bleached tonight for now. It would've been so much easier if this had all happened last week! :devil:


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## tinyfish (Nov 11, 2008)

I've seen some nice large and very reasonably priced faunariums on ebay here PLASTIC FISH REPTILE INSECT TANK VIVARIUM NURSERY CAGE | eBay. 

Re. the disinfectant, apparently F10 won't kill pinworm eggs, but a 10% bleach solution should do the trick. 

Good luck with the treatment! :2thumb:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

Well, after much trouble finding a large faunarium - 5 shops I went to didn't have any - had sold out just a couple of days ago and wouldn't be getting any more in until next week! Not much good when I need something now! I ended up buying a 35l rub in Staples and drilling loads of holes in the sides and lids. After much cleaning both geckos are now in their temporary sparsely decorated homes. Seconds after putting Buffie into hers, she did the biggest poop I have ever seen her do so I had to replace the paper towel!:devil:


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## jmack (Jul 6, 2011)

Miss Lily said:


> Well, after much trouble finding a large faunarium - 5 shops I went to didn't have any - had sold out just a couple of days ago and wouldn't be getting any more in until next week! Not much good when I need something now! I ended up buying a 35l rub in Staples and drilling loads of holes in the sides and lids. After much cleaning both geckos are now in their temporary sparsely decorated homes. Seconds after putting Buffie into hers, she did the biggest poop I have ever seen her do so I had to replace the paper towel!:devil:


they like pooing in nice clean new places :lol2:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

Remembered I have a steam cleaner in the cupboard - it's been in there for years and never used! I shall arm myself with that later I think!:2thumb:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

Well, things didn't go to plan - I unboxed the previously unused steamer only to find that it didn't actually work!:devil: So, the cleaner paid a visit to my brother who was able to fix it so at least now I can steam clean the coconut hides, cork bark, vines and backgrounds over the weekend.

Both cresties have now had two doses of Panacur and I am still seeing worms in their poop. Both seemed to have passed a larger almost clot like lump too, which I presume is a bundle of dead worms! It's quite gross! Bleach cleaning everything every night is a pain the the proverbial, but hopefully I only have two weeks left with that! On the plus side, they both are not phased by being in smaller temporary homes, in fact we can see them better now and I do so love to see them curled up fast asleep in their plastic pipes!:flrt:


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## LuLu (Aug 13, 2011)

*Glad to hear everything is falling back into place and both geckos and on their way to being worm-free again!  x*


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## jmack (Jul 6, 2011)

glad they arent too stressed out or anything, and fingers crossed for the little ones:no1:


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

I really hope so - I am glad I only have two or I would spend all night cleaning - it takes an hour just to bleach and disinfect two small vivs and their plants, vines and tubes, lol! I just hope I can get rid of those damn worms and get back to normal so I can play with them every night rather than just plonk them in a new clean house every evening! Having never battled worms before I was unaware at how time consuming it is!


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

*Bit of an update!*

Splat did a couple of runny poops the other day after his third treatment and Buffie's was a bit wetter than normal too, but I haven't seen any worms in their last poops so I am really hoping that we have managed to get rid of them! Fecal tests are due again the end of the week or early next week so I guess we will know for sure after that! It will certainly be nice to spend more time playing with them rather than cleaning the viv in the bath every night, especially as Buffie has decided it's much more fun to climb up my arm than go back in her tank! :lol2:!


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## JamesJ (Apr 12, 2008)

I hope the next test show up clear for you!

I think id have to give up work if my lot got worms :O taking into account how much time its taking up if yours with just 2


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

I have the cleaning into a routine now and it only takes about an hour each evening. I bought two spare vivs so I can rotate them rather than pu my babies into a cricket tub while I clean them. I often wonder how people with a huge collection of cresties cope with an infestation of worms! 

They have a small plastic fish tank each into which I put one bendy vine and a plastic tube and a plastic plant each. Everything gets soaked in bleach dilute, rinsed well, sprayed with f10 and rinsed again then dried. I can't wait for those tests to come back negative! I am also not giving them livefood any more just in case the worms came from the crickets.

The cats have also been wormed again as someone suggested that they could have picked worms up from the soft furnishings too, so now the cresties aren't allowed on the sofa any more either and definitly not on the floor!


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## kirsten (Jan 13, 2008)

Miss Lily said:


> I have the cleaning into a routine now and it only takes about an hour each evening. I bought two spare vivs so I can rotate them rather than pu my babies into a cricket tub while I clean them. I often wonder how people with a huge collection of cresties cope with an infestation of worms!
> 
> They have a small plastic fish tank each into which I put one bendy vine and a plastic tube and a plastic plant each. Everything gets soaked in bleach dilute, rinsed well, sprayed with f10 and rinsed again then dried. I can't wait for those tests to come back negative! I am also not giving them livefood any more just in case the worms came from the crickets.
> 
> The cats have also been wormed again as someone suggested that they could have picked worms up from the soft furnishings too, so now the cresties aren't allowed on the sofa any more either and definitly not on the floor!


you don't need to rinse the f10 off, if i understand it right, it's more effective if you leave it on, and it doesn't harm your animals, as it can be used as a nebuliser to treat respiritory infections.


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

I will leave it to dry from now on then. Used to treat respiritory infections? That stuff sets my asthma off every night when I spray it!:devil:


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## kirsten (Jan 13, 2008)

there are lots of different ones, and some aren't suitable for that use, but the one i have is non-toxic, non-irritant, biodegradable, and i know snake keepers use f10 to treat snake ri's as it's an antibiotic, anti-fungal and anti viral.


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Unless your livefood is food that has been recycled after being uneaten in an infected viv the worms did not come from your livefood. The worms dont have an intermediary host. Good luck with things. You have gone to great efforts to get your cresties well and Im sure their repeat samples will be clear.


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

What sort of worms are they? How do the cresties get them then? I would like to know as much as I can to take steps so they don't get them again! Maybe it was just 'one of those things' but I would still like to know if there are any answers!


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## kirsten (Jan 13, 2008)

Miss Lily said:


> What sort of worms are they? How do the cresties get them then? I would like to know as much as I can to take steps so they don't get them again! Maybe it was just 'one of those things' but I would still like to know if there are any answers!



how long have you had them? it could be that they had worms when you bought them, but it is only now that it has been brought to your attention.


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## Miss Lily (Oct 3, 2008)

I have had Splat for a year and Buffie since January. I would have thought I'd have seen the worms before now, plus the vet said he's never seen so many worm eggs in such a small sample before when he looked at Splat's under the microscope. They always got live food in a separate empty faunarium as I never leave any live food in with any of my lizards.


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

I strongly suspect your cresties will have had low level nematodes for a longtime and possibly before they came to you. Many many reptiles have worms and go forr years without them becoming evident. It is thought by some that they are a natural part of the gut flora in wild reps. Often captive reps dont show any symptoms or come to any harm until something occurs to tip the balance allowing the worms to get the upperhand. It is only then that you begin to see the evidence as in the OPs animals. This is by no means a negative reflection on the OPs standard of husbandry. In fact the reason they have taken o long to get the upperhand is probably because the cresties have received the highest standards of care.


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