# Mantis dying?



## fiona_951

I KNOW THIS IS LONG BUT PLEASE READ IT. I DESPERATELY NEED ADVICE.

Okay, so this is my first little mantis but I fell completely in love with him and i'm so upset because it seems that he is dying even though he is really young.

I'm not sure though as i've never witnessed it before so if someone could give me a sort of, yes or no or even advice on what to do?

So, I checked him earlier, he didn't seem well, got him out to try and feed him, definitely wasn't well. He was shaking violently and then suddenly lifted his arms up and them brought his arms and legs all in, tightly and fell over. He got back up, did this again a few more times. Obviously I was panicking, didn't know what to do for him at all so I tried to give him water and food and nothing. He did it one final time and then didn't move, so I put him in a cricket box and left him, JUST IN CASE, and unfortunately hate to go to work =(

I then got back from work and my little Strad is STILL ALIVE. He had moved, and had positioned himself in a sort of weak standing up position but with his head drooping. I got him out again, he clung on to my finger for me to lift him out and he sort of stumbled around on my hand a bit. I gave him water off my finger, and tried giving him baby (I literally had no idea what to do, I was just shocked he was still with me). He seemed to take the baby food and the water. Wouldn't try the cricket though, i'm guessing through lack of energy?

So, now, i've left him in the cricket box, on dry towel, on top of slightly damp towel so it is moist, on top of a vivarium so he gets the heat from the lights. I have left the cricket box open so it doesn't get too hot or too humid.

He is still trying to stand up although he looks completely weak and he keeps dropping his head. There is no obvious damage to him, apart from one of his feet which he chewed off himself a while ago and continued on with without it being a problem.

I don't know if he is dying? Or what? But what should I do? Is there any other way I can help him?

Please help?


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## vivalabam

Is he an adult or a nymph? 

If he is a nymph it could have been a possible moult, the way you describe the head makes me think that... 

Or if he is an adult, chances are he is coming to the end of his life, they don't last long, couple of months tops.


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## KWIBEZEE

*illnesses...*

Either it is half starved or on its way out. I have had a couple of 'tids that have suddenly got the 'shakes' and subsequently died. I would avoid feeding crickets constantly and offer a wider range of prey items next time you wish to keep a mantid. It could be poisoned and I am asking if you use perfumes or any chemical spray - both will have a toxic shock effect and lead to fatality most probably. What species is it and when did it last ecdyse?


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## Crab Man

KWIBEZEE said:


> Either it is half starved or on its way out. I have had a couple of 'tids that have suddenly got the 'shakes' and subsequently died. I would avoid feeding crickets constantly and offer a wider range of prey items next time you wish to keep a mantid. It could be poisoned and I am asking if you use perfumes or any chemical spray - both will have a toxic shock effect and lead to fatality most probably. *What species is it *and when did it last ecdyse?


Going by the name of the mantid, Strad, it sounds like it could be a Gongylus...In that case a switch should be made to flying prey, fruit flies followed by greenbottles and bluebottles. When I first had Gongys they did not take crickets whatsoever, no matter what I did to try and persuade them...
But yeah, we need to know what age the mantis is. As bam said it could be an oncoming ecdyse, or it could just be that "shit happens" situation most mantid keepers will encounter when their animal decides to shuffle off for no apparent reason


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## vivalabam

KWIBEZEE said:


> Either it is half starved or on its way out. I have had a couple of 'tids that have suddenly got the 'shakes' and subsequently died. I would avoid feeding crickets constantly and offer a wider range of prey items next time you wish to keep a mantid. It could be poisoned and I am asking if you use perfumes or any chemical spray - both will have a toxic shock effect and lead to fatality most probably. What species is it and when did it last ecdyse?


Well noted, I didn't think or perfumes or sprays, I never use any these days it's all roll on so I forget. :lol2:


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## fiona_951

Thank you both.

He is young, a nymph, I believe only 1st instar? He's no bigger than about an inch.

He hasn't shed since I had him, which must been for about almost 2 months?

He eats tiny crickets every other day, when he wants them although he's never really been interested? How often should they really be eating? He eats waxworms occasionally as well. He also eats dead fruit flies if I give them to him with tweezers. He also once had a TINY piece of ham... Haha I sprayed the cage every other day as well and it sits on top of a vivarium for heat. Please don't tell me i've done it wrong? =( Because I love this little guy and I would hate for it to be my fault... =(

Recently he didn't eat as much so perhaps starvation? 

I have birds as well so all deoderants, perfumes etc are sprayed outside of my room away from the animals. Unless of course they can still be poisoned by just wearing perfumes around them? Because I have worn perfume in the morning and then came back in the evening and held him, could that have happened? Although, it's shown no effect on him before?


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## fiona_951

I'm not sure if Gongys is the scientific name but he is a Voilin Mantid. Haha Yes, Strad as in Stradivarius violins. The best violins made. I love my little man...


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## vivalabam

fiona_951 said:


> Thank you both.
> 
> He is young, a nymph, I believe only 1st instar? He's no bigger than about an inch.
> 
> He hasn't shed since I had him, which must been for about almost 2 months?
> 
> He eats tiny crickets every other day, when he wants them although he's never really been interested? How often should they really be eating? He eats waxworms occasionally as well. He also eats dead fruit flies if I give them to him with tweezers. He also once had a TINY piece of ham... Haha I sprayed the cage every other day as well and it sits on top of a vivarium for heat. Please don't tell me i've done it wrong? =( Because I love this little guy and I would hate for it to be my fault... =(
> 
> Recently he didn't eat as much so perhaps starvation?
> 
> I have birds as well so all deoderants, perfumes etc are sprayed outside of my room away from the animals. Unless of course they can still be poisoned by just wearing perfumes around them? Because I have worn perfume in the morning and then came back in the evening and held him, could that have happened? Although, it's shown no effect on him before?


It does just sometimes happen with young nymphs, although it could be too hot for him. All mine live at room temp fine, they generally don't need extra heat. 

Also the cricket thing could be an issue, you haven't said what species it is but some only do well on flying food. 

It could be a possible moult, and you got worried and moved him instead of leaving him, although I'm not sure. 

There's so many possibilities. :whistling2:


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## fiona_951

Hm... I guess so... I regret moving him now... Maybe I should have just left him... I'm leaving him to it now but I honestly don't think he is going to pull through this =( Is there anything I should try and feed him? Or like, anything to make dying easier?... Ugh. I know how horrible that sounds...


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## vivalabam

fiona_951 said:


> Hm... I guess so... I regret moving him now... Maybe I should have just left him... I'm leaving him to it now but I honestly don't think he is going to pull through this =( Is there anything I should try and feed him? Or like, anything to make dying easier?... Ugh. I know how horrible that sounds...


I'd just leave him for tonight, then possibly try feeding in a day or two if he is still alive. I thought mine was dead once, it was on the floor, I picked it up, barely alive, had it out for a bit then put it back, mouled that night and has been fine ever since, she is now an adult and produced 2 ooths for me. :lol2:


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## fiona_951

Well, yea, I guess, there isn't much I can do so I will just leave him for now and see how he is tomorrow... Should I leave him somewhere hot or cool?

Thanks everyone.


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## vivalabam

I'd move him away from the vivs, just normal room temp should be ok.


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## fiona_951

So, he's still alive, literally only just, shaking occasionally and his bum moving very little. I'm assuming though at this point there literally is nothing I can do for him and i'm basically just waiting for him to pass? Am I right? Poor little thing...

I think maybe next time, if I do even consider getting another one, i'll go for a slightly more hardy species =(


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