# Herpetological Expeditions



## Dave-Flames (Sep 20, 2006)

Posting this on behalf of a friend that runs these..

Take a look..

Herpetological Holidays


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## rob-stl-07 (Jun 3, 2007)

one of these in a different place wasnt ther? or was it moved?


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

rob-stl-07 said:


> one of these in a different place wasnt ther? or was it moved?


it got locked cos morons spoilt it.


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## slippery42 (Mar 23, 2008)

*Herp expeditions*

Or people could organise their own herping field trips!!!!!!!!!

Save a lot of money and have just as much fun!!!!


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## Zeeman (Aug 15, 2008)

would be interesting..educational:2thumb:


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## spend_day (Apr 10, 2008)

i have a question whats the difference between one of these tours and going out there are hireing a tracker for a few days.


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

spend_day said:


> i have a question whats the difference between one of these tours and going out there are hireing a tracker for a few days.


what the differance between going to a travel agent and getting your own flights hotel etc.


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## spend_day (Apr 10, 2008)

cooljules said:


> what the differance between going to a travel agent and getting your own flights hotel etc.



 oh so its a convenience thing. i was wondering if u got anything more like better informed guides or something. as far as im aware in alot of places u can hire a tracker to help u find the animals u wanna see for a decent price but the info u get is basically here's the snake/lizard/whateva u wanted too see. do the guides on these tours provide extra info or is it a similar affair


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## mantella (Sep 2, 2007)

cooljules said:


> it got locked cos morons spoilt it.


 
Morons spling it ?

I was telling people they could save a hell of a lot of money if they just went and did it themselfs. Going with companies like this you don't get much freedom to do what you want, for example useing your own techniques. 

Your merely following other people about.


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

spend_day said:


> oh so its a convenience thing. i was wondering if u got anything more like better informed guides or something. as far as im aware in alot of places u can hire a tracker to help u find the animals u wanna see for a decent price but the info u get is basically here's the snake/lizard/whateva u wanted too see. do the guides on these tours provide extra info or is it a similar affair


well if i wanted to goto somewhere in the jungle looking for exotics, would rather get it well planned beforehand than get a flight with a tent and go into the jungle and trying to find a tracker that way (god i loved those snack bars in the 80's)

the same can be said for prices in rep shops..computer stores...always get cheaper but some want some form of reasurance


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## spend_day (Apr 10, 2008)

cooljules said:


> well if i wanted to goto somewhere in the jungle looking for exotics, would rather get it well planned beforehand than get a flight with a tent and go into the jungle and trying to find a tracker that way (god i loved those snack bars in the 80's)
> 
> the same can be said for prices in rep shops..computer stores...always get cheaper but some want some form of reasurance



yeah i see what u mean i was just curious and i can see why people go for thing like this and i can see why some people would prefer to go it alone so to speak. me personally i would rather do a conservation holiday its hard work but u get to see these animals and do some good at the same time.


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## Matt Harris (Aug 21, 2007)

An experienced guide can make a herping trip much more productive, not to mention safer.

Even in fairly pristine rainforest you don't just walk in and start seeing monkeys, big cats, reptiles etc etc dancing around your feet; it takes knowledge and experience to spot these things.

Hiring a local guide can be fraught with difficulty - what's to stop them taking you to a remote location and chopping you up and stealing your stuff?

In many countries, you can't just get off a bus and go wandering around the counryside. If you're out and about in a foreign country you will often need a good reason to explain what you're doing there; 'looking for lizards' just won't cut it. Certainly countries in Africa are very protective of their sovereignty and you need may need permits to access certain areas or to catch certain species. Again, an experienced guide should be aware of local regulations, safe/unsafe areas etc.

Overall, certainly for the first few trips to a place, you're better off going with a guide.


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## slippery42 (Mar 23, 2008)

Matt Harris said:


> An experienced guide can make a herping trip much more productive, not to mention safer.
> 
> Even in fairly pristine rainforest you don't just walk in and start seeing monkeys, big cats, reptiles etc etc dancing around your feet; it takes knowledge and experience to spot these things.
> 
> ...


*With this fangled new idea called the web you can apparently do lots of research, get cheap flights, cheap hotels and lodges and even book a guide in Jonny foreigners own country!!!!

Doing it this way two or three herpers may even be able to see lots of animals in comfort without having to crowd round and wait for a gap in the crowd!!!

And your money goes right to the guide, local hotels etc!!!!

B*gger me that sounds simple........might even have to try it!!!!

Oh Shoot I've done it a few times...:2thumb::2thumb::2thumb:*


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## arachnopus (Jan 13, 2007)

*Hi People (Herp Trips)*

Hi people, 

I organise herpetological expeditions and if anyone would like to learn more about my trips and read the positive feedback from people who have been on them - then check out the link below:

http://www.partnershiptravel.co.uk/Herpetological_Holidays.aspx

I myself am a lifelong herper and after reading the posts above would like to make the following points about the benefits of going on a preorganised herping expedition.

- First and foremost - Safety of everyone is our top priority, sure anyone can book a flight then go off in a jungle somewhere - but what happens when something goes wrong? like you get bitten for example?
We travel with antivenom, additional medical supplies and a fully qualified wilderness medic, in the event of any problems, there are contingency measures in place and you will be well looked after. 
if we visit very remote regions we may take satelite phones with us and can call on a helicopter medivac if needs be in extreme circumstances - otherwise, offices in London & India are aware of our location and movements and we travel with a support team ready to deal with emergencies.

- Furthermore, the itineraries we devise entail a great deal of prior research and preparation and the locations are selected primarily for their richness in herps as well as relative proximity to medical facilities.

- You therefore get a trip where you encounter a great diversity of not just herps - but all sorts of wildlife and also habitats - which make for a much more rewarding experience.

- Believe me - guides can vary in their quality - i began devising these trips because most of the commercial trips i have been on did not live up to my expectations. The specialists on our tours are the very best herpetologists & naturalists in India today - people like Gerry Martin & Romulus Whitaker, Sandesh Kadur and many more talented individuals - including members of the snake tracking tribe - the Irulas. This means you learn so much more than if you were to go off on your own, everything from identifying almost imperceptible snake tracks to peculiar behaviours of certain species. I collaborate with the very best people around so as to create the most rewarding expeditions that I can (where you also find much more than if you go off on your own)

- These expeditions contribute directly to herpetological research and conservation - from the fees we pay to institutions like the Madras Croc Bank, the Agumbe Rainforest Research Station, the Gharial Conservation Alliance and also from the private donations of clients who feel they wish to contribute more.

- Then there is convenience - we take care of absolutely everything - from flights, to transfers to providing all your meals - all you have to focus on - is the herping!

- Finally - you get to meet the individuals at the forefront of pioneering herpetological research and conservation and you travel with like minded people who share your passion.

Devising these trips is the culmination of a lifelong passion for reptiles and wildlife, I am not just some random tour operator thats wants to cash in - if it was about the money i would do a different job - Im someone who has spent my whole life involved with wildlife and believe that responsible wildlife tourism - managed effectively - can be a positive force for conserving endangered species and habitats.

If anyone has any questions about any aspect of these trips then please get in touch and i will be happy to chat.

Paul Greig Smith
[email protected]
Mob: 078886 99537
Partnership Travel
0208 347 40 20
[email protected]


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## STReptiles (Feb 6, 2009)

doing it on your own the chances of finding a good amount of reps is pretty slim, you might see the odd gecko up in a tree for a few seconds. Much better to go with someone who knows the area well and knows what they are doing i think...


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## Azemiops (May 1, 2008)

STReptiles said:


> doing it on your own the chances of finding a good amount of reps is pretty slim, you might see the odd gecko up in a tree for a few seconds. Much better to go with someone who knows the area well and knows what they are doing i think...


 
Complete nonsense, ive been going out on self organised trips to Asia for the past 5 years, where we literally book nothing but the flights, and have found absolutely loads of species.


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## STReptiles (Feb 6, 2009)

lucky you.


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

Azemiops said:


> Complete nonsense, ive been going out on self organised trips to Asia for the past 5 years, where we literally book nothing but the flights, and have found absolutely loads of species.


You forgot to mention u went to a zoo


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## Azemiops (May 1, 2008)

Owzy said:


> You forgot to mention u went to a zoo


 
I went to many zoos whilst out there, they are interesting places to visit whilst travelling around. However, this has nothing to do with the fact that i have caught many species of reptile and amphibian whilst out on 'self-organised' trips.

Feel free to check out this page regarding a few of my trips:

Welcome to Tom Charlton's adventure


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## Azemiops (May 1, 2008)

STReptiles said:


> lucky you.


 
I do feel lucky. Youve clearly not gone out on a herping trip by yourself, or if you have, then youve been looking in totally the wrong places if youve only seen geckos running up trees.


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## Aquai (Feb 11, 2009)

We'll see who's laughing when you get bit


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## pythondave82 (Nov 14, 2007)

Aquai said:


> We'll see who's laughing when you get bit


 
It comes as no surprise that yet again another know it all takes pole position in the RFUK numpty parade.

What is it with you; Tom has been travelling for years around the world, working with venomous snakes from every continent they can be found, what kind of negative comment was that?

Obviously you are viewing the DWA section because you display interests in this field, have you not thought that instead of posting such worthless comments and maybe discussing your views in a more professional way, you may actually come away with a little more knowledge on the subject in question?

Yes he, I or anybody else can be bitten, and your point is? (I guess travelling with an organised trip would prevent a bite when/if you actually find a venomous snake – or is it a strictly hands off experience?)

Because of threads like this, the majority of experienced venomous keepers rarely post on this forum anymore; it’s such a shame because RFUK is the UK’s busiest forum.


Lets al try to get along, we all pee in the same bucket, don’t we?


Dave


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## stuartdouglas (Mar 5, 2008)

Well said Dave, I wonder if the mods can put some sort of IQ filter on this section, maybe prevent those who snuck into the gene pool when the lifeguard wasn't looking from sneaking in here too


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## Mememe (Feb 15, 2009)

TBH, both methods have their advantages.

On your own, you get to choose when and what to look for, where to go, and how much it costs. You choose who you go with. Most of all, you get the satisfaction of doing it yourself.

On the other hand, your personal safety is potentially reduced, and it is harder to spot some animals with less pairs of eyes/local guides (anyone can go road cruising or trampling through the forest, but sometimes locals will know of particular areas for certain species - even certain sets tree trunks you would walk past unless you knew that there was a high concentration of Uroplatus there). Then again, in one area I visited, of six snakes found over two days, NONE were spotted by our local guide.

Overall, do it yourself and you may well enjoy it more, but may well strike out too. I find it encouraging that these kinds of trips are being offered now, it can only be a good thing for herping!


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## wildlifewarrior (Jun 26, 2008)

Well said mate. 
i think he needs to learn some manners,respect and maybe be abit mature

I wouldnt worry to much about that aquai anyway

look at his sig.


> _Reptiles/Herps;_
> 1.0.0 Black/White Argentine Tegu, *1.1.0 Bob Clark Royals*, 0.1.0 Albino Burm, 1.0.0 Anery Corn, 1.0.0 Tokay Gecko



that always makes me laugh. a real poser.


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## muru (Apr 27, 2008)

id like to say im shocked by some of these posts but im not, hard to beleive people would even think about posting such irrelavent and pointless posts as 'lucky you' or 'we'll see who's laughing when you get bit'............grow up people, i very much doubt youd be so cocky in a real life situation.

anyway onto the point, i have myself aswell as Tom travelled around a few countries on herping trips, 90% were self planned trips, while each have their advantages, i know which i prefer. I have been on both and there is so much more freedom when you plan things yourself, and with regards to finding herps, if you have a decent knowledge on what you are looking for in the first place, why need a guide? Just find an area that looks promosing, and look around at the right time, its never going to be like the TV, finding a snake under every rock but youd be suprised what you can find if you look in the right places......... and remember, where there are chickens, there is seed, where there is seed, there are rats, and where there are rats, there are DEFINATLY cobras!!!

(please note the last sentence is a private joke, and is indeed not always the case....unfortunatly:whistling2


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

Azemiops said:


> I went to many zoos whilst out there, they are interesting places to visit whilst travelling around. However, this has nothing to do with the fact that i have caught many species of reptile and amphibian whilst out on 'self-organised' trips.
> 
> Feel free to check out this page regarding a few of my trips:
> 
> Welcome to Tom Charlton's adventure


You took my bad joke seriously. Wasn't having a dig


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## Azemiops (May 1, 2008)

Aquai said:


> We'll see who's laughing when you get bit


Im sorry Aquai but this comment is completely unnecessary, im not even sure where you come into the equation with my previous posts, and implying that you would find it amusing if i was to be bitten whilst herping is absolutely not on.



muru said:


> , finding a snake under every rock but youd be suprised what you can find if you look in the right places......... and remember, where there are chickens, there is seed, where there is seed, there are rats, and where there are rats, there are DEFINATLY cobras!!!
> 
> (please note the last sentence is a private joke, and is indeed not always the case....unfortunatly:whistling2


Ha ha, nice one dude!



Owzy said:


> You took my bad joke seriously. Wasn't having a dig


Thats fair enough owzy, thats one of the biggest problems with forums, comments can often be taken the wrong way.


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## leptophis (May 24, 2007)

having known Tom a long time and seen him grow over the years he is self aphasing and a great venomous handler, many people who wish to learn venomous should look no further, I have put my trust in him on many ocasions, having been to asia on a number of times as well, he is right , it certainly is possible to go out with just a plane ticket, I have absolutely no idea why numpties who wouldnt know a viper from a mamba come on hear and shout the odds,


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## milsom (Nov 14, 2008)

Tom, AKA Azemiops, has been there, done that and got the t-shirt. He is well travelled, well read and highly respected amongst the clan of venomous snake keepers. 

One could learn from someone like this?


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

It is a case of each to their own. Some people prefer to go on package holidays where everything is laid on for them and all they need to do is relax and enjoy themselves....
I on the other hand have never been one for organised guided tours and wherever I go I try and get away from tourist areas and organise my own transport so as to see the real countryside, villages and people as they really are.... not some artificial encounter put on for tourists.
I guess that I am lucky in having enough friends/contacts worldwide that can take me out to find herps etc. and not have to pay (high fees) for the privilege.
As regards having more chance of seeing things in a larger group (more pairs of eyes) it all depends if the other members of the group know what to look for! As an example, I joined a group of American school children and Peace Corp guys on a walk/climb through the Cameroonian Rainforest to see a waterfall. I was at the end of the line bringing up the rear while walking along a river-bed..... It was me who spotted and caught a snake that everyone else had walked straight past. Later that day I spotted a Red Baboon Spider at the base of a tree that everyone had climbed past.
A lot of people could not cope with travelling on their own and organising everything, but some of us really enjoy the challenge....... for the others there are always the organised tours.
Whichever way you do it try and stay safe.


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## kenneally1 (Feb 17, 2009)

Not sure i understand why anyone would laugh at someone else getting bit.


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

PDR said:


> It is a case of each to their own. Some people prefer to go on package holidays where everything is laid on for them and all they need to do is relax and enjoy themselves....
> I on the other hand have never been one for organised guided tours and wherever I go I try and get away from tourist areas and organise my own transport so as to see the real countryside, villages and people as they really are.... not some artificial encounter put on for tourists.
> I guess that I am lucky in having enough friends/contacts worldwide that can take me out to find herps etc. and not have to pay (high fees) for the privilege.
> As regards having more chance of seeing things in a larger group (more pairs of eyes) it all depends if the other members of the group know what to look for! As an example, I joined a group of American school children and Peace Corp guys on a walk/climb through the Cameroonian Rainforest to see a waterfall. I was at the end of the line bringing up the rear while walking along a river-bed..... It was me who spotted and caught a snake that everyone else had walked straight past. Later that day I spotted a Red Baboon Spider at the base of a tree that everyone had climbed past.
> ...


The challenging thing for me has been finding other people who would be interested in going, none of my friends are interested at all in reptiles... 

And to be honest I would not feel confident travelling to some place on my own and simply trudging into a forest looking for animals, I am not bore but that sounds slightly unsafe to me, what happens if you are an hour or two into a forest and you get bitten...

I am sure it is easy to organise if you around those in the field a lot, but my only interaction with those interested is on here & at the shop I go to.. Unfortunately I do not spend enough time on here to develop a relationship with anyone to the extent where I would feel comfortable going to South America for example & trusting them.

Lame excuses in a way, I could join a local rep club etc but to be honest they do not appeal to me all that much, do not know why... 

I tried enquiring at the local shop (the one I used to go to) and they were about as helpful as an ashtray on a motor bike, that kind of arrogance and lack of help hardly enspires you to make much of an effort.


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## tokay (Mar 13, 2007)

defo my sort of thing , thats what i call a holiday!
im off to Ecuador on monday 4th on a heping photography trip cant wait for this


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## Al Hyde (Jan 6, 2008)

I agree with Paul, i've always organised my own trips and herping trips. My brother always joins me and we love to get off the beaten track, meet the real people and see what the country is really like.
I've had unsuccessful trips where i've seen very little and very successful trips where we've seen alot. 
There is real satisfaction in finding a certain species through research and our own hard work. For Example: We didn't manage to find the Ottomans viper (v.xanthina) until about the 8th or 9th trip to Turkey, and boy was I excited when we did, I almost shouted the valley down in delight!
Turns out that they're fairly common in other areas of Turkey, but where we go they can be quite scarce.

It's a personal thing, and I just do not get the same feeling of accomplishment being shown an animal by a tracker/Guide.


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## muru (Apr 27, 2008)

> It's a personal thing, and I just do not get the same feeling of accomplishment being shown an animal by a tracker/Guide.


couldnt agree more with that, another thing to bear in mind is that not all guides would feel confident in letting you have contact with certain (mainly venemous) species, granted you see the animal, but you dont have the satisfaction of knowing you found it, and may not even get the opportunity to get hands on.

On one of my 'Planned' trips to australia, when the guys up front on the trail found a red bellied black snake, they were more than happy to take a photo and let it go, fair enough for some, but i wasnt prepared to just let it crawl off after spending so much money on this organised trip, so as it was sneaking off i got the hook out and did what any keen herper would do, after it was safely bagged, we took it back to the campus and got some decent photographs aswell as a closer look of the snake, in the end everyone was happier. Just another reason i prefer the self planned travels. The freedom factor does make a difference.


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## Mememe (Feb 15, 2009)

tokay said:


> defo my sort of thing , thats what i call a holiday!
> im off to Ecuador on monday 4th on a heping photography trip cant wait for this


Nice, where are you staying?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

herp ohio


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

HABU said:


> herp ohio


Like it, what is it please?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

Owzy said:


> Like it, what is it please?


 
northern ringneck snake... common.


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

HABU said:


> northern ringneck snake... common.


Pretty cool, I just read your care sheet on them

Have not seen these for sale before though...


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

Owzy said:


> I am not bore but that sounds slightly unsafe to me, what happens if you are an hour or two into a forest and you get bitten...


What are the odds of being bitten? I work every day with hundreds of venomous snakes, so statistically I have a much higher chance of receiving a bite here in the UK than anywhere abroad.
I have been out in plenty of remote locations such as the African rainforests working with forest cobras & gaboon vipers (for National Geographic TV) and the only difference is that I take a little extra care as I know that I am hours away from any hospital. I do try and take AV with me if possible.
There are plenty of other dangers to consider when moving from the beaten track, mugging, kidnap, murder, RTA’s falls etc. Life is too short to worry about dying so get out there and enjoy life.


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

PDR said:


> What are the odds of being bitten? I work every day with hundreds of venomous snakes, so statistically I have a much higher chance of receiving a bite here in the UK than anywhere abroad.
> I have been out in plenty of remote locations such as the African rainforests working with forest cobras & gaboon vipers (for National Geographic TV) and the only difference is that I take a little extra care as I know that I am hours away from any hospital. I do try and take AV with me if possible.
> There are plenty of other dangers to consider when moving from the beaten track, mugging, kidnap, murder, RTA’s falls etc. Life is too short to worry about dying so get out there and enjoy life.


The odds are pretty high if your crap at handling snakes.

You are correct though.


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## slippery42 (Mar 23, 2008)

My take on this for what its worth..........

If you think you are likely to get bitten stay at home!

Like Paul I've done a fair bit of field herping abroad and you take even more care than usual.

The risk of being robbed and beaten up is a bigger worry and that it something I had first had experience with.

Car crashes are also big on the risk factor.

As Paul says go out see the world and enjoy, life is to short and this isnt a rehearsal.


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## tokay (Mar 13, 2007)

Mememe said:


> Nice, where are you staying?


We will be staying in Guango , bellavista and sani lodge, we will be using a mix of using guides and also going off exploring on our own. i gotta a feeling this is gonna be a good one! :2thumb:
already thinking of my next trip lol


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## milsom (Nov 14, 2008)

Interesting thread!

At the age of 17 I was jungle bashing in Indo China where I was taken over the Camdodian border looking for rare birds and herps. This was at a time when the Khmer Rouge still had power in certain regions, including the one I was in, and we did actually come across some KR patrols. It was only years later I realised the enormaty of the situation. But I have had a great time over the years in the field. I guess the moral of the story is to stick to the friendly places and be careful, let common sense prevail.

If you are lucky enough to find a nice big King Cobra or whatever, and your not a confident handler, observe, dont touch.


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