# Waterproofing melamine vivariums



## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Morning!

I have a 6x2x2 vivarium which will need to hold some pretty damp substrate and I was wondering what methods people have used to waterproof the wood that the substrate will be sitting on. As eventually I'm thinking it'll soak through the laminate and rot the chipboard! 

Any advice would be appreciated!!


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Iv been looking into this and from what iv read is seal the edges of the viv with aquarium silicone then once that's dry yacht varnish the inside of it all and hey presto you have a waterproofed viv : victory:


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## dorian (Nov 27, 2010)

Yacht varnish is a good idea, but apparently it stinks for months.
I'm sure there's some waterproof varnish out there which isn't designed for such intense water usage as a boat and therefore less potent.


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

kirky1980 said:


> Iv been looking into this and from what iv read is seal the edges of the viv with aquarium silicone then once that's dry yacht varnish the inside of it all and hey presto you have a waterproofed viv : victory:


How long should it be left until it's safe for a rep and where is the best place to get Yacht Varnish?


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Link's a bit long but what do you think about the below

Ronseal Yacht Varnish Clear 1L, 5010214571666


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Nigel_wales said:


> Link's a bit long but what do you think about the below
> 
> Ronseal Yacht Varnish Clear 1L, 5010214571666


That seems ok but iv never used it before so I really don't know. But it was the same stuff I saw aswell and was thinking of using. But as been said it may take a couple of weeks to get rid of the smell aswell.


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## Jeffers3 (May 18, 2010)

Another way would be to put a glass bottom in the viv. It wouldn't cost much and wouldn't have the fume issue.

Before you use yacht varnish on melamine, it may be worth checking that the solvents in the varnish won't attack the melamine surface. It will probably be OK, but as it only takes a little while to check it on an off-cut, it could save wasting an expensive bit of board. Melamine is pretty solvent-resistant, but why take the chance?


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Picked up some Ronseal Yacht Varnish and some more silcone to go over the joins again. I'm going to do atleast 2-3 coats of Ronseal varnish as the substrate will be damp pretty much constantly!!!


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## Rabb (Jan 13, 2010)

Melamine is water proof so all you need to do is seal the joins with sealant. 

You only need to varnish bear wood to make it water proof.


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

I'm going to line the bottom with thick plastic and silcone that in as well now as an extra precation, don't want the viv to rot at all.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Nigel_wales said:


> I'm going to line the bottom with thick plastic and silcone that in as well now as an extra precation, don't want the viv to rot at all.


That's what I'll be doing aswell cause my splendid need the humidity around 80/90% and it's not worth the risk really


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## UrolithicTitan (Sep 12, 2010)

Would I be able to just seal a Vivexotics viv with aquarium sealent.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

UrolithicTitan said:


> Would I be able to just seal a Vivexotics viv with aquarium sealent.


Yes I'll be using a vx24. But I'd think it would matter how wet the viv is going to be. The only reason I'm using the varnish is because I need mines very wet lol


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## bollocklegs (Sep 19, 2009)

what i did was cut perspex to the size of the bottom silacone that in place and then cut inch wide strips and fix them in place around the edges then seal the joins. done : victory:


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

have you tried lining the bottom and a few inches up each of the sides with 2mm perspex and use silicone ( clear ) to glue it into place. works wonders :2thumb::2thumb:


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## Jeffers3 (May 18, 2010)

manni said:


> have you tried lining the bottom and a few inches up each of the sides with 2mm perspex and use silicone ( clear ) to glue it into place. works wonders :2thumb::2thumb:


This would be my solution as well, but I'd use glass instead. From what I've seen, glass would work out cheaper. I'd always be worried about residual fumes if I used varnish. It takes ages for the fumes to clear.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Jeffers3 said:


> This would be my solution as well, but I'd use glass instead. From what I've seen, glass would work out cheaper. I'd always be worried about residual fumes if I used varnish. It takes ages for the fumes to clear.


I must admit I never thought about the glass/perspex idea:whistling2:
I'd prefer to do that than spend weeks airing out yacht varnish really. Cheers for the idea: victory:


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Hmm where is a good place to get perspex cut to size to.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Nigel_wales said:


> Hmm where is a good place to get perspex cut to size to.


Haha that sound better to you aswell then lol

you could try the local glaziers the might be open half day on a Saturday. That would be first stop really


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

kirky1980 said:


> Haha that sound better to you aswell then lol
> 
> you could try the local glaziers the might be open half day on a Saturday. That would be first stop really


Yea it did , im still going to use the varnish as I got a few months until the lizards go in there but i was gonna line the bottom with thick pond liner but perspex sounds like a better plan....... Less likely to rip etc lol.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Nigel_wales said:


> Yea it did , im still going to use the varnish as I got a few months until the lizards go in there but i was gonna line the bottom with thick pond liner but perspex sounds like a better plan....... Less likely to rip etc lol.


What are your putting in there anyway it's a huge viv. Is it some sort of monitor or something?


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## Jeffers3 (May 18, 2010)

kirky1980 said:


> What are your putting in there anyway it's a huge viv. Is it some sort of monitor or something?


If it is a monitor, pond lining won't last 5 minutes!

To answer the perspex cutting question - it's easy enough to saw through it. Easier to cut glass to size, though.


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Jeffers3 said:


> If it is a monitor, pond lining won't last 5 minutes!
> 
> To answer the perspex cutting question - it's easy enough to saw through it. Easier to cut glass to size, though.


Well that's what I was thinking about the liner. 
As for cutting glass would a tile cutter work for cutting it ?


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## reticmadness79 (May 7, 2009)

you dont need to yacht varnish a melamine viv it doesnt adhere properly to the melamine coat used,as for cutting perspex just use a metalruler and scour with stanley knife you get a clean cut just keep running it in over the same line with gentle pressure.
If you were to build a new viv use 18mm ply and then coat with G4 pondsealer,about 4 coats,aquarium seal the edges and joins youll never have to worry about buying or building another viv,this is how i build mine for me and for people who want a dogs viv that lasts,iv had retics in mine they were forever tipping over there water bowl but the tank would hold the water,this is how good they are.


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## 12843 (Nov 16, 2007)

Rabb said:


> Melamine is water proof so all you need to do is seal the joins with sealant.
> 
> You only need to varnish bear wood to make it water proof.



Its water resistant, not proof, over time it will degrade due to the moisture and temps.

A low VOC yatc, floor and durable water based varnish are a good choice, a close second would be a a good grade of pond liner. Be sure to check the degradation period as some are shorter than others. Personally I'd use a mixture of the above.

Glass could be an option depending on the inhabitant, but I would be concerned of the long term effect of temps and humidity on the rest of the un-glassed areas. 

Not sure on the fibre glass front, but may well be worth looking into it, as it could be hand moulded in, providing complete coverage.


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## Jeffers3 (May 18, 2010)

Krispy1984 said:


> Not sure on the fibre glass front, but may well be worth looking into it, as it could be hand moulded in, providing complete coverage.


This is an interesting idea. I like to see vivs that look realistic and you could get that sort of look with glass fibre - and, as you say, it's waterproof. I've never worked with it in this way (I used to make fishing rods from it, but the tube sections were pre-formed).

Have you used it, Kris? Or know anyone else that has, perhaps? If so, is it easy to mould?


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## 12843 (Nov 16, 2007)

Jeffers3 said:


> This is an interesting idea. I like to see vivs that look realistic and you could get that sort of look with glass fibre - and, as you say, it's waterproof. I've never worked with it in this way (I used to make fishing rods from it, but the tube sections were pre-formed).
> 
> Have you used it, Kris? Or know anyone else that has, perhaps? If so, is it easy to mould?



Its best used in a vacuum if you ask me tbh, should be tricky to do in a viv with a dual flow compressor (?), but it can be manage and moulded by hand if you are fast enough. I have no idea if the resin is reptile safe, though they are quite commonly used for fish keeping. Be it a full scale koi farm or small garden pond. 

Last time I used it was to fix a leak in a friend car boot, though I've used it for alsorts. I've made cases for console, hulls for remote control boats to tanks that fired 6mm ball bearing with 42psi, Police confiscated that one. Made a friend a new body for a remote control plane once too. Roman shields for school production (which I also did the lighting and sound for, just to slip that in  ), erm think we made a sledge one year too, car't seem to remember completing it? Maybe I hit a tree while ,out and about on it? 

I know what you mean by the prefrab tubing, where yours pre tapered? Its so tedious working out truth lengths .
Used to make a lot of whips (with and without reel rebates and cuffs)out of bamboo for pike baiting at one point, Light as anything made a 2lb roach feel like a 6lb perch. Most fun I ever had pulling in a 7lb2oz tench in on one! xD


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## reticmadness79 (May 7, 2009)

G4 pondsealer is the resin used with fibreglass in fishponds,you can also get it in a couple of colours aswell,you could use foam to make rock effect or tree/bark effect then cover with the fibreglass and G4 sealer,best to use fibreglass matt rather than the weave aswell
I normally just brush 4 coats or clear on ply and gives the wood a natural look.


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## 12843 (Nov 16, 2007)

reticmadness79 said:


> G4 pondsealer is the resin used with fibreglass in fishponds,you can also get it in a couple of colours aswell,you could use foam to make rock effect or tree/bark effect then cover with the fibreglass and G4 sealer,best to use fibreglass matt rather than the weave aswell
> I normally just brush 4 coats or clear on ply and gives the wood a natural look.



 Cheers buddy!


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## reticmadness79 (May 7, 2009)

Krispy1984 said:


> Cheers buddy!


no probs,glad to help: victory:


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Nigel_wales said:


> Morning!
> 
> I have a 6x2x2 vivarium which will need to hold some pretty damp substrate and I was wondering what methods people have used to waterproof the wood that the substrate will be sitting on. As eventually I'm thinking it'll soak through the laminate and rot the chipboard!
> 
> Any advice would be appreciated!!


only if the moisture can get to to the bare chip wood, try sealing all the edges with aqua selant, maybe even to be extra sure use a thin sheet of tarpulin and use the aqua selant to keep it in place then put your damp substrate own


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

Whats wrong with a glass viv ?? sounds like alot of hassle to me:whistling2: ( 31 replies later )


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

manni said:


> Whats wrong with a glass viv ?? sounds like alot of hassle to me:whistling2:


glass viv`s dont keep the heat in as well as wood viariums.

also because of the moisture and heat, the gass will be all fogged up probabbly:lol2:


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

mate im not being funny but glass or wood its still gonna get misted up


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

manni said:


> mate im not being funny but glass or wood its still gonna get misted up


but it still doesnt keep the heat in like wooden vivs do


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

have it double glazed :lol2::2thumb:


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

manni said:


> have it double glazed :lol2::2thumb:


 oh yeah go to safestyle uk, bog of lol buy one get one free ... i say you buy one you get one free


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

:lol2::lol2:


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## Meko (Apr 29, 2007)

manni said:


> Whats wrong with a glass viv ?? sounds like alot of hassle to me:whistling2: ( 31 replies later )


probably because....



Nigel_wales said:


> Morning!
> 
> *I have* a 6x2x2 vivarium



now unless Jesus lives next door and has got bored turning water into wine.... there's nothing wrong with glass vivs except:


he's already got a wooden one
glass vivs are bloody expensive
can you get 6x2x2 glass vivs?


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## kirky1980 (Apr 4, 2010)

Plus glass vivs are rank rotten at keeping the humidity in and it's easir to see the shite smeared all over it ewww


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## Tombo46 (Aug 5, 2010)

I just seal whole thing with aquarium sealant. It's nasty stuff but does the trick. the base where the substrate goes gets a normal layer and a big "cake it on" layer to make sure it's sealed.


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## Jeffers3 (May 18, 2010)

Krispy1984 said:


> Its best used in a vacuum if you ask me tbh, should be tricky to do in a viv with a dual flow compressor (?), but it can be manage and moulded by hand if you are fast enough. I have no idea if the resin is reptile safe, though they are quite commonly used for fish keeping. Be it a full scale koi farm or small garden pond.
> 
> Last time I used it was to fix a leak in a friend car boot, though I've used it for alsorts. I've made cases for console, hulls for remote control boats to tanks that fired 6mm ball bearing with 42psi, Police confiscated that one. Made a friend a new body for a remote control plane once too. Roman shields for school production (which I also did the lighting and sound for, just to slip that in  ), erm think we made a sledge one year too, car't seem to remember completing it? Maybe I hit a tree while ,out and about on it?
> 
> ...


I think I'll look into this fibre glass idea - but maybe not some of your, shall we say, less legal activities!

I used to buy fibre glass blanks, which were pre-tapered. I attached reel fittings and cork handles, which were then filed and sanded to shape. I whipped on the eyes and varnished the whipping. I had some solid glass spinning rods and hollow float rods. They were probably pretty crap by todays standards, but it gave me something angling related to do in the close season. I don't remember catching tench of that size back then, but I took chub to over 5lb and some very large eels (used to night fish for these and sold them to the owners of the local chinese restaurant - not for the menu!)


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

whats jesus got to do with it i thought he didnt like reptiles


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Some good ideas... I think I'm going to use Perspex and silcone it in. Seems the easiest way to do it once it's cut to size.


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## manni (Nov 26, 2010)

Go GO Nigel !!!!:2thumb: He DA man nice one mate always worked for me :Na_Na_Na_Na: No doubt someone will try to change your mind again my advice is go with what sounds good to you ........the perspex idea lol


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

manni said:


> Go GO Nigel !!!!:2thumb: He DA man nice one mate always worked for me :Na_Na_Na_Na: No doubt someone will try to change your mind again my advice is go with what sounds good to you ........the perspex idea lol


Haha ! Yea definately sticking to it now mate...


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## sharpstrain (May 24, 2008)

Nigel_wales said:


> Morning!
> 
> I have a 6x2x2 vivarium which will need to hold some pretty damp substrate and I was wondering what methods people have used to waterproof the wood that the substrate will be sitting on. As eventually I'm thinking it'll soak through the laminate and rot the chipboard!
> 
> Any advice would be appreciated!!


 
I cover mine with fablon (sticky back plastic) and seal the joins with aquarium sealant - works a treat


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## 12843 (Nov 16, 2007)

Nigel_wales said:


> Some good ideas... I think I'm going to use Perspex and silcone it in. Seems the easiest way to do it once it's cut to size.


If your using UVb it will discolour quite rapidly, and look very naff. Almost like a tobacco stained room.

Acrylic stands up to UVb better but does scratch easily.


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Thought I'd bump this thread back up to recommend what I ended up using in the end.

Blagdon V8 Pond Sealer - This stuff really is awesome. I can literally fill the bottom of my viv up with water and put some goldfish in :2thumb:. The smell goes away within a couple of hours and it soaks deep into wood.


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## Spikebrit (Oct 23, 2006)

Not sure if this has been said, but i have two wooden vivs that are live planted, thus very humid.

i sealed these with a layer of silcone, folowed by cheap pondliner, followed by more silocone. it works fine and is still going strong 2.5 yers later. 

jay


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Spikebrit said:


> Not sure if this has been said, but i have two wooden vivs that are live planted, thus very humid.
> 
> i sealed these with a layer of silcone, folowed by cheap pondliner, followed by more silocone. it works fine and is still going strong 2.5 yers later.
> 
> jay


 
Sounds like another good idea! With the viv being for rock monitors I was worried they'd rip through that as they dig a lot.

I also changed from melamine to ply and stained/ varnished it so it looks nice.

Pic below but I am now in the progress of a fake rock background for it which sits on the wood about 1 foot up from the bottom. It also hides the frame inside which I had to put in to support the other viv.


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