# The Velvet Worm Care Thread(From me & GRB)



## enlightenment

Okay, so Grant and I have ordered some velvet worms.

I actually ordered one, and Grant a trio, I think I am right in saying?

Anyway, as we did with the 'Camel Spiders', I thought we could use this to update you on their progress, on their arrival.

A lot of people seemed to like that, before.

Maybe some pics, when apt, as well?

I have heard conflicting stories on how hard these are to keep alive.

Many reputable dealers say that they are_ not esp hard_, yet many who have had them have not enjoyed success, even if they can live up to six years of age, it is said.

I am not sure what temp my bedroom usually is, but without any means of securing a cooler environ, I will have to go with that, and hope it pans out.

Humidity seems important, therefore, lots of spray misting, perhaps.

Hmm. Isn't humidity created by heat, therefore, would the absence of real heat not actually fail to create a true humid air space?

Been told to keep tank pretty well ventilated, however, not sure how good these are at getting out, and if they often attempt it.

Grant, did you ask what size yours are?

He told me that they were between 2-5cm, and that he will try to send me the larger.

Even then, it is not that big really.

Do you think you can keep it alive easier/longer, than our camel spiders?


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## Lucifus

I heard the major problems was with breeding them.


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## enlightenment

So Grant feels, as well.

I am not doing that anyway, but I suspect he might have an eye on it.

And Wikipedia!

:whistling2:


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## DannyLeigh

Can't wait for this thread, especially if it gets as much attention as the Camel Spider one! :2thumb:


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## Mutley.100

I'll be following this thread with great interest as these look like a very interesting alternative to T's and such .


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## benjo

lookin forward to this!


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## enlightenment

Mine gets here Tue.

Not sure about GRB's.


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## enlightenment

Fella who sold us them, told me this, via e mail, Grant.




_Velvet worms are easy as long as you keep the air and surface temperature cool around 15-18oC, even at 12oC they seem to be happy. Keep moist but not wet, nocturnal feeders, also like to be in the dark. Feeding insects ie small crickets_


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## wetmackeral

> I heard the major problems was with breeding them.


Not quite true... I bought a breeding pair from exotic-pets.co.uk , andbefore I'd even got em out the pot one of them was giving birth to a tiny little baby ojne, ho is doing very well in the main tank.
Anyway, I'd say these were extremely easy, you just need to stick em in a large-floored enclosure somewhere away from the radiators. Inside it, there should be a layer of substrate/orchid bark, covered with a layer of spagnum moss, with a few bits of rotten wood/rocks spread around the enclosure.
They need to be sprayed at least once every two days, if you use the spagnum moss, or once daily if you don't.
Feedings pretty easy too, just use either waxworms (which can be left to roam the tank, they seem to last a while) or small crickets (if you know there are babies in there, I'd uses micro crickets, and wax/mealworms for the bigger ones [mealworms are also quite good, as they dig into the rotting wood, creating holes for the velvet worms to hide in, and they offer a good nutrition])
I would recommend buying a night-vision camera with long battery life to put into the cage, so you can see what they are doing without disturbing them.
They can be handled, but you have to be careful because they squirt a rather sticky glue when first disturbed which can get your hands stuck to the substrate.
They like living communally, so fairly large populations can be kept in the same tank, as they share food in a similar way to lions (apart from the matriarch feeds first)

Hope this helped, I'll just put the URLs to some pics of mine on the end. : victory:
As a note, if you find a small white mark on them, I shouldn't worry- I'm still trying to figure out what it is, but it doesn't seem to affect them.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...vetWorm013.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...vetWorm014.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...vetWorm015.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...vetWorm016.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...vetWorm018.jpg


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## enlightenment

Hi mate.

Maybe your pics are deceptive, but it looks bigger than 4-5cm?

Yet I am told that is about the standard size, which doesn't make it v big.

I understand that humidity is important, yet they need to be as cool as possible.

But doesn't heat create humidity, therefore, in a cooler environment, less humid?

What room do you keep your one in?


Steve


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## wetmackeral

They are 4-5cm, I used a macro lens so they seem a bit bigger.
When they stretch out, they do look much bigger.
HEat does make humidity, yes, but I think that thebreeders used the wrong word on this one. I think that the enclosure should be cold and damp, rather than humid. The spagnum moss really helps with this. Besides, they spend a lot of time burrowing into this in the day, so they stay wet in any case.
I keep mine on a shelf which is away from the radiators, heat mats etc but still in view in my bedroom. The water helps to cool down the cage anyway, it also helps if you put ice cubes (sounds bizarre I know) on top of the mesh, to keep temp down.
I've included a few pics of my set-up, I hope they are of use.
BTW, they won't crawl out the ventilation holes, as they cant climb perspex or glass at all.
And a final note- I found out that the white scar thingy was the entry point for the males seed, they have a weird method of mating, which would also explain why that one is fatter than the other ones.
Cheers: victory:
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/003.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/004.jpg
http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/012.jpg


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## GRB

Hello,

I've just found this thread. I bought 5, and they are arriving on Tuesday.

Thats some interesting info - I wasn't sure about communal living so I bought 5 smaller tubs to house them individually. I think i'll keep them separate or in pairs perhaps, until I am more accustomed to them.

Regards breeding, i've heard that people do recieve gravid females, but no-one has yet managed to breed them from scratch, as far as i could find out. Much the same as with solifuges it appears....

I'm using a coir, small volume peat and some sand. Sand does sound strange, but i've based this mix upon the soil at my local forested area (which i've been studying for my harvestmen work). I'm aiming for something that retains moisture yet is quite free draining so hopefully mould will not be a problem. Will get some orchid bark and try, but i've got large patches of moss. Will put up some pics of enclosures later.


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## enlightenment

wetmackeral said:


> They are 4-5cm, I used a macro lens so they seem a bit bigger.
> When they stretch out, they do look much bigger.
> 
> *5cm is what - couple of inches? Not really large at all, then.*
> 
> *Even those I have seen on You Yube seem larger, but as you say, perhaps they are stretched out, as they are filmed?*
> 
> HEat does make humidity, yes, but I think that thebreeders used the wrong word on this one. I think that the enclosure should be cold and damp, rather than humid. The spagnum moss really helps with this. Besides, they spend a lot of time burrowing into this in the day, so they stay wet in any case.
> 
> *Okay, I will try to get some spag moss. Maybe my local T shop might have it? How deep a sub are you using?*
> 
> I keep mine on a shelf which is away from the radiators, heat mats etc but still in view in my bedroom. The water helps to cool down the cage anyway, it also helps if you put ice cubes (sounds bizarre I know) on top of the mesh, to keep temp down.
> 
> *You use a mesh lid? Nylon, plastic, like a net? Then some cubes on top of that, each day? Good tip*.
> 
> I've included a few pics of my set-up, I hope they are of use.
> BTW, they won't crawl out the ventilation holes, as they cant climb perspex or glass at all.
> 
> *No? I imagined them to be able to do so, for some reason.*
> 
> And a final note- I found out that the white scar thingy was the entry point for the males seed, they have a weird method of mating, which would also explain why that one is fatter than the other ones.
> Cheers: victory:
> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/003.jpg
> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/004.jpg
> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/012.jpg


*Glad it was nothing serious.*


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## enlightenment

Looks quite a large set up, for such a small thing!

Good though.

:no1:


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## wetmackeral

its a big set up, I'll admit,but I am planning on breeding a colony of them, so more space is better.


> *How deep a sub are you using?
> *



I'm using about a 1-2cm deep multi-layered subn, with inflatable substrate below and spag moss above.


> *Even those I have seen on You Yube seem larger, but as you say, perhaps they are stretched out, as they are filmed?*


The ones on youtube are either a different species which grows larger, or they may be what is seen when the camera zooms in quite a bit- on the david attenborough one, the cricket is almost twice the size.


> *You use a mesh lid? Nylon, plastic, like a net?*


Actually, I use a plastic one that came with the tank, but yeah, mesh would work quite well.

As an added point, I should say that depending on the species, the velvet worm may or may not be asexual. They're quite hard to tell apart the two species, but it does mean you need to be prepared for any eventuality.
Cheers: victory:


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## enlightenment

Inflatible sub?

What is this?


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## wetmackeral

Soz- my slang word for the freeze-dried blocks you can get from zoo-med, etc.
You can just use orchid bark, that would work. Or ordinary compost, but you'd need to check for mites.


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## GRB

The species you will get in the hobby will likely be the smaller species.

There is a species that grows to around 22cm. From what i've seen, most are around 4-6cm, although they can stretch a little. The sad part is that most species of velvet worm are threatened or endangered, and we wont see them in the hobby unless things improve in their home habitats.


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## enlightenment

GRB said:


> The species you will get in the hobby will likely be the smaller species.
> 
> There is a species that grows to around 22cm. From what i've seen, most are around 4-6cm, although they can stretch a little.* The sad part is that most species of velvet worm are threatened or endangered*, and we wont see them in the hobby unless things improve in their home habitats.


Don't you feel a little bad, buying into the supply and demand trap, then?

Just a thought...


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## gizzard

could turn out that if you guys can breed them and they become extinct in the wild, then they will be purely captive bred, like axolotls, and can be re-introduced into the wild later...?


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## Ozgi

Can they bite?

Is there a link anywhere to the camel spider thread? they fascinate me and I'd love to read it. cheers.


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## enlightenment

I would guess their mouth parts would not really be suited for biting people.


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## enlightenment

Okay, I am pretty much set for it to arrive, tommorow.

Went to an invert shop to get some spag moss, but none in until Wed. :bash:

We'll see what happens.


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## enlightenment

Chaps, any thoughts on my idea of using ice, not on top of the tank, as proposed, but by way of placing it on the underside of the tank?

I am told these can live up to six years, but I would be v surprised if that turned out to be the case.


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## enlightenment

Hey Grant, has your one arrived yet?


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## GRB

Yep, they are very very cool.

And quite small, it's cool. I have placed them all into one of the tubs I prepared as now i've heard they can be kept communally. Thankfully my kitchen is sitting at 17C so they should be fine in there. I'm going to prepare a lot of bags of ice however just in case we get some hot days.

I'll post photos up later, although the enclosure is just a sea of sphagnum moss at the minute.


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## enlightenment

ASSHOLES.

RMSD? What a f*****joke. According to the website, it was delivered at 11.08. I rang their customer service. I have to wait 3 to 5 DAYS for a proof of del sig.

So it will be dead on arrival.

Utter rubbish.


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## Willyleigh

Can you not go to the RM depot and pick it up from there?


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## enlightenment

Handily enough, they close just after 1pm.


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## spend_day

GRB said:


> Yep, they are very very cool.
> 
> And quite small, it's cool. I have placed them all into one of the tubs I prepared as now i've heard they can be kept communally. Thankfully my kitchen is sitting at 17C so they should be fine in there. I'm going to prepare a lot of bags of ice however just in case we get some hot days.
> 
> I'll post photos up later, although the enclosure is just a sea of sphagnum moss at the minute.


i assume u got new zealand ones then. i was gonna get some a little while back but my supplier never came through. 

u could hook up a cool stat and a minifridge or something like that in summer


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> ASSHOLES.
> 
> RMSD? What a f*****joke. According to the website, it was delivered at 11.08. I rang their customer service. I have to wait 3 to 5 DAYS for a proof of del sig.
> 
> So it will be dead on arrival.
> 
> Utter rubbish.


Thats lame, poor little guys. At least the weather is cold; there is hope that they will survive ok. Mine were packed amazingly, and I think the tub they arrived in should be ok for a few days. 



spend_day said:


> i assume u got new zealand ones then. i was gonna get some a little while back but my supplier never came through.
> 
> u could hook up a cool stat and a minifridge or something like that in summer


Yes, these are the New Zealand species. Hopefully I can breed them and this whole WC malarkay can be reduced...as for the cold, i'm not too worried just yet. I've got a few ideas - a mini fridge was one of them rightly so.

On another note, I got to see firsthand how these animals hunt shortly ago. I placed a small cricket in and it touched one of the 'adult' specimens. It immediately turned and fired, at a speed which was quite amazing given how cold it is (it's easily on par with the speed that a fast tarantula strikes). It was a short shot, about 2cm but it hit the cricket dead on. 

The entire cricket was enveloped in "goo" - and quickly suffocated. Alas, the worm appeared not hungry and as of yet has not consumed the prey item. However, it was amazing to watch. Next time I will try for some photographs. I just observed that behaviour under red light, so hopefully I will be able to photograph some strikes.


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> ASSHOLES.
> 
> RMSD? What a f*****joke. According to the website, it was delivered at 11.08. I rang their customer service. I have to wait 3 to 5 DAYS for a proof of del sig.
> 
> So it will be dead on arrival.
> 
> Utter rubbish.


I've read this again.

Try the post office again tomorrow, I imagine that the worms will be ok. If they left the call card then its at the depot. These things thrive at 10-12C so that advice reads, so they should be completely fine waiting another day.


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## enlightenment

GRB said:


> I've read this again.
> 
> Try the post office again tomorrow, I imagine that the worms will be ok. If they left the call card then its at the depot. These things thrive at 10-12C so that advice reads, so they should be completely fine waiting another day.


Mate, there WAS no card.

What happened is that I waited in all day.

I went online.

Put the Track number into the Royal Mail site.

It came up as having been delivered.

But it hadn't

The people I spoke with at RM could not have been any less helpful.

On the other hand, the fella that runs the store, and Liz, they could not be more helpful.

They are going to send me another, and one that was CB apparently too, therefore, it appears they may have had joy actually breeding these...



Steve


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## AbraxasComplex

Just be happy yours were not sent during a heat wave. I ordered a large group (25) and on the day they were to arrive the temperature hit 35'C. And instead of taking it to the door like I requested to the postman of all the parcels I recieve (told them they usually had plants or animals in them), he placed them in our mailbox at the end of the block. A large metal box that burns in the heat.

Neadless to say 2 barely survived, but died soon after.


Now I've been trying to get tropical species, that can withstand the heat so I don't have to worry about cooling their enclosure.


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## enlightenment

Royal Mail are an utter joke.

Try Googling Royal Mail Are Rubbish, and you will soon read thousands of threads and post from irate customers.

They are a shoddy service, and deserve to lose the Royal seal.

Time for more competition for them, imo.


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## enlightenment

Anyway...

Did anyone answer my idea, to keep temps cool, by literally placing the tank in a small tray of ice or cold water?


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## Mutley.100

enlightenment said:


> Anyway...
> 
> Did anyone answer my idea, to keep temps cool, by literally placing the tank in a small tray of ice or cold water?



I'd be concerned about dropping the temp too much .


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## enlightenment

Mutley.100 said:


> I'd be concerned about dropping the temp too much .


Well, there is that, I guess.

Dunno then.

What is 18, that's usually about room temp, right?

I think these thrive at 18, as long as there are no obvious heaters, mats, etc.

Least, that is what I am being told.


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## Mutley.100

I'm wondering if something like a PC water cooling system could be used as under-tank cooling .


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## enlightenment

Mutley.100 said:


> I'm wondering if something like a PC water cooling system could be used as under-tank cooling .


A pic?

What price are they, usually?

: victory:


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## Mutley.100

enlightenment said:


> A pic?
> 
> What price are they, usually?
> 
> : victory:


I'm not an expert , it's just something I considered looking into when the Velvet Worms threads appeared a few weeks ago .


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## Lucifus

wetmackeral said:


> Not quite true... I bought a breeding pair from exotic-pets.co.uk , andbefore I'd even got em out the pot one of them was giving birth to a tiny little baby ojne, ho is doing very well in the main tank.
> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w176/wetmackeral/2009VelvetWorm018.jpg


Breeding in captivity. Could have been mated in the wild before it arrived.

Would love to get hold of some though.


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> Well, there is that, I guess.
> 
> Dunno then.
> 
> What is 18, that's usually about room temp, right?
> 
> I think these thrive at 18, as long as there are no obvious heaters, mats, etc.
> 
> Least, that is what I am being told.


The advice I got was that they sem to thrive at 15C, or even less.

18C is probably a cold-ish room. My kitchen sits around 13-16C so is ideal, and it is unheated. If I were you, i'd invest in a good min/max thermometer to get an idea of where the cold spots in your house are. I got one from B&Q for £6.


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## enlightenment

Grant,

Liz and Adrian were good enough to post me a replacement, and a 'baby', just for good measure. Those arrived this morning.

As to the original one, hey, well done Royal Mail (sarcasm).

Yesterday, they said it had arrived and been delivered when it hadn't.

Today they said they had put a card through my door (nope, they hadn't).

I finally spoke to someone with a brain cell, and he admitted that they had f***** up, and that the original one was never delivered to me, and is sitting at the depot.


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## enlightenment

GRB said:


> The advice I got was that they sem to thrive at 15C, or even less.
> 
> 18C is probably a cold-ish room. My kitchen sits around 13-16C so is ideal, and it is unheated. If I were you, i'd invest in a good min/max thermometer to get an idea of where the cold spots in your house are. I got one from B&Q for £6.


I have placed a damp dish towel on top of the tank, leaving plenty of vents, obviously.

Do you like them?

Steve


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## GRB

I had one on my hand this morning, and they are amazing. 

They are so...different from all my other hard shelled inverts, it's like looking back into the Cambrian or something. Very glad I finally bought some, they've been on my list a long time.

What do you think? I have to admit,the initial reaction can be underwhelming, but they grow on you - especially if you get to see one feed.


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## enlightenment

Yeah, well, they are pretty small, but I like them.

I have probably put mine in a tank which is larger than needed, but there you go.

I put a water bowl in, however, lest they drowned, I used a piece of cotton, got that damp, and placed that in the bowl.

I bet I never see them eat!

Did you mix some sand into your sub, as you proposed?

I did, just a little bit really.


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> Yeah, well, they are pretty small, but I like them.
> 
> I have probably put mine in a tank which is larger than needed, but there you go.
> 
> I put a water bowl in, however, lest they drowned, I used a piece of cotton, got that damp, and placed that in the bowl.
> 
> I bet I never see them eat!
> 
> Did you mix some sand into your sub, as you proposed?
> 
> I did, just a little bit really.


See, I debated useing water, but in the end didnt bother. There's lot of wet sphagnum in there, so hopefully all will be well.

As for the sand, yes: I mixed roughly 3 coir to 1 sand 1 moss. The living moss was then placed on top for shelter. They seem to enjoy it, I hardly see them!


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## enlightenment

Not that I plan to, but I wonder what else could live in there, with them?

Earthworms?

Small snails?

Slugs?

Might even be good for the soil, at least the earthworms would..


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> Not that I plan to, but I wonder what else could live in there, with them?
> 
> Earthworms?
> 
> Small snails?
> 
> Slugs?
> 
> Might even be good for the soil, at least the earthworms would..


Hmmmn...I did read that isopods were observed eating velvet worms, so perhaps its not a great idea to mix them with other 'harmless' inverts. I cant imagine an earthworm eating on, but then again i've never heard of woodlice eating living animals before then either...


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## enlightenment

GRB, I managed to collect the original one from the sorting office.

They admitted they had not attempted delivery.

Here's a a thought.

These chaps, they are so small, and so black, not to mention the fact that you never see them, that were they to die, I am quite sure we might not know about it for some time!


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## the-reptile-mafia

Can i jusdt ask were you got these from as ive been thinking about these for a long time?


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## enlightenment

Myrmecology - Antsectopia

Here ya go, chap.


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## the-reptile-mafia

Thank you very muuuuuchly :lol2:


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## enlightenment

No problem.

Grant?

How are your five doing?

I had three in the end, as you know.

You rarely see them, and as I mentioned, owing to their smallness, black colour, and soft bodies, they could die, and you might never really know it, esp as they burrow.

I had the dilemma of needing to heat my house, but not them, and it is a small place.

I did my best by turning off the heating in that room, putting a cold and damp cloth on top of the tank, and two of those freezer pack things on either side.

I have seen one of the three since I got them, so that's where I am at.


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## Mutley.100

Guys I stumbled upon this and thought it might be useful in keeping temps under control for the Velvet worms . 

Cool Control Thermostat by: HabiStat - Cornish Crispa Co.


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## GRB

That seems like a very useful device.

I may invest in one ready for the summer, and one of the fans.


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## enlightenment

Quite expensive though....


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## enlightenment

Hi Grant,

You're not saying too much about these, are you not v impressed? Anyway, as you know, by default I ended up with three of these, rather than the original one.

This comprised of two 'adults', and one that was much smaller.

I wake up this morning, have a look, and one of them was lying dead, with the other (alive), close by it.

The dead one appeared to have a couple of minor white marks on it.

Temps have been fine etc, therefore, I am going to hazard a guess, and say that one _might_ have killed the other.

Is that possible, from what you have read?

Shame.

In truth, probably wouldn't get these again, good to get just for the experience, but hardly the most gripping, are they!


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## GRB

enlightenment said:


> Hi Grant,
> 
> You're not saying too much about these, are you not v impressed? Anyway, as you know, by default I ended up with three of these, rather than the original one.
> 
> This comprised of two 'adults', and one that was much smaller.
> 
> I wake up this morning, have a look, and one of them was lying dead, with the other (alive), close by it.
> 
> The dead one appeared to have a couple of minor white marks on it.
> 
> Temps have been fine etc, therefore, I am going to hazard a guess, and say that one _might_ have killed the other.
> 
> Is that possible, from what you have read?
> 
> Shame.
> 
> In truth, probably wouldn't get these again, good to get just for the experience, but hardly the most gripping, are they!


I really like them, but in truth there's not a great deal to actually discuss - they dont really do very much, and they remind me of my old whip scorpions.

I'm hoping that I can establish a breeding colony of these guys and just leave them be really. As for the death, thats a shame, and its certainly possible that one ate the other - Adrian (from Antsectopia)told me that some of the little ones do go missing that he keeps, so its quite likely they do get the munchies for one another.


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## enlightenment

Could well be mate, I will never know, and I don't think it is a police matter! :lol2:

You are right, there is not much to say.

You put them in.

They dissapear.

You rarely see them.

And that is about it!


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## enlightenment

Grant, to the best of your knowledge, have your 'velvet worms' eaten anything?

I have had a smallish brown cricket in there for about 10 days now, and it is still alive!!!


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## wetmackeral

*Tbph...*

They arent the most exciting of inverts, to be perfectly honest, unless you invest in an infared camera. If you wait until the night, before removing the wood and bits of the moss, adding in a couple of crickets and setting up a camera, you will see how amazing they are. I would post the video of my three ones, but I cant work out why it wont let me upload it. 
They are good for saying that you have kept them though.


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## enlightenment

I wonder how long they can go without eating though?


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## wetmackeral

well, according to the sources, they will go for perhaps months without feeding in the wild.


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## enlightenment

I had three.

One (relatively) large sized one, one medium one, and a tiny one.

The large one is still alive and well, the medium one seemed to die quite speedily (cause unknown), and not seen the tiny one since.

Hard to keep the temps down.

I am using ice packs against the size side of the tank.


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## larythelamb

*Velvet worm help*

Hi all , im new to these forums. I am a PHd student studying arthropod evolution. I will be sequencing some genomes and i need a onychophoran specimen. Can anybody tell me the what are some sites that sell them, I really need to find some in the next month or so, so any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, lahcenn


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## enlightenment

Antsectopia Ant Shop

Contact these guys. Although they say 'out of stock' on the site, they will order them in for you.

Steve


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## wetmackeral

Theyre still high in stock at Exotic Pets - Amphibian, Reptile and Invert UK exotic pet shop which is where I got mine


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## enlightenment

Aren't they a little unreliable though?

I read so on Bug Nation?


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## wetmackeral

I never had a problem with them


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## GRB

Steve: I now have 6 velvet worms. 

There's a tiny (4-6mm) one that seems to have appeared from nowhere, so I'm quite pleased. How are yours doing?

Also: No to hassle wetmackeral, but that sig is _Ma-Hou-sive._


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## wetmackeral

Mine are doing well, I too have found a couple of little wrigglers in the moss. Ruddy hard to spot though.

And yes, I know he sig was oversized to the extreme, soi I've changed it for summet smaller


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## enlightenment

GRB said:


> Steve: I now have 6 velvet worms.
> 
> There's a tiny (4-6mm) one that seems to have appeared from nowhere, so I'm quite pleased. How are yours doing?
> 
> Also: No to hassle wetmackeral, but that sig is _Ma-Hou-sive._


Well chap, given that I have heard of people who have bought them and they have died v quickly, I am glad to say that at least one of mine is still alive.

I had three.

A (relatively) large one, a medium sized one, and a tiny one.

The medium sized one died (mentioned that on this thread, I think), the little one I have *never* seen since, however, the largest of the three is still alive, and seems to be growing.

Maybe my little one got on a bus to you.


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## enlightenment

wetmackeral said:


> Mine are doing well, I too have found a couple of little wrigglers in the moss. Ruddy hard to spot though.
> 
> And yes, I know he sig was oversized to the extreme, soi I've changed it for summet smaller


:Na_Na_Na_Na: Good, because I kept banging my head trying to read your posts!


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## enlightenment

Tsk.

Just found it dead.

Think it was hard to keep it as cold as I'd have lived, here.

Oh well.


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## Joe1507

Ive no Idea about them but they look cool!


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