# brumation and energy costs



## spigotbush (Feb 8, 2019)

just thought it would be a good idea to share a little of our methods. with the energy issues getting worse i worry a lot of people will be giving up on their reptiles and there isnt enough space in rescues to accommodate a flood of surrenders. fortunately for many common species in the hobby keepers could start brumating and save themselves some energy costs over the winter when they would be worst. i am a believer that if the species brumate naturally then it should be done in captivity but i know there are many who just dont. some because they dont want to not see their animals for a months. some that dont agree that its part of their biology. some who simply dont know how, are too scared to ask or dont believe they have the facilities to do so. i think that there is a fair amount of people who may be able to at least stave off having to give up their pets by adapting. there is plenty of good and in depth instructions on how to go about it so hows about we put up some of the day to day side.

personally, i brumate in a small room in the house. my house doesnt have any central heating so i can use this little box room and it can get down to 2c if i leave the window open. its straight forward tubs with ventilation, some with aspen, some with soil. i set all my lights to switch off before sunset in general so that they follow the natural light levels through the year.
for my adult russian rat snake i use an 84ltr rub which i put 4-6 inches of soil in the bottom and two hides. one is in the soil and the other is a closed bottom one (a quality street tub thing) which i put aspen in. this is so he can choose a drier hide should he want to. then i put the water bowl in and change the water every few days. he doesnt particularly use the hides much though and will often be sat on the surface. for him i let him sit at ambient temps, he will slow down a little at 15c but will still be active until it drops below 10c and then he will settle in. if it drops to 5c i will open the door and let some house heat in to help and that keep him between 5-10c. he will refuse food at the start of october so he will then be gradually cooled down and once the temps in the box room line up with the viv i transfer him across, which is usually 4-6 weeks. so by mid november he is down to temp and settled in and will stay down until the beginning of march. then he will get moved back to the viv but no heat/lights, just house temps, for another couple of weeks, then i start warming things back up again.

my corn snake goes into a spare 3ft viv (tub would be fine, i just have it in the box room anyway) with aspen substrate, water bowl and two hides. one dry and one with soil/moss, which he rarely ever uses. that viv has a ceramic heater which i set at 10c to act as a safety net. he will keep eating until mid january if i keep offering so i stop feeding at the start of november and gradually cool him down. he will be in bed by mid december and stays down until beginning of march. he goes shorter because i know he will refuse food in the spring so i stretch the feeding a little further to help him along. he will become inactive at 15c so i maintain 10-15c.

the milos grass snake i do much the same as the corn snake. 

it sounds like a lot but the day to day is really simple. i manage the temps and light in accordance with sunrise/set and the temps just drop a couple of degrees every few days. my vivs are reasonably big and the heaters are localised so they will naturally cool down along with the house. the most important is deciding when to stop feeding so that there is time to clear them out and get their guts empty. its fortunate for me that my house is fairly cold so its pretty direct. i would do much the same with an insulated shed (like those little tool stores) if i didnt have that option though. if i saw something untoward with their health at the point of stopping feeding or the cool down then i would go to the vet and follow their advice.

it certainly a little dull without the snakes around and come spring i am well up for getting them up again. its a nice rest for the finances though as there is no food or heat to account for. plus i use the winter to do any modifications or alterations to the vivs and the room, i find it really useful.


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

We brumate all the subadult to adult colubrids as well, so will be doing the same this winter, which will definitely help keep electricity down. I also don't heat many species at night (unless they're from a particularly tropical climate like SE Asia) and then I shorten the days to naturally replicate winter which also helps with electricity costs. 
Many people heat their animals all the time, or provide night time heat sources for species that don't really need it such as Beardies. Definitely doesn't help with impending electricty crisis. 

Also people are dumping their animals to save electricity use and then still using stuff like tumble dryers and boiling the kettle constantly..... its nonsense


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## NickN (11 mo ago)

Good posts and some useful information, thank you. Where I live the outdoor temperature almost never goes below freezing even at night in the winter, so am planning to use 64 or 84 litre RUBs filled with de-dusted hay (handy as that's what we use for ferret bedding too) and place them in the part of the house that is completely unheated.
Potentially I could also use the shed, but there's not much light there, and I don't know how important light, or lack of very much, would be during brumation?

Would a king snake (L. mex mex) or a rosy boa be suitable candidates for brumation as well as Asian rats? If so it would just leave my spotted python and northern blue tongue skink as consumers of energy during the winter.


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

NickN said:


> Good posts and some useful information, thank you. Where I live the outdoor temperature almost never goes below freezing even at night in the winter, so am planning to use 64 or 84 litre RUBs filled with de-dusted hay (handy as that's what we use for ferret bedding too) and place them in the part of the house that is completely unheated.
> Potentially I could also use the shed, but there's not much light there, and I don't know how important light, or lack of very much, would be during brumation?
> 
> Would a king snake (L. mex mex) or a rosy boa be suitable candidates for brumation as well as Asian rats? If so it would just leave my spotted python and northern blue tongue skink as consumers of energy during the winter.


I don't think the light would make much difference, though mine are all put in a room with a window so there is a natural light cycle. I do know some keepers do brumate their animals in almost total darkness, I guess the animals are often underground. 

Mex mex can be brumated yes, same goes for the rosys. Asian ratsnake is vague, does depend on the species, stuff like bamboos and mandarins require brumation, other species such as Red Tail racers can't be brumated.


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## NickN (11 mo ago)

Ah, that's good to know, and yes given that many do brumate in caves/underground I suppose it would make sense not to worry too much about the light.

I should have been more specific: Russian and Japanese. Both of which I am led to understand (and have therefore made preparations for already) pretty much require brumation for an optimum life, regardless of breeding intentions?


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## LiasisUK (Sep 30, 2019)

Yes both those species can be brumated, especially if trying to breed them. Russian ratsnakes can tolerate very cool temps


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## Malum Argenteum (5 mo ago)

Great discussion. 

Can confirm that rosy boas are a good candidate for brumation. They are typically brumated to cycle for breeding; I give mine at least three months at about 45-50F/7-10C. They hold weight well over that period so I don't think four months would be too long. Make sure that their water bowl is small and not tippable; I've read of rosies coming out of brumation with RIs after spilling their water.

I have some experience with brumating the same specimens in both natural light cycles and darkness. I currently brumate in a basement room with a small window, but for the first 10 or so years with my box turtle group (_Terrapene triunguis_) they were brumated in a fridge with no light cycles. I did not find any difference in the turtles' toleration of brumation or apparent overall well being under the two different methods. They typically dig in for the winter (in the wild of course, but also in captive brumation), which is somewhat different than other (snake) species who may just find a deep rock crevice with some light penetration so it is hard to know how analogous the cases are.


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