# Hognose hunger strike



## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

I got a 1 year old baby hognose who has been a picky eater for a while now but now shes completely off food for 3 months now and im getting concerned.
Anyone got any fixes? ive tried brumating, more heat, less heat, smaller enclosure, co habing with good eating females, scenting the pinkies etc....


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

The most likely cause is husbandry. How exactly are you keeping her?


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## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

In a 12 liter tub with aspen, a moss hide on the warm end a water bowl on the cool end with a dry hide.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

Bariof said:


> In a 12 liter tub with aspen, a moss hide on the warm end a water bowl on the cool end with a dry hide.


How are you heating her, what is the heat source, how are you measuring the temperature?
And what temperatures are you providing?


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## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

Warm end is 32°c cool end is room temp which is between 24-26°c. She's on a meat mat with a thermostat.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

Warm end isn't warm enough. Mats are not ideal unless in a heated room as they do not warm the air.
You need to have the warm end at around 34.
Are you using a thermometer?


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## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

Yeah


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## Helvetica (Mar 20, 2017)

Just having a look through your recent threads and you've had another snake refuse to feed, likely due to wanting to brumate admittedly, and then have also had a mite infestation and an issue with another animal. 
Firstly, just as an overall, snakes don't necessarily need/want to feed constantly. One of mine will likely have 5-6 meals in a year and is perfectly happy with that, whilst another would eat every day if I offered. Droughts in appetite are not necessarily a cause for alarm. 
Regarding care requirements and husbandry, this is likely the route cause of your issue as mentioned above. Especially with species that enjoy a warmer climate heat mats just don't really cut the mustard. They do nothing to raise ambient temperatures. 
You mentioned that you had tried co-habiting this animal with other hognoses, and that was a particularly surprising idea given female hognoses especially are not opposed to cannibalism.
How often are you interacting with this animal at the moment, I would suggest that it sounds like in 3 months you have made numerous attempts to get it to eat by changing environments multiple times, and to attempt to brumate over summer in a very short period which likely will have done nothing. 

If it were my animal, and there was nothing imminently concerning like they were very lethargic or underweight, I would improve the heating, add hides and clutter to the viv and in 2-3 weeks simply introduce 2/3 pinkies overnight and shut the viv back up to give the snake 24 hours to choose to eat. 

I understand you have kept other animals in RUB's and I personally don't rate them, if you are choosing to care long term for your animals I would recommend picking up some wooden vivs second hand here/on preloved and making an effort to improve husbandry that way. From your previous threads you have at least 3 animals and were looking to acquire more. Some animals will not cope well with minimalist setups like RUB's and heat mats. Just something to consider.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

Bariof said:


> Yeah


This is like pulling teeth! 
Is it digital or analogue? Where is it placed? 
What would help would be a photo of the enclosure.
That said, having kept and bred both Western and Mexican hognoses, I can safely say that they do much better in a heated enclosure with overhead heating.


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## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

If I had the space or one I would but its reserved for the garters, the thing I don't get is that all of the other hognoses are smashing food every week. (That's 5).


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## Helvetica (Mar 20, 2017)

Helvetica said:


> Some animals will not cope well with minimalist setups like RUB's and heat mats. Just something to consider.


It sounds like you have a lot of animals kept in absolute bare minimum setups. At the end of the day when you do this you accept that you will not be meeting all of their care needs. And when you cannot meet their needs there will be a risk that they do not tolerate it. 
Best of luck for you and the little hoggy.


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## Elly66 (Feb 27, 2021)

Bariof said:


> If I had the space or one I would but its reserved for the garters, the thing I don't get is that all of the other hognoses are smashing food every week. (That's 5).


I'll say straight up that I am against rubs, except for hatchlings/ neonates /snakelet. 
Sorry if this sounds rude, but if you don't have the space and can't buy extra vivariums, please don't get anymore snakes. Think of their needs not your wants. Any animal we care for deserves that. 

Yes, it can be hard and yes, sometimes we have to admit we can no longer give them what they need. It's something I went through recently with my much loved pygmy goats due to my declining physical health and mobility, but their needs were my priority.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

Bariof said:


> If I had the space or one I would but its reserved for the garters, the thing I don't get is that all of the other hognoses are smashing food every week. (That's 5).


If you do not have the space to properly house all of your animals the you need to decide which you keep.
All snakes are different. They all need different care.
So suddenly you have 5 hogs?
So should know how to keep them.
Frankly your husbandry as described is lacking.
If the snake in question was bought as a reliable, established feeder, taking unscented defrost rodents, then there should be no issue. No need to scent either.
The only cause for refusing food is sub par housing.
I did ask you HOW you ar measuring the temperature, a question you have not answered.


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## Bariof (Jul 5, 2021)

ian14 said:


> If you do not have the space to properly house all of your animals the you need to decide which you keep.
> All snakes are different. They all need different care.
> So suddenly you have 5 hogs?
> So should know how to keep them.
> ...


I'm using a 100w Microclimate Thermostat attached to the bottom on the heat mat.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

Bariof said:


> I'm using a 100w Microclimate Thermostat attached to the bottom on the heat mat.


That says literally nothing other than you are using the cheapest way to heat a snake.
So it seems you actually have no means of checking the temperature being provided the mat.
Please, either rehome these snakes or get them properly set up.
The hognose not feeding is down to one reason. 
Your husbandry is wrong.


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## TheHouseofReptilez (Sep 26, 2021)

Bariof said:


> I'm using a 100w Microclimate Thermostat attached to the bottom on the heat mat.


You can't take temps from a thermostat not one as cheap as the Microclimate 100w either as it has no digital screen,

I use the Microclimate 100w to heat a mat for one of my baby corns but I also have a digital themometer taking the temps along with a temp gun,

I also have a young royal in a rub on a heat mat on a habistat 600w thermostat again with a digital thermometer to take temps alongside the temp gun,

These animals are in my bedroom 4 snakes and a leopard gecko there's no excuse for not being able to provide the correct enclosures, heating and temps if you can't do that then please do as Ian said rehome a few of them as they deserve the best.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

OP, any reply?????
We are trying to help here, sadly I think our help may be wasted. And a snakes life lost due to a stubborn pigheaded attitude.


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

ian14 said:


> OP, any reply?????
> We are trying to help here, sadly I think our help may be wasted. And a snakes life lost due to a stubborn pigheaded attitude.


Ian, there seems to be a trend of late where "new" people join the forum, ask for urgent assistance, get input and advice, sometimes very detailed advice, and then it never gets followed up and the new member disappears never to post again. The recent thread on vets in Doncaster in which I got flamed for providing too much detail is another prime example where the OP was an active poster up until the date of the appointment and hasn't posted on that thread since.

I sometimes wonder why we bother at times...


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## TheHouseofReptilez (Sep 26, 2021)

It's actually quite sad, I question do these people take the advice provided or does it fall on deaf ears?

And this *''If I had the space or one I would'' *that is quite worrying why would you get another snake knowing you don't have the room to give it the correct setup? or even make room, as I said my reptiles are in my room and I can tell you my room isn't very big but yet I've gave up things in order to provide them with the correct enclosures there needs come before my own and the same should apply for the animals you keep,

So I say this either make room for the correct enclosure for that Hognose or rehome him or her to someone who will privide the correct setting for that snake.


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

Well the OP was last active on 30th June so would have seen this thread as he only posted on it the day before, so I'm guessing they have chosen not to respond to the advice or questions asked.


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## TheHouseofReptilez (Sep 26, 2021)

Very sad that they were given some great advice by long time keepers and have decided not to even acknowledge any of it,

I hope the OP does the right thing when it comes to the snakes,

Very sad indeed.


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

TheHouseofReptilez said:


> Very sad that they were given some great advice by long time keepers and have decided not to even acknowledge any of it,
> 
> I hope the OP does the right thing when it comes to the snakes,
> 
> Very sad indeed.


after watching "the undeclared war" on Channel four, I sometimes wonder if they are genuine keepers or people from some form of agency that post provoking topics in order to generate lots of responses to make the forum owners stats look good for the financial backers --


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## TheHouseofReptilez (Sep 26, 2021)

Malc said:


> after watching "the undeclared war" on Channel four, I sometimes wonder if they are genuine keepers or people from some form of agency that post provoking topics in order to generate lots of responses to make the forum owners stats look good for the financial backers --


Not a bad thought actually and maybe the case either that or this guy is asking for help getting the awnser and choosing to ignore the advice given to him,

I'm unsure what one to believe and we'll never know seeing as the OP has vanished into thin air.


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