# RSPCA Donations



## bradly

Despite all the negative sentiment towards the RSPCA I do think that they carry out an imperative role towards animal safety and welfare. As a NGO they rely entirely on donations and I can happily confess to being a donor.

Do any of you guys give to the RSPCA and does it make any difference if and when they visit?


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## wozza_t

I do not give to the RSPCA, would rather put my money into a strangers pocket than give to them.

And I think I would make there lives hell, trying to get into my house to see my reps, just so they have to waste time and money organising police, transport, "OFFICERS" etc.

But thats just who i am, when they come to me, with the correct information into how to keep my specific reptiles, including the minor details, then i may be a bit more welcoming.....
but untill then, god help the one who knocks my door, cos noone else will!:lol2:


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## candoia aspera

i don't give to charity as i don't know where the money will go - selfish i know but that's my stance.

if i was gonna throw caution to the wind the RSPCA would come high on the list - i don't have a problem with them if they don't have a problem with me.


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## peaches

No I do not give to the RSPCA, I do support local animal sanctuaries : victory:


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## punky_jen

id rather do hands on work, caring for the animals, that way i know im helping.


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## *H*

With the salaries the R.S.P.C.A pay their high ranking employees I don't think they need 'donations'............

I'd rather donate to a more deserving organization


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## Nerys

lets see

would i donate to a group, who.. from every pound i give them allocate about 4p to the animals, whilst the other 96p gets stashed in their bank accounts.. 

NO i bloody well would not!

did you know that none of the money you donate goes to the individual centres for instance? that they all have to be self funding? bet you did not know that did you..

the truth hurts, is how the saying goes. at the moment, the truth is hidden.. we're working on that though.. watch this space etc etc

if you have to donate to the rspca.. find your local reptile inspector and buy him some reptile handling equipment.. they are not provided with any at all by the muppets than run it.

better still, donate to the Cats protection league, Pdsa, Dogs Trust (formerly canine defense league), your local herp group

but not to the group who have more in reserve than some small countries have in yearly income..

Nerys


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## 1949_sam

I would never donate to them as an old friend use to work there and i asked her about my dog as i wanted to give him up and asked her if i gave him to the R.S.P.C.A what would happen to him and all she said was make sure u say a very big good buy to him as they hold for a max of 2 months and then put them to sleep. So what does all that money really go on then as it's not to care for the animals or re home them etc as my 10 year old dog would be put to sleep if he went there


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## bradly

So what do they actually do with the cash then?


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## gaz

well they play the stock market for one,also they invest in property
regards gaz


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## Nerys

well.... 

have a read here... thats one example..

Perversion of Justice

as to the rest... the majority is sitting in accounts, waiting to be used... for what? this is a good question.. but there is enough there to really give us all grief...

something will be published later on, i'll link you all to it then.. no doubt we could get sh*t for doing it, but the information IS public domain, just as yet un released in a format where it can be seen, easily read, and easily understood.

it makes for shocking reading guys.. a few of us had a preview last night, and tbh, even we were appalled..

N


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## bradly

As does any sensible company to ensure future cash flows...its a normal part of business. If they are a registered charity there will be checks that it uses donations wisely. 

Oxfam is a big big property investor....


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## hermanlover

i got told off for slaggin off the rspca:lol2: so i wont say much.

all ill say is i would rather burn the cash than give it to them


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## lightbulb1976

with the attitude i got when they turned up at my door step. i wouldnt give a bucket of water to them if they were on fire, (could have put something abit nastier if i could). 

when she come over she even admitted she didnt know about reps.

sean


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## Nerys

normal part of a business...

yus, but they are a NON POLITICAL CHARITY.. 

why are they stashing so much cash... we are not talking a few grand..

why do they not fund their regional centres..

why do they pay some staff so highly

why do they not spend the money "helping the animals" as they are supposed to do? when you see the figures for how many animals taken in, don't come back out..

its wrong, they are wrong. they should not take donations from people, and spend less than 5% helping the animals they are there to protect

N


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## bradly

It does make for shocking reading but you cannot guarantee that it is true!! The RSPCA is set up for a good cause and I am sure that they go at least some way to do it! 

They do not deliberately set out to be corrupt, the responsibility of that lies with the individual. Just like the police force must have a fair share of corrruption it still does the job it is intended to do.

I am going to investigate further with a view to my donations.


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## Nerys

bradly said:


> As does any sensible company to ensure future cash flows...its a normal part of business. If they are a registered charity there will be checks that it uses donations wisely.
> 
> Oxfam is a big big property investor....


who checks them? the government? 

and they are so pure yes? (cash for honours... cash for favours...)

N


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## LeeH

to all the people looking for other places to send donation money than the RSPCA...ill have it 
seriously..id rather do many painful things to self than give a penny to those barstewards


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## Nerys

bradly said:


> They do not deliberately set out to be corrupt,


unfortunately this is not necessarily the case.

both the rspca and government have very very strong ties with the animal rights groups... indeed people within both, are part of such ideas themselves.. there are people within the rspca who would like nothing more than to see no pets being kept at all in this country

this info IS accurate... figures are for 2005, and are published on PKL currently. (Pro Keepers Lobby | "Left Wing Right Politics!")

there will, as i said, be further infomation published soon.

*In the UK there are in excess of 300 organisations that are either overtly or covertly Animal Rights orientated and opposed to the pet industry, and to a greater or lesser extent pet keeping. The ten most proactive anti pet trade organisations (and subsidiaries) are shown above. Additionally these organisations employ between them at least 7 political lobbyists, and have heavy weight political supporters.*​ *Annual Income for Organisations Opposed to the Pet Industry*​ *Total charitable income: £191,761,484*​ *Total non-charitable income: £ 25,704,738*​ * Total income: £217,466,200
​ * _*Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals [RSPCA]*_​ *Advocates For Animals*​ *Animal Aid [AA]*​ *Born Free Foundation*​ *Captive Animals Protection Society [CAPS]*​ *Captive Animals Protection Trust [CAPT]*​ *Environmental Investigation Agency [EIA]*​ *International Fund For Animal Welfare [IFAW]*​ *IFAW Charitable Trust*​ *Political Animal Lobby [PAL]*​ * People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals [PETA]​ Royal Society for the Protection of Birds [RSPB]​** World Society for the Protection of Animals [WSPA]​*


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## hermanlover

bradly, from the looks of things on this thread i think you are the only one that supports (or donates) to the RSPCA. i think there are more people that would rather give the money to a stranger than to the RSPCA. to be honest i dont think they deserve to have a name!! :lol2:

(as you can tell i am RSPCA's biggest fan) :lol2:


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## DaveM

much rather give money to the PDSA that to a "charity" who only tends to go out when their is a camera crew with them


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## wozza_t

what anoys me the most is the fact that they call themselves a "royal sociaty".
do you think the monarchy knows about all this corruption, when they could even get a ban on them owning dogs!

i am a proper royalist!!! come on queeny, sort this out!


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## Nerys

and whilst my blood is up... and yes, this is a long post, and yes they do make me cross.. this whole joke of a set up makes me blooming furious tbh... hence why i am now involved in the fight against the apathy and oppression going on... its great to see some mods who are just as apathetic as the majority of keepers, and goes to show why we get no-where fast. well new blood, a new generation. its time for US to kick butt i feel...

how about an article from the Times... just to show its not "just" people on forums who have issues with them

Invasion of privacy - Times Online

read this too

The Court Case

and this

Untitled Document

and this

Would you keep a horse in these conditions? The RSPCA have.

would you keep a horse in these conditions? the RSPCA have...










how about a conviction for perverting the course of justice? thats a good way to spend the money donated by the public.. the RSPCA were convicted, not the animal keeper..

The Attorney General v The Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals

how about this, from the *Alternative Veterinary Medicine Centre
RSPCA

* *The Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals*​ This is the largest and richest animal welfare charity in the UK. As far as can be ascertained, it has, at the time of writing, approximately £170m in the bank.
There are questions being asked, however, about how much this organisation in its present guise is a positive force for animal welfare, as its founders wished. There are several areas in which these concerns arise.
There are reports of ‘bully-boy’ tactics in seizing animals, often illegally, from people who have no wish to hurt animals. These seized animals are sometimes reported to be inadequately kept and to end up dead, with no chance for their legal owners to collect defence evidence. On the question of illegal seizure, the RSPCA has long known the law and has apparently knowingly flouted it, according to its own statements, in the pursuit of prosecutions. The RSPCA has a vested interest in prosecutions, since they attract more funds, yet it is still allowed to bring them and to take statements under oath. The Police and Customs & Excise no longer bring prosecutions themselves, instead going through the Crown Prosecution Service. The Scottish RSPCA does not bring its own prosecutions and has been heard to list the disadvantages (and unwarranted cost) of doing so.
RSPCA Inspectors have intimidating, police-like uniforms and read out people’s rights, telling them that "*you are not under arrest …*". What does that do to a respectable lady of 70 years? The terror can only be imagined. There are many cases in which it could be argued that education and communication were needed, not the strong arm of criminal law. Animal welfare, not convictions, should be the objective. Can a body, with a clear and manifest vested interest in prosecutions and with no constitutional ‘checks and balances’ in place, be safe with this right and capability?
There is evidence that many in the RSPCA are against natural medicine, particularly homeopathy. Prosecutions are often brought, against people using homeopathy, with no veterinary homeopathic expert brought in to support the prosecution evidence brought by the RSPCA. This approach appears to be borne of ignorance and to be fuelled by prejudice within the veterinary profession. In order to guide owners in their use of natural therapies, for animal welfare and relative security from prosecution, we have formulated some guidelines: Responsible use of natural therapies for animal welfare.
Many small, private animal rescue centres have been the subject of prosecutions. These centres attract funding from the animal-loving public, albeit in a small way, which might otherwise go to the RSPCA. One hopes that there is no connection between these facts. There is talk of licensing such establishments and the RSPCA is angling for the inspecting duty for this. Can a competing body, with no checks and balances, be safely granted such a rôle?
There are anxieties about an organisation which can set up a so-called ‘welfare standard’ for farm livestock (Freedom Food), market the food at a large premium on account of its claimed welfare merits, yet not publish the names of the farms that subscribe. There is, footage to show that welfare standards on such farms are not what they are supposed to be. There have been reports of hot-wire de-beaking of chickens and tail-docking of pigs, to prevent the cannibalism caused by the stress of over-crowding. The Director General of the RSPCA (Peter Davies) was heard, on BBC Watchdog, to say that intensive farming was a necessity. Why would a welfare organisation support such a view, unless its vested interest in Freedom Food necessitates it?
Anyway, Freedom Food is not a standard for granting a 'free' outdoor life to farm animals, as one might be led to believe from idyllic photographs. Rather it is claimed to aspire to allow the animals 'five freedoms': from 'hunger & thirst', from 'discomfort', from 'pain, injury or disease', from 'fear & distress' and to be able to 'express normal behaviour'. The  Daily Telegraph reported on the RSPCA's subsequent search, at great financial cost, for the council member who spoke out on the programme. Free CDs are obtainable from Hillside animal sanctuary. Footage and reports can be viewed at: Hillside animal sanctuary, to compare reality against expectation.
It may be surprising to learn that the Freedom Food logo has even been ‘sold’ to MacDonalds (of all companies) and other retailers, and appears on their take-out food packs. It is not clear what the RSPCA earns from this.
The RSPCA has written disparaging remarks about welfare on organic farms (their direct competitor in the market place, for food sold at a premium) and about the use of homeopathy on organic livestock units. There is talk of licensing all livestock farms, whether organic or not. The RSPCA could be in line for the inspecting duty for this. Can a competing body, with a vast commercial interest, with a self-confessed prejudice and with no constitutional ‘checks and balances’, be safely granted such a rôle?
The RSPCA recently published its 10-point Action Plan, in the wake of the Foot & Mouth Disease disaster. In it are some worthwhile proposals, which had often been made by others, long before the FMD crisis! It speaks of the evils of long-distance travel to slaughter, remarking that this has long been known. Why did this 10-point Plan not appear before, if it was so obvious to the RSPCA? Where were the RSPCA, when animals needed them? Others have spoken out stridently about such things while the RSPCA, with enough funds to enable it to be effective, stood back. What happens to RSPCA ‘Freedom Food’ animals destined for slaughter? Has the 10-point Plan yet achieved anything, for the welfare of farm animals?
Where were the RSPCA when animals were starving and drowning in fields, left there because of Foot and Mouth (FMD) movement restrictions? The MAFF appeared to be guilty of mass and corporate cruelty, by leaving these animals to starve (In the interest of conserving our meat export market). Why was there no prosecution? The RSPCA may have been guilty because it did nothing. It could have brought prosecutions against MAFF. With its millions, it could also have paid the military to airlift and drop hay for these unfortunate creatures.
Where were the RSPCA, during the same crisis, when animals were being wrongly shot, being left to die slowly in the piles of their dead fellows? Was this what they refer to as ‘necessary suffering’?
It may surprise the reader to know that there appear to be no controls over the RSPCA. There is a Police Complaints Commission; there is an Insurance Ombudsman; there are watchdogs for telephone, electricity and gas suppliers. There is no such person or body to apply checks and balances to the actions and activities of the RSPCA. Nonetheless, this organisation has been given even more powers, through the Animal Welfare Act 2006 (successor of the Protection of Animals Act 1911).
Police-like uniforms, police-like ranks, the right to take a statement under oath, the right to bring criminal prosecutions without a ‘filter’ being applied by the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS), the secrecy over the ‘Freedom Food’ scheme, the routine mutilation of animals in that scheme; are these the usual activities that we associate with an animal welfare charity?
It is always worth looking at the spending pattern of any charity, to which one is considering making a contribution. If a charity spends your money on an activity, you are effectively funding that activity. It is prudent to be sure that you agree with the actual use of the money, rather than the stated objectives of the charity. The case of P.C. Jonathan Bell, who was prosecuted for killing a seriously injured cat, in which he was acquitted, a verdict against which the RSPCA tried unsuccessfully to appeal, should be read (Daily Telegraph 8th April 2006). The BBC aired a report on this case: '_The RSPCA and the Dead Cat_', at 10am on Sunday, April 9 on BBC Radio Five Live. The relevant web page is: BBC NEWS | England | Staffordshire | Pc 'pursued' over killing of cat .
Animals desperately need a champion. The money that has been donated to the RSPCA has been given for the cause of animal welfare. We sincerely hope that the RSPCA will revisit its roots and remember its original purpose. In this way, we may regain an effective and rightly wealthy animal welfare charity, in which we can have confidence and pride.
If anyone has information about the RSPCA or Freedom Food, from any standpoint, we will be grateful to hear it via our feedback facility. We are, however, only able to take information that is properly supported by fact.
Also read Protection of Animals Act 1911and Animal Welfare Act 2006.


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## Nerys

and how hard is it to find things like this? just google:

ALL this info is already hosted freely on a number of sites round the web..


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## Mez

"RSPCA Donations"
- I'd hapilly donate some knowledge....


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## hermanlover

two things i would donate

1) knowl;edge (as mez said)

2) my fist in thir face :lol2: (they make me angry especiall after seing the state of those horses)


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## bradly

Bloody hell! I'm sold.

I started this thread to get a discussion going on the RSPCA as I was thinking about setting up a donation...certainly not going to do that now. 

How can we get the RSPCA discredited? Lets get organised and take action (legal action ie letters petitions etc not riots or raids!)


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## hermanlover

it would be very hardto take action as they work closley with the government!!

there are things that we could do, but the RSPCA just would not listen to them purley because they dont have to!!


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## DaveM

not riots or raids...spoil all my fun :lol:


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## Nerys

sure thing, the more the merrier... to have a voice, we need people to stand up and be counted... not sit around pretending it will never happen to them... 

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## bradly

I saw that website and couldnt really read it due to the silly colour scheme going on. It would look a lot better with blue and white, would be more easily printed and I am sure more people would take it seriously..


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## Nerys

how about reading the aims and doing something about it? instead of asking us to change our colours to match the RSPCA's !!!

N


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## gaz

well put N
regards gaz


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## WeThePeople

gaz said:


> well they play the stock market for one,also they invest in property
> regards gaz


Do you have any sources for that? That would be hugely illegal if true.

Im another RSPCA hater too, couldnt care less either way till they offered my wife a job a couple of years ago. Whe she was in meetings with them she got to see them for their true colours.


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## bradly

Hey hey Nerys don't get mad at me matey!!


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## rockkeeper

i donate to them




a large contico box,


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## gaz

WeThePeople said:


> Do you have any sources for that? That would be hugely illegal if true.
> 
> Im another RSPCA hater too, couldnt care less either way till they offered my wife a job a couple of years ago. Whe she was in meetings with them she got to see them for their true colours.


 
dont have the sources to hand,there was a lot of investigation onto RSPCA dealing during the fight to preserve hunting,one thing i know for sure is that they took out full page advertisements in the broadsheets to put their case at £30,000 a pop,not really the right way to use their money surely??
regards gaz


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## DaveM

Nerys, I have bookmarked that site in your sig


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## peaches

Remeber the petition into the RSPCA on the *Goverments* *own* website.

And this was their reply.:whip:

The Animal Welfare Act 2006 - as with most other legislation - is a 'common informers act'. That means any person or organisation can bring a private prosecution under the legislation. It is because anyone can initiate criminal proceedings under animal welfare legislation that the RSPCA successfully prosecutes between 750 and 1,000 people each year who have been found to have caused unnecessary suffering to animals.

There is no evidence to show that this current arrangement is not working. Indeed the evidence suggests the contrary: the RSPCA are successful in some 97% of cases they bring before the courts (2004). That is a very high success rate and clearly justifies the RSPCA's general approach. The Government is not aware of any complaints from Magistrates' Courts about the way the RSPCA bring cases before them and we are satisfied that there are adequate safeguards in place within the judicial system to ensure that the right to bring private prosecutions is not abused.
The Government works closely with the RSPCA to ensure this country has the highest animal welfare standards. The RSPCA has played a crucial role as enforcers of animal welfare law for more than a hundred years, and the Government hopes that they will continue to do so in the future.


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## Nerys

well, tbh... there is just a tad more to worry about than the colour scheme of a website you know!!!

tbh, we were thinking of having a "simple" version for those who cannot navigate the main site... but at the moment there is more to do.. like publishing the figures and facts we have obtained.. 

trust me, they make far more interesting reading than whether the site is black, blue or pink with purple spots!

N


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## FreddiesMum

I would not donate to the RSPCA but I am happy to donate to cat charities and WWF


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## bradly

Nerys I am sure that the facts and figures are indeed more important. I was just suggesting a very easy way of making it more accesible. I dont have very good eyes and those colours made it hard for me to read the website...


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## gaz

one thing that happened at that time is that pro hunt/shoot people joined the rspca and voted against things they wanted to do at their ruling council meetings. this is the right of anyone in the country to have their say in the running and direction of a charity,however the rspca started vetting anyone wanting to join and screened out the opposition,i'd say at a guess that this is and was illegal.
may be possible for pro pet keepers to join still and vote down proposals within the organisation itself??
regards gaz


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## gaz

FreddiesMum said:


> I would not donate to the RSPCA but I am happy to donate to cat charities and WWF


i am a member of the WWF though even they have to be watched carefully,not everything they do is what you might want
regards gaz


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## WeThePeople

gaz said:


> dont have the sources to hand,there was a lot of investigation onto RSPCA dealing during the fight to preserve hunting,one thing i know for sure is that they took out full page advertisements in the broadsheets to put their case at £30,000 a pop,not really the right way to use their money surely??
> regards gaz


No but there's a big difference in spending money irresponsibly and illegally. If they are playing the stock market or investing money ini property or any investment then they are breaking the law.


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## Nerys

Mmmm bradley... the background and colour scheme is the one used generally by the  TSKA  brand, so all the sites under tska's branding hold the same format.. 

TSKA, (the specialist keepers association) works as the consultancy for FOCUS, and also hosts, runs and maintains PKL.

is it the colour of the text against the back ground? the back ground itself? or what part of it?

N


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## bradly

Presumably as a company we can get copies of their accounts from Companies HOuse and see exactly what they do with the money they receive. 
If they do invest it I am not sure that it is illegal activity. Why would it be??


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## sparkle

although I am in the process of moving house and cant do much right now my partner and myself have decided once the move is over we will fully get behind this... I am a member of SEAS and they are affiliated with FBH... but I know thats not enough if I want to feel safe in the knowledge that in 10 years I can keep my animals without animosity at my door... I am truly supportive of DOING something.. I havent decided yet where my help is best required but once my heads stopped spinning and were all moved in I wil be onto this... 

perhaps it took a thread that wasnt INTENTIONALLY started about politics and facts to stir people up... 


well done nerys for posting all that info... thanks


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## carpetviper

I dont give them money but I do go out and help them and advise them when they have a reptile and they are not sure about it like if the snake is huge or they have been told it could be a hot. I also foster reps for them occasionally too


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## pythonmatty

i dont give to the rspca as the ones in my area dont have a clue with reptiles anyway but i do donate to the local reptile rescue as i see were my money goes then but rspca NO.....


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## gaz

pythonmatty said:


> i dont give to the rspca as the ones in my area dont have a clue with reptiles anyway but i do donate to the local reptile rescue as i see were my money goes then but rspca NO.....


in your sig should read Corallus hortulanus not enhydris
regards gaz


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## 1949_sam

I wonder wear the money does go as this is still happing everwhere 

*Warning* this video contains graphic and disturbing images of animal abuse and should be viewed with caution

YouTube - Animal Cruelty - Could You?


Images speak louder than words; and in this video are the images of animals who have been and still are the victims of unnecessary abuses and horrific injustices.

The answer is so simple, just don't hurt them and leave them in peace and if we do use them for our benefit under the right circumstances, we do it as humanely and with the highest code of ethics as possible.

They're not here to hurt us, they are not ours to do whatever we wish with, and they deserve the same thing all humans do (at least the kind hearted ones) and that's to just be shown kindness dignity and respect.

The song is Fire & Ice by Enya.

Thank You


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## Barry.M

I find it incredulous that some people on here keep defending an organisation that would happily destroy every single reptile kept by every single member of this forum.Their total aim is to ban the keeping of exotics completely and they are taking genuine steps towards their goal.The RSPCA is a cash register,nothing more,nothing less!


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## SiUK

no I wouldnt give them any money, ever I would rather support a local privately run animal shelter


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## madaboutreptiles

barrym said:


> I find it incredulous that some people on here keep defending an organisation that would happily destroy every single reptile kept by every single member of this forum.Their total aim is to ban the keeping of exotics completely and they are taking genuine steps towards their goal.The RSPCA is a cash register,nothing more,nothing less!


I could'nt agree more, I think the RSPCA is like most other big organisations or charity's.....they are just a money making machine:bash:


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## ratboy

Nope. The charities I support are about disabled kids, not animals.


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## madaboutreptiles

ratboy said:


> Nope. The charities I support are about disabled kids, not animals.


Bear in mind I only said "Most" not all, I have had direct experiance with UNICEF and the RED CROSS

Some Charity's are very good I,m sure?


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## ratboy

Palmanda said:


> Bear in mind I only said "Most" not all, I have had direct experiance with UNICEF and the RED CROSS
> 
> Some Charity's are very good I,m sure?


LOL... The answer was not aimed at you Palmanda... the "Nope" was in answer to "Would you donate to the RSPCA" 

The RSPCA are a money making machine and the money you donate does not go towards helping animals in need.


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## tokay

Nerys said:


> lets see
> 
> would i donate to a group, who.. from every pound i give them allocate about 4p to the animals, whilst the other 96p gets stashed in their bank accounts..
> 
> NO i bloody well would not!
> 
> did you know that none of the money you donate goes to the individual centres for instance? that they all have to be self funding? bet you did not know that did you..
> 
> the truth hurts, is how the saying goes. at the moment, the truth is hidden.. we're working on that though.. watch this space etc etc
> 
> if you have to donate to the rspca.. find your local reptile inspector and buy him some reptile handling equipment.. they are not provided with any at all by the muppets than run it.
> 
> better still, donate to the Cats protection league, Pdsa, Dogs Trust (formerly canine defense league), your local herp group
> 
> but not to the group who have more in reserve than some small countries have in yearly income..
> 
> Nerys


DITTO!


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## yellow_rat_gal

I remember a while ago owen and I were watching one of those documentaries where they follow the rspca around, and we both got really annoyed about this one case;

it was reported that someone had left their cats (with kittens) for a couple of days in the house and so they put tap over the door one night, hadn't been broken the next night so they called the police out and broken in to the house. What REALLY annoyed me was the rspca woman saying "Well they haven't left food for the kittens out" WHAT!?! They're newly born kittens! They're still nursing for gods sake! They'd left out food and water for the cats, and they were all looking healthy!

Grr


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## madaboutreptiles

Its ok, I know it wasnt a dig at me...dont worry about that. I have really thick skin anyway.............lol


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## tokay

yellow_rat_gal said:


> I remember a while ago owen and I were watching one of those documentaries where they follow the rspca around, and we both got really annoyed about this one case;
> 
> it was reported that someone had left their cats (with kittens) for a couple of days in the house and so they put tap over the door one night, hadn't been broken the next night so they called the police out and broken in to the house. What REALLY annoyed me was the rspca woman saying "Well they haven't left food for the kittens out" WHAT!?! They're newly born kittens! They're still nursing for gods sake! They'd left out food and water for the cats, and they were all looking healthy!
> 
> Grr


Typical RSPCA , i was watching them trying to catch a swan down the quay where i live , the swan had fishing tackle caught up in its feet grrr , they were trying for over 2 hours to caught the poor thing chasing it in a boat :crazy: they gave up in the end , a mate of mine who used to work the ferrie down there caught it in under 5 minutes attacting it over to the bank with some bread , it came over and he grabbed it tucked it under his arm and got the fishing tackle off then released it. it took him around 5 minutes from catching it to releasing it! the RSPCA are hopeless and havent a clue


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## Geopathic

punky_jen said:


> id rather do hands on work, caring for the animals, that way i know im helping.


 
I totally agree with this. How much of the donation just goes to the "politics" of things rather than actually to the animal? 

I fostered for Cats Protection for 3 years until I started back to work full time. Think I looked after about 35-40 cats not including the last cat we had in that came in pregnant and had 7 kittens. Really rewarding work to actually do something.

If I had the time to commit I would do it again.


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## bradly

Is it not illegal to have more than 6 cats in your house...ridiculous I know.


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## wozza_t

just watched that video on utube......is that a video from the rspca's archive? cos if so, there was a dog on there, looked all burnt up and stuff, i am sure i read about how it was the only thing to survive a house fire where the owners died! Also, how many of those animals where actually from the uk?:-x


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## Geopathic

I don't think it matters where the animals are that are being harmed. If everyone started to think the same about animal cruelty in one country then hopefully it would carry on in other countries. And how many British people in other countries are doing just what the video is showing?

I think it is disgusting that anyone can do anything like that and that includes what people do to people (but hey that is another story). All we can really do is keep our own conscious clear by repecting the animals we choose to keep. If we do have the time etc to help others then good on us - thats a bonus.


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## bradly

Any body here been to a bull fight? quite a spectacle...


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## storm

im ashamed to admit.. i did support the RSPCA.... DID until i saw all of this!! :cussing:it defies belief that a so called animal protection charity, and i use the word charity loosely, can make and keep so much money aside, while seemingly not really giving a damn about animal welfare at all!!! 

they just seem more intent with prosecuting anyone and everyone that keeps a pet. 

and their standards of care leave a lot to be desired.


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## Markgrieves

Id rather buy a meal for a guy sleeping in a doorway, than donate to the RSPCA.


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## reptilesrock

Jeeeeez.......WOW


Never realised that all that about the RSPCA went on, pretty damn shocking to learn about too. It's not like it's just someone else's view on their behaviour either, there is evidence galore, all put together seemingly undeniable too.

And the protection they as a society have seems unreal!!!!!

The only angles for realistic petition are those from way back in time starting with the "Magna Carta 1297"!!!!
Other than that it looks like "Royal Prerogative" or "Parliamentary Sovereignty" would be the best bet.

The people that are put through the justice system though with no monitoring stsyem in place is a bit screwy, i mean, which court hears the cases?
If no legallised system for monitoring of prosecution within the system of the RSPCA prosecution exists, then the whole of the UK becomes guilty of a breach of rights under the "European Convention of Human Rights" Article 6 providing the 'Right to Fair Trial' and protected by the "Human Rights Act 1998", there must be something that allows what they do...........?

Im not agreeing with it don't get me wrong, just feeling my way through one particular point that stands out very brightly to me, as an avenue to explore to bring the correct attention to the RSPCA with a view to carry out full inspections, this would be a very rewarding one!!!


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## reptilesrock

peaches said:


> Remeber the petition into the RSPCA on the *Goverments* *own* website.
> 
> And this was their reply.:whip:
> 
> The *Animal Welfare Act 2006* - as with most other legislation - is a 'common informers act'. That means *any person or organisation can bring a private prosecution under the legislation*. It is because *anyone can initiate criminal proceedings under animal welfare legislation* that the RSPCA successfully prosecutes between 750 and 1,000 people each year who have been found to have caused unnecessary suffering to animals.
> 
> There is no evidence to show that this current arrangement is not working. Indeed the evidence suggests the contrary: the RSPCA are successful in some 97% of cases they bring before the courts (2004). That is a very high success rate and clearly justifies the RSPCA's general approach. The Government is not aware of any complaints from Magistrates' Courts about the way the RSPCA bring cases before them and we are satisfied that there are adequate safeguards in place within the judicial system to ensure that the right to bring private prosecutions is not abused.
> The Government works closely with the RSPCA to ensure this country has the highest animal welfare standards. The *RSPCA **has played a crucial role as enforcers of animal welfare law for more than a hundred years, and the Government hopes that they will continue to do so in the future*.



Hmmm, seems like the required monitoring is in force then, had missed this post when reading before, sorry guys.

Still, this legislative monitoring and government support, whilst being fully legitimate under UK common law, may well be breaching the rights mentioned before in the eyes of the European Court of Justice.........it's a possibility, just needs to be raised properly.


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## slither61

Nerys said:


> lets see
> 
> would i donate to a group, who.. from every pound i give them allocate about 4p to the animals, whilst the other 96p gets stashed in their bank accounts..
> 
> NO i bloody well would not!
> 
> did you know that none of the money you donate goes to the individual centres for instance? that they all have to be self funding? bet you did not know that did you..
> 
> the truth hurts, is how the saying goes. at the moment, the truth is hidden.. we're working on that though.. watch this space etc etc
> 
> if you have to donate to the rspca.. find your local reptile inspector and buy him some reptile handling equipment.. they are not provided with any at all by the muppets than run it.
> 
> better still, donate to the Cats protection league, Pdsa, Dogs Trust (formerly canine defense league), your local herp group
> 
> but not to the group who have more in reserve than some small countries have in yearly income..
> 
> Nerys


These are all the reasons above why I would never donate to the RSPCA 

They want to spend their stashed millions training their officers about Reptiles and give them the equipment they need.
Stop killing the amount of dogs and cats they do every year

I thought charitys were not there to make a profit.

The RSPCA is a charity, How do they justify the millions they have in the bank.

I would like to see them investigated they are not putting the money donated, to the purpose people give it to them.
Why do the RSPCA center's have to be self funding, they should be getting a percentage of that money stashed in the bank.

slither61 :snake::snake::snake:


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## blood and guts

bradly said:


> Despite all the negative sentiment towards the RSPCA I do think that they carry out an imperative role towards animal safety and welfare. As a NGO they rely entirely on donations and I can happily confess to being a donor.
> 
> Do any of you guys give to the RSPCA and does it make any difference if and when they visit?


No and i never would, i havent read the full thread so may have already been mentioned but they do not need any more money! they have millions earning lots of intrest. 
They have also closed many wild animal rescue centres and try and get a officer to come out asap!
Until they loose the animal rights loonies in charge they will not be a welfare charity like they once was!
Also as reptile keepers we have a lot to loose if they carry on there current agenda so we would basicly be giving money to fund our own downfull!


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## brittone05

I would rather use my money as toilet paper than give it to an organisation like the RSPCA!


I use the word organisation because I genuinely do not feel they should be classed as a charity.

For me, a charity is a group who desperately relies on public funding NOT government funding and certianly not with an estimated £170 MILLION in the bank!

I am keen to learn more about this :



> The *Animal Welfare Act 2006* - as with most other legislation - is a 'common informers act'. That means *any person or organisation can bring a private prosecution under the legislation*. It is because *anyone can initiate criminal proceedings under animal welfare legislation*


Would I be right in assuming that, for instance I go off to my local RSPCA centre, see an animal in conditions that are incorrect under the guidelines of the AWA and get 100% fact proof that it is incorrect, as an individual, I can begin a private prosectution and a crimial proceedings case against them?

That is how I translate it and I may be totally wrong.

Recently, the RSPCA went to a small, private centre local to me. The lady is in her 70's and has spent the last 35 years or so rescuing, rehabilitating and caring for neglected nad sick animals.

In all of that time, and for the FIRST time, a member of the public contacted the RSPCA to say they didn't feel the lady could do her job properly due to her age, living space etc.

The RSPCA were in there like a shot, police in tow and have taken most of the animals away from her care. Thankfully, our local paper "The Wirral Globe" managed to cover the story from the perspective that the local public are going beserk and the basic attitude is that because this lady runs privately and relies on donations form the public which she receives with no problems, the RSPCA are miffed becasue that money isn't going into our local centre! I am sure after rading some of the figures here, the public would indeed agree that it boils solely down to greed and the need for targetted prosecution figures to be met each month.

I agree wholeheartedly, the RSPCA has become solely based on animal rights rather than welfare and there is a difference between the 2, allbeit hard to distinguish.


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## ratboy

brittone05 said:


> Would I be right in assuming that, for instance I go off to my local RSPCA centre, see an animal in conditions that are incorrect under the guidelines of the AWA and get 100% fact proof that it is incorrect, as an individual, I can begin a private prosectution and a crimial proceedings case against them?


Yes you could if you could afford to.


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## Nerys

now that would be a classic Brit...

say you were the one who walked in and spotted the LEOPARD GECKO someone handed in..

you know? those yellow and purple geckos that come from the pakistan deserts???

well, i would love to prosecute the dickhead at the rspca who identified it as an english newt and housed in on a rock in a fish tank of water..

poor bloody gecko... rspca.. sink or swim?

N


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## ratboy

Unfortunately with private prosecutions, the winner is invariably the one with the most money.


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## brittone05

That is indeed true Steve but it is good to know, that in theory, the tables may well be turned for the RSPCA at some stage.

It sickens me to think that with the cash they have, they could do so much - so much more than buy bloomin cars and expensive suits that don't do anything to protect the welfare of the animals they are there for


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## hermanlover

we went to court a while ago (wont bore you with the details)over a horse we were sold. anyway we didnt have to pay any legal fees. we pay extra in our house insurance to be covered in legal stuff. the insurance would have had to pay 15 grand in legal fees, but we won it so the stupid woman that conned us had to pay 20 grand in total!!!!!

dunno if you would be able to use the same type of thing with the RSPCA?

would be worth a try


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## brittone05

I don't think that would be applicable due ot it being more down to a criminal proceeding. I know with financial claims you can go privately to paper court (civil court) and that the fees are relatively nominal and that the losing party pays the fees for both the court tie and the solicitors etc.

I am pretty sure that should a case ever arise against the RSPCA, there would be a fair few solicitors who would work for free on it - all in the hope it would be a landslide case which would mark thema s the first solicitor to successfully work a prosecution case against in a private matter as opposed to a public matter?


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## ratboy

another point is that if you prosecuted the RSPCA under the AWA, you would presumably be prosecuting one of the animal shelters since it is they that hold the animals until they are either rehomed or destroyed.

Not really sure how it works, but I know that the shelters themselves are self funding. The RSPCA have also been known to prosecute people that they themselves use for the rehoming of animals !!!

I would be willing to bet that if you took them to court through the AWA, you would be fighting the shelter and not the actual organisation. In which case, upon losing, they would just shut down that shelter and open up another one... which means they lose little to nothing through the case.... other than some bad publicity that they can blame on the shelter.


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