# gem snow



## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

does anyone own a gem snow? or know where i might get one from? can anyone explain the genetics of them,


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

do they stay white?


or go yellow?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Gem snow, like TUG snow, is codominant to Mack snow (you can get supers that way) - but unlike Mack snow, both of those genes are DOMINANT to normal. 

An animal with two copies of Gem snow is a visual Gem snow.
An animal with one copy of Gem and one copy of normal is a Gem snow.
An animal with one copy of Gem and one copy of Mack is a super snow.


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

so do you know if a white juvenile tug or gem would stay white or do they go yellow like most macks do?


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## HadesDragons (Jun 30, 2007)

Does a Gem-Mack Super Snow look any different to a Mack Super Snow? If you have a TUG-Gem, which would be dominant in that, or is there no visual way to tell?


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

Ssthisto said:


> Gem snow, like TUG snow, is codominant to Mack snow (you can get supers that way) - but unlike Mack snow, both of those genes are DOMINANT to normal.
> 
> An animal with two copies of Gem snow is a visual Gem snow.
> An animal with one copy of Gem and one copy of normal is a Gem snow.
> An animal with one copy of Gem and one copy of Mack is a super snow.


so they kind of act a bit like enigmas seem to, you get one copy enigmas, two copy enigmas and non enigmas. is this how the gem snows work?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Other than the fact that a "one copy Enigma" IS a het....

Yes, a Gem snow looks the same whether it is het or homozygous for Gem Snow.

I don't know if a Gem/Mack "super" looks the same as a double Mack super.


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

so a one copy snow is a het because het means different? does anyone know of anyone who has gem or tugs?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

That's right.

Het ONLY means "the two genes of the pair are different" - which is why you have to account for the "normal-not-snow" gene if you've got a single-copy visual dominant animal like a Gem Snow.

Some people do get confused and think that "dominant gene = homozygous" - which can lead to confusion when their Enigma or Gem Snow has a normal-looking baby!


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

so a het gem snow can pass either its gem allele or its normal allele and depending on wich of the pair is passed on decides if the baby is gem or normal, so i'm best to get a gem x gem or tug x tug hatchling then? would this be a homozygous gem or tug?


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

suppose it might still be a heterozygous form, only way to tell would be a test breed? if i got even one non snow baby from a gem x normal pairing it would prove the gem to be a het not a hom. if it was a hom it would produce 100% gem hets?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

You've got a CHANCE of it being a homozygous Gem or TUG snow... a 33% chance, actually - out of two heterozygous animals.

Every Gem Snow out of a pair of heterozygous Gem Snow parents is 66% chance HET Gem snow - and 33% chance Homozygous Gem Snow 

And yes, if it was homozygous you would NEVER get a not-Gem offspring out of it.


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

been reading loads of stuff on American forums about gems and tugs it seems that gem snows are basically the same as mack snows but are less polluted with high yellow, therefore they stay monochrome as adults. its tug snows that are the dominant genetic snows


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

If a "super" Gem snow (i.e. homozygous Gem with a different appearance to heterozygous Gem) has never been created and a homozygous Gem looks exactly like a het one... 

Then Gem is a dominant gene.

Last I read, they had not yet produced a homozygous Gem snow that looked different to the heterozygous ones. They'd produced a Gem/Mack snow that looked like a Super Snow, but never a Gem/Gem snow that looked different.

It's sort of like the "Mystery Dilute" in royal pythons.
Cross a Platinum to a normal, and you will get some normal-looking animals and some Lesser Platinums. The normals look normal, the lessers have a distinct visual look. Breed a lesser to a lesser and you'll get some blue-eyed white snakes.
Breed a mojave to a lesser and you'll get some blue-eyed white snakes.
Breed one of the normal-looking animals to a Lesser and you will get Platinums.
Breed one of the normal-looking animals to a Mojave and you probably get Crystal Balls.

Different flavours of the same gene pair, with very slightly different effects.


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## pmamhayes (Jun 13, 2007)

boywonder said:


> does anyone own a gem snow? or know where i might get one from? can anyone explain the genetics of them,


somebody had them at doncaster, they had tugs as weel IIRC, there were on the back wall, could have been BIGYELLOWGECKO.COM or possibly 
REPTILERAPTURE.co.uk

just looked on thier sites but non seem avaable try emailing


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

pmamhayes said:


> somebody had them at doncaster, they had tugs as weel IIRC, there were on the back wall, could have been BIGYELLOWGECKO.COM or possibly
> REPTILERAPTURE.co.uk
> 
> just looked on thier sites but non seem avaable try emailing


 
nick lamb at ark has gems but he didn't have any for sale. he had a jmg co dom snow female that was quite nice but i want a tug or two now, after researching, he was under the stairs,


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## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

boywonder said:


> he had a jmg co dom snow female


That just a nother name that jmg took it up on there self the give mack snow just to make are life more confusing:lol2: .


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

it looked different to most macks, cream background with yellow saddles that had black spots only on the saddles, head and tail


i wasn't keen so didn't buy it but i didn't notice any tug snows on any tables at doncaster


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## pmamhayes (Jun 13, 2007)

boywonder said:


> nick lamb at ark has gems but he didn't have any for sale. he had a jmg co dom snow female that was quite nice but i want a tug or two now, after researching, he was under the stairs,


 thats correct he was under the stairs, We talked at lenght, but theguys/girls with the TUGS were on the back wall they had quite a few I'd never seen them befor that why I remember


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## pmamhayes (Jun 13, 2007)

pmamhayes said:


> thats correct he was under the stairs, We talked at lenght, but theguys/girls with the TUGS were on the back wall they had quite a few I'd never seen them befor that why I remember


thinking moor about it they could have been GEMS I adn'y seen those either and could have got confused?


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## arkreptiles (Sep 26, 2007)

Indeed the JMG line of Snows we are working with are effectively Mack Snows. They have however variously been bred a) for increased white and b) mixed with Hypo gene carriers and tangerine/yellow lines to produce Cremesicles.

The TUG snows are interesting and we are working with a 1.4 group currently and would dearly like to get our hands on a breeding group of Gems too.

Effectively working towards that elusive monochrome snow that will reproduce true!!!


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## boywonder (Mar 10, 2008)

nicklamb said:


> Indeed the JMG line of Snows we are working with are effectively Mack Snows. They have however variously been bred a) for increased white and b) mixed with Hypo gene carriers and tangerine/yellow lines to produce Cremesicles.
> 
> The TUG snows are interesting and we are working with a 1.4 group currently and would dearly like to get our hands on a breeding group of Gems too.
> 
> Effectively working towards that elusive monochrome snow that will reproduce true!!!


 
i thought tug snows were black and white as adults, did yours get yellow on them nick?


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