# Help Fattening Up Bearded Dragon!!



## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Hi,

I have an 8YO bearded dragon, female, who seems to have lost quite a lot of weight. She normally goes through a period over winter where she slows down quite a lot and stops eating, and I think this was made worse this year by me moving house back in November, and the house being colder generally than my old house.

Her appetite has come back in the past few weeks, after I would say.. about 2-3 months of not really being bothered. I wasn't too worried as she has done this virtually every year for the past 5 or so years, and has never lost any weight and her condition has stayed the same.

However, I have just put some locusts in with her, and she's absolutely ravenous, and seems to have lost a noticeable amount of weight. Her hip bones feel pokey and her thighs and tail are much less firm and chubby than before. I also have a nasty feeling that she may be gravid. She has not ever been mated, nor been kept with or near a male, but around May time for the past 3 years she has laid a clutch of between 18 and 25 infertile eggs. I take it this could also be contributing to the weight loss?

I'm really gutted about all of this, I've had her 8 years, and not once ever had her lose condition like this. Tank set up, she is in a 3ftx2ftx2ft viv, hot end is around 100 degrees, cold end is around 80, she has a full spectrum UV, which was last replaced in october before I moved up. Both the UV tube and the basking light are on 12 hours a day on a timer.

She doesn't eat veggies, and hasn't for a long time, but all the food is gut-loaded. I don't like to feed her too many mealworms because of their shells, or too many waxworms because of their fat content.

Has anyone else had any experience of this / has any suggestions on how to build her weight back up?

Thanks in advance,


Lindsay


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Generally a healthy beardie will not lose weight whilst brumating. But as she seems to have an appetite then hopefully she is okay and maybe underweight if she laid eggs not long before brumating thus not getting chance to put weight on before brumating.

I would suggest your basking spot needs to be higher, around 105-110f will be good for her. Try feeding her small amounts maybe twice a day and she should hopefully start putting weight back on.

Morios, the large mealworms will help her put weight back on quickly as will black crickets which are meatier than browns and locusts. Dont worry about the shells too much on the mealworms/morios as most adult beardies can cope with that.

Make sure she is kept well hydrated.


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## Ron Magpie (Oct 11, 2009)

Waxworms are also great 'fatteners'- not something that would be recommended as a staple- too rich, on the whole- but great for a bit of short-term building up.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Thanks all, will look to boost up the temperature at the hot end. She last laid eggs back in May, 18/19 if I remember correctly, and was in perfect condition before the winter / before the move.

She's had about 8 large locusts today (size below full adult with big wings) and I also picked her up some roaches which she's not had before; she chomped 3 of those down straight from the tub. I've offered her some veggies; grated carrot, broc and a grape cut in half to see if she wants a bit of fruit. She's not bothered at all with that, sprinkled a couple of waxworms in with the veg, and she's picked those out and got maybe 3 pieces of grated carrot in with the mouthful lol.

I've not tried her on crickets before or morio worms. Will try and pick some up tomorrow if I can though being easter sunday I may have to wait until tuesday.

Got plenty of food for her in the meantime which I'm gutloading with broccoli and carrot.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

More bad news. Whilst she's still eating like a horse, I'm not seeing any noticeable improvement in her weight, and when I picked her up today to feel if her belly felt full, I've felt a lump on her ribcage. It feels hard and immovable, though I didn't really squeeze it or move it in case it's painful. It seems to be on top of her ribcage in between her ribs and her skin.

Coupling this with the weight loss, and lack of improvement, I'm now extremely concerned as to what is it . It seems to be about the size of an egg (reptile not chicken), but whatever it is, it shouldn't be there.

Have just called the specialist vets and they're now closed until tomorrow, so will call tomorrow and get her booked in.

So bummed out


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Awwww shame she isnt better, eating lots but not putting on weight is indeed a worry. I hope all goes well at the vets for you both.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Managed to get an appointment at a reptile vets in Leeds on Saturday, so will post an update once I have one. I'm desperately hoping it's a cyst; I've just given it another squeeze and a bit of wiggle, it feels firm rather than hard, and is smaller than I initially thought; it's about 1inch by 1/2 inch, oval in shape, and feels like it is attached to something, as it won't move about under the skin.

You can see the lump here on the left;


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Aww I hope she is ok. Do let us know what the vet says


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

Really sorry to see this, hope your Beardie is OK.

Which vet are you seeing? I don't know how many Reptile vets there are in Leeds but we go to Holly House and see Sarah- if this is where you're going she's really knowledgeable, and weighs things up carefully before jumping into things.

Good luck. xx


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

That's exactly who we're seeing; Sarah at Holly House, good to know that we comes recommended. We were hoping to get in with international zoo vet in keighley but really it was a case of whoever can get her in first.

Appointment is at 2:45pm tomorrow. I'm dreading it in all honesty because I just feel that where the lump is isn't a good sign, but I'll have to see what they say. Cleared the balance on the credit card in preparation... Lol


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

Sarah is lovely. :2thumb: She knows her stuff, takes her time and their prices seemed reasonable to me.
As reps need such small doses of meds they don't sell you the whole bottle, but decant it out into smaller bottles meaning the meds end up much more reasonably priced. I have no idea if this is the same for all reptile vets as have only been to Sarah.
When I first started ringing round I couldn't get an appointment with the Keighley vet either, but since then my friend went (again not sure how many actual vets there are at that surgery) and she wasn't impressed at all.

Let us know how you get on, and fingers crossed.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

So. I feel much better now we've come back from the vets. We discussed everything with Sarah, and we've both agreed that at the moment we're not sure she's strong enough to withstand a GA to have the lump biopsied / explored / removed.

Sarah's confirmed it's not an egg, and unlikely to be a hernia because of where it is. She also said the same as me, that it feels like it's attached to the skin but also anchored to the ribs as well and feels like it's outside the organ wall on top of the ribs. She said the most likely causes at the moment are an abscess (unusual because she has no external injury, which would mean the infection is coming from the inside somewhere), or that it's a tumour of some sort.

Obviously because of her age, tumours are more common but whether it's cancerous or not is another matter. Couple that with the weight loss and it's pretty concerning.

What they've done today is take a blood sample to run complete bloodwork, we're hoping that will give us a reason for the weight loss (kidney and liver function were mentioned specifically), and once we have the results on tuesday, we can take steps to combat the issue to hopefully build her up prior to surgery.

Sarah seems somewhat reluctant to leave the lump where it is, especially as it has grown quickly, but first thing is to get the results back and see what's going on and why she's not putting on any weight.

She has an incredibly cute little bandage on her tail where they've taken the sample, and all credit to Gizmo, she was very well behaved. Even let Sarah open her mouth and check the quality of her teeth and gums (which are apparently very good considering her age). It was like geriatric day at the vets, one lady turned up with a 16 year old dog who's back legs had gone completely, and there was a couple with a 17 year old cat lol. We were all comparing notes on how sad it is when they start getting old.


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

I'm glad yo're feeling a bit better, lets hope the blood results are OK. xx


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

She's just been splashing about in the bath, so she's doing ok in herself, which is nice.

Frankly, even if the results are bad on tuesday I'll just be relieved to know what is going on!

Thanks for your kind words everyone.


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## Irri (May 7, 2014)

So sorry you're both going through this, hopefully it turns out to be an easy fix. 
Will follow the thread and hope shes better soon! <3


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Gizmo's results are back, and had a long chat with the vet today.

Kidney and Liver function were within normal tolerances for her age, so there doesn't seem to be an indication of a problem there. What has shown up as a problem is that she has a very low white blood cell count, so much so that apparently on a few slides they couldn't find any at all . Vet said that this normally means that they are either fighting an infection (though there were no dead cells or pus cells in her blood, suggesting she's not actively infected by anything) or that for some reason she's not producing enough, meaning her immune system is really depleted. The other thing is that she had elevated levels of calcium in her blood, vet said this is normally because they're trying to reabsorb calcium from their bones, which can indicate a problem with bone marrow. Vet said it can happen sometimes when females are preparing to lay a clutch of eggs (I'm hoping her body isn't gearing up for this, because it's about the right time, and it's the LAST thing she needs to do now! :bash, so I'm trying to be optimistic, but being that there was no real reason for the weight loss looking at her bloodwork, it seems as though the weight loss may be more connected with the lump. 

I asked about MBD regarding the reabsorption of calcium, and the vet didn't seem to think it's a cause; stated that she normally sees it in much younger lizards, as they don't normally live long with it, and that Gizmo isn't showing any of the other symptoms (toes, tail, wobbling, twitching etc etc), so she would find it unlikely. The vet did say however that she's seen Leukemia before in bearded dragons and that her symptoms would seem to fit with that, especially that the lump is in a particularly bony area on her ribcage.

So for now, she is on antibiotics to try and boost up her immune system and flush out any infection, warm baths twice a week, and she's booked in for surgery for next Wednesday to have the lump biopsied / removed and full x-rays to check bone density / whatever else is going on.

The vet has said that she's going to probably need quite a lot of post op care in terms of syringe feeding and so on, poor little thing, and in the mean time we'll just continue to feed her up.

The sad thing is, if she seemed down or depressed in herself, I'd be questioning whether surgery is the right thing to do, but she's so perky, full of beans, doesn't seem to be in pain, splashing about in the bath, and I just feel I'd be doing her a disservice by putting her to sleep without even trying. There is a possibility that the lump is an abscess, and obviously removing it and a course of antibiotics would hopefully mean she'll be fine, but I think we'll just have to see how things go.


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

Hope that the biopsy gives you some good news. Lizards can be very good at hiding it if they feel ill. In the end you as long as you follow your gut you will know what paths to follow with her treatment and how far to take it. 
Wishing her all the best


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

Although that's mixed news you seem to have got a good plan together with Sarah.

I hope the biopsies give you some answers, but as you say she's perky and happy in herself so you carry on regardless of what any tests show you. As Fizz says let Gizmo take the lead.

Good luck with her. xx


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Will let you all know how it goes. I'm dreading it and preparing for the worst as I just don't know if she's strong enough for surgery, but in all honesty, not doing anything is possibly going to result in dying / being in pain anyway, so I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place.

I'm sort of trying not to think about it at the moment, because there's no point worrying as it won't change anything.

My other projects are going on hold until she's sorted out. I think she's probably going to have to stay in overnight, so I'm going to give her cage a good scrubbing while she's away, remove and soak all the decor and probably replace the substrate with newspaper / something simple to avoid it contaminating the wound. Does anyone have any experience with post-op beardie care that they can impart?


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Basically you are doing the best things for her post op already making sure the viv is clean and you have paper down rather than sand. Keep her nice and warm and hydrated and there isnt much more you can do. Now my experience of reptiles having beeing operated on is a positive one. I had a uro which had an egg stuck and had to be operated on and the next day she was up and about like nothing had happened. Some of my other lizards have ocassionally needed surgery and all have been fine too. None needed help feeding though so that may be the hardest part for you if you need to syringe feed her. It can be hard work and somethin you find upsetting but hopefully it will be worth it. Hopefully she will surprise you and be just as perky after the op as before she went in. They are very resilient creatures. Good luck.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Sort of good news!

Dropped her off at 8am this morning before work, had a phone call at 2pm to say she was out of surgery and was groggy but breathing by herself and that she'd probably have to stay the night. However, another phone call at 4pm to say she was up and about, basking, traipsing around in the tank and generally seemed very bright and that I could take her home tonight.

Went to pick her up after work and have a chat with the vet and here is lowdown; the lump was unlike anything Sarah has seen before, apparently it was a very hard solid white lump with one of her ribs going right through the middle of it. They've removed the lump and a portion of her rib, and taken bone density x-rays too. The lump is almost certainly a tumour / growth rather than an abscess, and has been sent off for testing to determine exactly what it is, and if it's malignant or not.

The x-rays didn't look too bad, you can see right to the tips of her toes indicating that the density is relatively good, even right down to the last digit. Sarah did say you sometimes can't see the lizard's feet at all because the density goes from there first. Strangely, you couldn't see the mass at all, which implies it's not calcified so makes it harder to work out what it is.

She didn't eat at the vets, but she's back home with me now, viv has been cleared out and sand replaced with newspaper. Within 2 mins of her being in the viv she's munched down 6 waxworms which I'm so pleased about :flrt:. I know she's not out of the woods yet, but I'm hoping this is all a positive sign, she hissed at me trying to give her antibiotics tonight, so at least she has some fight in her!!

Main things now are checking the wound isn't weeping too much, feeding her up, and continuing with pain meds and antibiotics. Hopefully she will heal well, no follow-up appointment unless she goes downhill again, or she hasn't shed the stitches out in 8 weeks time.

Bless her she looks like someone's stitched a handbag lol.


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Pleased to hear that she has come through the op well, as I said previously, they are very resilient. Hope you get good results from the biopsy.


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

Well it's good news that she made it through the op, and that they managed to remove the tumour.

I really hope the biopsy doesn't show anything nasty, but remember you said she's happy and bright in herself (though perhaps not today after her op), something you've got to hang onto.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Bless her, I checked on her before bed and she'd tucked her head under the one bit of fake plant left in her viv lol. All the other decor has been pulled out so she doesn't snag her stitches on anything / get infected.

Today she's been trashing the viv, the newspaper is ripped and scrunched up so she's obviously moved around. Still got a huge appetite, so I'm off to get her lots of roaches and locusts this weekend, and for now I'm keeping her on waxworms as they're easy to eat and she doesn't have to chase them down.

She's getting fed up of us syringing her medicine already, lots of hissing and then sitting on my knee glaring at us both lol. Wound is looking good though, dry, and not weepy like it was yesterday (apologies if anyone's eating haha).

Feel amazed at her tbh. So so glad to have her back, and even if it's not good news from the biopsy at least she seems happy in herself


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## Susukachoo (May 21, 2014)

Any news on what the growth is yet?


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Oh bless her.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Susukachoo said:


> Any news on what the growth is yet?


Not yet, the results are due in next wednesday / thursday, I'll report back on here once I have them.

She's had 3 roaches and 7 dusted locusts today, and she's good in herself.

Going to probably offer her a bath next week and she's starting to shed her head and I don't want her finding it hard to shed as she has nothing to rub up against.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Hi All,

Sad to report I spoke to the vet today and it is cancer.

She said the lump they removed is an unusual and aggressive form of cancer, which she has never seen before, and rarely grows in the chest wall. It has already spread to her intercostal muscles (muscles in between her ribs), and judging by the strange bead-like growths I saw on her xray on some of her other ribs, Sarah thinks it has probably spread through her ribcage too.

Chemo isn't an option as it doesn't really work on beardies, and Sarah said the only other treatment would be to basically remove her rib cage and muscles and replace them with some sort of mesh / graft. Given her age, and the fact she already has one large wound that is currently healing, I'd already decided last week that if the outcome was cancer, further surgery wouldn't be considered. Sarah has said that she would not recommend this surgery anyway as it experimental and not guaranteed to work, just that it was the only other solution.

The diagnosis of cancer also goes some way to explaining the weight loss and lack of white blood cells.

Sad as it is, and don't get me wrong it hasn't quite sunk in yet, I'm trying to focus on the fact that currently she is eating like a horse, chasing down insects, hissing at me trying to give her antibiotics, and generally seems absolutely fine in herself. She has another week of antibiotics left, and I will start back up with the twice weekly warm baths as she is shedding and MEGA tetchy about that.

She doesn't seem to be in pain at all, as she's really active, launching herself around the tank and not at all reluctant to hunt food down, so the future for her is just going to be a case of monitoring for any more tumours, trying to keep her weight up and maintain her appetite, and if and when the time comes where she's suffering then we may have to make the decision to have her put to sleep. I'm hoping that is a way off yet and I still have some time ahead with her, but you never really know.

I'm off work on a flexi day tomorrow luckily, so going to spend the day fussing her, warm bath, food, give her tank a bit of a clean etc.


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## Susukachoo (May 21, 2014)

PigeonYouDead said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Sad to report I spoke to the vet today and it is cancer.
> 
> ...


I am very saddened to hear that! That's terrible news. It's good that she is still acting healthy…I hope her condition doesn't get any worse for a very long time.


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## Fizz (Jan 18, 2014)

So sorry to hear this  
I think you are right to draw the line here for surgery tbh. Removing her ribs etc.. would be a massive trauma to her and there is no guarantee that it would put her in the clear, add to that her age and the recovery process and it all seems a bit too much for one little lizard.

Its great that she seems well in herself atm, and as long as she continues this way and seems happy, I would try to focus on these positives for now.

All the best to the pair of you.


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

I too am sorry to read this, but as you say focus on what she is like in herself.

At least you know you've done your very best for her, and that you've cared for her really well not only now but throughout her life as she has got to such a good age.


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

So sorry to hear this hun. I also fully agree on no more surgery it sounds like a very major op with no certainty of success.

I hope that she continues to do well for some time yet.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Thanks for all the kind words everyone 

She's had a bath today to loosen up some of this skin thats hanging off as all the decor has been temporarily removed while she heals.

I hope to post some more pictures once she's fully healed, and will keep you updated on how she's doing x


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## Irri (May 7, 2014)

I am so, so sorry to hear the diagnosis  
It must be really hard to come to terms with, especially when she seems like she's doing well, I know I would be totally in denial!

Pets ageing is heartbreaking, that's why I just couldn't keeps animals (like rats) with a small lifespan. My cat is elderly now and I find myself worrying more and more about him getting ill etc.

You really come across like an incredibly loving and caring owner and honestly she is very lucky to have you. So many beardies are treated badly and stuck on gumtree, so she won the lottery when you chose her!

I wish the best for you both and hope you will have lots of time together yet!


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## spadam (Dec 23, 2013)

Sorry to hear this news. On the positive side she is very active and seems to be enjoying herself to be back at home.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Irri said:


> I am so, so sorry to hear the diagnosis
> It must be really hard to come to terms with, especially when she seems like she's doing well, I know I would be totally in denial!
> 
> Pets ageing is heartbreaking, that's why I just couldn't keeps animals (like rats) with a small lifespan. My cat is elderly now and I find myself worrying more and more about him getting ill etc.
> ...


To be honest I have quite a lot of elderly / poorly animals now, and it is so sad. I have a geriatric rescue hamster who has just turned 2, and after nearly losing him several times in January he's pulled through and seems to be doing great. Then back at my parents I have a 9 and a half year old house rabbit, who has spinal arthritis and is slowly losing her fur, along with her eyesight and hearing deteriorating. The only young one I've got is my dog who is also a rescue, 3 and a half years old approx, and he's mental lol.

Thanks for your kind words.

Gizmo seems to be doing great, she's had a bath today (she pooed in the bath... first time 8 years I've ever seen her do a poo. She's normally mega secretive about it and holds it in until no-one's looking lol) and then back in the tank she's had 8 locusts and two roaches. I'll post up a pic of her tummy soon as the wound is looking much flatter and seems to be healing well


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Hi All,

Quick update, she's doing well at the moment, off of the antibiotics now, and I'm just leaving her to rest and recuperate with food as and when she wants.

She did something strange today though; I put her in the bath, and she had a fairly big drink. Put her nose in and lapped up the water with her eyes closed. She's done this once before in the bath, and was fine afterwards, but I put her back in her tank after about 10mins in the bath (she was crawling up my arm to get out), offered her a cockroach to eat, and a lot of water has just poured out of her mouth.

It was just water, and she didn't openly vomit, it was more like she had water in her mouth and when she opened it to eat the roach it all fell out???

Even stranger, she then started trying to rip up and attack the wet newspaper. Anyone got any ideas and is it worth me syringing her some more water to replace what's been lost?

I'm guessing what she drank in the bath hadn't got down to her stomach yet and moving her around make her chuck it back up but being that she's never done it before I'm pretty bewildered!!


Lindsay


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

I have known this happen ocassionally, I think they take too much in sometimes and it just comes back up. I am sure she will have taken some in so if syringing stresses her out I wouldnt bother her.

As for ripping up the paper well Im not sure about that who knows what goes through their heads lol.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Debbie1962 said:


> I have known this happen ocassionally, I think they take too much in sometimes and it just comes back up. I am sure she will have taken some in so if syringing stresses her out I wouldnt bother her.
> 
> As for ripping up the paper well Im not sure about that who knows what goes through their heads lol.


Ha ha ha, she looked at the puddle of water and seemed kind of confused as to where it had come from.

She's not brought up the two roaches she ate though, so have just left her to it.


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

Like most beardies a bit loopy:whistling2:.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Hi All,

Just a quick update. It's been 6 weeks since Gizmo's surgery now. It took me a good 3 weeks to get my head around everything after the diagnosis from the vets. I put everything on hold with the frog tank I was building, and I've been super stressed out with my job, which is why I've dropped off the forum.

Generally she's been doing a lot better, but since monday she's been off her food, and I came home from work today and she's laid eggs all over the tank. She hadn't been showing any signs of digging or looking for a site to lay them, but I've pulled 29 out of the tank today.

The frustrating thing is, her body is too poorly and weak to be putting energy into growing eggs. I'm hoping she'll be ok now, but she's eaten 6 or 7 big locusts today so I think it's brought her appetite back. None of the eggs looked particularly healthy, but she'd only just laid them as most of them are still soft and a few were stuck together. I'm hoping she's not eggbound, and that 29 is all of them. 

Strangely in all the infertile clutches she's laid, this is the biggest number. Will keep you posted on how she gets on at the vets on wednesday,


Lindsay


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## CarlW21 (Jul 21, 2013)

Ron Magpie said:


> Waxworms are also great 'fatteners'- not something that would be recommended as a staple- too rich, on the whole- but great for a bit of short-term building up.


This, I give my BD morio's and mealworms from time to time, I notice the periods he has these he seems more full out.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Another update,

The stitches came out on tuesday, she's healed now, but still has a flap of skin where the wound was. I'm hoping eventually she will shed this off and her tummy will flatten out a bit. Here's what it looks like now;










There's a slight black mark / dent / hole to the top right of the flap which is where the top stitch was. I'm hoping this will close and smooth off in time. The vet said there is some swelling under the flap which could be either another tumour coming back, or scar tissue.

She's also lost a lot of weight, about 50g, from laying eggs and recovering from surgery, so her total weight now is 370g. Prior to surgery she was at 420g.

So her tank is reassembled, she's back on sand and her wood decor is back in. I'm still going to be bathing her regularly to keep her fluid intake up, and to keep her scar comfortable. She seems much happier now, appetite is good, and I'm feeding her up on whatever she wants. She's currently chowing down on cockroaches, dusted locusts and dusted fruit beetle grubs.

Not really bothered about limiting her fat intake now; as far as I'm concerned, she may as well enjoy what life she has left


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

That scar should smooth out, one of my uros had a similar area operated on to remove a stuck egg and it looked similar to that for a little while after but smoothed out eventually.You may have to help with any skin that gets stuck around the scar area though as I did.

Pleased to hear she seems happier and is eating.


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## Joe'sMum (May 31, 2010)

I missed your last up date about the eggs! Poor girl that was the last thing she needed, however she seems to be doing well.:2thumb:

Good luck with her, I hope she continues to be a happy and hungry Beardie for a while longer yet.xx


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Just thought I'd post this up because it made me laugh.

This is how she fell asleep last night;










Think she's liking having a 'proper' tank again with things to climb on and sand rather than newspaper. Tonight she has fallen asleep with both her front legs on pieces of wood above her head, her head resting between a V shaped piece of wood, and her back legs hanging like little frog legs . Taking it as a good sign that she's obviously comfortable enough to move around the tank and climb.


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## PigeonYouDead (Aug 9, 2013)

Hi All,

I know it's been ages since I was last on the forum, but thought I'd share some sad news. I had Gizmo put down last week because she was not doing well.

She laid a clutch of infertile eggs in May this year, 26 in total, and all looked really healthy but in the past few weeks she'd been looking thinner and thinner, was struggling to keep her head up and her jaw was looking very soft and strange. When I took her back to the vets, whilst they confirmed she didn't have MBD which was my immediate concern, they said she'd lost a lot of muscle mass and had fluid round her internal organs. They also said that the hard mass under her scar felt very "sinister" and not like scar tissue should feel, so I decided it would be better to put her to sleep rather than subject her to more testing / go down the route of force feeding.

I had 10, nearly 11 years, with her and although I'm sad to see her go, I'm glad in a way that I got an extra 18 months with her thanks to the efforts of Sarah the vet at Holly House in Leeds.

Here's a pic taken by my boyfriend when we went to say goodbye. She crawled up and snuggled in under my chin 











Lindsay


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## Debbie1962 (Dec 5, 2008)

So sorry to hear the sad news hun. Looking at her she had indeed lost a lot of weight, the indentations in her head are an indicator. You did the best for her.


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