# Deadliest Snake



## keithb (Jan 29, 2009)

Hi all just watching deadliest snake on Nat Geo and this guy has a list of 7 snakes that he is investigating to choose the worlds deadliest.
He marks them on 
SIZE
VENOM
VOLUME
TOXICITY
DEATHS

Snakes are 
KING COBRA 
SPITING COBRA
BLACK MAMBA
PYTHON
RUSSELS VIPER
FER DE LANCE (sp)
INLAND TAIPAN

So now you got the info I will post in a few days what snake won if you seen it then you will all ready know.:2thumb:


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

really?

no entrance on there for the tiger snake?


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## kingball (Jun 21, 2009)

id go with the FER DE LANCE


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## Steve (Aug 20, 2007)

I'm surprised that the puff adder is not on the list, or kraits for toxicity.


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

kingball said:


> id go with the FER DE LANCE


it's supposedly the Taipan

remember i saw 1 of many of Steve Irwin's programmes and he was looking for the deadliest snakes in the world

and number 1 was the taipan and Steve lay down flat on his front and went face to face with a taipan

LEGEND!


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

YouTube - 10 Most Deadliest Snakes (Part 5)

this is it


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## DavidR (Mar 19, 2008)

"Deadliest" is an ambiguous term. It could be the snake that kills the most people (in which case it would be the Saw-scaled vipers _Echis_ which do not appear on the list posted above), or the snake that if you are bitten, is most likely to kill you. There are certainaly a number of snakes that if bitten, your chances of survival without antivenom are not great (e.g. Taipans, mambas, kraits etc) but it would be impossible to say which is the 'deadliest' without conducting human trials (try getting that past an ethics comittee!).
Inland taipans (_Oxyuranus microlepidotus_) are the most toxic to mice, but have never been recorded to kill a human. Saw-scale vipers (_Echis_) kill tens of thousands of people annually. The rating system for 'deadliest' would have to take into account:
*How likely a person is to encounter the snake.
*How likely the snake is to bite.
*How much venom the snake is likely to deliver.
*How the venom works (i.e. are the effects easily treated with/without antivenom).
*Toxicity to humans.
*Whether effective treatment exists and is available if bitten.

My choice would be _Echis_, but I would much rather be stuck in a lift with a Saw-scaled viper than a black mamba, taipan, spitting cobra, _Bothrops_ etc.

David.


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## pythondave82 (Nov 14, 2007)

Well said David - but B. atrox, just little slugs mate, honest!!!

Dave


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

DavidR said:


> "Deadliest" is an ambiguous term. It could be the snake that kills the most people (in which case it would be the Saw-scaled vipers _Echis_ which do not appear on the list posted above), or the snake that if you are bitten, is most likely to kill you. There are certainaly a number of snakes that if bitten, your chances of survival without antivenom are not great (e.g. Taipans, mambas, kraits etc) but it would be impossible to say which is the 'deadliest' without conducting human trials (try getting that past an ethics comittee!).
> Inland taipans (_Oxyuranus microlepidotus_) are the most toxic to mice, but have never been recorded to kill a human. Saw-scale vipers (_Echis_) kill tens of thousands of people annually. The rating system for 'deadliest' would have to take into account:
> *How likely a person is to encounter the snake.
> *How likely the snake is to bite.
> ...


great analysis Dave

i think it's been proven that Taipan venom is drop for drop the most poisonous but like you said it could mean a number of things

the way i meant it was if you were to be bitten, what snake would leave you with the least chance of survival, basically meaning which snake has the most potent venom, in which case i would of thought the fierce snake aka the inland taipan would be the answer


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

There is one problem with these sorts of lists. People often interchange the words deadly, lethal and dangerous and the definition can change from one person to the next. 

Whenever I provide tours around our Herpetarium I state the following:

People often ask what is the most dangerous / toxic snake in the world. The fact is there are two parts to that question. There is a distinct difference between what is the most dangerous and what is the most toxic. 
The most toxic land snake is Oxyuranus microlepidotus the Inland Taipan... this carries enough venom to kill a hundred people.. BUT it has never caused any human fatalities as it generally lives in very remote areas of Australia. There have been cases where Herpetologists have been bitten, but they have all survived due to good antivenom, hospitals , emergency services, road systems and education in what to do and how to treat bites.

By contrast.....

The most dangerous snake, the one that kills the most people is the Saw-Scale Viper, Echis Sp. the reason for this is it is widespread, occurring across sub-Saharan Africa, Middle East and on through India and Sri-Lanka. In other words across some of the world’s poorest /developing countries where there is often severe antivenom shortages, poor hospital resources, long distances to hospital on poorly maintained roads, lack of education, money and a reluctance to use “western” medicines. These snakes are found around human habitat in numerous quantities and so there is a high level of interaction between these snakes and humans.


Dead is dead... you can only die once. Echis kills thousands of people, it may take several days but the result is just as “deadly” as someone who dies within hours after being bitten by an Elapid with a fast acting venom.


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

Good post Dave,
You beat me to it... I had to go and check on progress on the Herpetarium refurbishment half way through my reply : victory:


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## nitro (Dec 8, 2009)

Stiletto snakes have to be on the list for me.


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

PDR said:


> There is one problem with these sorts of lists. People often interchange the words deadly, lethal and dangerous and the definition can change from one person to the next.
> 
> Whenever I provide tours around our Herpetarium I state the following:
> 
> ...


think you just put everybody's thoughts into words

kind of what i was getting at anyway

cheers for clearing that up!

crackin post


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## TWGarland (May 24, 2009)

I'm pretty sure there are no recorded fatalities from the Inland Taipan

Although it is considered the most venomous based on LD50's, it never comes into contact with people in the wild because of its remote distribution. 

So i'd be suprised if it is considered the most deadly. 

I would have thought the most deadly would be something found in the third world, some Viper that kills thousands in rice fields or something


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## TWGarland (May 24, 2009)

PDR said:


> There is one problem with these sorts of lists. People often interchange the words deadly, lethal and dangerous and the definition can change from one person to the next.
> 
> Whenever I provide tours around our Herpetarium I state the following:
> 
> ...


Ah beat me to it. :notworthy:


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

nitro said:


> Stiletto snakes have to be on the list for me.


 i think one forum member on here may dissagree:whistling2:


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## nitro (Dec 8, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> i think one forum member on here may dissagree:whistling2:


Hmmmm why?

EDIT- I read it as dangerous, not deadliest. D'oh.....


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## nitro (Dec 8, 2009)

Would the most toxic not be a sea snake?


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## mad martin (Sep 4, 2008)

I think what these guys do is take factors into consideration and place the animal in a scenario.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

As said befor the deadliest snake is the one thats just bit you


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## mad martin (Sep 4, 2008)

> As said befor the deadliest snake is the one thats just bit you


I don't like that statement. That would mean that if a corn snake just bit me its the deadliest.

See, my opinion, is that saying "which snake is the deadliest?" is so random. What needs to happen is you need to put every species on the same foot. Black Mambas, for example, or not found between people as often as Saw Scale vipers. So the bite rate on people would make saw scales the deadliest of the two.
But if you take an empty room, with no place to hide, which snake would you rather not have in there? A Saw Scale or a really pissed off adult Black Mamba? And that is how these t.v. shows approach that question.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

mad martin said:


> I don't like that statement. That would mean that if a corn snake just bit me its the deadliest.


 ok ok the dedliest *venomous* snake is the one that just bit you......:Na_Na_Na_Na:
But the "deadliest snake" argument is one that always makes me laugh
as everyone seems to have there own theory
and it all depends on which angle you come from
toxicity and delivery capability and speed of death which is my stance
or
snakes with the highest kill rate due to habitat locality and availability of medical help

Both will give totally different animals as being the "deadliest"
as has been said Echis _sp _will be the top of the later list
and _Oxyuranus microlepidotus _will be top of the former


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## mad martin (Sep 4, 2008)

Dead is dead, who gives a toss which one could do it faster?


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## salvatoruk (Apr 28, 2009)

You're all wrong. 

The deadliest snakes in the world are Royal Python morphs. Everytime I see one I get suicidal.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

salvatoruk said:


> You're all wrong.
> 
> The deadliest snakes in the world are Royal Python morphs. Everytime I see one I get suicidal.


:lol2::2thumb:


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## STReptiles (Feb 6, 2009)

DavidR said:


> "Deadliest" is an ambiguous term. It could be the snake that kills the most people (in which case it would be the Saw-scaled vipers _Echis_ which do not appear on the list posted above), or the snake that if you are bitten, is most likely to kill you. There are certainaly a number of snakes that if bitten, your chances of survival without antivenom are not great (e.g. Taipans, mambas, kraits etc) but it would be impossible to say which is the 'deadliest' without conducting human trials (try getting that past an ethics comittee!).
> Inland taipans (_Oxyuranus microlepidotus_) are the most toxic to mice, but have never been recorded to kill a human. Saw-scale vipers (_Echis_) kill tens of thousands of people annually. The rating system for 'deadliest' would have to take into account:
> *How likely a person is to encounter the snake.
> *How likely the snake is to bite.
> ...


 saw scales wipe out enough people to equal wiping out a small community every year in india........saw this on steve backshals deadly 60 lol


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## venomous111 (Dec 24, 2009)

No Eastern Brown????I thought the eastern brown was one of the 'deadliest' (maybe mispelled) as it live's in highly populated areas of Australia.


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## paulrimmer69 (Oct 26, 2008)

id guess the eastern brown was one of the most toxic but due to australia having good medical facilitys i dont think there are actually many deaths, please correct me if im wrong im just guessing here


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## RAZZ-MCFC (Jan 25, 2010)

paulrimmer69 said:


> id guess the eastern brown was one of the most toxic but due to australia having good medical facilitys i dont think there are actually many deaths, please correct me if im wrong im just guessing here


i think you are correct, quite similar to the taipan and tiger snakes

all possess highly toxic venom but not as dangerous as say the saw-scaled viper due to Australia having the means to deal with a bite


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## DavidR (Mar 19, 2008)

Eastern Browns are incredibly toxic, will not hesitate to bite and often live around habitation, but they yield very little venom (~2-4mg) and as Paul says, are found in Australia which is almost certainaly the best country to get bitten by a venomous snake (from a medical care perspective). They also have a limited distribution in PNG, I'm unsure as to how much of a problem they are over there.

David.


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## masticophis (Jan 14, 2007)

Just out of interested as it's related to this.

Are there any snakes, or which are the ones that are deadly (for most) even if you get into a decent hospital pretty soon after the bite. I'm thinking of here obviously the ones without AV, I'm taking a guess based on hearsay that you would stand a half decent chance with most elapids as you can go on life support till the venom is broken down by the body. But with tissue destroying venom then is there anything that can be done, as life support is no use if the venom destroys your organs.
Was thinking of twig snakes, no AV,would blood transfusions stand a chance of saving you in the event of a significant bite.

Obviously, I am not looking for an exact answer as there are too many variables to any bite, just sort of a rough idea. It's not based on kill times, more the increased likelihood of death or severe impairment even with the best medical aid possible (excluding AV).

Mike


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## Burmese Man (Jan 10, 2007)

i believe the death adder causes a fair few fatalities over in PNG due to lack of footware and the appropriate amounts of AV in the country not sure on how many deaths per year are recorded though.


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## SWMorelia (May 15, 2007)

keithb said:


> Hi all just watching deadliest snake on Nat Geo and this guy has a list of 7 snakes that he is investigating to choose the worlds deadliest.
> He marks them on
> SIZE
> VENOM
> ...


It's interesting to see python in the mix...... I didn't realise that spotted pythons were that dangerous....:whistling2:LOL
OTOH.... I would of thought the Fer de lance would be up there with the best... They have a good yield, they are quite potent and they live in remote enough places to make rescue difficult...


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## DavidR (Mar 19, 2008)

> Are there any snakes, or which are the ones that are deadly (for most) even if you get into a decent hospital pretty soon after the bite. I'm thinking of here obviously the ones without AV, I'm taking a guess based on hearsay that you would stand a half decent chance with most elapids as you can go on life support till the venom is broken down by the body. But with tissue destroying venom then is there anything that can be done, as life support is no use if the venom destroys your organs.
> Was thinking of twig snakes, no AV,would blood transfusions stand a chance of saving you in the event of a significant bite.


Once again I think _Echis_ are a good candidate for a number of reasons. The way in which the venom works means that no amount of antivenom will reverse some of the more morbid symptoms. The venom triggers all your blood clotting factors to be 'set-off', so your bloodstream is filled with tiny blood clots, which collect in the kidneys causing renal failure. So you can be killed by an exess of blood clots in the kidneys, but you can equally die from lack of clotting factors which play an essential role in preventing you from bleeding at the bite site, and to prevent heamorrhage elsewhere in the body. So unless you receive antivenom before the cascade starts, you are in serious trouble. Further complicating this issue is the massive venom variation that exists within the genus, meaning that unless you are lucky, the antivenom you receive is not guaranteed to be particularly effective. A number of other groups of snakes venoms work in a similar way (e.g. Russels). Saying that, only about 7% of _Echis_ bites result in death (in reported cases anyway), even without antivenom treatment (but 7% of hundreds of thousands is still a huge number of deaths). A large number of bites are likely to result in some kind of permanent disability. 
As you say, necrosis cannot be reversed with antivenom, so chances of secondary infection and becoming permanently disfigured are high. 


David.


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## keithb (Jan 29, 2009)

Hi all i forgot all about this post but on the show they come to the conclusion that the black mamba was the deadliest snake.

Dont know much about any kind of snake but it was interesting to watch


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## keithb (Jan 29, 2009)

Oh and the deadliest snake is the one wich just nit you is what the guy said at the end of the show:lol2:


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## Greg_E (Jan 16, 2010)

This thread is confusing, are we looking at the snake that has killed the most people (or kills the most people a year)? or are we looking at the most venonmous snake?


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## mad martin (Sep 4, 2008)

And that, Greg, is what makes this thread pointless at best. Everyone has a different point of view and there is no result. It doesn't matter, because even if an Oxyurannus is the deadliest, you still going to die if bitten by a Krait or whatever.


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## paulrimmer69 (Oct 26, 2008)

please dont think im doing a viperlover but the beginning of this vid sums the thread up pretty well

YouTube - Just when you thought it was safe!!!


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## stuartdouglas (Mar 5, 2008)

So.........which *is* the deadliest snake?


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