# Reptile Park Market Research



## ReptilePark (Feb 23, 2010)

Hi
Please could you fill out this short survey to help with market research for a newly planned reptile park.

Survey provided by FreeOnlineSurveys.com


Many Thanks


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## Pipkin28 (Oct 6, 2007)

Done!


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## ipreferaflan (Oct 8, 2009)

Double done!


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## AnythingWithAShell (Apr 14, 2009)

Done, but I didn't fill in the email thingy. Hope you still get it


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## kazzy (Aug 17, 2009)

AnythingWithAShell said:


> Done, but I didn't fill in the email thingy. Hope you still get it


 
*same as anythingwithashell*


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## ReptilePark (Feb 23, 2010)

they're coming in thick and fast! Thanks for all your help!


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## pied pythons (Jan 18, 2008)

Done


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## GlasgowGecko (Feb 23, 2008)

I would be very interested to know how this potential venture will be "dedicated to the conservation of reptiles", what practical steps will be put in place for this?

Andy


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## Serious D (Apr 12, 2008)

I just sighned it, this is a fantastic Idea and I realy hope it gets granted.


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## jme2049 (Jan 11, 2008)

Done!


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2010)

replied  I would like to see a reptile park in the uk :2thumb: (as long as all the reptiles are kept in perfect conditions :whistling2


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## SteveCourty (Oct 4, 2009)

ive filled it but not to sure if its worked. Im not adding my email as I hate spam


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## ReptilePark (Feb 23, 2010)

As with most public animal collections conservation through education is the main route. It is nigh impossible and in many cases impractical or damaging to breed rare species for release into the wild. This project is in its very early stages and more details about our conservation aims will be highlighted in the mission statement. Thanks for your input.


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## kieran8143 (Mar 10, 2008)

just filled it out and would be great if it got granted!


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## AnythingWithAShell (Apr 14, 2009)

Yay! :no1: Good luck with it.


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## pmcpaul (Sep 11, 2008)

I've completed the survey for you too. Sounds like a good idea to me.


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## Hissy Missy (Dec 6, 2009)

done : victory:


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## salvatoruk (Apr 28, 2009)

I've seen a few people have this idea in recent years.

I did answer your survey, could you spend a moment sharing your idea for the Reptile Park? Goals, species planned etc?

Best of luck with it.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

it will need some huge investment to become reality i remember a few years ago something similar going around but the funding was just not there. dont get me wrong it is a great idea but personnaly i think it would be better if more centrally located


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## jennlovesfrogs (Jan 22, 2009)

also done


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## SteveCourty (Oct 4, 2009)

Also On of the questions was about who Id bring. Chances are the first time would be me and the gf but if its a good place then id visit a few more times with my brothers kids and a few others I look after from time to time.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

There was a similar project planned some time ago, and I am sure it was in North Wales, which eventually was shelved after planning permission was refused due to the locals petitioning on the grounds that they didn't wasnt deadly snakes near their homes. I will try and find out some more details.
A shame, as it would, I am sure, have been a fantastic venue.


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## RobM (Aug 27, 2009)

Done.. No idea what a reptile is though


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## jack14 (Oct 4, 2008)

Done


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## Jem (Mar 12, 2009)

done :2thumb:


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## 53bird (Sep 30, 2009)

i have replied too, i think it worked lol. i think its a very good idea, just a shame it will be so far away :sad:


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## LIZARD (Oct 31, 2007)

also done :2thumb:


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## viperd (May 11, 2009)

I've replied too


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## Tehanu (Nov 12, 2006)

ReptilePark said:


> As with most public animal collections conservation through education is the main route. It is nigh impossible and in many cases impractical or damaging to breed rare species for release into the wild. This project is in its very early stages and more details about our conservation aims will be highlighted in the mission statement. Thanks for your input.


Not impressed by that statement at all.

Do some proper niche research and discover the wealth of successful, worthwhile and genuine release to the wild conservations efforts going on in ex-situ institutions right now. 
Conservation via education alone??? 

Reptiles and amphibians have far greater potential for achievable release to the wild conservation than birds/mammals or fish.


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## GlasgowGecko (Feb 23, 2008)

ReptilePark said:


> As with most public animal collections conservation through education is the main route. It is nigh impossible and in many cases impractical or damaging to breed rare species for release into the wild. This project is in its very early stages and more details about our conservation aims will be highlighted in the mission statement. Thanks for your input.





Saedcantas said:


> Not impressed by that statement at all.
> 
> Do some proper niche research and discover the wealth of successful, worthwhile and genuine release to the wild conservations efforts going on in ex-situ institutions right now.
> Conservation via education alone???
> ...



I will admit my question was a little loaded, and my assumption was that conservation goals would be more geared towards education, which to be honest with you i'm more than a little dubious about.

However as far as release programs are concerned, this is a whole different kettle of fish, and in my opinion should only be carried out when appropriate scientific research is carried out first. That said, I'm not a massive advocate of single species conservation.

Any way, I will look forward to reading more literature about your project.

Andy


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## crazyg (Feb 3, 2008)

a reptile park cool ive always wanted to ride a crocodile


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## laurencea (Aug 28, 2009)

done!


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## Zak (Jan 7, 2008)

This isnt a criticism at all but how do you propose to do well when well established facilities like Jersey Zoo are suffering because of the recession? Also do you not think you are severly limiting your target audience ie people looking for days out by only exhibiting reptiles? At the end of the day this would be set up as a business surely.

Have answered questionaire as well.


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## Gaboon (Jun 20, 2005)

Good luck! Education is paramount to any conservation institute that interacts with the public.


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## cocobates (Jun 7, 2008)

done:2thumb:


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## Tehanu (Nov 12, 2006)

Gaboon said:


> Good luck! Education is paramount to any conservation institute that interacts with the public.


There's a clue in this message, the education supports the actual conservation... rather than constitutes the whole of it.

Even smaller enterprises using the "conservation" buzzword, these days ensure if they can't physically perform conservation efforts themselves, the fund in-situ projects that do.


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## Gaboon (Jun 20, 2005)

Collections open for the public have a duty to educate, not only for 'conservation' purposes but it makes good business sense. It generates interest which generates income. This income can be partly distributed to organisations that can conserve more practically, in situ or ex situ. 

Way all the nay saying?

In any case education is key, not just within conservation biology. 

I'm sure the OP can see a few talks are not going to save the rainforest!


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## ReptilePark (Feb 23, 2010)

Saedcantas said:


> Not impressed by that statement at all.
> 
> Do some proper niche research and discover the wealth of successful, worthwhile and genuine release to the wild conservations efforts going on in ex-situ institutions right now.
> Conservation via education alone???
> ...


I was warned that this site could be formidible! anyway, as I tried to say before, there are many problems associated with releasing captive bred animals back into the wild. Stud books are a start, but the pedigree must be verified by genetic analysis. for example, an analysis on waldrapp ibis revealed only 5 of 33 animals whose pedigree was correct. there are also doubts cast on the pedigrees of Przewalski's horses, arabian oryx and the bali starling, all of which have had considerable "proper niche research" undertaken on them. 

further to this, the taxonomy of many well known species remains very poorly understood. The genus _Naja _is a good example of this, with not so long ago many experts considered there to be only 1 asian species and maybe 4-5 african ones. we now know this figure to be 11 and 15 species (and rising) If, hypothetically speaking, a captive breeding and release program was undertaken, would it be _N naja, N. kaouthia, N. sputatrix _etc etc that was being released...or a hybrid? 

wild populations, within a species may also be differentiated to an extent where they would require management as seperate units, due to say, adaptation to different ecological conditions, selection pressures etc. You said that there is far greater potential for achievable release to the wild than...fish. I have to disagree, as fish too can face the same problems. If you look at salmon from scottish lochs and the same species from the south of england, they have differentiated enough due to different selection pressures that fish farms wouldnt ever consider moving fish between the farms to try and increase genetic diversity. IT would do more harm than good.

There are also considerable differences between captive animals and their wild counterparts. Captive chimps for example have shown that a single dominant male is responsible for almost all offspring in the group...so zoos move them around to prevent inbreeding. However, studies in the wild have revealed that the dominant male only sires around 50% of offspring. I know its not a reptile example, but unfortunateley most of this kind of research has been done on mammals and birds. 

Im not saying that it is impossible to do breed and release programs, it is just very difficult, requires a hell of a lot of consideration, is problematic in ways we possibly havent realised just yet and requires more research. Not to mention the red tape. So, whilst you may shun conservation through education, it can and does help and as far as I can see does far more good than harm.

I would also like to say, that we do intend to breed the rarer species in the collection, but due to the reasons listed above, whether they will one day be suitable for release is another matter. I agree that endangered species should be conserved through captive breeding programs, creating something of a safety net. It is however, only a short term solution to the problem and in my opinion I believe in-situ projects are more effective, both financially and biologically and it is these projects which I intend to fully support. I am merely stating what I intend to do and am being realistic about what I know I can achieve. I would rather be honest about the kind of conservation that I intend to promote, than tell everyone what they want to hear and then not be able to do it.


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## Natrix (Dec 9, 2006)

ReptilePark said:


> I was warned that this site could be formidible! anyway, as I tried to say before, there are many problems associated with releasing captive bred animals back into the wild. Stud books are a start, but the pedigree must be verified by genetic analysis. for example, an analysis on waldrapp ibis revealed only 5 of 33 animals whose pedigree was correct. there are also doubts cast on the pedigrees of Przewalski's horses, arabian oryx and the bali starling, all of which have had considerable "proper niche research" undertaken on them.
> 
> further to this, the taxonomy of many well known species remains very poorly understood. The genus _Naja _is a good example of this, with not so long ago many experts considered there to be only 1 asian species and maybe 4-5 african ones. we now know this figure to be 11 and 15 species (and rising) If, hypothetically speaking, a captive breeding and release program was undertaken, would it be _N naja, N. kaouthia, N. sputatrix _etc etc that was being released...or a hybrid?
> 
> ...


ReptilePark

Firstly, you will find that captive breeding for release is easier in reptiles than it is for mammals and birds due to the hatchlings being born as a ready to go package. Captive bred mammals and birds all lack the knowledge of how to survive in the wild that is normally taught in situ by the parent. 

Secondly, and more importantly, you need to be aware that the last three attempts to set up reptile parks in the UK have failed due to negative imput of several Animal Rights groups that have wound up the local population and councils with stories of escaped snakes killing local children while they sleep in their beds etc. 
Can I suggest that if you are serious about this, that you contact the Federation of British Herpetologists for advice on dealing with the negative imput that you will recieve as soon as you make it known what area you plan to set up in.

Gordon Glasson
FBH Vice Chairman


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## Matt Harris (Aug 21, 2007)

I wish you all the best of luck, but I find it hard to see how such an establishment would be commercially sustainable. I think zoos etc rely on repeat visitors - people who come back time after time because there are always new exhibits. I would be happy to bring my family once, if we were in the area, but what would you do to get us back the 2nd, 3rd 4th time?

As above, I have heard of various attempts at herp parks over the years but none of them have taken off. Saying that, there are a lot of small zoos, butterfly houses, rainforest exhibits etc around, so why not?


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## gtm (Jan 23, 2008)

Nice idea but it's simply not commercially viable. The average member of the public simply isn't interested in reptiles enough to pay to go somewhere to look at them.

My advice is to stay at home & flush your cash down the loo (or sent it to me) - it's less hastle in the long run


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## pam b (Mar 3, 2005)

May i ask who are the people behind Reptilepark, IE who is planning this and making the fundraising efforts for it?


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## Natrix (Dec 9, 2006)

Matt Harris said:


> I wish you all the best of luck, but I find it hard to see how such an establishment would be commercially sustainable. I think zoos etc rely on repeat visitors - people who come back time after time because there are always new exhibits. I would be happy to bring my family once, if we were in the area, but what would you do to get us back the 2nd, 3rd 4th time?
> 
> As above, I have heard of various attempts at herp parks over the years but none of them have taken off. Saying that, there are a lot of small zoos, butterfly houses, rainforest exhibits etc around, so why not?


Some very good points Matt but not totally unsolvable. A friend of mine owns and runs the National Parrot Sanctuary in Lincolnshire. This place has less potential variation of species available than a reptile park would have (once you've seen one parrot, you've seen them all). This is got around by including other species that are either effected by parrots or have an effect on the parrots in the wild. He is also in the process of setting up various habitat settings such as a walk through rainforest display, so lots can be done ti increase interest.
The big problem will always be trying to get planning permission in the face of an all out attack on the locals and council by the antis.

Gordon
FBH Vice Chairman


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## Matt Harris (Aug 21, 2007)

I think as long as you've got a cafe, a gift shop and are on the tourist maps, then you've got at least a chance.


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## Jb1432 (Apr 19, 2008)

Done, this sounds like a fantastic idea. Hope that it does actually happen :notworthy::2thumb:


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## ReptilePark (Feb 23, 2010)

Thankyou to everyone who has filled in the survey or given advice, ideas and constructive criticisms. I will continue to try and answer any questions you have.


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