# New project... The Black Pearl *UPDATED with new pictures*



## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

We would like to publically announce our latest project which sees TS and MMM Geckos in joint ownership of a European exclusive.... The Black Pearl!
The following pictures are around the beginning stages of what The Urban Gecko describe as the sixth of seven developmental stages. 
More info on this can be found here: 

The Urban Gecko

If you would like any more info please feel free to contact either:
Sam of TS-Geckos at [email protected] or 
Mike of MMM Geckos at [email protected]

We hope you like our new project and are as excited as we are; the possibilities at this point really are endless!

So what are you opinions?
Any comments are greatly appreciated!


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## exoticsadmirer (Oct 22, 2009)

absolutley gorgeous!


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## daveplymouth (May 26, 2009)

awesome!!! i like the fact when they get older they look whiter then a mack snow , lol would be awesome if you can get one that stays black throughout, red eyes would also be amazing!!!


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## daveplymouth (May 26, 2009)

also can i just add i love your quote at the bottom of your sig, absolutley brilliant!!:2thumb:


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

daveplymouth said:


> awesome!!! i like the fact when they get older they look whiter then a mack snow , lol would be awesome if you can get one that stays black throughout, red eyes would also be amazing!!!


It is strange how they lighten up then darken again. Red eyes may be a possibility as well


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

That is absolutely brilliant. We look forward to hearing your future breeding plans.


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## Lisasgeckonursery (Feb 14, 2008)

Brilliant, nice to see someone working with them in the UK. How i'd love to get my hands on one:mf_dribble:


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

sam12345 said:


> So what are you opinions?
> Any comments are greatly appreciated!


lol Mike knows my opinions on this but will repeat anyway hun ~ I think it's bloody amazing and wish you both great things ................. and can I be put on the waiting list :2thumb:


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## Lisasgeckonursery (Feb 14, 2008)

SleepyD said:


> can I be put on the waiting list :2thumb:


ditto:whistling2:


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

i have only one question

HOW MUCH ARE THE BABIES GONNA COST?????????
i want one


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

SleepyD said:


> lol Mike knows my opinions on this but will repeat anyway hun ~ I think it's bloody amazing and wish you both great things ................. and can I be put on the waiting list :2thumb:


Cheers Mel  Not sure on the waiting list though, may be a while before we sell any :whistling2:


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

ginnerone said:


> i have only one question
> 
> HOW MUCH ARE THE BABIES GONNA COST?????????
> i want one





SleepyD said:


> lol Mike knows my opinions on this but will repeat anyway hun ~ I think it's bloody amazing and wish you both great things ................. and can I be put on the waiting list :2thumb:


I think the only three things we can be sure of at the moment with this project is:
1. As i say the opportunities are endless!
2. We are both overjoyed!
3. What ever we do produce will be in high demand, not only by you guys but also by us.
As Mike says it may be another season before we release any.


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

ginnerone said:


> i have only one question
> 
> HOW MUCH ARE THE BABIES GONNA COST?????????
> i want one


For you? 25 hand tame CB Tokays, 15 of which have to be Calicos.........


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## funky1 (Jun 18, 2008)

Bah Humbug :devil:

Haha, great stuff - you both must be so excited and apprehensive at the same time!

Great coup for the both of you, and judging by the pics, that little beauty is going to worth every scrap of time, money and worry that you`re going to spend on it - a very, very rare opportunity to have a direct influence on the way forward for an entire morph. Get this right, as I know you will, and it could open up a real `pandora`s box` of delights......and one of the best parts about it, is that whatever you pair her to, and whatever you produce in the coming seasons - there is no right or wrong because there is very little to compare it with!!! The only thing I don`t envy you though is the worry, no way would I be able to sleep - I`d have an alarm clock set hourly in the night so I could get up and hand feed her scraps of lobster, just to make sure she was ok haha!!!

It`s pretty remarkable to think that your BP is still some way short of reaching it`s full increment, and fulfilling it`s potential - to think it could go even darker really takes some imagination.

All the possibilities that I know you`ve ploughed through already - black body/black eyes; black body/red eyes; black body/carrot tail mf_dribble etc, etc....can`t wait to see your results if you decide to go ahead and pair her to an Enigma or Calico; and introduce the Blizzard gene - and why not throw in Eclipse too just to see what happens?! Where do you start?

Anyroad - genuinely hope that everything pans out 100% perfectly, and smoothly for you - as it will - and that, aside from all the technicalities/genetics/potential, you both just have an excellent, and rewarding time being the proud owners of one of the most unique leos in Europe - congrats : victory:


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## exoticsadmirer (Oct 22, 2009)

if you ever get a pure black with red eyes i'll sell you both my kidney's and my liver or on second thought a hell of a lot of money.


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

MrMike said:


> For you? 25 hand tame CB Tokays, 15 of which have to be Calicos.........


 eugh, calico's, you can have em all PMSL, 25 hand tame omg it would take me a year to get that many tame LOL, 
speaking of such ventures, i got offered 400 quid for rocky due to his size and puppy tame nature, tempting but he's my baby so NO!!


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

Thats really exciting!

Did i miss the bit when you said exactly what and how many you are getting?

I have looked at the TUG prices several times for these guys and noticed they have some which carry hets too.


But, fantastic news they are coming to the UK - congratulations!!

I really cant wait to see your results.


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

MrMike said:


> Cheers Mel  Not sure on the waiting list though, may be a while before we sell any :whistling2:


lmao don't blame you hun ........... best things are those that take time


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## sammyj (Nov 13, 2009)

Im not really a gecko man perfer my chams but they are amazing. Red eyed or not they look stunning almost a black leopard gecko. I love the stage 5 (i think) when they are sort of purple, black and white.
Keep up the good work, you might have just tempted me into geckos as well as chams.


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

i wouldn't mine a satanic leaftailed gecko


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

excession said:


> Thats really exciting!
> 
> Did i miss the bit when you said exactly what and how many you are getting?
> 
> ...


Ours are pure black pearl, no hets... a clean slate to start with.
Not coming... Here already... and show stopping to see in the flesh, we are both pretty dissapointed that we couldnt get pictures that show how striking this morph really is. Just seeing the morph first hand in my eyes is worth a pretty penny.



exoticsadmirer said:


> if you ever get a pure black with red eyes i'll sell you both my kidney's and my liver or on second thought a hell of a lot of money.


Okay the kidneys, liver and your left hand :whistling2:



funky1 said:


> Bah Humbug :devil:
> 
> Haha, great stuff - you both must be so excited and apprehensive at the same time!
> 
> ...


Thanks for the kind comments Tony (and to everyone else for that matter), they really do mean so much to both of us. As you know so many plans have been spoken about. Its obviously something thats going to take time and patience but its certainly something we both have for this project.
After speaking to Craig it really seems like this could take us anywhere, just little things seem to change with this morph...carrot tails seem to come out a vivid yellow, i think this could even turn out to "unlock" or "change" things as we already know it.
After all this morph doesnt fit in with geckos maturing as we know them, not even the patternless hatches patternless, let alone gains patterning. This morph even lightens up to the point of an outstanding snow and then darkens up. Its just crazy, why a gecko that starts and then finishes so dark would lighten up to the point where its background colour is white.

Really i speak on behalf of both of us here, we can not describe how excited we are about this... we've been like 2 school kids for weeks dying to tell people constantly smiling as we look at what we will be putting the next few years of our reptile keeping into... and hopefully soon we will be able to share it all with you!



sammyj said:


> Im not really a gecko man perfer my chams but they are amazing. Red eyed or not they look stunning almost a black leopard gecko. I love the stage 5 (i think) when they are sort of purple, black and white.
> Keep up the good work, you might have just tempted me into geckos as well as chams.


Funny you should say purple that is what we have noticed, where the pictures show here as a yellowy/brown colour in the flesh it is more purple.


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

funky1 said:


> Bah Humbug :devil:
> 
> Haha, great stuff - you both must be so excited and apprehensive at the same time!
> 
> ...


Cheers mate! Trust me when I say we have looked at all breeding possibilites


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## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

i had a leo like this last year that came in on a mates pakistani shipment, it had only one clutch of eggs and sadly died shortly after.
must have been the stress of it all!
i managed to hatch the eggs after many problems with mould on this clutch which was very unusual, the babies hatched and i had one box standard normal and then one which was completely black.
the marking which are in the black band spread over the whole body appart from a yellow nose.
it developed and the black started going a dark grey with dark black spots. after about 5 weeks it died for no apparent reason and i am still confused as to why.

i decided after to no longer breed geckos and they slowly faded out of my collection.

but after seeing this beut i am thinking of starting up again with just the dark morphs!

good one guys


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

DRD said:


> i had a leo like this last year that came in on a mates pakistani shipment, it had only one clutch of eggs and sadly died shortly after.
> must have been the stress of it all!
> i managed to hatch the eggs after many problems with mould on this clutch which was very unusual, the babies hatched and i had one box standard normal and then one which was completely black.
> the marking which are in the black band spread over the whole body appart from a yellow nose.
> ...


That's a shame they didn't make it. Sorry to hear that. We know dark morphs aren't everyones cup of tea, but seeing them in the flesh would turn most peoples heads


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## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

MrMike said:


> That's a shame they didn't make it. Sorry to hear that. We know dark morphs aren't everyones cup of tea, but seeing them in the flesh would turn most peoples heads


it defernatly would lol

its just the price that would put some off lol


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

DRD said:


> it defernatly would lol
> 
> its just the price that would put some off lol


They are expensive, but we couldn't turn down the opportunity to get in on the ground floor with these. Also, they are nothing compared to Royal morph prices


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

MrMike said:


> They are expensive, but we couldn't turn down the opportunity to get in on the ground floor with these. Also, they are nothing compared to Royal morph prices


or some tokay morphs for that matter, the Leucistic and the Axanthic morphs are about 2000 for proven bloodline morphs.
I point this out as i'm hopping your cuties are gonna be alot cheaper LOL.


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

MrMike said:


> They are expensive, but we couldn't turn down the opportunity to get in on the ground floor with these. Also, they are nothing compared to Royal morph prices


As Blackadder would have said - you lucky,lucky barst:censor:s..........


:lol2:

Quality Leo there guys, hope you have all the fun in the world the next few years !!!


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Big Red One said:


> As Blackadder would have said - you lucky,lucky barst:censor:s..........
> 
> 
> :lol2:
> ...


Lol i dont know this could bring more stress as funky has already suggested.
Hopefully it will be extremely rewarding at the end though.

Thanks for your comments.


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## Slurm (Jun 6, 2008)

well it seems im the only one thats unimpressed by this morph.

its seems that currently this morph seems to only look good when photo'd in a dark room with no flash(hint):whistling2:.

I also have to admit im kinda jealous too, as with quite a bit of hard work this could be a true coup. 

I really hope this turns out good for both you and the morph and send my best gene wishes onto you.: victory:


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## suez (Jul 8, 2007)

gongratuations and good wishes to yous and i sincerely hope ALL of your dreams come true.it cool they are here now in the uk and we have the pleasure of knowing the peeps that own them.:notworthy:


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## Tempestas (Nov 25, 2009)

Slurm said:


> well it seems im the only one thats unimpressed by this morph.



Not the only one Slurm, The only thing I would be interested in with this "morph" is to see how black you can make it. I have already expressed my opinion to TS-Geckos.

And again I still wish them all the luck in the world and again congratulations.


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## [email protected] (Oct 10, 2008)

Sam, Mike, you jammy gits lol. congrats :2thumb: i saw em on the tug website longggg before i got the phantoms. obviously because of the price Lee went NO WAY! lol. look forward to see what you have in store these coming years 

Kay (",)

PS waiting list please


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## suey (Aug 21, 2008)

That's brilliant and exciting news, congratulations Sam and Mike!


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Congratulations Sam & Mike. I know you will work things out carefully to unlock her true potential.I really hope things work out well for you, the efforts you put into looking after your reps really deserves some outstanding results. I will be very interested in seeing how things develop for you. Good luck.


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

Slurm said:


> well it seems im the only one thats unimpressed by this morph.
> 
> its seems that currently this morph seems to only look good when photo'd in a dark room with no flash(hint):whistling2:.
> 
> ...


It is actually really hard to get a decent photo of these. We both took about 100 photos yesterday and 5 came out good 
I will take your best gene wishes though 



suez said:


> gongratuations and good wishes to yous and i sincerely hope ALL of your dreams come true.it cool they are here now in the uk and we have the pleasure of knowing the peeps that own them.:notworthy:


Thanks!



Tempestas said:


> Not the only one Slurm, The only thing I would be interested in with this "morph" is to see how black you can make it. I have already expressed my opinion to TS-Geckos.
> 
> And again I still wish them all the luck in the world and again congratulations.


Thanks for the congratulations. Working towards blacker Leos is definately one way forward with this mutation. A solid black Leo would be gorgeous.



[email protected] said:


> Sam, Mike, you jammy gits lol. congrats :2thumb: i saw em on the tug website longggg before i got the phantoms. obviously because of the price Lee went NO WAY! lol. look forward to see what you have in store these coming years
> 
> Kay (",)
> 
> PS waiting list please


Thanks! As we said earlier, we're not sure when any offspring will actually be for sale. Be sure we will let people know when they become available though.



suey said:


> That's brilliant and exciting news, congratulations Sam and Mike!


Thanks!



Mal said:


> Congratulations Sam & Mike. I know you will work things out carefully to unlock her true potential.I really hope things work out well for you, the efforts you put into looking after your reps really deserves some outstanding results. I will be very interested in seeing how things develop for you. Good luck.


Thanks Mal.


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## Boro (Aug 2, 2009)

Congrats to you both, cant wait to see how things turn out


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

Boro said:


> Congrats to you both, cant wait to see how things turn out


Thanks, neither can we.


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## JayThomas (Dec 23, 2009)

I think they look amazing.
Is it true that they go white as they age?
I was always led to believe that the ideal (possibly super morph of) black pearl was a pitch black (from the top view anyways) animal.
Im realy getting interested in Diablo Blancos at the moment. I just love white lizards.


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

JayThomas said:


> I think they look amazing.
> Is it true that they go white as they age?
> I was always led to believe that the ideal (possibly super morph of) black pearl was a pitch black (from the top view anyways) animal.
> Im realy getting interested in Diablo Blancos at the moment. I just love white lizards.


They do indeed, they get to the point of a beautiful snow with a purple-ish hue.
Put it this way if i hatched a snow that looked like the BP at its lightest stage it would be a hold back.

If it proves correct that they are recessive then there can be no super form.
Of course there is variation as there is with any morph but at the moment its just an extreme hypermelanistic morph, without a doubt with line breeding these could be *solid* black animals as adults, and look how the hatchlings do.


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

I have never been too impressed with them, have always thought they look more mud brown than black.

But I wish you guys all the best with them and hope you et lots of funky new morphs :no1:


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

MrMike said:


> It is actually really hard to get a decent photo of these. We both took about 100 photos yesterday and 5 came out good


 
Any chance you could post these 5 decent pics? I for one would love to see


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

excession said:


> Any chance you could post these 5 decent pics? I for one would love to see


Check the first post of the thread, i posted pictures then :2thumb:


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

Ahh I thought there was some updated ones


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

excession said:


> Ahh I thought there was some updated ones


Not yet sorry  Mike was referring to the photoshoot that we did prior to this thread. 

We haven't really got round to another photoshoot, but as soon as we have any photos or updates we will update the thread accordingly.


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

*Black Pearl Webpages*

We've now got our Black Pearl webpages all done and they have gone live.

Feel free to check them out:

Black Pearl


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## Breadrun (Mar 1, 2007)

Just wondering is the black pearl different to the black velvet I have seen because the black velvet seems a 100% black gecko (apart from the belly) where-as the black pearls seem to still have colour in them

I'm not trying to urinate on your strawberries btw lol


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Breadrun said:


> Just wondering is the black pearl different to the black velvet I have seen because the black velvet seems a 100% black gecko (apart from the belly) where-as the black pearls seem to still have colour in them
> 
> I'm not trying to urinate on your strawberries btw lol


Black Velvet Leopardgecko
"Blackie" to me is the only one that is black none of the others come close which to me with the limited info and the fact the breeder has never sold hets says the velvet is line bred, and it doesnt seem to be passing down very well. However i do believe that the Black Velvets ive linked to will be darker in the flesh, as we have found out how un-photogenic the colour makes them.

We are not to the point where the Black Pearl is solid black yet, but to have the foundations of an extreme melanistic gecko we are more than half way there, and the fact that they are genetic means that you can guarantee results dependant on the pairings.

The Black Pearl obviously isnt fully understood yet which is why its even more exciting, but to date we know of no other genetic black/melanistic lines.


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## Breadrun (Mar 1, 2007)

ahhhh right, I think it was a different site i saw where it showed only photo's of blackie (so i thought the morph was like that) - but yes it does seem that there is colour in both and i would say that within a few years someone will get a pure black gecko


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

May as well stick my page in as well 

MMM Geckos - Black Pearl


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## 53bird (Sep 30, 2009)

well done and good luck to you both:2thumb: and im nice and close if any thing special comes up or a sneaky peek:whistling2:


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

53bird said:


> well done and good luck to you both:2thumb: and im nice and close if any thing special comes up or a sneaky peek:whistling2:


Thanks!


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## Nic B-C (Dec 4, 2008)

Dont want to rain on anyones parade or anything but Im a bit unimpressed from those pics, seem little more than a slightlydarker colouration of a normal crossed with a mack snow, theres a lot of yellow showing in them from those pics ansd the blackie ones on other page seem to be grasping at straws.

I saw the project advertised for sale on other site is this the same things as those certainly looked a lot darker than these.

Anyways good luck with your project but not really doing anything for me


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

Nic B-C said:


> Dont want to rain on anyones parade or anything but Im a bit unimpressed from those pics, seem little more than a slightlydarker colouration of a normal crossed with a mack snow, theres a lot of yellow showing in them from those pics ansd the blackie ones on other page seem to be grasping at straws.
> 
> I saw the project advertised for sale on other site is this the same things as those certainly looked a lot darker than these.
> 
> Anyways good luck with your project but not really doing anything for me


It seems the black pearls go through "developmental stages" (as TUG calls it). They hatch pure black, then over the course of a few months loose the colour until they look almost snow like. After this they start to regain the increased melanin. This morph as it stands does not have reduced yellow pigment, just increased melanin.

As said, these aren't a pure black Leo, but hypermelanistic.










Above is an adult pic (courtesy of TUG). I do believe a few generations selective breeding will increase the amount of melanin produced, moving towards a solid black leo. Of course this won't be everyones cup of tea, but the world would be boring if we all liked the same things


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Well we've had another quick photoshoot, and the melanin definitely has increased, we still feel there is a bit more darkening up to happen, but for us the changes we have already witnessed are enough to get us very excited!


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

I think you have good cause to be very excited. A stunning gecko. Wishing you every success with this project. Keep on updating us


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## ginnerone (Aug 2, 2009)

jools said:


> I think you have good cause to be very excited. A stunning gecko. Wishing you every success with this project. Keep on updating us


 Me two, i'm well impressed and think its an awesome looking leo, your bound to get one or two loons that can't see the potential or beauty in these, hell i'm one of them when it comes to Tokay morphs, but this is a stunning set of leo's.
i'm not easily impressed but these get my vote.:2thumb::no1:


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

jools said:


> I think you have good cause to be very excited. A stunning gecko. Wishing you every success with this project. Keep on updating us





ginnerone said:


> Me two, i'm well impressed and think its an awesome looking leo, your bound to get one or two loons that can't see the potential or beauty in these, hell i'm one of them when it comes to Tokay morphs, but this is a stunning set of leo's.
> i'm not easily impressed but these get my vote.:2thumb::no1:


Cheers guys. I have some updated pics i'll post later on.


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## swift_wraith (Jan 4, 2009)

sam12345 said:


> Well we've had another quick photoshoot, and the melanin definitely has increased, we still feel there is a bit more darkening up to happen, but for us the changes we have already witnessed are enough to get us very excited!
> 
> image



That photo needs more lighting, its too dark and gives a false statement in my eyes. Looking at the exif info, you need to use a flash (preferably off camera) and increase the iso slightly.

Still want a pearl tho!! :whistling2:

A Didsbury - willing to photograph in exchange for Black pearls:2thumb:


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

swift_wraith said:


> That photo needs more lighting, its too dark and gives a false statement in my eyes. Looking at the exif info, you need to use a flash (preferably off camera) and increase the iso slightly.
> 
> Still want a pearl tho!! :whistling2:
> 
> A Didsbury - willing to photograph in exchange for Black pearls:2thumb:


Regardless of what morph you are photographing people have very mixed views on leo morph photography and in most cases (and my opinion included) people feel flash gives a false sense of colours.

Unfortunately our photography skills and budget limit us to what we can do, after all we arent going to spend hundreds on a light studio when we would have the foggiest of how to use it.

All of the Black Pearl photos have been taken in natural light, on an opaque light table.

We have had offers from professional photographers which we may well take up, but for the moment it seems a waste of time when there still may be some way to go in regards to the darkening.

One thing i can tell you for sure is that the photos we have released dont darken or give a false sense of colour in a way to benefit the Black Pearl.


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

As Sam said really, photographing the BPs is difficult. I have a camera, I point and click :blush:

We are looking into getting some decent pics taken, with remote flashes, diffusers and a manne rof other things which we don't get


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## POAGeckos (Jul 11, 2008)

I think that you should take a photo shoot with 2 geckos, a black pearl and a very brightly coloured gecko such as a sunglow so you can see the dark pigment of the black pearls.


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## eddy (Feb 24, 2009)

the potential of theses geckos is of course amazing, and i cant wait to see how they look a few more generations down the line, though i'm joining the 'unimpressed' team for the time being


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

POAGeckos said:


> I think that you should take a photo shoot with 2 geckos, a black pearl and a very brightly coloured gecko such as a sunglow so you can see the dark pigment of the black pearls.


On our to-do list once the quarantine period is over


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## swift_wraith (Jan 4, 2009)

sam12345 said:


> ....All of the Black Pearl photos have been taken in natural light, on an opaque light table.
> 
> We have had offers from professional photographers which we may well take up, but for the moment it seems a waste of time when there still may be some way to go in regards to the darkening.
> 
> One thing i can tell you for sure is that the photos we have released dont darken or give a false sense of colour in a way to benefit the Black Pearl.



If you can, take some pics next to a window. natural sunlight is the best light source available. No flash or extra lighting needed.


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## Nic B-C (Dec 4, 2008)

I would like to see some better pics to highlight the differences, be interesting to see


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

swift_wraith said:


> If you can, take some pics next to a window. natural sunlight is the best light source available. No flash or extra lighting needed.


That was where all of the Black Pearl pictures are taken. With the direct sunlight beaming in onto the light table.


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## pmamhayes (Jun 13, 2007)

congratulations on your purchase, a very brave bold move and a chance to shape a new morph,

I do realisle you must have plans for her and I'd love to what they are, but Im thinking if you only 1 female you can only deminish the black pearl strain in her by out breeding it into other morphs (and only one in the first season):devil:

you should cut off and sell your other arm & leg and get a male?

"BOY THAT WOULD BE EXCITING"


good luck....


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

pmamhayes said:


> congratulations on your purchase, a very brave bold move and a chance to shape a new morph,
> 
> I do realisle you must have plans for her and I'd love to what they are, but Im thinking if you only 1 female you can only deminish the black pearl strain in her by out breeding it into other morphs (and only one in the first season):devil:
> 
> ...


Thanks 
Its a question we keep getting asked and its something we are not going to release just yet.
Theres a limited number of people with them and it seems all everyone wants to know is what the other is doing, whether to beat them to it or just stay clear of them combos, were not sure.
We're happy to any suggestions on pairings though, and we will release plans, but probably not until the deed is done and we cant change our minds any more.

Obviously as with any new morph, numbers is this big problem especially when you are working on intensifying something like this, its not to say we haven't got a male though :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## Geckogirl_88 (Apr 24, 2009)

as my fave morphs are blizzard based and the exact opposite, BP's aren't my fave lol. but I do think it's very exciting 
So are you going to use lower incubation temps to darker their colours even more?
It will be very interesting to see how this developes 
xx


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

Geckogirl_88 said:


> as my fave morphs are blizzard based and the exact opposite, BP's aren't my fave lol. but I do think it's very exciting
> So are you going to use lower incubation temps to darker their colours even more?
> It will be very interesting to see how this developes
> xx


We are in constant contact with TUG as they are the only ones with BP eggs cooking at the moment. We will decide on incubation temps once we see their results 

Here's another pic, hopefully it is a little clearer.


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

Geckogirl_88 said:


> as my fave morphs are blizzard based and the exact opposite, BP's aren't my fave lol. but I do think it's very exciting
> So are you going to use lower incubation temps to darker their colours even more?
> It will be very interesting to see how this developes
> xx


Our intention is to get a line of Black Pearls that is genetically darker, so dont intend to be incubating at low temps.
The main problem we would face there is we will be masking any progress we do make through selective breeding.


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## Geckogirl_88 (Apr 24, 2009)

sam12345 said:


> Our intention is to get a line of Black Pearls that is genetically darker, so dont intend to be incubating at low temps.
> The main problem we would face there is we will be masking any progress we do make through selective breeding.


Ah ok. Didn't think about that.
Still that above pic is really good 
Just imagine if you got an all black adult one day!
So excited for both of you 
xx


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

Here is an image (courtesy of The Urban Gecko), comparing a TUG sunglow and a Black Pearl. We will update with our own images when we can.


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## Geckogirl_88 (Apr 24, 2009)

I take it back, I DO like them lol.
That one's gorgeous!
Im soooo envious lol
xx


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## James Prala (Apr 4, 2009)

i'm not even a gecko man and i want one so they must be good lmao x


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

*Another Picture update!*

So we feel its time for another update, and after trying to take as much advice on board about the photography with out buying equipment, we have taken this photo with as much natural light as possible.
Its meant waiting for lovely weather but we have been blessed with some lovely weather recently and made the most of it.


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

Wow she looks stunning. How much does she weigh now?


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## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

sam12345 said:


> So we feel its time for another update, and after trying to take as much advice on board about the photography with out buying equipment, we have taken this photo with as much natural light as possible.
> Its meant waiting for lovely weather but we have been blessed with some lovely weather recently and made the most of it.
> 
> image


Looking good: victory:.Could you do a Black pearl leo with a good example normal leo picture at some point.


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

gazz said:


> Looking good: victory:.Could you do a Black pearl leo with a good example normal leo picture at some point.


It's something we will get round to.
We want to do pictures with snows, sunglows (or other bright morphs) and normal/high yellows.
As soon as we do I'll put the pics on here.


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

The colour changes these guys go through is amazing to see in the flesh.


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

Looking good guys !

Good luck with the project.......:no1:


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## JustJordan (Jul 2, 2008)

Im only just getting in to leo morph breeding and these guys got me a bit excited.
How much do you expect to sell the babies for when you get round to selling any of the offspring?

Obviously there will be quite a wait but maybe put me on the list?


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

JustJordan said:


> Im only just getting in to leo morph breeding and these guys got me a bit excited.
> How much do you expect to sell the babies for when you get round to selling any of the offspring?
> 
> Obviously there will be quite a wait but maybe put me on the list?


Its very hard to say at the moment, but i think both myself and Mike have agreed standard Pearls wont be going for $3k.

The actual availability is an even harder question to answer, theres going to be a lot of hold backs to line ourselves up for the year after so at the end of this season we might have a few hets, and maybe a visual to release but its something we are just going to have to wait and see.
We haven't bothered with a waiting list yet because of these reasons.

Glad to hear you like them


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## Mrs Swans (Jul 4, 2009)

Really nic ones! :2thumb:


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

So, we decided to get some comparison pictures together, which highlight exactly how dark these guys are...

With a couple of Sunglows


















With a normal/high yellow









With a Phantom









With a Mack snow









All comment are greatly appreciated and welcome :2thumb:


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

She looks stunning!!

Love the contrast with the phantom, wicked pic 

Do you guys have any plans to bring any more over now?


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

excession said:


> She looks stunning!!
> 
> Love the contrast with the phantom, wicked pic
> 
> Do you guys have any plans to bring any more over now?


We are looking into it  We really believe more is better in this case


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## excession (Apr 11, 2009)

MrMike said:


> We are looking into it  We really believe more is better in this case


I thought temptation might get the better of you!!

Brilliant pics though, I want one!


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## 53bird (Sep 30, 2009)

wow, shes looking good :2thumb:


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## Gemstone Dragons (Jul 29, 2009)

Stunning :gasp:


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

I still dont like them, the phantom and mack snow are stunning tho:flrt:


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## swift_wraith (Jan 4, 2009)

I'm meant to be trying to save for a new house and here you are waving these buggers under my nose!!

ill take twelve 

ps, natural light is really showing them off lovely


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## MrMike (Jun 28, 2008)

swift_wraith said:


> I'm meant to be trying to save for a new house and here you are waving these buggers under my nose!!
> 
> ill take twelve
> 
> ps, natural light is really showing them off lovely


Looking back through the photos we took previously we can see what people were on about. Maybe we couldn't see it before because we knew how dark they really were?


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

purpleskyes said:


> I still dont like them, the phantom and mack snow are stunning tho:flrt:


As we've said all along these wont be everyones cup of tea, but the chance to seem them in the flesh makes you appreciate a little more how unique these animals are.


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## sparkle (Mar 21, 2007)

I want to love them.. I just dont

Interesting, exciting but ugly

Good Luck with your project x


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## leopardgeckomad (Feb 2, 2008)

firstly i wish you both the best of luck.

but tbh i dont think there anything special other than a new morph, also i hope the prices of these stay quite high as we all know how cheap leos get over the years.

anyway i wish you both luck.

Brad : victory:


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## sam12345 (Dec 28, 2007)

leopardgeckomad said:


> firstly i wish you both the best of luck.
> 
> but tbh i dont think there anything special other than a new morph, also i hope the prices of these stay quite high as we all know how cheap leos get over the years.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your good wishes!

I think the good thing about this morph being high priced is that it stops people that just want to make a quick buck buying in.
People buy into things like this because they want to work with the morph and build it's foundations.
For us we aren't rushing things, many others would have released at least hets by now to start raking in the cash. However for us it's more about setting the building blocks for future seasons... Branching out into other projects, all things we find very exciting!
It also means that we won't have threads reducing the price of the geckos every other day... If the geckos don't sell for what we believe they are worth then they will stay, that's something we believe strongly in anyway.
And it doesn't just go for the black pearl, it's the same for any gecko/reptile, if people stuck to these principals then markets wouldn't crash.


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## leopardgeckomad (Feb 2, 2008)

sam12345 said:


> Thanks for your good wishes!
> 
> I think the good thing about this morph being high priced is that it stops people that just want to make a quick buck buying in.
> People buy into things like this because they want to work with the morph and build it's foundations.
> ...


i fully agree with you, atleast theres people like you and mike, i think its stupid how Engimas are becoming low priced, i can understand if they circle!

anyway good luck.


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

sam12345 said:


> It also means that we won't have threads reducing the price of the geckos every other day... If the geckos don't sell for what we believe they are worth then they will stay, that's something we believe strongly in anyway.
> And it doesn't just go for the black pearl, it's the same for any gecko/reptile, if people stuck to these principals then markets wouldn't crash.


*nods* I agree unfortunately not everyone does the same and you always get someone who drops to ridiculous prices/bargain bucket efforts to GROASAP :roll:


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## leopardgeckomad (Feb 2, 2008)

SleepyD said:


> *nods* I agree unfortunately not everyone does the same and you always get someone who drops to ridiculous prices/bargain bucket efforts to GROASAP :roll:


and i also admit that someone could be me as i do, but now i dont anymore.


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## Spider Call (Mar 23, 2007)

Wow!
I am not fond of leo's... But she is GORGEOUS!
Grats <3 and good luck.


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## Slurm (Jun 6, 2008)

sam12345 said:


> Thanks for your good wishes!
> 
> I think the good thing about this morph being high priced is that it stops people that just want to make a quick buck buying in.
> People buy into things like this because they want to work with the morph and build it's foundations.
> ...


so by my reading, is it that you have bred your female, what did you breed her with? did you go down the mack snow route? giving 2 distinct paths to follow.

Your post is a bit idealistic, people will always pay a premium for something unusual or new, afterall you did yourself, but as it becomes more common place the price naturally drops, it does so in pretty much all the genetic variants in many species. Why would the the BP be any different? 

I seriously wish you and Mike sucess, but lets be honest here, if she has been bred then at very best you would have 20 hets but more like 10 so your really not in a position of "released at least hets " just yet, hereby implying you have more than hets.

Also i was under the belief that the genetics were still being clarified, is it clear this gene is recessive?

This is a very nice project to get stuck into and i hope you pull out something special over time, but be realistic

sorry if this comes over in the wrong way its not my intention.: victory:


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## SpeckledGecko (Sep 5, 2010)

im not usually a massive fan of the leo's 
but i have to say that is very nice
:mf_dribble:


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## fat-pat (Mar 5, 2008)

Just notices this thred as been inactive for 3 years now. Whats the news / progress with the black pearl as I am itching to get my hands on them


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