# My "Frogroom"



## frogman955

Well for a long time now I`ve wanted to sort up my Leucs viv as it was wild in there plant wise.
Also the substrate had over time been rotting away, so if I`d left it as it was the poor Leucs would have been walking about on the plastic mesh on top of the hydro leca.
So off came the coco panel which was on the end and I replaced it with a brick effect background which I got from Marc at Dartfrog.
I deliberately bought a larger one so that I could use the extra to build up some sort of central area for planting and for the Leucs to climb about on.
My pitcher plant (Nepenthes Alata) had grown huge so I had to cut that back big time.
But as you can see in the photo the colours are stunning and I`d find it hard now to not have that plant in there.
I bought it from Dartfrog about 4 years ago and it just thrives in that viv.
I took out all the soil which was one messy job lol, and put in egg crate with my favourite peat plates sitting on top.
As I`ve said before the peat will take on a gorgeous covering of moss in no time and it will also be more durable than the previous substrate.
The egg crate will lift the peat up away from the water table giving it some breathing space below allowing it to drain better.
The pool at the end remains as I have found that Leucs just love water and they spend a lot of time in that pool.
What substrate I`m going to use in the walled part I`m not sure yet, but maybe a mix of eco earth and orchid bark, something fast draining.
The Leucs of course are having fun as I`ve moved them into a rearing viv for the time being.
They`ve just not stopped since I put them in.
Anyway, more later.


Mike


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## frogman955

Today I found an awesome lump of wood so had to grab it quick.
Just as well it`s a large tank lol.
It`s 4 1/2ft x 2ft x 2ft.

Mike


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## grizzlymonkyboy

Mike what's the brick looking square in the middle mate?? 


Thanks 
Dane


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## frogman955

grizzlymonkyboy said:


> Mike what's the brick looking square in the middle mate??
> 
> 
> Thanks
> Dane


Hi Dane
I bought the brick effect background from Dartfrog with the intention of blanking off one end of the viv (which in fact was designed as a room divider 130 gallon aquarium) and what was left over was to be used to build a raised area in the centre for putting plants etc.
And of course as Leucs love climbing it gives them a higher level to play around on.
When I found that slab of bog wood in my mates shop it was just what I needed to finish the viv off as it now creates a massive overhang which will give the Leucs some shade from the 4 tubes which are in the hood.


Mike


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## frogman955

Well I decided I`ll put them back in their "new" viv and see how they like it.
They`ve already been all around it and inspected everything, and within 10 minutes one of the males was calling his little heart out.
I`ve not heard them calling since moving them out so it must meet with their approval.
One has already been in the pool for a splash around.


Mike


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## soundstounite

Damn that little leuc is pretty nearest camera last shot Mike:flrt:

Stu


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## frogman955

Hi Stu.
Yes it is a nice one, and after your post I checked and that is in fact the same one in the first 2 shots.
But they just haven`t stopped calling since I moved them back in, it`s unreal.
They obviously love their new home so it`s good news all round :2thumb:.
Lights out and they`re still at it and again as soon as the curtains are opened before lights on.
Damn but I just love my Leucs :flrt:.
I`ll never regret buying them.


Mike


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## janeb

Love it I like the moss what is it?


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## Ron Magpie

janeb said:


> Love it I like the moss what is it?


I'm guessing Java moss- it does really well in wet situations. I use it underwater with my clawed frogs and on (continuously wet) land with my FBTs.


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## frogman955

Truth be told I`ve no idea.
That tank has been on the go now for over 4 years and I don`t remember ever putting moss into that tank.
As far as I can remember it has all grown on it`s own from the damp conditions around the pool.
The only moss I`ve ever bought in the past came from Marc at Dartfrog, but there was no specific name for it so if I did in fact put some of that in I have no idea what it is.


Mike


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## janeb

Just realised I have some in my fish tank it's java moss can I put some in my pool in the Azzies viv?


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## frogman955

Can`t see any reason why not Jane.
What to do is give it a wash and put some in a bowl of fresh water for a few days to help neutralise any nasties before using it.

Well I just went to move one of the coco huts and found a clutch of eggs inside.
That was a nice surprise, I was thinking they`d gone on strike lol.


Mike


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## janeb

Ah that is a nice surprise have to admit ones in pics look fab


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## soundstounite

frogman955 said:


> Truth be told I`ve no idea.
> That tank has been on the go now for over 4 years and I don`t remember ever putting moss into that tank.
> As far as I can remember it has all grown on it`s own from the damp conditions around the pool.
> The only moss I`ve ever bought in the past came from Marc at Dartfrog, but there was no specific name for it so if I did in fact put some of that in I have no idea what it is.
> 
> 
> Mike


Mike Marc does some little squares of moss,in between two bits of celophane,if it's that it's black jungle sheet moss,if not I haven't a clue:lol2: Yeah I thought it was the same one as in the earlier pics. Ours are going nuts too,we have had a few storms last few days,it's pretty noisy all round here,I don't think we could be without leucs either

Stu


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## frogman955

I did try that Black Jungle moss Stu but couldn`t get it to grow.
The stuff I got from Marc he sells in sheets 20 x 40cm for £3.99.
But as it was a long time ago I can`t be sure if I used it, but I`m suspecting that I did now I`m thinking about it.
Landscaping & Decor Price List 6th one up from the Décor.


Mike


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## soundstounite

frogman955 said:


> I did try that Black Jungle moss Stu but couldn`t get it to grow.
> The stuff I got from Marc he sells in sheets 20 x 40cm for £3.99.
> But as it was a long time ago I can`t be sure if I used it, but I`m suspecting that I did now I`m thinking about it.
> Landscaping & Decor Price List 6th one up from the Décor.
> 
> 
> Mike


Ha I thought I might t rigger the old grey matter Mike:lol2: Buddy I'm starting the Bj stuff on ecoearth in little curry tubs,popped under the lights between the vivs,on the rack,it seems slow ,but a little liverwort in some packs might be a winner,all damn slow though. Anyway grats on the leucs,man I love baby leucs,we just got some ootw:flrt::flrt:best 'o' luck with the little darlings
cheers for that^^
Stu


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## frogman955

Looks like there`s some lurve going around at the moment :whistling2:.


Mike


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## frogman955

I`m thinking someone needs to go on a diet :lol2:.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

like the colouring on the guy on the left there


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## frogman955

Meefloaf said:


> like the colouring on the guy on the left there


I get quite a few looking like that Joe.
They definitely stand out.


Mike


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## frogman955

FEED ME!!!!!

NOW!!!!



Mike


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## stephenkelly

looking good mike. :2thumb:

stevie


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## frogman955

Hi Steve.
Those things are mobile dustbins lol.


Mike


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## frogman955

Some pics of a few of my frogs.
First pic is some chubby froglets with no respect for each other :whistling2:.
Second one is a sub adult Basti.
Third one is some BriBri hunting down some fly`s.
Last one is one of my Salt Creek females.


Mike


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## janeb

Fab pics mike! 

Another note my viv doesn't looks as wet as yours yet the readings are fine?


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## frogman955

Don't worry Jane photos can be deceiving. 
My vivs had not long been misted when those pics were taken.

Mike


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## frogman955

Some more photo`s of my frogs.
First one is some Netted Leuc froglets which I`m babysitting for Liam.
Second photo is one rather plump Pumilio Black Jeans.
Last one is a Salt Creek froglet playing around in the leaf litter.


Mike


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## Arcadiajohn

Stunning!


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## janeb

Looking fab!


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## frogman955

Some more photo`s, this time of some of my Pum vivs.
The first pic is the Bastis viv.
The second one is the Black Jeans, here you can see Rip Van Winkle (bottom left) to which I referred in an earlier post about the Jungle Dawns, http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/amphibians/1037080-exciting-day-arcadia-jungle-dawn-9.html
Third one is the BriBri, and the fourth one is one of the Salt Creek vivs.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

i must admit Mike, whenever i see your 'backgroundless' viv's i am impressed with how awesome they look, personally i dont have the vision to spot the 'layout' of your odd bits of cork to make it look good to me and then i'd whack a load of stuff in lol


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## frogman955

Thanks Joe.
There are different ways to look at how a viv is built.
Hopefully I can explain what was behind my thinking so that you and others can understand me.
Hopefully it will also give some ideas for your own vivs.
You can have a sloping background the same as I`ve made for one of my vivs, photo`s to come soon.
Or you can have a decorated background stuck onto the rear glass, like cork bark or Gorilla Glue, or even coco fibre mat.
Finally you can have what I`ve done, plain glass with a couple of extra levels made with cork siliconed to the glass.
The sloping background I`ve always said should start around halfway between the back of the viv and the front, leaving some ground area for the frogs.
The taller the viv the steeper the slope becomes, so if your viv is low the slope should be fine for say Tincs.
If the viv is tall like mine are at 70cm the slope is a lot steeper which is perfect for Pums or thumbnails.
Decorated backgrounds which are flat on the glass look okay but for me they are only okay.
They don`t give so much scope to do much with them other than having a plant climbing up the "wall" or laying a nice branch against it to help decorate the viv.
I know that's not a great description of a background, I`m just trying to give an example.
The plain black I`ve used makes the colours stand out better.
If you look closely at those pics the black creates dark areas at the back of the viv.
But, you can see a Basti female on the wood in the first pic.
The second pic there was actually a Black Jeans sitting there but you don`t see it in that pic.
In the third one you can see the BriBri against the dark area at the back where the lamp doesn`t shine, you can clearly see the shadow line..
And although the last pic is a bit brighter, the dark area helps to show up the red Salt Creek froglet that's jumping around. Yes it`s in that photo.
So going for the bare background created a little problem for me in that it effectively gave the frogs very little ground area.
It also had the potential to make the viv look very bare and I`d almost been there before using coco fibre and Gorilla Glue.
So the answer for me was to use the cork to create platforms.
This also served other uses as well.
They created shadows on the floor to give the frogs shelter from bright lights, something I`m a believer in.
It also gave extra floor space, at higher levels, for whichever frog in whichever viv as I have also used the same idea in one of the Tincs vivs, and they always climb up onto it.
Another use is for plants to sit on and as can be seen they give a great effect as they hang like a curtain, or like the one where all the roots hang like vines and sink into the peat plates on the bottom.
There is of course the age old problem of finding the right bit of wood for the viv to get THAT look which we`re all after.
When choosing your bits of wood remember to play with it in the shop by trying to imagine how it`s going to sit in the viv.
Also an important thing is to try and imagine how your going to mount any broms to it.
Are there any well placed holes for you to jam a stolon into ? or are there any nice jutting mounting points to tie a brom onto ?
Then of course there is the long wait for it all to grown in.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

cheers mike, certainly something i will be looking into when i inevitably go for some pums


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## Orlex

Hi Mike,
Just find your topic, looks great. Frogs healthy and nice colours  .
Unique vivs  like it.


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## plasma234

I like how clean your vivs are, concise is the word I would use. Effective and to the point. :2thumb:I can imagine you get a lot of viewing pleasure from your frogs, even the shyest of frogs you will be able to spot from a distance without spooking them. 

I am looking into redesigning my terrib viv as I am really unhappy with the back ground and I have taken that massive bit of driftwood out and have put a cork flat on the floor and have just jammed loads of broms into it. I know terribs aren't known for their climbing but mine seem to love it lol, so I will be looking to add some easy to climb apparatus into the viv. 

The picture of your rack that you posted on another thread was really nice, as it really shows off how clean your vivs are and how effective they look all together.


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## Meefloaf

me and Stu have coveted mike's tendrils for a bit now

as for you callum, i seen this on (as its mikes thread, i'll use his words) facepish, and thought of you

....in true facepish fashion, i've lost its whereabouts, but basically it was a few dif layers in the land with the odd bit on the back and the odd 'fallen' branch/log, looked amazing, and im sure it was for terribs


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## frogman955

Thanks for the nice comments guys :notworthy:.
I just took another photo of the rack but not downsized it so much so that you can click on the photo and fill your screen with it lol.
Callum from where I`m sitting I`m about 18 feet from my vivs so I`m able to use a small pair of binoculars to sit and watch the frogs.
It`s a good way to watch them playing around or courting without going near the vivs and disturbing them.


Mike


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## Liam Yule

I'm always impressed when I see your vivs too Mike, 
I'm always talking to sara about doing this and that to the background but she's a really big fan of your style. I am happy with my terribs background as the climbers have now filled every single gap between the cork mosaic and left those bits of cork showing which has worked out well but a lot of the time you can see guys who have spent countless hours for it just to be covered up, which is ok if that's what your after. Your tall vivs have grown in really well and it stands out even more with the black background.


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## frogman955

Thanks Liam.
You`ll probably be in agreement that the photo`s don`t show the vivs as they really look.
They`re close, but .......................
It`s always better in the flesh.
What you mentioned is something I should have pointed out above, about all the work put into making a nice background.
Hours are spent designing and shaping until it looks awesome.
Then, in goes all the plants, and 6 months later the background is gone, buried under a pile of leaves and flowers.


Mike


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## plasma234

I spent a bit of time on my background for the cauchero but I wasn't too fussed on getting it perfect as I had designed it to be grown over, with hygrolon and cork bark tubes it is perfect for climbers and trailers, it has grown in and given the effect I was after. The terrib viv was just one of the flat premade things that was made to look like oak bark, it is no 3dimensional enough for me and provides very little in the way of depth and height for them and plant growth. I am thinking of using a similar method as the pums but your vivs have given me something to ponder about..


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## ButterflyLordette

Such stunning frogs <3


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## frogman955

It's a pretty good feeling to know that what I've done has generated so much interest.
There are also other advantages to be had as happened to me recently. 
When one of the vivs got infested with nemerteans I ended up with only one way to get completely rid of them, a strip down.
A viv with a built in background would be soul destroying to have to rip out.
All that it needed for me was to remove some cork and plants.
To kill off any that were left behind I poured hot water from the tap (not the kettle) onto the peat plates several times until it was nice and toasty and basically boiled them.
Once done it was just a case of put in some new cork, bog wood and plants and I was off again.
That was just maybe 3 or 4 months ago and now the Bastis have a new home.
Some bits of bogwood have been held in place with a blob of silicone but most are just sitting on their own base or propped against the side of the viv.
The frogs are not heavy enough to move the wood and I'm not moving the vivs any time soon so there's no risk.
It's all simples.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

sorry to invade here young Mike, but here's that pic for callum, its a big viv but imagine you can scale down


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## frogman955

Invade away Joe.
Just because it`s "my frogroom" thread it`s here for anyone to share photo`s or knowledge.
That is a nice viv and although I`m not a fan of ornaments in a viv that wee hut kinda looks cute.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

as a massive nerd, i'd love to do a kind of Frogzilla viv so looks like huge frogs in a jungle etc, but i do prefer the natural look. also a Miyazaki inspired viv would be amazing


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## frogman955

I posted this link somewhere once before but here it is again anyway Vivarium
Loads of photo`s to fire up your imagination.


Mike


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## plasma234

That viv Joe looks not much bigger than mine. Remember mine is 5ft x 2ft x 2ft . It actually becomes a challenge scaping such a big viv, trying to get the ratios and perspective correct. :bash:


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## frogman955

It is a lot of viv to fill for sure.
Ask my Leucs lol.
They think they`re in a mansion.
I`m still sitting on my thumbs over doing the new Terribs viv 100x50x100.
Where do I start lol.
I`ve got a few ideas and I`ll hopefully be starting on it soon.


Mike


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## plasma234

I saw a really nice 100 high x 100wide done by a frogger down Brighton way who was selling up. It was the expanding foam and eco earth method, but the thing that really made it look amazing was the VERY established pumila quercifolia all over the sides and back.


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## frogman955

This one has already been done with exp foam etc Callum.
But I`m ripping it all out and going a different route.
Think yellow Terribs climbing up 1 metre to the top :2thumb:.
Yes, I`m confident that they will be doing exactly that.


Mike


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## plasma234

frogman955 said:


> Think yellow Terribs climbing up 1 metre to the top












One of these aha


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## frogman955

Callum your not going to tell me that you own that are you ? :gasp:


Mike


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## plasma234

Not a ****ing chance :lol2: I do keep roborovski hamsters but they are in aquariums. 



By the way, are you going to Holland at all? I need these








Pumilio el dorado


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## frogman955

No Callum I don`t own a passport, although last week I thought I might have to get one for going to BAKS lmao.
Sits and breathes a sigh of relief lol.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

love em with the markings


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## plasma234

I don't own a passport. I need one before February next year. Joe, come through Southampton and we can road trip to Dutch rana :whistling2:


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## Meefloaf

i was meant to be going to north holland at end of october but would've cost me far too much

i too have no passport


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## frogman955

Haha it`s passports all round for xmas.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

i'll settle for the euro millions


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## frogman955

Now your talking Joe.
And I`d build the biggest damn frogroom in the world for all to see.


Mike


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## plasma234

I should have made minecraft. ...


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## frogman955

A frog which I`ve had my share of bad luck with is Reginas, but I`ve stuck with them because they are one of the best looking Tincs there are.
Now I`ve been rewarded with the very first 2 froglets about to leave the water.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

awesome news Mike


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## frogman955

Thanks Joe.
Shame they won`t be ready for Sunday, but BAKS in April I`ll have a few with me.


Mike


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## Basin79

You've just received about 30 likes off me, only just looked through your thread. Brilliant.


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## frogman955

Just found them, it made me chuckle.
Much appreciated.
There`ll be lots more in time.


Mike


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## frogman955

Well I`ve had a proper bugger of a week and then tonight I came home to see one of my Yellow Terribs with a big black mark on it`s back.
On closer inspection I had a big smile on my face and the Terrib is in fine fettle.
He in fact was carrying some passengers around, his first.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

awesome to see mike, terribs at the next baks it is then


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## frogman955

Hi Joe.
I think it would be a fair comment to say, yes.
Unfortunately for this weekend all my froglets are too young so apart from some which are pre booked my table will have no animals on it for the first time.
Now the next BAKS is different.
I`ll have no room on the table for anything other than frogs :lol2:.
And if the Terribs live up to their reputation I`ll need a table for them alone lmao.
Damn but I hope not.


Mike


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## myreptile

frogman955 said:


> FEED ME!!!!!
> 
> NOW!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> image


Oh my!!! Look at the state of that!!!! They don't look real. Them heads dont look like they belong to them bodies. Plus they have a very 'crouching' human look to them. I have just taken the plunge and got my first frogs 4 amazon milk frogs. Some of these dont look real with their colours. They would be a dream to own.

Im sorry for my ignorance but what are these yellow beastly looking frogs called? Would love to plant a viv and have a crayola party going on in there. :flrt:


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## frogman955

The yellow ones are Terribilis, or Terribs for short.
The most poisonous dart frog in the world, with no known cure.
But that of course is only in the wild and not in captive bred frogs.
Awesome frogs with awesome personalities.
An eating machine.
If they were the size of a human they would be eating the equivalent of a whole cow at one sitting.
Living dustbins lmao.
And yes some of the colours and patterns have to be seen to be believed.


Mike


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## Ron Magpie

They'd be eating the cow in very small, budgie-size bites, though! :lol2:


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## Ron Magpie

And the bloody budgies would escape all the time and get everywhere...


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## myreptile

Exoterra 45x45x60 (the long one) would this be suitable for a trio of darts? It currently has white lined geckos in but once they grow and upgrade I will have an empty tank, seeing as this is strictly forbidden im thinking of planting it up.


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## frogman955

A 60 long viv is fine for a trio.


Mike


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## plasma234

frogman955 said:


> The yellow ones are Terribilis, or Terribs for short.
> The most poisonous dart frog in the world, with no known cure.


They also have a very loud call, as i was woken up on my day off with a very persistent male who won't stfu :lol2: he gets evewn louder when another male pipes up :bash:

i do love them though, very visual and bold. they would probably feed from my hand (i don't do this nor would i recommend it) and he calls even when i am fiddling around with stuff in the viv. :flrt:


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## frogman955

Loud?
Not a chance Callum.
Very quiet timid creatures they are.
Sneaks away to clear ones throat :whistling 2:


Mike


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## Liam Yule

Mine hasbeen the same lately. Loud. I love it though. I'm happy they are happy. He's been a bit shy since the viv disaster and hiding away. Everyone else is out and about as usual though.


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## frogman955

Don't worry Liam I'm sure you'll have some tiddly poles soon.
I'm positive you have a pair there.


Mike


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## frogman955

Right I`m at work on the vivs again.
This time I picked up my new viv from Dale at DMS Vivaria - Amphibian vivaria
This one is 50x40x70 tall and is going to be housing a group of Bastis.
When I was in to Dartfrog - Everything for the Amphibian Keeper for a visit, Marc had this lovely lump of wood just lying there calling out for me.
So my soft side told me to help it out and give it a new home.
I`ll be using a similar layout to my other vivs but am going to be going slightly down the minimalist route with this one for a change, so, watch this space as they say.


Mike


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## Meefloaf

you wern't wrong about that piece of wood Mike


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## frogman955

That photo doesn`t do it justice Joe.
But I`ve got it all in my head what I`m going to do with it.
I`ve a lovely small lime green brom to fit on the branch on the lower left.
On the upper area I`ll be fixing some lovely broms which with luck will keep their proper colours with being right under the lights, and I`m hoping that apart from the Bastis scavenging amongst the leaf litter for food they will spend a lot of time up in the broms where they`ll be easily seen getting on with what they do best.


Mike


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## frogman955

Well that's the "substrate" in place and the broms tied on.
Just got to put some other plants in place and a couple of other mods and I should be about ready to put the frogs in.
As usual I forgot to get a couple of things from Marc when in his shop so I`ll have to send off an order for them and that should be it.


Mike


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## Liam Yule

Looks good Mike. The size of the wood really pops when the broms were attached. I was holding off commenting until the broms were on.


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## frogman955

Liam Yule said:


> Looks good Mike. The size of the wood really pops when the broms were attached. I was holding off commenting until the broms were on.


Hi Liam
That's why I`m putting the top of the viv in every shot, to show how high everything is.
There is still plenty of room up top and I`ve a couple of ideas on what I`m going to do.
More to come later :2thumb:


Mike


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## frogman955

Here you go Liam that's the back of the viv blacked out now.


Mike


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## Liam Yule

That's better, been looking on here on my phone for months. Pics look way better that I'm on my laptop. looks good bud. What's next on the agenda?

I'm going to start logging on here a bit more and do some learning again. I get to see some pretty pictures on facebook but in all honesty, that's about it.

Might make a thread and stick to one like you have. Although it wont be nearly as interesting as yours, Stus or Joes and anyone else that I have missed...I'll make some stuff up just for you guys to read or ignore at your leisure  lol.

Liam


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## frogman955

But then I could chuck your new viv together for you and you`d have nothing to post other than "Mike did me viv for me so I`ve got nowt to do now" :lol2:.


Mike


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## Liam Yule

You will steal all my fun!  :Na_Na_Na_Na:

breaking down into tears trying to put it together is the good bit :lol2:


Liam


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## frogman955

Well I got enough done today to allow me to put the Bastis into their new home, 50x40x70 tall..
Talk about kids in a sweet shop lol.
They were all over the viv playing in the leaf litter and trying to work out a way up the "root" to reach the broms at the top.
A couple of them decided to go for a climb up the back of the viv.
First pic also shows the Arena Blanca viv.
Second pic shows them exploring the heights of the viv.
Third pic, playing on the floor.
Fourth pic, exploring.


Mike


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## Liam Yule

Looks Awesome. Love the variation in those Basti's


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## frogman955

Liam Yule said:


> Looks Awesome. Love the variation in those Basti's


It`s easier to see them now Liam.
Every time you`ve been here they`ve been hard to see.
In fact one of those photos shows how Bastis change colour a lot as they grow.
The one nearest the camera, on the moss, is the same one in the photo below, taken 7 months ago.


Mike


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## frogman955

Who can resist these ?
One of the nicest Tincs around.


Mike


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## Orlex

Looks nice  what is that on a left?
Do its Cintronela?


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## frogman955

Orlex said:


> Looks nice  what is that on a left?
> Do its Cintronela?


Hi Mantas
I think I understand your question.
On the left is a fake rock.
The froglet is Tinc Regina.


Mike


----------



## Arcadiajohn

stunning, what a frog!

john





frogman955 said:


> It`s easier to see them now Liam.
> Every time you`ve been here they`ve been hard to see.
> In fact one of those photos shows how Bastis change colour a lot as they grow.
> The one nearest the camera, on the moss, is the same one in the photo below, taken 7 months ago.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> image


----------



## frogman955

Yes John, as adults they are gorgeous. 


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Meet the parents :2thumb:.


Mike


----------



## Meefloaf

mm:mf_dribble:mm


----------



## frogman955

Meefloaf said:


> mm:mf_dribble:mm


Ah Joe, you have excellent taste my friend.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Here you are Joe, just for you.
A couple of close ups of them.


Mike


----------



## Meefloaf

aha, shh mike im trying to talk myself out of needing the racking


----------



## Orlex

frogman955 said:


> Hi Mantas
> I think I understand your question.
> On the left is a fake rock.
> The froglet is Tinc Regina.
> 
> 
> Mike


Hi Mike  yes, you did )) .
Never seen that kind of fake rocks 
Frogs looks stuning )) .


----------



## frogman955

Thanks Mantas.
The rocks were made by a friend Howard, who lives in Durham.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Every night it sits there just watching and waiting.
Waiting for what, I wonder.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

One baby Leuc taking it`s very first steps onto dry land while a Regina looks on intently.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Over on Callums thread http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/amphibians/1042539-first-cauchero-froglet-wtf.html Stu talks about "big boned" when referring to one of his frogs :lol2:.
Me ?
I just call it normal :2thumb:, as can be seen from the big butts below.
What a bonus though.
While grabbing a couple of photo`s to post I found a new froglet just OOTW :no1:.
Notice the wingless Mel just in front of it, it shows how small the froglet is.



Mike


----------



## frogman955

Following on from the big butts subject above I had to grab this photo tonight of a Citronella female.
You can also see extra moss growth compared to other photos posted due the Jungle Dawns.



Mike


----------



## Orlex

Cool frogs, I started to like them today earlier  how tall tank is ? Asking bacause wondering how big impact jd does  . 
I already see good improvement in one tank where jd is also  .
JUST SEEN PICTURES EARLIER, what is that yeallow pumilio?? I depserately love it... I defo getting some in comming year if its av to buy from you??
What about yeallow with black spots, what specie is it also?


----------



## frogman955

Hi Mantas
The Citronella viv is 50 tall and the Pum vivs are 70.
I`m seeing moss and plant growth in both.
The only difference is that I`m using 9 watt bulbs for the Tincs and 13 watts for the taller Pum vivs.
The yellow Pums with black spots are Bastis and the small yellow one is a Salt Creek, as is the red froglet.


Mike


----------



## Orlex

Hi Mike,

Thanks for answering  .

Beutifull frogs you have  . Do yeallow salt creek is rare? I put it in google it shows me only red ones mainly.
How many you got?


----------



## frogman955

Hi Mantas
Yes the yellow Salt Creek is rare but I`m trying to get them out there.
I have 2 of them breeding here but getting yellow froglets is not so easy.


Mike


----------



## Orlex

Can you put me in list please? Just tell me they are bold or not?


----------



## frogman955

Oh they are bold alright.
I see and hear them all the time.
The problem with the yellow ones though is that they are born red and then turn yellow as they get older.
So in theory I could keep them for a year before knowing if they were yellow or not.


Mike


----------



## Orlex

And this is almost imposible as nobody wants to keep so long  its alright, I understand that  . 
So my bed one day get some from hamm, I am sure some will be av. Just wondering if some frogs not born yeallow and turning red latter?  its maybe little bit off-topic for your topic,sorry.


----------



## frogman955

I`ve never seen a yellow froglet yet, always red.
The photo posted earlier of the yellow one, that one was born as red as a tomato.
As it happened I had that froglet for a while and saw it begin changing so I held onto it.
Luckily it turned out to be male and I had a spare female so I put them together.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Happy families :2thumb:.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Getting comfy :2thumb:.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Well this is something I never thought I`d ever be posting.
Tonight I fed my Terribs and out of the 11 only 4 came out to feed.
I didn`t think it was possible to have a Terrib whose belly was full :lol2:.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Never a day goes by without something new happening with these frogs :whistling2:.
While having a look in one of the Pum vivs I happened to glance into one of the others which contains 4 females.
I was like "WTF is going on here ?"
There was a new froglet sitting looking at me and here`s me thinking that I had 4 females and no males in the viv.
So I`m now looking at raising some BriBri froglets lol.



Mike


----------



## Liam Yule

Jurassic Park! 

Nature finds a way:lol2:


----------



## frogman955

Liam Yule said:


> Jurassic Park!
> 
> Nature finds a way:lol2:


Considering I`ve had these for more than 18 months and have never heard any calling I was convinced they were all females.
Now there`s babies and I`m still not hearing anything.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Just thought I`d post a couple of pics of the Leucs viv.
The plants are starting to get a hold now but still a bit slow.
The moss is growing well and getting a good hold now.


Mike


----------



## Arcadiajohn

coming along very well!

John,


----------



## frogman955

Arcadiajohn said:


> coming along very well!
> 
> John,


Thanks John.
As usual it`s a bit slow moving but it`ll get there.


Mike


----------



## soundstounite

frogman955 said:


> Never a day goes by without something new happening with these frogs :whistling2:.
> While having a look in one of the Pum vivs I happened to glance into one of the others which contains 4 females.
> I was like "WTF is going on here ?"
> There was a new froglet sitting looking at me and here`s me thinking that I had 4 females and no males in the viv.
> So I`m now looking at raising some BriBri froglets lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> image



Ahh mate sexing pums...walk in da park huh,:lol2: don't look at me kiddo haven't a bloody clue,but I know I have 2 more male rfb than I did yesterday:bash:

ha this struck me as funny grats on the new kid mate

Stu


----------



## frogman955

Haha thanks Stu.
You may remember me saying I`d bought the 4 of them back in April last year when down at BAKS.
I was convinced they were all females and I was happy with that lol.
But okay in the back of my mind it would have been nice to have a male, but I was also worried about having a male in with 3 women lol.
Now this has happened I`ve had a proper look and it`s now looking like I`ve got 2 pairs.
What I`m really happy about though Stu is that I`ve seen no fighting at all, none.
For me and Pums that's a first and also bodes well for anyone wanting to keep a group of Pums together.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Just a couple of photos to add to the pile :2thumb:.



Mike


----------



## myreptile

I really do hate all you frog keepers.
It is going to cost me a fortune. 

On the plus side look at these little beasties. I have 4. 
Theladerma bicolor


----------



## frogman955

myreptile said:


> I really do hate all you frog keepers.
> *It is going to cost me a fortune*.



It doesn`t have to :2thumb:.


Mike


----------



## myreptile

frogman955 said:


> It doesn`t have to :2thumb:.
> 
> 
> Mike


Haha that sounds so wrong. I really do have to ask the question though. 

Why doesn't it have to cost me a fortune?


----------



## plasma234

Second hand vivs, bang for buck plants and cuttings, efficient lighting, self collected bits and pieces like leaf litter, home made fruitfly media and washing out culture pots, breeder bought frogs etc

It is never cheap to start up but it doesn't have to cost as much as you think :lol2:


----------



## Dave1986123

*New build*


----------



## Dave1986123

Not finished yet few more finishing touches :whistling2:


----------



## frogman955

That's a nice looking viv.
As Callum says there are ways to keep costs down without having to compromise your frogs well being.
And we`re all here to help out.
My first viv cost me a fortune to set up, but over time I realised that there were other ways which were just as effective and in some ways better.
My vivs average in price £80 each from Dale at DMS vivariums.
Peat plates for substrate about £15.
A roll of fablon wich would black out several viv backgrounds £9.
Some bog wood and plants and some broms at various prices.
My lights are all made by myself apart from having bought a few Jungle Dawns, well, quite a few :lol2:.
So as you can see it doesn`t have to be overly expensive, a good setup can be had for a couple of hundred quid, bearing in mind £80 of that is the viv.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

A couple of Regina froglets not long out of the water.
Note the unusual colours/markings on the legs of the one in the lower photo.
The legs should turn to black as it gets older.
Oh and of course a single Azureus which is slightly older.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Can we not get some privacy around here ?
There`s always someone snooping around with a camera.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Unfortunately the photo`s are not very great due to the algae, but it`s not every day that you get a chance to see dad dropping one of his kids off at the pool.
In the 2nd photo you can see 2 eggs and just to the left you can see the dark shadow of the tadpole.
The 3rd one is similar.
I`ll grab a better photo later if possible.


Mike


----------



## Razzmatazz

Fantastic! 
Quick question about heating. How do you heat your terrariums? 
I'm running at a day temp of 21.5 degrees and would like to increase it. 

Ryan


----------



## frogman955

Hi Ryan
I just adjust the central heating to keep the temps about right.
All my leds are mounted on aluminium and sit on the glass so this also gives some heat transfer into the vivs.
If your getting over 21C at this time if the year though I'd not be too concerned. 


Mike


----------



## Razzmatazz

Ok cheers mike!


----------



## frogman955

Something I never tire of seeing.


Mike


----------



## Arcadiajohn

wow! another great sight : victory:




frogman955 said:


> Something I never tire of seeing.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> image


----------



## frogman955

On xmas eve I checked on how the tadpole in the test tube was doing and thought "bugger me I`ve lost another one".
I had lost a previous one because the water had gone sour.
Unlike broms which allow some water to drain from them allowing fresh water to to cycle back in through misting systems the test tubes have no way of naturally doing a water change.
So I removed it for a better look and thought I saw some slight movement.
Nothings lost now I thought so got my syringe and stuck the needle down the tube and sucked out most of the water and then pumped fresh in.
I did this 2 or 3 times to make sure all the water had been changed.
A few hours later I checked again and the tad was back to normal.
I say tad, but in fact it has legs so has progressed quite a bit.
Anyway I took the photo below and the tad seems to be doing really well now.
So for anyone using test tubes, do a water change or risk losing your tads.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

It`s impossible to not enjoy this hobby.
41 days after finding a tad in the water I now have this.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Citronella chasing some food down and a couple of better shots of the tad.
You can now clearly see it`s rear legs and also the bulges where the front legs are hiding.


Mike


----------



## soundstounite

Good luck with the little fella bro and HNY. Mike what is he,salty? Maybe I keep the vivs drier,maybe it's because I hand mist,ha maybe different viv design(I went though all those deliberately,it just shows how many variables there are,just to affect one little water holding container),but I have to physically top up film cans broms etc,so have never knowingly seen this,good tip kiddo. Mike how much water do the test tubes hold compared with a can,i'm trying to get a mental picture of size,curiosity really

Stu


----------



## frogman955

Hi Stu.
Thanks and also HNY to both you and Shaz.
Yes your correct it`s a Salt Creek.
This is only the 2nd time I`ve had a tad in one of these so that's why I got caught out with losing the first one.
Normally until now all my froglets have come from brom axils.
But the lesson has been learnt.
Because of where the tube is I`m getting a great view of the tad growing and it`s been great to see.
The test tube has about 6mls of water in it Stu, so just a bit more than an average brom axil.
And so you can see the size I`ve posted a pic below to eliminate all guesswork for you :2thumb:.
Oh I`ve added a photo below where you can see the tube in the left viv.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Well another 4 days gone by and that's the front legs out now.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

I`ve always said that selfies are for sad people.
But, I`ve finally found a use for them.
The only way I could get this photo was by reversing the camera and putting it to the rear of the viv.
Here we have the froglets very first trip out of the water, 51 days after dad putting it in there.


Mike


----------



## Liam Yule

Epic photo. It's cool you have been able to follow the wee guys journey so easily!


----------



## frogman955

Liam Yule said:


> Epic photo. It's cool you have been able to follow the wee guys journey so easily!



I wish it was easy Liam.
That wee guy will be glad to get out of that tube and away from me and my camera.
To get half a dozen decent photo`s I had to take which felt like 100.
The froglet must be sick to the teeth with me.
So no more pics till I see it on the viv floor.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Some of the inmates of the frogroom.


Mike


----------



## soundstounite

Mike macheto or regina? We are both stumped here for all the world they look like macheto to me and Shaz,but I'm pretty sure you have regina not macheto,hence da stumped

enlighten please:bash::lol2: 

cool frogs which ever way they are painted,good for you mate

Stu


----------



## Meefloaf

thought the same stu "Mike doesnt have Matecho's does he ? i'm sure he had regina's" , tho im sure Mike said he had really yellow reggie's


----------



## frogman955

Hey guys, that was quick.
They are Regina.
But as you`ve already pointed out it`s pretty much impossible for us mere mortals to I.D. them.
There are about 4 morphs which all look the same but for some strange reason have different names.
Regina, Matecho, La Fumee and Giant Orange.
Me ? I`ll leave it for the "experts" to argue about lol.
They will of course lose some of the yellow and grow a bit more black as they grow, but gorgeous frogs all the same.


Mike


----------



## Meefloaf

I like Matecho and La Fummee's because of the 'poster child' pics of them, but like you said, sometimes you'll see pics and other than hte owner saying its X, would you think it is.

look at Stu's super blues, not only do they have a few names, but sometimes get ID'd as others


----------



## frogman955

Joe, have a read of this https://saurian.net/frog_tinc_regina.html and also check out the links at the bottom for other morphs like Giant Orange.
After reading that let me know if I`ve messed your head up even more by showing it to you lol.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

This moss growth has me intrigued because of the way it is growing in columns.


Mike


----------



## frogfreak

Hey Mike, do they have blue markings on their throat and inside the flanks?

Regina and Giant Orange are the same frog...Regina in your neck of the woods. GA is a false name. 

Lafumee and Matecho look very similar but there are small differences. Very small lol Mine have very different personalities though. :whistling2:

Disclaimer: All of the information above is based on my experiences only. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


----------



## frogman955

Hi Glenn.
I seem to remember there being a hint of blue on the throat.
There is also a blue pattern on the lower belly which stops on the underside of the upper thighs.
On the photo below you can just make out some of the blue pattern around the back end.


Mike


----------



## frogfreak

Cool, Mike

Only the Regina's have the blue colouring.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Hey Mike, do they have blue markings on their throat and inside the flanks?
> 
> Regina and Giant Orange are the same frog...Regina in your neck of the woods. GA is a false name.
> 
> Lafumee and Matecho look very similar but there are small differences. Very small lol Mine have very different personalities though. :whistling2:
> 
> Disclaimer: All of the information above is based on my experiences only. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


Ha I hoped you'ld see this. Mike, this one has perplexed me from way back, I started try to work this out, damn me mate, about a year before frogs,and have never really got to the bottom of it,:lol2: What's new huh?

Glenn run through those slight differences for us please,don't worry about the personality issues,they are all canucks,they'll all be laid back and cool anyway,or fed up waiting for the thaw to come:Na_Na_Na_Na:. But the blue is of note.:2thumb:

For what it's worth my understanding is GO is a yank marketing ploy? applied to regina,so same morph as Glenn notes. Macheto don't carry blue to adulthood? but, it's there in the kids (incidentally the atachibakka morph shows this trait) I 'erm think macheto is bigger than regina? Lafummee v's macheto size wise haven't a clue,both big I think. Nakita could also come into this malarky,but I understand it to be smaller,with different underbelly markings?. I don't know about how the blue fits into the equation beyond the above hence the ask for a refresher course from Glenn. 

Lads I see you have posted more while typing,I'll leave the above as is,though CBA to go through deleting

Oh Mikey they are crackers mate: victory:


----------



## frogman955

If I was told I could only own two types of frog there would be no hesitation in saying Salt Creeks and Reginas. 
I'm just fortunate enough to have another ten on top of those.
Anyway I'm busy at work so I'll post a better reply tonight.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

frogfreak said:


> Cool, Mike
> 
> Only the Regina's have the blue colouring.


Hi Glenn
It`s great to have your wisdom to fall back on :2thumb:.
I`ve a mate who has been breeding these for ages and all the confusion just makes him laugh.
It`s a fact that there are so many stories going around about what is Regina and what isn`t.
I was having a chat with him on this subject last weekend and he says the same as you Glenn, and so far I`ve seen nothing to prove any different.

Stu
It confuses everyone so your not alone there me ole mucker.
If I remember rightly Stu Matechos are larger than Regina.
As regards the blue I have wondered for a while now if in fact Azureus was first to come along and the rest of the Tincs followed suit.
When you look at the photo below you can see the blue marking which are similar to the Azureus but as the frog grows a lot of it (on the legs in particular) turns to black.
Isn`t it a fact that blue is a dominant colour in Tincs ?



Mike


----------



## frogman955

Now before anyone says anything, I`ve made an appointment with gut busters for it :lol2:.


Mike


----------



## Meefloaf

aha, chunky


----------



## frogman955

Well as some know I have for a long time now been striving to find that "perfect" light.
Well, perfect for the plants that is.
The Jungle Dawns have done a grand job and in fact one of my broms has doubled in size to the point that I`m having to consider removing it.
I`ll have to remember to post a before and after photo.
I am after low power but high output and of course I`m after reliability.
What I have now is leds running at what I think is about 2 thirds of their full power.
I have used similar leds now for a couple of years and not so much as a hiccup from them.
This time around I`ve sourced from elsewhere and have mounted them differently and have sourced a more powerful driver, 50 watts.
Light output is 6 - 6500K which should be good for the plants.
I have on order some specially made sun glasses for the frogs :whistling2:.
Although I`m hoping for good reliability, if there are any failures the leds will at least be easily swapped out for a new one.
The unfortunate downside to say a Jungle Dawn is that when it`s broke, it`s broke.
Anyway on the photo below the vivs on the left have led tapes and a Jungle Dawn over each viv.
The 2 vivs on the right are the new leds only.
Can you tell the difference ?
I can`t.
I`ll now keep these running for a while to see how they perform and update if I have any worthwhile news on them.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Well here`s the before and after photos I mentioned earlier.
The viv in question is the middle left one, and you can see how the leaves have started to grow long and thin, which I blame on the leds not being quite strong enough..
The second photo shows the viv as it is now and you can see the difference in the brom.
The leaves are still a similar shape but the brom has increased in size by a lot.
The first pic was taken in mid July when I first put the Jungle Dawn in and the second one today, 7 months later.


Mike


----------



## Arcadiajohn

thanks for the update,

It really does seem to do the job hey 

I would hope so! it was a 4 year project working with the states to get a product that we are delighted with.

and..... theres MORE to come 

john





frogman955 said:


> Well here`s the before and after photos I mentioned earlier.
> The viv in question is the middle left one, and you can see how the leaves have started to grow long and thin, which I blame on the leds not being quite strong enough..
> The second photo shows the viv as it is now and you can see the difference in the brom.
> The leaves are still a similar shape but the brom has increased in size by a lot.
> The first pic was taken in mid July when I first put the Jungle Dawn in and the second one today, 7 months later.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> image
> 
> image


----------



## frogman955

Just thought I`d share some more of the inmates from my collection.
1st pic 3 of a group of 4 Bastis, the red one is the male.
2nd pic is a group of 4 BriBri which I`ve always thought were all females until I found a youngster in the viv. 
On closer inspection I`m now certain I`ve 2 pairs in there, but strangely I`ve never heard any calling in all the time I`ve had them.
3rd pic is of a Salt Creek froglet which I found tonight, this could be the froglet which I was talking photos of as it developed in the test tube.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

Today I found another froglet, but this time with my Bastis.
I`ve also put a photo of one of my females.


Mike


----------



## frogman955

I thought I`d post some updated photos of the vivs that I`ve taken over the last few days.
They are all Pum vivs with Salt Creeks, BriBri, Bastis and Black Jeans.


Mike

Salt Creeks.









BriBri.









Salt Creek.









Black Jeans.









Bastis.


----------



## martin r

great frogs and vivs mike! what ratio are the 4 bastis?
got my bastis from j the weekend and one was calling after the first hour 
i'm totally hooked!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## frogman955

Hi Martin.
Cracking wee frogs they are.
The Bastis are 1 male and 3 females, but I`m thinking of splitting the group as I suspect they are egg eating.
Be careful if you find a 2nd male as they WILL fight.
Here is a better photo of my ones that I got tonight.
And of course my favourite, a Salt Creek.


Mike


----------



## martin r

great pics mike!
yeah i'm on the lookout for any fighting. two seem to go around with each other all the time and i was starting to worry about the third, but they were all in one brom today.


----------



## gavinc7

this is all so fascinating, s great thread Mike, were do I start, , so much to choose from, hoping to get a viv next week and making a start on that, still unsure about what darts to start with and what species ,there does'nt seem much available in my neck of the woods sunny surrey.


----------



## frogman955

Thanks Martin
Keep an eye on them all the same.
You might get a couple of females rolling around having a spat, and I`ve had that before.
But, males are a different story I`ve found.
Good luck anyway.

Thanks Gavin, you might be surprised at how many keepers are near you.
But often you`ll find that a few of them will travel a bit to help people out and meet up somewhere so you can get the frogs your after.


Mike


----------



## ItsExiled

Hiya 
I love how the substrate goes so green, you use peat plates right?
I think I might think about using them from now on, is it the terra peat panel/plate things you use? 

Lovely vivs mate


----------



## frogman955

ItsExiled said:


> Lovely vivs mate



Thanks :2thumb:
Yes it's the Namiba Terra ones from Dartfrog. 
Keep them moist with plenty of light and the moss will grow.

Mike


----------



## frogman955

Tonight while feeding the Leucs I found that they`ve been playing sneaky and hiding their eggs again.
I caught a glimpse of some movement and on closer inspection I found a tad and then another and another and counted at least 5 tads in all happily swimming around.
So they are up to their old tricks and giving me some free range froglets again :lol2:.
I managed to grab a few pics of tads and the parents watching my every move while taking the photos.


Mike


----------



## Arcadiajohn

A real "frog culture" 

they know best I guess, all we have to do is to provide for their core biological needs in a safe and measured way and let them get on with it.....at least that's the theory ;-)

john


----------



## frogman955

I got another nice surprise today.
I caught the male Basti wetting some eggs to keep them moist which was great as I didn`t know they were there.
When I checked the photo I realised they were all growing and I counted at least 9 eggs.
That is a huge clutch for a Pum.
I`m now thinking it must be the fat female I posted the pic of earlier, especially as it`s on the same brom.


Mike


----------



## Orlex

Congratulations mate  thats really big clutch for Pumilios  and also you made my toughs reall  as I was always thiking if some water pool av in tank, it would be very nice if frogs rear tadpoles there  and I see you manged that  .:2thumb:


----------



## frogman955

HI Mantas
I`ve reared many frogs from a pool in the viv.
Azureiventris, Terribs, Anthonyii, Leucs, Azureus.
There are lots more will do it.
Just be aware that Tincs for example are cannibalistic and the tads will eat each other.


Mike


----------



## Orlex

Well done Mike 

We will try to make a pool for frogs in atother frog tank )) . In future .
Do you never lost any frogs in pools? Mean adults


----------



## frogman955

Hi Mantas
Rule number one, ALWAYS make sure your frog can get out of the water easily.
Ideally never have the water deep enough to stop the frog from being able to get it`s head out of the water.
I always keep the water depth shallow so that the frog can put it`s feet on the bottom and get it`s head out to let it breath.


Mike


----------



## soundstounite

Big clutch mate wow,seriously curious as to what she carries and rears though,I suspect less. Mind as hard as it is when they leave some in some ways it's nature,maybe picking the best, which I find sort of reassuring, as I always will worry on how much mum oophaga actually does. Once one has seen exactly what they feed Mike I guess these thoughts become more common. Ha bastis going nuts here too,good init:mf_dribble:.

Orlex,I don't think healthy strong darts die from drowning,I think it's a myth because a sick frog oft goes to water,if it is found dead there drowning is the thought of cause ,but I think this to be the wrong asumption. I'm similar to mike cautious I use gravel to make the water that bit shallower,but the more I learn the more I feel that this is a myth,because of poor observation. 

We have mysties leucs pan special superblues atachis and maybe just maybe a summersi all being or have been reared in viv,mortality is higher,Mike's nailed that canibalism,but it's very doable.

Grats Mike....corkers :2thumb:

Stu


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## frogman955

Hi Stu and thanks.
They have hidden some of the tads now and I suspect they have left one or two behind.
My main concern is the lack of drop off sites but I suppose as long as they have water for them they will manage.
The viv is crowded though as there are 3 females in there lol.
I`m away to try something "new" for them so we shall see.
It`s just another one of my experiments to try and improve things for them.
If it works you`ll hear about it here.
If not ? it will disappear into the depths of time never to be seen again lol.
Anyway on the plus side I was looking for the froglet I knew was jumping around in there and was confronted with a gorgeous little red froglet which has been in there for ages and I never even knew.
And I also found the wee brown one I was looking for.
Damn but I love these things lol.


Mike


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## soundstounite

Ha how they slip kids past us is so funny Mike,i'm still smarting in a good way from these red head kids,how in god's name we missed two I'll never know:blush::lol2:. 

We have two groups (cem basti) kicking really well at this time mike,as mentioned else where watch those lasses kiddo,the removal of females/young has lead to way more eggs being carried,i'm even more sure know about the egg eating we mused on as I'm seeing the results of me pulling the suspects

Good luck with the project mate:2thumb:

best

Stu


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## frogman955

Hi Stu.
I'm a bit hacked off at the moment. 
When I got in from work last night I saw my Citronella getting cozy on top of a brom right at the door.
She was cowering down like she wasn't very well and the male was right next to her looking a bit concerned. 
But after watching for a minute I left them and went to get something to eat, and then I forgot about them.
Well.
When I went to feed them later she was back to normal and chasing flies around.
Then I saw why she was acting funny.
On top of the brom she left a clutch of 9 eggs.
And I missed a great opportunity to get some damn good photos of her laying them :bash::bash::bash:


Mike


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## frogman955

Here`s a photo of the eggs that I took Stu.
And tonight I found the male sitting on them wetting them down.
Also I found the male Salt Creek testing the water again, presumably because he plans on dropping some tads in there at some point.


Mike


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## frogman955

I thought I`d stick up a photo of the Citronella male carrying his babies.
Also for Arcadia John a couple of photos to show plant colours under the Jungle Dawns a few months on.
The first brom lost all its colour and went green, the JD has brought it back.
The 2nd brom again has gone bright red in the centre and all because of the JD.
Oh and John, the carpet of moss in the first pic is that same moss I posted before.
As you can now see it has really grown and looks great.


Mike


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## Orlex

Beautifull photo of Citronella, do you find them bold as all tincs? 
We buying them latter this year too  .
What moss in that photo?:no1:


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## frogman955

Hi Mantas, the citronella are the same as my other Tincs, very bold.
The moss is growing on the peat plates that I use instead of substrate.


Mike


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## soundstounite

Sorry slow bro up to me eyes in it. mike were the cit eggs any good? 'Grats by the way,shame you missed the eggs,we all do it mate,I really wanted to film the summs escapdes the other day enchanting/hilarious and for the first time laid in the open missed the eggs too:bash: Good luck kiddo 

seeya soon

Stu


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## frogman955

Hi Stu, yes the eggs were all good but along the way I think a couple of tads pegged it.
But that's not a bad thing as I`ll end up with too many froglets later.
Mantas I`ll have froglets ready to go in a couple of months if your interested.


Mike


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## kwiky

This is a fantastic thread, but I must admit it makes me worry about what I've gotten myself into and where I am going to put all my future vivariums! Lol


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## Arcadiajohn

Wow that is so cool, thanks for the images,

I just love jungle dawn, it just....works.. Now that we are about to launch the 22watt, well that doubles the PAR and Klux again :whistling2: sunglasses time 

John


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## frogman955

kwiky said:


> This is a fantastic thread, but I must admit it makes me worry about what I've gotten myself into and where I am going to put all my future vivariums! Lol


Well as I keep telling people.
If you can`t build along a wall, build up :2thumb:.

Mike


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## soundstounite

kwiky said:


> This is a fantastic thread, but I must admit it makes me worry about what I've gotten myself into and where I am going to put all my future vivariums! Lol


Don't worry Phil,family members tend to move out as the addiction really kicks in:mf_dribble:,it's all about timing mate:lol2:

Thanks Mike 

Stu


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## frogman955

Another reason to enjoy feeding time at the zoo, is finding a wee smiling face looking out at you.


Mike


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## frogman955

Well there was me just checking out the vivs.
I was checking out the Vanzos as I`ve not long put them into the viv vacated by me selling up my breeding group of BriBri.
So I take a photo of the Vanzos and just as I`m away to leave the viv something catches my eye.
Down on the floor are some froglets sitting looking at me.
But, there is a catch, they are not Vanzos.
It seems that my BriBri have left me a parting gift which once again I was totally unaware of.
Damn but I love these things.


Mike


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## frogman955

Just got a couple of photos of mum dropping off some eggs for baby to feed on.


Mike


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## markg6

Always enjoy new pictures in this thread. You are guru my friend. :2thumb::2thumb:


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## frogman955

Thanks Mark, very kind of you.


Mike


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## frogman955

I don`t know why I`ve never posted this series of photos before so here we go.
Leuc eggs from day one right through to tadpoles and froglet.
Enjoy.


Mike

Day 1.









Day 2.









Day 3 and you can now see one egg start to go bad.









Day 4.









Day 5.









Day 6.









Day 7.









Day 8.









Day 9.









Day 10.









Day 12.









Day 13.









Day 14.









Day 15.









Day 17.









Day 19.









Day 24.









2 Months.









And finally a froglet with all 4 legs.


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## darrensimps

Great post mike


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## Gecko Bob

nice pics mike superb bit of camera work thanks for putting them up :no1:


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## frogman955

Thanks Darren and Bob.
I took these a couple of years ago but for some reason I`ve never posted them.


Mike


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## frogman955

Some pics of my Bastis.
1st one is a new froglet feeding on springtails.
2nd one is mom with another one of her babies.
3rd pic was a hard one to come by, Mom, Dad and baby all feeding together.


Mike


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## frogman955

Pondering my next move. 3ft wide 3ft tall, lots of room to play with.


Mike


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## Groom

*Darts*

Hey guys I'm going to dart frog tomorrow to pick my second set of darts up what ones would you guys get??


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## frogman955

Everything he`s got lmao.
Well that's what you`ll be thinking when you get there.


Mike


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## Groom

*Darts*

Haha I've just got back now it's amazing!! I just wanted them all


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## frogman955

Been there and got the T shirt lol.
A visit there makes for a great day out, for me anyway.


Mike


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## Groom

I came back with a pair of netted Leucs which are stunning I'm thinking a thumbnail pair next time lol


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## frogman955

Just thought I`d post a couple of shots of one of my Leucs playing on the glass.
I`m thinking it needs to be on a diet lol.


Mike


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## soundstounite

Mike,I know you love 'em but no more happy meals dude,bloody mcdonalds have a lot to answer for!!

How ya doing mate? Luecs are not an easy frog to keep lean ours aren't lean either:whistling2: 'ere kiddo how old are yours now? I just can't remember how long you have had these ,but i'm sure it's longer than us. Just curious really mate,nowt more
take care buddy

Stu


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## frogman955

Hi Stu.
That's not my original ones.
I`ve had those for about 6 years now and they`re still bouncing around like kids.
The ones posted are netted Leucs which I picked up.
Got a breeding group of 4 and another group of 3 which have yet to do the honours.
Might have 3 males and 4 females, to be confirmed.
I`ve decided when I get my big viv finished I`ll put the 7 of them in there and leave them to it.
But please note I don`t feed them shite from McD`s.
I give them healthy fish suppers from the chippy lol.
Strangely though, as per your comment. I have one group looks like barrels with legs.
All my others no matter how I try don`t put weight on.
I`ve said for a while that Leucs have one helluva fast metabolism.
I just sold 6 youngsters that had pot bellies like you wouldn`t believe.
Everything I fed them went down their throats, but as adults? I give up lol.


Mike


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## frogman955

Stu, here`s one of the Leuc froglets beside a younger Azureus.
But you can see that they just shovel the food down lol.


Mike


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## frogman955

I`ve had this group of Leucs for 6 years but this is the first time I`ve caught dad dropping his tads off.


Mike


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## soundstounite

Hey mate sorry slow bro,so little time at the mo. Mike if there is a frog I always want to be fatter as a kid it's tincs mate,I dunno what gives exactly here they are slow maturing(maybe azzies are quicker than my atachis) yet I hammer the food especially springs,but they always seem rangy where as a leucs I see just what your photo shows,always found this a bit weird but it is how it is I suppose.

Remarkable really it was years before one of our leucs transported anything,so grats on getting the pic:no1: not an easy capture that ,I'll share your joy on that one buddy. Now ours carry regularly just had two morphout in the last week as it happens. 

Mike had a little chap maybe 3 weeks back,whom had sussed eating springtails off the water surface,I've seen them nail flies but this one really had it sussed with the springtails,he came ootw as a monster mate. Our luecs are normally a goodly size and I'm happy enough with them,but that one came from nowhere I just couldn't believe the size of him...always something new to see and learn in this game mate!!

Grats on the netted Mike I can't keep up at the mo,thanks for putting me straight though I thought you had a group of leucs for yonks,ha just got the wrong ones here

seeya

Stu


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## frogman955

It`s the same here Stu, Tincs are slow to put weight on while the Leucs just bulk up in no time.
And yes it doesn`t matter how much food I throw at the Tincs they are slow.


Mike


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## frogman955

A new addition to the zoo which I found last night.


Mike


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## Trevor1981

Very nice Mr frog man


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## frogman955

Thanks Trevor :2thumb:.


Mike


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## Trevor1981

Do u keep a few diff ones in the same tank ?


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## frogman955

I don`t as a rule.
You have to be careful with mixing as you could end up with inter breeding and hybrids if your not careful.
I have done it and know others who have as well but unless you know what your doing I wouldn`t recommend it.


Mike


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## frogman955

A couple of photo updates on babies progress.
It`s doing rather well and getting bolder all the time.


Mike


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## Trevor1981

Crazy small . Very nice


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## frogman955

It was tiny when I first saw it Trevor, maybe 5mm long.
Now that it`s grown another few mm it`s easier to see.
Great little frogs though.


Mike


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