# Why keep DWA?



## Bantastic (Jul 29, 2008)

what is it about DWA that DWA keepers enjoy? im not saying i have a problem with them being kept im just curious?


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## hysteria_uk (Nov 28, 2007)

though you posted this in the right place unlike the one in the link, you might want to join in with this conversation

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/snakes/222122-venomous-snakes.html


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## Bantastic (Jul 29, 2008)

yeh i saw that one, saw it was in the wrong place and wasnt getting repsonses, so i posted one in the right place and now they have a big discussion going on there lol


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## hysteria_uk (Nov 28, 2007)

welcome to the world of internet forums lol Is your keyboard locked and loaded?


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## Bantastic (Jul 29, 2008)

lol it is, im just joiing in the discussion now lol


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## Repta (Jul 29, 2008)

slr123 said:


> lol it is, im just joiing in the discussion now lol


I've been watching that one. Take a granade... :whistling2:


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

I have been fascinated by venomous snakes from a very early age, probably around the age of 5. I knew back then that I wanted to work with venomous snakes when I grew up. I am not a Private Venomous Keeper, rather a full time professional working with a large venomous collection and I get a good wage for doing so.... but I still maintain the passion and interest that first drew me to this work.
Yes, it is dangerous work and yes I’ve been in intensive care a few times but when people comment on the dangers I always point out the following: “look out the window at all the building work going on in the city, see all those cranes and scaffolding, if you fall from there you’re in a wooden box or a wheelchair at best.... at least with the use of antivenom you stand a good chance of making a full recovery”. I have been in and out of hospital within 3 or 4 days following serious bites.
I’m not trying to play down the _very real dangers_ of keeping venomous snakes, merely trying to put them into some perspective.
Oh, and who ever said that venomous keepers should keep antivenom at home really needs to think again, as antivenom is a dangerous substance in its own right and should only be given under the supervision of medical personnel and preferably under the controlled conditions of a hospital ward.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

PDR said:


> I have been fascinated by venomous snakes from a very early age, probably around the age of 5. I knew back then that I wanted to work with venomous snakes when I grew up. I am not a Private Venomous Keeper, rather a full time professional working with a large venomous collection and I get a good wage for doing so.... but I still maintain the passion and interest that first drew me to this work.
> Yes, it is dangerous work and yes I’ve been in intensive care a few times but when people comment on the dangers I always point out the following: “look out the window at all the building work going on in the city, see all those cranes and scaffolding, if you fall from there you’re in a wooden box or a wheelchair at best.... at least with the use of antivenom you stand a good chance of making a full recovery”. I have been in and out of hospital within 3 or 4 days following serious bites.
> I’m not trying to play down the _very real dangers_ of keeping venomous snakes, merely trying to put them into some perspective.
> Oh, and who ever said that venomous keepers should keep antivenom at home really needs to think again, as antivenom is a dangerous substance in its own right and should only be given under the supervision of medical personnel and preferably under the controlled conditions of a hospital ward.


you mind me asking what you have been bitten by Paul?


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## Zodiac (Apr 17, 2008)

PDR said:


> I have been fascinated by venomous snakes from a very early age, probably around the age of 5. I knew back then that I wanted to work with venomous snakes when I grew up.*I am not a Private Venomous Keeper, rather a full time professional working with a large venomous collection and I get a good wage for doing so....* but I still maintain the passion and interest that first drew me to this work.
> Yes, it is dangerous work and yes I’ve been in intensive care a few times but when people comment on the dangers I always point out the following: “look out the window at all the building work going on in the city, see all those cranes and scaffolding, if you fall from there you’re in a wooden box or a wheelchair at best.... at least with the use of antivenom you stand a good chance of making a full recovery”. I have been in and out of hospital within 3 or 4 days following serious bites.
> I’m not trying to play down the _very real dangers_ of keeping venomous snakes, merely trying to put them into some perspective.
> Oh, and who ever said that venomous keepers should keep antivenom at home really needs to think again, as antivenom is a dangerous substance in its own right and should only be given under the supervision of medical personnel and preferably under the controlled conditions of a hospital ward.


Where is your work based mate? assuming you're saying you sell DWA, what you currently selling. I'm intrigued


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## Doodles (Aug 4, 2007)

Zodiac said:


> Where is your work based mate? assuming you're saying you sell DWA, what you currently selling. I'm intrigued


Paul works in venom research.


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

Zodiac said:


> Where is your work based mate? assuming you're saying you sell DWA, what you currently selling. I'm intrigued


None of the snakes are for saleoo:

Images - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine
The Herpetarium - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine


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## Elisha Metcalf (Sep 12, 2008)

where do people get dwa species, private breeders or something?

i dont want any............yet, just curious!


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## pythondave82 (Nov 14, 2007)

PDR said:


> I have been fascinated by venomous snakes from a very early age, probably around the age of 5. I knew back then that I wanted to work with venomous snakes when I grew up. I am not a Private Venomous Keeper, rather a full time professional working with a large venomous collection and I get a good wage for doing so.... but I still maintain the passion and interest that first drew me to this work.
> Yes, it is dangerous work and yes I’ve been in intensive care a few times but when people comment on the dangers I always point out the following: “look out the window at all the building work going on in the city, see all those cranes and scaffolding, if you fall from there you’re in a wooden box or a wheelchair at best.... at least with the use of antivenom you stand a good chance of making a full recovery”. I have been in and out of hospital within 3 or 4 days following serious bites.
> I’m not trying to play down the _very real dangers_ of keeping venomous snakes, merely trying to put them into some perspective.
> Oh, and who ever said that venomous keepers should keep antivenom at home really needs to think again, as antivenom is a dangerous substance in its own right and should only be given under the supervision of medical personnel and preferably under the controlled conditions of a hospital ward.


 
Well said Paul, Im not so sure others will ever understand the love and passion venomous keepers have for the snakes they keep or work with, its built in us.


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## Mason (Jan 21, 2008)

Elisha Metcalf said:


> where do people get dwa species, private breeders or something?
> 
> i dont want any............yet, just curious!


breeders, deaers, shops, shows, other keepers, breeders. Every single avenue you can buy a corn snake from you can also aquire venomous reptiles from.


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## Mason (Jan 21, 2008)

PDR said:


> None of the snakes are for saleoo:
> 
> Images - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine
> The Herpetarium - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine


The penny drops


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## Repta (Jul 29, 2008)

I can see the attraction of having a venomous snake. From what I've seen (and that's not a great deal I'll happily admit) some of the breeds are absolutely beautiful. I've seen breeds where the scales are more prominent and the head wonderfully curvaceous.

I've not gone trawling for it; why would people get stick for keeping them? I may be being naive but I just don't see the problem myself. I think there is a 'cool' factor to those that have a DWA. Then again I'm prone to hero envy. Balls of steel if you ask me.

Me, myself? Happy to just look. Through the toughened glass.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

PDR said:


> None of the snakes are for saleoo:
> 
> Images - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine
> The Herpetarium - Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine


I can't help but notice the mention on there of a venomous handling course that's Home-Office accredited.... but what is the "Home Office Personal Licence" that's required? I take it that's different from a DWAL.


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## PDR (Nov 27, 2008)

Ssthisto said:


> I can't help but notice the mention on there of a venomous handling course that's Home-Office accredited.... but what is the "Home Office Personal Licence" that's required? I take it that's different from a DWAL.


Any person who wants to undertake work with animals within UK research facilities is first required to undergo a specific training course before they can be issued with a personal licence by the Home Office. The Home office identified a need for an extra module to be added to cover the few people who would need to work with venomous snakes within the UK. An example would be University Staff or Students who want to study wild Adder populations. I was asked to design and teach the course. So far there have only been a handful of people who have taken the course.
The DWAL only applies to members of the general public, as a research unit we come under the control of the Home Office.
I sometimes teach staff from Zoos and Safari Parks etc. We have looked at the possibility of adapting and extending this course to include Private Keepers but there are a number of possible pitfalls in doing this. 
Hmmm, I have just noticed a few errors on that page, Eastern Diamondbacks are not Crotalus atrox, I’ll have to ask the author to make some changes.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Thank you, Paul, that was very helpful. I hope that if you do ever extend the course or adapt it for private keepers you'll let folks like myself know - we've been looking to do a course for some time in preparation to see if we are able and equipped to keep our own venomous species.


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## Doodles (Aug 4, 2007)

PDR said:


> Any person who wants to undertake work with animals within UK research facilities is first required to undergo a specific training course before they can be issued with a personal licence by the Home Office. The Home office identified a need for an extra module to be added to cover the few people who would need to work with venomous snakes within the UK. An example would be University Staff or Students who want to study wild Adder populations. I was asked to design and teach the course. So far there have only been a handful of people who have taken the course.
> The DWAL only applies to members of the general public, as a research unit we come under the control of the Home Office.
> I sometimes teach staff from Zoos and Safari Parks etc. We have looked at the possibility of adapting and extending this course to include Private Keepers but there are a number of possible pitfalls in doing this.
> Hmmm, I have just noticed a few errors on that page, Eastern Diamondbacks are not Crotalus atrox, I’ll have to ask the author to make some changes.



Hi Paul is there any way of me getting on this course?


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## trueviper (Jan 13, 2008)

slr123 said:


> what is it about DWA that DWA keepers enjoy? im not saying i have a problem with them being kept im just curious?


Personally, I keep venomous because several years ago I came across a local Adder population and have spent several years since returning to the site and studying them just as a spare time activity. I also go to sites in the New Forest and also around Studland in Bournemouth.

Before I discovered the Adder I wasn'y really that interested in snakes, in the wild or captivity. I was into lizards and have kept them many times when I was a child.

Anyway,a couple of years ago an exotic pet-shop opened in my town and I decided to get into colubrids and within a couple of months was the proud owner of a kingsnake and a cornsnake. However I quickly got bored.
Not that colubrids aren't great snakes to keep in there own right, I think there fantastic.
It's just that I think that by then, to me, whenever I thought about snakes I always envisioned vipers.
It's that specific group of snakes that really interest me. 

A couple of months after I got my kingsnake and cornsnake I visited my local exotic pet-shop on the off-chance and the owner when seeing me called me to the back of the shop.
He introduced me to the Wesrtern Diamond-Back Rattlesnake.
The rest is history.....2 months later I had my licence and have been keeping ever since.

I love keeping pit-vipers and truevipers because I think they are a fascinating and beautifull group of reptiles, and I consider it a HUGE privelidge to be able to do so.

I have never kept them because there is some sort of "cool" factor attributed to them although I can understand why people would believe that I do.

Handling snakes also doesnt interest me, I much prefer to just observe their behaviour from behind a piece of solid glass and leave them in peace.
However obviously from time to time I have to interact with them and handle them with tools and I am very confident to do so. 
I think I have a very good understanding of viper behaviour and my years in the field watching Adders helped me immensley, even though at the time I never considered I would be keeping venomous snakes in captivity in years too come!

Funny how life works out isn't it?


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