# maine **** trouble, help!



## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

So I bought an amazing maine **** kitten which when we brough her home had the runs, we at first left this down to stress and different food. She has been with us a couple weeks and we have taken her to the vet as there has been no change and she was rather skinny, though eating and drinking plenty. We wormed her as a precaution and as she had fleas when she arrived back with us we deflead her as well. It turns out she has an inflamed entestinal tract and a possible respitory problem that would have been present long before we took her home. We saw no problems with the kittens when we went to view them but got her home and she absolutely stunk, we gave her a baty but no change. Turns out the stink coming from her oil glands is because of the problems in her gut and her smelly breath. She had some anti-inflamotories and is on antibiotics. What I find appauling is that breeders can sell animals that are sick. I have sent her an email with no reply. Im just wondering what I should do next. I love her and will pay whatever it is to make her better and keep her well but I paid a big price for a kitten that is going to cost the same in vet bills. Shes very active now that shes had anti biotics and her shots her temps have gone down and has an appoimtment with the vet again on wednesday to give the all clear or not. I have pet insurance but it doesnt cover illness in the first 4 weeks. I was wondering if the breeder should be held liable for vet bills as she was sick before I got her. As I said i will pay out myself but think that if your a breeder then you should be caring about the animals, she has kittens still that are most likely ill as well.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Sadly it sounds like you chose a bad breeder!!

I don't know if she's registered with GCCF, but all their registered breeders are supposed to breed under a breeder Code of Ethics, which says kittens should be fully healthy before they go http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/ethics.pdf

What age was she when you brought her home?

Did the breeder not send you off with some of the food she was feeding so that you could keep the kitten on the same food for a few days to try and avoid an upset tummy and so that could also then gradually change her over to the food of your choice??

And I'm sorry, but no good pedigree breeder should be selling kittens with fleas, :bash: but are you absolutely certain that she had the fleas when she came? Now don't take offence at that comment because I'm trying to help you, not offend you, but you do have 2 other cats and before you do make any complaint you do need to be sure that the kitten brought the fleas with her and not that she picked one up in your house.

Is the insurance you have the Pet Plan 6 week insurance that breeders send off with kittens, because I thought that covered the kitten from Day 1.

I have had kittens with the slightest of problems and wouldn't let them leave until they were absolutely healthy - that's how I ended up keeping Luna, my Siammese, because she was a bit snuffly after her last vaccination and I wouldn't let her go until she was perfect, by which time the prospective owner had changed her mind. No loss to me because she was an incredible cat, full of personality, a brilliant Pets as Therapy cat and I loved her desperately until the day she died!

Personally, if it was me - and your vet will back you up that the breeder must have known this - then I would complain. If the kitten is registered with GCCF then you can report her to them. If you found her through the Maine **** Cat Club you can make a complaint to the committee and they will have to investigate it.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

I'd say you probably chose the wrong breeder... Fleas etc should and would of been spotted when you visited her? It can take months to find the right breeder, and in my case, years.


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## mrandmrsk (Nov 28, 2009)

can you give cats manuka honey???

cheri xxx


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Don't see any reason why not! It has very healing properties.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi If you get a letter from your vet to say the kitten had the problem before you brought her, then tell the breeder by email{ keep all or any emails right from day one} you are taking her to the small claims court , with your vet to back you up you do need this, you will win with vets letter , you will also be making sure the breeder does not sell on more kittens like this, i am sure she has sold many like this its all about money to some breeders , a good breeder would always answer a email, plus sort out problems or try there best , I used to show and breed bsh cats myself, everyone wants good breeders out there that are honest and sell healthy cats , there are so many bad breeders selling kittens with ecoli, fip , just to say a few . sounds like a bad breeder that will sell kittens for years giving eveyone else large vet bills and very possible dead kittens in six to seven months , i would report to gccf, trading standards then small claims, get the rspca round that could help with a report for court has to all be started before six months might seem harse but no one seems to stop bad breeders they just line their pockets . I expect her own vet would not wright a very good report on her the breeder to back her up.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

feorag said:


> Sadly it sounds like you chose a bad breeder!!
> 
> I don't know if she's registered with GCCF, but all their registered breeders are supposed to breed under a breeder Code of Ethics, which says kittens should be fully healthy before they go http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/ethics.pdf
> 
> ...


She was 5 months old had her 2 sets of jabs and is microchipped all of which I have proof of. She seemed like a very good breeder at the time and we did have a look over and saw no fleas or flea poop at the time. It for sure wasnt our other cats as they are indoor and regularly deflead and there was no sign on them that they had fleas. It was only apon bringing her home we brushed her and found one. She had a smell to her though I have no sence of smell so only my partner knew when I got home. She is registered so I will make a claim and I wont be going to her again or recommending her. The petplan cover, covers emergency or injury and not illness for the first 4 months im guessing so people dont buy insurance claim for illness then cancel. She gave us food to give her but she had the runs from day 1 which we put down to stress and now obviously it isnt. Ill email her again and see what I get. I think its appauling to pay a breeder not a good one at that 400 pounds and then spend half that the next week in vet fees because of her. Fleas were bad enough but they are managable.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

In that case you need to complain. of course the fact that she hasn't answered your e-mail suggests she's avoiding you, so try again - keep it polite, don't be rude or accusatory, imply that you are trying to resolve the matter in a civilised way. 

Any breeder worth their salt would always offer to pay for veterinary treatment for illness until the insurance cover begins - certainly I would have and most of the breeders I know would too.

Obviously keep copies of your e-mails so that you can show you weren't aggressive or accustatory. Any breeder worth their salt would always offer to pay for veterinary treatment for illness until the insurance cover begins - certainly I would have and most of the breeders I know would too, but you would need your vet's evidence if you go to the small claims court.

whatever though, you should report her to GCCF and the Investigations Committee will look at whether the breeder has a case to answer and if she is a member of the Maine **** Cat Club then I would write to them too.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Will write another email to her tonight, she is registered and I found her using the cat club website so I'll email them as well. At the end of the day all I want is recognition that she made the mistake and to get the other kittens vet treated as well.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I have emailed her again and there has been no responce, I have tried looking for the advertisement for the kittens and it has been taken down. Her website is still up though under construction. What do I do now how long to wait? this is so frustrating!


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

I would just email her tell her what you are going to do, keep copy and report her to trading standards ( item sold as unfit for perpose) its a kitten but its classed as sale of goods act with trading standards wright a letter they will help you compose it, send it of to her recorded then wait your seven days if no response go to small claims court with vet to back you up . you can report her to gccf but will not really do that much to her . you have six months from date of buying , if you wait longer their is not a legal thing you can do. plus get the rspca round her house while she still has kittens and ever dence in her home.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi she is a bad breeder , otherwise she would email talk to you , she is hopeing after a couple of weeks your stop emailing money in her pocked another one she has got away with, on to the next litter or getting her queen mated up again . sometimes breeders get away with it for years theirs one not far from me in her tenth year of breeding cats like a puppy farm .


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

me again , plus if you start all this you really mean bussiness i expect she will get scared and not go to court , its to much of a risk to her as a breeder as if she goes to court the gccf should be informed and up dated on her then what happens if someone else does it all again in six months for a poor kitten , what will this do to her name?, i expect your get your money if you go forward with a case as its just £400 to her she has the rest of the money from the litter and much more in future years months.


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

SakuraPastel said:


> I have emailed her again and there has been no responce, I have tried looking for the advertisement for the kittens and it has been taken down. Her website is still up though under construction. What do I do now how long to wait? this is so frustrating!


Some people do not check emails daily

Have you tried contacting her by phone or by person?


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

iF YOUR SELLING YOU LOOK AT EMAILS DAILY , not a good idea to phone things are said you have no copy , you need it all in black and white whats said to make a case .


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

Not if all kittens have been sold?

Why does it need to be in black and white, maybe the seller is none the wiser as to whats gone on?


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

if your taking someone to court ,if ,, then its best to have all correspondence on paper , when someone breeds you always look for emails , even more so when they have just left , people email photo s say how well kittens getting on etc.


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

Bit premature for court, they could even be on holiday hence no answer?

If the kitten appeared healthy when collected and noting wrong at the time of pick up but became ill after, how do you prove that its their fault and not the OP's?

Pointing a finger of blame is all to easy and should have all the facts first.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

yes all correct , thats why you dont start a case if you dont have evidence and a vet letter to back you up , if you have all this how long do you wait? what is the point in waiting? six month no case , its really up to the person if they are happy to pay vet bills for a new pedigree reg cat then that fine carry on..


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

plus you dont just go to court the next day ,it all takes time to get all the paper work in order , its not done the next day, trading standarts is first they will give very good advice.you give the person time to respond to a legal letter.


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## bampoisongirl (Mar 28, 2008)

Just my 2ps worth, but it seems pretty unfair to only wait two days for an email reply without calling them or trying to contact them in other ways. Fair enough keep evidence in case such a thing would happen, but surely at least give them a call just to say you've sent them an email about the kitten you purchased and you would like a reply asap?

I'd be mortified if I, for whatever reason, hadn't checked my emails for a week, hadn't received a phone call and received a court letter on my door mat. It's common courtesy!


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

you dont get a court order on your door step straightaway , first of all a letter from trading standards giving 7 or 14 days to respond , lets face it if kitten was like it from day one either complain or get on and pay vet bill and except it , also phone trading standards but i think in most cases you have to complain about the issuue within 14 days or again no point .


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## bampoisongirl (Mar 28, 2008)

bampoisongirl said:


> Just my 2ps worth, but it seems pretty unfair to only wait two days for an email reply without calling them or trying to contact them in other ways. Fair enough keep evidence in case such a thing would happen, but surely at least give them a call just to say you've sent them an email about the kitten you purchased and you would like a reply asap?
> 
> I'd be mortified if I, for whatever reason, hadn't checked my emails for a week, hadn't received a phone call and received a *court letter* on my door mat. It's common courtesy!





sa123 said:


> you dont get a court order on your door step straightaway , first of all a letter from trading standards giving 7 or 14 days to respond , lets face it if kitten was like it from day one either complain or get on and pay vet bill and except it , also phone trading standards but i think in most cases you have to complain about the issuue within 14 days or again no point .


I didn't say court order, I said court letter. Like I said it would just come across as rude without even giving them a call to give them a chance to respond


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi i see things black and white ,,,, if you have proof vet etc you have a case a say a right, that the cat kitten was ill from day one , its no good saying the cat kitten got it from another pet in the house most things take at least 3 days to catch and come out , breeders quite often say its your other pets that made mine ill by, eg sharing litter trays food bowls ect .Apet should be clean none smelling and healthy unless stated when brought.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

SakuraPastel said:


> I have emailed her again and there has been no responce, I have tried looking for the advertisement for the kittens and it has been taken down. Her website is still up though under construction. What do I do now how long to wait? this is so frustrating!


I'm in the camp that says give her a chance to reply. If you decide to go for the small claims court, you have time to give her a chance to reply.

You could phone, merely to say that you have sent 2 e-mails and not had a reply, has she checked her e-mails? Did you converse by e-mail when buying the kitten? If you didn't then your e-mails could have diverted into her spam folder and I don't check my spam folder every day.

If she says she hasn't, then ask her to check her spam and obviously make sure you got the e-mail address right - just in case!! It's then up to you whether you tell her on the telephone what you have said in the e-mail, because obviously then you have no proof of what she says unless you record the conversation. 

If GCCF decide there is a case to answer they can suspend the breeder and stop her registering kittens, however, they will not get involved if they know you are taking her to court - they will wait to see what verdict you get and then act.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

it was noticed the kitten was thin but not underweight and she had some kind of mess on her paws. I cant smell so didnt know the kitten had the stink coming from her, I cant stay there until she pooped at the breeders but she had the runs from day one before feeding her. vet says its something passed from the mothers milk or between kittens. Her website says kittens available so id assume is correct. Ive emails her with an alternate email asking about kittens in hopes she replies. thank u for the advice ill get on it.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well certainly Maine **** kittens aren't fat or solid like siamese etc, so the fact that you said it was thin wouldn't necessarily mean it was 'skinny'. They are a big boned breed and the weight is in the bone, not the flesh, if you understand what I mean.

Have you asked your vet if he would confirm in writing that the kittens was not healthy when you bought it??


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

feorag said:


> Well certainly Maine **** kittens aren't fat or solid like siamese etc, so the fact that you said it was thin wouldn't necessarily mean it was 'skinny'. They are a big boned breed and the weight is in the bone, not the flesh, if you understand what I mean.
> 
> Have you asked your vet if he would confirm in writing that the kittens was not healthy when you bought it??


Yes the vet will give me a letter as proof of what has been carried out, cost diagnosis and that the kitten would have been sick WELL before I had her. I am going to leave her to reply and see what happens. ALL of our conversations were through email so I know she reads it and she has replied to nermerous before that. She had the runs before we even got her home so its not as if she came into contact with any other animals as I kept her at my parents for the first day. Anyway, I will wait till the end of the week and then take matters after that.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well if all your previous e-mails were read, then these last ones shouldn't have gone into her spam box, so it's highly unlikely that she hasn't read them.

I bought my GSD from a breeder and when I made my contact e-mail to her enquiring about puppies she phoned me back the next day full of chat about her puppies. She didn't have a male for sale, but she e-mailed me a couple of weeks later to say she had a 10 month old dog coming back to her. We arranged, by e-mail to go and meet him and decided we would take him. She gave us a glowing report about this dog, but it was obvious when we got him that we'd been told a pack of lies. She didn't answer any of my e-mails commenting about all the problems he had! However, he wasn't physically ill and didn't need veterinary help - he needed psychiatric help, so there was no need to follow it up. So that's another example of a breeder being quick to be in touch when there's a sale coming and then not wanting to know after the sale!!! 

Sadly there are too many breeders like that out there, which is why I've always tried to recommend breeders I personally know (or those who friends know) to people who are looking for kittens, to try to prevent them from going through what you went through.

If I were you I'd give her a week to reply and in the meantime ask your vet for a letter about the condition of the kitten and send a letter of complaint to GCCF and the Maine **** Cat Club together with a copy of your vet's letter.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I have got an email back from her which I'm no too sure what to make of it. I will get further proof from the vet today.

"Hi Samantha
I hope Jellybean is feeling better.
I was very upset to get your second email as on the 16th of February your email said nothing about flees or worming just that your kitten was fantastic and doing well.Jellybean had a Avocate spot on on the 16.1.13 which covers everything including flees and worms for I month.
I have NEVER had flees on my kittens as my vet can confirm.
I need to know what treatment you gave her and when as you said it was before you went to the vet so was it not prescribed by a vet,also when did you take her to the vet. Your 4 wks insurance should run from the 10th Feb- 10th March so I do not understand what you are saying about the insurance.
Also why didn't the vet take blood tests before treating her with antibiotics if she is getting better what will that show.
I agree she should not be neutered until she is better.
I am taking her sister on Thursday to my vet for a check up and to be weighed but she has not had an upset stomach.
I am not quite sure what you are asking but I am prepared to take back the kitten and refund your money and she will be treated by my vet if that is what you want."


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## DavieB (Mar 15, 2011)

I think you should phone her, all ths court stuff is a nonsense at this stage, tell her your surprised at what the vet said, don't play a blame game and if insurance is not covered ask her to meet costs.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Well she sounds like she's doing what she can by offering to take back the kitten and refund your money and you can't say further than that.

Did she tell you she'd Avocated the kitten and were you given documentation about that?


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

feorag said:


> Well she sounds like she's doing what she can by offering to take back the kitten and refund your money and you can't say further than that.


Sounds ok to me too.

Lets hope the wee nippa is feeling better.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

feorag said:


> Well she sounds like she's doing what she can by offering to take back the kitten and refund your money and you can't say further than that.
> 
> Did she tell you she'd Avocated the kitten and were you given documentation about that?


mee tooo


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

feorag said:


> Well she sounds like she's doing what she can by offering to take back the kitten and refund your money and you can't say further than that.
> 
> Did she tell you she'd Avocated the kitten and were you given documentation about that?


No there was no mention on her being flead or wormed and as she had fleas I assumed that wasnt the case, no documents for it. Should hear back on monday with the feacel sample.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

if the sample is not good say it comes back with feline coronavirus, just saying for example this could leed to other things , if its a if , i would take the kitten back even if you love it now its just not worth the cost to you and i expect upset , a pedigree kitten should be brought healthy , as once you say to her i love the kitten and i am keeping, then its your outlay of cost, you cant expect someone to pay vet bills then for months .plus the sister could look fine some carry the problem and some the problem comes out in the kitten, mum dad could be healthy but be carryers . you can find another breeder i am sure someone on here would know a good person, i would even go as far as looking in the breeders litter try just to see it all looks normal poo in their . This is what i would do . plus if you keep the kitten and it has something i would never risk mixing it with more so young and old cats they could catch it also, the breeder is doing her best by the ofer of money back plus she is protecting herself .


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

also the court trading standards , i would of made a move on all this , if i could of not made contact with the breeder with emails ,by saying what you are going to do, it gets her atention , she knows you mean bussiness and hopefully you have got a good result with money and return of the kitten , well i would be happy with this , no one wants a kittens poo all over the house, as i am sure in the end the litter tray will stop being used if kitten is ill , i myself could not have this with children around . hopefully the breeders vet will be aware of whats happening and will care for the kitten.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

She now has blood in her poo. This is getting worse and worse! its really upsetting and stressful. I love my kitten and Im so worried about her. The thought of giving her back is a horrible thought that I hope to never have to do. She was giving some medication and put on I.D prescription diet. Seems to be getting worse :-(


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

if she is skinny you can feel the back bone , you really need to return her ,you are going to lose so much ,I really dont think the vet will get her better honest, he will try , it will cost ,is the insurance paying? pet plan is only after 14 days if the kitten never had the condition when brought, i myself think this is something breed in her its in the breeders line . I bred and showed british short haired cats for 15years with a prefix and made my boy up to champion , I do know quite a bit , you really should return the kitten ,if you want to save yourself more upset . Its so sad ,and upsetting ,wish people would stop breeding a line if they know their is a problem .


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## Jamiioo (May 8, 2010)

There seems to be alot of jumping to conclusions in this thread. 


I hope your Kitten improves, keep us updated!


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I'm going to call the vet in the morning and see if there's any more I can do. Shes skinny but not underweight possibly malnourished from the diareah. She gained some weight and her tempreture went down from the last time she went to the vets so we thought things were improving but came home to blood in her stool. Complete dispair really. I'll keep things posted and I'll have her tests back on monday. Lets hope things get better quick. 
Not going to give her back until I know exactly what's wrong with her first, it could be something treatable. Looks like petplan will cover anything after 80 pounds so looks like im covered for now.


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## lisadew24 (Jul 31, 2010)

I hope you have been keeping her away from your other cats just incase it's something that can be passed to them.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I think you need to give her a chance to settle down if you're not going to return her.

Often young kittens do have blood in their poo when they have diarrhoea because they strain too much and burst minor blood vessels in the anus.

The first somali I bought had diarrhoea when i brought him home, which nothing cleared. I had stool samples tested and all that came back was "an excess of e-coli" - he was put on a course of anti-biotics, but the diarrhoea never stopped. He was a very healthy, good weighted cat all his life, but he never produced a normal poo - ever!!


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

just read post before , if that cat was going to be a breeder dont you agree this would be very bad as it will produce more the same . pet ok if you want to put up with lose poo all its life thats not normal in anyway , with young children this can be picked up ecoli not good.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Kittens are in different rooms now but they were not anitially. Obviously if things change for the cats they will go to the vet as well all are insured. I will wait it out today. Her poo was runny but distinguishable and not so liquidy more like a soft icecream whip but some blood. Could it possibly be her poo getting harder and she strained too much?


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

sa123 said:


> just read post before , if that cat was going to be a breeder dont you agree this would be very bad as it will produce more the same . pet ok if you want to put up with lose poo all its life thats not normal in anyway , with young children this can be picked up ecoli not good.


If this is genetic she would never breed, im not sure i would be breeding anyway however I dont want to get her spayed.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

has the vet placed her on pro-kolin + it helps to sort out the tum protexin probotic.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

the reason why i said about breeding is the breeder you brought from must be breeding with cats that have this .


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

No matter which decision I make, it wont be made until the poo sample comes back and I find out what is wrong with her. Stuck in limbo for now unfortunatley. Hopefully its some sort of stomach bug thats easily fixed with an injection or some medication. I'm not keeping my hopes up but I am hopeful. She was more playful than normal last night and seems a bit more lively. Lets keep possative until we know what we are dealing with, the thought of sending her back is killing me!


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

sa123 said:


> has the vet placed her on pro-kolin + it helps to sort out the tum protexin probotic.


I will check, im heading to work forgot what its called but its to stiffen the poo up! Ill put the name when I get home.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

wo wo wo stop for a bit..

I know its scary and upsetting, but to be honest runny stools can happen due to stress (IBS), different foods etc. And fleas can be picked up from having a friend round whos carried a flea in on their clothes. 

Its not going to be genetic, its a bit of runny poo, and blood (possibly from straining to hard, or from IBS (Stress)) both of which my cats have every now and then.

Just chill, and relax.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

SakuraPastel said:


> If this is genetic she would never breed, im not sure i would be breeding anyway however I dont want to get her spayed.


If you aren't intending to breed her then you must get her spayed as you are taking risks with her life.

I'm inclined to go with Gina on this. Cats stress very easily and stress shows itself in diarrhoea and with diarrhoea often comes blood because of the straining, as I've said before. Give the kitten a chance to settle.

Either you send her back or you don't - if you don't want to, then stop stressing yourself about it and give your vet a chance to deal with it.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi how is your kitten?, did you get any news back from your vet?


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

poo sample came back nothing wrong. Vet said could be just irritable bowl, doing a blood test today to make sure though. Going to check weight at tempreture. There was some blood in her stool but just the once. Hopefully the blood test turns out negative as well.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

fantastic news, fingers crossed then.


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

SakuraPastel said:


> poo sample came back nothing wrong. Vet said could be just irritable bowl, doing a blood test today to make sure though. Going to check weight at tempreture. There was some blood in her stool but just the once. Hopefully the blood test turns out negative as well.


Could very well all stress related then?


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I think that's what it was - it happens so often with new kittens and new owners always panic. 

Good to hear though! :2thumb:

Now relax and just enjoy her!!


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

SakuraPastel said:


> poo sample came back nothing wrong. Vet said could be just irritable bowl, doing a blood test today to make sure though. Going to check weight at tempreture. There was some blood in her stool but just the once. Hopefully the blood test turns out negative as well.


Told ya  alls ok!


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

shes on steroids for 7 days if that doesnt help they are doing a biopsy and if nothing shows up there then its just stress or thats how she is. Shes going to be changed to food from natures instincts which is 99% meat/bone/organ meat, hopefully the fuller raw diet will help her. Im just so pleased its not something serious. We loce her to bits and I took a day off work just to take her in amd spend time with her. Shes a key part of my family and we were SO happy that the vet said its not something that Ill have to worry about. All cats are sleeping together on the sofa and its nice to know shes okay. Thank god, petplan is paying the bill as long as I upgrade to insurance for life on friday. So pleased!

Thank you for everyones advice and Ill keep everyone updated. Hopefully the steroids help and she wont need the biopsy. Vet said if i do decide to have kittens it wont be passed as it isnt genetic and it wont be passed to other cats. My kitten karma is getting spayed in a months time and have yet to decide on a single litter for Jelly or not. Its early days however, wont happen if shes not fit to do so. I just want her healthy shes my fur baby first. Its been a scary few weeks but it seems to be getting better. Ill keep you posted, thank you to everyone!


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Your vet may be right that it isn't genetic, but it definitely runs in lines, as I found out with my Merlin and his irritable bowel. Most somalis who have shown this problem have gone back to the same lines, so i wouldn't be certain that if you did have kittens from her, they wouldn't have the same problem.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

feorag said:


> Your vet may be right that it isn't genetic, but it definitely runs in lines, as I found out with my Merlin and his irritable bowel. Most somalis who have shown this problem have gone back to the same lines, so i wouldn't be certain that if you did have kittens from her, they wouldn't have the same problem.



Oh no, don't want to breed anything bad into a line, hopefully it's just stress. I dont want to breed her if her kittens will get it. 

Here she is after a long couple weeks of tests


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Do you know if the breeder kept her separate from the main household. With the best will in the world a lot of breeders separate their kittens so they don't get the best socialisation that they should.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I dont think they were in the maine part of the building, the kittens were nervous at first but after 10 minutes were playing, there were 2 different litters. The area they were kept in was nice but wasnt in a part of the house used often. Not sure how to describe it, looked like a livingroom with only a couch in it. You could hear dogs barking from another part of the house, website says she breeds labradores as well but she said they were some sort of small dog breed. Shes a really laid back kitten who is also very attached to me and my partner. If one of us gets up she must follow us, she seems a bit needy but it makes a change from our other 2 who could care less. I dont know if the breeder knew or not, one thing I do know is that she had the runs before I got her. Im sure the breeder meant well, she was lovely shame really. Hopefully its stress of a knew home, food and an older cat who refuses to play with her. She plays well with the other kitten though and doesnt seem the least bit stressed but we will see.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Biopsy soon, vets in the morning still runny poo though we have switched her food to Natural instints food which is 99% meat with tourine and she has perked up a fair bit. Petplan has decided since is was a condition before insurance they wont settle any claims. This means that I'm paying the £400 bill so far. I dont care as long as she WILL get better. I'm hoping the raw diet and high meat content will firm everything up.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi its great your happy to pay on going vet bills , I myself would be very upset to pay when I had brought and paid a lot for a pedigree ment to be healthy cat kitten ,plus some people would not be able to aford this unexpected illness arriving with their kitten . petplan you have to have had the kitten in your home and owned 14 days before they pay out, well this is how it used to work , as petplan will not pay a vet bill for breeders selling out sick kittens and i agree with this .


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I'm far from happy with the circumstances. The breeder has offered me a refund in return of the kitten, however she is loved very much and I do not want to see her health in the hands of the breeder. I had her 4 week kitten insurance and I went to upgrade and surprise, they will not pay out or insure me. At the end of the day I just want her better, however I have reported her to GCCF as I feel that if the breeder had paid more attention and actually brough her kittens to the vet then this would have been picked up sooner. No self respecting vet wouldn't tell the breeder there was a problem with the kitten, it took all of 2 seconds for the vet to tell me she was severely bloated. I will contact the breeder again tonight and see what she thinks. Thing is shes a very active playful kitten but she stinks and stinks up the whole house!


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## Jamiioo (May 8, 2010)

I'm just a bit confused now! What did the results come back saying was wrong? Bloat? x


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

the results are a lack of results. nothings wrong with the poo sample. This morning I woke up to solid poo, perhaps the raw diet has helped her gut? its her first solid poo. Im hoping it is the food. Now if she could make up her mind if shes sick or not. Yes she had a bloated tummy.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

SakuraPastel said:


> the results are a lack of results. nothings wrong with the poo sample. This morning I woke up to solid poo, perhaps the raw diet has helped her gut? its her first solid poo. Im hoping it is the food. Now if she could make up her mind if shes sick or not. Yes she had a bloated tummy.


IBS and bloated tummies go together, get them on RAw/BARf and I'm sure all will be fine. I think it's fairly normal settling in / stress.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

]this is one of the reasons why I would never buy a kitten from someone who keeps them isolated in "cat rooms", rather than living with the family as one of the family. How can they observe everything that is going on if the kittens aren't around them all the time? Also keeping kittens isolated and 'bringing them into the front room' when kitten buyers come doesn't socialise them properly, which could account for stress when they go to their new homes.

One thing though, unless things have changed since I stopped breeding, the breeder has to sign a declaration declaring that the kitten is healthy, has not had any vet treatment or illness when they complete one of the insurance cover notes. Did she declare to the insurance company that there was a problem? If she didn't and your vet is convinced that these signs were all there before you bought her, then she hasn't been honest with the insurance company and you are paying for that!

I would phone her and tell her you've become attached to the kitten and don't want to send her back, but you feel that she should contribute something towards your vet bill, as she has had this problem since you got her and your vet has confirmed that she came to you with the problem, so the insurance she gave you with the kitten is now negated and you will have to declare this condition to any insurance company you seek out to insure her with, so she won't be covered for this condition - at least for a year or so if there is no recurrence.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

very very good advice above , plus now you have reported her to gccf it would of cost you but you will get this back ,when proof of vet letter etc is sent in , the good thing she will then go on the name and shame gccf sight and get a fine , so this could put of buyers if they read it , but if other people pay and start a case like you its not going to look good on the person as a breeder .


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

Not totally right. The Investigations Committee will look at it first and decide if there's a case to answer. If there is then the case will preferred to the Disciplinary Committee and they will decide what to do about it, so there's no guarantee that the breeder will be named and shamed.

Presumably you downloaded a "Sick Kitten complaint" form from the GCCF website and filled that in???


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

yes but now there is a charge , as years ago I brought a BSH kitten for stud boy ,I was given his pedigree with mum dad breed numbers saying he was to be active reg , and receipt with mans name address but for some reason i waited about 4 months and the man just would not reg kitten ,i phoned lots so in the end with my proof sent in GCCF got him sorted and on the active for me ,free of charge then , I was so worried at the time and so pleased with GCCF for helping me , of course there is a correct procedure for ill kittens, and i think they would agree a good case with proof ,but yes if case is proven in your favour then they will go on named and shamed list.plus as you say all on line now ,it never was then things change .


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Back from the vets...shes constipated! She has been signed off though so that is brilliant. Her poo was firm yesterday which seems maybe the food helped. Two days after we started it on her she was going solid. Well worth the cost of it. Insurance even though I went to extend they have made a refusal to pay as they believe it was a pre existing condition. I have the recipt for all of it. In my opinion if you sell a pedigree cat that is ill from the day you brought it home the breeder should either recover and refund the money or offer cover vet fees to fix that illness. At this point I have paid £746 for a sick maine ****. However Im glad in a way that it wasnt someone who couldnt afford to pay out vet bills that took her. Am I asking too much for her to cover the vet bill or possibly atleast half.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I've already posted to tell you to approach the breeder to ask for at least some of the vet bills, so you don't need my reply to this.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

feorag said:


> I've already posted to tell you to approach the breeder to ask for at least some of the vet bills, so you don't need my reply to this.


I asked her but she just offered to take back the kitten for a refund.


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

What is the actual diagnosis on this kitten, I'm a little lost?


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

Whosthedaddy said:


> What is the actual diagnosis on this kitten, I'm a little lost?


apparently constipation?


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## Whosthedaddy (Nov 29, 2009)

freekygeeky said:


> apparently constipation?


Bloody big vets bill thus far for bungedupitis.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

Hi I would not think the breeder will pay any ,why should she unless she is taken to court in selling a sick kittens , its also in her favour that she tryed to help and take kitten back . It seems so wrong that someone would pay this vet bill with kitten being ill from day one , i would of taken kitten back as i said in the begining as their could be even more vet bills no one will insure her for the problem she has on going it would not cover for this . you could of brought 2 or 3 kittens for the price, that you would still love the same .the breeder will not even think twice about selling a sick kitten again ,as she will just hope someone else will sort the problem out.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

This is driving me insane, and I should really just stop reading the thread/forum... lol.. but its addictive!

The breeder has done all she can, shes offered to take her kitten back, and give you a refund. You cannot expect her to pay your vets bills, for all she knows it could of happened whilst at yours.

For runny stools, its near enough always IBS in my house, which is caused by stress/moving house/new house etc... this is sorted by a good diet, love, and sometimes some tablets. Or even a stool sample, which costs a few quid.

For constipation, youd likely feel it in their belly, a vet should feel this asap as its fairly easy to feel. So i doubt this is from when you bought her, she couldnt of been constipated that whole time, without the vet noticing..


To me, it sounds asthough, you should of just left it a week or two, with good diet, and just waited for your cat to calm down a little. 

Put her on a good diet, read in to maincoons, and enjoy her.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

here here lol


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

She was told that it was likely stress from the very beginning and to give the kitten a chance to settle, but doesn't seem to want to listen.

OP I know you told her about the kitten and she offered to take it back and refund your money, but if you still feel cheated, then have you gone back again and asked her to share the vet's bill?


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Everyone on here said it was stress tge vet thought at first it could be but no medication or steroids changed that. Shes now being weaned off steroids, diarreah has stopped foe the first time in a month. I was unhappy letting a kitten whose skinny and not getting nutrition from food. She had a bloated tummy and a high tempreture and underweight at the vets. She has just started gaining weight again. Vet has signed her off now so things shoild be better. I left her 2 weeks to settle im thinking it was stress there has to be a line where you say something isnt right. The breeder isnt responsive to emails.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

*medication / steroids / copious vet visits won't solve treat or fix stress. It's a mental thing.


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## sa123 (Jan 12, 2012)

*hi*

So would you say this stress could be just a new home or has it arrived with the condition it could be breeder taking her away from mum to fast or weennig kitten incorrect to early breeders can be keen to get them sold for the money , a breeder should know the correct way, and should be aware of a illness or change in kittens or any animals , well i surpose we will not know a answer to this ,the only thing i can see is more ongoing vet bills more so if a new pet comes in hoildays new child any change that could course a kitten cat to stress.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

sa123 said:


> So would you say this stress could be just a new home or has it arrived with the condition it could be breeder taking her away from mum to fast or weennig kitten incorrect to early breeders can be keen to get them sold for the money , a breeder should know the correct way, and should be aware of a illness or change in kittens or any animals , well i surpose we will not know a answer to this ,the only thing i can see is more ongoing vet bills more so if a new pet comes in hoildays new child any change that could course a kitten cat to stress.


If its stress it could be, the new home, new people, new cat, car journeys, vets. 

Ginger has had it this month as we've had lots of decorating done. 

Simba has had similar issues due to us going away for the weekend. 

Zingi has similar problems as he gets bullied by Scooby. 

Etc.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

SakuraPastel said:


> Everyone on here said it was stress tge vet thought at first it could be but no medication or steroids changed that.


As gina has already said, if a cat gets stressed because of a change in its circumstances that stress doesn't vanish in a couple of days, that's why the advice was to give the kitten a chance to adapt to her new circumstances and stop stressing.



sa123 said:


> So would you say this stress could be just a new home or has it arrived with the condition it could be breeder taking her away from mum to fast or weennig kitten incorrect to early breeders can be keen to get them sold for the money , a breeder should know the correct way, and should be aware of a illness or change in kittens or any animals , well i surpose we will not know a answer to this ,the only thing i can see is more ongoing vet bills more so if a new pet comes in hoildays new child any change that could course a kitten cat to stress.


The kitten was 5 month sold so the breeder wasn't in that much of a hurry. However, as I said earlier, if she kept her kittens isolated from the family in a kitten room, then that kitten hasn't been socialised for the whole 5 months of its life, in which case it's no wonder it was stressed going to a new home.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I did wait 2 weeks before bringing her to the vet. Im wondering if the breeder moved the kittens to that room before we got there as another couple were picking one up before us. Could the move from ome room into another cause it straight away. Vet thinks its an immune system thing but wont know. seems its fixed for now though. there were 2 different litters which im not sure were kept together at first or not. Its the first pedigree animal ive gotten besides my snakes.


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

I hope it is stress I guess every cat is different, my moggie kitten was kept in a barn and scared of the owners and had ti catch her and she never had a problem. Shes still adjusting to domestic life now if she would use the litter tray! Anyway id rather pay the vet and nothing be wrong then not and she get really ill. For now its the end of it. Thanks to everyone who gave advice when it was so badly needed. I loce her to bits and just wanted the best for her. Sorry if I sounded completely crazy. Im knew to this and was really worried. Now to relax and play fetch with the kitties who are now all asleep in a row on their radiater bed.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I think you just over-worried and over-thought it, but that's understandable when you're not used to cats and how they behave and react.

Not knowing how the breeders keeps her cats I can't comment other than if I walk into a breeder's house and the kittens are brought to me, or I'm taken to the kittens, I wouldn't be happy and I would think very hard about buying a kitten from that person, because I would worry about socialisation.

Hopefully, it was just stress of the new home and new cats and she'll be fine now! :2thumb:


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## bampoisongirl (Mar 28, 2008)

How's kitty doing?


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## SakuraPastel (May 14, 2011)

Shes fantastic, solid poo now that shes on a raw diet and doesnt stink either!! No more taking clumps of mess off her rear end fur and shes gaining weight. She looks healthy her coat is looking nice and her behaviour is amazing. I'm so happy shes all better. The older cat has started hating her less but still the odd hiss but nothing serious, the older kitten loves her and they clean each other and sleep together. Jellybean has also learned how to play with the door stoppers. I got her a small kong ball since she loves anything round that rolls and she spends hours with it. She has become an awesome part of our crazy house hold and even though it cost me to get us to this point I wouldnt trade her!


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