# Floating plants



## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

IN a bid to fight the ever lasting war on my nitrate-tastic tap water, i've already been recommended to get some plants on the go.

I tried java moss. In 2 nights it had been eaten! However we have three moss balls that are surviving and escaped the jaws of our 2 apple snails and 2 goldfish.... i guess they're too lazy to chase them!

So i'm thinking anything that is to be rooted in is going to be instant lunch, unless i really redo the tank properly as a full planted monster and hope they they can't eat it fast enough... i'll be honest i'd really rather not as it will break my poor bank to smithereens!(Although i'm promising myself my next tank for these beasties will be planted from the start!)

I tried to use a shower caddy thing as suggested in my previous topic... the goldfish seem to take offense to it and kept head butting off the side, no matter where i put it (they like to do this with the filters too :whistling2:until one gets a bonk on the head from it, luckily the wiring is quite taught so they never fall off properly)

So i'm probably going to get some more moss balls, and was thinking some sort of floating plant would work? Any suggestions as i have no idea! My fish are of the persuasion of 'if i have to chase it then i'm not going to bother with it'


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## Moogloo (Mar 15, 2010)

Trouble is, the goldies will eat the roots of floating plants that will kill em. You'd need something pretty tough and prolific. Short of putting in duckweed  Though... thats not such a bad idea... too small and prolific to eat... you'll need to net it out every week or so LOL but it would work.

Or maybe Frogbit, usually seen in ponds so it is pretty tough... dont know if you'd find much this time of year.... I have Salvinia Natans and the goldfish would munch that in one mouthfull!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

My idea didn't work 

Anyway, water lettuce, water hyacinth, amazon frog bit, hydrocotyle, duck weed (would get nomed probably).


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

Morgan Freeman said:


> My idea didn't work
> 
> Anyway, water lettuce, water hyacinth, amazon frog bit, hydrocotyle, duck weed (would get nomed probably).



it would have worked brilliant if it wasn't for my fish being such little demons! they just took a real dislike to it!

if they nom the roots of any of these things... then i don't know! i'm just hoping that if it floats, it be moving a lot off the currents made by the filters... so they'll be too lazy to bother like they have with the moss balls!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

I'm not one for using chemicals, but maybe those nitrate removal bottles might be worth a go?


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

miss_mystra said:


> it would have worked brilliant if it wasn't for my fish being such little demons! they just took a real dislike to it!
> 
> if they nom the roots of any of these things... then i don't know! i'm just hoping that if it floats, it be moving a lot off the currents made by the filters... so they'll be too lazy to bother like they have with the moss balls!


What kind of fish? How big are they?

And what size was your Salvinia natans?


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

They're fancy goldfish I think.


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## opakg (Oct 14, 2011)

Moss balls are very slow growing, will not help alot at all. You want something fast growing, the faster it is the more nitrates it eats up.

I'm actually selling a fair bit of floating water lettuce, very attractive and fast growing plant, some fish eat it but I have never had an issue 

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...ater-lettuce-floating-plants.html#post9294741


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

Morgan Freeman said:


> I'm not one for using chemicals, but maybe those nitrate removal bottles might be worth a go?



Not seen anything like that, i take it you mean like dechlorinator etc but for removing nitrates?

i've got nitrate removing media in both filters, trouble is they're both bodge jobs!


The Fluval U2 has that middle box inside which originally had the biomax pellets in, now has the fluval nitrate removing media in one of them sock things that came with it, stuffed into the box... doesn't fit in very easily :S

The Eheim has a Jewel Nitrate removing sponge squashed on the top of the original sponge, and likes to pop open occasionally! Because the eheim has like a big spikey holder going through the middle of the filter bit, unless i stab a big hole in the Jewel sponge it doesn't fit in properly. And as i found out the first time i tried to stab a hole in, turns out the stuff that makes it a nitrate remover is in a weird pellet thing in the middle and i broke it!


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

Mynki said:


> What kind of fish? How big are they?
> 
> And what size was your Salvinia natans?



2 big fancy goldfish that like to head butt things.

Didn't have any Salvinia natans... i had to look up what they are :blush:


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

opakg said:


> Moss balls are very slow growing, will not help alot at all. You want something fast growing, the faster it is the more nitrates it eats up.
> 
> I'm actually selling a fair bit of floating water lettuce, very attractive and fast growing plant, some fish eat it but I have never had an issue
> 
> http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...ater-lettuce-floating-plants.html#post9294741



cool! this looks like a good idea


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## Stan193 (May 27, 2009)

You could try this:
Seachem. Purigen


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

Stan193 said:


> You could try this:
> Seachem. Purigen



nearly got that one but bought the fluval version instead : victory:


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## INJAF (Nov 12, 2011)

If the water lettuce is pistia stratiotes mine didn't do too well in a tank with a lid, I've read other reports of it not doing well under lids too. It also needs a reasonable distance between it and any lighting. My goldies ate salvinia, amazon frogbit and ate the roots of the pistia. Always worth a try though 

How about hornwort? You can leave that to float, some of mine eat it and some don't so you might be in luck. You could try giant duckweed perhaps? Duckweed as in lemna minor might get eaten, the only bits of mine that didn't were tangled up in some floating hornwort. My mossballs have grown well, to be fair I have got a lot of them and they have been attacked a bit but some of them are about the size of a large orange now.

Purigen gets good reviews and I've read reports on other forums about it's effectiveness


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

INJAF said:


> If the water lettuce is pistia stratiotes mine didn't do too well in a tank with a lid, I've read other reports of it not doing well under lids too. It also needs a reasonable distance between it and any lighting. My goldies ate salvinia, amazon frogbit and ate the roots of the pistia. Always worth a try though
> 
> How about hornwort? You can leave that to float, some of mine eat it and some don't so you might be in luck. You could try giant duckweed perhaps? Duckweed as in lemna minor might get eaten, the only bits of mine that didn't were tangled up in some floating hornwort. My mossballs have grown well, to be fair I have got a lot of them and they have been attacked a bit but some of them are about the size of a large orange now.
> 
> Purigen gets good reviews and I've read reports on other forums about it's effectiveness


sounds like i'll be buying a nice selection - and see what survives! :lol2:

I have a lid on the tank, but it is kept open (pointless having it i know but i was a measure to help Pedro recover which has worked very well - something to do with more oxygen) so it will be kept open, and our room that they're in is fairly sunny (luckily the snails help do battle with any algae i get... although i do have to scrape off a fair amount in the summer on one side!) so maybe the water lettuce would be ok... ah well fun times with random plants here i come!

can't wait for the moss balls to grow more though, i think they're ace looking, and i've decided they're 'alive' (i know they are alive but as in like a moving creature type thing!) and i'll probably start naming them!! :lol2:


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

im battling exactly the same fight with my fancy goldfish tank. nitrates out of the tap 40ppm or just above, in the tank within a few days it rises to 60-80ppm. we have now added seachem matrix to the fx5, waiting for that to hopefully kick in in the next few weeks, and seachem purigen in one of the internal filters which has dropped the nitrates a bit, but we only got 1 packet and we need 2 for a tank of our size. need to wait for payday! if only the goldfish didnt see all plants as an expensive salad bar :bash: good job i love them!


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

goldie1212 said:


> im battling exactly the same fight with my fancy goldfish tank. nitrates out of the tap 40ppm or just above, in the tank within a few days it rises to 60-80ppm. we have now added seachem matrix to the fx5, waiting for that to hopefully kick in in the next few weeks, and seachem purigen in one of the internal filters which has dropped the nitrates a bit, but we only got 1 packet and we need 2 for a tank of our size. need to wait for payday! if only the goldfish didnt see all plants as an expensive salad bar :bash: good job i love them!



ack, it's not fun is it, our nitrates read about 50ppm out the tap last time i checked, it's a pain in the bum!!

and yep... we need to train these fishies to be less green nibbling and more green fingered... or finned :lol2:


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

miss_mystra said:


> ack, it's not fun is it, our nitrates read about 50ppm out the tap last time i checked, it's a pain in the bum!!
> 
> and yep... we need to train these fishies to be less green nibbling and more green fingered... or finned :lol2:


Right then....

Buy Salvinia natans. Go for large adult plants rather than the crappy little stuff you find in LFS. These are ideal :-

Salvinia natans x 6 Live FLOATING aquarium plant | eBay

This stuff grows like mad and will make a difference with your nitrate levels. As INJAF will terstify, their moss balls are pretty good. But in order to help them grow quickly, the addition of trace elements also helps.

I've just planted one of these in one of my tanks as they look cool! 

eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace

However I don't know what a shoal of goldies would do to it.

Anubias heterophyla should be OK. Also, java fern, normal, narrow leaf and windelov varieties will also be OK.


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

I'm selling nitrate free water at 10p a litre, you just have to come collect it from my house :2thumb:

But seriously, I can do bottles of trace mix for super cheap if anyone wants some.


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## Moogloo (Mar 15, 2010)

It was my goldies, specifically my black ranchu named Bob (2") who liked eating salvinia natans, i bought handfulls of the stuff, the more i bought, the longer it lasted... but he ate it roots first and chewed and chewed it, they stopped eating pellets and bloodworms too, they just liked the plants. They were the only fancies i've kept personally in my own tanks. Kinda went backwards, started with marine and brackish then trops, sub trops and then my fancies.

The downside of the salvinia was the roots, if they could get hold of the roots, they dragged it down and ate it...

EDIT: didnt see the second page :blush:

EDIT AGAIN: Mynki, you are a genius! I've been trying to remember for 3 years now, what the lily leaf type plant with funky base and roots was! That description wasnt used in the books very often  bannana lily eh... i loved that plant but it grew so bloomin tall! Even in a 2.5ft deep tank it hit the surface quickly. Dont think it will hold up to goldies though.


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

Thats why I said buy adult Salvinia. The leaves are too tough for goldies and the thick black roots won't be killed off. They will nibble at the runners they send out and eat it, but the mother plants will be fine. 

Salvinia oblongifolia will also be OK if you can find it.


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## Moogloo (Mar 15, 2010)

Yeah sorry, I only said that because you made some comment on the first pages about the size of the goldfish but no one seemed to know who the comment was aimed at lol. Im tired, ought to just go to bed 

Im not a fan of floating plants, were just too messy for me, i had frogbit for ages in a trop tank but i got all twitchy when it kepts moving about and it grew and shaded all the other plants, and it was shading out my aponogeton madagascariensis and im sorry but im not letting my lace plant suffer for some floating plants lol. I dont think i will keep goldies again, like my plants way too much!


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## Mynki (Mar 24, 2010)

Moogloo said:


> Yeah sorry, I only said that because you made some comment on the first pages about the size of the goldfish but no one seemed to know who the comment was aimed at lol. Im tired, ought to just go to bed
> 
> Im not a fan of floating plants, were just too messy for me, i had frogbit for ages in a trop tank but i got all twitchy when it kepts moving about and it grew and shaded all the other plants, and it was shading out my aponogeton madagascariensis and im sorry but im not letting my lace plant suffer for some floating plants lol. I dont think i will keep goldies again, like my plants way too much!


Aponogeton madagascarensis needs some shade to flourish. 

Random fact but true. They look awesome when the central leaves go orange.


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## INJAF (Nov 12, 2011)

Mynki said:


> Thats why I said buy adult Salvinia. The leaves are too tough for goldies and the thick black roots won't be killed off. They will nibble at the runners they send out and eat it, but the mother plants will be fine.


And so the gauntlet is thrown down ... are you up for a Salvinia Challenge? Send me some salvinia from a retailer of your choice and I'll let you know how it goes 

I know someone who kept an open top tank with pistia and goldies and that worked well so you may be in luck with your open top set up Miss M. I think most floating plants seem to prefer a lid free life.



Morgan Freeman said:


> I'm selling nitrate free water at 10p a litre, you just have to come collect it from my house


Excellent, you're not a million miles from me, I'll be round with a tanker and £100 :2thumb:

@ Miss M - if your tap water is coming out with high nitrate you may find it easier to do something with it before you put it in the tank with a water change otherwise you'll always struggle to reduce tank nitrates. How about leaving your tap water in a large container with a filter full of nitrate reducing media for a while before you use it for a water change? Or have you considered a filter from the likes of pozzani that take nitrates out of the tap water? You can plumb them into the mains or run them as and when, depending on what you want. If you do manage to get enough plants to reduce nitrate you'll be adding it back in with every water change if your tap water is 40ppm+ so I think I'd be inclined to go for a two pronged attack; reduce nitrates before you add water to the tank and try and use planting and/or nitrate reducing media to keep them low between water changes.


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## Christie_ZXR (May 14, 2011)

I can't remember if I recommended it to you before or not, but incase I didn't that Nitrate Minus stuff from Tetra actually seems to work.

NitrateMinus 100ml

I did a controlled experiment with it to test it! Honest!! :lol2:

Well...actually, I put a load of it in a glass of water and then tested the water and it came back 0 after adding the stuff as opposed to about 80ppm before! But that was a teensy bit of an overdose...lol! 

Seriously though, if you add it direct to your filter sponges, it does seem to do some good in the tank too. Maybe make a good extra weapon in your armoury against the evil nitrate!!


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

INJAF said:


> And so the gauntlet is thrown down ... are you up for a Salvinia Challenge? Send me some salvinia from a retailer of your choice and I'll let you know how it goes
> 
> I know someone who kept an open top tank with pistia and goldies and that worked well so you may be in luck with your open top set up Miss M. I think most floating plants seem to prefer a lid free life.
> 
> ...



If this was my own house and i was allowed to muck about plumbing things into the taps etc i'd be using the pozzani filters (seen you suggest them elsewhere on someone else's thread). Trouble is, it's rented property and whilst they're happy enough me having my 3 snakes and the fish, i don't want to push it any further by messing with their plumbing etc, i'd probably botch it right up anyway! Plus another factor is cost unfortunately, i really can't afford it right now... i think if Pedro was getting sicker then obviously i'd find a way, but he is improving so hopefully i can get away without the investment in this sort of kit.

I'm hoping the nitrates will go down eventually from the tap, as this time last year they were very low in the tap water,so maybe they will calm back down. Pedro is getting much better as time goes on, so hopefully will a few things to help to keep the levels as low as possible in general (obviously there will be spikes when i put new water in). Annoyingly i bet if i could plumb in a pozzani i wouldn't need to do much else!

Plus i reckon the floating plants could look quite nice whether i need them or not!


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

Christie_ZXR said:


> I can't remember if I recommended it to you before or not, but incase I didn't that Nitrate Minus stuff from Tetra actually seems to work.
> 
> NitrateMinus 100ml
> 
> ...



ooh that's a new one! i'll take a look and probably just buy some! Thanks!!


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## opakg (Oct 14, 2011)

Try tesco value spring water!
Its 15p for 2 litres, I use it for my snakes drinking water, not tested it with API yet but I bet there's barely any nitrates in it!


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

opakg said:


> Try tesco value spring water!
> Its 15p for 2 litres, I use it for my snakes drinking water, not tested it with API yet but I bet there's barely any nitrates in it!



:lol2: would be ideal but i don't fancy trying to bring home 100 bottles without a car! eek!


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## opakg (Oct 14, 2011)

miss_mystra said:


> :lol2: would be ideal but i don't fancy trying to bring home 100 bottles without a car! eek!


haha take it you have a large tank!
Pick up 1-2 bottles a time when you pass by, until you have enough for a partial water change :2thumb:

Or going up to the extreme try reverse osmosis water kits. I have no idea about them but people with large salt water setups use them for there sole water source. Tap water sucks! :devil:


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

opakg said:


> haha take it you have a large tank!
> Pick up 1-2 bottles a time when you pass by, until you have enough for a partial water change :2thumb:
> 
> Or going up to the extreme try reverse osmosis water kits. I have no idea about them but people with large salt water setups use them for there sole water source. Tap water sucks! :devil:



i carry out a roughly 50% water change each week, that's quite a lot of bottles :eek4: 60L would be a good 30 bottles... and 50% of my tank would be more than that i think  plus our Tesco is crap, i don't think they know what stocking things means, they hide the milk most days!

i'd love an RO kit but it's not financially viable right now. It's the waste water that puts me off as well.... doesn't it chuck out 1/4 of what goes in? but then i chuck out buckets and buckets of water each week doing water changes too so you can't win haha...wish i had a garden to chuck it all out into to water the plants... not that we've not go rain or anything... but feels a bit of a waste!


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## Morgan Freeman (Jan 14, 2009)

Can you get a sump drain that hangs over the back and works like a syphon? The same way an external filter outlet looks but basically works by pulling the water itself. I'm sure that sounds logical.

Anyway, try and build one out of PVC. Have a sump made out of a R.U.B, fill with nitrate removing plants then have a return pump. You can get them cheap enough on ebay.


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