# Say NO to breed specific legislation (now with site)



## ami_j

Hey guys ...i know many of you signed a petition but we would be really greatful if people could write to their local MPs using the letter provided or their own letter...a link for finding said MP is on the top of the letter
Also would be really helpful if those on facebook could join the group and send a request to join to as many people as possible. 

we have other things in the pipeline and will keep you updated..
for those who havent seen it Bruces story
http://img.youtube.com/vi/FRJYVszJ7tE/default.jpg

the site 
No To BSL - Home

facebook group
DEED NOT BREED PETITION | Facebook
petition
Petition to: Punish the deed not the breed!. | Number10.gov.uk

thank you


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## SaZzY

:up: Still need more sigs from you nice people :flrt:


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## ami_j

surely more ppl must be interested! who here owns a staffy or something else thats got the "look" of a type...or another breed that could be added!


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## sarahc

*breed not deed*

I've signed,I don't have any of the breeds but the faces of those poor pit bulls that after suffering abuse get carted off to their death by the police when they are doing one of their clean up dangerous dogs campaigns is one I can't forget.Best of luck.


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## gazz

Signed:2thumb:.


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## ami_j

thank you everyone that has signed


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## ami_j

PLEASE
YouTube - Send In The Dogs 07-08-09 2of5
watch from 3.40 til 8.00...

theres many things wrong....suspected bad dog...yet its a lovely looking dog...
many staffys and crosses love grabbing trees...and as for prob wants it for fighting she obv forgets its his pet...
this is happening daily and must be stopped!


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## gazz

ami_j said:


> PLEASE
> YouTube - Send In The Dogs 07-08-09 2of5
> watch from 3.40 til 8.00...
> 
> theres many things wrong....suspected bad dog...yet its a lovely looking dog...
> many staffys and crosses love grabbing trees...and as for prob wants it for fighting she obv forgets its his pet...
> this is happening daily and must be stopped!


Stupid people think they've ID'd a American pit bull terrier coz it has a red nose:banghead:.Even pure staffies can have a red nose it comes with the liver coat color.However that dog is not a red nose American pit bull terrier.It's a pup and is big and will get bigger and stockyer so no even a American pit bull terrier as the build it to big.

It's a *Staffordshire bull terrier X French mastiff.*
So these so call ID experts have killed a staffy X.
You can't go killing dogs just coz they have red noses.
Red nose is a dominant trait.So what ever you breed a 
french mastiff It result in red nose offspring.


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## ami_j

unfortunately it wont be getting bigger it got destroyed as a pit type :bash:


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## cpiggott22

ami_j said:


> PLEASE
> YouTube - Send In The Dogs 07-08-09 2of5
> watch from 3.40 til 8.00...
> 
> theres many things wrong....suspected bad dog...yet its a lovely looking dog...
> many staffys and crosses love grabbing trees...and as for prob wants it for fighting she obv forgets its his pet...
> this is happening daily and must be stopped!


I was so appalled by this that I signed immediately. I can't believe she dismissed his attempt to save the poor thing as 'he wants it because it would be a good dog to breed from'....HE WANTS IT BECAUSE IT'S HIS BELOVED PET YOU IDIOTIC WOMAN!!!!! I actually cried watching that beautiful friendly chap being taken from his owner and I'm disgusted by the attitude of a so-called 'expert'. I can't believe there's only 123 signatures on this petition, come on peeps, here's our chance to speak up!


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## ami_j

cpiggott22 said:


> I was so appalled by this that I signed immediately. I can't believe she dismissed his attempt to save the poor thing as 'he wants it because it would be a good dog to breed from'....HE WANTS IT BECAUSE IT'S HIS BELOVED PET YOU IDIOTIC WOMAN!!!!! I actually cried watching that beautiful friendly chap being taken from his owner and I'm disgusted by the attitude of a so-called 'expert'. I can't believe there's only 123 signatures on this petition, come on peeps, here's our chance to speak up!


i kno that infuriated me soooo much. a fighting dog wouldnt be clean and cared for being walked in public. and most dogs i know like sticks even though they are bad for them terriers just have the tenacity to get the stick thats been held high for them (as far as they know) andto hold on to it


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## LisaLQ

If someone set up a petition to get that policewoman so-called dog lover struck off, I'd sign that. She's a disgusting pig ignorant woman who should be nowhere near animals. That dog wasn't dangerous, it was after a cuddle, stupid, ignorant woman.


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## laranicheallaigh

Could I sign the petition even though i'm not 18 yet?


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## KathyM

Didn't like the video but didn't like his owner either, dodgey as hell on both sides, police and owner. I am 150% against BSL but people who create these pit type dogs knowingly (whether it's staff x bordeaux or not it's still one!) also really do my head in. Whether it should be illegal or not, it IS illegal and they shouldn't be making more until the law is changed (and never if they're doing it to look hard or get fighting dogs).


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## ami_j

LisaLQ said:


> If someone set up a petition to get that policewoman so-called dog lover struck off, I'd sign that. She's a disgusting pig ignorant woman who should be nowhere near animals. That dog wasn't dangerous, it was after a cuddle, stupid, ignorant woman.


i might add it to the list lol 
she definatley was clueless and stupid



laranicheallaigh said:


> Could I sign the petition even though i'm not 18 yet?


yes you can 



KathyM said:


> Didn't like the video but didn't like his owner either, dodgey as hell on both sides, police and owner. I am 150% against BSL but people who create these pit type dogs knowingly (whether it's staff x bordeaux or not it's still one!) also really do my head in. Whether it should be illegal or not, it IS illegal and they shouldn't be making more until the law is changed (and never if they're doing it to look hard or get fighting dogs).


thats the problem...the people wanting dogs for less than innocent means and encouraging agression..much better spend of money than the millions spent taking innocent friendly dogs away


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## gazz

KathyM said:


> But people who create these pit type dogs knowingly (whether it's staff x bordeaux or not it's still one!)


Staffie cross French mastiff is not a pit type.To be pit type they have to be pure American pit bull terrier or have the blood of a American pit bull terrier or another baned breed.Both staffie or french mastiff don't have pit blood.And the dog wasn't in no way aggressive.And baased on that how can you judge the bloke ?.He was pi$$ed as anyone would be.If the police say they are taking your dog that's it what can you do ?.Other express that you are pi$$ed.


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## ami_j

gazz said:


> Staffie cross French mastiff is not a pit type.To be pit type they have to be pure American pit bull terrier or have the blood of a American pit bull terrier or another baned breed.Both staffie or french mastiff don't have pit blood.And the dog wasn't in no way aggressive.And baased on that how can you judge the bloke ?.He was pi$$ed as anyone would be.If the police say they are taking your dog that's it what can you do ?.Other express that you are pi$$ed.


pit "type" is a set of characteristics used to define a dog it has nothing to do with blood...hence innocent dogs are taken


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## LisaLQ

And considering pits were originally made from molosser type breeds (where mastiffs originate from also) and terriers...a staffy cross mastiff is most definitely a "pit type".


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## KathyM

gazz said:


> Staffie cross French mastiff is not a pit type.To be pit type they have to be pure American pit bull terrier or have the blood of a American pit bull terrier or another baned breed.Both staffie or french mastiff don't have pit blood.And the dog wasn't in no way aggressive.And baased on that how can you judge the bloke ?.He was pi$$ed as anyone would be.If the police say they are taking your dog that's it what can you do ?.Other express that you are pi$$ed.


As someone supposedly genned up on BSL as your signature suggests, I am surprised you are so ignorant on Section 1 of the DDA. ANY dog of any breed, pedigree or cross, that fits the measurements, is legally of "pit bull type". Very few pit bull type dogs in this country have APBT in their parentage. Have you read the DEFRA guidelines on identifying illegal dogs??


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## KathyM

ami_j said:


> pit "type" is a set of characteristics used to define a dog it has nothing to do with blood...hence innocent dogs are taken


I would personally argue that all dogs that are seized under the DDA are "innocent", regardless of whether they're illegal. :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## gazz

KathyM said:


> As someone supposedly genned up on BSL as your signature suggests, I am surprised you are so ignorant on Section 1 of the DDA. ANY dog of any breed, pedigree or cross, that fits the measurements, is legally of "pit bull type". Very few pit bull type dogs in this country have APBT in their parentage. Have you read the DEFRA guidelines on identifying illegal dogs??


The dogs have to be beleave to have blood of a DWA breed.And they base this on how the dog looks.But it so easy to make a American pit bull terrier look alike.

I've beleaved it to be that the illegal DWA breeds are American Pit Bull terriers, Japanese Tosa, Dogo Argentino and Fila Braziliero.The act also covers dogs that have the physical characteristics of these breeds because they *could* be partly bred out of any of the named breeds.So are judge with out real proof.Coz it's really hard to prove.The attitude is get rid of the problem before it becomes problem.(That's close enough that will do).

As of YET hopfully never there is nothing illegal about a Staffie cross French mastiff or any legal Bull/Mastiff/Bull terrier breed cross.IMO there no legal reson for taking such a dog deffo for one that shows no aggression.The problem is it's hard to tell out of the Bull/Mastiff/Bull terrrer cross's.Yet they base there finding on looks and all these breeds share ancestory.

The BSL is about not judging breed by there looks.But base your opinion on there charactor.That copper just saw that red nose 'you just know it' and didn't even see that it was a bouncy pup.If it was a fighting dog that bloke would have set it on her but he couldn't set it coz there was nothing to set.You just know she saw that nose color and that was it (Red nose American pit bull terrier) and that's all she saw.


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## rakpeterson

gazz said:


> The BSL is about not judging breed by there looks.But base your opinion on there charactor.


I really think you have missunderstood.

BSL is nearly entirely based on the way a dog looks, very little about the actual behaviour of the dog. 

You are right that it shouldn't be this way, the law is wrong. Thats the whole point of anti-bsl. Many dogs, regardless of being cross breeds or pure, are illegal based purely on the way they look, despite having 0% blood from the banned 4.

Unfortunately I cannot sign this petition. I only6 half agree with the cause.

I agree with the fact that our current DDA is wrong on many levels, but cannot support any campaign to totally lift BSL, we need it in some form. The UK is filled with too many degenerates for a society with no BSL to work.


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## KathyM

gazz said:


> The dogs have to be beleave to have blood of a DWA breed.And they base this on how the dog looks.But it so easy to make a American pit bull terrier look alike.
> 
> I've beleaved it to be that the illegal DWA breeds are American Pit Bull terriers, Japanese Tosa, Dogo Argentino and Fila Braziliero.The act also covers dogs that have the physical characteristics of these breeds because they *could* be partly bred out of any of the named breeds.So are judge with out real proof.Coz it's really hard to prove.The attitude is get rid of the problem before it becomes problem.(That's close enough that will do).
> 
> As of YET hopfully never there is nothing illegal about a Staffie cross French mastiff or any legal Bull/Mastiff/Bull terrier breed cross.IMO there no legal reson for taking such a dog deffo for one that shows no aggression.The problem is it's hard to tell out of the Bull/Mastiff/Bull terrrer cross's.Yet they base there finding on looks and all these breeds share ancestory.
> 
> The BSL is about not judging breed by there looks.But base your opinion on there charactor.That copper just saw that red nose 'you just know it' and didn't even see that it was a bouncy pup.If it was a fighting dog that bloke would have set it on her but he couldn't set it coz there was nothing to set.You just know she saw that nose color and that was it (Red nose American pit bull terrier) and that's all she saw.


I think if you read into the seizures and amnesties over the last few years, what they believe and the facts are two different things. Pedigree staffs with papers were seized and destroyed. American bulldogs were seized and destroyed. The vast majority of seized dogs were staffie crosses. 

If you think a dog's known parentage will save it you need to read more into it because sadly that's a crock. As a pit bull "type" covers crossbreeds that look like pit bulls anyway, parentage makes no difference - measurements and appearance do, if they fit they legally are classed as illegal dogs. So if that mastiff cross fits the measurements and description, it's illegal. Bearing in mind the DEFRA guidelines are so loose a pedigree lab could be classed as one by up to 90% and a dog doesn't have to fit them 100% to be classed as type!

In Merseyside they had untrained police officers deciding the fate of the dogs entirely on looks. Do you have any idea of the process? It is all done on belief, not knowledge, and it's the only law in the country where the burden of proof is on the defense - guilty until proven innocent. 

ANYONE breeding bullbreed crosses in this climate is just as responsible for these deaths as the police. Only a heartless idiot would bring more illegal dogs into the world.


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## mrsfluff

I've signed, I hope more people do.

Jo


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## temerist

my first dogs when moving here from south africa were 2 american pit bulls before the ban. fantastic dogs, very loyal and have wonderful tempraments. my children were raised with my pit bulls and would trust them around my children more than I would a jack russell (although nothing against JRT)


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## SaZzY

temerist said:


> my first dogs when moving here from south africa were 2 american pit bulls before the ban. fantastic dogs, very loyal and have wonderful tempraments. my children were raised with my pit bulls and would trust them around my children more than I would a jack russell (although nothing against JRT)


I grew up with rotties and GSDs and the only dog that has ever bitten me was a JRT as I was pulling it off my rotties throat to stop the other dogs owner kicking my leashed up and not a tiny bit aggresive dog who was crying her eyes out. He said my dog was a psycho yet his was biting mine. :hmm:


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## temerist

yes our old girl borboel was attacked by 2 jack russells. my girl was on a lead and was not a danger to anyone as she had a lovely temperament. one of the jack russells actually ripped part of her ear off and they were very vicious. needless to say it was obviously our dogs fault as she is a large vicious bull breed. so vicious she just stood there and allowed the attack instead of retaliating.


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## KathyM

Dharma was attacked by a tiny collie x terrier thing, it bit her back legs like it was herding - her owner thought it was dead amusing and didn't put her back onlead, left her off to come bombing back and do it again. Now Dharma is frightened of little bitches. :bash:


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## xmashx

the goverment are serious control freeks. and have double standards. 
these dogs arent dangerous their trained to be that way. no dog, just like any human is born to kill they are trained.
its nature vs nurture
they believe any dog breed that has been in the passed been bred for fighting will naturally have a killer instinct. 
when they can be the most loving and gentle dog ever.
the police have dogs that are trained to bight and to be aggressive. but they dont go killing ever GSD because they have been bred by a police dog who has been trained to attack. 
they go killing innocent dogs while they quite happily walk around with a trained attack dog. 

if you ask me whats more dangerous to a police person and any member of society its a trained GSD not a pet that you have had for a while and is gentle.
if it wanted to. or if suddenly it turned. the GSD would know exactly how to bring someone down.
thats more of a threat than a pet.

xmashx


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## Daniel1

Anyone seen this ?
Bruce Appeal - Eleventh Hour Plea for Death Row Dog-Support Urgently Needed


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## ami_j

Daniel1 said:


> Anyone seen this ?
> Bruce Appeal - Eleventh Hour Plea for Death Row Dog-Support Urgently Needed


hes got an appeal thats excellent


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## CorntasticBully

Old thread I know I cant watch the video. Did the appeal work?
Can the owners try to request DNA test be done in these situations? There was a case here in the USA where a families dog was taken for being a Pit Bull. It was a Boxer mix but according to AC it looked Pit Bull so it is a Pit Bull. 
They family fought hard for their dog. They got it from being killed but the dog still had to sit in the shelter for months while the final decision was still being made. Anyway they got a DNA test allowed proving the dog wasnt a Pit.



gazz said:


> However that dog
> It's a *Staffordshire bull terrier X French mastiff.*
> So these so call ID experts have killed a staffy X.
> You can't go killing dogs just coz they have red noses.
> Red nose is a dominant trait.So what ever you breed a
> french mastiff It result in red nose offspring.
> image


Red nose is actually a RECESSIVE trait vetgen has color test which can tell you your dogs genotype. Even prior to this it was observed that red nose is recessive due to black nose parents producing red nose but red nose parents being able to produce black nose. I read there are actually 3 different mutations but they all cause the same phenotype. The only way you will get red nose pups from french mastiff x black nose is if the black nose is het for red nose. Otherwise all will be black nose but be carriers.


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## Shell195

Does anyone know whats happened to Lennox?


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## ami_j

CorntasticBully said:


> Old thread I know I cant watch the video. Did the appeal work?
> Can the owners try to request DNA test be done in these situations? There was a case here in the USA where a families dog was taken for being a Pit Bull. It was a Boxer mix but according to AC it looked Pit Bull so it is a Pit Bull.
> They family fought hard for their dog. They got it from being killed but the dog still had to sit in the shelter for months while the final decision was still being made. Anyway they got a DNA test allowed proving the dog wasnt a Pit.
> 
> 
> 
> Red nose is actually a RECESSIVE trait vetgen has color test which can tell you your dogs genotype. Even prior to this it was observed that red nose is recessive due to black nose parents producing red nose but red nose parents being able to produce black nose. I read there are actually 3 different mutations but they all cause the same phenotype. The only way you will get red nose pups from french mastiff x black nose is if the black nose is het for red nose. Otherwise all will be black nose but be carriers.


DNA wont make any difference , a dog is determined a pitbull type based on its looks not its genes


Shell195 said:


> Does anyone know whats happened to Lennox?


papers are saying its been thrown out of court and that he will be pts but no statment from the family and apparently its been said before


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## feorag

It'll be interesting then to see what comes up in the programme on BBC on Tuesday night in terms of how the law sometimes leads to sociable animals being pts and potentially violent ones going free.


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## ami_j

probably Eileen but I wont be watching it, I just see it winding me up with its bias tbh


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## staceylei

i didnt realise this was an old thread until some one mentioned it but i have signed an e -petition and joined facebook. this is something that always winds me up p:censor:s me of that people only have to hear the name staffy and they are like o god i wouldnt have one of them iv heard bout them in paper etc etc shut the f:censor: up and do your research you simple minded people. rant over
on another note if there is anything i can do OP to help let me know.
i will also take this opportunity to show of my gorgeous boy bodie :2thumb:


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## CorntasticBully

ami_j said:


> DNA wont make any difference , a dog is determined a pitbull type based on its looks not its genes


I realize that its the same in the states. If AC says its a Pit they take and PTS the dog. Some even have a physical definition of Pit Bull and dogs which are not really Pits have been taken. In the case I mentioned it was a first time deal. The family fought long and hard and finally found an acceptable way to get their dog back.

I also heard that the DDA may under go possible revision? I think it would be great if innocent SBT are no longer killed. Though if APBT become legal I could see negative repercussions too.


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