# license in birmingham? (crocodillian)



## aaron lynch (Feb 13, 2009)

hi guys, ive been keeping reps for 17 years now (mainly large constrictors and monitors) and ive wanted either a dwarf caiman or dwarf crocodile for a while now. i have been resding up on setups and general care for these species and think im pretty sure what im gonna need in that area, my question is how difficult is it to obtain a dwa through birmingham city council?
i have heard off a few people that they are very reluctant to give them. is there anyone on here from birmingham that has a dwa? and did you encounter any difficulty obtaining it?

thanks guys, im still in the planning stage and doing lots of research to make sure i can properly provide for one of these for life so any tips or findings on these species would also be appreciated.
cheers, aaron


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

Hi Aaron,

You might find that it's better to contact you're council to see what they say on requirements etc.

I think that councils who are reluctant to issue DWAL's are selfish to those who are prepaired to go the whole nine yards for their animals needs and welfare.


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## StevetheSnake (Mar 10, 2008)

or maybe someone from Birmingham who has a license may be able to help him?


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

StevetheSnake said:


> or maybe someone from Birmingham who has a license may be able to help him?


 
Possibly yes....But the council could give him a list of all the things to do for their requirements to pass the inspection...Thats what I was thinking anyway.


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## paulrimmer69 (Oct 26, 2008)

james please! read the original post again, he asked for advice off people who have a dwa in birmingham, you dont live in birmingham and you dont have a dwa license so why even answer????????????


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## aaron lynch (Feb 13, 2009)

thanks guys, and viperlover. i already know whats required with reegards to setup and safety precautions, i was asking if anyone had any difficulty as ive heard bham council are pretty stubborn.


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

paulrimmer69 said:


> james please! read the original post again, he asked for advice off people who have a dwa in birmingham, you dont live in birmingham and you dont have a dwa license so why even answer????????????


:lol2: Well said,

James, like you venomous snakes interest me too. However as I don't actually keep any, or could hazard a guess as to what individual local authorities will or won't accept so I don't post anything to that effect.

You've already been flamed on several threads for do this, yet you seem thick skinned and don't take any notice.

Please, unless you actually know something first hand from your *own* experience, please resist the urge to post a reply one every single thread.


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## StevetheSnake (Mar 10, 2008)

We are all talking to a brick wall unfortunately.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

"Yam alright our kid" well i am not from Birmingham but from Walsall my advice is MOVE.....:whistling2: i know two people who have personnaly applied for DWAL and were refused, one was my partner in crime who lived around by the Queslet about 12 years ago when after i first got mine and someone i met recently who lives over by Great Barr, and as far as i am aware there are no private Dwal holders in Birmingham. 
Also i have herd of one petshop that was under the impression that there PSL coverd them for DWA and the council found out they were keeping caimen and there was a bit of trouble over it and they had to get rid of them, and the person who sold them to the guy running the shop could have got in to a bit of bother as well.
But if you go on there website there is a link to download an application form for DWAL so im sure if you were to challange the council asking for its reasons why then they have to give a reason, you could then challange that reason etc.
Simple thing is if the council next door ie my council Walsall will issue, although there are only a couple od us. then why cant Birmingham.
Sorry i cant be of more help but i dont think you will have any Brummys coming on saying that they have a Licence and heres what to do.....


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> "Yam alright our kid" well i am not from Birmingham but from Walsall my advice is MOVE.....:whistling2: i know two people who have personnaly applied for DWAL and were refused, one was my partner in crime who lived around by the Queslet about 12 years ago when after i first got mine and someone i met recently who lives over by Great Barr, and as far as i am aware there are no private Dwal holders in Birmingham.
> Also i have herd of one petshop that was under the impression that there PSL coverd them for DWA and the council found out they were keeping caimen and there was a bit of trouble over it and they had to get rid of them, and the person who sold them to the guy running the shop could have got in to a bit of bother as well.
> But if you go on there website there is a link to download an application form for DWAL so im sure if you were to challange the council asking for its reasons why then they have to give a reason, you could then challange that reason etc.
> Simple thing is if the council next door ie my council Walsall will issue, although there are only a couple od us. then why cant Birmingham.
> Sorry i cant be of more help but i dont think you will have any Brummys coming on saying that they have a Licence and heres what to do.....


 
Its a real shame...Councils are just :censor: at the best of times.


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## mad martin (Sep 4, 2008)

I read about councils being full of....... well.......... digested food matter.
I have no experience with them, but from what I read, their being difficult may actually be a good thing. Weeding out the guys with genuine interest from the guys with a passing fancy. Correct me if I am wrong 

(sorry for the hijack of sorts)


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

mad martin said:


> I read about councils being full of....... well.......... digested food matter.
> I have no experience with them, but from what I read, their being difficult may actually be a good thing. Weeding out the guys with genuine interest from the guys with a passing fancy. Correct me if I am wrong
> 
> (sorry for the hijack of sorts)


 
I do agree with you...

BUT the guys with interest, and those with a fancy will be spotted out, by their willingness and dedication for meeting the requirements, having the correct equipment and experience etc...As to those who just feel like doing it, just so as they can show off.


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## rogersspider2007 (Apr 2, 2007)

from what my local council said that birmingham had not issued a DWAL to anyone, the reason i can confirm this ( so take note viperlover) is that i have my DWAL and i also had a few minor problems with my council with regardfs a few species of snakes i keep so my council decided to contact other councils to find out how they go on about it and birmingham was one of them and they confirmed they havent issued any DWAL's so there you go. i have now got my DWAL sorted out now and everything is ok as i had a little help from a few of my friends. regards roger.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

I was under the impression (although I was under the same impression back in march) that the law would be changing to make the licence fairer, now it didnt go through in March then October was muttered, but my council does not know whats going on with it, anyone else know the details?


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## rogersspider2007 (Apr 2, 2007)

hi Si, my council doesnt know anything else either. mind you they dont know sweet FA the best of times.


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## aaron lynch (Feb 13, 2009)

thanks for the input guys, im going to get i contact with them and see what they say. a friend of mine who runs a pet shop was recently told there was no chance as he wanted a caiman for the shop.
im currently in the process of applying to a new job which will give me the opportunity to move pretty much anywere in the uk so i might wait utill i hear the outcome then make a decision weather to apply elsewere.
i agree its good that bham are strict, but just flatout refusing is wrong, some of us have a genuine lifelong interest in these animals and a good background of experience to back it up.

guess i might have to move then!


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

If im right i think Slippery42 had a similar problem with a council but he held a licence from his previous adress in another LA and the new council gave it to him
But if you do move dont go to Cannock as they dont issue Dwal from what i herd the other day but localy to us Walsall will as will Dudley and lichfield councils
good luck mate


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## wba6745 (Jan 11, 2007)

hello bud i used to work for graham at birmingham city council who issues the licences and mate youve got no chance,he is completly 100% against large snakes and as for dwa he would make it impossible,he is strict to say the least hence why there are no dwa holders in birmingham and lot's of people without a licence


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## Malc (Oct 27, 2009)

I may be out of my depth here, especially as I'm only a keeper of non hot snakes, but if the decision is down to one person and he is prejudiced against people keeping DWA's in his juristriction, then surely there could be a case for the human rights of the applicants, especially if the applicant would otherwise meet all the requirements set out under the DWAL, or if a similar application was granted to someone in the next county ?


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## paulrimmer69 (Oct 26, 2008)

Malc said:


> I may be out of my depth here, especially as I'm only a keeper of non hot snakes, but if the decision is down to one person and he is prejudiced against people keeping DWA's in his juristriction, then surely there could be a case for the human rights of the applicants, especially if the applicant would otherwise meet all the requirements set out under the DWAL, or if a similar application was granted to someone in the next county ?


 
i agree with that as far as im aware a council cannot point blank refuse to issue a license without good reason, they can make things difficult as they can for you though, i suppose it all depends to what lengths your prepared to go to get it, i was lucky with mine as they were v helpful and had no problems with it, not even been charged for the vets fee yet (fingers crossed lol)


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## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

It is a part of the DWAL problem...because it is mostly local authorities (In NI it is our NI devolved Government), and the minimum and maximum requirements are put into place as and where the LA sees fit(within the Statues layed out by law), there really is no chance in courts.. in fact, what could happen is that a set minimum, higher than most but lower than say, Brum, could be enforced... 

The only solution I can see to this particular problem is a bit of responsible self regulation and help between all the DWA keepers in the UK..have one voice as opposed to many, and be organised enough to help and advise when it comes to getting one and making sure it is as safe as possible. 

Of course, this won't solve the problems,but will maybe help sort out the mess that exists now.


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## __sam69__ (Mar 4, 2008)

alright mate im from birmingham, great barr not far from the queslet. and i used to work in the rep shop on walsal road, tbf like stated your best bet is to move to say walsal its still pretty local and much easier to obtain a liscence. graham who issues the liscences from what ive heard from working in the shop is a complete arse. i dont personally have a DWA due to age, still living with parents etc etc, but when i do get one im pretty positive i wont be doing so living in birmingham. a guy who used to come into the sop who ownd american aligators i think it was had his dwa and lived in walvo if im not mistaken, so you may have to move somewere just out of birmingham like walsal etc to get your liscence tbh..hope that helped


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## aaron lynch (Feb 13, 2009)

cheers mate, thats what im looking into tbh. 
its just frustrating when i know im capable, have the room experience etc and know whats expected and theres just one stubborn jobsworth standing in my way! its for a dwarf caiman or dwarf croc preferably, i know they arent to be underestimated but its not as if i want to keep a tiger in the backyard!


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## __sam69__ (Mar 4, 2008)

aaron lynch said:


> cheers mate, thats what im looking into tbh.
> its just frustrating when i know im capable, have the room experience etc and know whats expected and theres just one stubborn jobsworth standing in my way! its for a dwarf caiman or dwarf croc preferably, i know they arent to be underestimated but its not as if i want to keep a tiger in the backyard!


 yeah its just unfortunate that in our area, the guy who sorts DWA's out is a tw*t


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## R.E.C.S (May 13, 2009)

i used to live in wolverhampton, not birmingham i know.

i applied for a dwa once and after speaking to the dog warden, (the guy who issues the licence, would you belive) i decided not to bother due to the fact they instantly took a dislike to my keeping a caiman, even after i corrected him and told him it wasnt a snake, lol

i have found out since though that it is illeigal for the council to refuse a license if you have all the requirements in place, they cannot simply say you cant have one because i dont like dwa animals for instance.

be thankful you dont live up here in newcastle, upto now the council have NEVER issued a dwa license.


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