# Help! Bearded dragon eyes closed constantly



## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

Hi guys, i bought a 4ftx2ftx2ft vivarium that was full set up, which came with a female bearded dragon, i got this as the vivarium for my adult male bearded dragon was way too small, plus too give him a friend. Inside the vivarium is a reptiglo 10.0, heat lamp and thermostat, reptile sand, some rocks and a bark piece that took the bearded dragons quite close to the uvb light, which concerned me but the female was fine so i didnt think to take it out. My male bearded dragon however took to sitting high up on it and for the past day has had his eyes shut and is not interested in his crickets. Which is worrying. I have removed the bark that he was sat on and turned his light off....is there anyone that can help have i done the right thing? How long should i leave his light off? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
I know there are a lot of people that will probably say you need to take him to a vet asap, but just cant afford to this close to christmas, would have to wait a week anything i can do in the mean time that could help i just want him to be comfortable


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## mrspebro (Mar 6, 2008)

are they in together


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## mrspebro (Mar 6, 2008)

as long as he can get within 8inches from his uv light i wouldn't worry he is probably sulking if you have put a female in with him you will have to be careful they don't breed mine sit as close to the uv as they can get as this is were they get there vitamin Dfrom hope this helps


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

He could get next to it and yes they are intogether : $


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## lizardboy5 (Aug 19, 2010)

let him get withen say 7-8 inches from the uv and he should be fine


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## mrspebro (Mar 6, 2008)

he is probley basking dont worry to much they are very sturdy reptiles i would put his light back on and carry on as normal ,feel free to message me and i will give you as much help as i can ,as you can see i breed beardies


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

So i should leave his light on even though he is hardly opeining his eyes? X


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

If dragons are allowed too close to a UV tube it can damage their eyes and their skin. 10% tubes should be 8-10 inches from the dragon and 12% tubes should be 10-12 inches away. They should not be at eye level.

Males and females are best not kept together also. Repeated mating will stress the female and can have detrimental effects on her health. This can lead to death if nothing is done about it.
When they mate (that is when not if) she will lay a couple of large clutches of eggs. You are going to be up to your ears in babies that all need feeding and housing. This will cost a hell of a lot and you will have difficulty selling them, and possibly even difficulty giving them away.
Also did you quarantine the female?

Bearded dragons do need company as they are solitary. There is a high risk of them fighting. I hope you have a spare set up to put one of them in.


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

that doesnt really answer my question, as much as im grateful for the advice breeding has nothing to do with izzo's eyes, yes she does have her own viv, she is in the smaller one he was in because she is smaller but she never had a problem with vivarium he is in.


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

klyon1989 said:


> He could get next to it and *yes they are intogether* : $


?????

Yes, he should have his lights on, but not now. Look at the time! They should be asleep now!

Follow my advise about distances and the tube not being at eye level and if you are still worried about his eyes, book him in to see a vet.


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

i never said his lights were on ive had the lights turned off since i noticed his eyes, because i didnt want to do further damage!


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

klyon1989 said:


> i never said his lights were on ive had the lights turned off since i noticed his eyes, because i didnt want to do further damage!


You asked if you should leave his lights on! So I have answered! Put his lights on as normal tomorrow, but don't let him get too close. If you are still worried a vet is the best option.


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

the reason i said should i leave his lights on was because someone else adviced me to put them back on, my original message does state that ive already turned them off. thanks for the advice though


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## lee young (Oct 14, 2009)

To be honest its unlikely to be the light unless he's got his face literally touching it 24/7. For the UV levels to be dangerous on a 10.0 tube thats even just a few months old the dragon would need to be within a few cm of the tube.

Could you please supply more info about the setup, temps in the hot end, cool end and basking spot (measured with a good thermometer, not a dial one), humidity, how close exactly was he getting to the basking spot, how long are yourlights on for?

Also, does he have his eyes shut all the time, even when the light is off? is he still active and basking or just lying flat/hiding, how is his feeding now you have seperated them, is he eating veg or livefood or both, or neither, and how close was he to the UV in his old setup?


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

lee young said:


> *To be honest its unlikely to be the light unless he's got his face literally touching it 24/7. For the UV levels to be dangerous on a 10.0 tube thats even just a few months old the dragon would need to be within a few cm of the tube.*
> 
> Could you please supply more info about the setup, temps in the hot end, cool end and basking spot (measured with a good thermometer, not a dial one), humidity, how close exactly was he getting to the basking spot, how long are yourlights on for?
> 
> Also, does he have his eyes shut all the time, even when the light is off? is he still active and basking or just lying flat/hiding, how is his feeding now you have seperated them, is he eating veg or livefood or both, or neither, and how close was he to the UV in his old setup?



Have a chat with Woodrott about it, and Glasgowgeckos.


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## Tarn~Totty (May 4, 2009)

Hi Kylon : victory:

A couple of other things it could be...if you have sand in your viv, it could be that in the eye...or a scratch from the other beardie...or vitamin A issues. Whatever it is, sounds lke a trip to the vets is needed...would your vet be willing to let you pay so much a week on the bill, or pay a deposit then the rest after christmas? (my vet is really good like that). 

If its an infection, it will need treating with antibiotic eye drops...if its vitamin A deficiancey, possibley a vit A injection too. Is there any discharge from the eye, or crusty bits sticking it shut?

It could be any number of things to be honest...could you possibley get some pics and post them so others can see exactly what your set-ups like, and some pics of the beardie too?

What do you dust their live food with? Do they get both calcium powder and vitamin suppliments? What live foods do they eat, and how often? 

You could bathe the eye a couple of times a day in some pre-boiled (and cooled) water, see if that helps at all :hmm:

Sorry if I seem to be pestering with all the questions etc...but the more you can tell us, the more help we can be hun.

Dickvansheepcake gave you a good suggestion mate...pm woodrott and see what he thinks...:2thumb:


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## lee young (Oct 14, 2009)

dickvansheepcake said:


> Have a chat with Woodrott about it, and Glasgowgeckos.


I dont need to have a chat with anyone, ive done extensive reading on it and measured levels with a solarmeter (UVA and UVB)

The only lights that put out dangerous levels of UV (UVA is the one that damages skin and eye tissue if over exposed) are Mercury vapour or metal halide bulbs, and only if the instructions are not followed. Most 10% tubes, even when brand new can not match the radiation levels of a sunny day in the uk, let alone summer sun in the outback.

The 12% ones shouldnt really be closer than 2" to your beardy, but again, only for the first month or two, after which they are completely safe.

As far as I can tell all of the bad press regarding UV and eye/tissue damage originated with a bad batch of MVB bulbs which had a faulty coating on, or from the first types of 'compact' uv bulbs.

I have looked far and wide and found no case whatsoever for eye or tissue damage resulting in desert dwelling creatures such as beardies from anyone using UVB tubes. If anyone has any documented cases from reputable source please let me know, I will be happy to admit I am wrong.

The only real danger with UV tubes is people mounting them too far away for them to be of any use. ar 12" distance a 10% UV tube kicks out between 10 and 30 uW/cm2, whereas midday sun in august in the uk on a sunny day peaks at 330 uW/cm2. This is in the UK, in oz it is much higher, up to 500 uW/cm2 has been recorded in places.

at just 2" away from a brand new 10% tube the reading is still lower than midday aussie sun, and this drops by at least half within the first 3 months of use. 

Bearded dragons like it hot and bright, and they need to be able to get close enough to the tube to absorb the UV to synthesise vitamin D. Telling people to mount UV tubes 12" away form their reps is virtually the same as not having a tube, and the amount of disinformation circling on here isnt helping matters.


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

lee young said:


> I dont need to have a chat with anyone, ive done extensive reading on it and measured levels with a solarmeter (UVA and UVB)
> 
> The only lights that put out dangerous levels of UV (UVA is the one that damages skin and eye tissue if over exposed) are Mercury vapour or metal halide bulbs, and only if the instructions are not followed. Most 10% tubes, even when brand new can not match the radiation levels of a sunny day in the uk, let alone summer sun in the outback.
> 
> ...


I believe I've had this discussion with you before. Woodrott is an extremely experienced and trustworthy keeper and breeder. I am going to have to take his word on this. I gave you links before and you were pointed towards people that could supply you information on correct distances of UV and papers that have been written etc. If Woodrott has had first hand experience with dragons getting damage to skin/eyes through UV being too close then I am going to take his word on it and make sure my UV is a safe distance.
I have no reason to doubt him so will follow his advice.


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## klyon1989 (Dec 14, 2010)

i would like to thank everyone who has given me advice it was all very helpful!
you will be glad to know doing what i thought was right, he had deffinetly been sat to close, so i took the branch out he had been sat on and left his light of for a day to let his eyes heal or readjust and let him have a swim in the bath to encourage him to move and open his eyes this has done the trick!
he has both eyes wide open again and is eating his greens and crickets well now!
if what i did didnt work i would of had him in the vets, but it i am a big panicker best to be safe than sorry! soo glad he is back to his normal self bopping is head and making a mess thank god : )
thankyou alll soooooooo much xxx


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

klyon1989 said:


> i would like to thank everyone who has given me advice it was all very helpful!
> you will be glad to know doing what i thought was right, he had deffinetly been sat to close, so i took the branch out he had been sat on and left his light of for a day to let his eyes heal or readjust and let him have a swim in the bath to encourage him to move and open his eyes this has done the trick!
> he has both eyes wide open again and is eating his greens and crickets well now!
> if what i did didnt work i would of had him in the vets, but it i am a big panicker best to be safe than sorry! soo glad he is back to his normal self bopping is head and making a mess thank god : )
> thankyou alll soooooooo much xxx


Glad to hear he is ok!


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## lee young (Oct 14, 2009)

glad he's doing better now, good to hear. 

Dickvansheepcake, I have heard of numerous problems with geckos and CWD's and things with too much UV, but never with Beardies. I know Woodrott is experienced, and his advice is always helpful and spot on, but I prefer to stick to scientific data and precise measurements when dealing with important things like UV, rather than solely relying on the opinions of other people.

A lot of reptiles dont get enough UV as a result of the tubes being mounted on the roof of 2 feet high vivs, and I was just saying that they need to be able to get close to get the benefits.

Each to their own and all that.


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## dickvansheepcake (Jul 8, 2009)

lee young said:


> glad he's doing better now, good to hear.
> 
> Dickvansheepcake, I have heard of numerous problems with geckos and CWD's and things with too much UV, but never with Beardies. I know Woodrott is experienced, and his advice is always helpful and spot on, but I prefer to stick to scientific data and precise measurements when dealing with important things like UV, rather than solely relying on the opinions of other people.
> 
> ...


Yes, I agree that the tube being 24inches away would be pretty useless! I never said to put it that far away. 8-10 inches for a 10% and 10-12 inches for a 12% is fine though. Personally I don't think it is right for you to say to newbies (this is the newbie section after all) that having a 12% UV 2inches from the dragon is safe, it is a bit ridiculous really. 
Especially when dragons have been harmed from being too close to the UV.
Even in this case the OP has said that the dragons eyes have got better after being moved away from the light.

Each to their own indeed, but I will continue to advise people as I have been doing. Not to put UV too close, or too far away!


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## woodrott (Sep 14, 2008)

dickvansheepcake said:


> Yes, I agree that the tube being 24inches away would be pretty useless! I never said to put it that far away. 8-10 inches for a 10% and 10-12 inches for a 12% is fine though. Personally I don't think it is right for you to say to newbies (this is the newbie section after all) that having a 12% UV 2inches from the dragon is safe, it is a bit ridiculous really.
> Especially when dragons have been harmed from being too close to the UV.
> Even in this case the OP has said that the dragons eyes have got better after being moved away from the light.
> 
> Each to their own indeed, but I will continue to advise people as I have been doing. Not to put UV too close, or too far away!


 
spot on

i dont think i need to add to that statment
as above babys closer than 10" to a 12% tube is asking for trouble


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