# Smallest ray species



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

I'm trying to find out what is the smallest readily available ray.

I've got no idea where to start. My knowledge of rays is good but restricted to motoro and leopoldii (the only ones I keep/have kept)

Got a nice big tank (probably one of the 8 footers). Just want smaller rays for a change. I've got 2 each of my motoro and leos so they are gonna be big guys when fully grown.


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## jenky (Sep 22, 2008)

ide say retic`s and hystrix are a couple of the smaller rays but there hard to find! seen a few hystrix about a good while ago but they were from memebers on other forums.

whats these 8 footers then, as in width? no good being 8ftlong if the 18" wide lol.

you may have a problem when looking for the smaller spieces of rays to be honest, well we always did but that was a couple of years ago now.

ide just keep my eyes open for a nice pair of marbled motoro, orinoco are really nice! or even better some more black rays (if you have the money!).

p14 are the smallest black ray and probably one of the smallest freshwater rays there is. im sure they max out at like 14" disc, but again its finding them to buy them.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

I've got 9 8x3x3's. It's what I grew the motoros up in. They've been moved into the trop pond with the leos now so I got a spare tank.


I did look for marbled motoros for ages. If I'm honest I wanted the rays as soon as possible so bought some normal motoros instead.

I don't want more black rays. I like my two but they are a great little pair as they are and I don't want any possibility of them changing

I'm looking for p14s. I don't see much chance in me finding them though. I'd love some but they sell pretty much as soon as someone knows about them


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## Reaper941 (Mar 21, 2008)

mike515 said:


> I've got 9 8x3x3's. It's what I grew the motoros up in. They've been moved into the trop pond with the leos now so I got a spare tank.
> 
> 
> I did look for marbled motoros for ages. If I'm honest I wanted the rays as soon as possible so bought some normal motoros instead.
> ...


How much room do you have?! I'd love to see pics tbh.


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

i was going to ask you the same thing mike,i dont have the room for them dust bin lids.

reaper not sure if you know this mate, but our mike dont do pics.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

bullet tooth t0ny said:


> i was going to ask you the same thing mike,i dont have the room for them dust bin lids.
> 
> reaper not sure if you know this mate, but our mike dont do pics.


 
that's because Im making it all up remember :whistling2:



anywho, basically they were all in a very well laid out fish room. Now however the glass tanks are mostly in a seperate fish room. with my indoor ponds taking up most of the cellar (the old fish room). I live in an old school that's been renovated. Nice big long building, with an equally big cellar. Well the building was built and they built the land up around the base of the whole house to level out the ground and form the cellar.

Basically I've got 2 brick raised ponds in the cellar. 1 24x12x4 foot one. another 36x18x6. The filtration system is all in the fish room above now though so it gives me some room to work with in there. I've got a 4 foot gangway with a 12x12 area at the far end for storage of stuff and one 8 foot tank that has my fav pair of Dovii in


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## Paul_MTS (Mar 23, 2008)

P. Scobina are the smallest ray getting to about a 12" disc.

All "t-cups" can attain 15-18" disc.

P14's are a very nice one and get to 15"

If you can get your hands on scobina though, they would be well worth breeding. 

Here's my old male, unfortuately he died due to suspected internal problems.


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## xyra (Apr 26, 2007)

Hi,

As has been said scobina are the smallest.
Retics have a small disc, but very long tail (which they are prone to breaking in tall tanks when they climb the walls) so actually need a similar size floor space to a medium sized motoro
Histrix are faily small, but being a brazilian ray true histrix almost never turn up
Histrix sold in shops are almost certainly orbignyi, another fairly small ray that usually attains about 13 - 16" disc, but can get a bit bigger exceptionally
Humerosa are also a small ray topping out at about 14" disc

8x3x3 could breed any of the above

Hope this helps!
Graham


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

just the fun of finding them now lol.

I like the sound of scobina. It's about the size I'd like as well.

anyone got a rough idea of price and where to start my search for them


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## xyra (Apr 26, 2007)

Try contacting this chap:

Home page

He's getting known for being able to get hold of most rays people want.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

cheers for that xyra. sent them an email asking a few bits.

I tried using my normal contacts that I use for cichlids and catfish but no luck.

So yeah, I'm gonna give these guys a go. fingers crossed


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

how much do they go for.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

no idea yet. Im trying to find that out now


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

i would think a high price mate.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

oh yeah, im expecting to dent my bank account quite a bit. got a limit in my head but it's a good sized limit. this will be my last fish for a good time.

There's nothing else I want. I've basically completed my wishlist. This last ray is a recent addition but it's pretty much the last one left


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

mike could you pm a guide price on them.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

I would if I had one mate.

to put it into perspective, my motoros which are a relatively common occurance, set me back 300 for the pair.

My leopoldii which are now stupidly difficult to get hold of, set me back 350 each. Now though you're looking at a good 8/900 for a good sized leo. Rumours of them going for over 1200 are probably not far off. I was offered 1600 for mine as they are a mature pair. These are all mine though lol, if they breed then I'd probably sell them but not for 800, probably around 250-300. Still a fair bit of cash but low enough to spread them to people who want to breed more of these.


As for the species Im looking for I have no idea as to price. I've never seen them before let alone seen them for sale


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

i am still up for a ray or rays.lol


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## Reaper941 (Mar 21, 2008)

bullet tooth t0ny said:


> i was going to ask you the same thing mike,i dont have the room for them dust bin lids.
> 
> reaper not sure if you know this mate, but our mike dont do pics.


Hmmm... Surely if you can afford all these fish, large tanks, etc, etc.

You can get hold of a camera? :Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## xyra (Apr 26, 2007)

Black & other brazilian rays are the expensive ones, as wild caught are almost impossible to find. A breeding pair of blacks (leo, henlei, p14) can sell for many thousands of pounds. Scobina are fraom brazil iirc.

Frank in the netherlands sells his p14 and leopoldi pups for 1250euros each I believe. He;s normally more than happy to help people out as well with advice etc, and might be able to help you find scobina, althought I'm not sure if he has any breeding or not.

Motoro, orbignyi and other white/peruvian rays are a lot less expensive comparitively. You can pick up a nice young motoro for £60 or so, retic for £45+, orbignyi £50ish. Expensive peruvian species can cost a good few hundred pounds, but not often as much as the brazilian species.

This may change, however, with the new export regs from peru (only really affecting L numbers so far, but might get other species later on)

I believe pier aquatics had scobina in a while back. And I understand there are a few people dotted around europe breeding them.

Mike515: no problem, i've not bought from him, but have heard good things. I think he has an international seller forum on MonsterFishKeepers that he is quite active on.


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## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

Reaper941 said:


> Hmmm... Surely if you can afford all these fish, large tanks, etc, etc.
> 
> You can get hold of a camera? :Na_Na_Na_Na:


there are posts of my fish on here.:Na_Na_Na_Na:

plus i am not keen on it cos there is always some prat that always knows better.or they try to put you down.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

Reaper941 said:


> Hmmm... Surely if you can afford all these fish, large tanks, etc, etc.
> 
> You can get hold of a camera? :Na_Na_Na_Na:


 
surely if you can read things on the internet. You can notice that this website is full of twats that have no idea what they are on about and are just out to put other peoples work down.


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## Paul_MTS (Mar 23, 2008)

Danny @ Tropical Imports is a top bloke. He's a good local friend, his fish are top notch and so is he customer service. He'll bend over backwards to please his customers.

I originally got my Scobina from Phil Aspinal years ago for about the £150 mark i think he was but as you can see he was badly scared.


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## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

I had a chat with a mate of mine in holland. He's got a pair of scobina and he reckons the female could be carrying. He said he will hold a couple back but it will cost me an arapaima.

Quite a hefty price. Not from a finnancial point of view. But I've grown really attached to these two guys. I'm not sure if 2 stingray are quite worth the cost.



Still waiting for danny at trop imports to get back to me. Little disappointed to be honest. Maybe he's busy but sending a little email to say he will get back as soon has he has some time doesn't take long


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## Paul_MTS (Mar 23, 2008)

Hey Mike, 

Just showed Danny what you wrote and he says he hasn't received any e-mails for scobinas, so maybe there's been a glitch somewhere!?

His current email address is [email protected]


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