# firs time Feeding ball python Epic fail helppp!!



## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

Ok here we are the usual feeding problem with ball pythons.

I got the ball python on Saturday afternoon its about 1 and half feet to 2 foot max its only 2 years old.

i got 2 mice (medium mice) (about 2 and half inch 3 inch max long)

by the thickness of its body, it looked like it could take it, but im not sure.

anyway when i got the mice home i put them in the freezer.

the guy i got it from said he fed it on Monday, so i thought ill give it a try today (7 days).

i lifted the hide it was in a ball, i stroked it to let it know i was there but it just balled tighter. i eventually lifted it in to a rub box lined with paper for feeding. within a minute it un balled and started to explore.

previously i had the mouse in the fridge over night to thaw slowly. tonight i put it in a plastic bag and the mouse had haemorrhaged from its nose but i thought it was nothing. 
i did the last warm up using warm water but as we know within 1 min or 2 max its going to go cold again. i put it in the rub box with the snake, even tried to wag it in front of it, but it eater backed off or treated it as if it wasn't there, No matter what i did it would not eat it or even consider it

what can i do?
was the mouse to big?
i cant keep the mouse warm long enough for the snake to take an interest.

i just don't know what to try next???

i cant put the mouse in the viv with him, cos he will associate every time my hand goes in that it will be food and may try to bite im toid


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## salukisue (Feb 3, 2010)

*salukisue*

First of all stop panicking and calm down,this is what Royals do, it might not eat for a few weeks.Save your money and only thaw out one mouse a week starting maybe nearer the end of next week,warm the head of the mouse put it in the viv and leave it overnight and leave the snake alone dont keep watching it,it will eat eventually then you will be fine .Im sure others will be along to give more advice good luck


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

salukisue said:


> First of all stop panicking and calm down,this is what Royals do, it might not eat for a few weeks.Save your money and only thaw out one mouse a week starting maybe nearer the end of next week,warm the head of the mouse put it in the viv and leave it overnight and leave the snake alone dont keep watching it,it will eat eventually then you will be fine .Im sure others will be along to give more advice good luck


but im told if i just place the mouse in the viv and not feed it in a rub box or something it will associate my hand going in as food every time and may just bite ???


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## roddy mac (Dec 10, 2009)

yes... leave it more time to settle in

as said take out 1 mouse till it starts eating then the next week try 2 .. royals are great at being fussy eaters


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## roddy mac (Dec 10, 2009)

kaleluk31 said:


> but im told if i just place the mouse in the viv and not feed it in a rub box or something it will associate my hand going in as food every time and may just bite ???


 


use tongs when feedin no your hand


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

roddy mac said:


> use tongs when feedin no your hand


oh i thought it was the actual act of putting food in the viv that the next time i put my hand in the viv to just handle it, it will still think its food time and bite


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

You only got the Royal yesterday & tried to feed it today? I would leave it well alone for 2 weeks, just change the water but don't handle it. Let it settle in. Then offer it a mouse (if it's 2 years old it should be able to handle stuff bigger than mice). Warm the mouse's head in hot water for about 10-15 seconds, Royals detect their food through the heat pits just below their nose. So a mouse that is super hot should spark a reaction from the Royal :2thumb:. When you go to feed it next time just dangle the mouse in front of the hide that the Royal is in, it will detect it & should come out to investigate.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

corny girl said:


> You only got the Royal yesterday & tried to feed it today? I would leave it well alone for 2 weeks, just change the water but don't handle it. Let it settle in. Then offer it a mouse (if it's 2 years old it should be able to handle stuff bigger than mice). Warm the mouse's head in hot water for about 10-15 seconds, Royals detect their food through the heat pits just below their nose. So a mouse that is super hot should spark a reaction from the Royal :2thumb:. When you go to feed it next time just dangle the mouse in front of the hide that the Royal is in, it will detect it & should come out to investigate.


id say it was no longer then about 2 ft long.it manages to curl up in to a ball about (7 inches)

my only concern is what people told me about putting food in the viv, that it would associate my hand going in as food every time even thnough im only going to handle him, so with this he would bite me thinking im food


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## doc281272 (Mar 1, 2010)

Don't worry about it , I picked one up about a month ago and it would'nt eat for the first 3 weeks , its nothing to worry about , its just adjusting to its new surroundings/smells. I personally feed mine in a seperate rub but thats more because I don't want any of them to ingest the aspen/substrate , I used to feed my bullsnake in her viv but that was because she was 4ft long and was a bugger for escaping when you tried to remove the lid to put her rat in , she never went for me in her viv thinking i was food. 
As said , make sure that you warm the mouse/rat up before feeding or there is a good chance that he won't take it. I know he's your new snake and you are hyper worried about him not feeding but this is definately nothing about, I'd leave it till the end of the week now before even thinking about feeding again as you'll probably just end up wasting another mouse , you'll know when he's hungry cos he'll be wandering around the viv trying to find something to eat :lol2:


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## chris2007 (Aug 18, 2010)

Same as above, first of all chill out, leave it alone for a week, only changing water, in 7 days wait till night time as its when they are normally active, stick your mouse in some hot water for a while, then with tongs offer it to your royal, dont just shove it its face, it will soon come searching if its hungry.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

chris2007 said:


> Same as above, first of all chill out, leave it alone for a week, only changing water, in 7 days wait till night time as its when they are normally active, stick your mouse in some hot water for a while, then with tongs offer it to your royal, dont just shove it its face, it will soon come searching if its hungry.


i hear everyone say "warm the mouse" but.... when warming a mouse in water will only keep the mouse warm for about 1 min or so max before its cold again, so...

How do i keep a mouse warm for longer?


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## doc281272 (Mar 1, 2010)

Pets @ Home do tiny little fleece lined jackets that you can put on them :whistling2: 

:lol2: , what I normally do is run the hot tap til the water coming out is just about bareable on your hand , put some into an old jug I have then drop the mouse in , leave it for about 5 minutes so it warms through , take out of the water and roll in kitchen towel to get off most of the water, then offer to snake. Once he starts feeding you'll find that it stops warm for more than long enough , mine usually take it within the first ten seconds of offering - my 09 royal knows the drill now so as soon as he goes into the rub he sits there waiting for me to open the lid again with the mouse :2thumb:

Not sure whereabouts you are in derbyshire but you're more than welcome to come down and watch me feed mine if you'd like :thumb:


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

doc281272 said:


> Pets @ Home do tiny little fleece lined jackets that you can put on them :whistling2:
> 
> :lol2: , what I normally do is run the hot tap til the water coming out is just about bareable on your hand , put some into an old jug I have then drop the mouse in , leave it for about 5 minutes so it warms through , take out of the water and roll in kitchen towel to get off most of the water, then offer to snake. Once he starts feeding you'll find that it stops warm for more than long enough , mine usually take it within the first ten seconds of offering - my 09 royal knows the drill now so as soon as he goes into the rub he sits there waiting for me to open the lid again with the mouse :2thumb:
> 
> Not sure whereabouts you are in derbyshire but you're more than welcome to come down and watch me feed mine if you'd like :thumb:


i live in glossop derbyshire , its the most northerly town in Derbyshire, i can be in another county in 2 miles or less lol


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

*is my set-up correct?*



corny girl said:


> .


Im beginning to wonder if ive set up the viv wrong??

on the left i have a hide under it is a heat mat covered with 3 layers of newspaper.
also on that side is where the basking heat light is pointed

during the day it sleeps on the right side of the viv, which has a hide also just no heat on it.

during the night when i turn off the basking light but leave on the heat mat 24/7 he sleeps under that hide which is on the left side?

in the middle is his water bowl, the water is changed every day.

ive had him over 48, have i set up wrong, will his moment improve?

please advise positions of items and heat please


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

kaleluk31 said:


> Im beginning to wonder if ive set up the viv wrong??
> 
> on the left i have a hide under it is a heat mat covered with 3 layers of newspaper.
> also on that side is where the basking heat light is pointed
> ...



Is your heat mat on a mat or pulse stat? Is the lamp on a dimming stat? To be honest there is no real need for a "basking light", you can just use the mat :2thumb:. My guess is that the warm end is far too warm which is why he stays in the cool end when the light is on & moves to the warm end once you've turned the light off (making it cooler for him). When you have the light & mat on what are the temps like?


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

corny girl said:


> Is your heat mat on a mat or pulse stat? Is the lamp on a dimming stat? To be honest there is no real need for a "basking light", you can just use the mat :2thumb:. My guess is that the warm end is far too warm which is why he stays in the cool end when the light is on & moves to the warm end once you've turned the light off (making it cooler for him). When you have the light & mat on what are the temps like?


see this is where im getting confused with all the advice.

at the moment on the right i have a heat light and a heat matt on the left, the thermometer says about 82.f and when i switch the heat light off at night the temp drops to 62f (heat matt is on 24/7)

the hot end people say 88f
the cold end people say 78f
how am i suppose to control these both at the same time?

i cant control the temp of the cold end without something that makes it eather cold or hot, if i just have nothing at the cold end, then in winter the cold end is going to be quote cold.

the hot end i was going to use a ceramic lamp and set it at 88f, but then people say the total heat should be lower in the night then at day, then that conflicts with the advice or a cold and a warm side.

i want "some light" just to put on during the day and switch off at night to simulate day and night, i was going to use a energy saving bulb cos there dimm, and use the heat light bulb holder/fitting just for the light not a heat light.

at the moment i have a microclimate B1 dimming thermostat coming in the post at the moment, when it arrives ill have a normal habistat temperature thermostat and the microclimate dimming thermostat

i cant buy more things like a better heat matt or a ceramic lamp and fittings because of most peoples advice saying things different that im getting confused

right now im at at a loss what to do


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

kaleluk31 said:


> see this is where im getting confused with all the advice.
> 
> at the moment on the right i have a heat light and a heat matt on the left, the thermometer says about 82.f and when i switch the heat light off at night the temp drops to 62f (heat matt is on 24/7)
> 
> ...




Right i'll tell you how my 08's viv is set up.... She has a 11" x 17" heat mat at one end (connected to a Habistat Pulse Stat), then i have newspaper on top covering the bottom of the viv. She has 2 hides (one warm end & one cool end) a water bowl, a branch & some fake plants. At the moment the only heat she has is the heat mat & the warm end temp is 32.2 degrees C (sorry i don't work in Farenheit). Warm end temps should be between 32 & 34 degrees C. Cool end can be room temp so long as your temps aren't lower than about 24 degrees C :2thumb:. I have a Habistat reptile radiator which i'm hoping to put in her viv soon which will give a better ambient temp, this will be connected to it's own Habistat Pulse stat :2thumb:.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

corny girl said:


> Right i'll tell you how my 08's viv is set up....


Heat radiator are alot of money last i checked and im not that well off lol.

ok this is the plan...
ceramic lamp 100w and fixing with guard, this will be controlled with a microclimate B1 dimming thermostat 600W max.

ive read in a royal python they need "belly heat" especially at night, so i will be getting a 15 x 11 inch heat mat

since the microclimate can take a max load or 600w i will get a double plug and attach the heat mat to it, lamp + mat is only a max of 130w (100 for the lamp, 30w for the mat).

since there both going to be hooked up to the same dimming thermostat in theory the mat will be a belly heat, the ceramic will be the ambient heat, both on the same side. when i turn it down 10f (i.e 32 - 26c)
at night both the heat sources will go down to the same temperature

energy saving light (lowest there is) to just give some light during day time, cos my rooms a bit dark, and i need to simulate day and night for him to.

at the moment i have alight emitting heat bulb, ill get rid of the heat bulb and just use the light emitting holder as just a light source with the energy saving bulb, far as i know its only the ceramic bulb need a special holder/fixings

does this sound ok to you?


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Not sure if you can run the ceramic & mat off the same stat (usually when you run mats off same stat they have to be the same size/wattage). There is no need to drop the temp at night, keep it the same 24/7 :2thumb:. Go on ebay for the reptile radiators (bought mine for £54 :2thumb: with free p+p).


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

corny girl said:


> Not sure if you can run the ceramic & mat off the same stat (usually when you run mats off same stat they have to be the same size/wattage). There is no need to drop the temp at night, keep it the same 24/7 :2thumb:. Go on ebay for the reptile radiators (bought mine for £54 :2thumb: with free p+p).


that's a new one to keep it at the same temp at night as it is in the day. ive never heard that before, so you can see my confusion?

ive seen the same radiator but... i think a mat and ceramic lamp should do the same thing and be cheaper. weather they will work on the same thermostat?? i read the maunual apermently not but not for the reason i thought.

the censor on the termastat measures ambiant temp if using ceramic lamp so has to be free hangling 22cm from lamp
if i used it for a heat mat the heat sensor would need to be on top of the heat mat

so if they where pluged in together i would not get a acurate reading on the mat, so no it wont work lol


HOWEVER i do have a habistat tempriture thermostat, doesnt dimm or anything just maintains the right heat, i Could use that for a mat, but according to the menual the way a ceramic bulb works is the futher away from the bulb the cooler it gets, mean ing if i had it on the left the left would be a hot side and the right would be cool but.... how cool dunno but seems i only need a cermaic lamp and dimming thermostat


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## MissCat (Mar 9, 2009)

Personally I really wouldn't bother with a heat mat at all, particularly when the royal gets bigger as the snake (being heavy bodied) lying on the mat can cause thermal hotspots, in turn leading to burns. 
If you have the heat mat INSIDE the viv, you also run the risk (albeit small) of the mat being faulty, water or urine getting in the mat...and as we all know, liquids and electricity don't mix. I don't recal having ever heard of this happening, mind...but I don't think I could ever have a heat mat INSIDE a viv for that reason. (outside on rubs, none at all in wooden vivs).
They don't need a night time temperature drop particularly either. 

I have a ceramic heater, guarded and on pulse proportional thermostat. The probe is situated on the floor directly beaneath the lamp. Temps are held at a steady 32*c hot end, 25*c cool end, even in winter


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

MissCat said:


> Personally I really wouldn't bother with a heat mat at all.....


i have a microclimate B1 dimming thermostat comming in the post, i read the manual and most of what you said is correct.

it said ceramic lamps work by closer to the lamp the hotter it is, further away cooler it gets.
i know you think well.. duhh yeah lol but im new so be gentle lol

it also says because a ceramic lamp is heating ambiance that the censor needs to be 22cm from the lamp to get a correct temp and that it not be against any side of the viv, but in fact be free dangling from the roof

only if i used a heat mat would the censor come in to contact with the heat source

liqud leaking on the matt?
the mat ive seen are flat and kinda laminated in plastic so kinda waterproof for the most part.
thermal heat trapping?
well if thats true why would heat mats be used at all?? if you put it under a glass tank and on top of that weight is your adult snake, remember the glass tank is prolly 2 to 5mm thick id think a glass tank would cause this heat trapping if anything would


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

btw thank for your advice


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## Alex88 (Oct 9, 2008)

i kind of feel your going slightly OTT on the whole thing. i have 13 royals all in the same style setup, all on mat stats an heat mats, all the snake are healty an feeding twice a week. temp at hot end is 33.c an cool end is a 28.2c. have been rearing these royals for nearly 3 years now an not a single issue. as far as feeding goes i pour boiling water on the defrost rats, let them cool abit then tweezer feed them never putting hands in during feeding. dont be so afraid of a snake taggin you all your going to do is bleed. i have been nipped quite a few times by hot headed royals an boas they coil an realese its funny really. enjoy owning the snake rather than spending hundreds of pounds on fancy top-knoch stuff. thats my opinion any way.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Alex88 said:


> i kind of feel your going slightly OTT on the whole thing. i have 13 royals all in the same style setup, all on mat stats an heat mats, all the snake are healty an feeding twice a week. temp at hot end is 33.c an cool end is a 28.2c. have been rearing these royals for nearly 3 years now an not a single issue. as far as feeding goes i pour boiling water on the defrost rats, let them cool abit then tweezer feed them never putting hands in during feeding. dont be so afraid of a snake taggin you all your going to do is bleed. i have been nipped quite a few times by hot headed royals an boas they coil an realese its funny really. enjoy owning the snake rather than spending hundreds of pounds on fancy top-knoch stuff. thats my opinion any way.



Well put :2thumb:. All this should really of been sorted out before the snake was bought, but all we can do now is try to help the OP get the set up right so the Royal will be happy & therefore feed well :2thumb:.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

kaleluk31 said:


> my only concern is what people told me about putting food in the viv, that it would associate my hand going in as food every time even thnough im only going to handle him, so with this he would bite me thinking im food


I've got two dozen royal pythons.

I feed _every single one_ of them in their viv - because most of them, if I took them out of their enclosures, wouldn't eat at all. 

The whole "associating hands coming in with food" thing assumes that a snake can't tell the difference in smell between "your hand" and "a rat". Honestly, really, they can. Unless your hands smell of rat, in which case a feeding bite is your own fault. And really, it's not the end of the world if you get one - I survived having a near-five-foot adult Colombian Rainbow Boa attach himself to my hand.

It also assumes that you, the human, can't tell the difference between a defensive "leave me alone" strike and a hungry "I'mma eatchu" strike. The snakes I have that will strike at my HAND are not usually trying to EAT it, they're trying to scare it off. This morning I did have a retic try to give me a feeding strike because she was still in feed mode (had just finished her rat) - this is when learning your snake's behaviour and when to keep your hands well out is worthwhile.

I wouldn't have tried to feed your snake for a full week, though....


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## pam b (Mar 3, 2005)

Agree with the above completely.
Take a look at this poll, quite an eye opener.

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/snakes/581018-do-tub.html


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

*the solution*

the reason i could not Sort it out Before i go the snake was because it was a cheap basic set-up with from a home owner who didn't want it any more because _

it wasn't big enough??_ and he added_

"he had boa and such and he likes them that big, is all he told me"_

so i kinda hit the ground running so to speak.


Right it was a big confusing advice at first because alot of people setup there viv differently since im a "noob", i cant help but think ok so... which is the correct answer??? i settled on the solution i was given last night.

i have a microclimate dimming thermostat coming in the post.
i read the manual last night, according the manual if i have a ceramic lamp bulb i put the sencor about 22cm or 9 inches from the heat source, doing it like that creates and hot and then "cooler side" because the futher away from the ceramic the cooler it is.


ill be buying a ceramic lamp/bulb
also of course ill get a guard

Alex88, is what i said sound ok to you?
how are you controlling the heat at the "cold end"?? 

i dont wanna use a heat mat in a wooden vivarium because the advice here i got was that its bad because of these risks of burning the snake Etc... i dont know if its true i can only go off what ive been told, most of the advice ive gained has been from this forum.

last night i was told that to just set up a hot end and let the cooler end go to room temp, how i control what temp goes at the cooler end i dont know. i was also told not to turn it down at night but to keep the constant hot end at 88f (about 32c)

thanx for everyone's help


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

kaleluk31 said:


> ok so... which is the correct answer???


Quite simply, there isn't one  

As long as you achieve the temperatures and humidity you require in a space of the appropriate size and have a snake that eats, sheds and poos correctly, you've got the correct answer.



> how are you controlling the heat at the "cold end"??


If your heater is of the appropriate wattage, your thermostat will control it - basically, you've got the thermostat set to your basking temperature, and if your heater is the right wattage for the space (and this can take some trial and error to get right) your cool end will be kept at the right temperature by the same thermostat.


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## MissCat (Mar 9, 2009)

Also, stop putting yourself down and calling yourself a n00b!
Yes it's your first time, but we've all been there...and it IS all really, really confusing at first. 
Everyone does things differently, has different set ups and different husbandary techniques, most of the time there is no definitive right or wrong (all I and many others can say is what we find works for us). 

Obviously there are some definates, like making sure any heat source is on a thermostat, or heat lamps are guarded etc. But as far as achieving the correct temps goes, it is something that will take practice. 
This is one reason why it is suggested to make sur eit's all set up before you get the snake- obviously you were unable to do so in this case though. 

Best thing to do is just make sure your snake's basic needs are met while you get your head around it. Don't try to feed just yet until you have the set up sorted and its settled in a bit more. And lots of trial and error. 

Steal ideas from the advice you have been given here, try it out, monitor it as closely as you can until you have achieved the desired temp gradient. 

In theory- as long as you have the heat bulb in the hot end, on a thermostat and the probe in the correct place; the heat in teh cool end will also be kept under control. 

Grab yourself (if you haven't already) a couple of cheap digital thermometers from ebay, pop one in each end so you can see at a glance how it's all working out for you. 

Also...I'm sorry if my previous post on your thread sounded a bit...well...mean? Short? I was very tired.


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## Alex88 (Oct 9, 2008)

Agreed, royals are bomb-proof in my opinion, not alot harms them temp wise an there easly corrected problems. I have only had 1 royal being a fussy eater an that was during breeding season...nothing more. The fussy ones tend to be new wild caught but i have never seen one, all the CB (captive breed) ones should feed without an issue. 

Have you ever owned a snake before? I would of said a boa setup is going to be a tad overkill for a royal, anyone else agree?

I have my snakes in RUBS not viv's, as far as feeding goes you will have learn by trial an error. If you need any help everyone is here for you. Pm me if you wanna chat royals an have ANY concerns. Brownie points for you, least you do care for your reptile tho like all new owner an i have been there myself loads of times, its all new an exciting, but let the dust settle an let ur snake settle in an voilar.

Heating isnt usually an issue altho i dont use ceramics at all, i just dont like them i prefer mats. I have only had 2 matts fail, neither went supernova an melted my house down they just blew fuses an i check my mats most days as a result.

Have fun an well done your doing fine.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

Alex88 said:


> Have you ever owned a snake before? I would of said a boa setup is going to be a tad overkill for a royal, anyone else agree?


i haven't got a boa set-up for a royal python.
when the guy delivered the snake and setup, he said that he decided that 
_"ball/royal pythons do grow big enough for him"_
he added
_"He has boas and the bigger pythons in his converted garage and that he prefers them"_


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## Eyeball85 (Jul 21, 2010)

*royal python feeding*

I find if i heat the rat or mouse up with a hairdryer it works a treat,the food is usuall really hot when i offer it and it takes it no problem,never had any trouble feed my royal.:2thumb:


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

Eyeball85 said:


> I find if i heat the rat or mouse up with a hairdryer it works a treat,the food is usuall really hot when i offer it and it takes it no problem,never had any trouble feed my royal.:2thumb:


hair dryer mmm interesting lol ill give it a shot lol


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## heron (Nov 21, 2008)

_Please_ let it rest before trying to feed again. It's not going to hurt it to wait an extra week or so before feeding again.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

heron said:


> _Please_ let it rest before trying to feed again. It's not going to hurt it to wait an extra week or so before feeding again.


thing is, this Sunday coming will be 7 days ive had it but according to the prevous owner he fed it 6 days before i got it. making it this Monday 14 days and no feed.

i darn well hope it eats end of this week.

should i make sure there's no light on when feeding?


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

Alex88 said:


> Agreed, royals are bomb-proof in my opinion......


Should i have the lights off or very little light when feeding day comes? which will be Sunday or Monday coming?


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

kaleluk31 said:


> thing is, this Sunday coming will be 7 days ive had it but according to the prevous owner he fed it 6 days before i got it. making it this Monday 14 days and no feed.
> 
> i darn well hope it eats end of this week.
> 
> should i make sure there's no light on when feeding?


A couple of weeks without food won't do a healthy royal any harm - you are aware that they do occasionally fast *perfectly normally* for months, right?


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

Ssthisto said:


> A couple of weeks without food won't do a healthy royal any harm - you are aware that they do occasionally fast *perfectly normally* for months, right?


well i did notice this morning that it was a bit slow to react, probabbly cos it had been in hiding in the same spot for 2 days straight, even at night it didnt move.

so i moved the log it was under to another warm spot and then just watched.
after about 2 mins it went under one hide, came out and went in the other one.
on monday ill try to feed it it think, ill throw caution to the wind and feed it in its vivarium with some tongs.


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## scubamedic (Sep 7, 2010)

I have had my 2 royals (Male and Female). now 3years old ish. Both initially in a 4ft viv together as that was what I had after my beardie died. Female wasn't doing too well, was eating but sporadic, but got left behind as the male would eat every time he was offered. He was twice the size of her.

So split them up, got 2 x 3ft vivs to allow them to grow. 

She eat every time for months until she got to about 600gs and suddenly stopped for nearly 5 months. tried all sorts. No avail. Problem is she has a back problem and is slightly deformed. Took her to my local reptile shop (repti-lisious) and he has her eating, shedding and pooing well. She is now in a 12 litre RUB with a heat mat at one end with thermostat, a hide at the other ( sleeps on the hide) and a small water bowl the other end. 

One thing I have learnt from Dave at repti-lisious is not to panic with them, as I started to get really worried about my female as she lost weight and the back problem became more pronounced. It is finding what your royal wants and suits them, and trying difference things until they are happy. My female just about fits in one end of the rub but she is happy and is eating twice a week on hot water defrost xl mice and is slowly gaining the weight back. She strikes several times before actually taking the mouse and is quite a grumpy cow. 

Male is in a 3ft viv with a 150w ceramic bulb with guard set at 33 deg C and has now stopped eating his small rats but is 960g so not overly concerned. 

Both have a blue night light but I think that's just a gimmick for my benefit, they just get natural sunlight in lounge, but seldom come out during the day- well except to feed. 

These are my first snakes and despite what people say I don't believe they are beginners snakes in relation to their feeding habits, but they are ideal in relation to size and temperament ( despite my female being a bit of a psycho).

Keep plodding on and persevering.


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## kaleluk31 (Sep 6, 2010)

scubamedic said:


> I have had my 2 royals (Male and Female). now 3years old ish. Both initially in a 4ft viv


i heard 2 things about royal pythons and vivs, some say royals adult are ok in a 3ft viv, some say they should be in a 4ft viv cos they grow thick, sooo... who knows for sure


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## scubamedic (Sep 7, 2010)

I always grew up understanding you needed a viv that was a foot long per foot of snake :?

The way I look at it is " if you ask 10 people their opinions you will get 10 different answers and who is right? ". If half of them say a similar thing then they probably they are on the right tracks. 

Mine male royal is in a 3ft viv and he's more than happy, and he's an adult nearly 4ft in length. Royals don't grow that thick in relation to other pythons and boas.

This works for me and my royal but who says its right. I'm no expert and if I'm not sure I rely on forums or internet, but have received quite a bit of bad info, so I tend to go to someone who had kept royals or bred royals for years, such as a specialised reptile shop.


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