# Never disturb a Tarantula when moulting???



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

Well that's what I have always been told.
Was mooching about on youtube and seen RobC had physically flipped his ?T burgundy as it was moulting upright, then "surgically" removed the moult.
I was always under the impression that you have never to disturb them regardless unless of course there is bleeding from the joints
Anyway, here is the vid, the poor Tarantula looks like a car crash victim IMO
YouTube - Sammy update #3 - Removing her molt surgically!


----------



## jaykickboxer (Feb 11, 2008)

To be fair he's pretty clues up im sure he did it for a reason even if it was just to help people invade a emergency they had to try im sure it lived it's not something I think someone would guess they should try not noing it was safe


----------



## connor 1213 (Apr 6, 2009)

yes but he said that was the only option...to help it (alot) or it will die...so does it not stand a better chance now?


----------



## un4given (Dec 14, 2009)

I do not trust on that guy .... do you know if that T is still alive?


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

un4given said:


> I do not trust on that guy .... do you know if that T is still alive?


He says it is so far, and "update in a few days"
So whose to say it was done for the right reasons, eh? :whistling2:


----------



## dean.tman (Oct 31, 2010)

i watched all these vids was just watchin the vid before i came on here im sure he knows what hes doing he been breeding and keeping t,s for over 20 years if anyone can do a good job like that hes the man


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

Just a question not a criticism to all Rob fans BTW:whistling2:


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

dean.tman said:


> i watched all these vids was just watchin the vid before i came on here im sure he knows what hes doing he been breeding and keeping t,s for over 20 years if anyone can do a good job like that hes the man


Im not disputing the fact he doesn't know what he's doing, I'm just saying I was under the impression never to disturb a Tarantula mid moult:thumb:


----------



## un4given (Dec 14, 2009)

dean.tman said:


> i watched all these vids was just watchin the vid before i came on here im sure he knows what hes doing he been breeding and keeping t,s for over 20 years if anyone can do a good job like that hes the man


You are wrong mate ... he is been keeping spiders over 5 or 6 years and im sure what im saying ... i use to speak with people in Arachnophiles.com and what the americans say is he's too cocky and a bit off a liar when he says he keep t's for that long ... but im not saying he's a newbie im just saying that is wrong, the spiders should moult naturally ... 

Now tell me how she going to get rid of the cephalothorax or the chelicera or even the tovea

that is absolutely wrong ....



Cheers


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

can you not see that he had no other choice ? that Burgundy is one of his beloved spiders, just watch some previous videos...T went through a wet moult and he had no other choice but to help her. RobC is a legend for me and I couldnt care less what people on the arachnophiles have to say as you will always have haters all over the world.

stop judging before you see the end of this story...last update...

YouTube - Sammy update #5 - Had to flip her over!


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

Rob C is knowledgable in some aspects but some of his vids are plain silly. I wouldnt do something so daft for the sake of you tube.


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

selina20 said:


> I wouldnt do something so daft for the sake of you tube.


im pretty sure he didnt do it just for the sake of making a video, but he always documents everything. in the last update you clearly see that spider wasnt in good shape : victory:


----------



## tannia369 (Oct 1, 2010)

i know ROBC from aracnophile.com and i have to say that hes an upstanding person of the T world. hes always good for advice for others and has many many followers on there and youtube. dont be trolls and spout loads of crap if you dont know the man! he had no choice but to help his spider out of that molt, if he hadnt she would have died, and your T dying is not an option for many of us. id sure prefer to help my T's than watch them go through a bad molt and die. get a grip and realise that we all love our T's and would pretty much do anything to help them!!


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

tannia369 said:


> i know ROBC from aracnophile.com and i have to say that hes an upstanding person of the T world. hes always good for advice for others and has many many followers on there and youtube. dont be trolls and spout loads of crap if you dont know the man! he had no choice but to help his spider out of that molt, if he hadnt she would have died, and your T dying is not an option for many of us. id sure prefer to help my T's than watch them go through a bad molt and die. get a grip and realise that we all love our T's and would pretty much do anything to help them!!


Someones slightly touchy today lol. Its a forum where we discuss our views. Not everyone is going to agree.


----------



## un4given (Dec 14, 2009)

rudy691 said:


> im pretty sure he didnt do it just for the sake of making a video, but he always documents everything. in the last update you clearly see that spider wasnt in good shape : victory:


no mate you can't be sure of that!! i still have my opinion ... that guy is too cocky and i believe he just made that to upload a video for everyone to see and say he is a legend like you did... that's what he want and he doesn't care if end up with a disable spider or even a dead one ... that is soooo wrong!!!


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

tannia369 said:


> i know ROBC from aracnophile.com and i have to say that hes an upstanding person of the T world. hes always good for advice for others and has many many followers on there and youtube. dont be trolls and spout loads of crap if you dont know the man! he had no choice but to help his spider out of that molt, if he hadnt she would have died, and your T dying is not an option for many of us. id sure prefer to help my T's than watch them go through a bad molt and die. get a grip and realise that we all love our T's and would pretty much do anything to help them!!


All I know is that when I dissect animals it takes a hell of a lot of concentration, and I wouldn't be talking to a camera if it was so "urgent". 

I personally think the guy is a loose cannon, but then I only study arachnids for a living, so can't compete with some dude on youtube. :roll:

In case you read this an wonder where the hostility arises from, it's because I've seen these discussions time and time again, and frankly those who defend the guy seem to be unswayed in the same manner that Creationists are when shown yet more facts that they are talking rubbish. So, I'm kranky about the subject and get a little irked when people like myself (and those waaaay more informed -I've seen it on AP) get disregarded in favour of some dude that posts videos on the internet.


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

tannia369 said:


> i know ROBC from aracnophile.com and i have to say that hes an upstanding person of the T world. hes always good for advice for others and has many many followers on there and youtube. *dont be trolls and spout loads of crap if you dont know the man!* he had no choice but to help his spider out of that molt, if he hadnt she would have died, and your T dying is not an option for many of us. id sure prefer to help my T's than watch them go through a bad molt and die. get a grip and realise that we all love our T's and would pretty much do anything to help them!!


This is a forum, and one where we debate many issues passionately.. and the beauty of it is this - he, RobC, is free to come here and debate with us, if he so pleases. However, using the primary source, ie his videos, I doubt that he would change many minds.
Personally I don't care.. the exception being when I meet people who seem to think that this is 'the norm', when it absolutely is *NOT*!

Buy hey.. each to there own and all that..


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

GRB said:


> All I know is that when I dissect animals it takes a hell of a lot of concentration, and I wouldn't be talking to a camera if it was so "urgent".
> 
> I personally think the guy is a loose cannon, but then I only study arachnids for a living, so can't compete with some dude on youtube. :roll:
> 
> In case you read this an wonder where the hostility arises from, it's because I've seen these discussions time and time again, and frankly those who defend the guy seem to be unswayed in the same manner that Creationists are when shown yet more facts that they are talking rubbish. So, I'm kranky about the subject and get a little irked when people like myself (and those waaaay more informed -I've seen it on AP) get disregarded in favour of some dude that posts videos on the internet.


:no1::no1::no1::no1:


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

exactly like I said - you're gonna find haters all over the world


----------



## cbmark (Feb 23, 2008)

rudy691 said:


> exactly like I said - you're gonna find haters all over the world


you get it in every hobby someone always knows better than the next person everyone has haters its just life im not saying what he did was right or wrong i like watching his vids seems to know what hes doing then again im a newb :blush:


----------



## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

GRB said:


> All I know is that when I dissect animals it takes a hell of a lot of concentration, and I wouldn't be talking to a camera if it was so "urgent".


Exactly. I only watched part 3, but did he say anywhere how long the T had been attempting to moult upright before he decided he *had* to intervene?
There's been a couple of posts on this very forum in the last few days where spiders have taken over a day to moult, where the posters were told not to panic and leave it alone and the spider still managed it just fine.


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

rudy691 said:


> exactly like I said - you're gonna find haters all over the world


Hate is a strong word. I just dont agree with some of his practices thats all. Afterall we have our own way of doing different things lol


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

garlicpickle said:


> Exactly. I only watched part 3, but did he say anywhere how long the T had been attempting to moult upright before he decided he *had* to intervene?
> There's been a couple of posts on this very forum in the last few days where spiders have taken over a day to moult, where the posters were told not to panic and leave it alone and the spider still managed it just fine.


Iv had several spiders moult upright without the need to intervene. Also if your doing something like that which was such an emergency as people put it why would you grab your camera lol. I find im more nervy around cameras lmao


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Doesn't his wife do the filming? 

But I know what you mean about being on camera, I wouldn't be able to concentrate, I'd have to keep checking my make up. :whistling2:


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

selina20 said:


> Also if your doing something like that which was such an emergency as people put it why would you grab your camera


coz he documents everything so people would know  you dont expect him to write an essay about it ? :lol2:


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

selina20 said:


> Rob C is knowledgable in some aspects but some of his vids are plain silly. I wouldnt do something so daft for the sake of you tube.





GRB said:


> All I know is that when I dissect animals it takes a hell of a lot of concentration, and I wouldn't be talking to a camera if it was so "urgent".
> 
> I personally think the guy is a loose cannon, but then I only study arachnids for a living, so can't compete with some dude on youtube. :roll:
> 
> In case you read this an wonder where the hostility arises from, it's because I've seen these discussions time and time again, and frankly those who defend the guy seem to be unswayed in the same manner that Creationists are when shown yet more facts that they are talking rubbish. So, I'm kranky about the subject and get a little irked when people like myself (and those waaaay more informed -I've seen it on AP) get disregarded in favour of some dude that posts videos on the internet.





selina20 said:


> :no1::no1::no1::no1:


what grb and selina said, these guys are awesome :no1::no1::no1: you 2 simply illistrated that nicely :2thumb::2thumb::no1::no1::no1:


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

rudy691 said:


> coz he documents everything so people would know  you dont expect him to write an essay about it ? :lol2:


So your telling me from watching that vid you would be able to do what he did to save a T??? Its that well documented that you could do that??


----------



## TEENY (Jan 4, 2008)

I ahve had to step in and help a couple of my T's that have had bad moults and they lived after, one of mine had moulted nearly entirely but the moult was stuck around head and fangs, the other mnaged to split thier abdomen a little while moulting in a silly gap.


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

vivalabam said:


> Doesn't his wife do the filming?
> 
> But I know what you mean about being on camera, I wouldn't be able to concentrate, I'd have to keep checking my make up. :whistling2:


:lol2:


----------



## un4given (Dec 14, 2009)

TEENY said:


> I ahve had to step in and help a couple of my T's that have had bad moults and they lived after, one of mine had moulted nearly entirely but the moult was stuck around head and fangs, the other mnaged to split thier abdomen a little while moulting in a silly gap.


So, where's your video TEENY ? :whistling2: LOL


----------



## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

TBH if my blondi got stuck in a moult, filming the rescue op would be the last thing on my mind, a normal moult is worrying enough. I'm glad she moulted in her hide last time and I didn't notice until she was almost done!


----------



## frogbmth (Jan 1, 2010)

You know I have been keeping tarantulas for 20 years now, and I don't pretend to be an expert. But one thing I have learnt. If you post up videos on youtube, you have a huge responsibility to the people watching them. People have been out and spent money on products after watching my youtube videos and not all have been as pleased with them as I have. It makes you realize that youtube is a powerful force.

How many keepers will take scissors to their spiders after watching this? Is this a good thing? I think not.

Andy


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

I've spent the past week dissecting the penises from Harvestmen in order to identify them (the harvestmen, not a penis). _*Cue sig quotes and jokes*_

Joking aside, this is small scale work and it's extremely tricky. OK, so _Oligolophus tridens _is 4-5mm in total bodylength length (penis = 1mm that's a good ratio there lads:Na_Na_Na_Na, and that tarantula is about 10-20x that size. 

However, the interface between the old and new skin of the tarantula is likely to be extremely close, and the "new" skin is as fragile as tissue paper. Barring my objections on how "neccessary" this sort of thing is, If I were to do such a thing I'd sure as hell be working down a steroemicroscope to do so. And before anyone objects about cost and such, I have my own scope that cost £100 in total and ranges in magnification from 10x-120x. I do use a better one in the lab, but I used to ID things on my own scope beforehand so it's not unfeasible and I'd expect that many hobbyists do have at least a magnifying lens, which would make a world of difference even at 5x.

My point is, even if I wanted to film such a procedure to help others, I wouldn't be doing that "by eye" without magnification. And as someone else said, it's all very well getting the legs/some abdomen free, but the rest? 

It's a sad fact that not all arachnids make it through moulting. Perhaps trying to "save" an animal in such dire circumstances (objections aside) might not be the "best" course of action. Additionally, suggesting this as a possible means for other hobbyists is not a great idea in my opinion, because if people rush and try this too quickly, it could kill more than it saves.


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

frogbmth said:


> You know I have been keeping tarantulas for 20 years now, and I don't pretend to be an expert. But one thing I have learnt. If you post up videos on youtube, you have a huge responsibility to the people watching them. People have been out and spent money on products after watching my youtube videos and not all have been as pleased with them as I have. It makes you realize that youtube is a powerful force.
> 
> How many keepers will take scissors to their spiders after watching this? Is this a good thing? I think not.
> 
> Andy


I darent even take nail clippers to my skunks claws lol.


----------



## TEENY (Jan 4, 2008)

un4given said:


> So, where's your video TEENY ? :whistling2: LOL


I did take some pictures of the one that damaged itself, but only to try and understand with help from people on here how she managed it.


selina20 said:


> I darent even take nail clippers to my skunks claws lol.


I use a glass nail file on my dogs nails lol


----------



## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

I've heard him called a liar and a thief, that he stole other people's designs for things and presented them as his own.

He's knowledgeable but prone to hyperbole. Everything has to be _*extreme!!!!!!!!!!!>!!>!111!*_ Who's seen the videos where he's been scammed by someone?... :lol2: I'm not sure whether to laugh, cry or implode in shame _for_ him. Internet tough guys are more sad than threatening.

A personal problem I have with him is less his slightly abrasive method of delivery in his videos and more his somewhat rabid fan base. 



rudy691 said:


> coz he documents everything so people would know  you dont expect him to write an essay about it ? :lol2:


Well for a start an essay might actually have been of some use. Maybe he wouldn't have repeated himself and kept shouting the word "cuticle" at us.

The video taught nothing, it wasn't easy to see what exactly he was doing, no mater how many times he waved a pair of tweezers and a leg at the camera. His explanations were broken and poorly laid out because there was no script or flow.


----------



## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

TEENY said:


> I did take some pictures of the one that damaged itself, but only to try and understand with help from people on here how she managed it.
> 
> I use a glass nail file on my dogs nails lol


I clip my cats' claws with nail clippers, they do not get a choice in the matter :lol2:


----------



## TEENY (Jan 4, 2008)

garlicpickle said:


> I clip my cats' claws with nail clippers, they do not get a choice in the matter :lol2:


I reckon my dog is a bit of a woofter tbh, he loves getting his nails filed lol


----------



## Chromisca (Sep 28, 2010)

I actually summoned up all the courage in my body to watch the youtube video linked (I'm one of the worst arachnophobics you will ever meet, seriously). And the first thing that struck me as odd was that the guy had the spider on his/her back, does this not damage their organs? The other thing was that while the "surgery" was going on, the spider didn't move at all. 

I admit I didn't read the other 3 pages of posts... so sorry if this has already been said... but is it possible he hurt the spider by flipping it over and then preforming his "surgery"? I admit that I loathe, detest spiders, any word you want to use... but at the end of the day, it's still an animal that feels pain. 

And yeah if you couldn't tell, I know absolute squat about arachnids, but do find them a tad bit interesting... even if they scare the pants off of me.


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

TEENY said:


> I reckon my dog is a bit of a woofter tbh, he loves getting his nails filed lol


Lol its hard enough holding the skunk down for 2 mins while you use the clippers. Nail file would take too long


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

GRB said:


> I've spent the past week dissecting the penises from Harvestmen in order to identify them (the harvestmen, not a penis). _*Cue sig quotes and jokes*_
> 
> Joking aside, this is small scale work and it's extremely tricky. OK, so _Oligolophus tridens _is 4-5mm in total bodylength length (penis = 1mm that's a good ratio there lads:Na_Na_Na_Na, and that tarantula is about 10-20x that size.
> 
> ...


So this is what you get upto in your spare time you dirty dirty man :whistling2::whistling2:


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

selina20 said:


> So this is what you get upto in your spare time you dirty dirty man :whistling2::whistling2:


Yeah, it was difficult at first but after some ethanol they kind of just lay back and accept what's going to happen :whistling2::lol2:.


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

GRB said:


> Yeah, it was difficult at first but after some ethanol they kind of just lay back and accept what's going to happen :whistling2::lol2:.


They must be more understanding than most men would be lmao.


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

I do enjoy looking at his vids just to see his fantastic collection and being new to the hobby also to gain some insight and knowledge on this wonderful hobby, I do know lots use him as a knowledge base and regard him Godlike in the hobby, but what's worrying is how may people will now intervene with scalpels and such like just because "RobC did it so it must be OK"?
Personally in this instance I learned nothing from his vid as it was unstructured and poorly explained, or maybe I'm just a tad dim? lol


----------



## Baldpoodle (Apr 18, 2007)

don't like his videos and think him to be a bit of a tool, so don't need to even watch it to know it will be somewhat daft.
just what I think anyway so if you feel feel different thats also ok with me.


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

Baldpoodle said:


> don't like his videos and think him to be a bit of a tool, so don't need to even watch it to know it will be somewhat daft.
> just what I think anyway so if you feel feel different thats also ok with me.


He looks cracked out his face some of the time:lol2:


----------



## 34531 (May 27, 2009)

Sammy died


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

forever_20one said:


> Sammy died


Yeah I saw that, RIP Sammy.


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

forever_20one said:


> Sammy died


I'm not surprised. Poor little thing.


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

GRB said:


> I'm not surprised. Poor little thing.


Me neither.


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

I hope you're last moments were peacefull... NO

and what on earth, what he really means is, i squeezed her to hard on the abdomen and forced pheacies out...

all new found respect for this guy, NONE

fine somtimes a tarantula will get stuck, and will need assistance ok ok i can appriciate that

But dont anyone say he did all he could, because from were im sitting, if all you could do is poke and prod, move her about after she moves into position that suits her, and not him.. plus aparinatly "gently" touching the abdomen to the point of pheacies shooting out, IS unexeptible ..........:bash:


----------



## professorspidy (Jul 12, 2010)

Weather he made the wright or wrong decision to help her is debatable! Personally i would have left it at least a day longer. At the end of the day he thought she was stuck and made the decision to help her and it didn't work out.Maybe if he left her to it she might of pulled through but who knows! I still have 100% respect for him!


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

*He* made the wrong choice, and if anyone asked me what to do in a situation like that, I would tell them, in fact everyone I know, anyone who is published, will tell you.. *let the T do it, and leave them in peace!*
*He* killed it. Not the moult. *Him*. All for a few hits on Youtube.. *for shame!*


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

professorspidy said:


> Weather he made the wright or wrong decision to help her is debatable! Personally i would have left it at least a day longer. At the end of the day he thought she was stuck and made the decision to help her and it didn't work out.Maybe if he left her to it she might of pulled through but who knows! I still have 100% respect for him!



ok debatable. was *pokeing *the spider debatable, was* touching the abdomen with such force, the spider spilled out phecies everywere*, is that debatable. is the fact he wanted the spider to be in the *position HE *felt she should be in, is that debatable... i can go on and on,

so is it debatible ??


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

LeviathanNI said:


> *He* made the wrong choice, and if anyone asked me what to do in a situation like that, I would tell them, in fact everyone I know, anyone who is published, will tell you.. *let the T do it, and leave them in peace!*
> *He* killed it. Not the moult. *Him*. All for a few hits on Youtube.. *for shame!*



:no1: well said


----------



## professorspidy (Jul 12, 2010)

I've read an article in the tarantula keepers guide about helping a T out of a molt which involves surgery! hobbyists have had to do the same thing and been successful! Unfortunately rob wasn't


----------



## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

professorspidy said:


> I've read an article in the tarantula keepers guide about helping a T out of a molt which involves surgery! hobbyists have had to do the same thing and been successful! Unfortunately rob wasn't


Respectfully I have to disagree, to my understanding surgery is for _one or two_ stuck legs, not for stuff like that. And only once the spider's clearly stopped moulting.


----------



## professorspidy (Jul 12, 2010)

Hedgewitch said:


> Respectfully I have to disagree, to my understanding surgery is for _one or two_ stuck legs, not for stuff like that. And only once the spider's clearly stopped moulting.


 Would be
interesting to see what stan would make of it lol! Hopefully he might post!!


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

selina20 said:


> Rob C is knowledgable in some aspects but some of his vids are plain silly. I wouldnt do something so daft for the sake of you tube.


Really, you think I would intentionally kill a T of mine for views...I have 3,000,0000 I really don't care how many I have.....I do nothing for the sake of youtube.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

professorspidy said:


> Would be
> interesting to see what stan would make of it lol! Hopefully he might post!!


I have had dinner with Stan I will ask him! She had quite molting, her citicles had hardened so bad it was cutting into her new exco. I would say she was not getting any further.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

LeviathanNI said:


> *He* made the wrong choice, and if anyone asked me what to do in a situation like that, I would tell them, in fact everyone I know, anyone who is published, will tell you.. *let the T do it, and leave them in peace!*
> *He* killed it. Not the moult. *Him*. All for a few hits on Youtube.. *for shame!*


I forgot....ytiou where there at my house watching this?? If I had done nothing she would have been killed by bleeding out, her legs would have ripped off at the legs. I am glad she did not have to go thru that...she did pass but this was a "wet molt" as you will see in vid 5 & 6 if you know what that is.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

TCBT said:


> I hope you're last moments were peacefull... NO
> 
> and what on earth, what he really means is, i squeezed her to hard on the abdomen and forced pheacies out...
> 
> ...


Are you on something??? I never said that, I said I barely touched her abdomen to see if there was still a pocket in the abdomen, probably have no clue what I am referring to....before taking things out of context please get the facts. I moved her legs to make sure the new cuticles where in a position so she could stretch much easier....how would moving her legs benefit me in anyway!!!!! Learn how to spell feces before you criticize me!!


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Really, you think I would intentionally kill a T of mine for views...I have 3,000,0000 I really don't care how many I have.....I do nothing for the sake of youtube.


no one is saying you killed a spider for the sakes of youtube, but what everyone well most is saying is, what you did is rightfully questionable...

i can see you felt the need to intervene, but and its a big but at that,

what bugs me is, (and i mean alot) which made me lose all respect for you was, was there any need to keep poking her about like you did ?? or was that frans idea, considering fran needs to learn also that he is not god, and he doesnt no everything, nor do you, i or anyone else so i am curiouse also to how many opinions you took on board before taking such actions...

im not in anyway trying to start an argument here rob, but i think someone had miss lead you, or miss lead your self maybe helping her strip of the old skin was neccesary, but she had a wet molt, was this even considerd before taking actions ?? was everything thrown in the air before taking actions, its good to question it, and as a fellow hobbyist, i no you were looking out for the interest of your spider, but were you going by what fran said,


----------



## professorspidy (Jul 12, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I have had dinner with Stan I will ask him! She had quite molting, her citicles had hardened so bad it was cutting into her new exco. I would say she was not getting any further.
> 
> image


 Hi rob,
Well, in my opinion you did a vey good job in removing her molt! I'm sorry she didn't make it!
Chris


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Pinkytoes said:


> I do enjoy looking at his vids just to see his fantastic collection and being new to the hobby also to gain some insight and knowledge on this wonderful hobby, I do know lots use him as a knowledge base and regard him Godlike in the hobby, but what's worrying is how may people will now intervene with scalpels and such like just because "RobC did it so it must be OK"?
> Personally in this instance I learned nothing from his vid as it was unstructured and poorly explained, or maybe I'm just a tad dim? lol


Then why watch? I stated in every single video that this should not be attempted, just for that reason - so no one would just think "well he tried it, I will too". You guys weren't there, you have no idea what was happening. The videos were taken over 30 hours of time....it's not like she sat there for 15 min and I cut her out. She didn't progress for nearly a day before I attempted to remove the exo that was drying and cutting into her new exo. I did what I personally thought was best to attempt to save a pet I cared deeply about - you weren't there, it's wasn't your decision and I'll stand by my decision.


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I forgot....ytiou where there at my house watching this?? If I had done nothing she would have been killed by bleeding out, her legs would have ripped off at the legs. I am glad she did not have to go thru that...she did pass but this was a "wet molt" as you will see in vid 5 & 6 if you know what that is.



please do not judge my ability rob, anger is an ugaly enemy, .. out of context im sorry, but out of ignorence maybe....

i know what a wet molt is, i am knowledgeable of that, but if you, are willing to take the time, i would like you to im me


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

TCBT said:


> no one is saying you killed a spider for the sakes of youtube, but what everyone well most is saying is, what you did is rightfully questionable...
> 
> i can see you felt the need to intervene, but and its a big but at that,
> 
> ...


Everything I did was what I considered to be in the best interest of my pet. As I've stated, you guys weren't there...I did ask several others for advice on how I should proceed and took their opinions into consideration when deciding how to go forward. I didn't take the decision lightly, as many seem to imply. She was stuck, period. As for it being a wet molt, that wasn't determined at that point so I went forward with what I thought was the best action. It's really easy to sit in front of your computers and judge someone when you weren't there, you have no idea how it felt to watch a beloved pet appear to suffer and try to determine if you should intervene in some way or just end it for her? I'd like to see you all get bashed about just for attempting to do something. If I had ended for her and reported that that is what happened, I'd have gotten bashed for that as well. Had I let her sit there and slowly die without attempting to help, I would have gotten bashed for that too. There's no winning with people who sit in judgement. At least I know in my heart that I did all I could.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Pinkytoes said:


> Well that's what I have always been told.
> Was mooching about on youtube and seen RobC had physically flipped his ?T burgundy as it was moulting upright, then "surgically" removed the moult.
> I was always under the impression that you have never to disturb them regardless unless of course there is bleeding from the joints
> Anyway, here is the vid, the poor Tarantula looks like a car crash victim IMO
> YouTube - Sammy update #3 - Removing her molt surgically!


That is the case, as I stated in each and ever video...never mess with a molting tarantula. But there are always exceptions to every rule and this one, to me, was an exception. She wasn't molting any longer - she didn't get any further in her molt and was clearly stuck. At that point I decided to intervene when most would have simply put the tarantula into the freezer and called it a loss. It was a very last resort and shouldn't be attempted unless nothing else can be done short of killing the T.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Pinkytoes said:


> He says it is so far, and "update in a few days"
> So whose to say it was done for the right reasons, eh? :whistling2:


So what reason did I do it for? Reviews? Attention? I don't need or want more attention....never asked for any and don't care if I get any. I honestly did what I thought was best. Judge if you want, you all seem to enjoy it quite a bit.


----------



## Jay<3Jess (Sep 13, 2010)

Looks like I've missed a good debate haha. Must say Rob C can keep me up for hours watching his videos. His tutorials are great as far as I am concerned and given me some ideas for my T's. But there is a question to ask... Judging on my past with forums, people make fake accounts. So, is this actually Rob C? - Don't take to an offense if it is


----------



## GazP19 (Aug 26, 2010)

I think what he did was right, my opinion.

Fact is, was recorded over the past few days as he said, however i think it shouldnt have been recorded or even uploaded.

i think intervening was right, after all, without assistance would she have died? yes. so in an attempt to save something he cares about, he attempted to save sammy.

the only thing i disagree is he uploaded the video's. i would have kept it to myself. (within reason, i know he asked other peoples opinions)

thing is, if he had of saved her after doing all this, would you be slating him or praising him?

if he had of not intervened and she died, how do you think that would make him feel?

i would do anything and everything to save one of my pets. even if its against all the so called guidelines. 

it was worth a try, and i'm sure same position, he would do it again.

that's my opinion


----------



## TCBT (Jul 11, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Everything I did was what I considered to be in the best interest of my pet. As I've stated, you guys weren't there...I did ask several others for advice on how I should proceed and took their opinions into consideration when deciding how to go forward. I didn't take the decision lightly, as many seem to imply. She was stuck, period. As for it being a wet molt, that wasn't determined at that point so I went forward with what I thought was the best action. It's really easy to sit in front of your computers and judge someone when you weren't there, you have no idea how it felt to watch a beloved pet appear to suffer and try to determine if you should intervene in some way or just end it for her? I'd like to see you all get bashed about just for attempting to do something. If I had ended for her and reported that that is what happened, I'd have gotten bashed for that as well. Had I let her sit there and slowly die without attempting to help, I would have gotten bashed for that too. There's no winning with people who sit in judgement. At least I know in my heart that I did all I could.


IM me rob please read my IM, in this forum we do not do this, this way we go personal and sort it via IM, iv sent you one, and will not reply on this board anymore, so please

inbox me


----------



## Jay<3Jess (Sep 13, 2010)

If he does his videos for attention he does them well. He has already stated in most of his videos he does it to educate. I don't agree nor disagree as I don't have a clue. But the things that makes me lol is.. Most people said here he's done it for Youtube. Why? He done it for his views to educate them. :S


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

un4given said:


> You are wrong mate ... he is been keeping spiders over 5 or 6 years and im sure what im saying ... i use to speak with people in Arachnophiles.com and what the americans say is he's too cocky and a bit off a liar when he says he keep t's for that long ... but im not saying he's a newbie im just saying that is wrong, the spiders should moult naturally ...
> 
> Now tell me how she going to get rid of the cephalothorax or the chelicera or even the tovea
> 
> ...


Oh the folks on Arachnophiles think I'm cocky? Odd...they've never said that to me...but then I'm half owner of the site so maybe they are intimidated. Yeah, right. Anyone who really knows me, truly knows me in person, knows I am not the slightest bit cocky or arrogant. I'm just a regular guy....nothing special. And you personally know how long I've been keeping tarantulas? Wow...I haven't even been on the internet for 6 years so how do you know this? Have you been stalking me?? That's just creepy. And to tell you the truth...it's closer to 22 years...but you know, I must be lying since I do that all the time. LOL


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

un4given said:


> no mate you can't be sure of that!! i still have my opinion ... that guy is too cocky and i believe he just made that to upload a video for everyone to see and say he is a legend like you did... that's what he want and he doesn't care if end up with a disable spider or even a dead one ... that is soooo wrong!!!


You don't know me so where are these judgements coming from? We've never met that I'm aware of. Jealous much? Least that's what it sounds like. I make and upload videos to help educate others. I answer 200+ emails a day to help those that contact me through the boards or youtube. If I was that cocky, would I honestly care about spending my time answering all of those? I do have a wife and kids, I could spend more time with them but they are in this hobby too and care just as much about helping others. My wife helps me answer the messages at times since there are so many and she shoot all of the videos. Cocky is one thing I am not....if you truly knew me you could ask my friends but you don't know me or them. You see something in my videos and think you know me. Don't confuse the two.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

garlicpickle said:


> Exactly. I only watched part 3, but did he say anywhere how long the T had been attempting to moult upright before he decided he *had* to intervene?
> There's been a couple of posts on this very forum in the last few days where spiders have taken over a day to moult, where the posters were told not to panic and leave it alone and the spider still managed it just fine.


The couple of posts are correct, do not intevene just because it is taking long. I had a MM molt upright and it took 30 hours, he had a piece of booklung stuck at the very end and I removed it...took about 30 seconds.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

frogbmth said:


> You know I have been keeping tarantulas for 20 years now, and I don't pretend to be an expert. But one thing I have learnt. If you post up videos on youtube, you have a huge responsibility to the people watching them. People have been out and spent money on products after watching my youtube videos and not all have been as pleased with them as I have. It makes you realize that youtube is a powerful force.
> 
> How many keepers will take scissors to their spiders after watching this? Is this a good thing? I think not.
> 
> Andy


Why would they, I didn't use any??? If you really think people will start just cutting T's out of molts because of my vids....well yopu have more problems than I would like to address......WOW!


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Baldpoodle said:


> don't like his videos and think him to be a bit of a tool, so don't need to even watch it to know it will be somewhat daft.
> just what I think anyway so if you feel feel different thats also ok with me.


At least you are honest? And not childish, I can respect that.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

LeviathanNI said:


> *He* made the wrong choice, and if anyone asked me what to do in a situation like that, I would tell them, in fact everyone I know, anyone who is published, will tell you.. *let the T do it, and leave them in peace!*
> *He* killed it. Not the moult. *Him*. All for a few hits on Youtube.. *for shame!*


I killed for youtube hits???? Are you okay???? the 5,000 hits is really gonna make a difference on the 3,000,000...sure!!! I did not kill this T and if you knew or do know anything about a T you know that for a fact....I think you are the one that wants the attention.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Jay<3Jess said:


> Looks like I've missed a good debate haha. Must say Rob C can keep me up for hours watching his videos. His tutorials are great as far as I am concerned and given me some ideas for my T's. But there is a question to ask... Judging on my past with forums, people make fake accounts. So, is this actually Rob C? - Don't take to an offense if it is


Yes it is, i was notified by a member here that this was going on. no offense my friend.

I tried to use the name robc but is was already taken LOL!


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

TCBT said:


> no one is saying you killed a spider for the sakes of youtube,


Funny, it has been mentioned a couple of times???


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

BTW I am posting so much to get my post count up because I also want attention here....


----------



## aussiesk8 (Apr 28, 2009)

These threads are part of the reason why i barely post on forums. Personally i enjoy Robs videos and his videos are part of the reason i got into T's.

Its unfortunate what happened to the T regardless of what actions were taken. I feel it is up to the owner to decide the best course of action to take based on his/her experience. It is very easy to say woulda shoulda coulda in hindsight

Andy


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

*here is one of the cuticles that caused her legs to get stuck:*




















*Here a fe w pics of her molting, far as she ever got:*


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Here are pics of her 2 molts before this and leading up to it.

*Here are pics from 2 molts ago:*



















*Present pics:*


----------



## Hedgewitch (Feb 12, 2008)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Why would they, I didn't use any??? If you really think people will start just cutting T's out of molts because of my vids....well yopu have more problems than I would like to address......WOW!


Of course people will. Like it or not your videos are rather influential, especially amongst the less knowledgeable T keepers I expect. The fact that you keep saying people shouldn't be doing that while giving vague explanations of what you're doing means people _will_ try it. 

Regrettably it will most likely be exactly the people who definitely shouldn't be trying it, people who don't know when they should or shouldn't be intervening.

If you honestly think people won't try it because you said they shouldn't and that it's a last resort then I'm afraid that, as much as you know about tarantulas, you have much to learn about people.

Also, freezing apparently isn't the humane way to dispatch inverts. A brick is a kinder death.

_Edit: You keep mentioning "cuticles"... to my understanding the cuticle is just the exoskeleton. _


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Hedgewitch said:


> Of course people will. Like it or not your videos are rather influential, especially amongst the less knowledgeable T keepers I expect. The fact that you keep saying people shouldn't be doing that while giving vague explanations of what you're doing means people _will_ try it.
> 
> Regrettably it will most likely be exactly the people who definitely shouldn't be trying it, people who don't know when they should or shouldn't be intervening.
> 
> ...


Okay but they would I am sure ask someone before attemting this...I asked 6-8 people before proceeding? I agrer with the brick (it is instant) freezing...nope!!


----------



## Mutley.100 (Nov 3, 2008)

Not too sure I'd of done it but I wasn't there , but fair play to you for trying and good for you for coming on here and facing your detractors .


----------



## Annihilation (Nov 2, 2009)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Okay but they would I am sure ask someone before attemting this...I asked 6-8 people before proceeding? I agrer with the brick (it is instant) freezing...nope!!


 I really think you did the right thing. If any of my animals was struggling with anything i'd definitely try and help.

Its just like me say helping my snakes shed.... bathing them after and whatnot.

So well done mate, you did the right thing and no one really has the right to say it was wrong or a cocky thing to do, iv watched many of your videos and theyve helped me a lot so thanks. :no1:


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

glad you came to the boards Rob. You did what you could, its easy for people to throw shit at you as they weren't there and they can't say that they wouldn't do the same. Your videos got me into this hobby and you clearly care for all your T's and I can say it's not a money making business for you only


----------



## Peacemaker1987 (May 21, 2009)

Same here



aussiesk8 said:


> These threads are part of the reason why i barely post on forums.


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

Good to see you joined Rob, in the end. 

My thoughts still stand however; even a hand lens would have been a "must" for me; they only cost about £4-10 and if you had 30hrs of work on her then it seems a sensible buy.


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Then why watch? I stated in every single video that this should not be attempted, just for that reason - so no one would just think "well he tried it, I will too". You guys weren't there, you have no idea what was happening. The videos were taken over 30 hours of time....it's not like she sat there for 15 min and I cut her out. She didn't progress for nearly a day before I attempted to remove the exo that was drying and cutting into her new exo. I did what I personally thought was best to attempt to save a pet I cared deeply about - you weren't there, it's wasn't your decision and I'll stand by my decision.


Re-read again what i put..."I enjoy watching robs videos" THAT is the reason I watched it:whistling2:


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

Good to see you on here Rob, and I hope that you will knock around, and add your opinion to the many.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

LeviathanNI said:


> Good to see you on here Rob, and I hope that you will knock around, and add your opinion to the many.


I think there are some good people here and I would like to see how things are done across the pond if different.....if we all share knowledge we will all learn!


----------



## phil7870 (Nov 11, 2009)

i enjoy your videos and i think it takes a man to admit when something went wrong ,alot of people who are known to be knowledgeable about T's or reptiles would try to hide the fact that one of there animals has passed away (im not saying they all do just some ) . sorry to hear she passed and i think you done the right thing because imo you had a good idea what was going on a what to do along with whom ever you where in contact with . to the people who are saying it was the wrong thing to do '' would you prefer to let your T die in a molt or atleast try something ?''


----------



## jaykickboxer (Feb 11, 2008)

Good to see u on here u have a quality collection im sure what u did was right just unfortanate


----------



## azza100 (Apr 11, 2010)

i too watch all your vids rob and have learnt a lot, your enclosures are awesome!!. good to see you on here and my condolences about sammy


----------



## cbmark (Feb 23, 2008)

welcome to rfuk rob :no1:


----------



## alspider (Jul 19, 2009)

.......... i thought the invert section was nice,with educated debates between knowledgeable people unlike the rest of the forum (out to kill):whistling2: this thread seemed to be a bit more nasty than the usual.


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

alspider said:


> .......... i thought the invert section was nice,with educated debates between knowledgeable people unlike the rest of the forum (out to kill):whistling2: this thread seemed to be a bit more nasty than the usual.


95% of the time it is exactly as you describe.. however some things get people rattled, and this does spill onto the forum. It is a rare occurrence here, which is the way I am sure people want it to remain..

Edit - I should apologise to Rob btw, as I did strongly insinuate that he did it for youtube.. this I now know to not be true, and I have apologised in person for that.


----------



## Paul c 1 (Sep 30, 2009)

It wasn't too bad,....i've seen a lot worse, to be honest there were some very fair points from both sides,.. people are allowed an opinion.

what does make me chuckle is how perfectly sane and pleasent people turn into rude, ranting and raving idiots as soon as they log onto the internet and they get their hands on that keyboard, it's the same with any online forums; ordinary people feel somewhat empowered and free to say what they want with their "online" identity because they wouldn't get away with it in the real world!

-P


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

Sure.. we are only human, and Rob knows who I am


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

Paul c 1 said:


> It wasn't too bad,....i've seen a lot worse, to be honest there were some very fair points from both sides,.. people are allowed an opinion.
> 
> what does make me chuckle is how perfectly sane and pleasent people turn into rude, ranting and raving idiots as soon as they log onto the internet and they get their hands on that keyboard, it's the same with any online forums; ordinary people feel somewhat empowered and free to say what they want with their "online" identity because they wouldn't get away with it in the real world!
> 
> -P


I'm like that, talk loads online but I'm the most shy person ever in real life. :lol2:


----------



## Poxicator (Nov 14, 2007)

Im quite embarrassed by this thread. I read it early when it was just 2 pages but its descended into lots of negative stuff.

What is it with us as humans that enjoy being judge and jury on someone that has provided so much aid and so much visuals. I take RobC for what he is, someone who wishes to share his experiences, good and bad. Some of the videos are amazing to watch (eg. P. metallica laying eggs), some are inspirational (watering the multitude of GBB slings) and others are shocking (Pokie bites). This particular video had me questioning enough to watch all three. Its not something I would attempt but having seen it I now know its a possibility. However, to put it in perspective its got to be the last straw, not the first option.

We don't have to agree with everything we see, but nor do we have a need to condemn it. I agree that anyone that sets himself up on YouTube can be a target but its a failure in ourselves if we decide to shoot arrows at it. Surely this part of our character should be curtailed.

Rob, its good to see you on here, its good to see that you made an attempt at trying to keep alive what you hold so dear. I hope you'll find more relaxed threads on here and hopefully be encouraged by more civil and informative threads.


----------



## Mutley.100 (Nov 3, 2008)

Poxicator said:


> Im quite embarrassed by this thread. I read it early when it was just 2 pages but its descended into lots of negative stuff.
> 
> What is it with us as humans that enjoy being judge and jury on someone that has provided so much aid and so much visuals. I take RobC for what he is, someone who wishes to share his experiences, good and bad. Some of the videos are amazing to watch (eg. P. metallica laying eggs), some are inspirational (watering the multitude of GBB slings) and others are shocking (Pokie bites). This particular video had me questioning enough to watch all three. Its not something I would attempt but having seen it I now know its a possibility. However, to put it in perspective its got to be the last straw, not the first option.
> 
> ...


Well thought out and written Pete . I too read this early on but I decided to let the kiddies get on with it .


----------



## kingcobra (Jul 27, 2005)

a spawn of satan? an angel descended? as usual an element of polarisation of opinion is evident,hardly surprising with the subject, myself? i am trying to remove a rather uncomfortable fence post from my rectal area:blush:


----------



## Dr3d (Jul 31, 2010)

Poxicator said:


> Im quite embarrassed by this thread. I read it early when it was just 2 pages but its descended into lots of negative stuff.
> 
> What is it with us as humans that enjoy being judge and jury on someone that has provided so much aid and so much visuals. I take RobC for what he is, someone who wishes to share his experiences, good and bad. Some of the videos are amazing to watch (eg. P. metallica laying eggs), some are inspirational (watering the multitude of GBB slings) and others are shocking (Pokie bites). This particular video had me questioning enough to watch all three. Its not something I would attempt but having seen it I now know its a possibility. However, to put it in perspective its got to be the last straw, not the first option.
> 
> ...


 
I'm with you on that  could'nt agree more to be fair!!!


----------



## sage999 (Sep 21, 2008)

I stayed out of this one until now because it was starting to descend into nothing more than a character assassination which is something I loathe. There have been some good replies where differing views have been put across in a mature way but these have sadly been overshadowed by several truly cynical posts.

What we all must realise is that this hobby like many others is very subjective, in other words we all do many things in different ways but to the same end. 

Its easy to sit at a keyboard and throw abuse at someone you are never likely to meet who is hundreds or in this case thousands of miles away. I was truly appalled at the suggestion that Robc was killing his pet for the sake of a few more hits. I just hope that the fact that he has come on here to explain his reasoning for doing what he did will now calm this thread down.

Paul.


----------



## Corsetts (Dec 8, 2008)

kingcobra said:


> a spawn of satan? an angel descended? as usual an element of polarisation of opinion is evident,hardly surprising with the subject, myself? i am trying to remove a rather uncomfortable fence post from my rectal area:blush:


Beautifully put :no1:


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Interesting thread with lots of divided views. Chucking my own tuppence in though :whistling2:

I'm new to the hobby and have to admit - after the initial WOW of watching some of his vids on YouTube I came to the opinion that Rob is a bit of a sensationalist tool. I have no doubt that he cares for his T's but the level of bravado (which borders on disrespect in my view) when he is filming does nothing positive for me as a newcomer to the hobby. In his defence however he's come on to answer his critics.

I'm personally not interested in chasing my 12 inch T all around the invert room just to show people nor am I interested in videoing my feisty new Singapore Blue who is rightfully pissed off because I've had it out on a log taking pictures of it for ages and then showing off it's threat pose whilst trying to co-erce it into a cup.

Painful as it may be, animals die for one reason or another and some are more easy to offer intervention to than others. Removing a wet moult needs more than domestic grooming products - after all, I doubt we'd tackle removing gallstones from a cat with a pasta strainer and a stanley knife never mind video the process. Exaggeration I know but what I have seen of the video in question leaves me thinking that ultimately nature has it's order of things and sometimes we have to let it take its course.

On a more personal note - Robs videos have done nothing to alleviate my partner's fears of T's - especially when she realised I had a Singapore Blue coming. I fear however that YouTube is all about the sensationalist in any hobby and he is just playing to a crowd :whistling2:


----------



## Dr3d (Jul 31, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Interesting thread with lots of divided views. Chucking my own tuppence in though :whistling2:
> 
> I'm new to the hobby and have to admit - after the initial WOW of watching some of his vids on YouTube I came to the opinion that Rob is a bit of a sensationalist *tool*. I have no doubt that he cares for his T's but the level of bravado (*which borders on disrespect in my view*) when he is filming *does nothing positive for me as a newcomer to the hobby*. *In his defence however he's come on to answer his critics*.


Sensationalist LoL what American is'nt.... It's a Trate of american people long before Rob came along!!!!! America Saves the World!!! It comes with the personality, which Rob has a big one!! does'nt mean it's a bad thing!!!

Can you define Tool for me in this context ?? please

Why does his level of "bravado" border on disrespect in your View ???

why does his filming do nothing positive for you as a Newb to the Hobby??

I wonder how many would be flaming him to his face or instead sucking up to him.... Easy to rip someone apart on the forums hey!!!





fatJock said:


> *I'm personally not interested in chasing my 12 inch T all around the invert room just to show people* nor am I interested in videoing my feisty new *Singapore Blue who is rightfully pissed off* because I've had it out on a log taking pictures of it for ages and then showing off it's *threat pose* whilst trying to co-erce it into a cup.


 
What 12" T is this you have ??
I would say when you have 50+ pms a day if not many more with people asking you repeatedly to please get out a spider so they can see it in the flesh.... Wonder if you would personally be interested in letting people see ??? He has a massive client an friend base..... He is also going to great extremes to provide the videos you dont care to see..... and whats wrong with showing a threat pose ??? Singapore blues are pissed off at the slightest vibration its in there nature....




fatJock said:


> Painful as it may be, animals die for one reason or another and some are more easy to offer intervention to than others. Removing a wet moult needs more than domestic grooming products - after all,* I doubt we'd tackle removing gallstones from a cat with a pasta strainer and a stanley knife* never mind video the process. Exaggeration I know but what I have seen of the video in question leaves me thinking that ultimately *nature has it's order of things and sometimes we have to let it take its course*.


nope you would'nt youd take it to a VET correct ??? so taking the T to a Vet hmmmm wonder how many vets would know any more than Rob himself really ??? 

True nature does have its order of things, forget Rob here but how much do Humans mess with Nature!!!! The guy is trying to stop his T from dieing.. He filmed it on the off chance this turned out good, if it did and the spider lived it would be more evidence into the spider world.... Yes there are some real knowledgable people out there with regards to Tarantula's try getting hold of one when you have a problem with a T...

I keep getting told there is very little known in the spider world even to date... People like Rob who use places like youtube or any other P2P network to push information out there are doing GOOD!! sometimes it doesnt work out..... sad loss...some times it works out happy days!!!





fatJock said:


> *On a more personal note - Robs videos have done nothing to alleviate my partner's fears of T's* - especially when she realised I had a Singapore Blue coming. I fear however that YouTube is all about the sensationalist in any hobby and he is just playing to a crowd :whistling2:


I wouldnt think it was Robs job to alleviate your partners fears... that job is up to you... and if your partner has issues with it, why would you go and buy one..... it's your fault she is frightend!!!

And yeah his videos play to a croud, a very big croud.... He has confidence with what he does this doesnt make him a player!!!!


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

You're sitting here saying what he does is great, "putting it out there" - these guys are "putting stuff out there" too:

The Institute for Creation Research

All spiders should be banned 'coz they're evil bastards | Facebook

But hey, it's out there at least so let's give them kudos for filling the internet with yet more crap that misleads people. Don't dare throw a word against them however, otherwise you're just "a hater" or "cynical" or "jealous". :roll: That certainly seems the way this thread reads to me anyway. It might well be on the internet, but welcome to the biggest wheelie bin for non-peer reveiwed material of all time. My posts included!

Everyone has opinions. They are allowed them, it's an internet forum. And no, not everyone has to be nice and everyone's best pal. I though the move was going to fail as soon as a I saw the lack of even a hand lens, proper fine forceps and he was yakking to the camera. I dislike the style, and over-exaggeration. I hate false "excitement" - be factual, or don't. Don't try "jazz up" the biology of these amazing animals with buzzwords and by saying beautiful every 2 seconds. Although, maybe I am misreading the guy and he might just know his audience really well, and is simply giving them what they want.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Dr3d said:


> Can you define Tool for me in this context ?? please


I don't really think that needs defining.



Dr3d said:


> Why does his level of "bravado" border on disrespect in your View ???


You only have to see his Pokie bite video to see that. It's a personal view that although we keep T's that doesn't mean we should disrespect them by taking them out of their own comfort zone just for our own (or others) amusement.



Dr3d said:


> why does his filming do nothing positive for you as a Newb to the Hobby??


As a newcomer to the hobby his filming has done nothing for me, again - a personal view, other than be sensationalist.



Dr3d said:


> I wonder how many would be flaming him to his face or instead sucking up to him.... Easy to rip someone apart on the forums hey!!!


I've hardly ripped him apart and would be as willing to express *my own personal opinion* to his face.



Dr3d said:


> What 12" T is this you have ??


None as yet but I have an Avic Versi, Singapore Blue and an OBT. If I choose to get something larger I personally won't be firing a video of me chasing it around on YouTube. Apologies if I have to have the exact size, sex and species to be able to comment :roll:



Dr3d said:


> I would say when you have 50+ pms a day if not many more with people asking you repeatedly to please get out a spider so they can see it in the flesh.... Wonder if you would personally be interested in letting people see ???


Nope - I wouldn't. I'd happily take pics in their environment [which I have done here] but Rob is hardly a sheep, he's entitled to his own views. He doesn't strike me however as someone who would overtly bow to peer pressure.



Dr3d said:


> He has a massive client an friend base..... He is also going to great extremes to provide the videos you dont care to see..... and whats wrong with showing a threat pose ???


I'm sure he has a massive viewer base on YouTube but that doesn't mean all that he does is correct nor paints the hobby in the correct light. He is clearly experienced with T's but some of his videos will undoubtedly encourage others to have a go with potentially detrimental effects to both them and/or their spiders.

Wasn't just showing a threat pose - I'd encourage you to look at the video. I fail to see what benefit the spider was getting out of that performance.



Dr3d said:


> Singapore blues are pissed off at the slightest vibration its in there nature....


Possibly all the more reason to not put yourself in harms way?



Dr3d said:


> nope you would'nt youd take it to a VET correct ??? so taking the T to a Vet hmmmm wonder how many vets would know any more than Rob himself really ???


Hence my comment about being slightly exaggerated. Before I got a T I found a vet who had more knowledge of them than me and yes, I'd take it to the same vet I use for my herps. I admit that not everyone has that available to them however - from Rob's videos he is clearly also running a commercial operation and, with that in mind, I would have thought he would have all his bases covered in terms of professional welfare.



Dr3d said:


> True nature does have its order of things, forget Rob here but how much do Humans mess with Nature!!!! The guy is trying to stop his T from dieing.. He filmed it on the off chance this turned out good, if it did and the spider lived it would be more evidence into the spider world.... Yes there are some real knowledgable people out there with regards to Tarantula's try getting hold of one when you have a problem with a T...


Look, we'll never know the eventual outcome if nature would have been left to play it's course. For all we know the spider could have sorted itself out - you have to wonder really how they've coped all this time without human intervention, coir, perspex vivs and crickets on tap.



Dr3d said:


> I wouldnt think it was Robs job to alleviate your partners fears... that job is up to you... and if your partner has issues with it, why would you go and buy one..... it's your fault she is frightend!!!


This has to be your most comical comment. It's my fault that my partner is afraid of a Singapore Blue? She was only made significantly fearful after having seen Robs video. Admittedly my partner has a fear of spiders - I'm none to keen on her cats. Like grown ups however we discuss these things.

Type Singapore Blue into Google and it's pretty high up the list - look a bit deeper and there is another bloke handling one which is extremely docile. Two sides to the same coin! One casts the spider in a totally different light to the other. I appreciate that they can have different personalities but clearly one of the videos would introduce more fear than the other.

I'll listen to you about spiders but you can keep your Agony Aunt comments to yourself. The very fact that the video in question pretty much demonizes the spider does nothing for the casual observer or partner of someone in the hobby. 

As a side note, and in summary, I have researched my T's extensively and have discussed any additions to my collection with my partner - it's not like one has just appeared or she'd logged onto facebook/Bebo/MySpace/YouTube and seen me there chasing one around, being bitten or riling my latest addition :whistling2:


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

GRB said:


> You're sitting here saying what he does is great, "putting it out there" - these guys are "putting stuff out there" too:
> 
> The Institute for Creation Research
> 
> ...


I for got you where there to, when did I miss this party that was apparently going on at my house??? As for lens, the lens I used is $4,000 (wich I really did not need) is that good enough?, I say it is, it can get a macro shot of mite and you can almost count the hairs on it...sorry I am not a hospital/vet clinic and did not have 3-4 days to prepare for this or otherwise I would have had all the useless tools you listed above, they are not needed...tools I had did just fine, she was not injured once. Lets see here....the process took about 6-8 hours and I talked mayby 10 mins......I wouldn't say that was blabbing. False statement "Beautiful" how is that false...it is a "opinion".....pretty hard to be true or false:naughty:


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I for got you where there to, when did I miss this party that was apparently going on at my house??? As for lens, the lens I used is $4,000 (wich I really did not need) is that good enough?, I say it is, it can get a macro shot of mite and you can almost count the hairs on it...sorry I am not a hospital/vet clinic and did not have 3-4 days to prepare for this or otherwise I would have had all the useless tools you listed above, they are not needed...tools I had did just fine, she was not injured once. Lets see here....the process took about 6-8 hours and I talked mayby 10 mins......I wouldn't say that was blabbing. False statement "Beautiful" how is that false...it is a "opinion".....pretty hard to be true or false:naughty:


You were looking down a macro lens doing the "surgery"? 

Useless tools? Yes, I find having small forceps useless when attempting small scale surgery too. Pass me that spade, I see a house spider in trouble with moulting. :roll:

I also never said "beautiful" was not factual, I stated be factual or not, regards the "documentary". 

Look, if I had an animal in a similar state I'd probably attempt it myself. I wouldn't film it however, nor chat throughout, and i'd be working with a scope. You disagree that the "cuticle" layers are not extremely close together or something? What was your plan once you had extracted the legs for the rest of the body?


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Interesting thread with lots of divided views. Chucking my own tuppence in though :whistling2:
> 
> I'm new to the hobby and have to admit - after the initial WOW of watching some of his vids on YouTube I came to the opinion that Rob is a bit of a sensationalist tool. I have no doubt that he cares for his T's but the level of bravado (which borders on disrespect in my view) when he is filming does nothing positive for me as a newcomer to the hobby. In his defence however he's come on to answer his critics.
> 
> ...


First you need to get your facts straight, it was not known that it was a wet molt until a day later. @nd, I could honestly careless what you think of me.....so carry on LOL!! I actually think it is funny. Below, really do not feel like quoting.....you stated I got bit by taking my T's out of there enviroment....how is that if both tarantulas where in there enclosure???


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

GRB said:


> You were looking down a macro lens doing the "surgery"?
> 
> Useless tools? Yes, I find having small forceps useless when attempting small scale surgery too. Pass me that spade, I see a house spider in trouble with moulting. :roll:
> 
> ...


Once the cuticle is snapped/cut in 2 spots and is easily removed, go one leg at a time, you then have to go underneath since she had pulled out slightly.


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Once the cuticle is snapped/cut in 2 spots and is easily removed, go one leg at a time, you then have to go underneath since she had pulled out slightly.


And the sucking stomach and Oesophagus? I didn;t see if these were out or not, but I'd expect these to be the real clinch. [edit] found those images again. I suppose it is not an issue regardless by that stage...


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

*LOL!!! Anyway...moving on......*



fatJock said:


> Nope - I wouldn't. I'd happily take pics in their environment [which I have done here] but Rob is hardly a sheep, he's entitled to his own views. He doesn't strike me however as someone who would overtly bow to peer pressure.


I have 6 photobucket accounts with over 10,000 pics...so your point is what?? I do take more pics than vids!! I am getting a 7" Female P. subfusca today, can you advise me on where I should chase this one around at?? You say you don't watch the vids?? How is that when you know or think you know so much about them?? Just curious? Should I let this Pokie to bite me inside the tank or outside.....I wonder how many views I can get?? Get real brother!


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> First you need to get your facts straight, it was not known that it was a wet molt until a day later. @nd, I could honestly careless what you think of me.....so carry on LOL!! I actually think it is funny. Below, really do not feel like quoting.....you stated I got bit by taking my T's out of there enviroment....how is that if both tarantulas where in there enclosure???


Ah well, that's the two of us then. My personal experience, which I feel fully qualified to comment on, has been that your over effusive videos have actually hindered my attempts to get further involved in the hobby.

Additionally, my view of you being an (irresponsible) tool hasn't changed. You don't get tagged for being respectful.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

GRB said:


> And the sucking stomach and Oesophagus? I didn;t see if these were out or not, but I'd expect these to be the real clinch. [edit] found those images again. I suppose it is not an issue regardless by that stage...


One of the many considerations...if that was not out or her carapace had not popped I would not even have tried....she did get a lot of the important stuff out...basically it was just legs and abdomen, witch the abdomen was pretty simple as I am sure you know...it just peeled off. If you look at all her joints right before the cuticle you can see where the hardened cuticle almost cut into all of her legs.


----------



## Dr3d (Jul 31, 2010)

fatJock said:


> *Type Singapore Blue into Google and it's pretty high up the list - look a bit deeper and there is another bloke handling one which is extremely docile. Two sides to the same coin! One casts the spider in a totally different light to the other. I appreciate that they can have different personalities but clearly one of the videos would introduce more fear than the other.*


 
So what your actually saying in this paragraph is you would prefer your wife to see a guy holding a docile Lampropelma violaceopes over one showing a threat pose!!!! this would help her fear Hmmmm.... Personally that shows me just how new you are to keeping T's.....


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I have 6 photobucket accounts with over 10,000 pics...so your point is what?? I do take more pics than vids!! I am getting a 7" Female P. subfusca today, can you advise me on where I should chase this one around at?? You say you don't watch the vids?? How is that when you know or think you know so much about them?? Just curious? Should I let this Pokie to bite me inside the tank or outside.....I wonder how many views I can get?? Get real brother!


Well done - I commend you on all your photos. 

I'd advise you not to chase it about but maybe just pop it in the enclosure that you've undoubtedly got ready for it.

My partner drew my attention to the vids actually when saying "You're not getting one of those are you?" - perhaps you can answer one question, when you had the Singapore Blue on the log, what was the spider getting out of that? Did it enjoy it? was that threat pose a crude attempt at a thank-you?

Look at YouTube - Singapore Blue handling 5-22-2009 and then compare to your video. Chalk and cheese!

Regarding getting tagged - spose you got what you deserved. Personally I think people mistake your alleged experience with you just being cavalier.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Ah well, that's the two of us then. My personal experience, which I feel fully qualified to comment on, has been that your over effusive videos have actually hindered my attempts to get further involved in the hobby.
> 
> Additionally, my view of you being an (irresponsible) tool hasn't changed. You don't get tagged for being respectful.


Not my fault you are a wimp.....I view you as a cry baby that blames all his problems as others, people like you are dime to dozen....good day!


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Dr3d said:


> So what your actually saying in this paragraph is you would prefer your wife to see a guy holding a docile Lampropelma violaceopes over one showing a threat pose!!!! this would help her fear Hmmmm.... Personally that shows me just how new you are to keeping T's.....


Not at all - I prefer to show a balanced approach. Unfortunately the sensationalist will always go to the top of Google/YouTube. Also, the video of the more docile spider has some previous ones where it is feisty - balance!

Sigh - the same old rhetoric, you're new at keeping T's so your comments are null and void :whistling2:

Get real Dr3d - I'm hardly someone who's just bought an OBT from Loot and keeping it in a matchbox.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Not my fault you are a wimp.....I view you as a cry baby that blames all is problems as others, people like you are dime to dozen....good day!


In the space of two or three posts you've worked all of that out about me?

Beautiful, nothing like a good debate :whistling2:


----------



## Peacemaker1987 (May 21, 2009)

In reply to the comment about getting bitten due to being "cavalier" i don't agree with this. When keeping unpredictable animals such as tarantulas anyone can get bitten no matter how careful you are. I believe i read a thread earlier today about a guy doing his morning checks on his T's when his OBT that was uncharacteristically staying on the underside of the lid, ran out over his hand when he opened it. This could easily have resulted in a bite and this person was not acting in a cavalier manner. Mistakes can happen to anyone, you don't have to be acting in a cavalier fashion to get bitten.


----------



## Stelios (Aug 28, 2009)

fatJock said:


> Not at all - I prefer to show a balanced approach. Unfortunately the sensationalist will always go to the top of Google/YouTube. Also, the video of the more docile spider has some previous ones where it is feisty - balance!
> 
> Sigh - the same old rhetoric, you're new at keeping T's so your comments are null and void :whistling2:
> 
> .


It's called entertainment.

Yeah Rob exaggerates and dramatises every thing But hell he is a Yank!
Get past that and you can find alot of useful information on his channel!


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Look - I don't disagree that there is a risk to get bitten but it's all about being measured surely? There are folk on here (and Arachnoboards for instance) who have kept T's for years and have not been bitten.

I know there's a risk when moving from one enclosure to another etc but there's necessary maintenance and show for the sake of it.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Well done - I commend you on all your photos.
> 
> I'd advise you not to chase it about but maybe just pop it in the enclosure that you've undoubtedly got ready for it.
> 
> ...


My vid is better informing, I would Never want someone to handle a singapore blue???? Yeah tell some newbies as yourself go out and handle one of these and get tagged??? P. ornata bite, I was bitten taking the MM out, P. regalis: I was bitten because I open the lid and she mistaked me as food.... your point???


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> My partner drew my attention to the vids actually when saying "You're not getting one of those are you?" - perhaps you can answer one question, when you had the Singapore Blue on the log, what was the spider getting out of that? Did it enjoy it? was that threat pose a crude attempt at a thank-you?


Well, that is where she went to, I did not place her there is that is what you think. Unlike you I am guessing when I get a WC T I make sure is is free of parasites and it is examined before going into my T room. I took her out of the cup and that is where she went, guess she like it, but tarantuals really do not have Brains so......


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

Tarantulas don't have brains?
:gasp:


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> My vid is better informing, I would Never want someone to handle a singapore blue???? Yeah tell some newbies as yourself go out and handle one of these and get tagged??? P. ornata bite, I was bitten taking the MM out, P. regalis: I was bitten because I open the lid and she mistaked me as food.... your point???


Rob - we're clearly going to disagree, but that's part of forum discussion. 

I have no inclination to handle my Singapore Blue having decided very early on that I would keep any interaction with my spiders to a minimum as they really get nothing from it. 

So, when you got tagged it was legitimate - my point is that in some of your other videos you are showing for showing's sake. I'm struggling to see what your T Blondi (YouTube - Handling my biggest T-Blondi "Zilla") got out of that.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Pinkytoes said:


> Tarantulas don't have brains?
> :gasp:


That is correct, it is not classified as a brain, it is called a "Ganglion"


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Well, that is where she went to, I did not place her there is that is what you think. Unlike you I am guessing when I get a WC T I make sure is is free of parasites and it is examined before going into my T room. I took her out of the cup and that is where she went, guess she like it, but tarantuals really do not have Brains so......


Erm, I only buy captive bred T's - not really a big advocate of taking things out of their natural habitat. Agree however that in some instances it's necessary for survival.

Am sure on the video (YouTube - New Female Singapore Blue) you say that you're taking pictures of her (presumably why you have the camera out). Just wondering what the spider is getting from that - it's clearly not happy.

As for not having brains, I would beg to differ at a basic anatomical level (some pics refer to a brain). I think the inherent fight or flight response would denote some base level thought process.


----------



## Stelios (Aug 28, 2009)

fatJock said:


> I have no inclination to handle my Singapore Blue having decided very early on that I would keep any interaction with my spiders to a minimum as they really get nothing from it.


I always hear that same reason for not handling T's.
Why do you keep T's then? They get nothing from it? 
All those T's in the wild thinking a "I wish a large biped will come along soon and take me into captivity and make me a new home."


----------



## vivalabam (Aug 8, 2010)

I may get a load of people moaning, but it's also about what you get out of the Tarantula, at the end of the day it's every ones choice and HE wanted to hold HIS tarantula. No one really has the place to judge him on that in my opinion...


----------



## Peacemaker1987 (May 21, 2009)

I thought that the flight or fight response was actually an adrenaline enduced responce to a stimulus, not sure if that technically requires any level of thought as it is more of a reaction as oppose to a cognitive response...i could be wrong though as it was a while ago i studied this sort of thing.



fatJock said:


> Erm, I only buy captive bred T's - not really a big advocate of taking things out of their natural habitat. Agree however that in some instances it's necessary for survival.
> 
> Am sure on the video (YouTube - New Female Singapore Blue) you say that you're taking pictures of her (presumably why you have the camera out). Just wondering what the spider is getting from that - it's clearly not happy.
> 
> As for not having brains, I would beg to differ at a basic anatomical level (some pics refer to a brain). I think the inherent fight or flight response would denote some base level thought process.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Rob - we're clearly going to disagree, but that's part of forum discussion.
> 
> I have no inclination to handle my Singapore Blue having decided very early on that I would keep any interaction with my spiders to a minimum as they really get nothing from it.
> 
> So, when you got tagged it was legitimate - my point is that in some of your other videos you are showing for showing's sake. I'm struggling to see what your T Blondi (YouTube - Handling my biggest T-Blondi "Zilla") got out of that.


I had her out for maintance.....she got a clean enclosure.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Stelios said:


> I always hear that same reason for not handling T's.
> Why do you keep T's then? They get nothing from it?
> All those T's in the wild thinking a "I wish a large biped will come along soon and take me into captivity and make me a new home.


I keep them because I have an interest in them - I agree that at it's base level its for purely selfish reasons.

My aim however is to offer them as natural a habitat and existence as my means and experience allow. That to me doesn't involve them climbing on my face, curtains or scrabbling across lino.

Wow - this has gone off on a tangent :whistling2:


----------



## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

Peacemaker1987 said:


> I thought that the flight or fight response was actually an adrenaline enduced responce to a stimulus, not sure if that technically requires any level of thought as it is more of a reaction as oppose to a cognitive response...i could be wrong though as it was a while ago i studied this sort of thing.


not sure if tarantulas possess adrenal glands?


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Erm, I only buy captive bred T's - not really a big advocate of taking things out of their natural habitat. Agree however that in some instances it's necessary for survival.
> 
> Am sure on the video (YouTube - New Female Singapore Blue) you say that you're taking pictures of her (presumably why you have the camera out). Just wondering what the spider is getting from that - it's clearly not happy.
> 
> As for not having brains, I would beg to differ at a basic anatomical level (some pics refer to a brain). I think the inherent fight or flight response would denote some base level thought process.


It is NOT classified as one...it is a "Ganglion"


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I had her out for maintance.....she got a clean enclosure.


I'll bear that in mind - maintenance includes just letting your T run riot. Ta for the tips.


----------



## GRB (Jan 24, 2008)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> That is correct, it is not classified as a brain, it is called a "Ganglion"


Brain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's open to debate, and ultimately comes down to semantics. It's kind of like correcting someone for using "nerve cell" rather than "neuron". The way we use brain refers to a centralised mass of nerve cells, hence a ganglion is still a brain by this usage. A lack of brain would be something with a decentralised nerve net or such. 

It's good enough for these guys anyway, lol:

ScienceDirect - Comparative Biochemistry and Physiology Part A: Physiology : Learning and localization of brain function in the tarantula spider, Aphonopelma chalcodes (Orthognatha: Theraphosidae)


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Erm, I only buy captive bred T's - not really a big advocate of taking things out of their natural habitat. Agree however that in some instances it's necessary for survival.


Do you know the breeders who sold you these, 80&% if not more are WC in the hobby, To get a CB T you have to have a WC one first.


----------



## Peacemaker1987 (May 21, 2009)

garlicpickle said:


> not sure if tarantulas possess adrenal glands?


 
Mmm, not sure. I was basing my response from a mammalian biology, but like you said, not sure if T's possess the necessary glands. However i would imagine, and this is pure conjecture, that it would follow a similar path.


----------



## Chaika (Jun 5, 2009)

Gosh, getting a bit hot in here again . Chill out a little guys, I'm not even sure what you're arguing so strongly about. 

Rob did what many people faced with losing their pet with no hope of veterinary help would do, he saw that the situation was not going to resolve itself and tried to help. There is so little knowledge on how to 'help' tarantulas that run into problems that his attempt would be just as good as that of most vets out there. His animal, his decision,.. if anyone would have done differently then that's their perogative when it's their animal. By the way I'm sorry that he lost his pet in this way. It must have been very upsetting, especially after all of the care and attention he must have put into her.

Handling animals is a matter of personal preference whether they are tarantulas, snakes, hamsters or the like. Can you not just agree to disagree on this? So it might be a bit stressful for the spider, but it is not nearly as stressful as living in the wild that's why many animals live much longer lives in captivity. 

As for his personality and involvement with you tube and the like, I find some of the comments here distasteful. If you don't like his videos then you don't have to watch, criticising him for making and uploading you tube videos and for his style of commentating is a bit childish.

PS - Above is just my personal opinion on several or the topics that have come up in this long thread. As I am still not sure what the people still following this thread are arguing about, feel free to clarify .


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> I'll bear that in mind - maintenance includes just letting your T run riot. Ta for the tips.


I haVE A 3,500 SQFT basement that is sealed, not that big of a issue...I had her out so why not film her, didn't do it often. Your attempts to make me mad i guess have done quite the opposite....me and my wife are in tears we are laughing so hard....so please carry on with your rather dumb observations that have lead up to no point at all.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> Do you know the breeders who sold you these, 80&% if not more are WC in the hobby, To get a CB T you have to have a WC one first.


Hence my comments about ultimately some being WC. I don't directly support buying WC T's to own personally but I'd be a fool to ignore that ultimately that to originate the hobby some were and still are WC.

The comment was in response to you saying your interaction was to check for parasites and questioning how I did it. Firstly I dont have a massive collection in such close proximity as yours and secondly the rate is slightly reduced by having CB (admittedly I cannot always vouch for how many generations - I could be having slings from a gravid WC T).


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

Peacemaker1987 said:


> Mmm, not sure. I was basing my response from a mammalian biology, but like you said, not sure if T's possess the necessary glands. However i would imagine, and this is pure conjecture, that it would follow a similar path.


They don't produce adrenalin as they don't have kidneys.
Adrenal glands are only present in mammals.


----------



## Stelios (Aug 28, 2009)

fatJock said:


> I keep them because I have an interest in them - I agree that at it's base level its for purely selfish reasons.
> 
> My aim however is to offer them as natural a habitat and existence as my means and experience allow. That to me doesn't involve them climbing on my face, curtains or scrabbling across lino.
> 
> Wow - this has gone off on a tangent :whistling2:


I also keep them for purely selfish reasons and I too also try to give them best environment.
I do handle, because I like seeing them up close and it is easier just to pick them up when you need to move them.
That being said I rarely handle them and I never stress them out, just makes me laugh all the people moaning at other people about handling, but then they keep T's for that very same reason.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> I haVE A 3,500 SQFT basement that is sealed, not that big of a issue...I had her out so why not film her, didn't do it often. Your attempts to make me mad i guess have done quite the opposite....me and my wife are in tears we are laughing so hard....so please carry on with your rather dumb observations that have lead up to no point at all.


No intention to make you mad - I'm just entitled to express that I disagree with your approach at times.

You clearly enjoy having your spiders out and showing them off - I just don't think the spider gets much out of it and the filming of their corresponding (at times) aggressive response does more harm than good in my personal experience.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

fatJock said:


> Hence my comments about ultimately some being WC. I don't directly support buying WC T's to own personally but I'd be a fool to ignore that ultimately that to originate the hobby some were and still are WC.
> 
> The comment was in response to you saying your interaction was to check for parasites and questioning how I did it. Firstly I dont have a massive collection in such close proximity as yours and secondly the rate is slightly reduced by having CB (admittedly I cannot always vouch for how many generations - I could be having slings from a gravid WC T).


CB is a good thing, I have about 20 WC out of my 700+ T's but it souinded like you were trying to say I advocate getting WC T's? The one in the vid was bought from a show and was WC.


----------



## Mutley.100 (Nov 3, 2008)

Round and round the discussion goes , where it'll stop nobody knows . :lol2:


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

Stelios said:


> ..... them and I never stress them out


I think that's the key.

I started with the mind of minimal handling for ease of maintenance. I disagree with them being out of their environment and throwing threat poses for nothing other that photo/video/novelty value.


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

tarantulaguy1976 said:


> CB is a good thing, I have about 20 WC out of my 700+ T's but it souinded like you were trying to say I advocate getting WC T's? The one in the vid was bought from a show and was WC.


Not at all - I understand the need for WC but (admittedly hypocritical) I wouldn't feel comfortable knowing that I was the immediate purchaser of something that had been running free weeks before.

I'm sensible enough to know that ultimately all of my T's came from WC stock. If you have the nouse to breed something which is WC and introduce more spiders to the hobby then who am I to argue - I'm one of the people buying the progeny.


----------



## tarantulaguy1976 (Nov 15, 2010)

Mutley.100 said:


> Round and round the discussion goes , where it'll stop nobody knows . :lol2:


LOL!!!!! That is pretty much what it is LOL!!!


----------



## Chaika (Jun 5, 2009)

Mutley.100 said:


> Round and round the discussion goes , where it'll stop nobody knows . :lol2:


Yup...


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

I actually enjoy this  reading fatJocks silly arguments and clearly Rob is having a great time


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

Ach folks.. keep er lit! This thread is getting into good detail!


----------



## Dr3d (Jul 31, 2010)

Mutley.100 said:


> Round and round the discussion goes , where it'll stop nobody knows . :lol2:


 
ahhhh he come...... hehehehe


----------



## Muze (Jun 20, 2007)

Very sorry for your loss Rob  

I find alot of your videos informative and enjoy watching them to pick up little tips and tricks even after keeping spiders for 20 years myself. So please keep doing what you're doing : victory:

Expect certain people to try and have ago on here...they have nothing more constructive to do with their time :whistling2:


----------



## fatJock (May 17, 2010)

rudy691 said:


> I actually enjoy this  reading fatJocks silly arguments and clearly Rob is having a great time


Pleased my comments amused you - given your sig I can see you're a bit of a fanboy anyway :whistling2: (tongue in cheek before you go off on one)

The world would be a boring place were we all to agree on everything. On a side note, I am saddened that the spider that has spawned this thread ultimately died. I don't disagree that Rob is knowledgable & passionate about his spiders - that has never been in question and ultimately, the untimely death of one of his collection is likely to be painful for him.


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

i'm watching it now.
my salmonk pink moulted on saturday night! it's not molted for a while (probably nearly a year) so i thought it was an adult already but it's not as big as i expected so i was very glad to see it on its back on saturday night. i misted the cage just to help it out and i was gonna try and take pics but a couple of hours later, when i went back, it's already finished.
the spider was still weak so i managed to grab the old skin away without making it jump and i reshaped the old skin back (i couldn't blow up the tummy skin tho so i'm afraid the tummy will stay shrivelled up)


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

17 pages of posts that are probably not even related to this youtube video...
does anyone know what happened to the tarantula? is it alive or dead?


----------



## rudy691 (Aug 11, 2010)

did you even read these 17 pages ? you probably didn't as you wouldn't be asking these questions...


----------



## Corsetts (Dec 8, 2008)

muscleflex said:


> 17 pages of posts that are probably not even related to this youtube video...
> *does anyone know what happened to the tarantula? is it alive or dead?[/*QUOTE]
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

rudy691 said:


> did you even read these 17 pages ? you probably didn't as you wouldn't be asking these questions...


no sorry i didn't. you're right. altho i did go to i think page 3 and the last 2 pages of this thread...
so.... is this thumbs up or thumbs down regarding the spider? or are you gonna make me read the whole 17pages (i hope not!)


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

Corsetts said:


> muscleflex said:
> 
> 
> > 17 pages of posts that are probably not even related to this youtube video...
> ...


----------



## Craig Mackay (Feb 2, 2009)

rudy691 said:


> did you even read these 17 pages ? you probably didn't as you wouldn't be asking these questions...


I don't blame him for not reading through all this crap!!


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

Craig Mackay said:


> I don't blame him for not reading through all this crap!!


Hahahahahaha


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

so is it dead or alive?


----------



## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

It died


----------



## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

muscleflex said:


> so is it dead or alive?


:bash::bash::bash::bash::bash:


----------



## mythicdawn07 (Jun 18, 2009)

Sometimes it has to be done to be honest, i had to do it to my SLING, which was a pain in the arse and frustrating but it made it through its next molt. 

Sometimes its best to intervene. : victory:


----------



## Baldpoodle (Apr 18, 2007)

Hi
I posted on page 5 and just want to know if there is anything worth reading between then and now? If yes can you link me to the good bits and if not can you please say so.
thanks for you help
BP


----------



## Dr3d (Jul 31, 2010)

Baldpoodle said:


> Hi
> I posted on page 5 and just want to know if there is anything worth reading between then and now? If yes can you link me to the good bits and if not can you please say so.
> thanks for you help
> BP


 
Dont bother fella lol


----------



## Corsetts (Dec 8, 2008)

selina20 said:


> :bash::bash::bash::bash::bash:


I think it was a joke


----------



## Baldpoodle (Apr 18, 2007)

Dr3d said:


> Dont bother fella lol


 cheers for the heads up.


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

sorry to hear about the death..
i'd love a t blondi but i can't see me feeding it pinkies - my girlfriend would kill me!


----------



## garlicpickle (Jan 16, 2009)

muscleflex said:


> sorry to hear about the death..
> i'd love a t blondi but i can't see me feeding it pinkies - my girlfriend would kill me!


they don't need pinkies, XL locusts and roaches will do fine.


----------



## _TiMiSdRuNk_ (Aug 27, 2008)

Ok i've been long time banned. So i can only just say how i see it. But here's what i think of this....

Ok firstly for a 'tarantula expert' why did you think this would help it? If somethings moulting you leave it to moult. Anyone knows that, more so an 'expert' should know that. 

And secondly who died and made you God? Why would you mess around with nature? I'm sure that you THINK you know what you're doing, but nature knows best....


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

_TiMiSdRuNk_ said:


> Ok i've been long time banned. So i can only just say how i see it. But here's what i think of this....
> 
> Ok firstly for a 'tarantula expert' why did you think this would help it? If somethings moulting you leave it to moult. Anyone knows that, more so an 'expert' should know that.
> 
> And secondly who died and made you God? Why would you mess around with nature? I'm sure that you THINK you know what you're doing, but nature knows best....


That's what I was led to believe too Tim and the whole point of my post.
Leave them be regardless of how loved they are, needless stress mid moult would cause a fatality in most cases anyway let alone "surgery"


----------



## mythicdawn07 (Jun 18, 2009)

_TiMiSdRuNk_ said:


> Ok i've been long time banned. So i can only just say how i see it. But here's what i think of this....
> 
> Ok firstly for a 'tarantula expert' why did you think this would help it? If somethings moulting you leave it to moult. Anyone knows that, more so an 'expert' should know that.
> 
> And secondly who died and made you God? Why would you mess around with nature? I'm sure that you THINK you know what you're doing, but nature knows best....


If it doesnt stand a chance i would try give any of my Ts the chance it wouldnt have if i didnt intervene

It's not nature when they are sitting in a cage in your house, It's our responsiblity as owners of captive live animals to make sure there welfare is in check and give them every chance of survival.

Like i said one of my P.cambridgei slings had a really bad molt, me and my brother both stepped in, slapped god in the face and saved the little bugger, he was missing 4 legs which hes now grew back. : victory:

Sometimes it doesnt turn out so well.


----------



## _TiMiSdRuNk_ (Aug 27, 2008)

mythicdawn07 said:


> If it doesnt stand a chance i would try give any of my Ts the chance it wouldnt have if i didnt intervene
> 
> It's not nature when they are sitting in a cage in your house, It's our responsiblity as owners of captive live animals to make sure there welfare is in check and give them every chance of survival.
> 
> ...


Nope but maybe if it was left alone it might of survived? Fact is it shouldn't of been touched while it was trying to moult, everyone knows even the simplest things like a cricket running around a spider while it's moulting could stress it and kill it! So how is it going to cope with a human picking it up placing it down and prodding it with forceps?


----------



## jaykickboxer (Feb 11, 2008)

_TiMiSdRuNk_ said:


> Nope but maybe if it was left alone it might of survived? Fact is it shouldn't of been touched while it was trying to moult, everyone knows even the simplest things like a cricket running around a spider while it's moulting could stress it and kill it! So how is it going to cope with a human picking it up placing it down and prodding it with forceps?


So what made doctors god if u WAs ,ill would u not want somebody to try help u


----------



## _TiMiSdRuNk_ (Aug 27, 2008)

jaykickboxer said:


> So what made doctors god if u WAs ,ill would u not want somebody to try help u


Of course, but i'm human and i can communicate with other humans and tell them that i'm in need of help. This is a spider that was trying to do what comes natural to it, then some prat comes along and thinks he will 'operate' on it?


----------



## mythicdawn07 (Jun 18, 2009)

_TiMiSdRuNk_ said:


> Nope but maybe if it was left alone it might of survived? Fact is it shouldn't of been touched while it was trying to moult, everyone knows even the simplest things like a cricket running around a spider while it's moulting could stress it and kill it! So how is it going to cope with a human picking it up placing it down and prodding it with forceps?


 
Well from what he seen he didnt think the T stood a chance, and Ts are alot hardier than what some people might think when it comes to stress no i wouldnt suggest disturbing them while they are in molt but sometimes you dont have a choice (Atleast thats what i believe).


----------



## muscleflex (Sep 23, 2010)

I guess we'll never know now whether the spider would HAVE (note! it's would HAVE - not 'would OF') survived or not if left alone...

just leave it alone for the next spider and see if it survives


----------



## Stelios (Aug 28, 2009)

LOL a cricket running around whilst moulting could stress it out and kill it?:crazy:
Come on.


----------



## Paul c 1 (Sep 30, 2009)

Stelios said:


> LOL a cricket running around whilst moulting could stress it out and kill it?:crazy:
> Come on.


It does happen!,... not the stress part so much but a cricket can make it move into an un-natural position where the spider get's stuck in the moult and subsequently dies.

There was a hobbyist who I was speaking to at a local club meet and she had lost an AF P.murinus that was startled by a roach during shed process and the spider flipped onto it's underside and unfortunately didn't survive the moult.

-P


----------



## Stelios (Aug 28, 2009)

I know what can happen if a cricket is in the enclosure when a T is moulting, and it dying of stress is not one of them.


----------



## Craig Mackay (Feb 2, 2009)

Paul c 1 said:


> It does happen!,... not the stress part so much but a cricket can make it move into an un-natural position where the spider get's stuck in the moult and subsequently dies.
> 
> There was a hobbyist who I was speaking to at a local club meet and she had lost an AF P.murinus that was startled by a roach during shed process and the spider flipped onto it's underside and unfortunately didn't survive the moult.
> 
> -P


It tends to be crickets nibbling on moulting spiders that is the major problem if they're not removed.


----------

