# bitch spade gone wrong :(



## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

In June we had our keiko spade as we was never going to breed from her and we believed this was best for her health.

Keiko was a extremely healthy dog with no health problems apart from the odd ear problem that meds solve right away when used.

After her spade in June we was really pleased to get the stitches taken out and she was back to herself although we did notice some lumps appearing under the skin where the operation was.

we took her back to the vets once we noticed and they said this can happen and they will go down so nothing to worry about.

A week or so later she had a fit which seemed like it lasted for ages, she was in a right state and although I had seen dogs fit before this was the worst one I had ever seen. 
I rushed her to the vets and she had tests done to see what could be going on but they found nothing..... Whilst at the vets I pointed out the lumps again saying I was worried about them.. Again I was told they are fine and not to worry.. 

Another week or so past and the perfectly healed scar tissue from her spade had split open on one end and was leaking.. again we rushed her to the vets and they said she had become infected from the internal stitches and it was tracking up that whole area and she would need operating on again to remove the tracking (infection) The next day she was back on the operating table.

Whilst on the table they had to take away infected tummy muscle and the scar was as big as the spade scar.
The healing was not fun for her or us, it would swell and leak then swell again (with clear fluids) but eventually it healed.

About two week's ago she had her stitches out and all was looking good until the last few days, again she has reacted to the internal stitches and we can feel big bumps under the scar and her healed scar is opening up at one end because the body is rejecting the stitches... she has gone back again to the vets and they have tried draining but found no infection so we have been told to monitor her closely. needless to say she is going back again tonight as the opening has started to weep.

I know that its meant to be good to get your dogs spade but I feel right now that I have made a very bad mistake.
This is costing me hundreds and looks like more to come but worst of all I have put a healthy fit dog through this for what?!
I feel so bad for her, she doesn’t know why we keep doing this to her


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## pandamonium (Sep 25, 2009)

ladyboid said:


> In June we had our keiko spade as we was never going to breed from her and we believed this was best for her health.
> 
> Keiko was a extremely healthy dog with no health problems apart from the odd ear problem that meds solve right away when used.
> 
> ...



I'd be kicking off at the vet right now, it's obvious your poor dog should have been seen too the first time you where worried! I'd not be paying through the damn nose for what is in essence thier mistake! 

Spaying is usually a perfectly simple op, with no ill effects and many benefits, I really hope you get this sorted soon for your poor doggy's health and your peace of mind!


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

belive me my first reaction was to get cross as I was so hurt to see my baby go through this..

We had a chat with the vet and they said some dogs to react to the internal stitches but the swelling nearly always goes down once settled and in her 30 years of being a vet she has only had this get worse twice before and on one of them dogs it needed it correcting 3 times before it would heal 

I can understand why they didnt open her up sooner.. they just could not predict that it would get worse. 

I also feel that they are not to blame, we are they ones that asked for her to be spade 

this time they did give her different internal stitches which are not as strong but she was less likely to react to .. unfortunatly this didnt make a difference.


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## iiisecondcreep (Oct 29, 2007)

Poor Keiko, I hope she recovers soon. My mums last dog had to have an emergency hystorectomy due to pyometra and, I don't think she had any of the other problems your dog is having, but she did start to have fits after the operation


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## pandamonium (Sep 25, 2009)

ladyboid said:


> belive me my first reaction was to get cross as I was so hurt to see my baby go through this..
> 
> We had a chat with the vet and they said some dogs to react to the internal stitches but the swelling nearly always goes down once settled and in her 30 years of being a vet she has only had this get worse twice before and on one of them dogs it needed it correcting 3 times before it would heal
> 
> ...



Just because you asked for her to be spade doesn't make it your fault something went wrong, I can understand the blaming oneself as it's a natural reaction when something goes wrong with a beloved member of the family. 
*shakes head sadly* All I know is if it where one of my animals I would make damn sure I wasn't paying through the nose for after care from a service the vet provided that I had already paid through the nose for. After all you where sold a service that wasn't right...... trading standards still apply.


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## jinglejoys (May 5, 2010)

You payed for the dog to be speyed the after care should be all included in the bill if their is a problem you should not have to pay any more
...and congratulations on taking the right decission.Un speyed bitches can contract Pyeameatra (spellig!)which can lead to death if not caught quickly enough.They then have to be speyed anyway to save their life.Your dog went into the operation healthy,imagine what would have been the result if she had been ill before the op?
One of my bitches showed symptoms if Pyameatra and I took her straight to the vet.He said I was lucky because when she was opened up as well as the poisoned womb she had a growth on her spleen which,if it had burst would've caused her to bleed internally and the first I would've known was a dead dog.:gasp:


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

pandamonium said:


> Just because you asked for her to be spade doesn't make it your fault something went wrong, I can understand the blaming oneself as it's a natural reaction when something goes wrong with a beloved member of the family.
> *shakes head sadly* All I know is if it where one of my animals I would make damn sure I wasn't paying through the nose for after care from a service the vet provided that I had already paid through the nose for. After all you where sold a service that wasn't right...... trading standards still apply.


The vets have been very good, they said they have kept cost to a minimum and to be honist I have always been happy with their costs and they always let us pay when we can... in advance or after what ever the case may be. They are very good vets and the animals health does come before payment with them.
The correction operation cost about £230 all in , she was on the table for a long time as well.
I will question it more if we have to pay again but I just want her better...I was so happy the other week .. I did see the bill but i didnt care because I could see her stitches had all healed and all looked good and that put a smile on my face knowing she was on the road to recovery.
Its just a shame that it didnt last long 




jinglejoys said:


> *You payed for the dog to be speyed the after care should be all included in the bill if their is a problem you should not have to pay any more*
> ...and congratulations on taking the right decission.Un speyed bitches can contract Pyeameatra (spellig!)which can lead to death if not caught quickly enough.They then have to be speyed anyway to save their life.Your dog went into the operation healthy,imagine what would have been the result if she had been ill before the op?
> One of my bitches showed symptoms if Pyameatra and I took her straight to the vet.He said I was lucky because when she was opened up as well as the poisoned womb she had a growth on her spleen which,if it had burst would've caused her to bleed internally and the first I would've known was a dead dog.:gasp:


The reason we had her spayed was more to stop her becomming ill in the future as she would never come into contact with a male dog anyway whilst on heat.
Its like a risk you take to get them done and a risk you take to not get them done.. although I am sure this illness that has happened with my girl is alot more rare than the one that she could of got if left.

I am glad you got your girl looked at before it had got to bad.

The bit I highlighted above I will bring up with the vets..... but I just want her right again so at the moment thats all we are talking about with them.


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## danabanana (Sep 16, 2008)

ladyboid said:


> I feel so bad for her, she doesn’t know why we keep doing this to her


I know that feeling! My girl was on epilepsy medication when I got her spayed she was so ill and sick afterwards and the vets just told me it was harder on her because she was on tablets - if I'd known beforehand! She recovered though and as above, speying is better in the long run. Don't feel too guilty you're doing your best and your girl will get through it


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

danabanana said:


> I know that feeling! My girl was on epilepsy medication when I got her spayed she was so ill and sick afterwards and the vets just told me it was harder on her because she was on tablets - if I'd known beforehand! She recovered though and as above, speying is better in the long run. Don't feel too guilty you're doing your best and your girl will get through it


Thanks, I hope she does... I had a sinking feeling last night .. all I keep thinking is "how many times can she regect the stitches so they open her and re-stitch up before it stops"


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## Antw23uk (Jan 12, 2009)

This is such a tricky situation, my first reaction is to get her to another vets. :sad: Good luck.


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

I wouldnt change the vets as I dont feel like they have failed us.
I travel past two other vets to go to this one as I feel its the best in the area "or should I say out the area"

I can see where your comming from though! my advice would of been the same if I had not known the vet's. I feel they will do their best for her and they have the knowladge to deal with it.

Poor keiko knows its gone all wrong again, she wants to have a lick but knows I will not let her lick it so she just pulls a funny face at me after she cocks her leg to have a look.


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## JulieNoob (Jul 9, 2008)

Poor baby 
My sister's border terrier Bridget had a similar experience


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

JulieNoob said:


> Poor baby
> My sister's border terrier Bridget had a similar experience


what was the outcome if you know? I would love to hear something about this sort of condition (if you can call it a condition)


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## jinglejoys (May 5, 2010)

Has the vet suggested the "Bucket/lampshade collor" as I call it to stop her licking her stitches/


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## evileye (Nov 3, 2009)

i was about to say my opinion on spaying, but it will probably lead to a huge argument. oh, what the hell!

i think its wrong and hate it....don't argue please....


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

evileye said:


> i was about to say my opinion on spaying, but it will probably lead to a huge argument. oh, what the hell!
> 
> i think its wrong and hate it....don't argue please....


 
:lol2: Each to their own but I have seen what pyometra does to a bitch so I would spay every time


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## Megan. (Mar 11, 2009)

The poor thing!!! make sure you give her loads of cuddles.. if shes home that is!!

It is in no way your fault! so dont blame yourself! Just keep your chin up 



evileye said:


> i was about to say my opinion on spaying, but it will probably lead to a huge argument. oh, what the hell!
> 
> i think its wrong and hate it....don't argue please....


Fair do's as it is your oppinion! (Im not starting an arguement here just stating my knowledge.) Spaying and neutering is always the best for your dog/cat. Especially if you are not breeding, it puts the animal through stress as they have the need built into their head to produce, it also causes illness as has been stated in this topic by other people. In your head it is cruel but all in all its for the welfare of the animal, and gives them a better.. longer life 

Also (off topic.. sort of!), me and my friend came up with a query about dogs and neutering.. As they can get testicular cancer and tumors there aswel (one of my mums un-neutered dogs had this and died sadly  ) We were thinking its to do with semen release.. (Just to add this is for dogs that dont breed!) As they are not mating and releasing themselves, the semen just builds and builds up in their bits and just causes problems!! No idea if this is an actual fact to be honest me and my friend just had a strong think about it and it does actually make sense!!

Ill shush now :blush:

But to the OP Im sure your dog with be fine soon  Keep us updated!!!


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

really sorry that things have turned out badly.I've never had my bitches spayed but having three males now I thought it was to much to expect them to get along with bitches coming in season.I got everyone done this year in a job lot and one of my girls was 9.I felt terrible taking them in.They all recovered well but I would have felt just dreadful if things hadn't turned out.You do these things with the best intentions.I really feel for you.


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

jinglejoys said:


> Has the vet suggested the "Bucket/lampshade collor" as I call it to stop her licking her stitches/


We used a buster collar for the external stitches but its the internal ones that she is having problems with.
The only licking she wants to do at the momemnt is where her internal stitches and swelling is pushing through the already healed skin. 
she is not licking but she knows its there , I do have a buster collar here if she starts up though.



evileye said:


> i was about to say my opinion on spaying, but it will probably lead to a huge argument. oh, what the hell!
> 
> i think its wrong and hate it....don't argue please....


I belive everyone is free to have there opinion. : victory:
I could of left her and not had it done and she might not of ever had any problems but unfortunalty I couldnt predict this and I had to make a choice. I might of made a bad one for this lovely girl but I only made it in her best interest. 



Megan. said:


> The poor thing!!! make sure you give her loads of cuddles.. if shes home that is!!
> 
> It is in no way your fault! so dont blame yourself! Just keep your chin up
> But to the OP Im sure your dog with be fine soon  Keep us updated!!!


I will give her lots of cuddles dont worry.
last night she didnt go back to the vets as we think its the same at the moment but she will be going back monday for her appointment.
the swelling is inbetween at the moment ... I just hope by monday it starts to go down. 



sarahc said:


> really sorry that things have turned out badly.I've never had my bitches spayed but having three males now I thought it was to much to expect them to get along with bitches coming in season.I got everyone done this year in a job lot and one of my girls was 9.I felt terrible taking them in.They all recovered well but I would have felt just dreadful if things hadn't turned out.You do these things with the best intentions.I really feel for you.


I am glad all your's were well after there opps. :2thumb:

It does make you feel awfull.. your putting them through somthing they dont understand although its whats ment to be best for them. 

I will update if anything happends this weekend but fingers crossed she will not get worse. 
Monday I will let you all know if she is going back under for a re stitch


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## TommoNewton (Aug 27, 2010)

best of luck , hope she isa ok


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## fenwoman (Apr 15, 2008)

ladyboid said:


> In June we had our keiko spade as we was never going to breed from her and we believed this was best for her health.
> 
> Keiko was a extremely healthy dog with no health problems apart from the odd ear problem that meds solve right away when used.
> 
> ...



Sounds like they used a spade to spay her.:whistling2:
On a more serious note, I hope you didn't go back to the vet who _spayed_ her to sort the problem out? Ideally you would use a differnt vet who would write a report and you can use this to make a complaint aginst the first vet and issue a claim against them to reimburse you for the _spay_. Any vet who uses a spade to spay a bitch wants to be struck off!!


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

fenwoman said:


> Sounds like they used a spade to spay her.:whistling2:
> On a more serious note, I hope you didn't go back to the vet who _spayed_ her to sort the problem out? Ideally you would use a differnt vet who would write a report and you can use this to make a complaint aginst the first vet and issue a claim against them to reimburse you for the _spay_. Any vet who uses a spade to spay a bitch wants to be struck off!!



I did wonder if it was a *spade *or a *shovel *that was used to _*spay *_the bitch :whistling2:.


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

Thanks to the people who actually gave a dam and didnt want to reply just to pick up on my spelling or misuse of a word.

It must feel nice to kick someone when they are down!


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## TommoNewton (Aug 27, 2010)

ladyboid said:


> Thanks to the people who actually gave a dam and didnt want to reply just to pick up on my spelling or misuse of a word.
> 
> It must feel nice to kick someone when they are down!


 
amen.


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

hows your bitch doing today?


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## Marinam2 (Sep 4, 2007)

I'm intrigued as to why you kept returning to a vet that you were so unhappy with who clearly wasn't paying attention to the requests you were making.

I'd have been to another by now to have such appaling work taken care of.

Secondly its really unusual to return to have stitches taken out most vets these days use disolvables. Requiring you to only return for check at 1 week post surgery.

Thirdly i'd be putting in a claim against the vets in question for compensation for clear neglect of duties.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Most people are saying go & claim compensation, why when the vet hasn't really done anything wrong (some bitches do get a few bumps after surgery which is often a slight infection & they are usually given antibiotics anyway after a spay). The bitch had a reaction to the stitches (which i gather is rare but can happen), the vet wasn't to know this would happen with this bitch. The bitch was taken back & different stitches were used to try to stop a reaction happening again (to me the vet was trying to avoid it happening again so opted to use a different brand of suture). Unfortunately the bitch reacted again. Now if the bitch had been taken to another vet that vet wouldn't know which sutures had been used etc.. & you could of been back to square one.

Not all vets use dissolveable stitches, the vet that neuters & spays all our retired Greyhounds at the kennels i work at use normal stitches (i take the stitches out once the wounds have healed up which is normally after 10 days).


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

corny girl said:


> Most people are saying go & claim compensation, why when the vet hasn't really done anything wrong (some bitches do get a few bumps after surgery which is often a slight infection & they are usually given antibiotics anyway after a spay). The bitch had a reaction to the stitches (which i gather is rare but can happen), the vet wasn't to know this would happen with this bitch. The bitch was taken back & different stitches were used to try to stop a reaction happening again (to me the vet was trying to avoid it happening again so opted to use a different brand of suture). Unfortunately the bitch reacted again. Now if the bitch had been taken to another vet that vet wouldn't know which sutures had been used etc.. & you could of been back to square one.
> 
> Not all vets use dissolveable stitches, the vet that neuters & spays all our retired Greyhounds at the kennels i work at use normal stitches (i take the stitches out once the wounds have healed up which is normally after 10 days).


 

I agree with this.
Dissolvable stitches themselves can cause problems due to them being so hard and they take ages to actually dissolve which can cause irritation to the healing wound.


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## sarahc (Jan 7, 2009)

my bitches also didn't have dissolving stitches.


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## kazzy (Aug 17, 2009)

*mine never had disolvable stitches and they went back to vet after 10-14 days to have them removed*


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

TommoNewton said:


> amen.


Thank you : victory:



sarahc said:


> hows your bitch doing today?


she has just gone to the vets to see whats going to happen now. We are hoping we can ride this one out and infection not set in whilst the reaction subsides.
I will update later tonight if I get a chance : victory:



Marinam2 said:


> I'm intrigued as to why you kept returning to a vet that you were so unhappy with who clearly wasn't paying attention to the requests you were making.
> 
> I'd have been to another by now to have such appaling work taken care of.
> 
> ...


I have given reasons why in the other posts I made. 
I dont think I said I was really unhappy with the vets .. more upset that this has happend! Its not there fault.. they could not predict this... 

I also feel its much better to work with your vet (when you find a good one) rather than just find a new one when something ( that is not their fault) happens.



corny girl said:


> Most people are saying go & claim compensation, why when the vet hasn't really done anything wrong (some bitches do get a few bumps after surgery which is often a slight infection & they are usually given antibiotics anyway after a spay). The bitch had a reaction to the stitches (which i gather is rare but can happen), the vet wasn't to know this would happen with this bitch. The bitch was taken back & different stitches were used to try to stop a reaction happening again (to me the vet was trying to avoid it happening again so opted to use a different brand of suture). Unfortunately the bitch reacted again. Now if the bitch had been taken to another vet that vet wouldn't know which sutures had been used etc.. & you could of been back to square one.
> 
> Not all vets use dissolveable stitches, the vet that neuters & spays all our retired Greyhounds at the kennels i work at use normal stitches (i take the stitches out once the wounds have healed up which is normally after 10 days).


Exactly!



Shell195 said:


> I agree with this.
> Dissolvable stitches themselves can cause problems due to them being so hard and they take ages to actually dissolve which can cause irritation to the healing wound.


This is just what happend shell: victory:, Its the disolvable ones (inside) that she has reacted to , the external ones have healed lovely (which were taken out at day 10 and all looked good and healed well)
The reaction (inside) seems to happen once the external ones have healed and have been removed ... so my girl is reacting to the internal stitches at the point when they are disolving!
apparently very rare. 
They think its her body's imune system going into overdrive.

p.s excuse spelling mistakes and grammer! I don't get paid enough to do spell check on the forum and I never was great at english :whistling2:


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

It went well (or as well as can be expected) 
she doesnt seem to have another infection, we now just have to sit tight and hope the swelling goes down internally.
its just a matter of keeping a very close eye on her and hopefully it will stop reacting very soon. she will be closely watched by us and rushed to the vets if needed.
she has had a large dose of antibiotics that should help keep infection away.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

poor poor thing.
only just seen this!
this is awful!!

What vet was it?
(pm me pleaseeeee)


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## TommoNewton (Aug 27, 2010)

hows she doing ?


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

It looks like the swelling under the skin is going down (very slightly) :2thumb:
she does still have a very small open wound at the moment though that we are keeping a close eye on , its acting like a drain for the extra body fluids that she is making.

She is happy.. she is well in herself and showing no signs of discomfort ect...

although she is not out of the woods yet its looking more hopefull that she will not have to go under again to sort it out.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

It sounds like the wound is settling down now and hopefully she will make a complete recovery:2thumb:


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## TommoNewton (Aug 27, 2010)

great  , keep us updated


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Fingers crossed that she makes a full recovery :2thumb:. At least you know now that she reacts to dissolvable stitches :whistling2:.


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

Shell195 said:


> It sounds like the wound is settling down now and hopefully she will make a complete recovery:2thumb:


lets hope so: victory:.. I just have to be vigulant, I dont know how long the internal ones last inside and whilst they are breaking down anything can happen . 


TommoNewton said:


> great  , keep us updated


I will do thank you : victory:



corny girl said:


> Fingers crossed that she makes a full recovery :2thumb:. At least you know now that she reacts to dissolvable stitches :whistling2:.


I sure do! I just have to make sure she never needs dissolvable stitches again! :lol2:

I thought I would post these up.. not sure if they will make sence but the first picture is the cut where it has all gone on.. looks ok apart from the bobble.

definatly much better than it was last week and much much better than it was last time she reacted










I have added on this picture where the swelling was interenally (and aprox size)










her all chilled out after dinner










and after the W.A.L.K word was mentioned.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

Oh she is beautiful :flrt:, is she a GSD x Rottie? That wound is looking very good, doesn't look red at all now. A good tip for anyone who suspects an infection is to feel the area, if infection is present there will be heat at the site :2thumb:.


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## kazzy (Aug 17, 2009)

*shes looking good lets hope she well on her way to total recovery*


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

corny girl said:


> Oh she is beautiful :flrt:, is she a GSD x Rottie? That wound is looking very good, doesn't look red at all now. A good tip for anyone who suspects an infection is to feel the area, if infection is present there will be heat at the site :2thumb:.


Thank you
her mum was a akita x GSD and dad was either GSD or akita.
we are just not sure how much of each she is. Her mum was rescued whilst pregnant from a home that had two entire dogs.
she does have the rottie look about her though but some days looks very akita. 


kazzy said:


> *shes looking good lets hope she well on her way to total recovery*


thank you.. lets hope so.
she seems much happyer: victory:


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## ladyboid (Nov 25, 2007)

Keiko went to the vets again last night for her check up.
All is well! the swelling is still going down : victory:
(although we didnt need a vet to tell us that but its always good to get them to look at it aswell:lol2
next check up again in a weeks time! 


I am so pleased about this ! a few weeks ago I was sure she was going to have to be opened up again , if she had we would of had to go through all this again.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

ladyboid said:


> Keiko went to the vets again last night for her check up.
> All is well! the swelling is still going down : victory:
> (although we didnt need a vet to tell us that but its always good to get them to look at it aswell:lol2
> next check up again in a weeks time!
> ...



That's great news hun, she'll be back to normal again soon :2thumb:. Fingers crossed she doesn't have to have any other operations in her lifetime (well that need internal stitches anyway).


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