# HELP!! URGENT!! CRESTED GECKO ISSUE! Whats wrong with him?!



## Osk (Jun 28, 2013)

Hello

It's late where I live, and I just went to mist my Gecko before I went to bed, but instead I found it laying on its back as if it fell, with its legs all in a seized up position and its "hands" also seized up. It's eyes are constantly wide and if I put it on its back it won't move itself, it feels very ridged, hard almost. The only response I can get from it is it occasionally opening its mouth, but it seems like its tongue is bunched up.

The gecko is 4 months old at most and has never had anything wrong with it until this point, never been dropped and its been at 60-70% humidity always with around 24 degrees C of heat.

Please help!! What could be wrong?! Shock?! Is it dying?!


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## blabble182 (Dec 26, 2010)

Osk said:


> Hello
> 
> It's late where I live, and I just went to mist my Gecko before I went to bed, but instead I found it laying on its back as if it fell, with its legs all in a seized up position and its "hands" also seized up. It's eyes are constantly wide and if I put it on its back it won't move itself, it feels very ridged, hard almost. The only response I can get from it is it occasionally opening its mouth, but it seems like its tongue is bunched up.
> 
> ...


prob the best thing would be phone an emergency vet rather than posting on an internet forum?!

if im being completley blunt it doesn't sound good to be honest.


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## ip3kid (May 21, 2008)

I have no experience in such a case, however whilst reading it all that came to mind is that it's in rigor mortis. The muscle and limb stiffness etc, not sure about the mouth opening, could be a nerve twitching? Is it breathing at all?


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## Osk (Jun 28, 2013)

ip3kid said:


> I have no experience in such a case, however whilst reading it all that came to mind is that it's in rigor mortis. The muscle and limb stiffness etc, not sure about the mouth opening, could be a nerve twitching? Is it breathing at all?


Can't tell if it's breathing steadily...It's taken one or two breaths from what I can see. If it is they are incredibly slight. I'm so confused as to what caused this. It also went to the toilet about 15 minutes ago, so..


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## BretJordan (Apr 9, 2013)

Vet's need to be informed immediately for this one i'm afraid! Let us know what happens. 

Bret.


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## ip3kid (May 21, 2008)

Osk said:


> Can't tell if it's breathing steadily...It's taken one or two breaths from what I can see. If it is they are incredibly slight. I'm so confused as to what caused this. It also went to the toilet about 15 minutes ago, so..


One problem could be that it's had a stroke?(can reptiles have strokes?) from the ridiculous heat waves we've been having recently.
You really do need to call a vet ASAP.


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## hmendez (Jul 3, 2013)

How often do you give your crestie calcium?


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

you say the temp was only 22c, my house has been more than that over the last few days, a crestie living in a glass house the temps could have been much more, how are you measuring the temps, what with, where are they taken from, how often...anyway I guess all those questions can be answered after a vet visit but you need to make sure you give him/she the correct living conditions so he has something to work with, so maybe check those temps are correct.

Hope all goes well for you.


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

OH NO! A living creature appears to be gravely ill and in need of medical attention! I KNOW!!! I'll post on an internet forum and then sit around waiting for someone to give me a miracle cure!

This is a no brainier, call a vet.


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## arran7225 (Dec 21, 2008)

02:45 don't think a vet will be available!!! Can't get one out for my horse at that time pretty sure it will be the same for a gecko. 

So well done asking for advise in the meanwhile. 

How is he today?


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

arran7225 said:


> 02:45 don't think a vet will be available!!! Can't get one out for my horse at that time pretty sure it will be the same for a gecko.
> 
> So well done asking for advise in the meanwhile.
> 
> How is he today?


You can't find an emergency vet in KENT!?! It's not exactly the 3rd world is it?!? They don't come to you, you go to them and they are very expensive but you can always find one.


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## Woody82 (Dec 23, 2010)

every vets by law have to have some form of out of hours service. al be it they can hire another company to see it, and soemtimes in a bigger city if you live in the sticks. emergency treatment can not be refused either. so if your crestie or any other animal seems like its on deaths dorr they will have to see you!! (will cost an arm and leg and then some mind most of the time!!!)


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## GECKO MICK (Jun 6, 2012)

Doesn't sound good.Keep us updated with what the vet says.


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## blabble182 (Dec 26, 2010)

no vet at the time is very unlikely. ive found a vet at 4 in the morning on a sunday before. when something like that is wrong its your responsibility to find help for them. a quick google search finds all the out of hours vets, dartford, maidstone, gillingham and i know theres one in tunbridge wells. in the hours you were sat on a forum you could have got your pet help.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

Theres a absolutely noone within 2 hours of me that could help me with a reptile at night. Apart from to put it down. I have found in the past two of my rescues dead in the position you've mentioned. I put it down to heat, as they were on hot days.


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## Woody82 (Dec 23, 2010)

Alll vets will have some understanding of things reptile, but is a special area some excell at, like i said no vet can refuse treatment, some will suggest PTS but its your decision! if you say no they still have to do something! And there is an OOH service within about 30 mins max of everyone!!!!! (in mainland uk)


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## Woody82 (Dec 23, 2010)

anyhow how is the gecko?


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## micky0 (Jul 25, 2012)

geckograham said:


> OH NO! A living creature appears to be gravely ill and in need of medical attention! I KNOW!!! I'll post on an internet forum and then sit around waiting for someone to give me a miracle cure!
> 
> This is a no brainier, call a vet.


A bit mean , some people get upset and need reasurance. There is a lot of this on this forum , why I dont bother too much now !!


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

freekygeeky said:


> Theres a absolutely noone within 2 hours of me that could help me with a reptile at night. Apart from to put it down. I have found in the past two of my rescues dead in the position you've mentioned. I put it down to heat, as they were on hot days.


There is Vet 24, the University or Milton Vets. I'm not even from Cambridgeshire! Unless you are claiming that these vets are willing to euthanise but not treat and I wouldn't believe that for a second!


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## blabble182 (Dec 26, 2010)

freekygeeky said:


> Theres a absolutely noone within 2 hours of me that could help me with a reptile at night. Apart from to put it down. I have found in the past two of my rescues dead in the position you've mentioned. I put it down to heat, as they were on hot days.


really? obviously i dont know where you live but for future reference i think the practice chain is called cromwell vets? or cromwell vets group. one of my friends who's living up there at the moment has used them a couple of times said they're quite good. 4-5 locations around the area aswell, think theyre quite spread apart so you may have some luck with one being close to you, if not i know one of them does travel in the region for emergencys, but like said above it does cost a bit

EDIT:
I actually just googled it out of interest and practically all of cambridgeshire has vets within an hours drive of pretty much everywhere in the region, alot within half an hour, google maps search for "cambridgeshire emergency vets" the results of all the vets listings are numerous


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## Osk (Jun 28, 2013)

Well, according to the vet I took him too, he was dead for a while before I found him, and the rigidity was probably caused by Rigor Mortis. And the mouth opening and tongue flicking was something to do with his nervous system. He's unsure of the what killed him, but said its likely it fell and just landed wrong, damaging its spine. 

Also everyone asking why I didn't take it to a vet last night, it was almost 3 in the morning and I live too far from the vet for him to come to me, and I had no car.

RIP~Nyx


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## Drayvan (Jul 7, 2010)

People need to start building up good relationships with their vets... you need to find and be familiar with them BEFORE something bad happens (not just aimed at the OP)

Sorry to hear about the little gecko, it's such a shame when they go


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

Osk said:


> Well, according to the vet I took him too, he was dead for a while before I found him, and the rigidity was probably caused by Rigor Mortis. And the mouth opening and tongue flicking was something to do with his nervous system. He's unsure of the what killed him, but said its likely it fell and just landed wrong, damaging its spine.
> 
> Also everyone asking why I didn't take it to a vet last night, it was almost 3 in the morning and I live too far from the vet for him to come to me, and I had no car.
> 
> RIP~Nyx


Sorry to hear it.

I understand the vet thing, some of us don't have cars or the money in our pockets to jump in a taxi at 3am.


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## micky0 (Jul 25, 2012)

So sorry to hear abaout your little fella, sad to hear :gasp:


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

Do we need another long-winded thread about the importance of being prepared for medical emergencies? OP, it doesn't sound like your crestie could have been saved and many people wouldn't have found him until the next day so don't feel bad.

Generally speaking, it is against the law to deny a captive animal treatment where it is needed so you MUST have some kind of emergency fund in place, otherwise you can be classed as an animal abuser (technically).


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

geckograham said:


> Do we need another long-winded thread about the importance of being prepared for medical emergencies? OP, it doesn't sound like your crestie could have been saved and many people wouldn't have found him until the next day so don't feel bad.
> 
> Generally speaking, it is against the law to deny a captive animal treatment where it is needed so you MUST have some kind of emergency fund in place, otherwise you can be classed as an animal abuser (technically).


Sorry I disagree with your take on the law there, denying treatment is not the same as not having the money or having a fund set aside.

Happy to be proved wrong on this.


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

Jebb said:


> Sorry I disagree with your take on the law there, denying treatment is not the same as not having the money or having a fund set aside.
> 
> Happy to be proved wrong on this.


No ability to pay = no treatment = denying treatment.

It couldn't be simpler, YOUR pet = YOUR responsibility, NOBODY ELSE'S!

I've worked on (successful) prosecutions myself.


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## blabble182 (Dec 26, 2010)

in all fairness having a fund isn't a necessity, it comes it damn handy but most if not all vets will take a smaller amount as a deposit and then setup a payment plan for the costs of what ever happened. its handy to have for things like taxis etc if you don't drive, sample testing etc though.

Main thing now is to try and figure out why it happened, was it a fall or was it an error in husbandary. or was it a combination of weak bones due to calcium deficiency combined with the fall. only real way i except is a Post Mortem. but i personally have never put any of my animals through that after death


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

geckograham said:


> No ability to pay = no treatment = denying treatment.
> 
> It couldn't be simpler, YOUR pet = YOUR responsibility, NOBODY ELSE'S!
> 
> I've worked on (successful) prosecutions myself.


sorry again (I need to stop saying sorry when I'm really not:whistling2 but without calling you a liar, I doubt very much anyone was prosecuted never mind winning a case for not have the funds to treat an animal, I would think there was another aspect to the case, not just the lack of funds, I've watch animal recuse and the like (ok stop laughing it's good supporting evidence) some of the cases that don't make it to court are shocking so I really don't believe that...sorry.


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

Jebb said:


> sorry again (I need to stop saying sorry when I'm really not:whistling2 but without calling you a liar, I doubt very much anyone was prosecuted never mind winning a case for not have the funds to treat an animal, I would think there was another aspect to the case, not just the lack of funds, I've watch animal recuse and the like (ok stop laughing it's good supporting evidence) some of the cases that don't make it to court are shocking so I really don't believe that...sorry.


So without calling me a liar, you are calling me a liar?!? Prosecutions are easy, it's the sentencing that's a joke. Lack of funds is the defence of the vast majority of neglect cases. It's a defence that NEVER works!

I really don't care if you believe me or not. Who are you to me anyway?


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## Jesterone (Sep 30, 2012)

Jebb said:


> sorry again (I need to stop saying sorry when I'm really not:whistling2 but without calling you a liar, I doubt very much anyone was prosecuted never mind winning a case for not have the funds to treat an animal, I would think there was another aspect to the case, not just the lack of funds, I've watch animal recuse and the like (ok stop laughing it's good supporting evidence) some of the cases that don't make it to court are shocking so I really don't believe that...sorry.


There have been a few keepers on this very forum that have had visits from the RSPCA, given directions on what they need to improve on, but not had the money to follow through with these directions. In most cases this has led to the animals being removed, but some have ending in conviction.


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## blabble182 (Dec 26, 2010)

Jesterone said:


> There have been a few keepers on this very forum that have had visits from the RSPCA, given directions on what they need to improve on, but not had the money to follow through with these directions. In most cases this has led to the animals being removed, but some have ending in conviction.


i can back that, i know of a few one was indeed convicted under the animal rights act


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## geckograham (Jan 22, 2012)

I have never worked for or with the RSPCA, my job was with an organisation that actually does have legal authority! The two posts above are right though, if you say you can't afford to give your pets the proper care, they can be removed from you and a prosecution can (and often does) follow.


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## Woody82 (Dec 23, 2010)

sadly lack of money is no excuse for not getting treatment and as most have said, it is illegal and you can be prosecuted for not providing YOUR animal with treatment when its needed, and vice versa for vets refusing to see your pet (when its an emergency!)
even if you have no money a vet is obliged to carry out emergency treatment but be aware this is very likely to be a PTS, or pain releif to allow you to then get funds before further treatment!

Anyhow op really sorry for your loss


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## hmendez (Jul 3, 2013)

I'm sure all of you are frightening OP with all the prosecution talk.. Apparently there werent any tell tale sign that something deadly was going to happen. :/ My condolences OP!


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## jamlew (May 28, 2013)

To put it simply buying a pet and not having the money to give the animal a good standard of life and be ready for any care needed.its just like you wouldn't buy a car with out having money for tax insurance petrol etc. That's just my point of view. But still no need for arguements over this some people have different views end of. But if its part of the law you must abide by these laws.

Jam

Forgot to add I'm very sorry for your loss. There was nothing you could do so be assured there is no reason to be worried about all the talk of neglect and things. Hope this doesn't taint your love of reptiles


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## Firetaster (Apr 7, 2013)

Y'know the first few months of a cresties life are when they are very fragile-same goes for most species of anything.
Why anyone would buy a little one is beyond me!not a fan of the buying and selling of anything under a relatively decent age!


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## Woody82 (Dec 23, 2010)

i dont think anyone was actually trying to claim that the OP was neglecting his gecko, and i was just trying to get across both sides ie 
1. The OWNER has a requirement to seek veterinary assistance 
and also as importantly
2. Vets have to provide assistance, reptile specialists or not... ( but as i said with no money its only pain releif or PTS).

Both parties can be prosecuted. Both parties have responsibilities to ensure no suffering to animals!!!!!

Its a shame some people/owners dont have the confidence or beleif to just make the call to a vets as a first point of call!!


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## switchback (Nov 25, 2011)

OP sorry for the loss of your gecko, :sad:


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

geckograham said:


> So without calling me a liar, you are calling me a liar?!? Prosecutions are easy, it's the sentencing that's a joke. Lack of funds is the defence of the vast majority of neglect cases. It's a defence that NEVER works!
> 
> I really don't care if you believe me or not. Who are you to me anyway?


thought we were having a lighthearted debate but my bad :whistling2:


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## Jebb (Jul 3, 2013)

geckograham said:


> you MUST have some kind of emergency fund in place, otherwise you can be classed as an animal abuser (technically).





Jesterone said:


> There have been a few keepers on this very forum that have had visits from the RSPCA, given directions on what they need to improve on, but not had the money to follow through with these directions. In most cases this has led to the animals being removed, but some have ending in conviction.


To be fair this was the original point I was disagreeing with, that you have to have an emergency fund in place, or you can be classed as an animal abuser, many here I bet do not have such a fund and are not animal abusers.

To be clear, I agree if you do not have the funds to treat an animal you would be abusing that animal IF you let it suffer, but you always have the option to give the animal away or seek a free vet service, to claim a lack of a emergency fund classes you as an abuser is a bit OTT.


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## Iulia (Mar 2, 2011)

Geez.

The poor guy's (gal's) gecko is dead.

It was probably dead when he found it.

There are frankly lots of reasons why people might not jump into a taxi with a dead or dying gecko at 3am.

Maybe having people in the house that could not be left? or maybe needing to go to work in a few hours? 

But no, the forum gestapo got to get going. Yeah in the ideal world we have all got hundreds of pounds in shoeboxes under the bed waiting for reptile emergencies in the middle of the night ... but some people live in the real world of kids and jobs and recession. 

FFS 

Sorry mate about your pet. Suggest you ignore the rest of this thread.


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## Jesterone (Sep 30, 2012)

I hadn't read the whole thread was just making a comment on the topic being discussed. I doubt the OP will be back anyway seeing as he/she only registered for this purpose. With any luck anyway.


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## ChelsNLuke (Jun 23, 2012)

Iulia said:


> Geez.
> 
> The poor guy's (gal's) gecko is dead.
> 
> ...


Surely getting your animal to the vets is more important than going to work? :whistling2:

When I first got my CRB we had issues with the temperature and I had work in like four hours, I stayed up all night just to make sure the temps were okay, if my pet or animal was suffering I would take it to the vets, be it midday or midnight, I would get them to a vets. 
Priorities these days are so mixed up, an animals life for an hour or two late for work, I know which I'd choose.

-Luke


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## nicnet (Apr 3, 2011)

Jesterone said:


> There have been a few keepers on this very forum that have had visits from the RSPCA, given directions on what they need to improve on, but not had the money to follow through with these directions. In most cases this has led to the animals being removed, but some have ending in conviction.



Show me one.....just one case of where that has happened....

To be honest, if they ever knocked at my door I'd tell them where to get off. They forget they are a CHARITY and have absolutly no rights at all to remove any animal from anywhere without the express written consent of the owner. 
They have absolutly no legal rights at all to enter a property and have no say at all in how anyone keeps their animals. If the police is with them, then its purely at their request as they tell the police they are expecting trouble and the police are there only to keep the peace and in no other legal capacity, again they do not have right of entry and neither to the police unless they are carrying a search warrant.
They put on fancy uniforms and try pretend they are a law unto themselves to intimidate people into handing over reptiles that are more often than not put to sleep as they have no clue how to care for them.

The only thing they do is to make private PERSECUTIONS of people who do not keep animals to the letter of their care sheets. Which in the case of reptiles are mostly wrong and would kill the reptile if you kept them in those conditions. Go read their care sheet on beardies just for a start. I've been trying for 2 years now to get them to change that but some 'expert' in their charity who has no clue decided there was nothing wrong with it.


Back on topic.

I'm really sorry to OP for the loss of your little gecko. As you've only had him a relativly short time It may be possible that he was not as healthy as he should have been when you got him, but also possible that you made some husbandry mistakes. Either way you'll never know. All you can do really is to move on and do a heap more research before getting another reptile so if anything ever happens again you can rule out any husbandry issues.


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## Jesterone (Sep 30, 2012)

Somebody just loves the RSPCA lol. 

I'll PM you the latest one when I get to work and have time to find the link. This has already gone way off topic I don't want to prolong it further.


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## Iulia (Mar 2, 2011)

ChelsNLuke said:


> Surely getting your animal to the vets is more important than going to work? :whistling2:


Depends I think. If you would lose your job if you didn't turn up, and you have a mortgage and kids, actually I think many people would think the job.

My point was nobody had any idea of the OP's circumstances when they started jumping on him. He could have had three kids at home under the age of ten and a father with alzheimers in the house for all anyone knew.


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## Jesterone (Sep 30, 2012)

Iulia said:


> Depends I think. If you would lose your job if you didn't turn up, and you have a mortgage and kids, actually I think many people would think the job.
> 
> My point was nobody had any idea of the OP's circumstances when they started jumping on him. He could have had three kids at home under the age of ten and a father with alzheimers in the house for all anyone knew.


Welcome to the Internet


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## ChelsNLuke (Jun 23, 2012)

Iulia said:


> Depends I think. If you would lose your job if you didn't turn up, and you have a mortgage and kids, actually I think many people would think the job.
> 
> My point was nobody had any idea of the OP's circumstances when they started jumping on him. He could have had three kids at home under the age of ten and a father with alzheimers in the house for all anyone knew.


Then he should have a plan in place for just a situation, no? I'm sorry but getting an animal is a responsibility, it's not something to come second or third, but a living creature who should get the help it needs when it needs it, regardless or circumstances. If you are gonna get fired from missing one day at work then what sorta job is that? I work for Asda and they knew from the day I started that I kept reptiles and that if they needed help on a work day I would just go and do it, they know that because I told them... Animals deserve the care they require.

I am sad for the OP but again, saying there is no vets at 3am or no way to get to the vets is just poor excuses and shouldn't be accepted. 
Just my thoughts of course

-Luke


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## TractorTotty (Jun 3, 2013)

ChelsNLuke said:


> Surely getting your animal to the vets is more important than going to work? :whistling2:


Some people dont have jobs that they can just 'be late' for.. here at home on our farm, the farm and our work is our lives, we dont leave work at the end of the day, go home and forget about it, our work and the farm is our livelihood, work and home is the same thing! It is now coming up to harvest and when something needs doing, it needs doing. We are working flat-out already hay making and you can't just turn up late when you are working on a farm.. if you are late, harvest is late ~ no food ~ people cant eat. Simple. Its not a 9 to 5 job. The same with lambing season, you stay up all night, every night, without fail, for weeks and weeks on end, and you have to be there in those lambing sheds.

Saying that, I would never deny any of my animals treatment, just making a point that not everyone can just be late for work just like that, its just not realistic. One of our working spaniels got his foot stuck in one of the steps on the tractor as he was coming down them last harvest and needed emergency vet treatment as he injured himself badly.. obviously he wasn't denied treatment and was taken and sorted straightaway, but we had to get someone else to take him because it was the busiest day of the year and stopping just wasn't an option.

I am a bit of an OTT pet owner and have a savings account specifically for vets bills that may arise for my 2 dogs or my 2 leos, so hopefully I will be able to cover anything that may happen (touch wood, hopefully nothing will!) but I am realistic about the fact that if anything happens that they need to be seen urgently for, it may not be myself taking them, because important as they are, work is also of paramount importance here! I also know my local vets personally and have good relationships with them, even though they are part of a chain of vet hospitals in the area, and it helps that they know our pets in case they are taken in with someone other than ourselves.

The same goes for all of our livestock here, although it is slightly different with livestock vets. Local farmers all tend to have a very good personal relationship with their livestock vet.

RIP to the OP;s crestie ~ I am sorry to hear of your loss.


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## jamlew (May 28, 2013)

ChelsNLuke said:


> Then he should have a plan in place for just a situation, no? I'm sorry but getting an animal is a responsibility, it's not something to come second or third, but a living creature who should get the help it needs when it needs it, regardless or circumstances. If you are gonna get fired from missing one day at work then what sorta job is that? I work for Asda and they knew from the day I started that I kept reptiles and that if they needed help on a work day I would just go and do it, they know that because I told them... Animals deserve the care they require.
> 
> I am sad for the OP but again, saying there is no vets at 3am or no way to get to the vets is just poor excuses and shouldn't be accepted.
> Just my thoughts of course
> ...


It's a fair point but in my circumstances I have a 6 month old daughter and a girlfriend who is currently out of work (due to having the child) and have a mortgage.
Theses are my highest priority in my eyes and for me, if to miss a day of work for a pet could put my family at risk in any way (not that it would as luck would have it) I would not do it call me all you want. It's just how my priorities are that doesn't mean I neglect them or am a bad keeper its just some people's lives are harder. Luckily I have some back up funds if anything were to happen and also have a very helpful family around me so if worst. came to worst and I had to work iv got a few people that could take any pets to the vets. Peace and love brother!

Jam


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## colinm (Sep 20, 2008)

I think that this has gone round and round in circles.

Seeing that the gecko was already dead at three oclock in the morning I cannot see what good it would do to tell the op to call a vet at that time.Perhaps people would be better to give advice on why the gecko died rather thn the merrits of their particular ownership.This is a forum to give advice not to flame new members down for what may have been a natural death.


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