# Whats wrong with this setup? Noob here



## Snake_eyes (Jan 5, 2009)

Hello,

I hoping someone on here can give me some advice. I was bought as a present some leopard gecko's a month ago. The shop that sold the reptiles to my girlfriend recommended all the equipment bought.

Since then I've been to a different shop to purchase some cricket. whilst I was there I got talking to the guy who runs the shop, who asked what equipment I had. When I told him, him said I had been sold the wrong stuff and I needed to change it.

I currently have a heat mat at one side of the viv and a light at the other. I have some type of corn material on the ground + water bowl etc. I'm about to order a wet box and thermostat also.

He said I need to remove the light and heat mat, an replace it with a heat lamp/thermostat? He also said I must remove the material on the ground and fill the base with sand? 

I don't know if he just wanted a sale or he was trying to be helpful!











He also said that the type of leopard gecko's I have can't live in the same viverium? Is this true? 





















Can some please look at the setup I have and point me in the right direction. 

Thanks


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## Natonstan (Aug 9, 2008)

If there both males then they cannot live together as they can fight and kill each other


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## Philcw (Feb 7, 2008)

Your setup is fine, although there isnt any need for a light.
As long as temps are correct then a heat mat at one side is fine as it gives a warm and cool end.

Regarding the substrate, i personally wouldn't use a loose substrate as it can cause impactation, with sand being one of the worse the guy sounds like he is talking hot air lol

Also did he give you a reason why the leo's couldn't live together?

As if only one of them or none of them are male, they are both around the same size and healthy, and if your viv is large enough, then there is no reason they shouldn't be housed together.


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## HERP-man (Dec 22, 2008)

EDIT: everyones said what i wrote! haha.


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

Snake_eyes said:


> I currently have a heat mat at one side of the viv and a light at the other. I have some type of corn material on the ground + water bowl etc. I'm about to order a wet box and thermostat also.
> He said I need to remove the light and heat mat, an replace it with a heat lamp/thermostat? He also said I must remove the material on the ground and fill the base with sand?
> I don't know if he just wanted a sale or he was trying to be helpful!



would say he wanted a sale 
personally would keep the heatmat and run it from a stat, would ditch the light and the loose substrate ~ I would replace the substrate with tiles/lino or similar 



> He also said that the type of leopard gecko's I have can't live in the same viverium? Is this true?


 no it's not true ~ leo's do very well in wooden vivs :2thumb:


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## treacle82 (Aug 1, 2008)

hi,
you need to have the hot end just at one end of the viv & then a cooler end is left at the other side. have a search on here, im sure there's a care sheet but i cant find it at the mo :blush:

leopard geckos don't need a light either hun

as long as you don't have two males i don't see why the cant live together.

edit: just seen other posts above so all the same really


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## Meko (Apr 29, 2007)

to be honest i don't think either of them have much of a clue.

1 sold you corn as a substrate which isn't too good and a mat at one end and a light at the other.

The second told you to lose the mat and light and get a heat light.. 
The light will act be a heat light as it gives light and heat!

you need a heat mat or light, both on a stat, in the hot end. 



with the leos not being the type to live together it can only be 2 males or a male and female with the female being too young to breed.


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## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

there is no reason why males cant live together!

my friend also breeds geckos and keeps several males in one enclousres and they get along fine it is only if a female is added when fighting begins


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## Philcw (Feb 7, 2008)

DRD said:


> there is no reason why males cant live together!
> 
> my friend also breeds geckos and keeps several males in one enclousres and they get along fine it is only if a female is added when fighting begins


LOL and the small matter of territory


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

I'd say yes, get rid of the corn substrate (it is NOT digestible and could cause problems) and replace it with something else - my preference is for stone tiles personally as that more closely matches what they'd live on in the wild. They don't live on loose sand, so that's a fairly unnatural choice too.

Heat mat: get it on a thermostat as soon as possible, and I would say personally that if you do not have a thermostat now and your house isn't too cool, unplug the mat completely. If your house is quite cold, put the heat mat on the wall of the vivarium instead - this will reduce the risk of burns until you get the thermostat set up.

The heat mat and the light (if you choose to use the light for viewing) should be at the same end of the vivarium - this creates a warm side and a cool side, so they can regulate their temperatures. I would swap that big huge bulb for a very low wattage (15-25 watt) blue or red bulb personally - and use it only for viewing them.

And there's absolutely no reason - assuming that you do not have two males (which will have to be separated as they do fight) - that your normal and your albino leopard geckos cannot live in the same vivarium. Do you know what sexes they are? If not - if you post photos of each gecko side-on (so you can see the side and bottom of the tail) and from underneath (put the gecko in a cricket box then take a photograph up through the bottom) we can help you work out whether you've got two girls, a boy and a girl or two boys.


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## Jade01 (Feb 21, 2007)

DRD said:


> there is no reason why males cant live together!
> 
> my friend also breeds geckos and keeps several males in one enclousres and they get along fine it is only if a female is added when fighting begins


 
I'm afraid not, males will fight, whether it takes 2months or 2years. Males are really terratorial(sp).

But to the OP,
I think your viv looks and sounds fine, I'd change their substrate though


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## Meko (Apr 29, 2007)

DRD said:


> there is no reason why males cant live together!
> 
> my friend also breeds geckos and keeps several males in one enclousres and they get along fine it is only if a female is added when fighting begins


 
i hope you're not a marriage guidence councillor!

males will fight, its a domination thing. Yep *some* can be ok together if they've lived together all their lives. Question is, if he's a breeder why is he keeping males together and then throwing a female in for breeding? you sure you listened properly?


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## Snake_eyes (Jan 5, 2009)

First, thanks everyone for your advice, I wasn't expecting such a response! What a great forum :2thumb:.

Right so the general advice is too, remove the lamp and replace with lower wattage bulb/lamp (15 watt IRed). Is their any advantage to having it in a timer? I:e on a night when it gets colder? or shall I put that on a stat aswell?

Put heat mat on a thermostat. What setting is best? (Temp)

Ditch the corn substrate and replace with tiles. Are any kind of floor tiles acceptable? I have some spare thats all.

I've seen some hard compacting sand which sort of sets, whats the general opinion on that stuff?

Is a wet room needed also? I read it help with the moistor levels and can help with the skin removal.

With regards to why they can't live together. The guy asked me what colours they both were. I told him green/yellow colour and the other is more of a red/yellow colour. He started saying the latter must be an African gecko?!!!

Thanks again you lot! anymore advice is more than welcome.

P:S I will post some more photo's so I can find out what sex they are.


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## Meko (Apr 29, 2007)

for a leo about 90f i think but can't remember..

you don't really need a light in there except for viewing purposes.

any kind of tiles are fine although not too thick of the heat from the heat mat won't get through

you don't need a wet 'room' but a moist hide will aid shedding

by the sound of it from what you've said he may have thought they were different types of gecko rather than 2 leopard geckos


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Snake_eyes said:


> I've seen some hard compacting sand which sort of sets, whats the general opinion on that stuff?


I would worry about what it might do if the geckos swallowed a bit.



> Is a wet room needed also? I read it help with the moistor levels and can help with the skin removal.


Yes, having a damp hide is a good idea.



> With regards to why they can't live together. The guy asked me what colours they both were. I told him green/yellow colour and the other is more of a red/yellow colour. He started saying the latter must be an African gecko?!!!


There is a similar species- African Fat-tailed geckos - which are dark reddish brown and yellow/tan/orange - but you definitely don't have one. Yours are definitely both Leopard geckos, and the yellow and pinkish-brown one is an albino.


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## retri (Mar 5, 2008)

i would have the light above the heatmat, apart from that it seems fine :2thumb:


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## DRD (Nov 12, 2008)

i hope you're not a marriage guidence councillor!

males will fight, its a domination thing. Yep *some* can be ok together if they've lived together all their lives. Question is, if he's a breeder why is he keeping males together and then throwing a female in for breeding? you sure you listened properly?


he doesnt throw a female in with them he takes the males of choice and puts them in the females enclosure.
oh nd yh did listen properly as double checked wid him!!!
he said the reason y he puts all the males together is that they are very active and a bit of fighting helps to stimulate the breeding.

i however just keep all 30 of my leos paired up male to female and dont mix males!!!!
i have also been breeding geckos for 11 years now and it is only when they are sexually mature they may fight!!!!!!!!!


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## SleepyD (Feb 13, 2008)

> and a bit of fighting helps to stimulate the breeding.





> i have also been breeding geckos for 11 years now and it is only when they are sexually mature they may fight


two things ~ have to say that firstly I have never needed to ~ nor heard other responsible breeders needing to ~ stimulate a male leo's breeding ability by deliberately overstimulating his natural territorial aggression and secondly I've found that males can start fighting each other as young as 4-5 months (if not younger) hence why I seperate them as soon as I even suspect they are males.


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## Meko (Apr 29, 2007)

DRD said:


> he said the reason y he puts all the males together is that they are very active and a bit of fighting helps to stimulate the breeding.


maybe but its not the best advice for a newbie keeper..


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## Snake_eyes (Jan 5, 2009)

Right I still have a few questions. After reading the advice in this thread. I turned the light off and left the viv over night. When I woke up this morning the air temp in the viv at both ends was in the low 20's (69-72f). I know the ground temp in the area where the heat mat is will be higher, but isnt this generally too low?

So here are my questions

1) What temperature should the ground be above the heat mat?
2) What temperature should the air be in the hot and cold side?
3) Should the new red/blue light be used all the time? or just when the air temperature gets low? 
4) I know geckos DON'T need light, but doesn't a light cycle help? 12hours on 12hours off, to simulate day and night?
5) should their hide (See pics) be placed in the hot end/ above the heat mat?
6) I've ordered a wet room/hide is this best in the hot or cold end?
7) Someone recommeded to me a basking rock, should I get one? would it be best place under light so it gets warm

Sorry for all the questions, but if I get these questions answered I will be much happier.

Thanks


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## Bosscat (Sep 1, 2008)

Snake_eyes said:


> Right I still have a few questions. After reading the advice in this thread. I turned the light off and left the viv over night. When I woke up this morning the air temp in the viv at both ends was in the low 20's (69-72f). I know the ground temp in the area where the heat mat is will be higher, but isnt this generally too low?
> 
> So here are my questions
> 
> ...


Hope this helps


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## ryanthepet (May 6, 2008)

no 1 as said anythin about a uv you will need 1 due to your lizards getting mbd metabolic bone desiese


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Leopard geckos, being nocturnal, do not strictly require UVB to avoid getting MBD. Appropriate supplementation of calcium on correctly gut-loaded livefood is adequate. In the case of some morphs - albinos particularly - UVB can actually harm their eyes.

If you DO use UVB lighting with leopard geckos it should be restricted to 12 hours of daylight only, and I would use a 2% bulb at max.


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