# Skunks - Are they next?



## TSKA Rory Matier

"I smell a skunk!" 

It has been suggested today that the RSPCA may indeed be looking to launch a 'skunk awareness' campaign - this usually means the pre - emptives - are the start to a more serious campaign aimed at a species.

To the untrained eyes - these would just be small media alerts - to the trained eye however - this is a possible preliminary campaign?

Skunk kicks up a stink at a Blackpool nightclub | the Daily Mail

RSPCA || News

Hopefully Blossom & Nancy will find a new 'homes' and not sent to the Antarctic for the rest of their days?

R


----------



## ratboy

"After a successful appeal to find Blossom's owner, it was discovered that the animal had escaped a few days previously, and the decision was made to sign her over to RSPCA care."

Who's decision ? the RSPCA's or the owners ?


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Mmm*

Indeed, 

"curiouser and curiouser!" said Alice

R


----------



## powderpuff_girl

once again call me ignorant but i havent heard about this whats happening?


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Skunk*

Hi, 

Basically the RSPCA do not specifically place 'interesting stories' on their website just for the sake of keeping the readership informed, there are usually underlying reasons for it.

The fact that Blossom has appeared would strongly suggest that there is every possibility that the RSPCA wish to look into the keeping of Skunk keeping with a view to potentially banning it, or raising an awareness of skunk keepers and the pitfalls of keeping skunks.

Descenting of skunks - a long held forum conversation piece - is classed as mutilation and is seriously frowned upon, as well as and more importantly - illegal...now. Piece of legislation made it illegal as a practice this year.

I should imagine in the next few weeks we will quite possibly see other skunk related issues with RSPCA involvement hitting the press.

R


----------



## brittone05

Apprently, the RSPCA's own rescue centres don't understand the new leigalstion either as she clearly states "You can have them descented".

Poor little love though - no wonder she sprayed with all them people surrounding her and being bundled into a bag!!


----------



## Andy

So your saying that because the RSPCA have a story about skunks on their website they may be going to start a campaign about potentially banning them? Seems quite a jump from one story to banning a species in my opinion. I suppose the saying from little acorns and all that but cant see it myself.


----------



## Nerys

> but cant see it myself


i guess thats the advantage of rory's many years in the trade.. seeing things like this before. you don't even keep skunks andy, so you are probably not as up to speed on the issues as we are.

we know they are a target, and thats kinda the bottom line really.

N


----------



## Andy

Sneaky edit nerys! 

No i dont keep skunks but that doesnt change my opinion that because the RSPCA have a little article on their website that they are planning on banning keeping skunks. They even have a quote from an RSPCA person saying they make good pets. They also have piglets and ducklings on there. 

Like you say, being skunk keepers your will know far far more than me about it which is good.


----------



## Nerys

de-scenting is ALREADY banned, as of this year, thats what i mean about not knowing all the facts i guess


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Not being funny...*

Hi Andy, 

Not being funny, but you sort of politically opened yourself up there.

The fact is that as Nerys has pointed out - yes Skunk Descenting was made illegal this year.

The RSPCA have always been against the keeping of non native exotic pets in the UK for some time, whereas before they did not have legislation to back them up with skunks - they now have, And as such it is the right time to look at a potential campaign against those that do keep them.

R


----------



## Andy

Like nerys pointed out i dont keep them but...since descenting is banned and therefore noone should have skunks with the gland removed after it came into effect wouldn't that sort of put a stop to people buying them already? Or would people still want to keep them if they can spray?


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Now that is...*

..........a highly debated question Andy.

And one l assure you has been quarrelled about for many a year.

Do keepers wish to own entire skunks?

Yes.

Do keepers wish to own descented skunks?

Yes.

This is a very political issue now, as is primates, and as is reptiles.


The RSPCA would love to be able to politically prosecute a skunk keeper, as they tried to prosecute a primate keeper last year and failed.

But l do seriously think that as said the time for campaign is now.

R


----------



## Andy

That well may be i and hope it doesnt happen as i know hannah would be gutted if she lost her skunk! So does the rule on descenting just ban the practice of performing it or the owning of an animal that has had it done? I dont know the ins and outs of descenting but surely its no more invasive than castration etc for dogs?


----------



## shiva&kaa123

I think it's a similiar argument to venomoids, taking away the defence etc.
Plus I think it's quite an intrusive op.
Ben


----------



## Nerys

its not that much of an intrusive operation at all actually no..

but then i guess you do not own a skunk either? and have never looked into it being done?

the operation is done at a few weeks old, and take a very short time indeed..

it takes less time than removal of a dogs womb.. and is far less intrusive... it also takes longer to remove an amimals balls.. and yet that is fully acceptable - even on a rat who lives in a maisonette, or a cat who lives indoors in a cage all its life.

in terms of being invasive, de-scenting a skunk does not change the hormone balance in the animals - spaying DOES and so does castration. in fact as i said to the RSPCA Inspector stood cuddling Snuff on my landing.. no offense, but if i removed your nuts and turned you into a eunuch, your personality would change somewhat also!

its nothing like de-fanging a snake no. a skunk cannot kill you with spray! nor does a skunks spray help to digest its food. a venomous snake does NOT use its venom for defense as a primary function, it uses it to kill its dinner. a snake would rather not waste venom attacking something it cannot eat, as the biological debt is too high unless actual death is threatened.

de-scenting a skunk does not, that we know, have ANY effect on a captive skunk. spraying is ONLY used as defense, and as keepers we aim to remove the need for them to defend anyway.

in honesty, the only people i know keeping a scented skunk in the UK, i have just found out, will not publicly admit to doing so 

most people do not know enough about the operation, the cause and effect, and so on, to really know where they should stand on this one. or at least, they don't until they have met my skunks!

N


----------



## Andy

So basically your saying that skunk descenting is harmless. Who were the people campaigning to get it banned then? And who has banned it? Is it a criminal offence for someone to perform it? I am just wondering where the justification comes from other than the RSPCA dont want you to keep them.


----------



## Nerys

it started when the RVCS declared it an un ethical procedure.. the rcvs were asked by the government to compile a list of animals classed as mutilated species, and skunks were on that list.

no experts were pulled forward to argue this point, and so the legislation went up to the houses of parliement and was passed. somewhere there is a large gap, as the original statement was back in 1997, and the legislation passed this year, 10 years on.

the RCVS used to have links up to the document, but its recently been taken down, why one wonders.. it has meant i am telling you off remembered knowledge and so i may come back and confirm bits as and when i find them.

spaying and castration is seen as acceptable mutilation.. although i am not sure why tbh.. its supposed to be for the good of the species.. so how is it that i know cats castrated to stop them spaying - when they live their entire life indoors in a flat in chelsea?

the person who wrote the recomendation did this as pretty much her last act with the RCVS - where did they next turn up? working at the rspca thats where 

justification. good question. WHY is it ok to spay a cat who has no access to the outside world? Why is ok to castrate a rat so he does not make as bad a smell?? why yes to those, and no to an op that takes moments, and causes no side effects or long term effects post op?

if you are coming to essex, come and meet my skunks. come and see how "un-domesticated" they are!!!

N


----------



## Andy

I can see the justification in speying/castrating dogs as there are thousands and thousands left on the streets every year. I would like to see doctors practicing the same on human sex offenders but thats an entirely different debate!

So the person who wrote this for the RCVS then went to work for the RSPCA? What do they now do at the RSPCA? What other mutilations did they list it would be interesting to know! It seems another case of the government wanting to help but actually going about it the wrong way but you can hardly blame them. They asked the top dog vets in the country and they told them something,which maybe is wrong, so they took it as the truth and banned it.


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Justification*

It was all part of the Mutilations ban consultations.

I know for a fact that there are keepers on here, that do possess some very sound information on the actual dates and quite probably the missing intrim period.

On my forum of last year [Piedipers Ark] there was very hot debate leading up to the Skunk De-scenting legislation passing, and l also know how passionate skunk keepers are.

Last year l wrote to the RCVS to find out their views on this subject and they were very closed about it, here is their response:

_Dear Mr Matier,_


_Thank you for your email of today’s date._


_The Mutilations Report, an annex to the College's Guide to Professional Conduct, states that:_

_"The discharge of anal sac contents as a result of fear or other stress is normal, and the removal of normally functioning sacs is not an acceptable procedure. Infection or other pathological conditions can result in recurring or chronic discharge or in fistula and sinus formation. Removal in such circumstances is an acceptable therapeutic measure. Anal sacs are sometimes removed from animals such as the skunk and fox in order to make them more acceptable as domestic animals. The Working Party does not accept that this is an ethical procedure and considers that anal sacs should not be removed for other than therapeutic reasons."_

_The full report is available on the RCVS website here:_​

_*RCVS Online / k. Mutilations report*_


I hope this is of assistance. If you have any further queries, please feel free to contact me.

Now this link is dead, as is the information to it.

Skunks can be spayed and such by vets, but they will not carry out this proceedure unless the skunk is descented, and because that is now illegal this can not be achieved.

The ploy then was to ensure that the keeping of skunks was to cease.

It is a very heated debate even now.

R


----------



## Andy

So basically the RCVS are saying that since they deem it as a procedure that only benefits the keeper and not the skunk itself, then it cannot be done. I suppose in a way it makes sense in my humble opinion. I dont have a problem with people wanting it and having it done by the way I can just see why it is a hotly debated subject in the skunk keeping world.


----------



## loulou

This is a highly debatable topic, and often gets heated. 

Personal opinion, I do not think that it is an intrusive op I am lucky I have had a blow by blow of the procedure from a vet that used to do the op. I have also seen the skunk kits go in for an op and be returned from it, it was 20 minutes all in all per kit and the longest part was actually knocking them out. I see one of these skunks in question on nearly a daily basis and she is wonderful! would she have the indoor cushdy lifestyle she has now if the op never took place? no i doubt it, if she was whole I expect she would of been in an outside enclosure or she would of been inside and the bonding process for her and her owner would of been very different. 

But then the other side of the coin, I also know a skunk keeper who has a whole skunk, the bonding process is alot slower they cannot do what they would do with a descented skunk for fear of spraying in their home. The trust took a long time but they are finally getting there, they are nutty as hell though and i dont expect any normal person would have a whole live firing skunk in their home if they lived in the same place. There is also the fear from landlords, what would your landlord say if you had a live firing skunk in your house? you would be likely evicted its something I know they do not shout about for fear of this.

You cannot win with this little law, you can either break it and have descented skunks in your home or you can go along with it and risk ASBOs and eviction, a no win situation really. I

ts something that skunk owners (and exotic owners really as you could be next) need to fight we are losing our choices and this is not just effecting us but the animals as well.

NOTE: please no PMs I will not name vets or skunk owners names on this even though no laws were broken at the time.


----------



## Andy b 1

i wouldnt want a un-descented skunk thats for sure 

had a few of them wandering about in canada


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Another point...*

Is this.

If the RSPCA are not looking to have an extension of DEFRA, what is the need for the vast cash reserves they have as coffers in their bank accounts?

Prosecutions and court cases possibly as was originally raised by Gordon.

What does the normal ten day court case cost nowadays?

If a body is looking to prosecute, then you make damn sure that you can afford it.

With £200 million plus, how many court cases could you afford?

R


----------



## loulou

Skunk Descenting

For anyone thats interested (I think this is american but you get the idea) skunk descenting op some photos (the second to last one is not included in the descenting op)

and heres some piccys of spaying a skunk, 

Skunk Haven&#8482: Veterinary Care (pg. 3)

now looking at this (obviously we are not vets) which would you say is the most intrusive? oh and which one is illegal?


----------



## Snakes r grreat

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> Is this.
> 
> If the RSPCA are not looking to have an extension of DEFRA, what is the need for the vast cash reserves they have as coffers in their bank accounts?
> 
> Prosecutions and court cases possibly as was originally raised by Gordon.
> 
> What does the normal ten day court case cost nowadays?
> 
> If a body is looking to prosecute, then you make damn sure that you can afford it.
> 
> With £200 million plus, how many court cases could you afford?
> 
> R


 
And the best bit is, they have £200 million of donated money in the kitty, yet all the centre's have to fund themselves, some just about manage.


----------



## Fixx

I personally don't think this is the beginning of an anti-skunk campaign by the RSPCA. It's just coincidental that two skunk stories have cropped up on the same day. Most people are aware of a what exactly a skunk is and can remember Pepe Le Pue. Also bearing in mind that skunks are not well known or commonly kept pets in the UK, and not many are priviledged to know any skunks themselves, so have no idea of what wonderful 'pets' they make, it makes for an interesting story in the papers that people will find entertaining/fascinating/educational/shocking/unusual, and could well have been the most interesting bit of news from that area.


----------



## Fixx

The whole skunk who wenrt clubbing in Blackpool has now been rehomed to a lady in the Lake District.


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Are they aren't they?*

Hi Fixx, 

Well that is super that the entire skunk is now rehomed.

Your summary of it not happening would be a blessing if it was not for the fact that inside calls always occur and we were notified that a campaign against the keeping of skunks could well have been on the books.

Your description of cloak and dagger not being effective is also not exactly that correct. I do not use cloak and dagger but l do use propaganda, and if raising awareness to a potential problem is sufficient to spell the message out to our watchers that we are aware then it may be sufficient a message to stop the mechanism in its working.

Rory


----------



## Fixx

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> Hi Fixx,
> 
> Well that is super that the entire skunk is now rehomed.
> 
> Your summary of it not happening would be a blessing if it was not for the fact that inside calls always occur and we were notified that a campaign against the keeping of skunks could well have been on the books.
> 
> Your description of cloak and dagger not being effective is also not exactly that correct. I do not use cloak and dagger but l do use propaganda, and if raising awareness to a potential problem is sufficient to spell the message out to our watchers that we are aware then it may be sufficient a message to stop the mechanism in its working.
> 
> Rory


So who has notified you "that a campaign against the keeping of skunks could well have been on the books."? In the original post on this thread you stated "it has been suggested" that a campaign may be about to be undertaken, in PM's to me you as good as told me it was definitely going ahead in six weeks time, and yet in your last post you state "that a campaign against the keeping of skunks *could *well have *been* on the books". So which is it? Is it definitely going to happen, or is it possibly going to happen? Either way, as I have already asked you here and via PM, where is this information coming from? 

This is what I meant by cloak and dagger, the lack of a definititive answer to these questions, as I said in my PM to you, people will take more notice and possibly be willing to stand up and take notice and action if facts are posted rather than suppositions and "what if's". Your post entitled "5 years and counting" is another example of this, some will read it as scare mongering, some will read it as fact, yet nowhere did you say in your original post that the five years was in fact lifted from a comment by someone else on another thread, so this could be read as scaremongering or another "what if..."
Nerys also told Andy in this thread that as he did not keep skunks he was "probably not as up to speed on the issues as we are."
Well guess what, we keep skunks and this thread was the first we had heard of it too. At no point did neither you or Nerys think to give us the heads up, or tell us where this information is coming from or where to find it. I have no doubt you are passionate in your beliefs but unless you actually talk to those people that want to help, or could help then you are going to be fighting an uphill battle all the way. If you had told us where this information was coming from, then perhaps you would have had another voice in this thread helping the 'doubters' get the message.


----------



## Nerys

> At no point did neither you or Nerys think to give us the heads up,


this WAS your heads up on it. i would have pm'd you direct tbh, but seeing as you had the arse with me, did not.

most police informants do not broadcast who they are to their "class" either.. a source is a source, why do you need to know their name? 

we got told, the rspca are gearing up for a campaign about skunks. we told you about it, via here. and the problem with that is???? 

i'm not honestly sure what your problem is fixx, bar you are sore at me right now, so feel the need to take it out like this.. 

Nerys


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Good o*

Hi Fixx, 

Good stuff.

So why do l need to be concerned at this point in time?

This mechanism is now in place to those reading internally and externally.

We will wait and see.

Interpret that how you wish.

Heads up, l have to agree the heads up was in the pm's to you, and l don't even know you that well.

But by your posting in sypnosis of my pm's to you, you are now creating a propaganda yourself.

Is there a campaign? Is there not a campaign. Will it launch in six weeks now or will it not?

Who knows, media watching will stand the trial now.

Thankyou.

Rory


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Oddly enough...*

Here is another version of the Skunk found in Nightclub:

BBC NEWS | England | Lancashire | Skunk kicks up stink at nightclub

12th September 2007

Please take Note of this:


"Ann Hedley at the centre said the 1ft (30cm) long creature was probably someone's unwanted pet that had been set free in the town centre. 
"They don't make ideal pets," she said. 
"They have long claws, big teeth, and then there's the smell. 
"It sprayed here and the smell was very unpleasant." Ms Hedley said Nancy was leaving the centre this week for a more suitable home at a Cumbria wildlife sanctuary."

And then we look at out own thread of yesterday:

Skunk kicks up a stink at a Blackpool nightclub | the Daily Mail

12th September 2007


Ann Hedley, centre manager said: 'In all my years here we've never had a skunk in our care. I can only assume somebody has bought her and has abandoned her. Either that or she's escaped. 
'Skunks can make good pets, they are attractive to look at and you can have the scent glands removed although Nancy's are still evidently intact.' A vet is set to examine the skunk to ensure she is free of disease before a more suitable home can be found for her. 


Which one do we believe?

Rory


----------



## Nerys

considering they were from the same day, there is an odd discrepancy in the story for sure!

N


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Then...*

We look at this:

RSPCA || News


*A skunk found hiding in a garden shed in Grimsby, Lincolnshire has been rescued by the RSPCA.* 

RSPCA Animal Collection Officer (ACO) Alan Horan was called out to rescue the female skunk - the first he has rescued in 15 years with the RSPCA - managing to lure her into a cat trap with sardines. 

*Tame*
After a check-up the skunk was transferred to a local rescue centre, run by fellow ACO, Julie Stoodley. 

The skunk, named Blossom by ACO Stoodley is tame, although quite nervous. Her scent glands had been removed, suggesting that she has been kept as a pet. 

*Inquisitive *
After a successful appeal to find Blossom's owner, it was discovered that the animal had escaped a few days previously, and the decision was made to sign her over to RSPCA care. 

"Blossom is a little timid around new people, but is settling in really well," said ACO Stoodley. "I made a dedicated home for her here with everything she needs. 

*"She's inquisitive, friendly and loves spending time with us."* 

Blossom also escaped, but was signed over - why? Because she escaped?

Red highlighting that in order to keep them as pets you have to mutilate them.

This could be why those above thought a campaign may commence.

Here we have an RSPCA attendant giving two versions of the species above story.

They make good pets, then they dont!!? Spooky huh?

R


----------



## ratboy

It would be very interesting to know what times these statements were made.

The BBC quote reads like she has been told what to say. Even her use of words and language is different between the two.


----------



## Fixx

Nerys said:


> this WAS your heads up on it. i would have pm'd you direct tbh, but seeing as you had the arse with me, did not.


This is a perfect example of personalities getting in the way of disseminating facts and knowledge, so much for the hobby pulling together Nerys. This has nothing to do with you Nerys, despite whether your own feelings of self importance tell you otherwise.,

Because you think I have the arse with you, does that mean you don't want our help anymore then?

You also told Andy, as already stated that as he didn't own skunks and thus was not au fait with developments etc. ergo this implies that those of us with skunks are au fait with developments, well we're not because you chose to tell us before hand, or is it a case of "oooh we know something you don't know" and this makes you feel all important?



Nerys said:


> most police informants do not broadcast who they are to their "class" either.. a source is a source, why do you need to know their name?
> 
> we got told, the rspca are gearing up for a campaign about skunks. we told you about it, via here. and the problem with that is????


Who said I wanted a name? How about something along the lines of "Someone we know who works for or closely with the RSPCA has informed us that a campaign is about to be undertaken to yada yada yada...", rather than 'they' or 'it has been suggested'. 
A source may be a source, but then again unless actually stated this could have been Jack Jones, the local alcy down the pub for all anyone else knows.



Nerys said:


> i'm not honestly sure what your problem is fixx, bar you are sore at me right now, so feel the need to take it out like this..
> 
> Nerys


Nerys, take a step back from your own self importance for a moment, this has nothing to do with me having the arse with you. My points as I see them are all valid, I am merely pointing out that people would probably be a lot more inclined to help or take things seriously if the ambiguity, speculation and scare-mongering were removed from these kind of posts and hard facts posted instead.
But I'll tell you what, I'll step back from all of this, good luck with it, because if this is the way you treat people who want to help then good luck.

Oh and as as said in the PM I sent you Nerys, next time you feel you have to answer questions about our animals on behalf of us, don't, it has sweet Fanny Adams to do with you.



TSKA Rory Matier said:


> Hi Fixx,
> 
> Good stuff.
> 
> So why do l need to be concerned at this point in time?
> 
> This mechanism is now in place to those reading internally and externally.
> 
> We will wait and see.
> 
> Interpret that how you wish.
> 
> Heads up, l have to agree the heads up was in the pm's to you, and l don't even know you that well.
> 
> But by your posting in sypnosis of my pm's to you, you are now creating a propaganda yourself.
> 
> Is there a campaign? Is there not a campaign. Will it launch in six weeks now or will it not?
> 
> Who knows, media watching will stand the trial now.
> 
> Thankyou.
> 
> Rory


Don't give a stuff anymore Rory, it's been made plain that we aren't trusted or that our help or comments are not required.


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

*Not Trusted?*

Ray, 

A question of trust is not an issue l raised with you.

I am quite unsure how to answer you so directly on your comments to me.

I was and still am raising awareness to the possible problems associated with the RSPCA commencing a campaign against skunk keeping in the United Kingdom.

"Who said I wanted a name? How about something along the lines of "Someone we know who works for or closely with the RSPCA has informed us that a campaign is about to be undertaken to yada yada yada...", rather than 'they' or 'it has been suggested'. 

I was notified yesterday morning to keep my head up and alert to any media problems connected with skunks. It came from a trusted source. This source continued to say that this was the making of a campaign aimed at skunk keepers in the UK.

I should consider raising a thread on this forum in the political section - as skunks are now considered a political species as were primates [still are] and of course reptiles.

The information supplied was slim, but based on my previous experience with how the RSPCA write certain things l too wondered if perhaps there was something to it.

A campaign from hint to reality can take as little as six weeks.

Does this help any further or do you still not give a stuff?

R


----------



## Fixx

"Just for the record, they are actually launching a campaign in the next six weeks."

SO where is this campaign then Rory? Nearly ten weeks on and nothing....oh, actually there is an RSPCA campaign on black and white things....Badgers and trying to stop the proposed government cull of them.


----------



## Andy

Poor badgers they are wanting to cull them because of the spread of TB in cattle or something aren't they?


----------



## Esarosa

no offense,but is it such a hard feat to expect people to be civil to one another?

Rory heard some information, and informed what he had heard, to warn skunk keepers or potential skunk keepers.

he never said,unless i've misseed it 'there is definately a campaign started..and heres the ins and outs of the camels jacksy'

Can we try to be civil for the sake of the hobby if for nothing else. I dont agree with bringing the mention of pms in either. and that applies to all who have done so, as it seems to make the posts more personal rather than productive.

just my honest opinion and i dont mean it to offend


----------



## Fixx

Katiexx said:


> no offense,but is it such a hard feat to expect people to be civil to one another?
> 
> Rory heard some information, and informed what he had heard, to warn skunk keepers or potential skunk keepers.
> 
> he never said,unless i've misseed it 'there is definately a campaign started..and heres the ins and outs of the camels jacksy'
> 
> Can we try to be civil for the sake of the hobby if for nothing else. I dont agree with bringing the mention of pms in either. and that applies to all who have done so, as it seems to make the posts more personal rather than productive.
> 
> just my honest opinion and i dont mean it to offend


Show me where I was not civil Katie? 
Also as to the comment about PM's, if a person is going to offer information on the board that does not tally with what they are telling me via PM I want to know why. 
Rory told me via PM "Just for the record, they are actually launching a campaign in the next six weeks.", Katie whilst on the board he said it was 'suggested' there 'may' be a campaign. It has now been nearly ten weeks and there is no sign of a campaign against skunk keeping. 
To paraphrase another member on here:

"tbh, what i do and don't post is irrelevant, i can't do anything about it.. why would it matter if i said that or not.. surely Rory has nothing to hide.. right?"


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

Good Morning Ray

No l have nothing to hide? 

So it has not commenced, okay, well that is a good thing.

Does it mean it will not?

Probably not, but l think and know that the RSPCA are hard pressing for the restriction and banning of primates in the UK at present. Now there is no visible campaign on that, but they are doing it.

What else do you wish me to say?

Rory Matier

Pro Keepers Lobby.


----------



## Fixx

Six months on and still nothing.


----------



## Art_Gecko101

I havent read this whole thread, but i read both articles posted and the 1st says shes not descented and sprayed them all, the RSPCA one says shes 'descented so is probably someones pet'

whats going on with that?


----------



## stuartdouglas

How can an RSPCA inspector tell from external examination that a skunk is descented? Are they veterinary experts as well now? Or is this just another case of the RSPCA talking out of the same place a skunk scents from (or nearby anyway)


----------



## gaz

our local rspca nut nuts say that all skunks eventually grow up to be huge badgers,and then you have to call DEFRA and they send government scientists out to inject them with TB which turns them into cows,however even cows turn nasty and then have to be squashed to get milk............and thats why they dont make suitable pets
regards gaz
(bit of levity before we have the first RFUK murder):whistling2:


----------



## Fixx

Art_Gecko101 said:


> I havent read this whole thread, but i read both articles posted and the 1st says shes not descented and sprayed them all, the RSPCA one says shes 'descented so is probably someones pet'
> 
> whats going on with that?


Two different skunks were found around the same time (different parts of the country) and they both made the news.


----------



## HABU

peroxide and baking soda... it works!:no1:


----------



## Nerys

stuartdouglas said:


> How can an RSPCA inspector tell from external examination that a skunk is descented? Are they veterinary experts as well now? Or is this just another case of the RSPCA talking out of the same place a skunk scents from (or nearby anyway)


you can't tell for sure, unless they squirt basically,

one of the ones given over to the rscpa now lives up the road from me, she was taken in for spaying, and i am told the vet "tried to see if he could see" if she was "intact" or not, in the scenting department, and could not tell if she was or not..

turns out she _is_ intact, as she squirted some time later on, but she has only done it the once, had not done it before - even at the vets - and has not done it since.

in fact 3 skunks were found last year and handed over to the rspca, of the 3, 2 - flower and jasmine - now live just down the road. i met their mum the other day, lovely lady, she helps out with the rscpa and does a lot of ferret rescues. she's giving me a load of drain pipe to add into my ferret and meerkat pens 

N


----------



## DeanThorpe

sweet...drainpipe is well handy.


----------



## Young_Gun

I for one would love to see them try and enforce a ban, but I also do think that there should be more 'education' etc on them as they are a very popular pet, as ever, things being banned don't stop them from happening, that goes for both owning skunks if they were banned and for them being descented, plenty of people own skunks who in my opinion shouldn't, whether it's them following an idiotic diet with no allowance for 'natural' additions and feeding food items which are stupid and plain dangerous to the animals health in some cases or people who house them incorrectly.

Having met a few skunks (Ein is my favourite by far) I can say that no they aren't a perfect pet for everyone, but people should always have the choice to educate themselves and present a good caring home for an animal, not be 'banned' from doing so.


----------



## Myo

It's illegal to descent them now, I mean, surley only the most dedicated of keepers are still gonna keep them now anyway! Pet shops won't stock them cos of their stink, impulse buys are gonna be rare cos they won't be in pet shops, I just really don't see a problem with this animal's welfare. 

with the amount of dogs and cats that are neglected it'd be more usefull to do a dog and/or cat awareness campaign! That might actually save _some_ animals lives!


----------



## Fixx

Still waiting for this campaign to start.


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

LOL, 


Well that is a good thing then isn't it?

The mere fact that it was raised in a forum they are reknowned for frequenting, could well have been l believe sufficient for them to postpone any planned action, but that is not saying that just because its quiet now, it will not be present sometime in the future.

R


----------



## Fixx

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> LOL,
> 
> 
> Well that is a good thing then isn't it?
> 
> The mere fact that it was raised in a forum they are reknowned for frequenting, could well have been l believe sufficient for them to postpone any planned action, but that is not saying that just because its quiet now, it will not be present sometime in the future.
> 
> R


 :rotfl:keep taking the dried frog pills Rory.


----------



## Maureen Collinson

Fixx said:


> :rotfl:keep taking the dried frog pills Rory.


If I am reading you correctly Fixx, you are not being very kind to Rory, and after Rory was kind enough to reply to you, giving you what you seemed to be crying out for to make you feel good. A quick fix and all that. :rotfl:
Life must be boring for you at the moment as you appear to be looking for ways to beef it up.

Mo.


----------



## ogawa only

I think people some people have missed the point of this thread .....or some people are not old enough or some people just havent been in the whole animal thing long enough ...

This tiny little artical , will be the start of something big as it always is where the RSPCA is concerned . And lets be honest this thread was started as a heads up!!

so lets forget skunks and primates for the min , who on here know's any bird keeper's , or who had birds years ago in aviary's , it's these people who will tell you ,just how these things start . 

Back when ,the internet ect wasn't as wide spread , the RSPCA's out let was the cage and avairy , there was a tiny little artical about , how they wanted to stamp out the trapping of birds , because of the way it was done , a few week later they put pic's in another follow up artical , now , like most bird keepers we where shocked at these pics , and most of us agreed that it was not the way to go ... a few highly respected bird keep put forward articals ect ect , and the RSPCA soon got to work on getting the gov to ban the sale of imported bird's . 

if you could go back in time , which i wish some of you could !!! every tom , dick and harry had an avairy , we swapped bloodline , swapped info on getting certain bird's to breed ,feeding, allsorts of info was flying about .i could say hand on hart , there was more bird keeper's than is reptile and skunk keepers now . 

so 20yrs on whats changed ... hundreds of shop's have closed down and a whole industry has been almost lost and a great hobby destroyed ,and for what ... well that little artical , turned into ,it's cruel trapping and selling these birds... to it's cruel keeping them in cages .... to it's cruel keeping these bird in large spacious avairies . 

so where the RSPCA is concerned ,even a tiny little bit on there site , should be watched , and watched with vigour ...... they are now a political group thats funded by charity , they have a ton in the bank and even more invested , they prosecuted around a 1000 people last year , but put down well over 40,000 animals . if you thing that with these figures that they can be trusted ..............take it from someone who know's THEY CANT!!


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

Well posted and pointed out Steve!

Its funny [not] ironic [much more apt a description.

But not many unless avian orientated will remember, that this is where the destruction really began. I have been involved with this political game for nearly six years in one way or another, and l recall just before even looking with more than a passing glance at the political spread here in the UK exotic communities, back in perhaps 96-7 the heat that was 'just' beginning in the aviary world, well that is just 11 - 12 years back, but back then the avian market was being slammed and it was not a pretty sight. 

Inklings or even whispers were starting to leave the bird world that the reptile community would start to feel the pressure next and indeed they did, come 2000, the reptile community was under great fire, and the avian world was already reeling from the weighty blows of the officials by then, with shows being threatened and many successful closures of long standing shows.

Natrix [Gordon] alone made it quite clear in a written piece he did for the FBH conferences that reptile shows were once a right booming trade, and now look at the state of them???

There are indeed not many around - and not as many as there were some ten years ago!

Rumours back then, from the reptile community was that the animal keepers notably the mammal keepers were an ignorant bunch and indeed this still stands true, for the mammal keeping communities are in fact the slowest politically to catch on to the possible perils that they face already.

But the other point was this:

This THREAD WAS a heads up, it WAS a suggestion, it was not looping a fact, it was suggesting that the RSPCA were indeed looking at skunks with a little more than a curious glance.

It will only take figures from rescue centres in the years to come of abandoned skunks - perhaps another unwanted pet, before they too look a little more seriously at the growing population of skunks.

Illegal skunks, hence those being - entering illegally through the smuggle doors of this country should not go unheeded either, for it is these that will possibly close the doors to skunk keeping somewhere in the future.

The RSPCA administrator prior to her engagement in the RSPCA was in fact the head administrator for the RCVS don't forget before she moved, she in fact passed the memo to vets in the UK that it was considered unethical to descent skunks and they could be barred from practice should they do it.

It shows where the RSPCA are in their thoughts on this animal, and just because nothing is present now in so far as a clear and concise campaign, it does not mean that somewhere in the distant future, something will not be raised by this poltical charity.

If they can express concerns over the number of rabbits in the UK at present, a long held traditional pet, skunks, a newly accepted pet, will not be too much of an issue.

And just because nothing is visible every four months or so stop going on about it, perhaps it may be considered a challenge to them to do something ................

R


----------



## Fixx

Into the new year and still no campaign :whistling2:


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

LOL, 

Happy New Year to you too Ray!!


You make me laugh!

So keen to continually make one look foolish in the eyes of others, does it not ever possibly occur to you, who is actually truly looking foolish?

Have a good year.

R


----------



## sparkle

Nerys said:


> de-scenting is ALREADY banned, as of this year, thats what i mean about not knowing all the facts i guess


 
can i ask is importing de-scented skunks legal?


----------



## TSKA Rory Matier

Yes it is, there is nothing illegal about it Sparkle.

It is illegal to descent them in the UK, but you can buy them ie from the States descented and import them to UK for quarantine.

HTH R


----------



## sparkle

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> Yes it is, there is nothing illegal about it Sparkle.
> 
> It is illegal to descent them in the UK, but you can buy them ie from the States descented and import them to UK for quarantine.
> 
> HTH R


 
ahh cool thats what i wanted to know

:2thumb:


----------



## Young_Gun

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> LOL,
> 
> Happy New Year to you too Ray!!
> 
> 
> You make me laugh!
> 
> So keen to continually make one look foolish in the eyes of others, does it not ever possibly occur to you, who is actually truly looking foolish?
> 
> Have a good year.
> 
> R


:lol2::lol2:


----------

