# Rat Chat



## ami_j

Interested in seeing other peoples set ups and rats, also can be good to share tips and ideas with other people 

I have ten rats currently, 6 crazy girls and 4 very lazy boys 

I have just finished (there abouts anyway :lol2 kitting out my explorer so it is fun for my girls 

From the outside

















Lounging in hammocks (from the amazing http://fuzzbutt.co.uk

























Top Half








Silent spinner...they LOVE it









Bottom half

































Please excuse the blurryness they were taken on my camera phone


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## sammy1969

dolovethe way you have don it out fo rthem but what do the boys hve lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> dolovethe way you have don it out fo rthem but what do the boys hve lol


hammocks and boxes lol which they rip up. I could kit it out with ropes etc but for my boys they really wouldnt use them, bucks are so lazy :lol2: Plus half of my males have one eye and 3/4 are hairless with very small whiskers and one is 3 years old in june with hld so they come very low in the agility stakes :lol2:
They get peeved that I scatter feed them and mix it in so they have to dig for it :lol2:


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## Shell195

That looks amazing Jai:no1: How many ratlets are you owned by at the minute?


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## ami_j

Shell195 said:


> That looks amazing Jai:no1: How many ratlets are you owned by at the minute?


ten of the demanding little creatures :rotfl:
Thanks  I have really worked hard to get stuff in the right places, a nice mix of things. Theres gaps between things so they have to use agility, its certainly keeping them fit. And my oldest girl at 27 months still can get about it, but the girls dont age like the boys


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## Serenity's_Fall

Awww the cage looks amazing!! Some very lucky ratties there!! This is making want to get rats again, never been good at resisting temptation :lol2:


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## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Awww the cage looks amazing!! Some very lucky ratties there!! This is making want to get rats again, never been good at resisting temptation :lol2:


Thank you  lol I couldnt do without mine even when they are trying to play in my hair or see if my ears are edible while i'm trying to hang hammocks :lol2:


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## Serenity's_Fall

Haha I have quite a few piercings in my ears and my boys favourite thing was to sit on my shoulder and play with my earrings :lol2: Inevitably they would try and see if my ears were edible- i'm sure they thought if they kept trying my ears would magically turn into food! I miss my boys, i'll have to start slowly dropping hints at the OH...teehee


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## ami_j

One of mine tries to bite my earrings at free range time so if she goes anywhere near my ears she is removed cos it really hurts :lol2: They are so naughty arent they haha 

what piercings do you have in your ears? I have a few myself lol


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## sammy1969

Once i have set up the new cage for the girls everyone wil get to see someof Feorag's brilliant handiwork as i have 2 of her hammocks and a hanging pouch to go into it. in two different types of material one is the lovely deep red and the other is the black with red skulls on it as well as hanging toys ladders etc that i ahve been aquiring forthe past few months lol I justl ove gumtree.


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> One of mine tries to bite my earrings at free range time so if she goes anywhere near my ears she is removed cos it really hurts :lol2: They are so naughty arent they haha
> 
> what piercings do you have in your ears? I have a few myself lol


Hehe yep they certainly are naughty...but then they do that cute innocent "I didn't mean to" look and all is forgiven :lol2:

I have scaffolding, 1 lobe and a helix in the left and then in the right I have a helix and 3 lobes. But there will probably be more added at some point, quite fancy a rook as my friend got one at the same time i got my scaffolding done and it looks amazing! Also have a lip piercing too 

what do you have?


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## ami_j

Most of mine give that look, Mocha doesnt though, she is thoroughly unrepentant XD 

I have five piercings in each lobe, both tragus, two at the top on the left, helix and rook on the right, my nose and snakebites. rooks are cool, went to a different piercer with mine and she put too small a bar in -_- so healing was less smooth than it should of been


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## sammy1969

I miss te fact my last rats well one in particular literally lived on me most of the time. HEr name was gracewing but she used to be on my shoulder constantly and if I took a drink she would pull mylower lip down so that she could have some too. As for food well one of my favourite memories is of her pinching a whole fried egg off my plate which was about three times her size and draggin it to her corner on my sofa It was so funny as she struggled but the reward was her getting to eat it. Also she would nibble my ears and earrings and when i winced she would stop dead and look at me with that same look on her face lol.


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## ami_j

LOL cheeky Gracewing


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## sammy1969

She was such a character who lived to be 4 1/2 years of age and even survived a stroke which caused blindness in one eye and a weakness down one side but the vet would euthanise her as she was not in pain and for the most part unaffected by it, and also her daughter would be by her side constantly when she was i the cage helping to guide her round and up the tubes etc that were in there. I know I willnever get another like her and i miss her dearly she was one of the best and surprisngly tame for a pet shop rescue lol


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## Postcard

Lovely cage, ami_J - how big is it? It's always hard to tell from pictures!


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## ami_j

annabel said:


> Lovely cage, ami_J - how big is it? It's always hard to tell from pictures!


I'm five foot one and its slightly taller than me- thats with the base and castors though theres a big gap underneath. Its the liberta explorer, I would post the measurements but I'm using my phone, will post them later for you


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## ami_j

here you go annabel, I managed to nip on the computer 



 Height 159 cm
 Width 63 cm
 Length 93 cm
 Weighs 50.0 kgs
 Bar spacing: 15 mm


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## Postcard

ami_j said:


> I'm five foot one and its slightly taller than me- thats with the base and castors though theres a big gap underneath. Its the liberta explorer, I would post the measurements but I'm using my phone, will post them later for you


Thanks, was trying to figure it out compared to the birdcage I have at home for the wee birds - it is about the same size - just hard to tell from pictures without context sometimes!


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## ami_j

annabel said:


> Thanks, was trying to figure it out compared to the birdcage I have at home for the wee birds - it is about the same size - just hard to tell from pictures without context sometimes!


It really is! i had the measurements before I bought it and was still stunned at just how big it was :lol2:


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## Rach1

Hello....
thought i'd join in.
i currently have 7 rattie ladies...
2 i got from the dreaded [email protected] as i just couldnt leave them in the shop with no toys etc.
the other 5 have just sort of come to me...LOL

Moll- agouti hooded.
Dolly-Husky hooded
Nancy- Dark Brown/Black Berkshire
Blossom-self russian blue
Hera-rescue rat from storm off here-siamese
Ms Ernst-siamese naked
Florry- Dark naked.

Moll is the bees knees very very friendly and loves to come out for tickles.
the others are also very friendly except Hera who has her moments.
will try and post pics of cage later.


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## sammy1969

Hiya Rach. So we meet up again lol you know people will start to talk we keep meeting up like this you know lmao.HOw is Gus lol. I didn't know youhad ratties if oyu go into the cat chat thread you will see piccies of my new arrivals lol as cant be asked to repost in here as it takes too long and my brain isnt great lol.


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## ami_j

The more the merrier Rach  Cant wait to see pics  I love russian blues
I might spend my afternoon trying to get pics of my ratties, never easy when they wont sit still :lol2:


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## Rach1

Here's their cage

























Dolly when she was a baba








Moll as a baba









All fast asleep.









I'll try and get more later, that's all I have on my phone.


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## sammy1969

Awwwww so cute but must admit I do have a real soft spot for Dolly I just love roans


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## Rach1

I love my nakeds... never had them before and they really are a pleasure to keep.
very funny.


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## sammy1969

See I cant see the fascination with them lol I just cant get my head round them being nekkid but I am slowly coming round as Ami-J has nekkids and one of them I do actually think is really really cute.


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## Rach1

i find mine are more vocal than the others whether thats because they feel pain more or more quickly i dont know... but they are always chattering away...
I'd like another one actually to add to my clan, but then that would be it.
LOL...


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## sammy1969

Yo say that now but I bet it wouldn't be lol as you are animal mad just like me lmao


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## Rach1

Well, to be honest we've had to cut back a bit this year. several reasons, one of which is space when we've had our building work done but also time...
our snakes have been cut right back to just the one now.
we just found that they werent doing it for us anymore so to speak,.
I think my niche is mammal exotics...
if only i had the space...LOL


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## sammy1969

OOO exotic mammals lol i have a few of what they call exotic rodents ie Tristram, Shaw, and Bushey tailed jirds as well as multimate mice but I do still love my 5 corns and wont ever rehome them. I have found I have gone off of gerbils and hamsters and so only have my geriatrics nowbu I do find i have a soft spot with beardies who are disabled lol


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## ami_j

Cute rattys :flrt:

Hairless are cute but I wouldnt have them again. I'm yet to find one that hasnt had issues somewhere along the line and believe me I have had a few. Ones with fuzzy faces seem to have it a little easier but I have had three hairless that have had such bad eye issues they had needed an eye removed. Think theres an article kicking about why its unlikely they will ever be as healthy as their furry cousins. 
Sounds like your girls are drama queens like my Atari :lol2:


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## Rach1

ami_j said:


> Cute rattys :flrt:
> 
> Hairless are cute but I wouldnt have them again. I'm yet to find one that hasnt had issues somewhere along the line and believe me I have had a few. Ones with fuzzy faces seem to have it a little easier but I have had three hairless that have had such bad eye issues they had needed an eye removed. Think theres an article kicking about why its unlikely they will ever be as healthy as their furry cousins.
> Sounds like your girls are drama queens like my Atari :lol2:


 yeah, both of mine are not full hairless...both have slight fuzz around the face and on their little feets.
so hopefully less issues but we'll see.
Ms Ernst is a funny one... i suspect she is a siamese hairless as the fuzz on her nose is smutty brown changing to white (only just see the white tho)
and her feet are the same...
both are dumbo's too i forgot to add.


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## Rach1

Ami... do you breed then or just a collector?
i would like to get more into my ratties and go to some shows etc but dont know where to start/plus i dont drive.


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## ami_j

I'm just owned by them :lol2:
Would love to have my own happy healthy line one day, would struggle to give the babies up though :lol2:

You should check out the national fancy rat society and the yorkshire rat club. The yrc has regular meetings  I'm thinking of joining for the access to the forum and starrats as well though I wouldnt really be able to get to shows


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> Most of mine give that look, Mocha doesnt though, she is thoroughly unrepentant XD
> 
> I have five piercings in each lobe, both tragus, two at the top on the left, helix and rook on the right, my nose and snakebites. rooks are cool, went to a different piercer with mine and she put too small a bar in -_- so healing was less smooth than it should of been


I hate when they put bars that are too small in, especially as my ears seem to take aaaages to heal anyway. My scaffolding was annoying when I got to the point where it had healed and I needed a shorter bar, NOWHERE in Liverpool had the size of bar that I needed so I ended up having to go online in the end to get one, must have weird ear size :lol2:


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## Serenity's_Fall

Awww Rach you're ratties are gorgeous!!! Haha good job you didn't mention them when I was picking up the snake the other week, you might have ahd to check my pockets on the way out :lol2::lol2: Carpet is doing great- called him Araki in the end(it's an african homemade "brew" VERY alcoholic!!), he pounded down 2 rat fuzzies over the weekend!

I've been looking at rat adverts on preloved...I'm so naughty!! If I end up with more rats I entirely blame you lot :lol2:


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## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> I hate when they put bars that are too small in, especially as my ears seem to take aaaages to heal anyway. My scaffolding was annoying when I got to the point where it had healed and I needed a shorter bar, NOWHERE in Liverpool had the size of bar that I needed so I ended up having to go online in the end to get one, must have weird ear size :lol2:


my ear swelled around it oh it was agony! healed lovely with a bigger bar in  i love it. cartilidge is a pain to heal


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## ami_j

Hahaha doooo itttt Serenity you know you want to 

I think Stovokor is in liverpool, she is a rat breeder who comes on here I have forgotten her name though *blush* Her rats are gorgeous though if you google stovokor rats her site should come up


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> my ear swelled around it oh it was agony! healed lovely with a bigger bar in  i love it. cartilidge is a pain to heal


It is! One of my top ones took ages to heal and at one point ended up with a massive swelling which wouldn't go down...until someone suggested I use haemmarrhoid cream (que a trip to the chemist and an embarrassing few mintues purchasing "Anusol" :lol2: seriously who thinks up these names?!!) which I was skeptical at...but it actually worked and the swelling went away with no scarring! 

Someone near me has two 6 month rattie girls up for rehoming...I have just enquired about them...oh dear =/


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> Hahaha doooo itttt Serenity you know you want to
> 
> I think Stovokor is in liverpool, she is a rat breeder who comes on here I have forgotten her name though *blush* Her rats are gorgeous though if you google stovokor rats her site should come up


Ooo I think I've met her before a few years back, Laura I think her name is? I had to rehome one of my males as he just wouldn't get on with any of my boys(even after neutering!) and I didn't want him living alone so she took him in  I think she is in Wigan if I remember right, but that's near enough anyway

I think a wander to her website is in order!.....


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## sammy1969

YOu will love them lol and soon be addicted like te rest of us lol. Rats are such great pets I always swore I wouldnt have anymore after my last lot passed away but since thenI have had two lots lol and on thursday I have four new ones coming with cage lol and a new cage coming to put them all in well the girls at least lol.


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## ami_j

Laura! thats right! whoops I thought she was in Liverpool (fails at geography :rotfl)

aha naughty you enquiring  You wont regret being owned by rats :flrt:


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## Serenity's_Fall

sammy1969 said:


> YOu will love them lol and soon be addicted like te rest of us lol. Rats are such great pets I always swore I wouldnt have anymore after my last lot passed away but since thenI have had two lots lol and on thursday I have four new ones coming with cage lol and a new cage coming to put them all in well the girls at least lol.


Haha well that's the thing after my boys passed away about a year and a half ago, I was adamant I wouldn't get anymore...but all this rat talk and pictures is getting me all cooey again, I miss being a rattie mummy! 

Haha you are as bad as me, when I had my boys I started off with 2...which eventually ended up as 8 :blush:


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## Serenity's_Fall

To be fair my geography is only good around the northwest, anything south of about Stoke or further east than manchester and I'm useless :lol2:


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## sammy1969

I know i will have 8 in total when the new ones arrive. However at the moment I am sat here in tears as I havejust started feeding all the rodents only to find Flash my favourite bushey tailed jird is dying. He is currently sat on my chest being cuddled I have no idea what has happened as he was fine earlier running around his glass cage teasing the cats as he does normally but hnow he doesnt seem to be able to stand has droo all over his stomah and face and is very lethargic only able to move his head slightly. I am absolutely devastated as i think he has had a stroke.


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## ami_j

I had 24 at one point. But I prefer to keep just one cage group and give them my full attention so when my boys are gone I will just keep girls. Will miss my lazy cuddly bucks but I just love naughty does :lol2:


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## Serenity's_Fall

sammy1969 said:


> I know i will have 8 in total when the new ones arrive. However at the moment I am sat here in tears as I havejust started feeding all the rodents only to find Flash my favourite bushey tailed jird is dying. He is currently sat on my chest being cuddled I have no idea what has happened as he was fine earlier running around his glass cage teasing the cats as he does normally but hnow he doesnt seem to be able to stand has droo all over his stomah and face and is very lethargic only able to move his head slightly. I am absolutely devastated as i think he has had a stroke.


Awww I'm so sorry, that's awful! Poor Flash  How old is he? Wish there was something I could do  *sending hugs* :grouphug:


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> I had 24 at one point. But I prefer to keep just one cage group and give them my full attention so when my boys are gone I will just keep girls. Will miss my lazy cuddly bucks but I just love naughty does :lol2:


24?! :gasp: Wow, I think Eric might actually have disowned me if I had that many :lol: I do love the lazy boys...I think I might go for girls this time though for a change!


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## sammy1969

thank you its Becca isn't I am so gutted, as for his age i know he is over a year but no more than that as he was a rescueand i have no idea how long they live but believe it is around 2 years


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## Serenity's_Fall

Well at least you know he has had the best life possible since he's been with you and I'm sure he's grateful to be cuddling his mummy right now. Such a shame so many rodent species have such short life spans


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## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> 24?! :gasp: Wow, I think Eric might actually have disowned me if I had that many :lol: I do love the lazy boys...I think I might go for girls this time though for a change!


Yeah I probably wouldnt have that many again :lol2: 


*hug* for you sammy


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## sammy1969

Thank you both I appreciate it I truly do


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## Rach1

hug from me too...


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## sammy1969

THankyou Rach


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## ami_j

Just weighed all my rats, they did not want to sit still :lol2:


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## Serenity's_Fall

Can you weigh yours without using a box? My boys NEVER used to stay put and I had to put them in boxes then subtract the weight of the box lol


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## Rach1

weight them?
if mine look fat(ish) i'll go with that...LOL


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## sammy1969

Flash has just passed in Glyns arms I am so gutted cant believe he has gone


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## Rach1

aw...RIP little Flash.
at least it didnt take long and he was reastful and with you guys...


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## sammy1969

Thank you Rach, Glyn is just digging him a grave outside my front door under one of my plant pots so the wildlife cant get to him


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## Serenity's_Fall

RIP little Flash, at least it was peaceful xxx :grouphug:


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## Rach1

I'm thinking of joining NERS?
what you guys think?
their next show is in april at fulwood (christ church) so not too far...i think joel will take me and pick me up.
But I'm scared...LOL
what if i turn up and they're all sniffy?
what if all their rats are like really posh and i feel daft cause my ratties aint?
*sigh*


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## Serenity's_Fall

Oh dear I just had to google NERS :blush:

I say if you want to, go for it! You never know, they might be all lovely people! I bet there will be at least the odd one or two that are a bit sniffy but they can go stuff themselves. :lol2: Besides I think your ratties look gorgeous and just as good as any other rat posh or not :2thumb: Never been to a rat show myself, seems like it would be fun though! Just do what I do and drag someone along for moral support(whether they want to come or not lol)


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## sammy1969

Thankyou Becca I have just gone and said goodbye at least I know hehad a good life here and was spoilt rotten but I will miss him terribly.


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## Rach1

i joined....*flustered*
so i now await my newsletter and membership stuff with eager anticipation...
and i think i will go to the show...
you never know they may have biccies!


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## ami_j

so sorry sammy 


I bribed them with doggy choccy buttons serenity XD Aeon still escaped though luckily shes fairly easy to catch

Worth going along to see what its like Rach  sounds like fun


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## sammy1969

THank you hun


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## Serenity's_Fall

Rach1 said:


> i joined....*flustered*
> so i now await my newsletter and membership stuff with eager anticipation...
> and i think i will go to the show...
> you never know they may have biccies!


Woo go you!  You'll have to let us know how the show goes in April!!

If they have biccies they better have tea to go with them :lol2:


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## Rach1

I am thinking of taking a couple of my ladies to enter some of the pet sections.
They have some fun little categories.
Maybe take my self Russian blue and my agouti hooded.
Might be a good way of getting involved and introducing myself.


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## ami_j

Sounds like a good plan rach 
I was looking at the membership what do you get in the pack do you know?


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## Rach1

No idea.
Lol
I didn't look properly, I was at work.
It's 16 for the year... And 14 every year you resubscribe.
I know you get a newsletter every other month... Well a 32 page booklet.
And that's it.
I'm rubbish ain't I.
Lol


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## ami_j

you will have to let me know what is in it when it arrives


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## Rach1

Membership

The members of the NERS are its greatest asset, and we try to provide excellent value for money to our membership. As seen from the benefits of membership the society aims to provide a package that is appealing to rat lovers regardless of whether they are interested in showing their rats or not.
Benefits of yearly membership include:

NERS Joining pack (welcome letter, complimentary copy of Rattitude, show rules and varieties booklet and a little something for you and your ratties too).
Rattitude. Bi-monthly 32-page A5 newsletter with a wide range of new and informative articles as well as society news and information.
Annual Report.
Right to a voice and a vote on how the society evolves, by post if preferred.
Easy access to member breeders.
Support and advice via the members-only forum.
Eligibility to apply for the NERS Longevity award scheme.
Enter photos for the NERS calendar.
Eligibility to compete for NERS Championship awards.
Reduced show entry rates.
Loan service (items such as live/humane rat trap, books).


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## Serenity's_Fall

Ooo maybe it will have goodies in! Like stickers or magnets or something...(yup I have the mental age of a child lol!)

Ergh feel so ill, stupid Eric gave me his cold and now I feel like crap and have no painkillers or anything in the house cos he ate them all and didn't replace them :devil::devil::devil:


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## ami_j

Oh thats lots  I'm looking at the NFRS,NERS + YRC but joining all three would cost me a fortune :lol2:


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## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Ooo maybe it will have goodies in! Like stickers or magnets or something...(yup I have the mental age of a child lol!)
> 
> Ergh feel so ill, stupid Eric gave me his cold and now I feel like crap and have no painkillers or anything in the house cos he ate them all and didn't replace them :devil::devil::devil:


aha i'm the same I find the thought of a welcome pack really exciting XD


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## Rach1

ami_j said:


> Oh thats lots  I'm looking at the NFRS,NERS + YRC but joining all three would cost me a fortune :lol2:


join NERS and come and meet me... LOL


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## ami_j

I think you can go to shows even if you arent a member  
I like the idea of a magazine about rats. And a certificate for rats making good ages, should be able to get one for my old man Quinn


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## Disillusioned

Just seen this thread and wanted to join in! I LOVE my rats and refuse to believe that there are people who don't like them :lol2:
I'm always checking rehome section to see if I can rescue any lonely males to add to the group! Having a larger cage made for them so I'm sure a few more will fit soon hehe :flrt:


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## Rach1

Hi.
:welcome:

I have kept rats on and off for about 5-7 years BUT i am new to the whole rat show/breeders/ethics thing...and still have a lot to learn.
I only have 'pet' ratties at present... but they are still much loved little ladies...but i suspect they will show me up at any shows we attend...we'll be the delinquents in the corner!


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## Disillusioned

I also only have pet rats. I've never had show rats but would love to eventually when I have the time to attend!
I currently only have 3 boys and it will be their 1st Birthday this Friday woop woop! Birthday party I think!
Only ever kept girls before but after my dear mother purchased a preggers 'pets at home' rat I got landed with the males lol.
Always wanted a naked one but my partner thinks they look freaky!


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## Rach1

I have two nakeds...
Ms Ernst and Florry.
both are adorable.
my others are all furry.

i have just joined the NERS... and hope to go to their next show in April But having read up on showing i have to say i'm a little scared! LOL
lots to remember...
once my membership is agreed i will go on the forum and ask some questions...


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## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Just seen this thread and wanted to join in! I LOVE my rats and refuse to believe that there are people who don't like them :lol2:
> I'm always checking rehome section to see if I can rescue any lonely males to add to the group! Having a larger cage made for them so I'm sure a few more will fit soon hehe :flrt:


haha :lol2: GMR (get more rats) is a horrible afflication 


Rach1 said:


> Hi.
> :welcome:
> 
> I have kept rats on and off for about 5-7 years BUT i am new to the whole rat show/breeders/ethics thing...and still have a lot to learn.
> I only have 'pet' ratties at present... but they are still much loved little ladies...but i suspect they will show me up at any shows we attend...we'll be the delinquents in the corner!


Have you joined this forum? Fancy Rats • Index page
I'm sure you will be fine, breeder ratties will be just as naughty :lol2:



Disillusioned said:


> I also only have pet rats. I've never had show rats but would love to eventually when I have the time to attend!
> I currently only have 3 boys and it will be their 1st Birthday this Friday woop woop! Birthday party I think!
> Only ever kept girls before but after my dear mother purchased a preggers 'pets at home' rat I got landed with the males lol.
> Always wanted a naked one but my partner thinks they look freaky!


Yay for ratty birthday parties  My Quinn will be 3 in June, if hes still with me then a special celebration is called for


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## Rach1

are you on there?
i get nervous about joining new sites... what if they hate me?
LOL


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## Rach1

i joined...go and say hi in my intro's bit...so i dont look like a have no mates!


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## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> are you on there?
> i get nervous about joining new sites... what if they hate me?
> LOL


Why would they hate you :lol2:


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## Disillusioned

Yay birthday parties are great! My rats love prezzies!

I had never heard of NERS before this so I am no use to you...but they wont hate you! You Luv your ratties so they will defo like you! 
I get proper scared joining new things, always feel out of my depth lol.


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## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Yay birthday parties are great! My rats love prezzies!
> 
> I had never heard of NERS before this so I am no use to you...but they wont hate you! You Luv your ratties so they will defo like you!
> I get proper scared joining new things, always feel out of my depth lol.


aww it can be a bit daunting new things...
Also you have no posted any pics :gasp::lol2:


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> aww it can be a bit daunting new things...
> Also you have no posted any pics :gasp::lol2:


Hehe I have a few on my profile but am planning on taking some on friday when I give them a bday cake so will post some then


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Hehe I have a few on my profile but am planning on taking some on friday when I give them a bday cake so will post some then


awesome  will go have a look at your profile now


----------



## Disillusioned

Love all ur pics in ur siggy btw. Quite a variety you've had! I've got tons more pics will defo have to upload some more.


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Love all ur pics in ur siggy btw. Quite a variety you've had! I've got tons more pics will defo have to upload some more.


thanks  all been quite special in one way or another, might make it a little bigger at some point


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> thanks  all been quite special in one way or another, might make it a little bigger at some point


Aww they are always all special. Mine all have such different personalities! All little rascals tho. Fave past time is chewing holes in my sofa!


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Aww they are always all special. Mine all have such different personalities! All little rascals tho. Fave past time is chewing holes in my sofa!


Oh yes, my sofa looks like a sieve :lol2: All are special but theres always a couple that worm in extra deep and become heart rats


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

My old boy Sirius was definitely a heart rat, he was an albino I got from a horrible pet shop who had him in with a load of females who kept attacking him and had bitten his eye out!!! :whip: Needless to say as soon as I saw this wee one eyed ratty he came straight home with me! Sadly he is now in rattie heaven with my other boys, despite his dodgy start in life he still reached 4 years old though, my special little man :flrt:


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> Oh yes, my sofa looks like a sieve :lol2: All are special but theres always a couple that worm in extra deep and become heart rats


I know what you mean. Out of all my animals my little rat (patch) is my special little pal. He seems too clever! Always cheers me up by giving me kisses too. I honesty believe they are one of the best pets you can own. Seriously underrated by so many people!


----------



## Disillusioned

Serenity's_Fall said:


> My old boy Sirius was definitely a heart rat, he was an albino I got from a horrible pet shop who had him in with a load of females who kept attacking him and had bitten his eye out!!! :whip: Needless to say as soon as I saw this wee one eyed ratty he came straight home with me! Sadly he is now in rattie heaven with my other boys, despite his dodgy start in life he still reached 4 years old though, my special little man :flrt:


:gasp: thats terrible! Poor thing. Pet shops are so silly sometimes. My local pet shop owner keeps his rats on sawdust in tanks. I've told him so many times to change the sawdust as it's no good for them but does he listen?...of course not.


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Disillusioned said:


> :gasp: thats terrible! Poor thing. Pet shops are so silly sometimes. My local pet shop owner keeps his rats on sawdust in tanks. I've told him so many times to change the sawdust as it's no good for them but does he listen?...of course not.


No they never do because of course the pet shop knows best...:bash: Sometimes I wish they would just suck up their pride/put aside their ignorance and take advice!!


----------



## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> My old boy Sirius was definitely a heart rat, he was an albino I got from a horrible pet shop who had him in with a load of females who kept attacking him and had bitten his eye out!!! :whip: Needless to say as soon as I saw this wee one eyed ratty he came straight home with me! Sadly he is now in rattie heaven with my other boys, despite his dodgy start in life he still reached 4 years old though, my special little man :flrt:


Oh bless him :C I have three rats with just one eye , they had to have them removed. 


Disillusioned said:


> I know what you mean. Out of all my animals my little rat (patch) is my special little pal. He seems too clever! Always cheers me up by giving me kisses too. I honesty believe they are one of the best pets you can own. Seriously underrated by so many people!


they really are. I adore mine so much they have such personality for a small creature.

My first heart rat is the last rat on the top row, and the second pic on the bottom row is her with her brother. I got her from an appaling shed and she was tiny and had lice but grew up to love me and brux like a crazy whenever i held her, even though she often got abcesses and had to have lumps off so needed medicine and stuff , she always stayed sweet. 

This is my second heart rat, Atari

























he is a complete character, throws tantrums , i never knew a rat could throw a tantrum :lol2: some days he will not permit cuddles, others he loves it 

this little girl is also fast becoming a heart rat 








Aeon always comes running when i go over and when i pick her up she she is so relaxed she feels limp. very cheeky little girl , always trying to escape off and an adventure


----------



## Disillusioned

Serenity's_Fall said:


> No they never do because of course the pet shop knows best...:bash: Sometimes I wish they would just suck up their pride/put aside their ignorance and take advice!!


Ha I know! We only say something for the good of the animals, not to be clever! Wish I could have all the rats in the store! Then again I always find fault in animal stocked pet shops :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> :gasp: thats terrible! Poor thing. Pet shops are so silly sometimes. My local pet shop owner keeps his rats on sawdust in tanks. I've told him so many times to change the sawdust as it's no good for them but does he listen?...of course not.


Oh rats on woodshavings is a bug bear of mine :lol2: they can be really dusty and not that absorbant, theres some shavings that are meant to be ok though, bedmax? I use allbed and chopped card , seems to work well for mine. Plus woodshavings are messy , my hamster was getting them everywhere until i moved her into a tank with a topper (for ventilation) Plus it stops her getting a chill


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> Oh rats on woodshavings is a bug bear of mine :lol2: they can be really dusty and not that absorbant, theres some shavings that are meant to be ok though, bedmax? I use allbed and chopped card , seems to work well for mine. Plus woodshavings are messy , my hamster was getting them everywhere until i moved her into a tank with a topper (for ventilation) Plus it stops her getting a chill


I don't really use shavings for my rats.
I use bio catolet kitty litter lol. Tissue based, super absorbant and not dusty so suits mine fine! I scrub my ratties cage in the bath once a week so their cage doesn't smell and find the bio-catolet really helps to stop them smelling aswell. (people always say that rats smell but they really don't!)


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

I used to use carefresh until it got REALLY expensive :devil: Then I tried Hemp for a while which was pretty good and not dusty, I used finacard too which I liked. They did get the finacard everywhere though, I swear the little buggers did it on purpose just to watch me go round the floor by their cage hoovering/picking up all the pieces


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> I don't really use shavings for my rats.
> I use bio catolet kitty litter lol. Tissue based, super absorbant and not dusty so suits mine fine! I scrub my ratties cage in the bath once a week so their cage doesn't smell and find the bio-catolet really helps to stop them smelling aswell. (people always say that rats smell but they really don't!)





Serenity's_Fall said:


> I used to use carefresh until it got REALLY expensive :devil: Then I tried Hemp for a while which was pretty good and not dusty, I used finacard too which I liked. They did get the finacard everywhere though, I swear the little buggers did it on purpose just to watch me go round the floor by their cage hoovering/picking up all the pieces


I wouldnt use shavings either  allbed is like aubiose, its suprisingly soft and absorbant. messier though but easier to clean up than chopped card squares , they kept blocking the hoover


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> I wouldnt use shavings either  allbed is like aubiose, its suprisingly soft and absorbant. messier though but easier to clean up than chopped card squares , they kept blocking the hoover


is aubiose expensive? I pay about £6 for a small bag of biocatolet which is quite expensive imo...seeing as my rabbit bedding cost the same for a bag about 10x the size!


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Is aubiose hemp based? If so that may be similar to the one I was using but mine went under the name Hemcore.

The hemcore for me worked out quite cheaply as it's designed as a horse bedding so comes in massive bales...whioch I think I used to pay about a tenner for but it would last aaaaaaaages!


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> is aubiose expensive? I pay about £6 for a small bag of biocatolet which is quite expensive imo...seeing as my rabbit bedding cost the same for a bag about 10x the size!


I havent used aubiose , my allbed is ten pounds for a big bale that has lasted me over a month so far  I get it from a supplier, it might be cheaper if you bought it direct, i have no car though so wouldnt be able to pick it up.

finacard is 13.99 delivered if you cant find a supplier and cant drive, that still would be most cost effective for you i think. 



Serenity's_Fall said:


> Is aubiose hemp based? If so that may be similar to the one I was using but mine went under the name Hemcore.
> 
> The hemcore for me worked out quite cheaply as it's designed as a horse bedding so comes in massive bales...whioch I think I used to pay about a tenner for but it would last aaaaaaaages!


Yes, its like hemcore but i think hemcore has citronella? Bales really do last ages, my boys get a full clean out each week because they seem to wee so much more! my girls get the dirty litter taken out and fresh put in so it is clean but still smells of them, they are neater with their toileting than the boys :lol2:


----------



## Disillusioned

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Is aubiose hemp based? If so that may be similar to the one I was using but mine went under the name Hemcore.
> 
> The hemcore for me worked out quite cheaply as it's designed as a horse bedding so comes in massive bales...whioch I think I used to pay about a tenner for but it would last aaaaaaaages!


Sounds good. I buy all my other animal foods/bedding in bulk so probs would be more effiecient for me to do it with the ratties too. Don't want anything that's gona irritate their little noses  bed time for me but I will be back!


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Yeah my boys just peed on everything(me included) it was like they were somehow claiming "this is mine" except they would forget they already claimed it a few minutes before and then pee on the same thing :devil: They were excellent at peeing all over new people when I was trying to explain how lovely they were :lol2:


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

The Hemcore I used didn't have citronella but I think they had more than one version, or they could have changed how they make it as it's been well over a year since I lost my boys.


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> Sounds good. I buy all my other animal foods/bedding in bulk so probs would be more effiecient for me to do it with the ratties too. Don't want anything that's gona irritate their little noses  bed time for me but I will be back!


Night hun  I get the base for my rats food in bulk , then mix myself 


Serenity's_Fall said:


> Yeah my boys just peed on everything(me included) it was like they were somehow claiming "this is mine" except they would forget they already claimed it a few minutes before and then pee on the same thing :devil: They were excellent at peeing all over new people when I was trying to explain how lovely they were :lol2:


oh boys are terrible for peeing on things, I had a buck who would always leave a stream across my hand without fail :devil:


----------



## Rach1

Mine are on fleece blankets as the oh has asthma.
More time consuming changing wise but better.
Speaking of which...
Rattie pics for your pleasure.
I give my ladies a treat every so often... Tonight is treat night








Above is Florry having some yoghurt!








Then it was Molls turn...









More mummy!









Next up Hera my Siamese eating a left over pork pie...









Ms Ernst investigating a box full of kale...









Dolly eating yoghurt









Blossom my blue









Blossom, dolly and moll...









And lastly for now moll doing what she loves most...
Sitting on my head.









Sorry but the black Berkshire didn't wish to be photographed today...
Moody cow!
Lol


----------



## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> The Hemcore I used didn't have citronella but I think they had more than one version, or they could have changed how they make it as it's been well over a year since I lost my boys.


Maybe, i think it was hemcore people complained about smelling really strongly, havent used it myself though


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Mine are on fleece blankets as the oh has asthma.
> More time consuming changing wise but better.
> Speaking of which...
> Rattie pics for your pleasure.
> I give my ladies a treat every so often... Tonight is treat night
> image
> Above is Florry having some yoghurt!
> image
> Then it was Molls turn...
> image
> 
> More mummy!
> image
> 
> Next up Hera my Siamese eating a left over pork pie...
> image
> 
> Ms Ernst investigating a box full of kale...
> image
> 
> Dolly eating yoghurt
> image
> 
> Blossom my blue
> image
> 
> Blossom, dolly and moll...
> image
> 
> And lastly for now moll doing what she loves most...
> Sitting on my head.
> image
> 
> Sorry but the black Berkshire didn't wish to be photographed today...
> Moody cow!
> Lol


I love their little hands :flrt: bless them , they are really enjoying that 
I love the one sat on your head :lol2: lovely pics hun


----------



## Rach1

Thanks.
I love florrys Tongue on the yoghurt one...
But yeah their hands are cuteness.
They are now currently raiding each others food stashes!
Lol


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Thanks.
> I love florrys Tongue on the yoghurt one...
> But yeah their hands are cuteness.
> They are now currently raiding each others food stashes!
> Lol


their tongues are cute too :flrt: 

haha mine do that, when i hand out things , i have two that will squirrel it away then my hairless girl will just go in an steal it


----------



## Rackie

Oooh ooh a rat chat thread - yay 

So I breed and show rats, but at the moment most of them live at home with my dad while I'm at uni so I don't see them very much - sad times 
It also means I haven't taken photos of them in a long while!


----------



## ami_j

Rackie said:


> Oooh ooh a rat chat thread - yay
> 
> So I breed and show rats, but at the moment most of them live at home with my dad while I'm at uni so I don't see them very much - sad times
> It also means I haven't taken photos of them in a long while!


I was looking at your site the other day, your rats are stunning hun. Not see you post on here or facebook in a while hope you are good 
Must be hard to be away from them  How is uni going?


----------



## Rackie

ami_j said:


> I was looking at your site the other day, your rats are stunning hun. Not see you post on here or facebook in a while hope you are good
> Must be hard to be away from them  How is uni going?


I've been posting a bit in 18+, don't tend to post much outside of there these days!

Thanks, it's pretty hard being away from them all, but they're doing well. My litters aren't so successful but I've been trying and trying again! Fingers crossed....!


----------



## sammy1969

Morning everyone. Well it seems busheys cant live on their own so now hunting mad for a friend for Harry. Anyone know of a breeder near Southampton at all?


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

sammy1969 said:


> Morning everyone. Well it seems busheys cant live on their own so now hunting mad for a friend for Harry. Anyone know of a breeder near Southampton at all?


If you get very desperate I know that Viper and Vine have some and they do courier around the country but afraid I don't know anyone closer, might be worth as a last resort though.

Hopefully you can find someone closer who has one and poor little Harry won't have to be alone for long!


----------



## sammy1969

Where are they based Becca as it could work too expensive for me if they are too faraway?


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

sammy1969 said:


> Where are they based Becca as it could work too expensive for me if they are too faraway?



They are based in Manchester but for anyone further than 20miles away they charge a courier fee of £55 which imo is super expensive!!:gasp: Especially considering there is a defra registered courier on here who only charges £45 anywhere in the UK and gives a fantastic service. Even though I don't live that far from Manchester I'd have to pay £55 to get anything couriered here, costs me less to drive to and from their shop lol.


----------



## ami_j

Poor Harry! I hope you find a friend for him soon I had a right nightmare trying to find gerbils when mine needed a friend


----------



## sammy1969

Christ that is expensive Becca i mean the jird will be about £20 as they are hard to find then £55 to have him couriered by them to Southampton It just wouldnt condusive for my budget unless i have no other choice.

Me to Jai I can see it being like looking for a needle in a haystack down here and it costing me a fortune to get Flash replaced but i dont want to loose Harry as well.


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Yeah, it's super expensive, especially considering there is an excellent courier on here who does anywhere in uk for £45 which is a tenner cheaper!! Just thought I'd post it anyway in case you get super desperate. Shame I'm not heading down south anytime soon(Eric's family is down south) otherwise would have offered to pick one up and bring it down with me 

I'll keep an eye out for anything closer to you! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

Wow that would be pricey! there must be someone nearer  any pet shops that sell exotics near you they might be able to order one or know someone who has them. 

Just cleaned my rats out and gave them some prawns they loved them  The girls are busying about im sat watching them they are very entertaining. Also im enjoying how much easier it is that they are on allbed it vaccuums so nicely it looks clean now


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Awww they eat prawns?! That's so cute! I never thought of trying prawns when I had my boys. I've decided I'm definitely going to get some more ratties!! Now just a matter of finding some lovely wee girlies around the NW. Have sent a message to Laura(Stovokor). she doesn't have kits of her own available but does have a few rescues needing homes apparently so just waiting to hear what she has available!


----------



## ami_j

yes they adored them :3 they love stuff like that I give mine allsorts got them some prawns yesterday they will feature more in their diet also curly kale, green beans, chicken bones when we have a roast, pepper, cous cous, scrambled or boiled egg, carrot lol they get allsorts


----------



## Rach1

My rats have the odd live cricket... they love 'em.
Becca, if your looking for a cage... equinecaninefeline have some good deals on and i have a discount code for a further 10% OFF.
:whistling2:


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Rach1 said:


> My rats have the odd live cricket... they love 'em.
> Becca, if your looking for a cage... equinecaninefeline have some good deals on and i have a discount code for a further 10% OFF.
> :whistling2:


Ooo I got my last rat cage from them, love them!! Haha I wrote the 10% off code down on a post it and stuck it near my computer so I could keep using it :lol2: Well assuming the code still works, shall go have a looky at what they have now, I get so excited about choosing cages :lol2:

I used to have a Duprasi and she LOVED live food, she would hunt down crickets and locusts, good way of giving her excercise too haha


----------



## Rach1

if its expired let me know and i'll send you the new one...


----------



## ami_j

Hi Rach 
yes crickets go down here well too, not given them in a while, my beardie doesnt really appreciate sharing :lol2: might get my rats some mealies


----------



## Rach1

oh oh oh...mine love mealies too...

I have been chatting to some peoples from NERS over night...turns out several of them are in lancaster...including a breeder so i have made some contacts already!
a few people have been chatting to me on the forum too...


----------



## Rach1

What to do...
can i squeeze another rattie lady in?


----------



## ami_j

Ooh cool  are you still going to the show? sounds like fun 
I'm always looking at the pics in your rats section theres often baby pics :flrt:

Oooh you have GMR? haha I have it all the time *blush* if you are wondering if your cage could take another one or two google rat cage calculator


----------



## Rach1

I hate cage calculators... i just dont think they work... they dont take into account levels, play things, rat sizes, etc etc.


----------



## ami_j

yeah it does really only work on the cage size its a fair guide though  but tbf its also common sense really. your cage looks pretty big to me  what type is it


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Haha do it!! You know you want another rattie


----------



## Esarosa

Rach1 said:


> I hate cage calculators... i just dont think they work... they dont take into account levels, play things, rat sizes, etc etc.



I agree with this, our last cage it said could house 10 rats. We had four in it and I wouldn't have wanted to limit them to less room with more rats than 5 or 6 max, even though I had really bad GMR...but then they were a tad spoilt according to my other half :whistling2:


----------



## Rach1

LOL... i meant the other way...LOL
i have 7 in mine but they seem to have loads of space..?
I think its also about how much theyre out too... and how they get along...
mine are all very teeny lady rats who like to snuggle and climb about...
so they love their cage...


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Heehee have arranged to go see some lovely ratties on saturday night, so should be a rat mummy agian by the weekend!!!! Big thanks to Rach for giving me the heads up on them!


----------



## Rach1

this is my cage...
well a picture of it..


----------



## Esarosa

Ahh see I always deducted 2 rats from the cage calculators total anyways, just for my own peace of mind. But then the last ratties I had in there were insanely active and used all of the cage most of the time. I suppose if I'd had boys I may have got about 8 in there without feeling I was hindering them, as all the boys I've met have been ever so relaxed/lazy. My girls were little speed demons :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Heehee have arranged to go see some lovely ratties on saturday night, so should be a rat mummy agian by the weekend!!!! Big thanks to Rach for giving me the heads up on them!


great news :2thumb:


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Cage and lots of lovely rattie things ordered! The discount code I had still worked Rach, yay!  Ended up going for the abode cage as it will fit perfectly in the space between mine and erics desks in the study


----------



## Rach1

which one that then..post a pic..


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Sorry had to fiddle about with photobucket, obv a google pic but will post pics of mine when I receive it and get it all set up ready for the ratlings!  It is the same width and depth as your cage Rach, just a little smaller height wise, this is about 100cm tall I think


----------



## Rach1

measuremtnts on mine include the stand i think...
i will have to do deffo measurements when i get home.


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Ahh migth be a similar height then not sure, they had your cage on equinecaninefeline but the measurement didn't say whether the stand was included :? It was a toss up between the cage you have and the abode...all it came down to in the end is I prefer black things so went for the abode :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Sorry had to fiddle about with photobucket, obv a google pic but will post pics of mine when I receive it and get it all set up ready for the ratlings!  It is the same width and depth as your cage Rach, just a little smaller height wise, this is about 100cm tall I think
> 
> image


if you want a good site for nice stuff to set it up with i can recomend
http://fuzzbutt.co.uk/http://ratwarehouse.co.uk/index.phphttp://www.fuzzbutt.co.uk
The Rat Warehouse


----------



## Esarosa

Feorag on here makes some lovely things too.


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> if you want a good site for nice stuff to set it up with i can recomend
> http://www.fuzzbutt.co.uk
> The Rat Warehouse


Ooo thanks for the links, having a look at them both now!


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Have a wee question about food, I remember my boys were on a homemade mix but I can't for the life of me remember what it was :blush: I know there was definitely dog kibble and cereals involved...but apart from that my brain is failing me! Can anyone point me in the direction of a good website somewhere that has info on homemade rat mixes please? :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

google shunamite rat mix hun that should pull up the site  Im on my phone otherwise i would post you the link


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Awesome, thanks!!


----------



## ami_j

Oreo in the hammock :flrt:


----------



## Shell195

ami_j said:


> Oreo in the hammock :flrt:
> image


 
Awwww shes cute:flrt:


----------



## ami_j

Shell195 said:


> Awwww shes cute:flrt:


She is lovely Shell :flrt: Such a lovely rat, have you to thank for helping me get her


----------



## Rackie

I get to see my babies this weekend, and hopefully see if any of them look like they might be pregnant - fingers crossed


----------



## Rach1

what types do you breed rackie?


----------



## ami_j

Rackie said:


> I get to see my babies this weekend, and hopefully see if any of them look like they might be pregnant - fingers crossed


exciting  fingers crossed


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Awww Oreo is gorgeous!! :flrt:


----------



## Serenity's_Fall

Rackie said:


> I get to see my babies this weekend, and hopefully see if any of them look like they might be pregnant - fingers crossed


Oooo bet you can't wait!! Hopefully there are some little fuzzie rat babies on the way for you!


----------



## sammy1969

HI everyone. Thought I wuld update you on my delivery today Well i received 4 sisters about 5 months old all 4 are huskies although i cant say what colour as they have still to come out of the tube they are hiding in and Ihavent gonein and disturbed them yet. However I was shocked whe i saw what had been hidden under some new bedding, it was almost half of a birthday cake complete with icing and dolly mixtures and sweets on top, I had also been bought some of the food they had been fed on which is museli and a cheap one at that and they wonder why one of the rats is rather over weight. Not sure what damage has been done other than they are over weight but was pretty shocked as was also told they were tame but they havent been handled for a month due to new baby, sonow have alot of work on my hands to tamethem down and inroduce my babies when they are old enough.


----------



## ami_j

Serenity's_Fall said:


> Awww Oreo is gorgeous!! :flrt:


Thank you  I got her from someone who could no longer keep her, she had been living alone so shes happy to have friends again 



sammy1969 said:


> HI everyone. Thought I wuld update you on my delivery today Well i received 4 sisters about 5 months old all 4 are huskies although i cant say what colour as they have still to come out of the tube they are hiding in and Ihavent gonein and disturbed them yet. However I was shocked whe i saw what had been hidden under some new bedding, it was almost half of a birthday cake complete with icing and dolly mixtures and sweets on top, I had also been bought some of the food they had been fed on which is museli and a cheap one at that and they wonder why one of the rats is rather over weight. Not sure what damage has been done other than they are over weight but was pretty shocked as was also told they were tame but they havent been handled for a month due to new baby, sonow have alot of work on my hands to tamethem down and inroduce my babies when they are old enough.


speechless...get all that sugary crap straight out, hopefully the poor things arent on the road to tooth root abcesses. To get weight off them if you dont have a wheel, get one...12 inch silent spinner or senior wodent wheel the rest are too small. and free range building up gradually. Also scatter feed, instead of putting it in a bowl, throw it about and really mix it in with the substrate make them work for it...a lot more fun


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## sammy1969

Oh jaimi it came straight out as soon as they were out the door beleive me and the museli is in the bin as for substrate well at the monet ta is just bedding nothing more so tomorrow i am going to get it all out and reset up the cage I mean even the water had excuse my language aload of shite at the bottom of it and was half way up the cage in a bowl as was the empty food bowl so how they ate from it I have no real idea. I have no wheel so will get that as soon as i can and htey are going to be excercised to get their weight down will free range them and make them run will get the cats to chase them lol joking.I hope not too much damage has been done tooth wise but we will have to wait and see I suppose. I usualy scatter food I must admit for all the rodents, the exception being the babies, as it is a more natural behaviour so they will have to work for all food now lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Oh jaimi it came straight out as soon as they were out the door beleive me and the museli is in the bin as for substrate well at the monet ta is just bedding nothing more so tomorrow i am going to get it all out and reset up the cage I mean even the water had excuse my language aload of shite at the bottom of it and was half way up the cage in a bowl as was the empty food bowl so how they ate from it I have no real idea. I have no wheel so will get that as soon as i can and htey are going to be excercised to get their weight down will free range them and make them run will get the cats to chase them lol joking.I hope not too much damage has been done tooth wise but we will have to wait and see I suppose. I usualy scatter food I must admit for all the rodents, the exception being the babies, as it is a more natural behaviour so they will have to work for all food now lol


I stopped using bowls for dry mix a while ago but no i realllly scatter it and if im feeling like a mean mummy i will mix it all in so they reallly have to dig for it. amazon is probably the best place for silent spinners they are expensive but worth it.
have fun free ranging or as i call it my hour daily of being wee'd on and my toes nipped :lol2:


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## sammy1969

LOl i stopped with bowls for dry food ages ago too much more fun for them and me when watching them. THe other thing i forgot to menation is there is a shelf missing from he cage and the tube its a jenny with the covered bars is just suspended from the ceiling in the not even with an end lower over the shelf infact it s nowhere near the shelf so will have to make that safer for them when i reset up the cage tomorrow


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## ami_j

I thought it was a brio? You are gonna need another cage afterall then  You have 7 females dont you?


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## sammy1969

Thats they are going into once the pups are big enough and they have been introduced this is the cage they came in and will be used for the boys eventualy when they are big enough and yes i have 7 girls now lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Thats they are going into once the pups are big enough and they have been introduced this is the cage they came in and will be used for the boys eventualy when they are big enough and yes i have 7 girls now lol


well a jenny is a nice size for your boys think you have two or three...gives them plenty of room so you need a cage for the girls?


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## sammy1969

Glyn hs two boys yeah lol so will be fine for them, I have the brio for the girls lol sorry am I confusing oyu again lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Glyn hs two boys yeah lol so will be fine for them, I have the brio for the girls lol sorry am I confusing oyu again lol


yes you are lol you gave the impression that the jenny came with the new girls :lol2:


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## sammy1969

It did the 4 new grils arrived in the jenny but they will be going into the brio


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> It did the 4 new grils arrived in the jenny but they will be going into the brio


i thought the brio came with the new girls which is why you got them *confused* :lol2:


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## sammy1969

Nah the Brio is coming from my mate angie down the end it has had her budgies in it but she has put them into the jenny I sold her lol not so long ago as she only has three left


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Nah the Brio is coming from my mate angie down the end it has had her budgies in it but she has put them into the jenny I sold her lol not so long ago as she only has three left


ahhhh lol


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## sammy1969

confusion solved now lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> confusion solved now lol


yes it is lol


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## Disillusioned

MY RATTIES 1ST BIRTHDAY TODAY!!!


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## Disillusioned

Oops missed this one..


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## Serenity's_Fall

Awww Happy Birthday ratties!! They are all stunning :flrt::flrt:


Bad news at my end, seems I won't be getting my ratties after all, took the boyfriend to see a friends rats as he's allergic to loads of stuff so wanted to make sure he wouldn't react to the rats before getting them...unfortunately he did have rather a bad reaction and ended up in A&E with him  (He's ok now though)

Unfortunately I'd already bought and assembled the cage and accessories which I apparently can't return as I've opened everything and assembled the cage...so if anyone knows of anyone/or a charity in the NW that wants a brand new rat cage there is one going!! (If there is a charity in need of a cage then they can take everything for free)

So we have:

Liberta Abode Cage
12" Silent Spinner Green
Large Grass House
3 x Fluffy Hammocks
Large Fluffy Igloo
2x Plastic Hanging Tubes (one curved and one straight)
Coconut Hanging Chew Toy
Rat Rope Bridge
HUGE bale of Finacard bedding which includes 3/4 bags of nesting material

And various hammocks and igloos etc I ordered from another site which have yet to arrive but will go with the cage.

Here's a pic:











I'm going to post in the classifieds later but thought I'd pop a little thing in here as I figured you guys might know someone or a charity or something that could use it...


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## ami_j

Happy Birthday Rattys 


Oh no Becca thats such a shame  there is rat rescue in manchester i think run by a lady called cynthia. Amalthea knows her i think. What a lovely gesture im sure they will be well used.


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## Serenity's_Fall

ami_j said:


> Happy Birthday Rattys
> 
> 
> Oh no Becca thats such a shame  there is rat rescue in manchester i think run by a lady called cynthia. Amalthea knows her i think. What a lovely gesture im sure they will be well used.


I know, I was so looking forward to getting more ratties too...  At least I can still come on here and look at everyones gorgeous rattie pics 

Ooo thanks, I'll PM her and ask if she has her contact details, have advertised it for sale as well but to be honest I'm hoping that I can find a charity to make use of it


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## Disillusioned

Hehe thank you both! they loved their cake and did not wanna come out from under the sofa once they had snatched it off me lol.

Awww it's a shame ur bf is allergic but omg that he ended up in hospital!.. Thats terrible!
Your cage is lovely and I bet a charity would be chuffed with it. 
Imagine all the little ratties who would get to snuggle in the fluffy beds!

I have to have my cage made to fit because my new living room is a dodgy shape! My rats think they own pretty much the whole room anyway since they are free-roam in the day.


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## ami_j

Oooh a specially made cage I cant wait to see it


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## Serenity's_Fall

Disillusioned said:


> Hehe thank you both! they loved their cake and did not wanna come out from under the sofa once they had snatched it off me lol.
> 
> Awww it's a shame ur bf is allergic but omg that he ended up in hospital!.. Thats terrible!
> Your cage is lovely and I bet a charity would be chuffed with it.
> Imagine all the little ratties who would get to snuggle in the fluffy beds!
> 
> I have to have my cage made to fit because my new living room is a dodgy shape! My rats think they own pretty much the whole room anyway since they are free-roam in the day.


I know, he's had bad reactions before but usually it's his skin that's affected, this time it was his breathing, he passed out and everything, bloody freaked me out 

Haha aww bless such lucky ratties to have so much free roam time, not surprised they think they own the room lol :lol: How long did it take for the cake to disappear? Bet it wasn't around long :lol2:


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## sammy1969

Becca i have pmed you hope you dont mind lol.
Love the pics of the rat bday party they looked like they were having a great time.


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## Serenity's_Fall

Course I don't mind!! I'll get those bit and bobs sorted when they arrive. I actually have a small cat treat ball that you put treats inside(it has adjustable holes for different size treats) and the cat is supposed to push it round the floor to get the treats out, Howl has never used it though and just gives me filthy looks when I get it out lol, but might be good exercise for your girlies if you want it?


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## Rach1

Excited about my potential new arrivals!
:whistling2:
Gonna pm storm in a bit...


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## sammy1969

THat would be great becca yeah I would love it as if the ras dotn use it i know two little cats who will lol my kits who have a bday on the 1st April lol they love stuff like that lol


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## Serenity's_Fall

Awesome well it's yours and I'll pop it with the rest of the stuffs :2thumb: Hopefully either ratties or kitties have fun with it


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## sammy1969

Yeah thanx I will get pics of the kits i havehun and pm them oyu hun yuwill see just a small selection of what i have lol


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## sammy1969

WEll i finally got fed up with not seeing the new arrivals after being told two were dumboes I finally too the tube out of the jenny and emptied them into a tub lol to get a good look at them. I willsay theydont look too bad and one is extremely firendly towards me and ran up under my hair and sat there for ages whilst i cleaned and set up their cage for them adding some of the bits i had already purchased and adding a second platform as only one was supplied with the cage. THey are all very pretty and i think none of them are overweight tbh. They are all very very timid and willneed some quiet handlingot brig them around but i dont think it will be a hard task as they will come to the door to try and escape. Also discovered they have never had any proper food as i use the shumanite diet as a basis for my fod and theyhave no idea what dried banana is or millet, dog biscuit cat biscuit weetabix shredded wheat oats or anything allthey have had is musli. so will have to get them used to eating proper food now instead of cake and junk lol.I willpost the pics of their cage so far and of them and the way they slink around the cage instead of running and walking like normal rats I get he impression they have been terrorised by something as the slightest noise and they startle badly but here they will quickly get used to mayhem lol


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## Rach1

Yay!
I am getting some new ratties hopefully next weekend.
All being well.
Just waiting for storm to get back to me!
Becca... I cannot thank you enough!
I shall be calling one of the new arrivals at some stage... Serenity!
After you!


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## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Yay!
> I am getting some new ratties hopefully next weekend.
> All being well.
> Just waiting for storm to get back to me!
> Becca... I cannot thank you enough!
> I shall be calling one of the new arrivals at some stage... Serenity!
> After you!


oooh what types you getting Rach?


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## Rach1

Well, storm has 2 black berkshires and 2 Rex smeezies!
So not sure.
I am also treating myself to one or two show rats. Something special.
Problem is, I love too many types.
Gonna have a look at this show I'm going to.. See what I like that I ain't seem before.


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## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Well, storm has 2 black berkshires and 2 Rex smeezies!
> So not sure.
> I am also treating myself to one or two show rats. Something special.
> Problem is, I love too many types.
> Gonna have a look at this show I'm going to.. See what I like that I ain't seem before.


I would probably get one of each lol


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## Rach1

I think they are already paired.
I'll ask storm when she comes on...
Typical, she's been on days and now has beggered off!
I am excited.
Gonna move maybe one or two of mine on with the newbies for company... And then decide where to go from there
I fancy something a bit special...
There are so many varieties I hadn't even heard of... 
My NERS pack arrived today.. Lists pages long of types... I'll have to get googling!
Lol
Images will help.


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## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> I think they are already paired.
> I'll ask storm when she comes on...
> Typical, she's been on days and now has beggered off!
> I am excited.
> Gonna move maybe one or two of mine on with the newbies for company... And then decide where to go from there
> I fancy something a bit special...
> There are so many varieties I hadn't even heard of...
> My NERS pack arrived today.. Lists pages long of types... I'll have to get googling!
> Lol
> Images will help.


Hawthorn Rat Varieties

this is a good site


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## Rackie

Rach if you have any show questions feel free to ask - I've been to a lot :lol:! The NERS lot are all lovely people


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## Rach1

Well it's been decided for me.. And I'm getting two little Rex Siamese.
Just gonna arrange a collection date.
Rackie... I have a million questions!
Lol


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## Disillusioned

ami_j said:


> Oooh a specially made cage I cant wait to see it


My laptop died yesterday! Using my bf's til mine gets sorted on monday!

Their cage is being made this week hopefully so pics will be up soon! Exciting!

And yeah their bday cake didnt last two minutes lol. Made them a few new hammocks and snuggly bits which should last a bit longer tho. I think they had a good time


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## Rach1

Ok, i have some questions...
First off, i have been trying to widen my ratties diet but struggle to decide/understand the whol shumite (?) diet thing.
Can someone please make a list/recipe that is easy to understand.
like say, base of....
add one cup of...
etc.

next up, i have some new pics of my ladies and would be grateful if people could confirm what colours i have... i think i know but its best to be sure...


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## Rach1

ok, here goes...
first up...Moll.
I am assuming she is an agouti Hooded...

















Next up, Blossom. Am i right in thinking she is a Russian Blue Self?
she has no white at all even on her feet.
Shes certainly not show standard self but she is a nice colour.
she has slight browning near the base of her tail but other than that is evenly coloured all over...

































Hera... my Siamese.

















Next, Nancy a poorly marked berkshire but i'm not sure what colouration.
She is a nice dark brown but thats all i can say...LOL

















now Dolly but i'm sure she is a hooded husky (roan).

















Lastly the two hairless...
Florry the dark one and Ms Ernst the siamese hairless.



































I don't mind being corrected on any colourations/types... I'd rather know what they are...


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## Rach1

I have been looking at some colours i'd like to get hold of...and have discovered the golden himalayan...lovely.
I am still trying to find pictures of other types but may wait until the show to see whats about.


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## ami_j

I would say you are spot on really rach. The dark brown could be a mink or a black with recessive will have a good look when i get on the comp


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## sammy1969

Rach I would agree with all your colours the two i am not sure of is the blue and the berkshire which i think is a chocolate but i know Ami will come and correct me if i am wrong the husky looks to be a black but it is hardtotell wit the waythey roan out lol.
Hoping to get pics of th new girls on here today once i have done everything i need to.


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## ami_j

chocolate is possible but fairly uncommon tbh, blacks with a lot of recessives can look dark brown i will post a pic of my black hooded i had years ago that was quite brown. damn this phone not letting me see the pics properly lol


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## Serenity's_Fall

I can't help you on the colours at all as I'm useless with all that! But some very very cute little girlies there!! :flrt: Hehe and two more cuties on the way :whistling2:

Just dismantled the cage so it'll fit in my car, so you get the fun of putting that up again lol. Just discovered in the process that my rear car seats actually fold down, woo! Not surprising I didn't find out before though considering it took me 6 months to find the cigarette lighter so I could plug my sat nav in :blush: (when I say "I" found it, it was actually my dad that found it for me within about 2 seconds of seeing my car lol).


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## Rach1

I have named my two newbies... Serenity and storm!
Hope you like.
Thanks for all the kind comments guys.
I doubt very much that Nancy is a chocolate..
More likely a faded black.
As for blossom...
I've always assumed Russian blue.


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## ami_j

might be worth posting pics of the dark brown lady (sorry forgot her name *blush*) on the fancy rats forum rach  under the genetics and varieties bit


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## sammy1969

LOL will say i am looking without my glasses on so everything is a bit fuzzy and wasn't when i looked earlier either. 
Just had fun bathing NEro one of the cats, not sure who is wetter me or him but hopefully it will help his skin.


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## Serenity's_Fall

Rach1 said:


> I have named my two newbies... Serenity and storm!
> Hope you like.
> Thanks for all the kind comments guys.
> I doubt very much that Nancy is a chocolate..
> More likely a faded black.
> As for blossom...
> I've always assumed Russian blue.


Awww lovely names!! Heehee never had a rat named after me lol. 

Aww bless, does he have quite sensitive skin Sam? Hopefully he tolerates bathing better than my grans cats do, every time they need one my gran gets me to do it...usually come out soaking wet and head to toe scratches :lol2:


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## sammy1969

He scratches himself till he creates huge bald patches mainly on the base of his tail and the back of his head and neck. Ours and the vets first thought was flea allergy so frontlined him only to fid after using it for over a year he had an allergic reaction to it so now no flea treatments for him and it turnd out it isnt a flea allergy at all. Then had him tested for allergies and everything came back negative so both ourselves and the vets are at a loss as to the cause so have put it down to stress Loki can be a bit ott when it comes to play when it comes to him and so I think it stresses him out. WE know it isnt food based as we have changed it afew times to check that one and even had him on barf diet and still no improvement. Even today when we bathed him not a single flea showed up not that i thought any would but it of at least given me an idea as to whats causing it. As for being scratched I was sensible I clipped his claws first as they were like talons and had Glyn help me but he was more interseted in just getting out of the shower than attacking either of us lolHoweer I did end up soaked to the skin lol


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## Rackie

Rach, your Berkshire is a black. The one everyone is debating on,it's hard to tell from those pics, she does look Russian based, can you get a pic a bit further out of her whole body..? Your roan is a black roan (not hooded and husky is the US term ).

will reply to your PM in a bit, I have no laptop so am on my pho e which is tedious :lol:


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## Rackie

sammy1969 said:


> He scratches himself till he creates huge bald patches mainly on the base of his tail and the back of his head and neck. Ours and the vets first thought was flea allergy so frontlined him only to fid after using it for over a year he had an allergic reaction to it so now no flea treatments for him and it turnd out it isnt a flea allergy at all. Then had him tested for allergies and everything came back negative so both ourselves and the vets are at a loss as to the cause so have put it down to stress Loki can be a bit ott when it comes to play when it comes to him and so I think it stresses him out. WE know it isnt food based as we have changed it afew times to check that one and even had him on barf diet and still no improvement. Even today when we bathed him not a single flea showed up not that i thought any would but it of at least given me an idea as to whats causing it. As for being scratched I was sensible I clipped his claws first as they were like talons and had Glyn help me but he was more interseted in just getting out of the shower than attacking either of us lolHoweer I did end up soaked to the skin lol


Sounds like one of his cage mates is barbering him. It can be genetic and some rats don't stop doing it... Have a look at the other rat(s)' front paws, they usually barber those too. And have a google of barbering, I think Estelle has an article on her ratz site but again, on my phone it's not easy for me to link to!


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## Rach1

So the roan is a black?
Even tho she's White?
Lol
The Berkshire is a black and blossom is, well were not sure!
Yet!


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## sammy1969

Sorry Rackie Becca and i were talking about NERo one of my five cats lol so no cage mates. Didnt mean to confuse you hun at all.

I would say the roan is a black even though she has roaned out nicely lol


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## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> So the roan is a black?
> Even tho she's White?
> Lol
> The Berkshire is a black and blossom is, well were not sure!
> Yet!


yup she would of been like this as a baby?









shes roaned out hence her being white now


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## Rach1

Nope she looked nothing like that.
She had no black on her at all...
I got her when she was 6 weeks and she was silvery grey and White.
This is her at 6 weeks.


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## sammy1969

She looks the same as my 4 new girls and one little boy i have here lol


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## Esarosa

ami_j said:


> chocolate is possible but fairly uncommon tbh, blacks with a lot of recessives can look dark brown i will post a pic of my black hooded i had years ago that was quite brown. damn this phone not letting me see the pics properly lol



Here ya go here was my 'chocolate' aka bad black rescue rattie Puck








(bottom pic was the day we brought her home..skin and bone )


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## ami_j

she would of looked like that as a younger baby rach she was roaning when you got her  they are quite dark as youngsters, your girl has roaned a lot


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## ami_j

Esarosa said:


> Here ya go here was my 'chocolate' aka bad black rescue rattie Puck
> 
> image (bottom pic was the day we brought her home..skin and bone )


what a sweet face! its amazing how much black can lighten. poor girl being that thin some people make me so angry


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## Rach1

So dolly will have really roaned out that much by six weeks?
She looks terribly light by 6 weeks.
Not that I'm sAying your wrong cause I have no idea!
Lol


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## ami_j

some roan more heavily than others and at different rates  the roan in the pic i found wasnt a striped either hence her looking more white. they moult around six weeks so thats normally when they start to show lightening of the coat


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## sammy1969

Jai Just a question what if she hasnt heavily roaned out at six weeks would that make her a different colour or would she still be classed as a black roan?


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## Ameliaxx

Rach1 said:


> Well it's been decided for me.. And I'm getting two little Rex Siamese.
> Just gonna arrange a collection date.
> Rackie... I have a million questions!
> Lol


 hello everyone 

rach im getting 2 rex siamese too  as well as a rex dumbo burmese cant wait im new to rats so these will be my first trio of rats (there boys by the way  )


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## Rach1

Aw, great stuff!
Siamese are lovely.
I already have one called Hera.
She is actually a little grumpy at times.


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## ami_j

nope its definately roaning, if you look at her instead of one colour theres the darker hairs with the roaned ones


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## ami_j

Ameliaxx said:


> hello everyone
> 
> rach im getting 2 rex siamese too  as well as a rex dumbo burmese cant wait im new to rats so these will be my first trio of rats (there boys by the way  )


burmese are on my wish list :3
love siamese, i have a sealpoint siamese hooded and i had a russian blue point siamese berkshire who died at christmas  he was stunning.


----------



## Ameliaxx

ami_j said:


> burmese are on my wish list :3
> love siamese, i have a sealpoint siamese hooded and i had a russian blue point siamese berkshire who died at christmas  he was stunning.


they all sound beautiful :flrt:sorry for your little one that died 
if you go on to firesev rattery and then click on current litters the third litter down the 2 siamese rexs and the burmese is the one in the middle of the three kits together... there :flrt:
Current Litters


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## sammy1969

So it couldnt be that she has just lightly roaned out then?
Sorry i know it sounds like i am being perdantic but i am just curious and oyu know genetics confuse the hell out of me. There is another reason two of the new girls are definately black roans you can tell by the darkness of their hairs where they still have colour and they aso have black patches on certain parts of them. The other two hare alot paler on the darker hairs that are still showing and actually have a couple of solid colour patches on them which look grey rather than black hence my questions and my male kit definately doesnt look anywhere near as dark as the one in the pic and is more of the grey that is classed as a blue. ~I know I am a pain lol but i wondered if Rach's had been lighter and just had light roaning at six weeks rather than heavy roaning?


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## ami_j

roans start off with fur like normal all one colour. black roans start off black then start to fade to a grey colour and end up white with grey hairs flecked through, the amount of which varies from rat to rat. so its not a case of being a lighter rat who has roaned less as she has the darker hairs.


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## ami_j

also your male who is dark grey, if he was a blue roan he would be lighter than a usual blue at his age. i will try find some pics later but the colour change is definatly due to roaning


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## sammy1969

Ahh ok I knew the rat had roaned it was just the amount and if the base colour she was lighter Ie grey before the roaning process began that I was querying hun I will have to get a better pic of the baby up on here as it was quite dark and didnt show his real colour at all well but would say he definately not black but grey is possible and the nee girls I know oyu cant tell me about till i post the pics lol


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## ami_j

black roans are grey hun lol


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## Rach1

I know what you mean sammy.
I just cannot imagine that dolly was ever that black.
She seems to have lost her blackness very quickly due to the roaning.
I also wondered, as you did, if she was say a dark grey or bluey colour rather than black.
It's a cobbed one alright.
I understand what roaning means etc but i just went to look at her and the darker hairs she does still have are a grey colour and deffo not a black.
They look like blossoms colour... Dark blue/grey.

So, can you get say blue roans, or chocolate roans?
Sorry for the dumb qus... But you gotta ask to learn!


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## sammy1969

Ok now i am confused as he definately isnt black at all have him on me right now, mind you blue isnt blue but a form a grey is it not lol, and looking at him in this light he looks grey, but in daylight he looks blue, the same colour as a british blue cat.Damn genetics and colour in ratsd are confusing as the other thing is he is as light as two of the five month olds i have now and they have definately roaned out lol. Think i will give up on trying to understand genetics lol it makes my brain hurt too much lol.

Do you mean black roans are grey as adults JAimi or that they can start off as grey before they start to roan out?


----------



## ami_j

like i said in my last post, black roans are grey due to the roaning gene.look at grey hair for example. its white hair but looks grey due to the reflection of the darker hairs. you can get any colour roan really  but they tend to be black or agouti ime


----------



## Rach1

Well I'm ashamed to say I still don't get it.
I will, just need to get my head round it.
So, if you have kits that look black how can you tell they are gonna roan out.


----------



## sammy1969

~I'm with you on this one Rach lol I still dont get it either but ten my brain doesnt work well anymore as Jai knows. I know I have had blue raons from my blue litters when i used to breed rats hence what i am basing my guess on for the pup i have now but I am still none the wiser on this black and grey thing. MY last question was on whether you meant they look grey as young adults or can they be grey in colour before any roaning starts say two weeks of age Jaimi? So i could clear that bit up in my brain lol


----------



## ami_j

cos roans have white up their noses  which are different to blazed rats which stay the same colour, they dont fade at all. will post some pics when i get on the comp. roans just get their hairs replaced for white onces really


----------



## ami_j

In answer to your question sam, they start off dark and get lighter. obviously the darkness of the baby depends on how black it would be as an adult. wade was dark dark grey as a baby while he still had fur and this got lighter as he grew. will find pics


----------



## sammy1969

Ahhh i get that bit now lol god m head hurt lol cant wait for yu to get onto the comp so oyu can post te pics and it makes it easier for me to understand lol. Ever since I have had the chickenpox with this damn brain inflamation i find alot of things alot harder to get my head round and now have the problem of not being able to pronounce words properly even though i know how they should sound and I stop halfway through sentences thinking i have completed them when talking to someone in person lol


----------



## Rach1

ok, i've been reseraching and found this...
http://www.fancy-rats.co.uk/information/guides/images/roan2.jpg

this is exactly what dolly looks like...colouring etc...
so could she be this.
I know i'm being a fussy :censor: about this BUT I really dont think she has ever been black/dark grey even...
she was a solid grey/blue when I got her with no signs of black at all, not even a few hairs...


----------



## ami_j

here are some examples...bascially black roans are lighter than normal blacks and keep getting lighter, some get lighter than others

Roan / Husky Rat Genetics

this explains it further
Roan « Hawthorn Rat Varieties


in the simplest way of describing it , roans start out lighter than they would of done without the roaning gene (eg black roans are grey) and they continue to get lighter from their hairs becoming white, some stay darker than others. 

Also roans that have patches will look darker than ones with a smaller dark hair to white hair ratio


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> ok, i've been reseraching and found this...
> http://www.fancy-rats.co.uk/information/guides/images/roan2.jpg
> 
> this is exactly what dolly looks like...colouring etc...
> so could she be this.
> I know i'm being a fussy :censor: about this BUT I really dont think she has ever been black/dark grey even...
> she was a solid grey/blue when I got her with no signs of black at all, not even a few hairs...


thats a black roan thats roaned out alot hun


----------



## Rach1

so why is it called a russian blue roan?
I'm not being arsey but just trying to get my head round this...


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> so why is it called a russian blue roan?
> I'm not being arsey but just trying to get my head round this...


why dont you post it on the fancy rats forum see what they say?


----------



## Rach1

cause its not that i dont believe you... i just dont get the whole roan thing.
so they will say the same as you and i still wont get it...LOL
:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> cause its not that i dont believe you... i just dont get the whole roan thing.
> so they will say the same as you and i still wont get it...LOL
> :lol2:


which bit dont you get hun, im trying to think how to describe it best :lol2:

Do you know what her siblings were? were they all roan too?


----------



## Rach1

i dont know Ami... 
you wouldnt think i have a degree would you!
LOL...Ive posted her pics on the forum though in the hopes that someone can get it through to me...


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> i dont know Ami...
> you wouldnt think i have a degree would you!
> LOL...Ive posted her pics on the forum though in the hopes that someone can get it through to me...


she may be something lighter, will see what they say, to me though the few grey hairs look like a black roan, and the lightness being caused by the white hairs that have come through but i have been wrong before


----------



## Rach1

ami_j said:


> she may be something lighter, will see what they say, to me though the few grey hairs look like a black roan, and the lightness being caused by the white hairs that have come through but i have been wrong before


no I'm sure your not...lol.
I am just proper dumb at times.
the only aspect i dont get is the whole black hairs thing...as she really doesnt have any... they are all dark grey/bluey.
even when i got her she was mostly grey/blue with white hairs coming thru.


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> no I'm sure your not...lol.
> I am just proper dumb at times.
> the only aspect i dont get is the whole black hairs thing...as she really doesnt have any... they are all dark grey/bluey.
> even when i got her she was mostly grey/blue with white hairs coming thru.


roaning makes black lighter to a grey colour, black roans are greyish, plus the white hairs make them look lighter still. i wish roans didnt lose their colour, would love a roan that kept its colour :lol2:


----------



## Rach1

hmmm.
i know what you mean.
she is practically white now.
was browsing the other forum and found some piccies of some roans described as mink... they too were grey and i think thats whats confusing me...
some are grey at 6 weeks and described as say, blue, mink roans etc...
bloomin confusing!
and i thought snakes were bad re genetics...
LOL


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> hmmm.
> i know what you mean.
> she is practically white now.
> was browsing the other forum and found some piccies of some roans described as mink... they too were grey and i think thats whats confusing me...
> some are grey at 6 weeks and described as say, blue, mink roans etc...
> bloomin confusing!
> and i thought snakes were bad re genetics...
> LOL


roan can be a tricky one, making things look grey....its like with people , what people think is grey hair is white hair but it reflects off your hair making it look grey...guess thats how it works with roans lol


----------



## Rach1

edit- oops double post...


----------



## sammy1969

ONe quesion why did they label that pic as a russian blue roan if it is a black roan but just made to look lighter due to the roan gene I mean all of my new rats are sisters and all are roans two look to have dumbo in them and two dont which is weird and they were bought from a breeder not a pet shop and the breeder said two were black roans and two were blues have spoken to the person i got them off as needed to clarify age etc with them and if they had ever had anything other than museli as food etc so asked a few more questions about their back ground. Apparently one parent was a blue the other a blue husky so i get the throw backs to blacks in them mind oyu I wouldnt say for sure that the two others are true blue huskies as they look very pale grey to me but these are 5 months old and i know the roaning process is in full swing.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ONe quesion why did they label that pic as a russian blue roan if it is a black roan but just made to look lighter due to the roan gene I mean all of my new rats are sisters and all are roans two look to have dumbo in them and two dont which is weird and they were bought from a breeder not a pet shop and the breeder said two were black roans and two were blues have spoken to the person i got them off as needed to clarify age etc with them and if they had ever had anything other than museli as food etc so asked a few more questions about their back ground. Apparently one parent was a blue the other a blue husky so i get the throw backs to blacks in them mind oyu I wouldnt say for sure that the two others are true blue huskies as they look very pale grey to me but these are 5 months old and i know the roaning process is in full swing.


possibly it is a russian blue roan...like i said its a minefield but im still inclined to agree with rackie that dolly is a black. what kind of blue are the parents sam cos two british blues wouldnt make any black babies, same with two russian blues...its likely they thought the roan parent was blue as black is lightened by the roan gene...you have to wonder how reputable the breeder was to sell to people who gave such little care and fed them cake....


----------



## sammy1969

I have no idea what type of blues hun they just said blue and a blue roan helpful i know but will see if i can find out but dont want to have to keep calling them as they did come across as a few sandwiches short of a picnic if you know what I mean. Also justnoticed that he one that has attached itself to me has like a little ridge of hair that sticks up like on a rhodesian ridgeback from the back of its head down between her shoulder blades and she is the only one andit isnt that her hair is ruffled it literally grows that way, is that normal?


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I have no idea what type of blues hun they just said blue and a blue roan helpful i know but will see if i can find out but dont want to have to keep calling them as they did come across as a few sandwiches short of a picnic if you know what I mean. Also justnoticed that he one that has attached itself to me has like a little ridge of hair that sticks up like on a rhodesian ridgeback from the back of its head down between her shoulder blades and she is the only one andit isnt that her hair is ruffled it literally grows that way, is that normal?


not anything i have come across on any of mine , weird. if they dont know what kind of blue they are thats definately not a "breeder" more like someone throwing rats together tbh hun. But if they look to you like black roans like you said earlier thats probably what they are lol

edit it doesnt help that people are calling black roans, blues on google this is more of a blue roan

http://www.flickr.com/photos/beautifulwolf/2439112211/
http://www.worldofrats.com/ROUSKnut.html


----------



## sammy1969

To be honest they may of been told but they just havent told me what type of blues as I say they werent the brightest of the bunch lol. I wouldnt blame the breeder as when I first spoke to them I thought they were alot different from what they turned out to be thats for sure, i mean to get the info out of them on the parentage of these four was bad enough lol, i got the impression they didnt understand the question at all lol till i said do you know what colours their mum and dad were at all, so does that explain what i was up against lol

THe ridge on Baby is weird and I havent seen it on any of the others at all only her thoughit was just a darker patch as she is one of the black roans not the paler ones at all and oyu really can see a huge difference in their colours like from black to palest grey but you will see when i get round to posting pics


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> To be honest they may of been told but they just havent told me what type of blues as I say they werent the brightest of the bunch lol. I wouldnt blame the breeder as when I first spoke to them I thought they were alot different from what they turned out to be thats for sure, i mean to get the info out of them on the parentage of these four was bad enough lol, i got the impression they didnt understand the question at all lol till i said do you know what colours their mum and dad were at all, so does that explain what i was up against lol


maybe but i would of expected people like that to be weeded out with a kitten application form/emailing the breeder in response to the kittens


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## sammy1969

Me too but nt sure if they were on a waiting list or anything just went and bought


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Me too but nt sure if they were on a waiting list or anything just went and bought


hmm...well i dont suppose it matters much now lol , you will have to get some pics up see if they are black roan like you think hun...you will have to get more of the girl kittens up too see if they are both mink. think it can differ a little in shade tbh


----------



## sammy1969

~I know will try to do it tomorrow but i find photobucket complicated these days and yet i used to be fine with it lol . Mind you i find thinking hard these days too lol and no witty comments from you either lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~I know will try to do it tomorrow but i find photobucket complicated these days and yet i used to be fine with it lol . Mind you i find thinking hard these days too lol and no witty comments from you either lol


:lol2: ok...get them in good light and stuff and i will look when i get on the comp as my phone doesnt show them very well


----------



## sammy1969

I have taken some of the new ones when i had them all out cleaning which seem quite good on the camera but wil have to see once they are on the lappy


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I have taken some of the new ones when i had them all out cleaning which seem quite good on the camera but wil have to see once they are on the lappy


ok hun


----------



## Rach1

quick question...
just browsing my local animal shelter website and they have 2 ratties needing homes... i can't offer them a home but i did notice the rats were being kept on wood shavings...
now then do i send them a nice polite email telling them the error of thier ways? or do i mind my own bees wax and let 'em get on with it?


----------



## ami_j

I would send them a nice polite email, I'm sure being a rescue they want to do their best by the animals


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## Rach1

Have sent one...
hope they dont think i'm a nutter!


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Have sent one...
> hope they dont think i'm a nutter!


Shouldnt think so if they care about the animals


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## sammy1969

WEll all week I have been doing intros with the mum and babies and the new girlies. All has been going well so tonight I have put them all in together for the first time and the only squabble there has been so far was a quick tussle between the 2 baby girls lol which was stopped by two of the new girls.
I was hoping to have a bit more time to do the ontros but the boy babies have developed huge nuptials and I realy dont want to risk an accidental mating as they are not related to any of the girl babies or mum. Just hoping there are no setbacks now as wantto kep them in the smller of the two cages for a week or so to help tame down the new gilrs as the others aresed to beinghandled and itsaves me chasing them round a huge cage and scaring them instead of helping them to settle and bond with me.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> WEll all week I have been doing intros with the mum and babies and the new girlies. All has been going well so tonight I have put them all in together for the first time and the only squabble there has been so far was a quick tussle between the 2 baby girls lol which was stopped by two of the new girls.
> I was hoping to have a bit more time to do the ontros but the boy babies have developed huge nuptials and I realy dont want to risk an accidental mating as they are not related to any of the girl babies or mum. Just hoping there are no setbacks now as wantto kep them in the smller of the two cages for a week or so to help tame down the new gilrs as the others aresed to beinghandled and itsaves me chasing them round a huge cage and scaring them instead of helping them to settle and bond with me.


Sounds like its going well Sam, I shouldnt worry too much about the cage, does it have a big door? you will probably have the most luck with taming when they are out on free range tbh they will be shy at first but curiosity will get the better of them



Also guys I got an amazing book yesterday 
Shunamite Rats

its like the rat nutrition bible :lol2:


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## Rach1

Ah, ive heard about this book... the scuttling gourmet..is it worth the money?
only 3 days to go till i get my new cage/babies etc...hopefully.
very giddy!


----------



## Rackie

Rach1 said:


> Ah, ive heard about this book... the scuttling gourmet..is it worth the money?
> only 3 days to go till i get my new cage/babies etc...hopefully.
> very giddy!


It's a really useful book to have handy. I'd say if you had to buy any books on rats it would be the Scuttling Gourmet and the NFRS health handbook. They're both really useful I think!
(NFRS does a deal on both I think - National Fancy Rat Society )


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Ah, ive heard about this book... the scuttling gourmet..is it worth the money?
> only 3 days to go till i get my new cage/babies etc...hopefully.
> very giddy!


definatley, I can barely put it down :lol2:


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## sammy1969

The jenny they are in for a minute till i make room for the trio has the big door on the top but I am not sure on the brio. The new brio also has to be cleaned as it is quite dirty but I suppose for a tenner I cant grumble at having to spend a day cleaning it up properly.Oh and I found ot basically what the new rats have been being fed on too,LEFTOVERS!! ~I was eating fish and chips last night and the friendliest of the new rats came up and pinched a chip and took it away and then came back for more yet they still wont touch the food in the cage properly but hoping now the babies and mum are in with them they will follow their lead and start eating it.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> The jenny they are in for a minute till i make room for the trio has the big door on the top but I am not sure on the brio. The new brio also has to be cleaned as it is quite dirty but I suppose for a tenner I cant grumble at having to spend a day cleaning it up properly.Oh and I found ot basically what the new rats have been being fed on too,LEFTOVERS!! ~I was eating fish and chips last night and the friendliest of the new rats came up and pinched a chip and took it away and then came back for more yet they still wont touch the food in the cage properly but hoping now the babies and mum are in with them they will follow their lead and start eating it.


have you got me these pics yet?:lol2:


getting right stressed trying to re jig my mix :bash::lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

Oh hell completely forgot to put them on here will do it tomorrow during the day hun want to see if i can get some out side in natural light if they will behave any that donti wont force and willj sut put up the ones i already have of them but those who like it will take out there just have to hope the sun shines now lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Oh hell completely forgot to put them on here will do it tomorrow during the day hun want to see if i can get some out side in natural light if they will behave any that donti wont force and willj sut put up the ones i already have of them but those who like it will take out there just have to hope the sun shines now lol


ok lol you will have to wait til the evening til i can look properly then  intros still going well? My girls seem to be having a bit of a mutiny atm, i think its due to Raves increased age


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## sammy1969

The intros have gone amazingly well and all the girls are inth same cage but i havent put them into the brio yet as i want to tame them all right down before doing so as the pups are lost in the jenny. so need them to get a little bit bigger yet.I have names for most of them now which go with either their markings or personality lol. The friendliest is now named Sarah as she is like gracewings daughter then we have Domino as she has more than one spot on her white markings, Blaze because she has a white blaze on her face and Nibbler coz she likes to nibble at me at every chance she gets. The mum I have named Topaz as that is supposed to be her colour, the berkshire pup has the name of Star as that is the shape of her white patch on her stomach lol and the mink one has no name at all as cant think of one for her at all. The boys are called Badger coz it has badger like markings and the other darker mink or whatever colour he is is called Moley as Glyn likes Wind in the willows and they are his rats lol.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> The intros have gone amazingly well and all the girls are inth same cage but i havent put them into the brio yet as i want to tame them all right down before doing so as the pups are lost in the jenny. so need them to get a little bit bigger yet.I have names for most of them now which go with either their markings or personality lol. The friendliest is now named Sarah as she is like gracewings daughter then we have Domino as she has more than one spot on her white markings, Blaze because she has a white blaze on her face and Nibbler coz she likes to nibble at me at every chance she gets. The mum I have named Topaz as that is supposed to be her colour, the berkshire pup has the name of Star as that is the shape of her white patch on her stomach lol and the mink one has no name at all as cant think of one for her at all. The boys are called Badger coz it has badger like markings and the other darker mink or whatever colour he is is called Moley as Glyn likes Wind in the willows and they are his rats lol.


 baby rats are kittens sam not pups:lol2:
loving the names you will have to get a pic of Topaz too see if she actually is topaz...though I had a champagne called topaz so its still a nice name if she isnt


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## sammy1969

Lol down here we call them pups always have it is weird coz when i first started i used to call them kits no pups and got told they were pups so now completely confused as to what they should be called mind oyu when i buy them frozen I have to ask for rat pups not kits lol or is it different when they are food lol.


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## ami_j

for food they get called pups for some reason but in the UK at least they are definately kittens


----------



## sammy1969

Ahh i see so they do it just to conuse me lol and you know how easy that is these days and no comments on my brain prowess please lmao, as I know what you are like you mad woman.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Ahh i see so they do it just to conuse me lol and you know how easy that is these days and no comments on my brain prowess please lmao, as I know what you are like you mad woman.


i wasnt going to say a thing :lol2:


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## sammy1969

Lol yeah i know you weren't really butjsut in case lol I had to put that as i know i left myself wide open for a comment when i put that on here lol


----------



## ami_j

you did haha you are lucky that im not feeling like teasing you.... atm anyway lol


----------



## selina20

Hi guys im new to ratties and got my 1st rattie given to me on Sunday. His name is patch and here is the little sweetie


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## sammy1969

HI selina welcome to rat chat. YOu will find out that weare all as mad as hatters on here despite what Ami-j will try and tell you lol she is the worst of us all honest lol. I hope you enjoy your stay here and dont end up as addicted as the rest of us to these very cute adorable little critters lol


----------



## Esarosa

Aw Selina he's beautiful. Ratties are very addictive, I just loved watching mine interract with one another, and little obstacles/challenges you put in there way. I miss having ratties, but I'm banned as Will says they don't live long enough and I ended up "traumatised everytime" I lost one...apparently :roll:


----------



## selina20

I went to pick up a tarantula and came back with a rat lol. Honestly u cant take me anywhere :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

selina20 said:


> I went to pick up a tarantula and came back with a rat lol. Honestly u cant take me anywhere :lol2:


Lol give me a rat over a tarantula any day of the week lol but then i am arachnophobic, and oyu can't be any worse than any of us on here we go for one thing and come back with allsorts lol. I mean i was only supposed ot of been geting two baby blue female rats have ended up with 9 lol i was given 5 instead of the two babies and then got 4 more girls when i brought a cage lol. The 4 girls that came with the cage are huskies/roans like your little man there and the other 5 are 2 girl dumboes one black berkshire, one mink, and 2 little boys one roan and one that is like a dark mink and their mum who is a topaz normal lol. So still dont have my blue dumbo females i wanted in th first place lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> HI selina welcome to rat chat. YOu will find out that weare all as mad as hatters on here despite what Ami-j will try and tell you lol she is the worst of us all honest lol. I hope you enjoy your stay here and dont end up as addicted as the rest of us to these very cute adorable little critters lol


oi :whip::lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

You know I love you really but you are as mad as a hatter lol its what makes you so much fun


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> You know I love you really but you are as mad as a hatter lol its what makes you so much fun


hmmm bit of a back handed compliment that :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

WEll you know i know how to creep so well lol and you do so love it wen i am creeping lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> WEll you know i know how to creep so well lol and you do so love it wen i am creeping lol


I do not love it when you are creeping lol :lol2: you took them pics yet?


----------



## sammy1969

YOu do too love it lol 

Well its like this you see "flutters eyelids sweetly so you wont shout at me for being silly" I had ever intention of doing it today was even going to do it outside in the lovely sunshine so you could really see all their colours in natural light. HOwever after doing the dishes, feeding the snakes and lizards and sorting the washing it was getting a bit colder but thought it still should be ok so found camera and put cage by front door opened it and then had full scale panic attack as Glyn wasnt here to come out with me so i didnt get to do it so I am sorry but will try again toorrow as glyn is home


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> YOu do too love it lol
> 
> Well its like this you see "flutters eyelids sweetly so you wont shout at me for being silly" I had ever intention of doing it today was even going to do it outside in the lovely sunshine so you could really see all their colours in natural light. HOwever after doing the dishes, feeding the snakes and lizards and sorting the washing it was getting a bit colder but thought it still should be ok so found camera and put cage by front door opened it and then had full scale panic attack as Glyn wasnt here to come out with me so i didnt get to do it so I am sorry but will try again toorrow as glyn is home


lol no hurry XD


----------



## sammy1969

I knew you would understand


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I knew you would understand


you can answer questions instead for your punishment mwahaha!
what colour is mum and what colour are her eyes?


----------



## sammy1969

Ok her eyes are red and her colour is like a beigey colour lol if that helps she isnt a cream and she isnt a champayne as have had both of those lol and she seems a diferent colour from both of those lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Ok her eyes are red and her colour is like a beigey colour lol if that helps she isnt a cream and she isnt a champayne as have had both of those lol and she seems a diferent colour from both of those lol


sounds like she could be buff...could be topaz they tend to be more gingery though


----------



## sammy1969

She does have a gingery tinge to her but pics dont seem to show it up properly


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> She does have a gingery tinge to her but pics dont seem to show it up properly


probably is one then, the dark eyes indicate a topaz, plus silverfawns are really ginger..what were her babies again?


----------



## sammy1969

WEll thats the thing I am not sure which are her babies. It is supposed to be the two dumbo girls which are a black berkshire and a mink but she wasnt mated with a dumbo male it was supposed to of been a blue normal male. The two little males are the husky which we have our differences on his colour lol and one that is darker than the mink but lighter than a chocolate lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> WEll thats the thing I am not sure which are her babies. It is supposed to be the two dumbo girls which are a black berkshire and a mink but she wasnt mated with a dumbo male it was supposed to of been a blue normal male. The two little males are the husky which we have our differences on his colour lol and one that is darker than the mink but lighter than a chocolate lol


well topaz is agouti based so even with a self based male and carrying the genes for self colours (black being the self colour with the least recessives) I would expect some agouti based babies


----------



## sammy1969

So are any of the babies agouti based in colour


----------



## ami_j

black isnt and neither is mink. Its possible, genes dont always follow the probablities they are meant to lol. but yeah, even if mum was a carrier i would expect half and half. four is a small litter, was it four she had? agouti colours have ticked hairs, they should be well apparent on your rats by now...infact get some pics up here Fancy Rats • View forum - Varieties and genetics you will have to join but more opinions will help you


----------



## sammy1969

Well thats e thing I dont know how many babies this mum had I do know she adopted two that werent hers as she only had i think it was 4 max but i know the ones that came with her were two of hers and two she had adopted but was told the dumbo girls were her offspring and the boys werent bu t as the mum was supposedly mated to a blue normal eared boy i cant see how the two dumbo girls can be hers and that infact the two normal eared boys are hers and that would also explain the blue roan or would i be wrong in assuming that


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Well thats e thing I dont know how many babies this mum had I do know she adopted two that werent hers as she only had i think it was 4 max but i know the ones that came with her were two of hers and two she had adopted but was told the dumbo girls were her offspring and the boys werent bu t as the mum was supposedly mated to a blue normal eared boy i cant see how the two dumbo girls can be hers and that infact the two normal eared boys are hers and that would also explain the blue roan or would i be wrong in assuming that


topeareds can have dumbos if they carry the gene. sounds like a hell of a lot of messing about got done with the litters :\ the topaz would need to carry blue for that roan to be blue, if you post a pic on the rat forum they will be able to confirm if hes blue or not..you know i dont think he is cos hes too dark for blue roan so getting more opinions would be handy lol


----------



## sammy1969

~i have no idea lol what she did whenit came to the mating ust cant see how two dumboes came from two topears which supposedly didnt have dumbo in theri lines which is why i suspect the two boys are the kits to this female and the two females are from the other mating she did but i have no idea if either parents were dumboes although i do know she did have a dumbo male but think it was a berkshire but not sure of the colour lol. Still time for me to go bed lol so will speak to oyu tomorrow hun and will get those pics done.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~i have no idea lol what she did whenit came to the mating ust cant see how two dumboes came from two topears which supposedly didnt have dumbo in theri lines which is why i suspect the two boys are the kits to this female and the two females are from the other mating she did but i have no idea if either parents were dumboes although i do know she did have a dumbo male but think it was a berkshire but not sure of the colour lol. Still time for me to go bed lol so will speak to oyu tomorrow hun and will get those pics done.


it can happen...both ataris parents were top eared, and he had dumbo sibings lol 
but going with probability you would expect the most likely outcomes. but yes this breeder has really cocked things up tbh, how she would of bred when she mixed them up so much i dont know. Night hun


----------



## selina20

Is carefresh bedding ok for ratties?


----------



## ami_j

it is hun but its pretty pricey. probably get four times as much for your money if you go to a horse supplies shop and get a bale of card squares, auboise or allbed. or you can order finacard 13.99 i think it is for a bale and they deliver that would still be cheaper.


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> it is hun but its pretty pricey. probably get four times as much for your money if you go to a horse supplies shop and get a bale of card squares, auboise or allbed. or you can order finacard 13.99 i think it is for a bale and they deliver that would still be cheaper.


Thing is i dont need a huge bag of the stuff lol and the easibed comes in small bags on ebay lol. Will prob change my mind when i get him the big cage lol


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Thing is i dont need a huge bag of the stuff lol and the easibed comes in small bags on ebay lol. Will prob change my mind when i get him the big cage lol


true, with just a couple of rats you wont but it stores fairly easy and thats your bedding sorted for a good few months


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> true, with just a couple of rats you wont but it stores fairly easy and thats your bedding sorted for a good few months


Till my son finds it and has a substrate shower hahahaha


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Till my son finds it and has a substrate shower hahahaha


:lol2:


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> :lol2:


He covered his sister in shavings earlier lmao


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> He covered his sister in shavings earlier lmao


oh dear :lol2:


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## sammy1969

~I dont think she cocked up the mating just think she forgot who's offspring were who's when it came to who she had put in with this mum to adopt as she had just lost her home and was having to move to somewhere she couldnt take any of her pets and she had loads so was having to rehome them quickly to ppl she knew would look after them properly and not just sell them on or breed them to death sort of thing so she gave away alot toher very good friends like myself.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~I dont think she cocked up the mating just think she forgot who's offspring were who's when it came to who she had put in with this mum to adopt as she had just lost her home and was having to move to somewhere she couldnt take any of her pets and she had loads so was having to rehome them quickly to ppl she knew would look after them properly and not just sell them on or breed them to death sort of thing so she gave away alot toher very good friends like myself.


thats a shame  just would of been better had she kept better records.. still you wont be breeding them so it doesnt really matter


----------



## BMo1979

Some new pictures of our rattie girls.

Nibbles, the little tart :2thumb::








Nibbles dominantly cleaning Treacle








Treacle taking a nap (she's not hiding for a change)








Treacle being curious about the camera
















Nibbles and Treacle together









I don't know, if you read my thread about them. They were both from different shops, with Nibbles definitely coming from the better one, as she is very socialised and confident. Treacle on the other hand was terrified of nearly everything, but she is slowly getting there. 
She is becoming more inquisitive and now even comes up to the door and puts her front paws on mine or my husbands hand. She's fine being picked up and likes to sit on my shoulder and play with my hair. Last night she even pressed her forehead against my lips a couple of times, as if to say "groom me, please". 
Nibbles is a little diva. She wants to be centre of attention all the time and is definitely the dominant one. She is not scared of anything, which confuses our German Shepherd a lot, lol. Yesterday, he went to sniff her and she licked his nose. His face was a picture (which unfortunately I didn't take...).


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## ami_j

gorgeous girls :flrt:
hahaha poor dog still at least he didnt get a nipped nose like my dog did. He does insist on trying to stick his head in the cage *rollseyes*


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## sammy1969

HI Woke up this orning to find that the girls had been having a field day in their cage with the hanging pouch Eileen made for me. They had pulled it inside out and chewed a hole in one corner so that they could all get inside to sleep lol. I watched somewhat amazed as first one then 2 then a third etc etc till 6 rats appeared out of this tiny hole and curled up on the shelf the 7th ratty was my baby berkshire named Star who was being antisocial and had curled up on the floor of the cage under a ladder lol


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## ami_j

cheeky rats Sam lol
My girls sometimes all sleep together in the igloo or they pair off, theres enough places to rest in that cage hahaha. its nice to hear yours have bonded well


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## ami_j

also if i was you hun i would take the ladder out when the babies are a little bit bigger, get them climbing  does them a world of good having a little workout to get around


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## sammy1969

The cheeky mares have just done it again turned it inside out. THere is only the little berkshire who is not so well bonded as all the rest, but then she is the shyest of the whole lot but she does at times bundle on top or gets bundled beneath all the others lol and one of the 5 month olds either domino or nibbler does go to her and encourages her to come up with the rest of them. The light coloured kit, the only one without a name lol, does climb the bars rather than use the ladders that go from shelf to shelf but Star the berkshire is a bit more lazy lol so will take them out in a few weeks. I am hoping to get the brio set up in the next week as i think the kits will be ok in it now as they are about half the size of the 5 month olds now


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## ami_j

yeah they will be fine  did you manage to find them a wheel?


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## sammy1969

I have one coming from Becca on here as well as some other bits like igloos and hides etc and i am sending her a couple of xstitch kits in exchange as she does it as well as i do and i have enough to last me forever lol bit like my 340 years lol


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## selina20

I need some fleecy thingies for my rattie boo.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I have one coming from Becca on here as well as some other bits like igloos and hides etc and i am sending her a couple of xstitch kits in exchange as she does it as well as i do and i have enough to last me forever lol bit like my 340 years lol


ahh good, they will probably love the wheel and wheel use has been shown to increase life span 


selina20 said:


> I need some fleecy thingies for my rattie boo.


http://fuzzbutt.co.uk/
http://www.fuzzbutt.co.uk

this site is AMAZING the stuff is gorgeous, top quality. she is shut atm , well worth the wait though


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## selina20

Does anyone elses rat have an obsession with hair. Mine runs straight on my shoulder to play in my hair lmao.

Thanks Ami J


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Does anyone elses rat have an obsession with hair. Mine runs straight on my shoulder to play in my hair lmao.
> 
> Thanks Ami J


oh yes haha when i put my head in the cage to change something they will either pull it or chew it or climb in it


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> oh yes haha when i put my head in the cage to change something they will either pull it or chew it or climb in it


He will then sit there and regularly clean himself because it tickles i presume lol. Hes started doing that excitable dash leap thing on me which is cute


----------



## sammy1969

Yep Selina i have 3 that groom me every time the are out of the cage and on my shoulder. Sarah is the worst though as she never knows when to stop and tends to pull it a bit lol


----------



## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> Yep Selina i have 3 that groom me every time the are out of the cage and on my shoulder. Sarah is the worst though as she never knows when to stop and tends to pull it a bit lol


Oh he hasnt got that far but because im used to hammies im dubious of the bitey end and whiskers in my ears lol


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Oh he hasnt got that far but because im used to hammies im dubious of the bitey end and whiskers in my ears lol


in all the rats i have kept (and its a good fair few lol) i have never had a proper bite from one of mine, infact the only proper bite i got off a rat was off one on work exp that was being ridiculosly neglected

I have had nips off mine if they think my finger is food though :lol2: cold noses and whiskers down your ear feels awful though..worse when its my dog he snorts down there :lol2:


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> in all the rats i have kept (and its a good fair few lol) i have never had a proper bite from one of mine, infact the only proper bite i got off a rat was off one on work exp that was being ridiculosly neglected
> 
> I have had nips off mine if they think my finger is food though :lol2: cold noses and whiskers down your ear feels awful though..worse when its my dog he snorts down there :lol2:


It sends shivers down my spine lol. My little rattybum bless him is as good as gold he tolerates the kids stroking him etc. He now leaps out his tub onto my hand bless him


----------



## sammy1969

Oh i get noses in my ears as well as whiskers lol and will say i have never been bitten by any rat I know of a few hamsters that have done it to me lol and would never trust them up round my neck lol. Although i will admit it does tickle like mad I do tie my hair up but end up taking it down in the end as she will try to plow through it and take the band out lol. it is a weird sensation when she groom the strands at the back of my neck and she does like to try and clean my eczema when it is bad i notice but then the will do that to each other if they notice a wound so i tend not to worry. I also love the way she will chudder in my ear and when i turn to look at her she will brux like mad it is so sweet.


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> It sends shivers down my spine lol. My little rattybum bless him is as good as gold he tolerates the kids stroking him etc. He now leaps out his tub onto my hand bless him


aww. they can get really tame


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> aww. they can get really tame


Hes absolutely teenie though. My male syrian is far bigger than him hahahaha. Im also not used to this licking they do. Again im used to hammies using their bitey end hahaha


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Hes absolutely teenie though. My male syrian is far bigger than him hahahaha. Im also not used to this licking they do. Again im used to hammies using their bitey end hahaha


Oh he will grow lol how old is he?


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> Oh he will grow lol how old is he?


Dont know :/


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Dont know :/


bless him, will need lots of curly kale, egg, chicken and other yummy protein  

this might be helpful
Fancy Rats • View topic - Feeding rats for reproduction and growth


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> bless him, will need lots of curly kale, egg, chicken and other yummy protein
> 
> this might be helpful
> Fancy Rats • View topic - Feeding rats for reproduction and growth


This is guna sound completely random but can they have nutrabol???? Or is that deadly or dangerous to them.


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> This is guna sound completely random but can they have nutrabol???? Or is that deadly or dangerous to them.


good question, i dont see why not, cant remember what is in it...you can get rat supplements from here ratRations.com, Rat food, base mixes and herbs or here The Rat Warehouse but tbh if you are feeding a balanced diet then you shouldnt need them


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## sammy1969

Isnt nutrabol calcuim based? if it is i cant see it doing them any harm really Not usre what else it has in it though and have never thought of feeding it too any of mine bu tthen my are spoit rotten like Jaimi's lol. Todays treat was fresh apple, Yesterday they had mixed salad no lettuce though lol which they demolished and the day before it was hard boiled egg lol so they get something nice and as it is hand fed they also get tamed lol.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Isnt nutrabol calcuim based? if it is i cant see it doing them any harm really Not usre what else it has in it though and have never thought of feeding it too any of mine bu tthen my are spoit rotten like Jaimi's lol. Todays treat was fresh apple, Yesterday they had mixed salad no lettuce though lol which they demolished and the day before it was hard boiled egg lol so they get something nice and as it is hand fed they also get tamed lol.


it is, too much calcium leads to calcification of soft tissues though. growing rats need 5g Ca per kg food ,optimal maintainance is 3g per kg food...what are you feeding him , it could be that he is already getting that from his food


----------



## selina20

Atm this is guna sound soooooo bad lol. Please dont kill me hahaha

Hes eating wagg hammie food mixed with wild bird seed and some fruit and veggies lol.


----------



## sammy1969

Wahh i actually managed to remembered something not bad for being 340 lmao


----------



## sammy1969

selina20 said:


> Atm this is guna sound soooooo bad lol. Please dont kill me hahaha
> 
> Hes eating wagg hammie food mixed with wild bird seed and some fruit and veggies lol.


~I have known them to eat worse hun and although it may no be the best food out there it isnt going to kill him hun, if it were me i would try adding some shredded wheat or weetabix or porridge oats to add other foods into it or some cat food dry of course but not too much imo but jaimi will be able to direct you more on that one. 

This is what mine have in their mixture in different ratios so that oyu get an idea of how i make it up

Rat mix as a base
hamster with fruit and vegetable 
Fruity chinchilla 
Rabbit mix with vegetables
Guinea pig mix with alfalfa
miniature bonio biscuits
pedigree chum small bite mixer
Dried mealworms
exotic fruit mix
shredded wheat
weetabix 
porridge oats
pumpkin seeds
sunflower seeds but not many
peanuts in shells

I mix it up myself and then give it to them as a basic food then on top of that they will get boiled egg, apple, mango,couscous, toast dry and usually wholemeal lol, cat food now and then, tuna, or salmon as they seem to like it. 
Oh they pinch chips off my dinner plate and run off with them and also fried egg as Sarah has done both lol cheeky rat that she is,they will also eat plain cake as the 4 new girls came with half a birthday cake in their cage which was thrown straight in the bin lol. As you cantel the lst few mentioned are not wones i would nirmally feed as they are not good for them but rats willeat virtually anything to be honest if allowed


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Atm this is guna sound soooooo bad lol. Please dont kill me hahaha
> 
> Hes eating wagg hammie food mixed with wild bird seed and some fruit and veggies lol.


ooh would change that asap hun 
some links to help 
Shunamite Rats
Fancy Rats • View forum - Feeding

these have tonnes of info on making a mix that will be better for him. the fruit and veggies is good, give fruit less often and no citrus or mango as hes a male ( the d-limonene reacts with a protein male rats produce and it can cause cancer) 

making your own mix is a lot cheaper than buying it , and tbh there isnt really a decent commerical rat mix out there....there are also the rat mixes on ratrations, he will need supplements too...

i would fully suggest joining fancy rats forum, there are often members with cages and stuff for sale, also might be rats in rescue near to you his age, needing homes, at his age he really needs another kitten or two to be friends with


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~I have known them to eat worse hun and although it may no be the best food out there it isnt going to kill him hun, if it were me i would try adding some shredded wheat or weetabix or porridge oats to add other foods into it or some cat food dry of course but not too much imo but jaimi will be able to direct you more on that one


not too much dry cat food, though at his approx age he will need extra protein. try not to add too much wheat or oats to his mix as they are high phosphorus which can effect the kidneys, more kidney friendly options are rice, corn/maize, barley and millet


----------



## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> ~I have known them to eat worse hun and although it may no be the best food out there it isnt going to kill him hun, if it were me i would try adding some shredded wheat or weetabix or porridge oats to add other foods into it or some cat food dry of course but not too much imo but jaimi will be able to direct you more on that one


He gets a weetabix in the morning because i feel guilty when the kids get some and he dont lol. Iv also offered him a meal worm but he was scared of it lmao. Im guna move him onto a rat mix and add things to it iv just not managed to get to the shops this week to take a look :blush:


----------



## sammy1969

~I added to my last post hat i give my as a mix hun to give you an idea. Jami will tell me off for any bad bits lol but am still learning on this mix business


----------



## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> ~I added to my last post hat i give my as a mix hun to give you an idea. Jami will tell me off for any bad bits lol but am still learning on this mix business


For me to mix all that for 1 rattie would mean that i end up with a supply of food for the rest of his life lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~I have known them to eat worse hun and although it may no be the best food out there it isnt going to kill him hun, if it were me i would try adding some shredded wheat or weetabix or porridge oats to add other foods into it or some cat food dry of course but not too much imo but jaimi will be able to direct you more on that one.
> 
> This is what mine have in their mixture in different ratios so that oyu get an idea of how i make it up
> 
> Rat mix as a base - which one? might be better just using a rabbit base and adding dog food
> hamster with fruit and vegetable - i would cut this out hamster food can be too high in fat and peanuts can cause skin issues
> Fruity chinchilla - which fruits?
> Rabbit mix with vegetables- which you using? might be that you are using one where the vitamins are in the grass pellets which they wont eat
> Guinea pig mix with alfalfa-dont think they get anything from alfalfa
> miniature bonio biscuits- meaty?
> pedigree chum small bite mixer- extra protein not needed if you are using a rat mix
> Dried mealworms- ditto
> exotic fruit mix - whats in this? would be careful with amounts and also that you have male rats..this sounds citrusy
> shredded wheat - next three are phos rich, not kidney friendly, substitute for maize, millet, rice, barley
> weetabix
> porridge oats
> pumpkin seeds- these are good
> sunflower seeds but not many- a few are good, watch for skin issues
> peanuts in shells- i wouldnt use these as a mix, better nuts would be walnuts and brazils on occasion for their vitamins and enrichment
> 
> I mix it up myself and then give it to them as a basic food then on top of that they will get boiled egg, apple, mango,couscous, toast dry and usually wholemeal lol, cat food now and then, tuna, or salmon as they seem to like it.
> Oh they pinch chips off my dinner plate and run off with them and also fried egg as Sarah has done both lol cheeky rat that she is,they will also eat plain cake as the 4 new girls came with half a birthday cake in their cage which was thrown straight in the bin lol. As you cantel the lst few mentioned are not wones i would nirmally feed as they are not good for them but rats willeat virtually anything to be honest if allowed


lol you know me too well, i do have a few suggestions hun if you dont mind  
its not a bad mix, there are a few things that you could change...tbh you could save money changing your base to a rabbit food that has no pellets and cutting the others out but you are on the right tracks


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> For me to mix all that for 1 rattie would mean that i end up with a supply of food for the rest of his life lol


you can get smaller bags of rabbit food that are suitable  or there is rat rations 


this is the mix i have concocted, i havent made it yet, done a trial run with a few of the ingriediants lol , waiting for my new base to come in and i still may change it but spent a good while pouring over the scuttling gourmet and it seems that it will do the job

6 scoops of Harrisons banana brunch
1 scoop of economy cornflakes ( minimal sugar)
1/2 scoop of white basmati/puffed rice
"" "" pearl barley
" " buckwheat
" " quinoa
" " torn millet spray
" " broken wholegrain ryvita
" " puffed wheat/shredded wheat
1 scoop of dog food ( I may not use this as i often give fresh protein)
1/2 scoop of pumpkin, hemp, sunflower and linseeds

for the fresh portion of the diet they get curly kale, carrot, pilchards, broccoli, cous cous with salmon oil, kelp powder and garlic, chicken leg/thigh or if we have a roast some of the bones from that, banana, orange (girls only), pepper, egg, green beans and prawns. obviosly in different amounts, veg more often


----------



## sammy1969

~Ok mango they dont get often as it is a treat food and even I cant afford them that oten lol so they get a bit of mine lol. 
The rabbit mix doesnt have pellets in it but not sure of the name of it I never look at names lol just what i can see and scoop out of it lol. I get around half a scoop and the scoops are huge all this comes from pampurred pets as this is the nearest place i can get loose stuff from.
THe chinchilla is called fruity chinchilla and has carrot dried banana but i tend to make sure i dotn get too much in the half scoop I get.
The guinea pig mix with alfalfa is more for some of the other rodents i must admit as they all tend to get fed the same mix and this I only get a quarter scoop
The bonios are not meaty at all these are plain dry ones for thier teeth they get half a scoop of these
the pedigree chum mxer is only about an eighth of a scoop 
THe dried mealworms are more a treat inside their food and usually cost me less than 4p as they are so few in the mix lol
THe exotic fruit i cheat with as i only scoop out the coconut mango guava peanuts,and dried banan the rest leave behind but i know it doesnt contain citrus and is less than and eigth of a sccop.
Peanuts in their shells are only about half a scoopso not many get into the mix hun 
AS for the rat mix it is their own one and is two scoops worth as I have been using it as a base
Sunflower seeds are few and far between as i know they can make ther skin greasy hence why said varying amount or ratios whichever it was lol but the pumpkn seeds they love so they tend to get around a quarter of a scoop lol. The cereal is usually one per mx for the first two and about half a cup for the oats but will substitute from now on as have to get some more this weekend as nearly out.
OOOO forgot to say they also get spray millet

FResh food they get kale apples brocolli cauliflower greens salad like water cress now and then and also rocket and baby leaf lambs foot which they go ad for and also chard now and then they also get the odd brussell sprout whic i buy specal lol as hate them as does Glyn and the od bit fo sprng greens lol
Did you notice i put not too much cat food lol and you agreed lol which means i was right on that one lol and yes do know oyu well but you have done this longer than me and i am still learnng as the last time i had rats noone really knew the stuff they do now and just fed them basic rat food lol so am not doing to bad for being over 3 centuries lmao. Is there anything else you would recommend for me to add in hun?


----------



## sammy1969

selina20 said:


> For me to mix all that for 1 rattie would mean that i end up with a supply of food for the rest of his life lol


Not realy hun if oyu only get small amounts as you can see from my other post where I have put the number or measure of scoops use that amounts will last me about ten to twelve days you could end up with about a months suply for your one ratty but as you will soon be gettng him a pal it wont last as long lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~Ok mango they dont get often as it is a treat food and even I cant afford them that oten lol so they get a bit of mine lol. the boys shouldnt really ever have any, girls are fine
> The rabbit mix doesnt have pellets in it but not sure of the name of it I never look at names lol just what i can see and scoop out of it lol.
> this is good  try find out what it is, just for curiosity XD
> I get around half a scoop and the scoops are huge all this comes from pampurred pets as this is the nearest place i can get loose stuff from.
> THe chinchilla is called fruity chinchilla and has carrot dried banana but i tend to make sure i dotn get too much in the half scoop I get.
> that will be good for enrichment, theres something about dried banana and kidney friendlyness but a bit wont hurt.
> The guinea pig mix with alfalfa is more for some of the other rodents i must admit as they all tend to get fed the same mix and this I only get a quarter scoop
> you can probably leave this out tbh, it will be like the rabbit food with extra vit c, rats make their own but a bit from fresh food is good
> The bonios are not meaty at all these are plain dry ones for thier teeth they get half a scoop of these
> sound fine, might be worth looking at the wheat content (im on a kidney friendly fix lol)
> the pedigree chum mxer is only about an eighth of a scoop
> probably best to use one protein source or fresh
> THe dried mealworms are more a treat inside their food and usually cost me less than 4p as they are so few in the mix lol
> as a treat will be good
> THe exotic fruit i cheat with as i only scoop out the coconut mango guava peanuts,and dried banan the rest leave behind but i know it doesnt contain citrus and is less than and eigth of a sccop.
> i would probably knock this out they already get dried fruit from the chin food
> Peanuts in their shells are only about half a scoopso not many get into the mix hun
> a few wont hurt if the rats dont get skin allergies from them, high fat, i would still swap them for occaisional walnuts, hazelnuts, brazils for the omega fatty acids plus they will be more of a challene
> AS for the rat mix it is their own one and is two scoops worth as I have been using it as a base
> nothing wrong with that, if you have a rat mix as a base you dont need extra protein  rupert rat can be a good base,reggierat the protein can be a bit dodgy (not so good quality chicken) and theres alot of waste
> Sunflower seeds are few and far between as i know they can make ther skin greasy hence why said varying amount or ratios whichever it was lol but the pumpkn seeds they love so they tend to get around a quarter of a scoop lol. The cereal is usually one per mx for the first two and about half a cup for the oats but will substitute from now on as have to get some more this weekend as nearly out.
> sounds ok, if you look at my mix, theres a fair few things from the supermarket that you can use  and theres the cereal guide on FR, i know when i checked my cereals were wayyyyy too high in sugar and alot of wheat so i have done an overhall lol
> 
> its not a bad mix though hun, my first one was just terrible if you can call it a mix lol
> 
> Did you notice i put not too much cat food lol and you agreed lol which means i was right on that one lol and yes do know oyu well but you have done this longer than me and i am still learnng as the last time i had rats noone really knew the stuff they do now and just fed them basic rat food lol so am not doing to bad for being over 3 centuries lmao. Is there anything else you would recommend for me to add in hun?


lol hun you aint the only one still learning , i have done a hell of a lot of chopping and changing over the last 6 months or so and loads since i got the scuttling gourmet...i really recomend it, would cut out mango alltogether for the boys as like citrus that can effect the males.


----------



## selina20

What cant a rat eat and how often should they get fresh?? Wheres the best place to get the smaller bags for the mixes


----------



## sammy1969

I am well cheesed have jsut typed out a whole reply lol and then clicked the close tab button by mistake lol so now have to do it again.
You are on a kidney friendly kick arent you Jai. Will say the cereal are all recommended on the shuminite diet page as are the small amounts of dried fruit I use hence why i have used them lol. However i will chop out the guinea pig food though and i will never use reggie rat lol it is c**p if you ask me.Will say the boys havent had mango as they are acroos the room and the girls are right by where I sit so they get more treats lol


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> What cant a rat eat and how often should they get fresh?? Wheres the best place to get the smaller bags for the mixes


they cant have carbonated drinks, raw drybeans, green potato or avocado skin and stone

they shouldnt have food high in fat, salt and sugar

you can get burgess supafrutti, rupert rat in small bags, the burgess is at pets at home
Supa Fruiti Mixed Fruit Flavoured Rabbit Mix 1kg by Burgess | Pets at Home

or you can get small portions of stuff from here
Base Mixtures : ratRations.com

or theres these mixes 
Complete Ready to Use Mixtures : ratRations.com 

ready made up for you , about the same as pets at home food but more goodness...you would need to suplement with something like dr squiggles and fresh veg would also be good for them. loads of ways to feed rats a good diet


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I am well cheesed have jsut typed out a whole reply lol and then clicked the close tab button by mistake lol so now have to do it again.
> You are on a kidney friendly kick arent you Jai. Will say the cereal are all recommended on the shuminite diet page as are the small amounts of dried fruit I use hence why i have used them lol. However i will chop out the guinea pig food though and i will never use reggie rat lol it is c**p if you ask me.


haha i really am hun  
yeah they arent bad at all  just thought i would mention the kidney friendlyness XD like i said your mix isnt bad at all hun  just a couple of tweaks 
and yeah its utter crap most gets left is reggie rat


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## selina20

My brain hurts :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> My brain hurts :lol2:


YOUR brain hurts? :lol2: i have spent most of this evening researching vitamin D :lol2:


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## sammy1969

WE make a good trio lol as my brain hurts too lol but then i spent the afternoon researching retinopathy lol.
Rat food is a bomb field Selina there s so much to learn as I am finding at lol. You wil get there hun beleive me took me years to figure out the basics lol let alone the rest of it


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> WE make a good trio lol as my brain hurts too lol but then i spent the afternoon researching retinopathy lol.
> Rat food is a bomb field Selina there s so much to learn as I am finding at lol. You wil get there hun beleive me took me years to figure out the basics lol let alone the rest of it


seriously sam buy the book i told you about , i bet you will love it as much as i did  I learnt so much 

where you get your food from is it like big bins of stuff where you scoop and weigh?


----------



## sammy1969

Yeah i think i am going to have to lol as it does sound really good where will i get t from is it the shuminite site.
Yes it is all loose in bins with lids and i get the amounts I want from it picking out any bits i dont want in my mix like dried red peppers lol and other stuff i dont know what is lol just incase it is bad for them lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah i think i am going to have to lol as it does sound really good where will i get t from is it the shuminite site.
> Yes it is all loose in bins with lids and i get the amounts I want from it picking out any bits i dont want in my mix like dried red peppers lol and other stuff i dont know what is lol just incase it is bad for them lol


OMG that sounds amazing tbh haha i would be going around getting bags of everything. they can have pepper, i dont give dried veg but there is a load on rat rations , if they are on there they are ok


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## sammy1969

It is good i must admit and obthmy localpampurred pets do it this way whic is even more of a bonus lol the nly problem i get is the assistants can get a bit annoyed as some of the bits i get weigh less than the minimum wieght allowed so they have to input the cost differently lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> It is good i must admit and obthmy localpampurred pets do it this way whic is even more of a bonus lol the nly problem i get is the assistants can get a bit annoyed as some of the bits i get weigh less than the minimum wieght allowed so they have to input the cost differently lol


:lol2: you cause trouble everywhere you go you do:Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## sammy1969

Who me I am sweet and nnocent cant you see my halo lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Who me I am sweet and nnocent cant you see my halo lol


:lol2: yeah ok  that aint a halo

but thats why we get on so well :lol2:


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## sammy1969

Lmao so true so true as i know where yours is too and its no halo either lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Lmao so true so true as i know where yours is too and its no halo either lol


i never pretended otherwise 8)


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## sammy1969

I know its why I like oyu so much lol we can be brutally honest with each other lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I know its why I like oyu so much lol we can be brutally honest with each other lol


yup :lol2:


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## Salazare Slytherin

So whats all this about nutrition! I love these topics but these are not my best area with rats etc.

What is the ideal diet, feeding routines!
educate me  

I am reading sheets as I type.

I am hoping to get a pair or more:whistling2: soon


----------



## ami_j

Salazare Slytherin said:


> So whats all this about nutrition! I love these topics but these are not my best area with rats etc.
> 
> What is the ideal diet, feeding routines!
> educate me
> 
> I am reading sheets as I type.
> 
> I am hoping to get a pair or more:whistling2: soon


Oh sal you are making me weep :lol2: um i will have to really put thought in this tomorrow night though this is good for info
Fancy Rats • View forum - Feeding

the last few pages should give you ideas for making a small mix up as you will have just 2/3 rats. a bale of bedding will vary on where you get it from whetther you have a car etc but again for 2-3 rats will last you AGES but will be more cost effective than stuff such as carefresh 

any questions please ask


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## Salazare Slytherin

ami_j said:


> Oh sal you are making me weep :lol2: um i will have to really put thought in this tomorrow night though this is good for info
> Fancy Rats • View forum - Feeding
> 
> the last few pages should give you ideas for making a small mix up as you will have just 2/3 rats. a bale of bedding will vary on where you get it from whetther you have a car etc but again for 2-3 rats will last you AGES but will be more cost effective than stuff such as carefresh
> 
> any questions please ask


 
I will hun thanks 
what if I get one with two heads?:whistling2::Na_Na_Na_Na: technically I would have 4 then haha I am just kidding haha.

I will give that a good read  we do have a car, I just don't drive lol.


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## ami_j

cant say i have ever come across one with two heads sal :lol2:
if someone in the house drives it would be cheaper for you to get a bale of chopped card from a horse supllies shop


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## sammy1969

~That something I wont be able to learn to drive now i dont expect damn knew i should of passed my test by now. I really need to be able to drive too to get glyn to and from un and to get out and about more and so I can go get supplies for pets lke beddng in bales lol. Damn this life sucks. Jai can I pick oyur brain too why are the boy kits suddenly squabblng like mad is it that they are just sorting out who is the boss as they are about 6 weeks now or is it smething ore than that ? Nothing has been changed n their cage etc and it hasnt been moved either


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## ami_j

are they hurting each other, any scabs or the like? 
im guessing they are probably just playfighting, rat kittens are very silly and playful and do playfight. atari used to like to play fight whereas wade and his dad did not :lol2: cue they had a few scabs from him, to say he was loads smaller it was comical watching him


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## sammy1969

It seems to be more noise than anythng and alot of jumping about no marks at all to be honest but it does sound awful


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## ami_j

haha yeah sounds like play, wouldnt expect agression from 6 week olds hormonal issues if they do crop up tend to be about 5-6 months onwards. silly boys. my boys have the odd squabble they are all screamers XD


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## sammy1969

Screamers these sound like they are murdering each other lol cant beleive the noise lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Screamers these sound like they are murdering each other lol cant beleive the noise lol


haha i bet they sound like Atari, Atticus and Pilot when they get going XD kittens are quite vocal though my hairless three should know better they are far from kittens lol


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## sammy1969

They probably do hun the first time I heard them I jumped up quick to split them up but now I jsut sit there as i would br up every ten minutes once they get started lol


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## selina20

I need a cage in the hampshire area. All the ones on preloved etc are far far away


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> I need a cage in the hampshire area. All the ones on preloved etc are far far away


coud join here and post a wanted ad hun?
Fancy Rats • Login


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## sammy1969

selina20 said:


> I need a cage in the hampshire area. All the ones on preloved etc are far far away


Look on gumtree Selina they have them on there you can do it in the portsmouth area or just do hampshire I always see at least one a day lol. You may even find a companion or two for your little one as I know there are some on there with cage today males around 3 months old which would be ok for intros with yours.


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## ami_j

good thinking sam  


gave the rats their weekly cous cous with garlic, kelp powder and salmon oil my living room smells all garlicy now haha will keep the vampires away


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## sammy1969

Thank you hun lol it seems that no sleep makes my ancient brain work better lol. Did have one thought the ones i saw will be on the southampton section of the site lol i think they were dumbos too. i think they came wit cage but not sure what type or if it will any good for Selina but it may be worth the look even if it needs replacing with a bigger one later on as these were completely free lol but i have enough males thats for sure.


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## BMo1979

I'm very happy: 
We made a big step in Treacle's socialisation/taming progress. She still needs a little gentle persuasion to initially come out of her cage, but once she's out she's fine.
She still feels the safest being on my shoulders or under my hair, but last night she kept climbing from me to my kids and my husband, quite happily exploring. She still kept coming back to "mum" when it was getting too much, but her breathing isn't as rapid and she doesn't constantly freeze. I'm sure I could hear a little bruxing, too. 
When I put her back into her cage to get Nibbles out (Nibbles is still a bit hyper, so they get their free play separate at the moment), she kept jumping on my hands, which is a first and I had to use a treat to persuade her to stay inside /which she now takes from our hands). :2thumb:

I do have a question, tho:
Nibbles is the dominant one in the relationship. She is constantly force cleaning Treacle, who may squeak, but doesn't stop her. Last night, Treacle was climbing up on the cage and Nibbles grabbed her leg and pulled her off. She also constantly marks Treacle on her head and cleans her straight after. Treacle still follows Nibbles around like a bad smell and tries to be close to her all the time.
Now, will Nibbles' behaviour stop eventually?
At what point (if at all) should we intervene (so far Treacle has not screamed or anything like that)?

Sorry, if these are stupid questions, but we're still new to rat keeping.


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## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> Look on gumtree Selina they have them on there you can do it in the portsmouth area or just do hampshire I always see at least one a day lol. You may even find a companion or two for your little one as I know there are some on there with cage today males around 3 months old which would be ok for intros with yours.


Iv been offered a little one off corny girl but im umming and ahhhing over it lol. He looks quite ratty. What do you guys think?










Also how do i introduce them?


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## ami_j

sounds like shes just a bossy girly. the general rule is no blood no foul  i have a girl who tries to drag her cagemates by the ears  its great your shy girl is progressing too 

hes lovely selina i would defo take him your boy will be so happy to be a friend. tbh with babys i would just put them together wouldnt really bother introing babys like you would older rats


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> sounds like shes just a bossy girly. the general rule is no blood no foul  i have a girl who tries to drag her cagemates by the ears  its great your shy girl is progressing too
> 
> hes lovely selina i would defo take him your boy will be so happy to be a friend. tbh with babys i would just put them together wouldnt really bother introing babys like you would older rats


Okies ill take him then


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## BMo1979

Thanks, Ami, much appreciated.

@Selina, he's lovely. I'd take him!


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## selina20

Have asked her to bring him along


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## sammy1969

He does look cute Selina so i would take him and like Jai said I would just put them in together there shouldnt be a problem at all at their age and your little one will be so glad to have a friend for company.


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## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> He does look cute Selina so i would take him and like Jai said I would just put them in together there shouldnt be a problem at all at their age and your little one will be so glad to have a friend for company.


Well hes not used to being on his own and atm needs the stimulation which he wont get from handling alone. Im desperate for a rattie cage atm. All the ones round here are around £80 for a second hand one :bash::bash:


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## sammy1969

Blimey thats not good at all I do have a small cage i use for taming but that isnt going to be any good for you really or i would say come and get it lol but it is only a hamster sized one as it means they cant run off so far as they can in say a critter bt works wonders when you are trying to get them to bond. I did see two boys with cage on gumtree but they were in totton and a bit older than yours which is a pain lol and that was yesterday will check my local area again today to see what they have hun for you if oyu want


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## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> Blimey thats not good at all I do have a small cage i use for taming but that isnt going to be any good for you really or i would say come and get it lol but it is only a hamster sized one as it means they cant run off so far as they can in say a critter bt works wonders when you are trying to get them to bond. I did see two boys with cage on gumtree but they were in totton and a bit older than yours which is a pain lol and that was yesterday will check my local area again today to see what they have hun for you if oyu want


Atm they are in a faunarium which i really really really hate so anything is better than nothing atm


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Atm they are in a faunarium which i really really really hate so anything is better than nothing atm


this is a reasonable price the double would be suitable for the boys
Lazy Bones Rat & Ferret Single, Double or Triple Storey Cage Optional Stand | eBay


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## sammy1969

WEll hun if oyu want to come and get it oyu are welcome to hun inthis they willhave enough room as it is what my boys are curently n buti am transfering them to a enclosed cage as my cats like to watch thema nd although they dont touch i like to know that if they do get tempted they cant get to them and in the next week or so they will be going into the jenny and the girls into the brio so they wont be in there long


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## sammy1969

THey are great cages its what i used to keep my ld boys i last time i kept lol and thy arent a bad price either.
You on msn Jai or are you not at comp yet


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> THey are great cages its what i used to keep my ld boys i last time i kept lol and thy arent a bad price either.
> You on msn Jai or are you not at comp yet


yeah im on msn

they arent bad for the price , theres better cages though but its a nice size, big enough for three rats. all depends on what budget selina is working with as theres cages that are more but end up being better value and longer lasting if that makes sense


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## sammy1969

Thats true ihavve justfound this on gumtreedont kow if it is stillthere but might be worth a look it isnt brilliant but it would do for the time being and it is not a bad price 
large rat/rabbit/ferret/chinchiller cage for sale in Southampton | Pet Equipment & Accessories for Sale | Gumtree.com

There is alos a parrot come rat cage on there today that is only £55 but would need selves put into it i expect but it would be good for them all their lives I could post the link if you are interested Selina


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## sammy1969

Heres the link Selina its like a brio so would be brill forthemand oytu could add a few more ratties if you wanted lol
Indoor or outdoor avairy or rat cage in Reading, Southampton | Pet Equipment & Accessories for Sale | Gumtree.com


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Heres the link Selina its like a brio so would be brill forthemand oytu could add a few more ratties if you wanted lol
> Indoor or outdoor avairy or rat cage in Reading, Southampton | Pet Equipment & Accessories for Sale | Gumtree.com


the first one you posted, dunno if its just the pic it doesnt look right big though..the second one is awesome, would need kitting out with some shelves and hammocks but it would be a good buy


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## ami_j

is stroud anywhere near you guys?


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## sammy1969

nope lol
i wasnt sure on the first one but thought i would do till she could get a biggerone lol


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## ami_j

Ferret Rat Chipmunk cage 3 tier indoor | eBay

SALE CRITTER 3 LB CAGE FOR RATS CHINCHILLAS FERRETS | eBay

Options Luna 200 Rat Cage / Small Animal Cage | eBay (will hold up to 3 if furnished well)

Rat Cage Tango MkII Ferret Cages Hammock -Free UK Shipping | eBay (hold up to 3 is furnised well)

theres also this which will give tonnes of room for your boys and its a bargain for the price tbh 

Ferret / Chinchillas / Chipmunks / Rodent 2 Tier Cage | eBay

the ones that hold three will probably be better for two, they love the extra room, the 2 storey critter cage i have 3 in comfortably wouldnt have more in though really. the 3 storey holds five iirc...rats are expensive pets lol


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## sammy1969

~Ilike the last one Wouldlove to haveone like that if i had the rom but with the brio i would never get in the front room lol stilltrying to find a place for it lol


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## selina20

Argh i hate being sodding skint :bash::bash:


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## sammy1969

Never a good thing where rats are concerned hun lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Never a good thing where rats are concerned hun lol


my rats make me skint :lol2: i remember one year three of them had incidents requiring operations around christmas and two of them hit three figures, vet funds really are a must


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## sammy1969

Yeah tell me about it Jai I remember that well i dont know how you coped to be honest but you are right vets are a must. Look at when Grace had her stroke and the fortune she cost me well over £100 but well worth it when i was told by the vet he wouldnt euthanaise as she was coping so well. i think the worst though is the cost involved with tumours that rats seems to be prone too lol how many have we had between yus now lol think we could of put a deposit on a house the amount they have cost us over the years lmao


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah tell me about it Jai I remember that well i dont know how you coped to be honest but you are right vets are a must. Look at when Grace had her stroke and the fortune she cost me well over £100 but well worth it when i was told by the vet he wouldnt euthanaise as she was coping so well. i think the worst though is the cost involved with tumours that rats seems to be prone too lol how many have we had between yus now lol think we could of put a deposit on a house the amount they have cost us over the years lmao


Oh dont with lumps, Siouxie had them removed and she just got new ones... nothing but trouble she was but she was so lovely


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## sammy1969

Yeah siruis was the same paid out around three times to have them removed and he must be the only male rat that i ever had a real soft spot for as i much prefer girls athough badger here is really sweet even if he does keep trying to bite me lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah siruis was the same paid out around three times to have them removed and he must be the only male rat that i ever had a real soft spot for as i much prefer girls athough badger here is really sweet even if he does keep trying to bite me lol


cheeky boy...i hate it when mine do that, grab my hand and are like is this food? no...no it is not :lol2:


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## selina20

Someone hit my car when it was parked up over night lol. All my cash is going on that atm lol


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Someone hit my car when it was parked up over night lol. All my cash is going on that atm lol


shame people arent more careful  did they leave their details?


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## sammy1969

Yeah i know he is a very cheeky boy lol but very pretty like Selina's little one but with alot less roaning infact he hasnt roaned at all so far and has goten darker in colour lol. ~i only have to put my hand in to get his dish and he pounces on it lol and if i go to handle he likes to nibble and then chew on my fingers lol whereas Moley will run and hide and makes such a fuss when you go near him lol


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> shame people arent more careful  did they leave their details?


No they didnt :bash:. My other half went to get in the car for work and noticed a huge dent in the wing.


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## sammy1969

Ouch Selina not good at all


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## selina20

sammy1969 said:


> Ouch Selina not good at all


Not when its a xsara picasso and everything on its large lol


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## sammy1969

Isn't that jsut typical lol and i know they are expensive to repair too


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> No they didnt :bash:. My other half went to get in the car for work and noticed a huge dent in the wing.


:bash:


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## BMo1979

Just some pics of the girls. They're so cute when they're asleep, especially Nibbles as she sleeps in the oddest positions (see pic 3):

Nibbles impression of a ball









Still half asleep, but never too tired for food









Odd sleeping position no. 57


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## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Just some pics of the girls. They're so cute when they're asleep, especially Nibbles as she sleeps in the oddest positions (see pic 3):
> 
> Nibbles impression of a ball
> image
> 
> Still half asleep, but never too tired for food
> image
> 
> Odd sleeping position no. 57
> image


They are so cute :flrt: They do get themselves into funny positions :lol2:


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## sammy1969

aww they are so cute Ihav eone rat that gets herself into weird positions to sleep lolthought she was trying to break her own neck the other night the way she had curled up withthe other girls lol


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## ami_j

*RIP Oreo*

My black hoodie, Oreo had to be pts today


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## sammy1969

Awww hun huggggssssssssssss RIP Oreo


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## _jake_

A thread where mostly women sit and chat about their rats? Count me in. :whistling2:


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Awww hun huggggssssssssssss RIP Oreo


Thanks hun. Not even had her that long she was probably about a year?


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## ami_j

_jake_ said:


> A thread where mostly women sit and chat about their rats? Count me in. :whistling2:


There are even pics sometimes


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## _jake_

ami_j said:


> There are even pics sometimes


Awesome. Bet it's better than 18+ in here.:lol2:


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## ami_j

_jake_ said:


> Awesome. Bet it's better than 18+ in here.:lol2:


I think you might of got the wrong end of the stick....


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## selina20

I found myself a ratty cage from a member on here. Guna go fetch it tomorrow XD


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> I found myself a ratty cage from a member on here. Guna go fetch it tomorrow XD


Oooh what kind is it? :2thumb:


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> Oooh what kind is it? :2thumb:


Jenny but its missing the tubes but for £10 you cannot moan


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Jenny but its missing the tubes but for £10 you cannot moan


no you cant 
If its the old jenny i recommend you do the bars with japlac or plastikote. the bars arent coated and can get very smelly


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> no you cant
> If its the old jenny i recommend you do the bars with japlac or plastikote. the bars arent coated and can get very smelly


I may need links to them lmao. I found ratty playing in wet hair isnt good he was actually eating it. So much for summer fruits shampoo hahahaha


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> I may need links to them lmao. I found ratty playing in wet hair isnt good he was actually eating it. So much for summer fruits shampoo hahahaha


japlac...comes in all sorts of colours lol 
japlac | eBay


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> japlac...comes in all sorts of colours lol
> japlac | eBay


glitter lol


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> glitter lol


:lol2:


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> :lol2:


Was that a tad predictable lmao


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Was that a tad predictable lmao


you cant give the poor lad a glittery cage:lol2:

when are you getting his little friend from corny girl?


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> you cant give the poor lad a glittery cage:lol2:
> 
> when are you getting his little friend from corny girl?


Thursday hopefully


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Thursday hopefully


aww, just wait til you see them playing , its so cute


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## selina20

ami_j said:


> aww, just wait til you see them playing , its so cute


Might stop him from using my boobies as trampolines lol. He seems to like my cleavage :O


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## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Might stop him from using my boobies as trampolines lol. He seems to like my cleavage :O


yeah they do lol its warm and burrowlike :lol2:


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## sammy1969

Tell me about it but a rat downones cleavage is not always a good thing lol nearly lost one of the boys the other night. He went under my right boob and wouldnt come out lol. I had my nightie on ready for bed lol but would the little swine move lol everytime i caught him and took him out he ran straight back lmao. What is it with males and boobs lol


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## ami_j

:lol2: one of my old rats, Lily, used to climb in my bra and really wedge herself in up to her shoulders with her hindlegs and tail dangling out of the neck of my top


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## sammy1969

THis got painful due to little claws but would he come out nope he wanted to liv e under it lol and it must of been quite a weight on him lol


----------



## selina20

Glad my rat is acting as rat like as possible :lol2:


----------



## selina20

Well Mel turned up with a ratty buddy for my ratty. All went well till i realized my ratty was a girl


----------



## ami_j

Oh dear. will you be able to find a girly friend for her?


----------



## BMo1979

Oh no :gasp:! Thank God, you realised BEFORE leaving them together. So what happens now?

BTW, we got Nibbles first and I found it really hard to find another female, most of the litters seem to be mainly boys at the moment. Finally got Treacle from [email protected], where the females where kept in the back room (probably for snake food), but paid the price of having to resocialise a very frightened little rat. 
The small shop we got Nibbles from have been trying for weeks to get a hold of females. They get their rats from 1 or 2 breeders and they only had boys until now.


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> Oh dear. will you be able to find a girly friend for her?


Mel luckily has a girlie too . I never knew only female rats had nipples lol


----------



## selina20

BMo1979 said:


> Oh no :gasp:! Thank God, you realised BEFORE leaving them together. So what happens now?
> 
> BTW, we got Nibbles first and I found it really hard to find another female, most of the litters seem to be mainly boys at the moment. Finally got Treacle from [email protected], where the females where kept in the back room (probably for snake food), but paid the price of having to resocialise a very frightened little rat.
> The small shop we got Nibbles from have been trying for weeks to get a hold of females. They get their rats from 1 or 2 breeders and they only had boys until now.


Mel is bringing me a girlie hahahaha. Thing is iv never paid much attention to its bits lol. I didnt have a clue what they looked like. so iv told Patch that she should of told me and i will be giving her a treat later for calling her a boy so long lmao


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Mel is bringing me a girlie hahahaha. Thing is iv never paid much attention to its bits lol. I didnt have a clue what they looked like. so iv told Patch that she should of told me and i will be giving her a treat later for calling her a boy so long lmao


:lol2: you will recognise a boy in future they have unmissably big :whistling2:


----------



## sammy1969

TEll me about it my boy kits have huge bits lol already


----------



## selina20

Well i got my ratty cage and omg its massive lol. Needs a clean which ill do tomorrow lmao. Not bad for £10 i dont think.


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Well i got my ratty cage and omg its massive lol. Needs a clean which ill do tomorrow lmao. Not bad for £10 i dont think.
> 
> image


you will be able to japlac it a girly colour now you know you will have girls:lol2:


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> you will be able to japlac it a girly colour now you know you will have girls:lol2:


How am i not guna lose my rattie in there its mahoosive :O. I quite like the blue lol


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> How am i not guna lose my rattie in there its mahoosive :O. I quite like the blue lol


japlac for the bars hun, being uncoated they will absorb the urine and stink.


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> japlac for the bars hun, being uncoated they will absorb the urine and stink.


The bars are coated. Its like a grey plastic stuff


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> The bars are coated. Its like a grey plastic stuff


oh , looks bare metal in the pics lol well saves you coating it yourself


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> oh , looks bare metal in the pics lol well saves you coating it yourself


Its def not bare metal because there are some small areas of chewed bars but nothing major


----------



## Moony14

Hi! I will be getting my first rats soon and have loved looking through all your pics! Do you guys have any tips/suggestions for me? Also, what do you think of the Liberta Abode cage? Many thanks,

Aaron


----------



## sammy1969

HI Moony 
ASk anything you would like to know we all have slightly different opinions but when it comes down to it we all agree that all we want is what is best for our ratty friends.Personally I love the liberta abide and will say it is more suited to girls than boys who need height rather than length coz boys are lazy and choose not to climb so much lol,cant quite remember how many it can hold but AMi-j will i suspect lol.
Personally I prefer girl rats as i find boys are more smelly and less affectionate but as i say that just my personal opinion. As for food swear by the shuminite diet which you can look up online easily enough. Anything else just ask I promise we dont bite lol


----------



## Moony14

sammy1969 said:


> HI Moony
> ASk anything you would like to know we all have slightly different opinions but when it comes down to it we all agree that all we want is what is best for our ratty friends.Personally I love the liberta abide and will say it is more suited to girls than boys who need height rather than length coz boys are lazy and choose not to climb so much lol,cant quite remember how many it can hold but AMi-j will i suspect lol.
> Personally I prefer girl rats as i find boys are more smelly and less affectionate but as i say that just my personal opinion. As for food swear by the shuminite diet which you can look up online easily enough. Anything else just ask I promise we dont bite lol


Thanks, about the diet, I was going to feed pets at home nuggets as a base with pastas and fresh fruits and veg. However after reading about shunamite I am wondering if I should add Bakers complete dog food and cereal. Does that sound better? Also, I am not sure on the boy/girl situation I was under the impression that the boys were more cuddly while the girls were aloof- you would disagree? I was also recommended the Luna 400. Would this suit boys more than girls?

Many thanks.


----------



## sammy1969

If oyu read a few pages back on here you will see how both myself and Ami-j interpret the shumite diet and although Ami did say what she would change the diet I feed is perfectly ok.
As for the luna I personally wouldnt recommend it as it doesnt look big enough unless you are only gettng two boys


----------



## Moony14

sammy1969 said:


> If oyu read a few pages back on here you will see how both myself and Ami-j interpret the shumite diet and although Ami did say what she would change the diet I feed is perfectly ok.
> As for the luna I personally wouldnt recommend it as it doesnt look big enough unless you are only gettng two boys


I thought it would be ok as it has a larger volume than the Furet Plus, which can hold 3-4 rats.


----------



## sammy1969

AS i say it is just my personal opninion and i know Ami-j knows more than me when it comes to cages and i do like more room than is usually recommended for rats lol hence why i have a brio for 7 girl rats and a jenny for two boys rats lol


----------



## Moony14

sammy1969 said:


> AS i say it is just my personal opninion and i know Ami-j knows more than me when it comes to cages and i do like more room than is usually recommended for rats lol hence why i have a brio for 7 girl rats and a jenny for two boys rats lol


haha I think I'm gunna go with the Liberta Abode. If I buy two rats from a breeder that gives me some room to rescue further down the line :whistling2:


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> haha I think I'm gunna go with the Liberta Abode. If I buy two rats from a breeder that gives me some room to rescue further down the line :whistling2:


got to love liberta, I have the explorer :2thumb:

Food wise, like sam said theres a load of info a few pages back, and a list of what i currently feed. Bakers I wouldnt feed to rats...or dogs tbh theres stuff in it that is linked with cancer and rats can be prone enough as it is. there is also www.ratrations.com for ready made mixes allthough as they will need supplementing, or there is the option to buy different mixes and ingrediants for making your own mix. I also get stuff from tesco, my own mix is 

6 scoops of Harrisons banana brunch (this comes in 15kg sacks from my supplier, for just two rats you wouldnt need this much but you can get it in smaller amounts from rat rations)
1 of corn flakes (the mega cheap ones from tesco with hardly any sugar)
1/2 each of
buckwheat
puffed wheat
white basmati rice
quinoa 
ryvita
pearl barley

2 chopped millet sprays
quarter scoop of mixed hemp, golden linseed and pumpkin seed

they also get daily fresh food, carrot, curly kale, broccoli, pepper
fruit about once or twice a week
a small portion of pilchards roughly weekly
cous cous with grated garlic, salmon oil and kelp powder about once a week or fortnight
chicken on the bone about once a month

i have just bought a load of dandelion seeds so they will be getting dandelion leaves when they have grown :lol2:

the abode is down as being good for up to 6 rats so yes, lots of room :no1:

good sites for a rat owner are 
a bunch of good articles
Fancy Rats • View forum - Articles

loads of good stuff you might need
http://www.ratwarehouse.com/index.phphttp://www.ratwarehouse.com/index.php
Rat Hammocks, Rat Hammock, Hamster Hammocks, Hamster Hammock, Chinchilla Hammock, Chinchilla Hammocks, Rat Housing, Hamster Housing, Chinchilla Housing, Goth rat hammocks, Gothic rat hammocks, Goth Chinchilla Hammocks, Rat Igloo, Rat accessories, Rat - the nicest hammocks i have seen :no1:

think i have covered everything, any questions just ask :3


----------



## sammy1969

OOo I bet you end up with more than just two lol i know jai and i have said no more but still ended up with more lol


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> Thanks, about the diet, I was going to feed pets at home nuggets as a base with pastas and fresh fruits and veg. However after reading about shunamite I am wondering if I should add Bakers complete dog food and cereal. Does that sound better? Also, I am not sure on the boy/girl situation I was under the impression that the boys were more cuddly while the girls were aloof- you would disagree? I was also recommended the Luna 400. Would this suit boys more than girls?
> 
> Many thanks.


right i missed this whoops
luna cages

using the guide of 2 square feet per rat (obviously a well kitted out cage is a must too)

the 200 holds 3 rats
the 400 holds 6 rats

as for which gender, males do tend to be more cuddly, i find them a bit smellier, they generally get bigger and urine mark more. they are more prone to kidney problems
females are smaller, faster, more prone to mammary lumps, mine are cleaner than the boys. very busy little animals lol 

i keep both currently but will be just keeping females once my last boys have passed away so i can concentrate on one group of girls


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> OOo I bet you end up with more than just two lol i know jai and i have said no more but still ended up with more lol


lol you need self control madam


----------



## sammy1969

Me never lol and i still say girls are better nver had a cuddly boy lol only ever cuddly girls lol but as i said Moony we cant agree on eerything and the boys are defo smelier lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Me never lol and i still say girls are better nver had a cuddly boy lol only ever cuddly girls lol but as i said Moony we cant agree on eerything and the boys are defo smelier lol


I have girls that are cuddly, but they just dont like sitting still as much as boys do:lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

See thats where our girls differ lol. Mibne do sit stilland give me washes and cuddles whereas the two boys dont like me at all and wont stay stillf or a single second lol. 
See Moony Ami-j and i will never agree on which sex is best lol and the more cuddlybut ithink Our bias comes from which we kept first lol


----------



## Moony14

WOW thanks for all the help! And.. no need to brag about the Explorer (I'm jealous enough:lol2. How big is a scoop :blush:? Also how does pets at home nuggets 50%, cereal 30%, millet 10% and veggies+fruit 10% sound? It's a bit hard to explain to my mum that normal pet shop food won't be good enough ;D


----------



## sammy1969

I personally dont like [email protected] food and wont feed it to my rat smuch prefer my own mix but Ami will be able to tell oyu if it is ok


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> See thats where our girls differ lol. Mibne do sit stilland give me washes and cuddles whereas the two boys dont like me at all and wont stay stillf or a single second lol.
> See Moony Ami-j and i will never agree on which sex is best lol and the more cuddlybut ithink Our bias comes from which we kept first lol


as do mine, but they zip about more than the boys, is what i meant 


Moony14 said:


> WOW thanks for all the help! And.. no need to brag about the Explorer (I'm jealous enough:lol2. How big is a scoop :blush:? Also how does pets at home nuggets 50%, cereal 30%, millet 10% and veggies+fruit 10% sound? It's a bit hard to explain to my mum that normal pet shop food won't be good enough ;D


you can buy scoops from the rat warehouse, however you can substitute scoop for cup, if you have an old mug  
i think the shunamite principles are 80% dry 20% fresh so im not sure how that measures out..tbh i just shove them a nice portion of veg in lol 

food wise...in principle its a fairly balanced diet but not all rats will eat the nuggets and i personally wouldnt use them.

if you are willing to spend pets at home nuggets prices i would look at this 
Complete Ready to Use Mixtures : ratRations.com
with this
DailyRat3 - Mineral Vitamin supplement - £4.39 : ratRations.com

also fresh veg added

or you could use this as a base
Harrisons Banana Brunch - £0.39 : ratRations.com

with sugar free/reduced sugar cereal, a bit of good quality dog kibble, etc as outlined here
Shunamite Rats

if you want ideas of cereals that arent too sugary, refer to the list of articles i posted on the fancy rats forum 

i know it seems complicated but once you have a mix sorted its really simple. try to use more rice/corn than wheat

also i highly recomend this book
The Scuttling Gourmet - £10.00 : ratRations.com


----------



## Moony14

Ok, I will probably got with the no7 mix. How long will 1kg last with 3 male rats? Also, what is the p&p on that site? Finally, do I just mix the DailyRat3 with the food or add it to each serving?


----------



## sammy1969

I must admit I tend to do the same when it comes to fres. In the girls cage there are 3 food bowls that get filled with dry and then they get a good portion of some form of fresh food be it fruit or veg tonight it was brocoli which they seem to love scattered all round the cage so they have to hunt for it lol


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> Ok, I will probably got with the no7 mix. How long will 1kg last with 3 male rats? Also, what is the p&p on that site? Finally, do I just mix the DailyRat3 with the food or add it to each serving?


I dont use that particular mix so im not sure tbh though it varies with each group of rats, there is a postage calculator on there somewhere, also after a certain weight it stays the same until a certain weight so it pays to order more. 

DR3 gets sprinkled on food, that would be each day, this might be better as it goes in the water , if you want to scatter feed as that might knock the powder off
Daily Essentials 1 - Dr. Squiggles - £5.60 : ratRations.com


----------



## Moony14

ami_j said:


> I dont use that particular mix so im not sure tbh though it varies with each group of rats, there is a postage calculator on there somewhere, also after a certain weight it stays the same until a certain weight so it pays to order more.
> 
> DR3 gets sprinkled on food, that would be each day, this might be better as it goes in the water , if you want to scatter feed as that might knock the powder off
> Daily Essentials 1 - Dr. Squiggles - £5.60 : ratRations.com


Ah ok, the water one will probably be best. Also, what does your signature statement mean? Sorry I have seen it a few times and always wondered. Whats your fancy rat forum username?


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> Ah ok, the water one will probably be best. Also, what does your signature statement mean? Sorry I have seen it a few times and always wondered. Whats your fancy rat forum username?


its what i would use if it was using a straights based mix, but as i use a rabbit food as a base, the extra vitamins are added on. if i had less rats i would get the food from rat rations as it wouldnt be as cost effective to buy in bulk. 

fancy rats username is the same as on here, ami_j

sig statment.... deed not breed is to do with breed specific legislation with dogs, the too weird to live, too rare to die is a quote from fear and loathing in las vegas its a book/film


----------



## Moony14

Could you guys post some pics of your setups? I have found loads of old t shirts and fabrics I can make stuff with but I need some inspiration!


----------



## sammy1969

lol now hw many pics are yu waiting for from me now Jai lol


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> Could you guys post some pics of your setups? I have found loads of old t shirts and fabrics I can make stuff with but I need some inspiration!


if you go to the first post in the thread you will see mine 


sammy1969 said:


> lol now hw many pics are yu waiting for from me now Jai lol


tonnes...get working on it


----------



## BMo1979

*Oops, we did it again!*

We got another girlie. The small shop, where we got our first rat Nibbles from, finally had two girls brought in from the same breeder as her. The lady there knew I had been looking for another female (before we got Treacle), so she kept one aside for us. I picked her up on Saturday and she's lovely.
She is 6 weeks old, very light grey Husky and another Dumbo Rat. The only thing is that she's ruby eyed and her eye sight isn't too good (she does the typical head waving thing, ruby/pink eyed rats do...according to websites), but it doesn't limit her at all.
Characterwise she is definitely "Nibbles" stock. Very confident, cheeky, greedy and doesn't take any crap from the older girls. She's the one that starts the "fights" and as opposed to Treacle who doesn't move at all when Nibbles dominates her, she actually fights back when it gets too much, so Nibbles leaves her alone (other than play).
She has picked the older girls for certain roles, which is really cute: Treacle is for cuddles and sleeping, whereas Nibbles is for rough play and wild chases through the cage.

We call her Dusty.









Unfortunately a bit blurry. You see Dusty at the front, Nibbles nose sticking out in between and Treacle piled up on top.








Dusty using the girls as a mattress


----------



## ami_j

haha she looks very cheeky, shes really cute :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

She makes me laugh (well, they all do):
She initiates play with Nibbles by jumping on top of her and boxing her and when Nibbles retaliates, she starts squeaking very babyish, only to go back for second rounds.

The other thing I noticed is that having another confident rat seems to have helped Treacle a little bit, as she no longer freezes when Nibbles force grooms her, but grooms her back.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> She makes me laugh (well, they all do):
> She initiates play with Nibbles by jumping on top of her and boxing her and when Nibbles retaliates, she starts squeaking very babyish, only to go back for second rounds.
> 
> The other thing I noticed is that having another confident rat seems to have helped Treacle a little bit, as she no longer freezes when Nibbles force grooms her, but grooms her back.


Its amazing how much a group dynamic can change going from two rats to three


----------



## ami_j

ratty stirfry...went down very well :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

I do have pics its just getting them onto here lol my brain wont work enough and concidering I ended up i the hospital again this weekend with a bloody gastric bug I find nothing is working well right now lol. I will do a post i have pics of Rex too but cant get my brain to work out how to put them on here lol


----------



## sammy1969

*Pic heavy*

Ok at last as requested pics of basic rat set up as brio not set up yet lol and pics of the 4 new girl roans with their weird patches lol.

First the cage 

















Now changed around lol but it was how it started off lol. 
Now for the rats if i can work out who is who but they are named Sarah, Blaze, Domino and Nibbler.
Sarah









and in her favourite place lol



















nibbler I think


















Domino


















Blaze










And a couple of them in cage lol trying to escape etc lol




























And finally my two latest arrivals lol

and


----------



## sammy1969

Just to add no I am not pulling tails in the picsit is just where i have pulled back my hand along their fulllength and Glyn has snapped


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Ok at last as requested pics of basic rat set up as brio not set up yet lol and pics of the 4 new girl roans with their weird patches lol.
> 
> First the cage
> 
> image
> 
> image Now changed around lol but it was how it started off lol.
> Now for the rats if i can work out who is who but they are named Sarah, Blaze, Domino and Nibbler.
> Sarah
> image
> 
> and in her favourite place lol
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> nibbler I think
> image
> 
> image
> 
> Domino
> image
> 
> image
> 
> Blaze
> 
> image
> 
> And a couple of them in cage lol trying to escape etc lol
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> And finally my two latest arrivals lol
> 
> andimage


nice mix of topeared and dumbo in the roans, should help you tell them apart :lol2: 
liking the new arrivals, they look like an ivory and a mink :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

Yeah Blaze and Sarah are one of each and look like twins as do Domino and nibbler lol oh and the two youngsters I have are now called Star the mink and Dipper the black berkshire as she has a lighttip on her tail like a reversed dipstick lol. 
AS for the newest arrivals theyre a whit anda mink and I have no idea what sex they are think they may be neutured boys lol but they re so well behaved no biting noise or chewing can even leave them out of the cage over night with no damage to the furniture lol and best of all they were a gift lmao


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah Blaze and Sarah are one of each and look like twins as do Domino and nibbler lol oh and the two youngsters I have are now called Star the mink and Dipper the black berkshire as she has a lighttip on her tail like a reversed dipstick lol.
> AS for the newest arrivals theyre a whit anda mink and I have no idea what sex they are think they may be neutured boys lol but they re so well behaved no biting noise or chewing can even leave them out of the cage over night with no damage to the furniture lol and best of all they were a gift lmao


yeah the white looks ivory as he has black eyes :2thumb:


----------



## BMo1979

This is my set up at the moment. Eventually I think I'm going to have to move them into a bigger cage, but at them moment they seem content enough. 










The "swing" and hammock. 









THey prefer to all huddle up in this house. Probably because it's on a platform and they can see out from both sides (in case someone walks by with food, lol). This is my Berkshire Treacle, btw.









The "baby", Dusty. Can someone tell me what you call her colour and markings, please (my guess is Husky?)?









The three of them (from left to right: Nibbles, Dusty and Treacle)

















I love my ratties!


----------



## ami_j

with the light colour and the ruby eyes i would say british blue roan

did a google she looks similar to this rat


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> with the light colour and the ruby eyes i would say british blue roan
> 
> did a google she looks similar to this rat
> image


Thanks, that'll be her.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Thanks, that'll be her.


she might end up being white as an adult, depending on how she roans


----------



## Moony14

YAAAYY!! :3 I just got back from getting my first rats! We went for three, but came back with four beautiful boys- the bug has bitten early me thinks :lol2:. No pics just yet, they wouldn't stay still long enough! I'm not 100% sure on the colours but I think we have..


Two stripe roans (one black, one grey)
One self black
One self browny grey (I'm clueless with this one!)
The black one is called Ninja as he decided moving from his travel box to his cage wasn't interesting enough so he leapt out my hands


----------



## BMo1979

@ Sammy: I meant to ask: What do you use as substrate? Some kind of pellets? I was looking for an alternative to the bulk basic wood shavings (for very selfish reasons, i.e. mess).:blush:


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> YAAAYY!! :3 I just got back from getting my first rats! We went for three, but came back with four beautiful boys- the bug has bitten early me thinks :lol2:. No pics just yet, they wouldn't stay still long enough! I'm not 100% sure on the colours but I think we have..
> 
> 
> Two stripe roans (one black, one grey)
> One self black
> One self browny grey (I'm clueless with this one!)
> The black one is called Ninja as he decided moving from his travel box to his cage wasn't interesting enough so he leapt out my hands


Awww they will keep you busy :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> @ Sammy: I meant to ask: What do you use as substrate? Some kind of pellets? I was looking for an alternative to the bulk basic wood shavings (for very selfish reasons, i.e. mess).:blush:


If you dont mind me answering , it looks like back to nature?
Definatley move them off shavings, shavings are no good for rats they are often too dusty and irritate the rats respiratory tract. 

I recommend this if you have storage room

Cardboard Animal Bedding, Paper Horse Bedding, Nesting Material : Finacard

13.99 for a large bale that will last you MONTHS with just one cage. Much better value than carefresh or back to nature. Also if you drive you may find bales of bedding even cheaper if you have an equine supplies shop near you 

The chopped squares (walmsley premier bed) and hemp or softwood chips (allbed and auboise) are all suitable for rats, Chopped squares are very good, can be hard to vaccuum up off carpet unless your hoover can cope with chunky bits:lol2: I use allbed and its very good and absorbant, also soft but can be a bit messy...vaccuums up very well, and I mix a bit of shredded paper from the shredder to keep it together a bit better


----------



## sammy1969

BMo1979 said:


> @ Sammy: I meant to ask: What do you use as substrate? Some kind of pellets? I was looking for an alternative to the bulk basic wood shavings (for very selfish reasons, i.e. mess).:blush:


THe substrate I use is Smallbed universal llitter and bedding from Pampurred at £8.99 for a 5kg bag. IT is a 100% natural litter and is straw based not wood. Sawdust is terrible for rats although there are a couple of wood shaving makes out there that can be used but they are few and far betweena nd the one way to tell if they are safe is to see if they are dust extracted for a start. I would love to be able to get finacard or somethin similar but unfortunately i have no storage in this flat so have nowhere to store the size bale it comes in but this substrate i find as long as i clean the corner out that they use as a latrine regularly I have no problem with smells or anything, so i only have to do a complete substrate change every couple of months.


----------



## BMo1979

Thanks to both of you. I will look into that.
Love this thread!


----------



## sammy1969

YOu are most welcome I would never claim to be an expert on rats but have kept them on and off for over 20 years so most of what i talk about is from personal knowledge and from reading alot.

Another cat litter i use as substrate is this stuff which works in exactly the same way ao now oyuhave the choice of two lol 
Cats Best Öko Plus biodegradable Cat Litter Bargains at Zooplus and again for the price it isnt bad at all and it does come in different sized bags so oyu can pick the size best suited for your needs


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> YOu are most welcome I would never claim to be an expert on rats but have kept them on and off for over 20 years so most of what i talk about is from personal knowledge and from reading alot.
> 
> Another cat litter i use as substrate is this stuff which works in exactly the same way ao now oyuhave the choice of two lol
> Cats Best Öko Plus biodegradable Cat Litter Bargains at Zooplus and again for the price it isnt bad at all and it does come in different sized bags so oyu can pick the size best suited for your needs


The price of that for a small bag makes me shudder when you get get a bale for about a tenner :lol2: plus its pine based, im sure pine gives off phenols?


----------



## sammy1969

It was recommended o me by Feorag and is what she uses and swears by I tried it and she was right it is brill cant remember if it is pine based.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> It was recommended o me by Feorag and is what she uses and swears by I tried it and she was right it is brill cant remember if it is pine based.


It is, it says so in the review. Probably is fine tbf I think shavings have issues with phenols not sure about anything else. If Eileen has used it for her rats it must be fine, as if it was an irritant im sure it would show in her rats


----------



## sammy1969

Yeah thats true and i know Eileen is very hot on that sort of thing


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah thats true and i know Eileen is very hot on that sort of thing


I knew she used it for cat litter, didnt realise she used it for the rats. I wouldnt use it cos i think its poor value tbh when you consider what more you can get for your money but im sure it does the job well, it looks a good product.


----------



## sammy1969

Thing is with it is the fact you dont have to take it all out every clean just the soiled corner or litter try in Eileens case just top it up so it will last you months I only use one of those size bags about every 3 months so thats not that bad really


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Thing is with it is the fact you dont have to take it all out every clean just the soiled corner or litter try in Eileens case just top it up so it will last you months I only use one of those size bags about every 3 months so thats not that bad really


wouldnt last me that long lol would need abut three to get a decent covering of substrate. the stuff im using, with the girls they dont need cleaning out every week, probably the top tray and the dirty corner each week then a complete cleanout every 2-3 weeks depending so they stay fresh. A bale lasts me about 2 months and i give them a deep layer to search for food in , plus the boys need cleaning out weekly.


----------



## sammy1969

Ah yeah i suppose where you cages are bigger lol it makes sense you using more lol. mind you the small bed was £8.99 a bag lol so that one is slightly cheaper. I do tend ot use cat litter as a substrate though mor efor convienence and the fact they ar e right by where i sit so i like one that absorbs the smell lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Ah yeah i suppose where you cages are bigger lol it makes sense you using more lol. mind you the small bed was £8.99 a bag lol so that one is slightly cheaper. I do tend ot use cat litter as a substrate though mor efor convienence and the fact they ar e right by where i sit so i like one that absorbs the smell lol


If it suits them its good  Allbed is suprisingly absorbant, mine dont smell, the boys might have a bit of a whiff the day before clean out but its not highly offensive. My boys produce way more waste than the girls, my girls stay nice and clean. It did pong a little the other day mind when they had prawns, and today they have had pilchards so its a bit fishy :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

Lol i tried mine on chicken bones yesterday wow did they go mad for them.it was funny watching dippier and star on each end of one bone nibbling the joints lol


----------



## INJAF

Lovely to see other peoples' ratties 

I've just come back to the world of rats after about 15 years - am loving having them again  I've always liked rats, but we only ever had gerbils and hamsters when I lived at home. When I went away to uni and met my OH he already had some rats so ... he was clearly the man for me :lol2:

We've just taken on three females from one of my friends whose sons had lost interest in them. The rats were spending all their time in their cage and seeing as we rat sat for them last summer when they went on holiday she asked if we wanted to take them on for good. Initially we thought no, were concerned we wouldn't have the time for them but I weakened and they arrived last week while OH was out! It's been easy to make time for them, they come out in the evening and sit and watch tv with us, or I have them out while I'm faffing about on t'interweb etc. OH is very taken with them, he has them out and talks to them 

They seem to be getting livelier since they've arrived, might just be them settling in now I guess, but we've changed their diet a bit so they're getting fresh stuff now too (they were on rat nuggets before and not much else). Having said that they do love their hammock!

They're far more talkative than I remember our previous ones being, they're fairly quiet in the cage but when you get them out they witter and chunter at you no end, I'm sure they're trying to tell me things but I've no idea what yet!

Have got a few pics of them, they are dumbo rats, one is hooded (brown and white) and the other two are white with grey bits (I'm sure there's a more technical term for that!).

This one loves pockets and sleeves!









And they all love the hammock (the third is snuggled up at the back!)


----------



## sammy1969

HI Injaf welcome to rat chat you will find we are all mad lol especially aobut our rattie friends. Looking at the pics although it isnt clear you have an agouti the brown one and the other one looks like a roan/husky so would guess the other one is as well.THey are some cute ratties and I look forward to seeing more pics lol.


----------



## Rach1

Just been to the NERS rat show.
Twas an interesting experience...
Was a bit difficult to get talking to people I'll be honest, they all knew each other but eventually a couple of the ladies said hi.
I'm hoping to take two of my rats to the next show...
So I have a few months to get prepared.
Lol


----------



## sammy1969

HI Rach 
OOOO sounds interesting hun. so was it very clicky then? 
Hope everything goes well for you when you take your babies to their first show.


----------



## Rach1

Not cliquey but more established!
There were established groups of people and that can be hard to break into.
I spoke to several nice people from Lancaster as I am so that was good.
There was a lively stall selling bits and bobs for rats...
A nice little food stall and some lovely rats.


----------



## sammy1969

Yeah sounbds like you had a good time all in all Ineed to get a new rat pouch as the girls have wrecked theirs completely lol


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> It is, it says so in the review. Probably is fine tbf I think shavings have issues with phenols not sure about anything else. If Eileen has used it for her rats it must be fine, as if it was an irritant im sure it would show in her rats


Just to clarify the situation. I don't use Oko Plus as a substrate, I use cardboard pieces.

I use Oko Plus in their two litter trays. I've tried newspaper litters - I hated it cos I could smell it. I've also tried other stuff and don't like that either.

Oko Plus is made from untreated fir and pine, but the difference with this compared to the usual wood based cat litters is that it is a clumping litter. When liquid is poured on it, it immediately forms a hard solid lump, so imao doesn't give off the phenols that wood pellets or shavings do, because when wood pellets get wet they break down into wet sawdust which does give off fumes.

My rats use one litter tray just about solely for pooing in, so that just stays where it is for a week, the other tray is used mainly for weeing and eating in. I don't have to do spot cleaning cos they don't wee anywhere else (they did wee every day on the top shelf, so I moved the 'wee tray' up there and now they don't), but every other day I just lift out all the hard lumps.

It is expensive, compared to the price of a bag of other litter, but we've found using it in our cat litter trays that it costs us nearly half the price of the £5.50 per bag litter we were using previously, because it lasts so much longer and it certainly gives off very little smell because everything is so 'contained'. So because I have it in the house I don't find it expensive to use for the rats too.


----------



## ami_j

INJAF said:


> Lovely to see other peoples' ratties
> 
> I've just come back to the world of rats after about 15 years - am loving having them again  I've always liked rats, but we only ever had gerbils and hamsters when I lived at home. When I went away to uni and met my OH he already had some rats so ... he was clearly the man for me :lol2:
> 
> We've just taken on three females from one of my friends whose sons had lost interest in them. The rats were spending all their time in their cage and seeing as we rat sat for them last summer when they went on holiday she asked if we wanted to take them on for good. Initially we thought no, were concerned we wouldn't have the time for them but I weakened and they arrived last week while OH was out! It's been easy to make time for them, they come out in the evening and sit and watch tv with us, or I have them out while I'm faffing about on t'interweb etc. OH is very taken with them, he has them out and talks to them
> 
> They seem to be getting livelier since they've arrived, might just be them settling in now I guess, but we've changed their diet a bit so they're getting fresh stuff now too (they were on rat nuggets before and not much else). Having said that they do love their hammock!
> 
> They're far more talkative than I remember our previous ones being, they're fairly quiet in the cage but when you get them out they witter and chunter at you no end, I'm sure they're trying to tell me things but I've no idea what yet!
> 
> Have got a few pics of them, they are dumbo rats, one is hooded (brown and white) and the other two are white with grey bits (I'm sure there's a more technical term for that!).
> 
> This one loves pockets and sleeves!
> image
> 
> And they all love the hammock (the third is snuggled up at the back!)
> image


Welcome  Love seeing new rats  
I bet they are loving the inclusion of fresh food into their diet. A wonderful food they love is curly kale, its also got loads of good stuff in it, a bit of a "superfood"


Rach1 said:


> Just been to the NERS rat show.
> Twas an interesting experience...
> Was a bit difficult to get talking to people I'll be honest, they all knew each other but eventually a couple of the ladies said hi.
> I'm hoping to take two of my rats to the next show...
> So I have a few months to get prepared.
> Lol


Ooh that will be fun  I'm sure once you have been a few times you will be nattering away with everyone 



Rach1 said:


> Not cliquey but more established!
> There were established groups of people and that can be hard to break into.
> I spoke to several nice people from Lancaster as I am so that was good.
> There was a lively stall selling bits and bobs for rats...
> A nice little food stall and some lovely rats.


was there anything by philosophy fox there? she does beautiful sculptures


feorag said:


> Just to clarify the situation. I don't use Oko Plus as a substrate, I use cardboard pieces.
> 
> I use Oko Plus in their two litter trays. I've tried newspaper litters - I hated it cos I could smell it. I've also tried other stuff and don't like that either.
> 
> Oko Plus is made from untreated fir and pine, but the difference with this compared to the usual wood based cat litters is that it is a clumping litter. When liquid is poured on it, it immediately forms a hard solid lump, so imao doesn't give off the phenols that wood pellets or shavings do, because when wood pellets get wet they break down into wet sawdust which does give off fumes.
> 
> My rats use one litter tray just about solely for pooing in, so that just stays where it is for a week, the other tray is used mainly for weeing and eating in. I don't have to do spot cleaning cos they don't wee anywhere else (they did wee every day on the top shelf, so I moved the 'wee tray' up there and now they don't), but every other day I just lift out all the hard lumps.
> 
> It is expensive, compared to the price of a bag of other litter, but we've found using it in our cat litter trays that it costs us nearly half the price of the £5.50 per bag litter we were using previously, because it lasts so much longer and it certainly gives off very little smell because everything is so 'contained'. So because I have it in the house I don't find it expensive to use for the rats too.


Ahh I did think you used card tbh. Mine dont have a litter tray per se they have trays with their substrate in and they go in those, that may change in the future but atm they stick to certain areas and cleaning out is a doddle...my boys go everywhere they please, the girls are cleaner about it. 

If its something that you have anyway and its for the trays then the price will be negligible im sure, I meant it would be pricey as a substrate for the whole cage, when there are cheaper options that are just as good.


----------



## feorag

Precisely, that's why I thought I'd better explain that I only use it in their litter trays. My boys are very clean and always have been!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Precisely, that's why I thought I'd better explain that I only use it in their litter trays. My boys are very clean and always have been!


You will have to send Dougal here so he can teach my boys :lol2: Tbh I have heard a few people complain their boys are a little lazier in their toileting habits,after all it is in their nature to mark more so you have been lucky there  Though two of your boys being neutered probably made a difference.

How is Dougal coping after loosing Jeemy?


----------



## feorag

It was actually Angus and Hamish who decided which litter tray would be used for which purpose and neither of those were neutered. Dougal and Wee Jeemy kind of just followed suit, except a few months ago Dougal developed the habit of coming out the 'wasps nest' at the top of the cage onto the shelf and just peeing there, every day, so I was forever cleaning. 

As soon as I moved the 'wee tray' from the base to that shelf it stopped. In the place where it was I put an igloo and Wee Jeemy claimed that for his nest building.

I feel sorry for Dougal, because i took ill just after Wee Jeemy died and hadn't had time to start searching for a couple of friends for him. However, he seems to be OK, goes about his business as normal. To be honest I think it would have hit Wee Jeemy harder to have been the one left.

I've e-mailed Angus & Hamish's breeder to see if she has any kittens and Alison (Shunamite) to see if she has any (which she hasn't yet) or knows of any adults in need of a home, cos she does rat rescue for NERS, but there's no-one near me at the minute with kittens, so I'm not sure what to do.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> It was actually Angus and Hamish who decided which litter tray would be used for which purpose and neither of those were neutered. Dougal and Wee Jeemy kind of just followed suit, except a few months ago Dougal developed the habit of coming out the 'wasps nest' at the top of the cage onto the shelf and just peeing there, every day, so I was forever cleaning.
> 
> As soon as I moved the 'wee tray' from the base to that shelf it stopped. In the place where it was I put an igloo and Wee Jeemy claimed that for his nest building.
> 
> I feel sorry for Dougal, because i took ill just after Wee Jeemy died and hadn't had time to start searching for a couple of friends for him. However, he seems to be OK, goes about his business as normal. To be honest I think it would have hit Wee Jeemy harder to have been the one left.
> 
> I've e-mailed Angus & Hamish's breeder to see if she has any kittens and Alison (Shunamite) to see if she has any (which she hasn't yet) or knows of any adults in need of a home, cos she does rat rescue for NERS, but there's no-one near me at the minute with kittens, so I'm not sure what to do.


theres some older bucks in the north that might be worth a shot and on the boards Alison has a pair of does up for rescue 
Fancy Rats • View forum - North of England


----------



## feorag

Maybe Alison thinks those 2 females might not mix with Dougal? I did tell her at the back of last year that I would be looking for a pair of youngsters at any time in the immediate future and that I would take a rescued pair if she had them.

I e-mailed her back when she said she didn't have any kittens and said I would consider an older female as dougal was neutered, but haven't heard back yet.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Maybe Alison thinks those 2 females might not mix with Dougal? I did tell her at the back of last year that I would be looking for a pair of youngsters at any time in the immediate future and that I would take a rescued pair if she had them.
> 
> I e-mailed her back when she said she didn't have any kittens and said I would consider an older female as dougal was neutered, but haven't heard back yet.


The ad says she would let them go with neutered bucks, does she know he is neutered? maybe they have gone and she hasnt had time to update..The right ones will turn up soon im sure


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## feorag

She definitely knows he's neutered - she looks after them for me when I go on holiday and I did tell her that I would consider females because he is neutered.

They may have gone already, but I'm sure if she thinks they'll be good to come to me, she'll get back to me in response to my last e-mail.

In the meantime I'll keep an eye out.


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## ami_j

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...ifieds/831683-black-tame-baby-dumbo-rats.html
these anywhere near you?


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## feorag

I saw that advert, but it's about an hour's drive from me and at the minute I just don't think I could manage that, so I was hoping to find something a little nearer.


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> I saw that advert, but it's about an hour's drive from me and at the minute I just don't think I could manage that, so I was hoping to find something a little nearer.


Thats understandable


----------



## INJAF

ami_j said:


> Welcome  Love seeing new rats
> I bet they are loving the inclusion of fresh food into their diet. A wonderful food they love is curly kale, its also got loads of good stuff in it, a bit of a "superfood"


Thanks for the tip off on the kale, I bought them some yesterday and it was very well received  Although I made the error of giving it to them at the same time as a fruity snack stick thing which they were rather more interested in at first! This evening they've got carrots and a little bit of chicken to go with their 'normal' food, will be interesting to see how they take to the chicken  The snack stick was a scene of utter devastation once they'd done with it, lol. 

On a different note, and I hope it's ok to post the odd question or two in here, let me know if I should start a new thread - is there anything anyone can recommend as a precautionary mite treatment? They seem to scratch quite a bit and while I can't see anything on them I wonder if it would be worth doing a precautionary treatment?


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## sammy1969

YOu can post as many questions as you like hun thats the point of the thread as well as to talk ratties lol. as for precautionary mite treatments i personally dont use them but i a sure Ami will be able to recommend something


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## ami_j

INJAF said:


> Thanks for the tip off on the kale, I bought them some yesterday and it was very well received  Although I made the error of giving it to them at the same time as a fruity snack stick thing which they were rather more interested in at first! This evening they've got carrots and a little bit of chicken to go with their 'normal' food, will be interesting to see how they take to the chicken  The snack stick was a scene of utter devastation once they'd done with it, lol.
> 
> On a different note, and I hope it's ok to post the odd question or two in here, let me know if I should start a new thread - is there anything anyone can recommend as a precautionary mite treatment? They seem to scratch quite a bit and while I can't see anything on them I wonder if it would be worth doing a precautionary treatment?


what food are they on? or were they on
if you want to treat them theres this Anti-Parasite Spot On for Rabbits and Guinea Pigs by Beaphar | Pets at Home 
they wont need doing every month or so like a dog or cat but if you think they have mites or lice its worth doing


----------



## Rackie

As Ami has said the Beaphar spot on is the best thing for treating mites/lice. You want to use something that uses ivermectin as the active ingredient. You can't see mites, so that may well be it, there's no harm in treating them for it


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> if you want to treat them theres this Anti-Parasite Spot On for Rabbits and Guinea Pigs by Beaphar | Pets at Home
> they wont need doing every month or so like a dog or cat but if you think they have mites or lice its worth doing


Well over a year ago my Wee Jeemy was scratching madly at himself and I thought it could be mites. I got some spot on from my vet (he just gave me the end of a bottle he'd been using, so there was only a small amount left in it) I treated all 4 rats and cleaned out their cage and have never had to do it again. So, in my experience, it's not a treatment you need to keep repeating.


----------



## ami_j

No its not- hence I said they dont need repeated treatment like a cat or dog. With lice they tend to recommend doing them a fortnight afterwards just to make sure theres none missed. Mites tend to flare up if the rat is ill or stressed I think the belief is that they carry them naturally but their immune system keeps them at bay. They tend to be host specific too so if one has them it doesnt mean they all do best to do them all to be safe though imo


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## feorag

totally agree! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

Lice can be stubborn buggers though, I took in some rescues that needed treating twice so two lots of 6 week treatment (spot on every fortnight) but those poor babies were riddled


----------



## BMo1979

Took some photos of the "Trio Infernale" during free play last night.

Nibbles
















Treacle








... doing an impression of a kangaroo








"Nibbles!!!"








Baby Dusty braving it out, too








One small step for a rat, one giant leap for Treacle








Dusty doing some acrobatics








Little refuelling time








Nibbles being nosy








Treacle showing Dusty how to get out of the cage
















Nibbles and Dusty








You turn your back for 2 seconds...








And now she's trying to steal my lemonade








Hope you enjoy the pictures!


----------



## ami_j

Lovely pics :flrt: They looked to have a lovely time there and cheeky little thief :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> Lovely pics :flrt: They looked to have a lovely time there and cheeky little thief :lol2:


They always do, lol. Nibbles definitely is very cheeky. She's not scared of anything (I think she might be a bit hard of hearing though, as she doesn't even twitch with loud noises. Will have that checked out by the vet possibly) and she has an attitude only a female rat could have: Very stubborn, into everything, greedy, but she's forgiven cos she's so cute and friendly.
Treacle used to be terrified of everything and she still has her "off days" when she's very much on the edge, but she is getting so much more confident. She's very attached to me and keeps climbing back onto me during free play to give "kisses".
Dusty is more like Nibbles (same breeder and shop). Quite confident for her age, doesn't mind being picked up but prefers to explore. Her eyesight is (apparently) typical for a ruby eyed rat, not very good, but this doesn't stop her from climbing and getting up to mischief (climbing behind the couch ninja style).


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> They always do, lol. Nibbles definitely is very cheeky. She's not scared of anything (I think she might be a bit hard of hearing though, as she doesn't even twitch with loud noises. Will have that checked out by the vet possibly) and she has an attitude only a female rat could have: Very stubborn, into everything, greedy, but she's forgiven cos she's so cute and friendly.
> Treacle used to be terrified of everything and she still has her "off days" when she's very much on the edge, but she is getting so much more confident. She's very attached to me and keeps climbing back onto me during free play to give "kisses".
> Dusty is more like Nibbles (same breeder and shop). Quite confident for her age, doesn't mind being picked up but prefers to explore. Her eyesight is (apparently) typical for a ruby eyed rat, not very good, but this doesn't stop her from climbing and getting up to mischief (climbing behind the couch ninja style).


most rats have poor eyesight anyway, but ruby eyeds do have worse sight than black eyed and pink eyeds i think have less still...doesnt bother them though, infact i have a one pink eyed hairless rat (so hardly any whiskers) and she gets around brilliantly, i even saw an eyeless rat on the ratforum the other day and shes aparently not daunted at all


----------



## INJAF

ami_j said:


> what food are they on? or were they on
> if you want to treat them theres this Anti-Parasite Spot On for Rabbits and Guinea Pigs by Beaphar | Pets at Home
> they wont need doing every month or so like a dog or cat but if you think they have mites or lice its worth doing


Thanks for the info on the treatment (and to everyone else who posted with info on that too ) I'll see if I can get hold of some of that, they just seem to scratch a little more than I would have thought they would if it was just random itches.

As for what food they're on, they have the [email protected] rat nuggets ttp://www.petsathome.com/shop/nugget-rat-food-4kg-by-pets-at-home-15680 and Selective Rat Supreme Science Selective Rat Food. I still give them these, and add the fresh food as well, some in the morning and some in the evening.

Great pics BMo1979 :flrt: (I love this smiley, lol!). They do look like they're having a good time there. I do like seeing them getting up to stuff out of the cage, they're such nosey little devils!

Before I got mine I was curious about whether or not they could see in colour so I had a nosey about t'interweb and found quite an interesting article 

What Do Rats See?


----------



## ami_j

I really would consider shunamite for them. The nuggets are pretty boring for them even wth added fresh food. Plus with shunamite you can control the protein levels, as they are around two they will be needing less and more kidney friendly grains would be advisable, commercial pet food is a bit one size fits all


----------



## INJAF

Sorry for delay in replying! All info taken on board though  Have got some grains in stock now so will have a crack at that and see how they go, the mini shredded wheats (broken in half!) certainly went down very well


----------



## sammy1969

BMo1979 please return my nibbler and blaze lol. Your Dusty and Nibbles are the twins of my two lol and are just ascheeky although i am stillint he process of taming these two of my four roans which i have recently found out originally came from [email protected] and explains why they are so skittish but they are coming along nicely with the help of peanut butter and choclate mouss and fresh prawns as titibits and hot buttered toast lol works wonders for taminglol. Dry toast is another favourite of the girl i have f0und ut too as had two on my shoulders whilst making it for myself only to hae them both run and pinch a whole slice and play tug of war betwen themselves trying to run away with it lol along the kitchen side with four cats watching bewildered.
Jai no smell form the prawns lol thnk it was where i got the taste and they got he meat lol damn ats lol 

INAJAF please concider seriously taking them off [email protected] nuggets andd changing them to shumenite it is so much better for them the are not getting anything form thenugets if you ask me and it s so boring for hem even withe fresh added in. Much better to make up your own mix and if you have a pampurred pets near you easy to do as they sell all the base materials to make a great mix at a good price and a pound shop for cereals is just the icing on the cake lol. It doesnt need to be expensive to be good for them lol and probably will end up beter value than the nuggets lol. Please dont think I am having a go as I am not just trying to give a bit of helpif i can


----------



## ami_j

INJAF said:


> Sorry for delay in replying! All info taken on board though  Have got some grains in stock now so will have a crack at that and see how they go, the mini shredded wheats (broken in half!) certainly went down very well


awesome  cheap stuff tends to have less sugar , the more kidney friendly grains are rice, millet, barley while the less kidney friendly are rye , wheat and oats


----------



## sammy1969

~Ok love my cheeky girls to bits but after spending £7 on a new treat bal for the dogs i have jsut discovered tha they have chewed through it and nicked the treats out of it lol. Yes I was a wally who mistakenly thought that they wouldnt chew it through the top of the cage oh the stupidity lol. So thought fine they could have it to play with in that case so went put more treats in it lol and now watchign them chase it round te bottom of hte cage emptyig it of treats and tryig ot take them off each other lol and the bubbas are climbing in it, yes they have chewed that big a hole in it, and taking advantage of the way the older girls cant get in lmao. I do love my rats lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> ~Ok love my cheeky girls to bits but after spending £7 on a new treat bal for the dogs i have jsut discovered tha they have chewed through it and nicked the treats out of it lol. Yes I was a wally who mistakenly thought that they wouldnt chew it through the top of the cage oh the stupidity lol. So thought fine they could have it to play with in that case so went put more treats in it lol and now watchign them chase it round te bottom of hte cage emptyig it of treats and tryig ot take them off each other lol and the bubbas are climbing in it, yes they have chewed that big a hole in it, and taking advantage of the way the older girls cant get in lmao. I do love my rats lol


lol thats nothing wait til they have ruined the back of the sofa, several tops and your curtains let alone countless otherthings :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

I know hun I remember the devastation fromthe last time I had rattties lol this brought it all back and poor Glyn has it all to experience for the first time lol. I ownder how mad it will drive him lol?


----------



## BMo1979

sammy1969 said:


> BMo1979 please return my nibbler and blaze lol. Your Dusty and Nibbles are the twins of my two lol and are just ascheeky


Noo way :lol2:, they're here to stay. Although, Nibbles was doing my head in last night: She had her crazy 5s, feeling very dominant (or randy, lol) and kept throwing Treacle on her back to hump her persistently. Poor girl couldn't get 5 seconds of peace :devil:. Then during free play, she kept trying to steal my wine :gasp: (had a cheeky early birthday drink) and tried to climb up the curtains.
Oh well, we chose to put up with rats and I think their great personalities and funny traits outweigh the "bad" behaviour.


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> lol thats nothing wait til they have ruined the back of the sofa, several tops and your curtains let alone countless otherthings :lol2:


I gave up 'proper' curtains when some of my cats became sprayers and started standing on the window sill and spraying on the curtains! :roll:

So I changed to muslin curtains which are draped around the pole and hang down the side of the window _above _spraying height - problem solved *UNTIL *I got rats! :roll:

Unfortunately the cage is taller than the window sill and one day I discovered that they'd pulled the muslin into the cage and were happily chewing it up for bedding! :gasp:

So now the muslin on that side has a knot tied in it to keep it out of their reach.

Like I said if you love animals, it's very difficult to be houseproud too! Fortunately, I'm not! :roll2: PMSL!!


----------



## ami_j

haha you are not wrong Eileen between the dog and the rats it never ends :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> haha you are not wrong Eileen between the dog and the rats it never ends :lol2:


Add 3 (human) boys, a husband and 2 snakes to the mixture and your house looks like something out of "How clean is your house" on some days.... okay, most days :blush:


----------



## feorag

My husband is a brilliant hooverist! :lol2: He hoovers the houser no problem, but he doesn't seem to be aware of dust, marks on the kitchen benches and things like toothpaste stains and dried up drips in the bathroom! :roll:

I've recently been ill and spent 3 weeks in bed and still can't do much in the way of household chores. My carpets are beautifully clean, but when I went into the kitchen for the first time in 3 weeks, I just had to clean down the workbenches and as soon as I was able I had to clean the bathroom, cos dirty bathrooms are anathema to me - I really can't bear a dirty bathroom! Dust, however, I can live with, so it's still there for now!

It's funny what men see and don't see, isn't it?


----------



## Rach1

pah, what they 'claim' they dont see!

agreed tho.. my Oh never does see the toothpaste dried on the sink...
or the wee wee thats dripped under the seat onto the actual loo...:whistling2:


----------



## feorag

:lol2:

Our problem is we have ducted air heating, so there's always dust circulating in the air and landing on surfaces. As far as the bathroom goes I agree with you, but as Barry showers every morning, the surfaces in the bathroom are always damp, so again dust lies on it and gets wet and stays put, so it makes everything look dirty and uncleaned, so you can imagine what it looked like after 3 weeks of neglect! :gasp:


----------



## storm

hi, i hope you dont mind me joining in! i have 17 squishy boys and 16 wired girls, love em to bits! got 3 new ones yesterday, a hairless dumbo girl and a blue dumbo girl..and a hairless boy. im going to have a photo shoot tonight if i can so ill post some piccies of them, most are all rescues/rehomes


----------



## BMo1979

Rach1 said:


> ..
> or the wee wee thats dripped under the seat onto the actual loo...:whistling2:


Welcome to my world. It must be a male thing (I'm the only human female in the house)! I keep threatening the boys (incl. my husband) to stop cleaning the toilets after them, but they know fine well I couldn't do it. It's my pet hate!!!


----------



## Rach1

Of course we dont mind you joining in storm.
Welcome.
And having seen your ladies and gents I know you'll have loads to add to the thread.
Keep me posted on any female rehomers!
Lol


----------



## sammy1969

Eileen I live in organised chaos lol warn everyone who comes in my home isnt dirty just messy especially with allthe furries and scaleys I have here that demolish everything and anything material hence leather sofas no carpets and cheap curtains after loosing nearly £1,000 worth to the rats last time lol and I give up on really nice nets too as the cats shred them lol and keep them bunched in the middle of the Windows lol.

Storm the more the merrier lol cant wait to see piccies of your babies.
BMo1979 no fair lol pinching my babies like that lol I knew two were missing but dint see you sneak in and grab them lol. Seriously though thought I was seeing double when i saw the pics of your two and looked at mine


----------



## BMo1979

Arrgh, that's it! Nibbles will now be officially renamed Menace. I was just spot cleaning their cage, so let them run around on the computer desk and what does this little git do??? Only climbs inside the printer. I had to lift the whole top off to get her out and her snout was covered in ink. I got it all cleaned off (she wasn't impressed, lol). That rat gets into everything. I could probably put her in an empty room and she would find a way to get into trouble. :lol2:


----------



## feorag

Sorry, but I lol'd! :blush:


----------



## BMo1979

Don't blame you. I did, too (afterwards). At least it never gets boring with the pets around.


----------



## sammy1969

I lol'd too as it is the same sort of thing as my rats do and i was happy I wasnt the only one who has to suffer like it.


----------



## Rach1

i'm looking for two more rattie ladies to join my clan but i nearly did the did the daft thing today and got some from my local pet shop... was walking through town and saw two little babes in a tank together...no toys etc... felt so bad walking away!


----------



## feorag

You and me both - I'm still worrying about the single rat in PaH last Saturday! :sad:


----------



## Rach1

it's awful...
tbh i also didnt have £20 handy to pay for them both.


----------



## Lover

Hey guys thoughts id join in, i don't own any currently though i used to breed them years ago like 2-3 years now wow goes fast. So when i stopped breeding i just got two boy rats both have sadly just passed away not long ago, i'm at that stage to over come having lost them and maybe thinking of getting another pair of bucks.

I will be getting rescue's young males/babies.

thought id bring in some cute pictures of my old rats


----------



## ami_j

Lovely pics Kim


----------



## feorag

Couldn't resist posting this - although that's an odd name and a canny pair of testaklees for a female rat!!! :lol2:

Bill: The Love Of My Life - YouTube


----------



## Kiel

Any advice on stopping rats trying to bite whilst in the cage?

Had rats since I was a kid, not had any for a couple of years but got 2 males 3 months ago. They're awesome and not bitey at all when out, but trying to get them out of the cage or change water bottles is a real risk, they're not being vicious, just inquisitive I know, but they just try to bite every time my hand goes near the cage, pushing their noses through the bars if they think there's a chance they can reach. They're never fed through the bars, and when I fill their food bowl I always let them grab one 'block' each so they get busy chewing on that rather than my hand/arm.

Any ideas how to stop this behaviour? Having to warn people that come over not to put their fingers near the cage, then trying to convince them that once out they're completely fine is getting old


----------



## BMo1979

Mine were not very bitey to start with, but when they tried the occasional nibble (after all you could be carrying food) I would do what I did when training our dog and make a high pitched "Squeaky" noise before withdrawing my attention. My rats hate being ignored, so this did actually work.

P.S: Something completely different: Is it normal for a female rat which seems to be in season (when aren't they, lol?) to be a lot more affectionate than usual? I'm not complaining, but last night during free play, Nibbles would not leave me alone and kept crawling up onto me and snuggle up under my hands or inside my top. She's normally on the go all the time and prefers exploring and food to cuddles.


----------



## feorag

I've just succumbed!! :blush:

I've given up trying to find a breeder with rats and I'm so worried about Dougal who just spends all day sitting in his "wasps nest" on his own or eating and looking depressed, that I've just been to PaH







and bought 2 baby boys who've just come onto the shop floor today!









They had 7 altogether, so it took me ages to decide which ones to go for and I ended up buying probably the last 2 I would have said I wanted! :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

You've been to the chain of evil, lol???
I was in the same boat as you when I bought Treacle. Been round nearly every small pet shop (the ones I knew get their rats from decent breeders) and went to [email protected] as a last resort... Now I'm one that regularly lets her heart overrule her head (that's why I avoid rescue centres and animal shelters like the plague) and even though there was this tiny little niggle in the back of my mind (other people might call it reason, lol), I ended up buying Treacle. I don't regret owning her, but I do regret making space for 1-2 more farmed rat babies...
Anyway, I hope your new boys will turn out just as fine as Treacle did (she was already 12 weeks old when I got her, so it was a bit harder to socialise her) and that Dougal will be happy with his new pack.

BTW, photos or it didn't happen, lol!


----------



## feorag

I know - for once I didn't practice what I preached either!

However, I've been looking for a while and I hate seeing Dougal just sitting looking lonely. They're still in the rat carrier at the minuted, but I showed him the boys through the bars and he was sitting on the shelf right next to the carrier for ages.

I will take piccies once they've had a chance to settle down. They'd been in the back of the shop in quaranting, so fairly quiet and were only put on the shop floor this morning, so have been stuck in this large 'aquarium' being gaped at by all and sundry all day, so I've just left them to be quiet in the carrier for a while.

I _think_ one is a champagne, (definitely not white) and he has pink eyes, which I've never like and the other is a black berkie rex - at least he has long wavy fur, but not particularly curly whiskers.

Took me ages to make my mind up while I tried to assess their personality. I chose the champagne one cos he seemed the least skittish and jumpy and left the pile a few times and came to the front and didn't run away from my hand when I put it in the 'cage', so I decided he was braver than the rest, so i'd have him. That then left me to choose another. I really loved the champagne hooded rex, but I didn't want 2 nearly the same colour, so decided to go for the black.


----------



## ami_j

Been wanting silverfawns for AGES now i have three :flrt: been on a waiting list since last december, dont know how I have kept quiet for so long :lol2:





























feorag said:


> I know - for once I didn't practice what I preached either!
> 
> However, I've been looking for a while and I hate seeing Dougal just sitting looking lonely. They're still in the rat carrier at the minuted, but I showed him the boys through the bars and he was sitting on the shelf right next to the carrier for ages.
> 
> I will take piccies once they've had a chance to settle down. They'd been in the back of the shop in quaranting, so fairly quiet and were only put on the shop floor this morning, so have been stuck in this large 'aquarium' being gaped at by all and sundry all day, so I've just left them to be quiet in the carrier for a while.
> 
> I _think_ one is a champagne, (definitely not white) and he has pink eyes, which I've never like and the other is a black berkie rex - at least he has long wavy fur, but not particularly curly whiskers.
> 
> Took me ages to make my mind up while I tried to assess their personality. I chose the champagne one cos he seemed the least skittish and jumpy and left the pile a few times and came to the front and didn't run away from my hand when I put it in the 'cage', so I decided he was braver than the rest, so i'd have him. That then left me to choose another. I really loved the champagne hooded rex, but I didn't want 2 nearly the same colour, so decided to go for the black.


awww they sound cute, looking forward to seeing pics  its been a day fo newbies


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> Been wanting silverfawns for AGES now i have three :flrt: been on a waiting list since last december, dont know how I have kept quiet for so long :lol2:
> image
> image
> image


Arrgh! Alien Rats!
No seriously, nice colours and cute rats. :flrt:


----------



## feorag

I'll get piccies tomorrow when I don't have to use flash, cos of the red eyes.


----------



## selina20

Havent updated on here for a while. Well finally moved Patch into her big cage and got her a little friend who my son called Noo Noo :lol2:. Another girlie is coming to join them after i get back from holiday. Im amazed at how fast they settle with a new ratty in the cage. 

Anyway here are some pics 

Patch who has grown loads




























Patch and Noo Noo curled up together. Not got any pics of Noo Noo on her own yet because she is quite timid and atm im working on her confidence. Shes a dumbo eared ratty which looks so odd on such a small baby.


----------



## Kiel

The rats just after I got them:
Dave









Badger









Only way I could have them sit still was food lol.


----------



## selina20

Kiel said:


> The rats just after I got them:
> Dave
> image
> 
> Badger
> image
> 
> Only way I could have them sit still was food lol.


Hehehe a similar colour combination like me


----------



## Kiel

Dave had some health issues when I got them from [email protected], he's really sniffly and had mites, the mites were from the recycled paper stuff they had me buy and the vet gave me some antibiotics for the sniffles, he's just about catching up to his brother in size now, but behaves much more like the female rats i've had.

badger is happy to sit and snuggle and sleep whereas dave always wants to be off exploring seeing what could be edible.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Arrgh! Alien Rats!
> No seriously, nice colours and cute rats. :flrt:


Thanks :flrt: They are moulting atm should have a lovely orange adult coat when they are done


feorag said:


> I'll get piccies tomorrow when I don't have to use flash, cos of the red eyes.


: victory: will have to try that with mine too lol 


selina20 said:


> Havent updated on here for a while. Well finally moved Patch into her big cage and got her a little friend who my son called Noo Noo :lol2:. Another girlie is coming to join them after i get back from holiday. Im amazed at how fast they settle with a new ratty in the cage.
> 
> Anyway here are some pics
> 
> Patch who has grown loads
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> Patch and Noo Noo curled up together. Not got any pics of Noo Noo on her own yet because she is quite timid and atm im working on her confidence. Shes a dumbo eared ratty which looks so odd on such a small baby.
> 
> image


awwww :flrt:


Kiel said:


> The rats just after I got them:
> Dave
> image
> 
> Badger
> image
> 
> Only way I could have them sit still was food lol.


Bribery :lol2:


----------



## feorag

selina20 said:


> Havent updated on here for a while. Well finally moved Patch into her big cage and got her a little friend who my son called Noo Noo :lol2:. Another girlie is coming to join them after i get back from holiday. Im amazed at how fast they settle with a new ratty in the cage.
> 
> Anyway here are some pics
> 
> Patch who has grown loads
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> Patch and Noo Noo curled up together. Not got any pics of Noo Noo on her own yet because she is quite timid and atm im working on her confidence. Shes a dumbo eared ratty which looks so odd on such a small baby.
> 
> image


:gasp: Noo Noo?? :roll2: 2 lovely rats you've got there Selina.

By the way 3 words - necklaces - skunk - twilight!!! 



Kiel said:


> The rats just after I got them:
> Dave
> image
> 
> Badger
> image
> 
> Only way I could have them sit still was food lol.


Aw, would you look at that little scrawny thing at the top! :flrt:

His testaklees are nearly as big as him!!


----------



## Kiel

He's filled out and a lot more...buck looking now, he had a slow start because of the health issues. Will try get a pic of him being a fatty, hold on 

Edit:

Excuse my gut, Dave nomming a locust.









Double Trouble.









Not sure of the health implications of feeding them locusts, but i figure they've got to be healthier than many commercial 'treats' and they must come across a lot of bugs and stuff in the 'wild'.

I'm feeding them every time they're out right now, trying to have them associate being pulled out of the cage with good things, food and snuggles.


----------



## selina20

feorag said:


> :gasp: Noo Noo?? :roll2: 2 lovely rats you've got there Selina.
> 
> By the way 3 words - necklaces - skunk - twilight!!!


Hahahaha hun you might as well give up on them now so offer them to someone else please 

Ewan can only talk if all his words begin with N and as soon as he saw the new rat he said Noo Noo


----------



## ami_j

nothing wrong with them having locusts  mine have had crickets, waxworms and mealworms :lol2:

cant resists posting more pics of the gingers


----------



## feorag

Kiel said:


> He's filled out and a lot more...buck looking now, he had a slow start because of the health issues. Will try get a pic of him being a fatty, hold on
> 
> Edit:
> 
> Excuse my gut, Dave nomming a locust.
> 
> image
> Double Trouble.
> image
> 
> Not sure of the health implications of feeding them locusts, but i figure they've got to be healthier than many commercial 'treats' and they must come across a lot of bugs and stuff in the 'wild'.
> 
> I'm feeding them every time they're out right now, trying to have them associate being pulled out of the cage with good things, food and snuggles.


Good idea! :2thumb: He's definitely filled out a bit and doesn't look so 'sorry looking' - bless! :flrt:



selina20 said:


> Hahahaha hun you might as well give up on them now so offer them to someone else please
> 
> Ewan can only talk if all his words begin with N and as soon as he saw the new rat he said Noo Noo


OK - I'll see if I can sell them on here!



ami_j said:


> nothing wrong with them having locusts  mine have had crickets, waxworms and mealworms :lol2:
> 
> cant resists posting more pics of the gingers image
> image
> image
> image
> image
> image


I remember reading that they would happily eat mealworms, so I excitedly brought a few home from work and mine wouldn't touch them! I buy them now for the APDs, which guzzle them happily - not that I ever see it, but I'm not sure whether to try the rats on them again. I'm certain that my last 2 weren't fed as varied a diet as my first 2 cos they refused to eat a lot of stuff that my first 2 loved. I would strongly suspect that these 2 youngsters will have been brought up on nuggets and PaH feed nuggets, so even they were hesitant about the food they were given last night - both fresh and dried.

I couldn't give them crickets though, cos they could jump out of the cage! *shakes with horror* :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Good idea! :2thumb: He's definitely filled out a bit and doesn't look so 'sorry looking' - bless! :flrt:
> 
> OK - I'll see if I can sell them on here!
> 
> I remember reading that they would happily eat mealworms, so I excitedly brought a few home from work and mine wouldn't touch them! I buy them no for the APDs, which guzzle them happily - not that I ever see it, but I'm not sure whether to try the rats on them again. I'm certain that my last 2 weren't fed as varied a diet as my first 2 cos they refused to eat a lot of stuff that my first 2 loved. I would strongly suspect that these 2 youngsters will have been brought up on nuggets and PaH feed nuggets, so even they were hesitant about the food they were given last night - both fresh and dried.
> 
> I couldn't give them crickets though, cos they could jump out of the cage! *shakes with horror* :lol2:


lol you would have to handfeed crickets, after a bit of "omg it wiggles" they tend to despatch them pretty quickly. Bless them never seen fresh food  they will pick it up quick im sure


----------



## feorag

They might have had a bit of carrot thrown in with them when they were with their breeder, but to be honest I would doubt it, but I've never seen a rat or any other little furry critter with fresh food in its cage at PaH.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> They might have had a bit of carrot thrown in with them when they were with their breeder, but to be honest I would doubt it, but I've never seen a rat or any other little furry critter with fresh food in its cage at PaH.


Yeah I doubt it too, knowing the rodent farms they probably got better grub at PaH. I cant go in that shop, the temptation is always too much :lol2: 
Any ideas for names yet?


----------



## feorag

Well, having had an Angus, Hamish, Dougal and Wee Jeemy, I feel I need to stick with my Scottish names, but most of the other are kind of 'normal' names, so i'm still thinking.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well, having had an Angus, Hamish, Dougal and Wee Jeemy, I feel I need to stick with my Scottish names, but most of the other are kind of 'normal' names, so i'm still thinking.


Ooh picking names is exciting  I'm mulling names over in my head, Got ideas they just need to stick. But i have had since december to choose names :lol2:


----------



## feorag

And you still haven't thought of any???


----------



## ami_j

oh i have tonnes lol just need to see what their personalities are like, what sticks


----------



## DavieB

Wullie


----------



## feorag

Then he would have to be called "Wor Wullie" wouldn't he??? :lol2:

My vet's receptionist would probably put him down as "Wooly" though! :roll2:

Took some piccies today. I'm really pleased with the pale one (wanna tell me what colour he is??) he's very outgoing - probably the least skitty one I've had out of the 4 of them considering he's only been here a day.


----------



## ami_j

I would say you are right with champagne Eileen, my phone isnt the best at pics so will have a look later on the comp  They are really cute boys


----------



## feorag

Yeh! :2thumb: Couldn't think of what else he could be to be honest, but I'll wait for confirmation.

As I've said the champagne one in particular is very outgoing, the black is a bit skittish, but no less, if not as skittish, as my first 2 from a breeder of years of experience, so I'm well pleased with them so far. :flrt:


----------



## sammy1969

Woke up this morning to find both my boy rat kits dead. They still had both food and water and have shown no signs of illness at all. THey were both running round the cage last night before I went to bed so have no idea what has happened. I am absolutely gutted and nto sure if want to go on keeping again as been in tears over them, but will have to wait and see how i feel later.


----------



## feorag

Oh dear Sammy - so sorry to hear that! :sad:

What's happening with the cat?


----------



## ami_j

Oh Sam thats awful *hug*


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Then he would have to be called "Wor Wullie" wouldn't he??? :lol2:
> 
> My vet's receptionist would probably put him down as "Wooly" though! :roll2:
> 
> Took some piccies today. I'm really pleased with the pale one (wanna tell me what colour he is??) he's very outgoing - probably the least skitty one I've had out of the 4 of them considering he's only been here a day.
> 
> image image
> 
> image image


yup he is a champagne


----------



## ami_j

these babies arent half packing the food away :lol2: they are already visibly bigger!


----------



## BMo1979

That's awful news, Sammy. Wishing you all the best.


----------



## feorag

Well, I think there's no question that my little boys haven't been fed fresh food. Last night I gave them some Applaws chicken and it was still in the dish this morning. They've no idea what they're missing out on, but they'll soon learn! :2thumb:

At the minute the champagne is sitting on my shoulder quite happily - I'm thinking (and secretary hoping) that he's gonna be a shoulder rat. The black on the other hand sat on my shoulder for a bit and then started worrying, so at the minute he's down my t-shirt! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

awww sounds like it Eileen


----------



## feorag

feorag said:


> At the minute the champagne is sitting on my shoulder quite happily - I'm thinking (and secretary hoping) that he's gonna be a shoulder rat. The black on the other hand sat on my shoulder for a bit and then started worrying, so at the minute he's down my t-shirt! :lol2:


I've just noticed my typo - my fingers sometimes seem to recognise a word from the first couple of letters and finish it off, but it's not always the word in my brain! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

i did wonder :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

Ok my life with rats seems to go from bad to worse it seems. Today finally got round to setting up the brio cage for the girls as the babies are now big enough not to get lost in it. Well when transfering them from one cage to the other we noticed that one of the roan girls has gone completely missing no sign of a carass or blood or anything in the cage so have no idea what has happened to her and then to top everything topaz the mother to the babies decided to throw a fit and escaped and we now cant find her anywhere she has obviously gone to ground and I am hoping that when everything goes quiet later tongiht she will appear so we can get her back into the cage with her sisters by default. HAve also put a bowl of food inthe old cage jsut incase she decides to go into there.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Ok my life with rats seems to go from bad to worse it seems. Today finally got round to setting up the brio cage for the girls as the babies are now big enough not to get lost in it. Well when transfering them from one cage to the other we noticed that one of the roan girls has gone completely missing no sign of a carass or blood or anything in the cage so have no idea what has happened to her and then to top everything topaz the mother to the babies decided to throw a fit and escaped and we now cant find her anywhere she has obviously gone to ground and I am hoping that when everything goes quiet later tongiht she will appear so we can get her back into the cage with her sisters by default. HAve also put a bowl of food inthe old cage jsut incase she decides to go into there.


im sure they will show up sam  good luck in catching them


----------



## sammy1969

well topaz will but the roan didnt escape she just wasnt in the cge thsts the weird thing i mean topaz escaped by biting when she was being transferred but Blaze has dissappeared into thin air without the cage being open


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> well topaz will but the roan didnt escape she just wasnt in the cge thsts the weird thing i mean topaz escaped by biting when she was being transferred but Blaze has dissappeared into thin air without the cage being open


she must of found a way to escape, even if she passed away and they "cleaned up" there would be a trace i reckon with how often you check or blood on the bedding


----------



## sammy1969

I check them every day thought she was there this morning lol but now i am not so sure lol but then she is one of a twin I have found no blood or trace of a carcass so i am well intrugued as to where she has gone lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> I check them every day thought she was there this morning lol but now i am not so sure lol but then she is one of a twin I have found no blood or trace of a carcass so i am well intrugued as to where she has gone lol


is the base chewed?door loose? lol
she must of escaped some how, maybe slipped out whe the door was open?


----------



## sammy1969

NO chew marks anywhere lol but I am wondering if she crept out unseen when i was taking the shelves ou of the cage to put into the brio lol its the only thing i can think of


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> NO chew marks anywhere lol but I am wondering if she crept out unseen when i was taking the shelves ou of the cage to put into the brio lol its the only thing i can think of


Aeon did something like this, found her sat on top of the cage the next evening!!!! the only way she could of got out was through sneaking out lol.


----------



## sammy1969

WEll i am hoping sarah will do the saem I have left food in the jenny cage wih a door propped open and i am hoping that when we go to bed they will both come out and go into the cage for the food and just settle back in the hammock i have left in there for the night lol mind you i dont think it will fit int he new cage with all the bits i have already put in there lol


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> WEll i am hoping sarah will do the saem I have left food in the jenny cage wih a door propped open and i am hoping that when we go to bed they will both come out and go into the cage for the food and just settle back in the hammock i have left in there for the night lol mind you i dont think it will fit int he new cage with all the bits i have already put in there lol


hopefully 

ooh you will need to post pics


----------



## Kiel

One of my rats got loose on the second night, put a plastic faunarium down with the door up and food/bedding inside, went to sleep. By the time I got up in the morning he was fast asleep inside ready to go back with his brother 

Good luck.


----------



## feorag

Sammy I would be pretty certain that if you cannot find any trace of blood anywhere in the substrate,then she's not dead - I know rats 'clean up' very efficiently but blood dries on substrate quickly too and they surely arent going to lick all that clean. So I'm with Jaime that she's probably escaped or sneaked out when you were concentrating on something or someone else. I hope you do get her back - and her mother. I think they're very likely to go back into their original cage, as that's security for them - unless they've found somewhere that they consider to be the ultimate homer and then I think you'll have to set a trap for them.


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## Esarosa

feorag said:


> Morning all!
> 
> Sammy I would be pretty certain that if you cannot find any trace of blood anywhere in the substrate,then she's not dead - I know rats 'clean up' very efficiently but blood dries on substrate quickly too and they surely arent going to lick all that clean. So I'm with Jaime that she's probably escaped or sneaked out when you were concentrating on something or someone else. I hope you do get her back - and her mother. I think they're very likely to go back into their original cage, as that's security for them - unless they've found somewhere that they consider to be the ultimate homer and then I think you'll have to set a trap for them.



When Rolo escaped (this was the vicious rescue rattie who gave me permanant nerve damage in my fingers) she went straight under the drawers, and would she move..no. I couldn't lift the drawers as they weighed a ton. I was lucky in the sense that I knew where she was, so we ended up prodding from one side with a stick, to encourage her to move forward. The anticipation of having to pick her up when she got out though was terrifying, and true to form I ended up bleeding profusely...she was a real gem to own, such a character :lol2:


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## feorag

:gasp:


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## Kiel

Neither of mine are bitey at all outside of the cage, none of the rats i've ever owned have been. I've been telling people at work to get rats over hamsters/gerbils for their kids, they're hardier, smarter, don't bite i say.

A workmate comes to my house, puts his finger into the cage and gets bitten. Makes me look a right tool lol.

When dave got loose that first night, he ran behind my viv stack. This thing is solid, 5x3x6ft. It ain't budging. That's why I had to just leave the 'trap' down and hope he found his way in there.


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## Esarosa

Kiel said:


> Neither of mine are bitey at all outside of the cage, none of the rats i've ever owned have been. I've been telling people at work to get rats over hamsters/gerbils for their kids, they're hardier, smarter, don't bite i say.
> 
> A workmate comes to my house, puts his finger into the cage and gets bitten. Makes me look a right tool lol.
> 
> When dave got loose that first night, he ran behind my viv stack. This thing is solid, 5x3x6ft. It ain't budging. That's why I had to just leave the 'trap' down and hope he found his way in there.



None of my other ratties were ever bitey. But Rolo had a questionable start in life along with Puck, the rat who came with her. 

They were bought as pets for a child who had 'lost interest'. Rolo was missing a portion of her tail and when I asked how it had happened they couldn't/wouldn't tell me. Both rats were terrified of people. Puck was severely malnourished, their cage was an absolute state they had no food in there and the water looked disgusting (what little there was). Rolo was very round and had chunks of fur missing, hence how she got the nam Rolo as my partner joked she'd clearly eaten the last one, which accounted for her size and Pucks lack of. 

Rolo's fear of humans, had turned to aggression. I think her mantra was if I bite first they won't hurt me. God knows what the little :censor: had done to her, but I never gained her confidence despite trying every day, she'd take food from my hand then bite me lol. Trying to clean out or do basic tasks in the cage was a challenge. When we first introduced her to my other rats, every time I went to go in the cage to either feed, water change or get the others out for free range time, she would physically drag the other rats by their sides into the nearest bed/tunnel to protect them from me.

I could never stay mad at her, as I don't know what happened to her, and she really did love the other ratties to bits and just tried to protect them. In time she realised that the other ratties came to me willingly, and so she would begrudgingly allow it, but she always made sure she sat somewhere she could see them so she knew what was going on. Puck's fear of humans manifested itself in running away and trying to hide. I gained Pucks trust when she was choking, and in a sheer moment of desperation I did the heimlich manouvre on her as I didn't know what else I could do quickly. It worked. And from then on she trusted me implicitely and would actively seek me out for attention. But she remained terrified of any other people until the day she died.

You've got to wonder what had happened to the pair of them to make them so traumatised by humans. I tried reporting the previous owners to the RSPCA but was told as I'd taken the rats away from the situation they couldn't do anything. What was I supposed to do? Leave them in horrible, unsuitable conditions with a seemingly vindictive child? :bash:

This was Rolo (with Pucky peaking out)









This was Puck. The bottom picture is the day I brought her home, you can see how thin she was. The other pictures were taken as I gained her trust.


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## Kiel

Poor ratties, lucky to have you later in life though!

Whilst i'm thinking about it, does anyone know of any reason someone (my mother) would be allergic to the pair of female ratties I had previously to these males? I'd always had males before and decided to see the differences and get females after my last pair died (i've always had same sex pairs except one lone male once). My mum would sneeze as soon as she came into the room the rats were kept in (my bed room) but never with the males.

Was just a really odd thing to be allergic to one sex but not the other.


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## Esarosa

Kiel said:


> Poor ratties, lucky to have you later in life though!
> 
> Whilst i'm thinking about it, does anyone know of any reason someone (my mother) would be allergic to the pair of female ratties I had previously to these males? I'd always had males before and decided to see the differences and get females after my last pair died (i've always had same sex pairs except one lone male once). My mum would sneeze as soon as she came into the room the rats were kept in (my bed room) but never with the males.
> 
> Was just a really odd thing to be allergic to one sex but not the other.



Wow that's bizarre, I've no idea why a different sex could cause a reaction like that.


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## Kiel

Yeah, it was really bizzarre. I got the girls just before mothers day, she had them out the night before. When she got up on mothersday her eyes were all swollen and stuff. It was only ever with the girls.

I had her check if she was allergic to these boys and she's fine, same as the boys I had previous. They were all kept on wood shavings (before I knew better...), those girls no different to the boys before them so it won't have been an allergy to the substrate or anything...

Was just really strange.


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## Esarosa

Different fur type? Rex vs normal? No idea. Maybe something in the urine but can't imagine what.


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## Kiel

I said girls/boys a lot there.

Whilst we're sharing stories (and because work is dull) i'll expand on the lone male.

I must have been ~16 when we got Dusty (mine) and Kariel (My brothers) We'd just moved and since i'd finished school was having a hard time meeting people. My parents got us the rats and me being me wanted mine in my room but my brother protested. Ended up seperating them.

Later that year I went to live away at Melton Mowbray college (ND Animal Care), Dusty came with me every sunday and went back home with me every Friday. Lived free in my room whenever I was home, came to the social club and most of my classroom lessons too. He slept in the pouch or hood I wore every day.

He'll always have been my favourite. During a particularly lonely part of my life he was the constant that always made me smile.

I got kicked out of Tesco once because he came out to say hi to people, apparently rats can't be guide dogs no matter how good your impression of a blind person is.


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## BMo1979

Great! I'm very like going to have to call the vet tomorrow: Treacle has started making quite strange clucking noises. They're quite loud and don't seem to be normal bruxing. She only does them when she gets excited though, i.e. when outside her cage or sitting on my shoulder.
She doesn't show any other signs of a possible respiratory infection, but those noises are really quite odd and when googling (I know you shouldn't really google symptoms, cos they're always come back as cancer, lol) the advise is always to see a vet asap, because it's very likely to be an infection. As I said, she doesn't have any red discharge not even clear discharge or has lost her appetite. She still plays, eats and grooms herself and doesn't show any signs of pain or discomfort, but I've heard that because of their fast metabolism, rats can go downhill pretty fast. The only other thing I've noticed but put down to her being a [email protected] rat is that even though she's the oldest she is quite a runt.
Am I just being a panicky paranoid rat mum here?
The other two don't have any symptoms, btw, and they are now on "Back 2 Nature" bedding.


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## feorag

It won't hurt to take her to the vet and get her checked out. If there's a respiratory problem he'll pick it up with his stethoscope and a course of anti-biotics will clear it up. In my opinion, better safe than sorry!

My Wee Jeemy had regular bouts of this - it never stopped him eating, it never stopped him running around, he never had a nasal discharge of any kind and none of my other 3 rats ever had it. So in my experience that's not a good guide as to whether it's a respiratory infection or not.


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## BMo1979

Well, you know when you have a tooth ache, but on the day you go to the dentist it has disappeared? Seems to work for rats, too.
I had Treacle out by herself this morning and there was nothing. No funny noises just very content bruxing.
Took all 3 of them for a check-up anyway and even the vet couldn't hear any abnormalities (surprised they were able to hold her, as she is very shy with other people), but of course told me to keep an eye on her and if the noise comes back/persists to come and see them again. He reckoned it may be just one of those funny chatter noises some rats make when they're excited. It may sound crazy, but I'm beginning to wonder whether she is somehow trying to copy me, as every time I have her on my shoulder I make some sort of lip smacking clucky noises to "talk" to her. Maybe she is trying to get my attention???
Nibbles, however needs to watch her weight a little :blush:, as she's getting a little too round for her size...


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## feorag

I found this with Wee Jeemy too! A lot of the time I found his breathing was much worse in the evening. I'd hear him rattling or wheezing or clicking late at night and think "oh no, back on the Baytril" then I'd get up in the morning there was total silence and I'd think "oh he's OK" and then that night or the next night he'd start again!


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## sammy1969

Well topaz the mum of my bubbas is back with the rest of the girls in the cage after a lovely game of human and rat lol and poor glyn ending up being bitten badly by her trying to get her back into the cage. Talk aobutplay peek a boo and thenrun fr cover lol she is very good at that game lol but the bonding pouch hung over water bottle so she couldnt see him approach worked in the end even if he did end up bleeding badly, little minx wouldnt go into the cage even with the door beign left open and the other girls distracted by us both. HOwever Blaze it turned out it wasnt Sarah but as they are twins it can be hard to tell who was who unless they were side by side as SArah would climb onto my hand and blaze wouldnt,adn the one stillin the cage coem to me to come out still so must be Sarah lol. WEll Blaze is still awol with no sign of her anywhere and not one of the cats has shwon any interest in any of the sides etc to a give a hint of where she may be hiding and Dante would of certain my hunted her if he smelt her at all but not even droppings in a different place than normal so i hav eno idea what has happened to her as no sign of a carcass or blood in the old cage at all which is where she would of died if she has but i am at a loss as to what has happened to her. I have sifted through all the substrate when emptying he cage and no sign of blood anywhere.


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## sammy1969

ami_j said:


> hopefully
> 
> ooh you will need to post pics


Ihave pics of new cage set up lol just havent gotten round o uploading them yet as not been in for past two days as been helping my sister with some forms lol I will try to get them uploaded etiher tomorrow evening or sunday I promise


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## BMo1979

At least some good news, Sammy, apart from Glyn getting bitten and Blaze still missing. Hopefully she'll follow Topaz' example and tips up soon.

P.S.: Took me ages to write this short paragraph, cos I've got Nibbles who keeps jumping on the keyboard for attention. 
Made another vet appointment for tomorrow night, cos Treacle's "clucking" has returned. Maybe cos it'll be later on in the day as opposed to in the morning the vet will be able to hear something. She still seems fine other than that.


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## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> At least some good news, Sammy, apart from Glyn getting bitten and Blaze still missing. Hopefully she'll follow Topaz' example and tips up soon.
> 
> P.S.: Took me ages to write this short paragraph, cos I've got Nibbles who keeps jumping on the keyboard for attention.
> Made another vet appointment for tomorrow night, cos Treacle's "clucking" has returned. Maybe cos it'll be later on in the day as opposed to in the morning the vet will be able to hear something. She still seems fine other than that.


If shes well in every other way I really dont think I would take her again... shes probably just chattering away  if she was sneezy or wheezy then i would


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## sammy1969

Still no sign of Blaze Sarahs twin sister which is why i get them confused and I am begining to loose hope i will ever find her. NOt one of the cats has acted like they have smelt her or seen her out but there was no sign at all of any carcass in the substrate of the cage that i could make out no sign of blood at all so I am at a loss


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## feorag

I still find this very odd Sammy. When I tried to introduce the rats and Dougal bit Kenzie on the nose the inside of the box where he was hiding had blood smears inside it and there was blood on the cardboard substrate - I find it incredibly hard to believe that a rat could die, or be killed and all the other rats clean up the rat and all the blood to such an extent that there isn't any blood anywhere to be seen! She must have escaped.

Maybe you should make a trap?? She might have decided that she's found somewhere where she feels safer and is getting food from other sources (if none is missing from the open cage) maybe dog food/cat food??


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## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> If shes well in every other way I really dont think I would take her again... shes probably just chattering away  if she was sneezy or wheezy then i would


I went to the appointment tonight, because Dusty, the little one had started sneezing a lot this morning and one of her eyes were quite sticky this morning. 
Treacle actually made that clucking noise while the vet examined Dusty, so she put them on a 4 day course of Baytril (preventive). But she too said (it was a different vet from last time) that they all look really healthy, lively and happy, so if Treacle still makes funny noises after the medication, it is very likely just one of her quirks. 

P.S.: Got my fingers crossed for the poor pup (Collie) that was brought in at the same time. He had ran away and was found in the neighbour's garden. Looks like he's been knocked down by a car, cos one of his hind legs was just hanging down and he couldn't walk on it at all :-(.


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## sammy1969

I know what you mean Eileen it is a conundrum. I kow in the past there has always been some form of evidence thata furry has past even if the others in a cage have cleaned up but htere is literally nothing and knowing Dante like i do if hehad come across her or loki had come across her out of the cage they would of bought her to me be it alive or dead but not one of the cats is showing any interest that there is a rat on the loose which they did when topaz was free.SHe had hidden herself quite well but we had to remove the cats from the front room and shut the door so they couldnt keep harrasing her under the units. I am still hoping deep down she will show up but my brain says I am not going to find her alive at least and I found out today there is a whole in my bathroom that leads to the main down pipe for the block so she could of got throuht there and gotten into someone elses flats so have warned the neighbours if they see her to let me know just incase she has managed to climb up the pipe.I have set up a trap and left the other cage open with food in it but so far the food hasnt been touched but she could have another source as the shaws kick out alot of food as does Rus the gerbil so she could be eating that and if she is no longer in the front room the cat bowls always have food in them and the bin the dog food is kept in doesnt have a lid so she could get food from those two places as well although i doubt she would go near the cat bowls, I just want to find her and know she is safe.


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## ami_j

New pics of the Gingers :flrt:
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...ic-seven-kitsune-ginger-baby.html#post9982995


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## sammy1969

THey are so cute I am going to steal them from you lol


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## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> THey are so cute I am going to steal them from you lol


Dont think so :lol2:


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## sammy1969

I do lol


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## BMo1979

Are your rats thieves, too?
Mine steal about anything that isn't bolted down when they're on free play: pen lids, bottle lids, papers, my OH's cigarette filters, etc.
I'm constantly picking various items out of their cage. Tonight I caught the "little" one, Dusty, trying to leg it with an A4 sized letter...
They normally get caught out when they all of a sudden rush back into their cage, looking really pleased with themselves and hide behind their house, lol.


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## sammy1969

Yep mine will steal fried eggs and chips if given half the chance when they are out lol as well as filters anything they can get their tiny hands on and like yours they will run and try to hide with thestolen contraband


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## BMo1979

It's the way they look when they got something, that makes me laugh: All proud and pleased with themselves. But they seem to know exactly that they're not allowed to have it, lol.

They're all in scavenging mode anyway, because the antibiotics have caused slightly loose stool (not diarrhea, just a bit looser than usual) so they're on rat food only until it goes back to normal. Normally they would get their treat after free play (they all line up for it at the cage door), but I'd rather not put any strain on their tummies.


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## feorag

I've lost the odd square of chocolate when i've been sitting on the settee eating a bar when they've been on the settee with me.

I tear up pieces of paper and lie them around the room so they can 'pinch' them here is Angus (sadly long gone now) who was very keen on pinching paper and when he ran out, he found my bank statement and pinched that, as you can see in the second video.

Angus, my berkshire rat nest building - YouTube

Angus nest building - part 2 - YouTube

And Wee Jeemy, also long gone managed to pinch a carrier bag full of fleece cutting that I give them bits of when I clean out their cage - again he was defeated trying to get the back in his cage - sadly his technique was all wrong! :lol2:

Wee Jeemy attempts the impossible - YouTube


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## sammy1969

THey do look so chuffed with themselves dont they I think watching my last set of girls not the ones i have now Gracewing and her sister when they attempted to steal stuff was hysterical at times. I was sat eating a fry up one night I had a jumbo egg on my plate as well as sausage bacon etc but got distracted for a few seconds only to feel something warm and greasy hit my leg, I was wearing a skirt at the time, and looked down to see Grace trying her hardest to run off with my fried egg which was bigger than she was and take it back to her bed on the sofa lol. She did make it eventually with help from her sister and to see the both of them one either side of the egg running away was jsut so funny that i allowed them to keep it, I am just glad it hadn't been any fo the other stuff one the plate like the fresh sausages i had been looking forward to as they had been hand made by my nan and now i dont get to have them at all


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## feorag

I love critters that pinch! They are so optimistic most of the time!


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## BMo1979

Just watched your videos. Awww! :flrt: Wee Jeemy was gorgeous!
Lol, Nibbles is showing her "best side" tonight, trying to dive head first into my coffee. No chance!

I just put a newspaper on the desk to let them rip it up and take into their house. No point though as one (aka Dusty) takes it in and builds a nest and the other (Nibbles) pushes it all back out. She's a funny one: Prefers to sleep on the bare plastic cage floor. Treacle just follows the majority.


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## feorag

thank you! Wee Jeemy was a special rat and I still miss him, he was a nest building obsessive. Whenever I buy a giant box of cereal I open it by cutting the box in half across the middle and give the rats half a box at a time. Jeemy would spend absolutely hours chewing that box up into small pieces and carrying them into his igloo. Dougal never nest built, although since I've bought 2 new youngsters and he's been relegated to the smaller spare cage he's built a nest in his hammock.


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## feorag

Well, what an adventurous night my ratty chappies have had tonight!

Skye, my GSD has always fixated on the rats and used to sit for ages watching them, but over the last year he hasn't bothered as much, but I bought 2 new rats about 3 weeks ago and they're very active at this age, compared to the older boys, so his fixation is back.

Unfortunately my first attempt to introduce Archie & Kenzie to my surviving Dougal went well until they were finally put in a cage together at which point Dougal bit Kenzie's nose very badly leaving it nearly hanging off! :gasp: He had already bitten his hindfoot, when Kenzie climbed on top of his cage during an escape bid.

So for the moment Dougal is in the smaller cage cos it has wider spaced bars and the babies can get out the gap. Yesterday I put him on the floor alongside their cage (he's been on top of it since we put him in that cage) to start introducing again.

Anyway, Skye has been 'on duty' in front of the cage all blooming night, staring. A few minutes ago I watched him and Dougal had come onto the shelf right in the corner of the cage and Skye went right up to the bars so they were really nose to nose. I thought "ah isn't that cute" :flrt: and was just about to pick up the camera when Dougal decided enough was enough and the paws came out and he boxed Skye right on the nose - I've never seen Skye move so quickly! :roll2: PMSL!!!

Good old Dougal! :2thumb:

Only about 15 minutes later I was sitting watch BGT when I heard a squeak and looked over and Kamikaze Kenzie was at it again! :roll:

*ONE - *yes only *ONE!!! *bar of the large cage has detached at one end because of rust and he'd only managed in his desperation to get to Dougal to squeeze through the gap and was hanging half in and half out of this tiny gap, *but *his front feet were on Dougal's cage bars and Dougal must have nipped him! *AND *when I picked him out to check him over, I discovered that he's been bitten on the end of his tail as well!

I tell you that rat doesn't know how to take a hint! :roll:


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well, what an adventurous night my ratty chappies have had tonight!
> 
> Skye, my GSD has always fixated on the rats and used to sit for ages watching them, but over the last year he hasn't bothered as much, but I bought 2 new rats about 3 weeks ago and they're very active at this age, compared to the older boys, so his fixation is back.
> 
> Unfortunately my first attempt to introduce Archie & Kenzie to my surviving Dougal went well until they were finally put in a cage together at which point Dougal bit Kenzie's nose very badly leaving it nearly hanging off! :gasp: He had already bitten his hindfoot, when Kenzie climbed on top of his cage during an escape bid.
> 
> So for the moment Dougal is in the smaller cage cos it has wider spaced bars and the babies can get out the gap. Yesterday I put him on the floor alongside their cage (he's been on top of it since we put him in that cage) to start introducing again.
> 
> Anyway, Skye has been 'on duty' in front of the cage all blooming night, staring. A few minutes ago I watched him and Dougal had come onto the shelf right in the corner of the cage and Skye went right up to the bars so they were really nose to nose. I thought "ah isn't that cute" :flrt: and was just about to pick up the camera when Dougal decided enough was enough and the paws came out and he boxed Skye right on the nose - I've never seen Skye move so quickly! :roll2: PMSL!!!
> 
> Good old Dougal! :2thumb:
> 
> Only about 15 minutes later I was sitting watch BGT when I heard a squeak and looked over and Kamikaze Kenzie was at it again! :roll:
> 
> *ONE - *yes only *ONE!!! *bar of the large cage has detached at one end because of rust and he'd only managed in his desperation to get to Dougal to squeeze through the gap and was hanging half in and half out of this tiny gap, *but *his front feet were on Dougal's cage bars and Dougal must have nipped him! *AND *when I picked him out to check him over, I discovered that he's been bitten on the end of his tail as well!
> 
> I tell you that rat doesn't know how to take a hint! :roll:


Oh dear, he is definately making things difficult, mine would probably nip cagemates feet if they were walking about on the bars


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## feorag

Well that's how he ended up with the fat hindfoot when he escaped out of the cat carrier - and then when Dougal was on top of their cage, he climbed up on top of the big cage and had his forefeet on the bars of Dougal's cage and Dougal nearly bit one of his front toes off! So when you add in the nose nearly ripped of and the top lip bite just before the nose ripping job , you'd think he'd be avoiding Dougal instead of wanting to be in his face all the time.

He really is Kamikaze Kenzie!! :roll:


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## BMo1979

Wow, sounds like you've got your hands full. Kenzie reminds me of a Labrador that wouldn't get the hint despite my dog's clear signals (clearest one being one quick flip on the back) that contact was undesired. Some animals seem to have masochistic tendencies. 

My girls nip each other, too, when they climb on top of the cage, but never draw any blood.
The bite in the nose sounds bad, though. Do you think the boys will eventually get along? Sorry, I've got no experience in rat on rat aggression, the girls were very easy to introduce and got on like a house on fire from the word "go".

Your GSD Skye sounds just like my Trigger. He's still quite fixated on the rats, especially when they play wild chasing games. Once their out and I'm holding them, he's fine to sniff them and leaves them alone and vice a versa (spelling?). 
We had a scary moment when we first got Nibbles and she was out on the couch. She decided to make a dash for it and escaped my husband's and my hands. Trigger jumped forward and tried to grab her. He was actually jsut trying to help, cos he didn't snap just grabbed (or tried to), but he's a large dog with large jaws... Since that time he has to stay at a certain distance when they're out and he seems happy enough just to watch them.
He gets on best with Nibbles, probably cos she's confident and sniffs and licks his nose through the cage. Dusty couldn't care less about him and just ignores him, but Treacle and Trigger clash. Everytime he goes near the cage she jumps at the bar and snaps, which then he tries to retaliate. The first time I've witnessed it you could actually hear her teeth snap together and she was stood, holding the bars baring her teeth at him for ages afterwards. I know she's probably just very scared of him and defends her home. When I hold her, again there are no problems.


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## feorag

I've only introduced rats once before - that was when I introduced Dougal and Wee Jeemy to Angus and Hamish and that went really without a hitch. there was a bit of argy-bargy went on about 6 months later between the 4 of them and I had Dougal and Wee Jeemy neutered (Angus & Hamish weren't) and then re-introduced them when the operation scars had healed and no probems!

So I'm not that experienced in introducing rats.

If one of ours made a dash for it and skye intervened I don't think it would be to save them, to be honest! :sad: He has a very high prey drive and I don't trust him. The cats on the other hand take no notice of them at all.


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## BMo1979

feorag said:


> If one of ours made a dash for it and skye intervened I don't think it would be to save them, to be honest! :sad: He has a very high prey drive and I don't trust him. The cats on the other hand take no notice of them at all.


The cats I had as a child would try to hunt them. 
Our dog seems to enjoy the chase rather than the catch. He goes after things but even when he has them cornered, he lets them escape. It's funny because he is not interested in the snakes. He just sniffs them and leaves them be (might be an instinct thing, that snakes are potentially dangerous to him).


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## feorag

Unfortunately Skye fixates on everything that moves! :roll:

Our cats on the other hand are used to little furry critters flying around the house and know they are 'protected' so they mustn't touch them. Here's Luna, my siamese, sadly gone now :sad: being jumped on by a baby squirrel on its way from the back of the settee to climb up the curtains! :lol:


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## ami_j

some pics from yesterday


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## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> image


How cute is this one??? The face expression is just so :flrt:


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## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> How cute is this one??? The face expression is just so :flrt:


:lol2: shes like " im trying to clean myself in peace go away"


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## BMo1979

Definitely! Bl...y humans and their cameras.


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## feorag

I love that first photo - there's something about the shape of her that made something melt inside me! :flrt:

Here is Archie, looking comfy in the middle layer of the honeycomb hammock












And Kenzie in the bottom


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> I love that first photo - there's something about the shape of her that made something melt inside me! :flrt:
> 
> Here is Archie, looking comfy in the middle layer of the honeycomb hammock
> 
> 
> image
> 
> 
> And Kenzie in the bottom
> 
> image


They are right lil chubsters atm :lol2: i love her tiny teefs :flrt:
Lovely pics of your boys Eileen  Loving the rexy boys whisker


----------



## feorag

:lol2: Proper curlies they are.

And the scab has fallen off Kenzie's nose and it's not looking too bad underneath - it was a helluva mess!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> :lol2: Proper curlies they are.
> 
> And the scab has fallen off Kenzie's nose and it's not looking too bad underneath - it was a helluva mess!


I need me a rexy :lol2:

Bless him, hope it keeps healing well, he has certainly been in the wars


----------



## ami_j

got my order from rat rations today lots of lovely goodies for my lot : victory:


----------



## feorag

What are those flat white seeds at the bottom left of the photograph, Jai?


----------



## sammy1969

THey look like they may be pumpkin seeds Eileen


----------



## feorag

Aha - that's what they look like in the pod then?? I'm afraid I've only ever bought them ready to eat and they don't look like that! :blush:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> What are those flat white seeds at the bottom left of the photograph, Jai?


pumpkin seeds


----------



## feorag

Cross posted - thanks.

They are in Alison's food that I buy ready made up, but I'd no idea what they were due to only ever seeing the green things inside them! :blush:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Cross posted - thanks.
> 
> They are in Alison's food that I buy ready made up, but I'd no idea what they were due to only ever seeing the green things inside them! :blush:


:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Cross posted - thanks.
> 
> They are in Alison's food that I buy ready made up, but I'd no idea what they were due to only ever seeing the green things inside them! :blush:


have you read her book, the scuttling gourmet? highly recomend it


----------



## feorag

Yes, I bought a pdf format copy directly from her through her website before I got my boys. Toyah and Alison have known each other for years and feed a very similar diet, although they don't always agree on everything and when I found out that Alison would sell it to me made up, rather than buying the 'straights' from her and adding my own bits, I decided it just made life easier, and Lord knows I'm anything for an easy life!

Which loosely translates to being lazy! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Yes, I bought a pdf format copy directly from her through her website before I got my boys. Toyah and Alison have known each other for years and feed a very similar diet, although they don't always agree on everything and when I found out that Alison would sell it to me made up, rather than buying the 'straights' from her and adding my own bits, I decided it just made life easier, and Lord knows I'm anything for an easy life!
> 
> Which loosely translates to being lazy! :lol2:


yeah buying it direct will be easier  
Toyah has gorgeous rats


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> yeah buying it direct will be easier
> Toyah has gorgeous rats


And probably cheaper, cos Alison's charges are very reasonable.

Toyah does and now she's specialising in some lovely colours. We've been friends for many years now as she came to me for a breeding Somali years ago, so whenever I was up in Scotland visiting Iain, I always used to drive over for the evening and get my 'rat fix', so it was easy to get Angus & Hamish from her, as I collected them the night before I came home and then drove home with them.

Now, courtesy of Skye, I'm never up there. I did e-mail her to ask if she had any babies when Wee Jeemy died, but got no reply, which is very unusual for her.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> And probably cheaper, cos Alison's charges are very reasonable.
> 
> Toyah does and now she's specialising in some lovely colours. We've been friends for many years now as she came to me for a breeding Somali years ago, so whenever I was up in Scotland visiting Iain, I always used to drive over for the evening and get my 'rat fix', so it was easy to get Angus & Hamish from her, as I collected them the night before I came home and then drove home with them.
> 
> Now, courtesy of Skye, I'm never up there. I did e-mail her to ask if she had any babies when Wee Jeemy died, but got no reply, which is very unusual for her.


I should probably work out what my mix is costing :lol2: I do it buy volume not weight though


----------



## feorag

I just thought with 2 rats I couldn't buy in bulk and when Alison said she had some made up which I could buy it's so much simpler, cos I don't have to think. She lives not much more than a mile from where Barry works and it's on his way home, so he just calls in and collects it on his way home. I buy 10 kilo at a time and it works for me! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

Peafishing! 
























[imghttps://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/36492_10150815662511771_517041770_9976367_1515496618_n.jpg[/img]


----------



## feorag

I love watching mine pea fishing! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I love watching mine pea fishing! :2thumb:


its so cute isnt it :flrt: hoping that it is helping to keep them cool!


----------



## BMo1979

Mine played that today, too. It's so cute. The way they shake their little hands to dry them off...:lol2:.
Dusty and Treacle are quite good at it, especially Dusty. She hits the water with her paws so the peas float to the surface and then grabs them. 
Only problem was that Nibbles got frustrated cos she didn't want to dip her nose in, so she just tipped the whole bowl over and I had to change their bedding. She's still a menace (but I love her)!

P.S.: Treacle thankfully has stopped breathing funny. During the course of antibiotics it got that noisy, that you could hear it over the TV. 2 days after the medication had run out and I was just about to book another vet's appointment it just stopped like that. She's 100% fine now and is getting nearly as cheeky as Nibbles.


----------



## sammy1969

When it comes to pea fishing are they frozen or what never really done this with my rats and would love to watch them but have no idea what sort of stuff i can do it with ie frozen mix veg etc and is there anything they arenot allowed to have to do it with


----------



## ami_j

yup frozen peas there was also green beans and broccoli in there


----------



## sammy1969

Can they have carrots and beans as in runner or broad jsut so i dont poison them lol i have a bag of mixed veg that has cauli brocolli peas and carrots willtake out the cauli but can they hve the rest as they will probably enjoy the cold water etc as my place is like and oven just now even with ceiling fans going full blast and windows open.


----------



## BMo1979

Same here with the heat. Poor ratties are taking turns in who can stretch out and sleep outside their houses. No body contact allowed at the moment, lol, it's too hot.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Can they have carrots and beans as in runner or broad jsut so i dont poison them lol i have a bag of mixed veg that has cauli brocolli peas and carrots willtake out the cauli but can they hve the rest as they will probably enjoy the cold water etc as my place is like and oven just now even with ceiling fans going full blast and windows open.


if you go on fancyrats and articles theres a list of what they can have, on my phone so cant link you


----------



## ami_j

Aeon giving Seven a cuddle


----------



## Rach1

Quick question guys..
Any food suggestions for fattening up my ladies!
I feed them two bowls of food a day plus treats every other day or veg etc.
But I can't seem to get them to keep the weight on.
All are lively and full of beans and there are no major food fights going on so I k ow they ain't starving... Should I be worried?
All are healthy and bright eyed etc...
I suppose it's better than them all being obese!
Lol


----------



## feorag

More Carbs?? Pasta, rice, potatoes???


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Quick question guys..
> Any food suggestions for fattening up my ladies!
> I feed them two bowls of food a day plus treats every other day or veg etc.
> But I can't seem to get them to keep the weight on.
> All are lively and full of beans and there are no major food fights going on so I k ow they ain't starving... Should I be worried?
> All are healthy and bright eyed etc...
> I suppose it's better than them all being obese!
> Lol


Have a look at their tails, if they are nice and round i wouldnt worry


----------



## Rach1

Thanks...
I think it may just be that they are super active!
They are all still young all under a year... Do still at that super duper fast stage.
I'll try adding a bit more pasta to their diet as we have pasta a lot so it's easy enough.
I'll Also check their tails ... Although from a quick look just now all seems well.


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Thanks...
> I think it may just be that they are super active!
> They are all still young all under a year... Do still at that super duper fast stage.
> I'll try adding a bit more pasta to their diet as we have pasta a lot so it's easy enough.
> I'll Also check their tails ... Although from a quick look just now all seems well.


If they have round tails I would leave it as it is. Does are mega active and should be quite long looking. What food are they having?


----------



## sammy1969

I may have my blue dumbo girls at last not sure yet stillt ryingto get it sorted ot but fingers crossed in a few weeks they may be here YAY


----------



## BMo1979

Took some more pictures of the girls.

Nibbles and Treacle chilling on their platform
















Meanwhile Dusty takes the opportunity to raid the food bowl
















(Don't ask about the newspaper in the food bowl. That's Dusty and Treacle. They always do that!)

Nibbles and Dusty doing what they do best: Stealing! In this case an ice lolly stick.









How cute is that???








Dusty on a hot day









And so he doesn't feel left out. Trigger, with his trademark stupid look


----------



## feorag

Lovely photos and Trigger is gorgeous.

When I'm making my hammocks and pouches I save all the offcuts of fleece which I cut into strips and give my rats. Most of them end up in their 'wasps nest', igloo or sputnik, but inevitably there are always a few of them in the food hopper!


----------



## BMo1979

Well, Dusty and Treacle always collect newspaper when they're out and they always put it in their food bowls, lol. Strange creatures! Good thing is they also do it with food, which I sometimes let them scavenge.
Nibbles isn't too keen on nesting material, so when the other two get into their collecting rage, she always sits in front of the pile, looking as if to say "WTF???".


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Took some more pictures of the girls.
> 
> Nibbles and Treacle chilling on their platform
> image
> image
> Meanwhile Dusty takes the opportunity to raid the food bowl
> image
> image
> (Don't ask about the newspaper in the food bowl. That's Dusty and Treacle. They always do that!)
> 
> Nibbles and Dusty doing what they do best: Stealing! In this case an ice lolly stick.
> image
> 
> How cute is that???
> image
> Dusty on a hot day
> image
> 
> And so he doesn't feel left out. Trigger, with his trademark stupid look
> image


gorgeous pics:flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

Really chuffed tonight:flrt:.

While playing on the computer desk, Nibbles slipped and fell down the back of it (luckily down the curtain which broke her fall). 
At first I hadn't even realised she had fallen, cos I hadn't seen her climbing on the printer and Treacle was sitting on it, but when I saw she wasn't in the cage or anywhere else, I went straight underneath the desk to find her.

I put my hands down and called her and to my great joy she came to me straight away, crawled on my hand and up my shoulder. I was so proud of her being such a good girl.
She's fine by the way, didn't hurt herself.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Really chuffed tonight:flrt:.
> 
> While playing on the computer desk, Nibbles slipped and fell down the back of it (luckily down the curtain which broke her fall).
> At first I hadn't even realised she had fallen, cos I hadn't seen her climbing on the printer and Treacle was sitting on it, but when I saw she wasn't in the cage or anywhere else, I went straight underneath the desk to find her.
> 
> I put my hands down and called her and to my great joy she came to me straight away, crawled on my hand and up my shoulder. I was so proud of her being such a good girl.
> She's fine by the way, didn't hurt herself.


aww bless her, glad she isnt hurt :flrt:


----------



## sammy1969

My girls have had a fab time today lol unrolling half a toilet roll and trying to make it fit inside their cube and hammock or whats left of it lol. Went to see just how much they had managed to fit, into both to find inside the lining of the hammock a huge mound of food lol stocked up for times of famine lol their food bowls are all completely empty ( they have 3) so they have obviously taken it all and stored it. They still have about a quarter of the roll left to try and fill their toys with lol,but it was fun to watch them literally unroll it and drag it all round the cage before finally depositing it into either material home.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> My girls have had a fab time today lol unrolling half a toilet roll and trying to make it fit inside their cube and hammock or whats left of it lol. Went to see just how much they had managed to fit, into both to find inside the lining of the hammock a huge mound of food lol stocked up for times of famine lol their food bowls are all completely empty ( they have 3) so they have obviously taken it all and stored it. They still have about a quarter of the roll left to try and fill their toys with lol,but it was fun to watch them literally unroll it and drag it all round the cage before finally depositing it into either material home.


Haha sounds fun  might buy mine a box of tissues at some point

and also

MORE PICS!!!!
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...2-ratty-pics-very-pic-heavy.html#post10114982


----------



## ami_j

Made this for Old man Quinn to encourage him to eat more









Its a mix of peas, broccoli, green beans, carrot, potato, a clove of garlic and curly kale. I also added cooked pearl barley too it. 










Doesnt look that nice but it went down a treat :2thumb:


----------



## feorag

:hmm: I don't know, I reckon I could eat that with a plate of fish & chips very easily!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> :hmm: I don't know, I reckon I could eat that with a plate of fish & chips very easily!


I tried a bit the peas were definately a strong taste influence in it...might make it again but with salt to taste as a soup :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

Interesting behaviour from the girls this morning: There seems to be some kind of rank squabbling going on between Dusty and Treacle. Nibbles is still very much established as the boss (we call her the Godmother, because she normally sits on her platform overseeing her subjects with her eyes half shut.... that, and when she rolls herself up she does resemble Marlon Brando in his later days, lol).
Anyway, this morning Treacle went into the bottom house and next thing was her and Dusty come rolling out, fur flying, Treacle screaming. She ended up on her back (she actually had a bit of Dusty's fur stuck on her snout) as she always does and Dusty would not let her move for a good 30 seconds (seemed much longer). Dusty kept lowering her head on Treacle, it nearly looked like she was falling asleep on top of her.
After that Dusty walked away and Treacle followed her everywhere, grovelling, i.e. head down, "flat" position, waiting to be groomed, but for the first couple of minutes, every time Treacle went near her, Dusty would go on her hind legs, puff up and bare her teeth at her. Then she just started grooming Treacle, accepting her submission.
Nibbles ended up coming downstairs and their behaviour stopped. They all went into the bottom house together, but Dusty kept trying to push Treacle out. Nibbles was having none of that (she wanted to groom Treacle) and now Dusty looks like she's sulking in the house on the platform. 
It was quite fascinating to watch the body language and how clear they communicate. Neither one got hurt, bar some fur loss and they're all fine with each other now.


----------



## feorag

I'm a very optimistic rat owner today, cos I finally think I'm going to get my boys together!

For the last 2 days I've taken them upstairs, bathed them and let them run free in the bathroom for almost an hour with me supervising and things have gone really well.

Last night after free roaming I brought them downstairs and put them in a big plastic storage box we have which is too high for them to jump out of and left them in there together for a few hours without any problems.

As a final security though, I put them back in their own cages for the night.

Today I've cleaned out the small cage which had Dougal in residence and totally disinifected it and it's been out in the garden for the last 2 hours. Then i took the boys upstairs into the bathroom. This time, no bathing -I just tipped the young ones out of their 'toilet igloo' where they were when I took them out of the cage and Dougal out of the carrier where he'd been while I cleaned the cage and there was no aggression at all, even though there would be different smells. Now they're all 3 back in the plastic box, where I can see Dougal and Kenzie indulging in mutual grooming (which is very reassuring as they've been the problem previously) while I reassemble the smaller cage, where I intend to leave them until Friday so that I can go away on holiday secure in the knowledge that they will be able to go back in the big cage and be happy together.

So far ....................................... so good!! :2thumb:


----------



## sammy1969

Sounds really promising Eileen fingers crossed that it all works out for you but seems like Dougal has finally accepted Kenzie at last YAY. 
I had to laugh last night, I decided i fancied a treat so went and got some fruit bread with peanut butter on it. well the result of that was 6 very interested girls all at the side of the cage looking at me so decided they could try it. WEll i can honestly say fruit bread +peanut butter = 6 very happy rats as well as 5 happ cats and two happy dogs asthey each had to have a tiny titbit of it as a slice and one very hungry human who had lost both slices to the animals lol


----------



## feorag

Well they're finally all in the small cage, after sleeping the entire afternoon in a lovely fluffy pile.

We've had a couple of altercations so far. Dougal had Archie pinned in the open flat hammock and he was squealing, so I clapped my hands and Archie escpated, then the next minute Kenzie and Dougal were at it!

Then they ended up with Dougal on the lower shelf like garding the ladder and Kenzie and Archie both squashed in the bottom corner.

Every time any of the moved I was a nervous wreck, so I did what was suggested in that article you sent me Jaime and I left the room and went to prepare the tea.

When I came back in they were all in the same position, but then Dougal went down onto the floor and Kenzie kind of sidled over to him to go underneath and again I was a nervous wreck, cos Dougal fluffed up and then went back up the ladder, but he's now come downstairs and has joined them in the pile of paper bedding on the floor, so I'm going out into the kitchen again, cos I'm panicking already!!! :roll:

ETA: Back again and they're all lying on the floor, Archie is squashed in the corner, Kenzie is against the side of the base and Dougal is grooming himself slap in the middle, so we'll see what happens. :gasp:

Sammy whenever I have toast, whether it's peanut butter, banana or Marmite (my 3 favourite things on toast) I always cut a length off the end and divide it into 3 for my boys! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well they're finally all in the small cage, after sleeping the entire afternoon in a lovely fluffy pile.
> 
> We've had a couple of altercations so far. Dougal had Archie pinned in the open flat hammock and he was squealing, so I clapped my hands and Archie escpated, then the next minute Kenzie and Dougal were at it!
> 
> Then they ended up with Dougal on the lower shelf like garding the ladder and Kenzie and Archie both squashed in the bottom corner.
> 
> Every time any of the moved I was a nervous wreck, so I did what was suggested in that article you sent me Jaime and I left the room and went to prepare the tea.
> 
> When I came back in they were all in the same position, but then Dougal went down onto the floor and Kenzie kind of sidled over to him to go underneath and again I was a nervous wreck, cos Dougal fluffed up and then went back up the ladder, but he's now come downstairs and has joined them in the pile of paper bedding on the floor, so I'm going out into the kitchen again, cos I'm panicking already!!! :roll:
> 
> ETA: Back again and they're all lying on the floor, Archie is squashed in the corner, Kenzie is against the side of the base and Dougal is grooming himself slap in the middle, so we'll see what happens. :gasp:
> 
> Sammy whenever I have toast, whether it's peanut butter, banana or Marmite (my 3 favourite things on toast) I always cut a length off the end and divide it into 3 for my boys! :2thumb:


Excellent news there Eileen :2thumb:

The pinning and a bit of squealing is normal, the general rule is no blood no foul, sounds like they are working on a hierachy. All very good, if they are sleeping together and grooming.


----------



## feorag

Well at the minute Dougal is in the big open hammock, Kenzie is down on the floor in the 'nest' and Archie, who had another set-to with Dougal before has been stuck, static on the top shelf, but has just crawled into a little corner hammock I put up there. They have 3 hammocks, 2 litter trays and a pile of nesting paper on the floor, so plenty places to go and be on their own, but nowhere to hide in, so we'll see how it goes.

I'm still panicking every time I see Dougal go anywhere near them, but we'll see. Now Archie has gone down on the floor into his original corner and kenzie is mooching around - Dougal is still in his hammock. 

It's definitely the case that Archie would prefer to avoid Dougal and Dougal knows this, so maybe feels he can get the better of him, whereas Kenzie continues to be trying to challenge him. He just cannot ignore him.

He's just gone up onto dougal's hammock and sat staring at him, then walked past him into the other hammock. Dougal then followed him and then went back into his hammock and the 2 youngster and now dow on the floor boxing and Archie is actually chasing Kenzie trying to mount him. :roll:


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Interesting behaviour from the girls this morning: There seems to be some kind of rank squabbling going on between Dusty and Treacle. Nibbles is still very much established as the boss (we call her the Godmother, because she normally sits on her platform overseeing her subjects with her eyes half shut.... that, and when she rolls herself up she does resemble Marlon Brando in his later days, lol).
> Anyway, this morning Treacle went into the bottom house and next thing was her and Dusty come rolling out, fur flying, Treacle screaming. She ended up on her back (she actually had a bit of Dusty's fur stuck on her snout) as she always does and Dusty would not let her move for a good 30 seconds (seemed much longer). Dusty kept lowering her head on Treacle, it nearly looked like she was falling asleep on top of her.
> After that Dusty walked away and Treacle followed her everywhere, grovelling, i.e. head down, "flat" position, waiting to be groomed, but for the first couple of minutes, every time Treacle went near her, Dusty would go on her hind legs, puff up and bare her teeth at her. Then she just started grooming Treacle, accepting her submission.
> Nibbles ended up coming downstairs and their behaviour stopped. They all went into the bottom house together, but Dusty kept trying to push Treacle out. Nibbles was having none of that (she wanted to groom Treacle) and now Dusty looks like she's sulking in the house on the platform.
> It was quite fascinating to watch the body language and how clear they communicate. Neither one got hurt, bar some fur loss and they're all fine with each other now.



Rat behaviour is fascinating, I love watching my girl group of 6 in action. It is especially interesting at the moment as the ginger girls are finding their feet- They flip Luna easily with little resistance, skimishes with Aeon can go either way but they won't attempt it with Pink. They will try mounting her when playing or in season but she accepts their sillyness with patience. I'm pretty sure she is the alpha rat, often the problems occur with the seconds in command jostling for posistion. I'm certainly seeing it and hoping it calms down soon.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well at the minute Dougal is in the big open hammock, Kenzie is down on the floor in the 'nest' and Archie, who had another set-to with Dougal before has been stuck, static on the top shelf, but has just crawled into a little corner hammock I put up there. They have 3 hammocks, 2 litter trays and a pile of nesting paper on the floor, so plenty places to go and be on their own, but nowhere to hide in, so we'll see how it goes.
> 
> I'm still panicking every time I see Dougal go anywhere near them, but we'll see. Now Archie has gone down on the floor into his original corner and kenzie is mooching around - Dougal is still in his hammock.
> 
> It's definitely the case that Archie would prefer to avoid Dougal and Dougal knows this, so maybe feels he can get the better of him, whereas Kenzie continues to be trying to challenge him. He just cannot ignore him.
> 
> He's just gone up onto dougal's hammock and sat staring at him, then walked past him into the other hammock. Dougal then followed him and then went back into his hammock and the 2 youngster and now dow ont he floor boxing and Archie is actually chasing Kenzie trying to mount him. :roll:


:lol2:men eh ...nothing but trouble


----------



## feorag

It's fascinating. I never had a problem introducing Dougal and Wee Jeemy to Angus and Hamish and I never had any problems until the 2 youngster started to 'feel their ball's' as you might say and got a bit stroppy, so I had them both neutered and re-introduced them exactly as I had previously and that was it. To be totally honest, I couldn't really have told you who was alpha rat out of the 4 of them, in the same way as I never could tell who was alpha between Angus and Hamish.

Dougal went down on the floor 5 minutes ago and Archie was running behind him and mounting him and both boys had him a bit cornered and little wee tooty Archie managed to knock him over onto his back. So there was a lot of boxing and posturing and turning sideways, but no squeaking or attacking. Dougal then got himself something to eat and is back up on the 'top floor' in the corner hammock munching and the 2 boys are eating downstairs.

So I'm thinking they're going to be left to get on with it - they're right beside me on the floor, but I'm definitely going to leave them all together tonight and hope everything is OK in the morning.

No prizes for guessing that Barry will be the first into the living room tomorrow. 

So I'm thinking


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> It's fascinating. I never had a problem introducing Dougal and Wee Jeemy to Angus and Hamish and I never had any problems until the 2 youngster started to 'feel their ball's' as you might say and got a bit stroppy, so I had them both neutered and re-introduced them exactly as I had previously and that was it. To be totally honest, I couldn't really have told you who was alpha rat out of the 4 of them, in the same way as I never could tell who was alpha between Angus and Hamish.
> 
> Dougal went down on the floor 5 minutes ago and Archie was running behind him and mounting him and both boys had him a bit cornered and little wee tooty Archie managed to knock him over onto his back. So there was a lot of boxing and posturing and turning sideways, but no squeaking or attacking. Dougal then got himself something to eat and is back up on the 'top floor' in the corner hammock munching and the 2 boys are eating downstairs.
> 
> So I'm thinking they're going to be left to get on with it - they're right beside me on the floor, but I'm definitely going to leave them all together tonight and hope everything is OK in the morning.
> 
> No prizes for guessing that Barry will be the first into the living room tomorrow.
> 
> So I'm thinking


Yup I would leave them too it...It is always nerve wracking the first night you leave rats but I bet they are snuggled tomorrow when you come down


----------



## feorag

I so hope they are!

And you are right - men!!! :roll:

I don't know whether this scenario is stressing me or the dog more! Skye is doing my head in, cos he won't leave them alone. I keep sending him to lie on the other side of me and within minutes, as soon as my attention is diverted, he's managed to sneak by to lie beside them!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I so hope they are!
> 
> And you are right - men!!! :roll:
> 
> I don't know whether this scenario is stressing me or the dog more! Skye is doing my head in, cos he won't leave them alone. I keep sending him to lie on the other side of me and within minutes, as soon as my attention is diverted, he's managed to sneak by to lie beside them!


Oh Dexter does my head in sneaking into where the rats are to steal food


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> Rat behaviour is fascinating, I love watching my girl group of 6 in action. It is especially interesting at the moment as the ginger girls are finding their feet- They flip Luna easily with little resistance, skimishes with Aeon can go either way but they won't attempt it with Pink. They will try mounting her when playing or in season but she accepts their sillyness with patience. I'm pretty sure she is the alpha rat, often the problems occur with the seconds in command jostling for posistion. I'm certainly seeing it and hoping it calms down soon.


It's the same with Nibbles, she seems to be the Alpha, with Dusty being Beta and Treacle leaning towards Omega though questioning this position, especially when she's in season and Dusty isn't. The reason I believe that Treacle is more towards the bottom of the pack is that she is never seen alone, but has to be in close contact with any of the other two. Also Nibbles protects her from Dusty, but at the same time humps and submits her. Dusty and Nibbles hardly ever squabble and if so it's mainly Nibbles excessively grooming Dusty. 

@Feorag: That sound like a great progress. I'm sure they'll be the best of friends soon and I know what you mean with the dog. When I first introduced Nibbles and Treacle and they had their little rank fights, Trigger would always run up to the cage and stick his nose at the bars (Treacle is quite vocal). We ended up taking the cage upstairs with us every night, cos I was worried about the dog knocking it over.
Now we can safely leave them in the living room and Trigger leaves them alone (most of the time, bar to come for a sniff). He's just got used to the noise *touchwood*. 

P.S.: Laughing at the rats at the moment: I'm letting them forage their food tonight (hidden it all over the computer desk) and the girls are veeeryyy busy running back and forth.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> It's the same with Nibbles, she seems to be the Alpha, with Dusty being Beta and Treacle leaning towards Omega though questioning this position, especially when she's in season and Dusty isn't. The reason I believe that Treacle is more towards the bottom of the pack is that she is never seen alone, but has to be in close contact with any of the other two. Also Nibbles protects her from Dusty, but at the same time humps and submits her. Dusty and Nibbles hardly ever squabble and if so it's mainly Nibbles excessively grooming Dusty.
> 
> @Feorag: That sound like a great progress. I'm sure they'll be the best of friends soon and I know what you mean with the dog. When I first introduced Nibbles and Treacle and they had their little rank fights, Trigger would always run up to the cage and stick his nose at the bars (Treacle is quite vocal). We ended up taking the cage upstairs with us every night, cos I was worried about the dog knocking it over.
> Now we can safely leave them in the living room and Trigger leaves them alone (most of the time, bar to come for a sniff). He's just got used to the noise *touchwood*.
> 
> *P.S.: Laughing at the rats at the moment: I'm letting them forage their food tonight (hidden it all over the computer desk) and the girls are veeeryyy busy running back and forth.*


:lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

A "few" pictures from last night

Nibbles collecting food








Dusty trying to raid the small change box








Getting her share








Nibbles, the lap rat








Dusty sorting out the paperwork (I wish)








Rat, meet mouse








Nibbles and my youngest, Arran








Dusty still has her baby face








Finally, Treacle is venturing out (kids had gone to bed)

















To be continued...


----------



## BMo1979

More pics:

Nibbles is not camera shy








All three together








Treacle doind a hunchback impression








The spawn of evil, Dusty








Over the bridge, to the food








Nomnomnom








Making Treacle work for her treat


----------



## selina20

hi guys long time no chat. Well my ratties are just fab i really have fallen for them. Patch and Noo Noo have come on loads with Patch acting almost human haha. Got another ratty the other day off Mel and shes settling in well and has been called Feebee. I was going to spell it Phoebe but seeing as my kids surname is Fee and my surname starts with B why not lmao


----------



## feorag

Well I'm delighted and relieved to announce that all the rats are still alive this morning and there's no sign of blood! *Phew*

When I got up this morning Archie was in a hammock on his own and Kenzie and Dougal were squashed in the corner hammock together - whether by mutual choice or not I'm not sure! So I rewarded them all with a slice of banana - nomnomnomnom



















And some photos taken on Friday during bathtime - most of which were too blurred cos they wouldn't stay still long enough for the camera to focus :roll:






































And all 3 snuggled up on the cat bed in the plastic tub yesterday afternoon.


----------



## ami_j

Lovely pics guys :flrt: 
Selina where are your pics? tut  

Eileen I am thrilled for you, I knew you could do it  So many promising signs, the sleeping together, the grooming, the fact they shared the banana, hell my girls havent mastered share :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

OH, they look quite happy together. Things are looking up. :flrt:
Is Archie the Curly one (Rex?)?


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> Lovely pics guys :flrt:
> Selina where are your pics? tut
> 
> Eileen I am thrilled for you, I knew you could do it  So many promising signs, the sleeping together, the grooming, the fact they shared the banana, hell my girls havent mastered share :lol2:


Well usually if I give a rat a treat, they immediately run off somewhere to eat it on their own. Archie ran straight out of the hammock and into the litter tray and I honestly expected Dougal to do a runner, cos he always does, but he didn't.

At the minute it's siesta time, as happens every afternoon, but they are all on the floor in the corner lying on the shredded paper bedding and I'm just so thrilled. They are going to get such a treaty tea tonight! :flrt:

Needless to say I took great delight in pointing out to Barry that Dougal looked happy with his company, so he was wrong to leave him on his own until he died! :bash:



BMo1979 said:


> OH, they look quite happy together. Things are looking up. :flrt:
> Is Archie the Curly one (Rex?)?


Yes he is - he really reminds me of your Treacle.

And it took me so long to download, resize, upload and put those photos on here that by the time I'd done it I'd forgotten to say what lovely piccies you'd uploaded. Your rats are gorgeous. :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

Thank you, so are yours and Ami's and most likely Selina's (pics please).


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> Lovely pics guys :flrt:
> *Selina where are your pics? tut *
> 
> Eileen I am thrilled for you, I knew you could do it  So many promising signs, the sleeping together, the grooming, the fact they shared the banana, hell my girls havent mastered share :lol2:


Lol when she sits still ill take one XD


----------



## ami_j

My Little Quinn rat is 3 today! Happy Birthday little old man :flrt:



selina20 said:


> Lol when she sits still ill take one XD


yay :2thumb:


----------



## feorag

Awww, bless him! :flrt:

Happy Birthday Little Old Man Queen! :no1:


----------



## BMo1979

Happy Birthday to Quinn. Hope you'll spoil him rotten. :no1:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Awww, bless him! :flrt:
> 
> Happy Birthday Little Old Man Queen! :no1:





BMo1979 said:


> Happy Birthday to Quinn. Hope you'll spoil him rotten. :no1:


Thanks guys! Baked the ratty scones out of the scuttling gourmet with cheese and carrot...hoping they go down well


----------



## gecko_steve

Hi Guys, thinking of getting some rats, went to pets @home yesterday and they have the Jenny cage on offer with a few bits of bedding, food etc for £85. 
They said you can fit about 4 rats in there is that right? 
Also any other cage recommendations thats around this price range? 
Cheers in advance
steve


----------



## ami_j

gecko_steve said:


> Hi Guys, thinking of getting some rats, went to pets @home yesterday and they have the Jenny cage on offer with a few bits of bedding, food etc for £85.
> They said you can fit about 4 rats in there is that right?
> Also any other cage recommendations thats around this price range?
> Cheers in advance
> steve


I hate the jenny lol! The one I had had crap access and the bars werent coated so they held smells and reeked after a while. For that price there are a few cages, and it is always worth looking second hand. I have the explorer cage and I love it, it is pretty big though lol. There is the liberta abode, I have heard good things about that.

EDIT i wouldnt use the nuggets or the wood bedding if you do get the pah offer they are crap. MIght be worth joining here and checking the marketplace 
http://www.fancyratsforum.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=115


----------



## Moony14

I have the abode and I love it!! Great access and it's the same price as the Jenny! It's on amazon if you want a look at it. I'm going to have four makes in it once theyre big enough and I'd be happy to put another two in so it's really big! Also, watch the bar sizing as my smallest boy can still fit through.


----------



## trogdorable

i enjoy reading this thread, so thought i would put a few pics of my lot up : victory:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i enjoy reading this thread, so thought i would put a few pics of my lot up : victory:
> 
> <a href="Pictures by popeyepanda - Photobucket" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z321/popeyepanda/IMG_0250.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
> 
> <a href="Pictures by popeyepanda - Photobucket" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z321/popeyepanda/IMG_0248.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
> 
> <a href="Pictures by popeyepanda - Photobucket" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z321/popeyepanda/IMG_0245.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
> 
> <a href="Pictures by popeyepanda - Photobucket" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z321/popeyepanda/IMG_0239.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
> 
> <a href="Pictures by popeyepanda - Photobucket" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z321/popeyepanda/IMG_0240.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>


Gorgeous :flrt: I bet 8 does keep you busy :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Gorgeous :flrt: I bet 8 does keep you busy :lol2:


certianly does! :blush: i was only ment to have 3! the other 5 were a mistake :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> certianly does! :blush: i was only ment to have 3! the other 5 were a mistake :lol2:


:lol2: rats are never a mistake


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> :lol2: rats are never a mistake


tell that to my curtains! :Na_Na_Na_Na:

they are one of the most affectionate animals ive ever come across. couldnt be without them now =]


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> tell that to my curtains! :Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> they are one of the most affectionate animals ive ever come across.


Haha yeah one of my curtains is a bit holey :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

and they are also one of the most expensive and stress inducing animals ive kept. . .

in the last 2 months ive dealt with 4 throat abscesses on 3 different rats. the last one had an injection of strong antibiotics to see if she could fight it. and just right this very minute ive just discovered ANOTHER one on spazz, who had one lanced 3 weeks ago.


:blowup:


----------



## trogdorable

posting on this thread mustv been bad luck:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> and they are also one of the most expensive and stress inducing animals ive kept. . .
> 
> in the last 2 months ive dealt with 4 throat abscesses on 3 different rats. the last one had an injection of strong antibiotics to see if she could fight it. and just right this very minute ive just discovered ANOTHER one on spazz, who had one lanced 3 weeks ago.
> 
> 
> :blowup:


Its really weird you say that, I had this exact problem with mine about a month ago. I put them all on a course of septrin from the vet and prophlactically treated all of my rats


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Its really weird you say that, I had this exact problem with mine about a month ago. I put them all on a course of septrin from the vet and prophlactically treated all of my rats



did this involve the abscesses being lanced or burst? or were they reabsorbed? how many were you treating?


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> did this involve the abscesses being lanced or burst? or were they reabsorbed? how many were you treating?


I had three get abcesses all in the same cage,same place, my girls. I bathed them with a warm compress to help them come to a head. All ten rats were treated incase there was an infection going around, the ones with abcesses for ten days and the ones with out for 5. that was the 18th may and not seen a reoccurrence yet but there is always a chance it could come back i guess.


----------



## trogdorable

did you go in for a consultation with the vet to get the septrin or are you able to just buy it?

ive repeatedly read up on bringing it to a head, but feel uncomfortable that it would be irresponsible and that i should be letting a vet deal with it. but lots of people seem to have succes on dealing with it on theyre on with antibiotics.


----------



## trogdorable

sorry for all the questions >.<


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> sorry for all the questions >.<


Dont be sorry  
I had to get the septrin from the rat, we were gong to use synulox but with the amount of rats I would of needed about 5 bottles :lol2: the septrin certainly seemed to do the trick  will abscesses you need something that will cut through the pus cells

Health Guide this is a great site, lots of info. If you dont feel comfortable dealing with the abscess yourself then ask your vet


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Dont be sorry
> I had to get the septrin from the rat,


thats one very smart rat :lol2:

very good sight thanks for that! im sure id read from that website before but missed this:2thumb:

the thought of her going under anesthetic again is horrid.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> thats one very smart rat :lol2:
> 
> very good sight thanks for that! im sure id read from that website before but missed this:2thumb:
> 
> the thought of her going under anesthetic again is horrid.


whoops,,vet...can you tell i'm tired :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

@ Trogdorable: Lovely rats! Have you got any pictures of the rest, too (I love photos, lol)?

Your black one looks like my Treacle (the same face expression), I had to check she was still in the cage.


----------



## trogdorable

BMo1979 said:


> @ Trogdorable: Lovely rats! Have you got any pictures of the rest, too (I love photos, lol)?
> 
> Your black one looks like my Treacle (the same face expression), I had to check she was still in the cage.


thanks:flrt: i have lots of pics of the rest! il need to upload them onto photobucket first and il get some more up :2thumb:

black ones called jiji, and for some reason she's never taken a liking to humans =[ got any pics of treacle?


----------



## BMo1979

trogdorable said:


> thanks:flrt: i have lots of pics of the rest! il need to upload them onto photobucket first and il get some more up :2thumb:
> 
> black ones called jiji, and for some reason she's never taken a liking to humans =[ got any pics of treacle?


That's a shame, but I guess each rat is different. Our youngest one Dusty doesn't like being fussed over. She's not unfriendly (quite the opposite, she loves the children), but you can just tell she doesn't like being picked up and stroked:-(. Oh well, there's always Nibbles who doesn't mind getting her belly tickled or Treacle, who sits on the shoulder and gives kisses.

This is Treacle, btw:


----------



## trogdorable

i discovered a large pile of rat food on the floor outised theyre cage and i've just discovered why! chancey snatches food out the dish and takes it up to their bed on the top floor and stashes it there. but the food keeps falling out the bars at the side of the cage >.<
no wonder everyone seems so hungry tonight . . .


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i discovered a large pile of rat food on the floor outised theyre cage and i've just discovered why! chancey snatches food out the dish and takes it up to their bed on the top floor and stashes it there. but the food keeps falling out the bars at the side of the cage >.<
> no wonder everyone seems so hungry tonight . . .


Haha silly rat! Mine dont get their mix in a bowl , I scatter feed them it prevents my greedy girl stealing all the best bits :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Haha silly rat! Mine dont get their mix in a bowl , I scatter feed them it prevents my greedy girl stealing all the best bits :lol2:



when i scatter feed, one of my girls walks around picking all the food up and putting it back in the bowl! ( i always leave the bowl in lol ) she does the same thing when i give her treats aswell!


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> when i scatter feed, one of my girls walks around picking all the food up and putting it back in the bowl! ( i always leave the bowl in lol ) she does the same thing when i give her treats aswell!


:lol2: neat ratty 
I have a couple that are stashers, but mostly its a free for all :lol2:


----------



## feorag

Wow! She could come and live at my house and keep it tidy for me!! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

We need to replicate her so that I can have one too :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

Nibbles and Treacle put their food in their bowls, too. I sometimes spread little piles of food over their free play area and they always carry it back to the cage and put it into their bowls (Dusty normally waits there and eats whatever they bring back, lol).

Bought the rats a new house yesterday, as they had one of these wooden arches which was getting too small for all 3. They now have this massive plastic igloo thingy (but still squeeze into the other arch on the shelf). Unfortunately the "igloo" doesn't have a back door and Nibbles wants a back door. SO what does she do? Pushes her head under the edge of the house and chucks the whole thing up to crawl under it! I don't know how many times I have put it back into its place.


----------



## feorag

It seems most rats have an obsession to have a 'back door' :lol2: 

That's why I gave up on pouches, cos they were ruined in no time. Fortunately with a normal hammock or one of the honeycomb hammocks I make, which have basically 8 doors, they've not chewed them! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

Decided to revamp my explorer again today. Took the middle out to make it more climbing orientated. Want to get a few more ropes and a cargo net for it but for now its good  They have been climbing about (except for Pink, she is sulking because she is lazy :lol2


----------



## ami_j

I also got some new pics of the gingers enjoying ratty stirfry :lol2:
Using the walkway


----------



## BMo1979

Nice set up, a proper rattie theme park. I love those little wash baskets. What's in the bucket?

I like your cage as well, something I need to look into sometimes, as my rats cage is not big enough for the future. They're just so bleeding expensive!


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Nice set up, a proper rattie theme park. I love those little wash baskets. What's in the bucket?
> 
> I like your cage as well, something I need to look into sometimes, as my rats cage is not big enough for the future. They're just so bleeding expensive!


Thanks 
Aubiose, same that is in the bottom tray, and it will have their dry mix in a bit later so they have a good search for it 

Keep checking the marketplace on fancy rats now you are on there, theres often cheap cages


----------



## ami_j

:whistling2:


----------



## BMo1979

Where did that little cutie come from???


(I need a bigger cage cos I'm getting broody here, lol!)


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Where did that little cutie come from???
> 
> 
> (I need a bigger cage cos I'm getting broody here, lol!)


Someone I know, I got a silverfawn hooded, just taken some pics of her actually, will post them soon.


----------



## ami_j

here we go this is Little My..waited ages for a ginger got 3 and a ginger hoodie now :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

What a cute baby :flrt:!
Have you introduced the girls yet?


----------



## aidey07

Do rats have different morons like reptiles ?
If so is there a website with pictures of the morons ?

Aiden


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> What a cute baby :flrt:!
> Have you introduced the girls yet?


They have met the gingers, not met the three older girls yet, though they will soon  


aidey07 said:


> Do rats have different morons like reptiles ?
> If so is there a website with pictures of the morons ?
> 
> Aiden


Do you mean morphs? not morons :lol2: they are called varieties in rats, this is proably the best site 
Hawthorn Rat Varieties


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> They have met the gingers, not met the three older girls yet, though they will soon
> 
> Do you mean morphs? not morons :lol2: they are called varieties in rats, this is proably the best site
> Hawthorn Rat Varieties


Probably automatic spell corrector, lol, though I'm sure there are morons in the rat world, too.

Interesting site, thanks for posting. I really want a Siamese!!!

I always thought Treacle was a Black Berkshire, but she seems to be going chocolate colour now (might just be her summer coat). Nibbles and Dusty are Striped Roans, with both going darker in some places and lighter in others (they both look like they're getting monks' tonsures, lol).


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Probably automatic spell corrector, lol, though I'm sure there are morons in the rat world, too.
> 
> Interesting site, thanks for posting. I really want a Siamese!!!
> 
> I always thought Treacle was a Black Berkshire, but she seems to be going chocolate colour now (might just be her summer coat). Nibbles and Dusty are Striped Roans, with both going darker in some places and lighter in others (they both look like they're getting monks' tonsures, lol).


Siamese are gorgeous :flrt: I had a stunning russian blue point boy called Dylan, he died at christmas  He was a berkshire too so he had white feet instead of pointed. 

Black rats can go brownish due to sun or age, copper supplements can help some of them go black again. I had a quite brown doe who was meant to be a black


----------



## aidey07

Sorry i was on a iphone and it auto corrected... :bash:


----------



## ami_j

aidey07 said:


> Sorry i was on a iphone and it auto corrected... :bash:


Haha its fine  this also has a lot of pictures on it 
National Fancy Rat Society


----------



## feorag

Loving your little hoodie Jai! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Loving your little hoodie Jai! :flrt:


Thanks :flrt: She is quite a character! Did you see the piccy of the black berkie?


----------



## feorag

Yes I saw your piccie of her on the Cat chat thread, but when I saw you'd posted on here I decided to acknowledge it on here. :2thumb:

I was just thinking to myself today that I was miserable at the thought of going home on Friday :sad:, but how happy I will be to get my rattie chappies back on Saturday! :jump:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Yes I saw your piccie of her on the Cat chat thread, but when I saw you'd posted on here I decided to acknowledge it on here. :2thumb:
> 
> I was just thinking to myself today that I was miserable at the thought of going home on Friday :sad:, but how happy I will be to get my rattie chappies back on Saturday! :jump:


:2thumb: I bet they will be thrilled to see you again


----------



## feorag

I certainly hope so - they'll probablly say they want to stay and live with Alison! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I certainly hope so - they'll probablly say they want to stay and live with Alison! :lol2:


Oh I'm sure they won't :lol2: How old are your younger lads now? My gingers are 15 weeks tomorrow :gasp:


----------



## feorag

Well I didn't have a date of birth obviously, but they'd been in the back of the shop for a week in quarantine before they came out to the front, so I reckoned they were probably about 7-8 weeks when I got them probably about the beginning of May.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well I didn't have a date of birth obviously, but they'd been in the back of the shop for a week in quarantine before they came out to the front, so I reckoned they were probably about 7-8 weeks when I got them probably about the beginning of May.


Not far off the same age then


----------



## feorag

Yes, cos I'm pretty sure you got your gingers very near the same time as me.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Yes, cos I'm pretty sure you got your gingers very near the same time as me.


It was the same day iirc


----------



## BMo1979

Just had to think there:
Nibbles should now be around 22 weeks old.
Treacle about 28 weeks and Dusty around 18 weeks. We got Nibbles and Dusty at 6 weeks and Treacle was already 12 weeks old, but she's till the runt of the pack.
Time flies, doesn't it? 

I've got a question, btw (hope, it's not a stupid one, lol). Or maybe not a question but would like to hear more experienced owners' views: Nibbles has started marking everything, including us. It doesn't smell, but leaves little wet stains which are a bit annoying. It doesn't appear to be incontinence, cos she only does it to "things" that seem important to her: Toys, her people, cushions, the other rats. Is this normal behaviour for the most dominant rat in the pack? 
I've also noticed she's becoming more and more affectionate, constantly coming up and rubs herself against my hands, cheeks and cleavage, which is of course a nice thing (though she's probably viewing me as her property rather than being nice, lol), but at the same time she constantly humps Treacle, who has started submissive peeing in return. She mainly does it during free play and leaves her alone (most of the time) when their in their cage. 
Is it just Nibbles having established her position and Treacle being the Omega fall guy? I'm not intervening as Treacle seems to have settled in her low position and other than getting humped doesn't get hurt (is that the right thing to do?).


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Just had to think there:
> Nibbles should now be around 22 weeks old.
> Treacle about 28 weeks and Dusty around 18 weeks. We got Nibbles and Dusty at 6 weeks and Treacle was already 12 weeks old, but she's till the runt of the pack.
> Time flies, doesn't it?
> 
> I've got a question, btw (hope, it's not a stupid one, lol). Or maybe not a question but would like to hear more experienced owners' views: Nibbles has started marking everything, including us. It doesn't smell, but leaves little wet stains which are a bit annoying. It doesn't appear to be incontinence, cos she only does it to "things" that seem important to her: Toys, her people, cushions, the other rats. Is this normal behaviour for the most dominant rat in the pack?
> I've also noticed she's becoming more and more affectionate, constantly coming up and rubs herself against my hands, cheeks and cleavage, which is of course a nice thing (though she's probably viewing me as her property rather than being nice, lol), but at the same time she constantly humps Treacle, who has started submissive peeing in return. She mainly does it during free play and leaves her alone (most of the time) when their in their cage.
> Is it just Nibbles having established her position and Treacle being the Omega fall guy? I'm not intervening as Treacle seems to have settled in her low position and other than getting humped doesn't get hurt (is that the right thing to do?).


yeah, rats scent mark with urine, males more so (I had a male who would wee over my hands yuk!)
Sounds like she does want affection, and rats certainly seem to love cleavage. My himi girl Lily used to force her head and shoulders into my bra and leave her legs and tail hanging out :lol2: she was a character!

Humping is a sign of dominance, but does often do it when one or more of them is in season. Season humping, you tend to see one of the rats running around, ear wiggling and trying to get the others to chase them. Does the dominant doe flip the others over at all?


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> yeah, rats scent mark with urine, males more so (I had a male who would wee over my hands yuk!)
> Sounds like she does want affection, and rats certainly seem to love cleavage. My himi girl Lily used to force her head and shoulders into my bra and leave her legs and tail hanging out :lol2: she was a character!
> 
> Humping is a sign of dominance, but does often do it when one or more of them is in season. Season humping, you tend to see one of the rats running around, ear wiggling and trying to get the others to chase them. Does the dominant doe flip the others over at all?


Thanks for your reply.
Nibbles does indeed flip the others, tho Treacle more than Dusty. Treacle just lies completely still whereas Dusty squeals like a baby, lol. 
Treacle seems to be the one in season at the moment as she actually arches her back and moves her tail when she gets humped. BUt then again when are rats actually not in season (isn't it every 5 days or so)? At the moment it's quite peaceful with Nibbles cleaning Treacle (gently for a change) and Dusty raiding the food.


----------



## ami_j

Haha sounds like Treacle has accepted her place but Dusty is protesting :lol2:
Yup does come into season every 4-6 days I believe it is


----------



## trogdorable

what are every ones rats like for licking? before i got mine i was under the impression it was only really affectionate rats would do it. 
but even one of mine who doesnt even like being touched will now come up to lick my hands.

is it just affection? or yummy salty hands aswell?


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> what are every ones rats like for licking? before i got mine i was under the impression it was only really affectionate rats would do it.
> but even one of mine who doesnt even like being touched will now come up to lick my hands.
> 
> is it just affection? or yummy salty hands aswell?


Some of mine are mad lickers, some dont do it and some give the odd lick...same with bruxing :lol2: got some that rarely do it and some that go mental with it


----------



## feorag

:jump: I've got my boys back! :flrt:

We picked them up this afternoon at 4:00pm and it was the only good thing about having to come back from holiday! :lol:

I swear they've grown! Lying side by side in the carrier, 3 in a row, on my knee, Archie and Kenzie were nearly as big as Dougal! :gasp:


----------



## ami_j

Awww  yeah they grow soooo quick  Are they still getting on then?


----------



## BMo1979

Had some fun yesterday:
It was my middle son's birthday so gran and grandad came for a visit. Grandad had always said that he wasn't very keen on rats, always thought them to be vermin, so of course we let the girls out for their free run on the couch :devil:. What can I say, Nibbles broke the ice and grandad ended up carrying her around on his shoulders and taking pictures and videos all night. Unfortunately, Treacle is still terrified of other people (I don't think it'll change  ) and ended up sitting on my lap the whole time. Dusty at least went to sniff my MIL's hair (she's not bothered about people anyway, rather does her own thing). 
Next mission is to get my FIL to hold the snakes, lol (or at least give them a pat).

The other positive thing happened this morning. I spot cleaned the rats' cage and my dog Trigger came to sit next to me. Nibbles came out and they ended up sniffing each other in a very friendly way, Nibbles even licked his nose. I think we're getting there...


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> Awww  yeah they grow soooo quick  Are they still getting on then?


Yes! :2thumb:

Alison reported no problems between them and they were all snuggled up together in the carrier and last night when I went to give them a piece of banana before bedtime they were all in the igloo together! Woop, Woop! :jump: I'm ecstatic about it! :roll:

I was delighted to get them back, but it appears that there is another member of our family is glad to have them back too, cos Skye was on 'watch duty' for the whole night lying in front of the cage watching them!

And Purrdy was on the arm of the settee standing guard waiting for the APDs to come out!


----------



## feorag

Just taken this photo of them all peeping out the igloo this morning. Poor Archie is barely visible as he's on the bottom! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Yes! :2thumb:
> 
> Alison reported no problems between them and they were all snuggled up together in the carrier and last night when I went to give them a piece of banana before bedtime they were all in the igloo together! Woop, Woop! :jump: I'm ecstatic about it! :roll:
> 
> I was delighted to get them back, but it appears that there is another member of our family is glad to have them back too, cos Skye was on 'watch duty' for the whole night lying in front of the cage watching them!
> 
> And Purrdy was on the arm of the settee standing guard waiting for the APDs to come out!


Excellant news :2thumb:


feorag said:


> Just taken this photo of them all peeping out the igloo this morning. Poor Archie is barely visible as he's on the bottom! :lol2:
> 
> image


Awww they look so happy :flrt:


----------



## feorag

I know - I can't tell you how ridiculously happy I am about it! They're just little furry critters after all, but I do luvs them! :flrt: :blush:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I know - I can't tell you how ridiculously happy I am about it! They're just little furry critters after all, but I do luvs them! :flrt: :blush:


Oh I can guess! nothing better than a difficult intro finally working. And rats dont half worm their way into your affections


----------



## feorag

They do indeed! I have a real problem with little furry critters ever since I got those 2 squirrels way back in about 2007! That's what set me off for permanent little furry critters - it just took a while too persuade Barry to agree!


----------



## trogdorable

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK

the oh just said i can get another one XD a little brown rex!!!!

i shall cal her mrs T


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> They do indeed! I have a real problem with little furry critters ever since I got those 2 squirrels way back in about 2007! That's what set me off for permanent little furry critters - it just took a while too persuade Barry to agree!


rats are the best small pets imo


trogdorable said:


> EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK
> 
> the oh just said i can get another one XD a little brown rex!!!!
> 
> i shall cal her mrs T


Oooooh exciting :flrt:


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> rats are the best small pets imo
> 
> Oooooh exciting :flrt:


That's why I chose them (and boys) - they're just more cuddley than other small furry critters.


----------



## trogdorable

had a guy come in today asking to get a rat ( work in a petshop) . 
i told him they really do need to be in pairs. his response boiled my blood >.<
" i know they do better, but i once had 2 and they fought. and i dont want to spend extra money "

im not allowed to refuse sale unless the person is obviously intoxicated.
this was my first customer to go home with just one. even though im told i shouldnt, i always push them to buy 2 and explain why they are so better off. 
i have a funny feeling this will bug me for a while . . .


----------



## feorag

That would bug me too!


----------



## ami_j

So guys...question for you...

if you had 3 males living together and one of them was quite ill and either due to illness or the ill rats advancing age he was pts or died...what would you do with the left over males? the remaining two are about 18 months old. 

would you rehome them as a pair to be integrated into a group s that they have someone familiar? or rehome the one that is left when I am down to just one?


----------



## trogdorable

if there is no other option other than rehoming them, i would defo do it as a pair.

but personaly, i would just get more young males when one was left.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> if there is no other option other than rehoming them, i would defo do it as a pair.
> 
> but personaly, i would just get more young males when one was left.


i would do but i want to have just the one cage and dedicate my time to one group


----------



## trogdorable

yeah i can understand that tbh. one group can be so time consuming >.<


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> yeah i can understand that tbh. one group can be so time consuming >.<


it is, and its less cages to clean, less room used. I'm not sure yet what i will do, i love atticus and pilot but i'm thinking what is best for them..hmmm


----------



## feorag

I was going to say the same as Trog, but if you don't want to continually have boys, then I would rehome both boys together. If you don't want to rehome them then I'd gamble on them both living for a similar length of time so that the one who is left when the first one dies doesn't maybe live too long and you just give him lots of quality time until he dies???


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I was going to say the same as Trog, but if you don't want to continually have boys, then I would rehome both boys together. If you don't want to rehome them then I'd gamble on them both living for a similar length of time so that the one who is left when the first one dies doesn't maybe live too long and you just give him lots of quality time until he dies???


well thats what i had to do with quinn because he wont accept any of the rats i tried to pair him with. they are brothers so they should live a similar time. i guess it depends on how the lone boy acts whether he really misses company. i need to think what im going to do i think


----------



## feorag

I think you do, especially if you've had the boys for that long.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I think you do, especially if you've had the boys for that long.


aye.. i didnt think i would need to think about this yet, its crept up on me


----------



## trogdorable

ive just had to seperate one of my girls into a cage by herself =/

the last week shed been getting quite rough and aggresive with the others. today has been the worst ,non stop assaults on everyone and finally aggressivly attacking munchkin with no provocation.
think a vet will be in order, this is so unlike her =/


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> ive just had to seperate one of my girls into a cage by herself =/
> 
> the last week shed been getting quite rough and aggresive with the others. today has been the worst ,non stop assaults on everyone and finally aggressivly attacking munchkin with no provocation.
> think a vet will be in order, this is so unlike her =/


Oh dear sounds like someone is getting too big for her boots! has she hurt munchkin?


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Oh dear sounds like someone is getting too big for her boots! has she hurt munchkin?


munchkin wouldnt hold still for me to look properly. her fur looks a bit scruffed up where she was bit. will have a proper look when she settles down.

i feel horrible. buffkin ( mrs grumpy ) hates being alone. but regardless shes getting some chill time by herself for today.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> munchkin wouldnt hold still for me to look properly. her fur looks a bit scruffed up where she was bit. will have a proper look when she settles down.
> 
> i feel horrible. buffkin ( mrs grumpy ) hates being alone. but regardless shes getting some chill time by herself for today.


a bit of chill time will do her good, if she hasnt hurt any of the others i would pop her back tomorrow


----------



## BMo1979

Must be something in the air, at least in Scotland, as Dusty, the youngest of my three is rebelling a bit at the moment, too. SO far it's not escalated into anything more serious than a lot of posing, shoving and the odd squabble (no blood *touch wood*, but she is being really cheeky towards the Alpha Nibbles. She has already made sure Treacle knows she's underneath her and Treacle is just happy to accept her lowest position, but now she seems to be trying to move up a bit further.
Yesterday, it was initially Nibbles who "pulled rank". They were all given a piece of egg biscuit (for rats, though they smell really nice) and after Nibbles had finished her's she decided to try for Dusty's (Treacle hides to eat her's, lol). Nibbles just slowly walked up to Dusty, making herself look really big, basically claiming ownership over the treat. She edged closer and closer and Dusty eventually delivered it. Just about a minute later Nibbles had her back turned when all of a sudden Dusty jumped her. They ended up on their hind legs, engaged in a shoving/boxing match and Nibbles eventually just walked away and did her own thing. Again very fascinating behaviour. Like a pack of miniature wild dogs!


----------



## claire101

*rats*

I breed rats im based in south wales


----------



## trogdorable

just popped buffkin back in and all is peaceful so far . . .


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> just popped buffkin back in and all is peaceful so far . . .


hopefully it will stay that way: victory:


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> hopefully it will stay that way: victory:


it didnt >.<

the others are putting her in her place a bit more now though. keeping a very close eye, but keeping her in with them for the moment. 
its not as violent or frequent :notworthy:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> it didnt >.<
> 
> the others are putting her in her place a bit more now though. keeping a very close eye, but keeping her in with them for the moment.
> its not as violent or frequent :notworthy:


yeah no blood no foul  as long as no one is getting too stressed by it all


----------



## ami_j

intros....

tried doing it on the landing and My decided the best place for her was down my shirt :lol2: so they are in a small cage and seem to be snuggled up...Harker seems to be taking to it well, My has been squeaky and defensive and Aeon has been bolshy but its quiet at the moment


----------



## feorag

Fingers crossed, eh?


----------



## trogdorable

down your shirt is always the best place :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Fingers crossed, eh?


aye  seems to be going good, except for Aeon throwing her weight about, the babies seem to be calming down. there is a load of them in the hammock. harker definately looks the odd one out, all the other girls have pink or ruby eyes, fur colour got a hooded siamese, a pink hairless, a white, 3ginger, oneginger and white , then this little black face peeking out of the middle :lol2:


trogdorable said:


> down your shirt is always the best place :lol2:


hehe :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

intro pics, it seems to be going ok, had them snuggled up together , still some squeaking though. Aeon started on Little My and The big gingers went over and pushed Aeon away from her :flrt: ginger mafia :lol2:

































thats my lil intro cage, i find a small cage at first helps them bond quicker, less chance for chasing and running off...also lol at Harker, such the odd one out


----------



## BMo1979

What a lovely pile of cuteness. Harker really stands out, but her face shows pure content.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> What a lovely pile of cuteness. Harker really stands out, but her face shows pure content.


yeah shes really taking it better than My who is very vocal if someone tries to assert them self to her, i can see she going to be a madam :lol2:


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> ...also lol at Harker, such the odd one out


Bless her! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Bless her! :flrt:


shes so lovely :flrt:


----------



## feorag

I've just given my boys their supper. I used to feed them their fresh food every morning, but now I do it in the evening when I feed the dormice. 

They were so excited - running up and down the front of the cage as if to say hurry up. tonight they had Nature diet dog food, a couple of blueberries, a couple of cubes of fresh coconut and a chopped strawberry.

I open the door and they rush forward to see what's in the dish, so I always hold it and make them come out and choose what they wanted first - no prizes for guessing it was the dog food! then I put it on the shelf and left them to it.

I was sitting watching the dormice as the 3 boys munched away, then when they'd finished, they all went into the cargo net at the top and were sitting watching me, watching the dormice, like the 3 wise monkeys! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I've just given my boys their supper. I used to feed them their fresh food every morning, but now I do it in the evening when I feed the dormice.
> 
> They were so excited - running up and down the front of the cage as if to say hurry up. tonight they had Nature diet dog food, a couple of blueberries, a couple of cubes of fresh coconut and a chopped strawberry.
> 
> I open the door and they rush forward to see what's in the dish, so I always hold it and make them come out and choose what they wanted first - no prizes for guessing it was the dog food! then I put it on the shelf and left them to it.
> 
> I was sitting watching the dormice as the 3 boys munched away, then when they'd finished, they all went into the cargo net at the top and were sitting watching me, watching the dormice, like the 3 wise monkeys! :lol2:


Awww :flrt: fancy tea, i got my lot three bags of country mix (baby carrots, peas, green beans, cauliflower) from farmfoods today, so all i have to do is take it out and defrost...they will get that a few times a week, kale another couple, cous cous once and some broccoli 

Just noticed you can see Atomic's tail mark on these pics :lol2: they have marker pen on them so i can tell the difference im getting so much better at it though


----------



## feorag

Oh, I didn't even notice that!

Forgot mine also got some carrot and if I have banana on my cereal in the morning, they get a small slice for brekky too! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Oh, I didn't even notice that!
> 
> Forgot mine also got some carrot and if I have banana on my cereal in the morning, they get a small slice for brekky too! :2thumb:


yum  mine get dried banana in their food, im thinking of taking some out though cos they have put a bit of weight on since i swapped foods 

and yeah kitsune has pink and seven has blue :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

Mine always get a treat/fresh food after free play. It's so cute when I put them back into the cage and all three of them line up on the "doorstep" waiting.
Nibbles has figured out where I keep the treats (drawer of the cabinet their cage sits on) and always tries to get into the draw when I open it (have to be careful I don't squash her tail).
Treacle and Dusty have realised that they're only getting the treat, if they sit nicely and wait, so them two are just like little dogs. Treacle normally hides it somewhere away from the others and comes back to see if she can get seconds. 
What I find with rats is that it's the same as with children: The other "person's" treat always looks tastier than your own (even if it's the exact same)...


----------



## feorag

:lol2: that is so true!

I keep things like tiny puppy dog biscuits and yoghurt drops in tupperware boxes, so I just rattle the box and they're there!


----------



## BMo1979

Oh dear, just had another mini stand-off between Nibbles and Dusty, this time Nibbles throwing her weight around (I think she's starting to realise that Dusty is no longer the baby and becoming a potential "threat" to her position).
Dusty was eating and Nibbles decided, despite the fact that there are 2 bowls, she wanted to eat out of the very one Dusty was eating from. So she did her usual slow walk up to the bowl, made herself really big and shoved Dusty off it. The two stood there like 2 boxers for a while and then Nibbles climbed on top of it, while Dusty retreated into her house. Nibbles then marked the food (glad I'm not a rat, imagine having to eat someone else's pee?) :gasp:. 
Now they're besties again, snuggled up inside their house. It's really cute how Treacle uses her Omega position to try to diffuse the situation by snuggling up to both of them.


----------



## BMo1979

Right, starting for the 3rd time now (bl..y Nibbles keeps climbing over the mouse and deleting everything I write. I swear to it, she's the spawn of Satan himself, lol (and obviously quite tech savvy, too, even managed to break my printer)!
Anyway: Has anyone got any experience using ecchinacea as a remedy/preventive for respiratory infections? *Just copied the text again, so I can paste it cos she's getting close again and this time she brought re-enforcements, aka Dusty*
Treacle has started sneezing and making those loud clucking noises again. Just like last time she seems active and fine otherwise and eats and poos well. It's like a crescendo of those noises (sound like she's got a blocked nose) which normally end with a loud sneeze. *saving again, lol*. After that she sounds clear for a while and then it starts again.
Before having them put on another course of antibiotics (not a big fan of repeated use of them), as the last one is not that long ago, I'm trying to see if there are different alternatives. So if anyone has any ideas it would be greatly appreciated. *quickly submitting before the beast deletes again*


----------



## feorag

I bought some Micoform T, when Wee Jeemy had recurring wheezing, but I couldn't be sure it made any difference, cos he died not long after I got it! :sad:

I've just put some in the drinking water at the weekend, cos Kenzie was wheezing when I picked him up from Alison's and she didn't want to put him straight onto anti-b's cos she thought it could just be stress. So I thought I'd try the Micoform.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Right, starting for the 3rd time now (bl..y Nibbles keeps climbing over the mouse and deleting everything I write. I swear to it, she's the spawn of Satan himself, lol (and obviously quite tech savvy, too, even managed to break my printer)!
> Anyway: Has anyone got any experience using ecchinacea as a remedy/preventive for respiratory infections? *Just copied the text again, so I can paste it cos she's getting close again and this time she brought re-enforcements, aka Dusty*
> Treacle has started sneezing and making those loud clucking noises again. Just like last time she seems active and fine otherwise and eats and poos well. It's like a crescendo of those noises (sound like she's got a blocked nose) which normally end with a loud sneeze. *saving again, lol*. After that she sounds clear for a while and then it starts again.
> Before having them put on another course of antibiotics (not a big fan of repeated use of them), as the last one is not that long ago, I'm trying to see if there are different alternatives. So if anyone has any ideas it would be greatly appreciated. *quickly submitting before the beast deletes again*


there are people who use it on the rat forum and rat rations sells it to add to your mix...i have heard it is best used in cycles rather than all the time for best results...there is also this 
Fancy Rats | Information | Feeding to Support the Immune System


----------



## ami_j

The babies are now in the explorer, all seems to be going well except for Aeon, so she has been removed for a day or so, she is the only one really causing problems. The gingers have been sticking up for the babies if she starts and going over and pushing them away. not had squealing since aeon came out, touch wood


----------



## BMo1979

feorag said:


> I bought some Micoform T, when Wee Jeemy had recurring wheezing, but I couldn't be sure it made any difference, cos he died not long after I got it! :sad:
> 
> I've just put some in the drinking water at the weekend, cos Kenzie was wheezing when I picked him up from Alison's and she didn't want to put him straight onto anti-b's cos she thought it could just be stress. So I thought I'd try the Micoform.


Thank you. I just checked it at rat rations and it looks like it could work, judging by the ingredients. I'm no fan of constantly giving anti-bios, but maybe I'm just being paranoid. I always thought that taking too much of it can weaken your immune system therefore creating a vicious circle.

Just read your post, too, Ami. Thanks, will check it out.


----------



## ami_j

Lost my little old man :'(


----------



## trogdorable

saw on your fb , lovely looking boy, very sorry to hear


----------



## feorag

Oh dear - do you mean Quinn??? :sad:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Oh dear - do you mean Quinn??? :sad:


Yeah  Had him pts, his back legs werent working hardly, the final straw was him laying in his wee and a sore from pulling himself along


----------



## BMo1979

Very sorry to hear that.


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> Yeah  Had him pts, his back legs werent working hardly, the final straw was him laying in his wee and a sore from pulling himself along


In that case you did the right thing - hard though it will have been! :sad:

RIP Little Man Quinn! :sad:


----------



## selina20

Its taken me a while to pluck up the courage to write this due to me not wanting to be judged but i hope you all understand. I had to come to a really really heartbreaking decision last week to rehome my rats . One of them bit my 1 year old daughter and almost took her finger off and i couldnt risk it again. I had to choose between my furry babies and my human babies and believe me it broke my heart :'(


----------



## ami_j

selina20 said:


> Its taken me a while to pluck up the courage to write this due to me not wanting to be judged but i hope you all understand. I had to come to a really really heartbreaking decision last week to rehome my rats . One of them bit my 1 year old daughter and almost took her finger off and i couldnt risk it again. I had to choose between my furry babies and my human babies and believe me it broke my heart :'(


no judging hun, that is understandable...rare for rats to bite  what a shame


----------



## feorag

No judging from me either. When children and biting meet, then something has to be done. :sad:


----------



## selina20

ami_j said:


> no judging hun, that is understandable...rare for rats to bite  what a shame





feorag said:


> No judging from me either. When children and biting meet, then something has to be done. :sad:


We think the rat in question had neuro issues . I will never get the image of it dripping blood . My little girl only has tiny fingers so lucky it wasnt severed. I had to literally pull the rat off her. I know it wasnt the other 2s fault but i could never risk it again while shes so small. Broke my heart in 2 it really did. Patch went to a friend to keep her hairless company and Feebee and the bitey one went to Mel. Felt even worse when later that night i saw the substrate move and noticed Feebee had had a litter of 9 babies (she managed to with hold sperm). So i felt so guilty thinking i had put the babies at risk but luckily Mel picked them up and Feebee has been rearing them since. Talk about a kick while you are down.


----------



## trogdorable

sad times on the rat thread lately.

just got back from the vets to lance what i thought was an obvious abscess on misty to discover it was a tumour. shes only a year old.


----------



## feorag

Oh dear - poor girl. What was the vet's advice?


----------



## trogdorable

we're going to remove it next week.

never thought i would see the day when i WANTED the prognoses to be an abscess.


----------



## feorag

I can understand that! :sad:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> sad times on the rat thread lately.
> 
> just got back from the vets to lance what i thought was an obvious abscess on misty to discover it was a tumour. shes only a year old.
> 
> image


Hoping her surgery goes well *hug*


----------



## BMo1979

Hope all goes well, too! Give the "Nibbles-Look-a-like" (spitting image of my rat Nibbles) a nice treat for me.


----------



## BMo1979

Decided to bump the thread with a couple of pictures (you must be getting fed up, lol)

Nibbles thinking of how she could get on the snake vivariums to tease them (note the book my oldest got from the library - definitely following in my footsteps, lol)









Trying to get all 3 of them in one picture...









Nibbles spent ages chilling inside my dressing gown









Treacle and Dusty: Who put that there?









Grooming pictures, always cute









Treacle coming to "Mum" when called









Nibbles and Dusty taking a nap while Treacle still runs aaround









Rat Photobomb (Treacle)









Kind of group photo (with Dusty ignoring me)


----------



## ami_j

I love the photobomb :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

love nibbles!:lol2:

it can be hard getting a nice group photo eh?

i realised tonight that tmrw will have been 2 weeks since i got my new little baby rex, and i still hadnt named her! think ive just been so preoccupied with misty.

think im going to call her mew, after the cute little pokemon that can kick your ass :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> love nibbles!:lol2:
> 
> it can be hard getting a nice group photo eh?
> 
> i realised tonight that tmrw will have been 2 weeks since i got my new little baby rex, and i still hadnt named her! think ive just been so preoccupied with misty.
> 
> think im going to call her mew, after the cute little pokemon that can kick your ass :lol2:


oh getting group pics is really hard :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

lets see everyones ruined attempts at group photos ! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

i will have to dig through my photobucket..here is a failed one of My and Atomic until then :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

An "older" one.

"No, haven't done my fur, so no pictures!"


----------



## trogdorable

not failed group ones , but thought i would share a photo of the little one newly introduced to the group tonight:2thumb: no problems at all.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> not failed group ones , but thought i would share a photo of the little one newly introduced to the group tonight:2thumb: no problems at all.
> 
> image


She is adorable :flrt: gimme :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> She is adorable :flrt: gimme :lol2:


i always underestimate the cuteness of babies until i bring them home!

love the expression shes pulling in this one XD


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i always underestimate the cuteness of babies until i bring them home!
> 
> love the expression shes pulling in this one XD
> 
> image


or how small they are :gasp:

shes great, what did you call her? and wooo you are a member of the ginger club too :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> or how small they are :gasp:
> 
> shes great, what did you call her? and wooo you are a member of the ginger club too :lol2:


i know! i was so taken aback by the size difference :lol2:
mew. but it may change :whistling2:

the ginger is spaz =P she truely lives upto her name . . .


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i know! i was so taken aback by the size difference :lol2:
> mew. but it may change :whistling2:
> 
> the ginger is spaz =P she truely lives upto her name . . .


:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

group pic of the girls while they were in the small intro cage :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

edit-wrong thread -_-


----------



## feorag

:lol2: what thread did you think you were on???

My boys have just been fed their supper. Soaked cous cous with mixed vegetables and a pinch of their vitamin supplement! My word did it vanish quick! :gasp:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> :lol2: what thread did you think you were on???
> 
> My boys have just been fed their supper. Soaked cous cous with mixed vegetables and a pinch of their vitamin supplement! My word did it vanish quick! :gasp:


night thread :lol2:
Oooh mine had cous cous tonight with veg and prawns :2thumb:


----------



## trogdorable

think its worth adding vitamin drops to their water every now and then?

this stuff Johnsons Vit-Min Vitamin Rats Mice Drops 100ml - Interior Essentials


----------



## feorag

To be honest I've no idea what my vitamins are! :blush:

Alison gives me it and it's whatever their diet (Shunamite) doesn't provide.


----------



## trogdorable

well the tumours out! 
such a large incission for such a wee animal =[ its a good thing they are such proficiant healers!

she a lot more groggy from the aneasthetic than the others were though.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> well the tumours out!
> such a large incission for such a wee animal =[ its a good thing they are such proficiant healers!
> 
> she a lot more groggy from the aneasthetic than the others were though.


bless her, give her a gentle scritch from me


----------



## feorag

It's always a huge relief when they wake up after an anaesthetic! :2thumb:


----------



## trogdorable

shes not really keen on getting scritches right now, think shes fallen out with me a bit =[

it is a relief isnt it! it helps a lot having a really good vet you trust though!


----------



## feorag

Absolutely! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

(not so little) My


----------



## BMo1979

They grow so fast don't they? Too fast actually, IMHO.

She's lovely!:flrt:


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> They grow so fast don't they? Too fast actually, IMHO.
> 
> She's lovely!:flrt:


They do! She has outgrown Harker already...but Harker is small, she doesnt sit still!


----------



## ami_j

*rats vs ice lolly*

Gave the rats an ice lolly today as a nice cold treat. The ones that actually bothered getting out of bed loved it :lol2:

































































































also updated pics of the explorer layout


----------



## trogdorable

SOOOOO going to try mine with lollipops!! 


now just as misty is almost totally recovered from her operation, buffkin is starting to get a third abscess! since she got her first abscess several months ago i have not had a break from vet visits and lancing/ operations! really starting to feel counter productive. and the only vet i trust is on holiday for 3 weeks! HULK SMASH!


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> SOOOOO going to try mine with lollipops!!
> 
> 
> now just as misty is almost totally recovered from her operation, buffkin is starting to get a third abscess! since she got her first abscess several months ago i have not had a break from vet visits and lancing/ operations! really starting to feel counter productive. and the only vet i trust is on holiday for 3 weeks! HULK SMASH!


Oh dear, its a pain when they are prone to them


----------



## trogdorable

dont get me wrong, ive got the money there, but im starting to resent not just paying for them to have them removed / lanced at the vets, but also the fact they have to keep being aneasthnatised =/ its a small risk, but a risk all the same.

think its time i pluck up the courage to try and do this at home after getting some antibiotics. try the whole warm compress thing.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> dont get me wrong, ive got the money there, but im starting to resent not just paying for them to have them removed / lanced at the vets, but also the fact they have to keep being aneasthnatised =/ its a small risk, but a risk all the same.
> 
> think its time i pluck up the courage to try and do this at home after getting some antibiotics. try the whole warm compress thing.


thats what i do hun, bringing it to a head it will probably burst itself. what antibiotics do they give?


----------



## trogdorable

i was given baytril for one of their previous abscesses, wich ive still got some left over. ive heard baytril not being very effective toward abscesses but it seemed to do the trick. 
going to see about getting some septrin though.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i was given baytril for one of their previous abscesses, wich ive still got some left over. ive heard baytril not being very effective toward abscesses but it seemed to do the trick.
> going to see about getting some septrin though.


it doesnt seem to do well at shifting them  septrin or synulox will be better


----------



## trogdorable

who else uses a litter tray for their ratties?
right now im using carefresh in their litterbox, just wondering what other people use?


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> who else uses a litter tray for their ratties?
> right now im using carefresh in their litterbox, just wondering what other people use?


i didnt but they have taken it upon themselves to use their purple bucket as the loo :lol2: clean girls :lol2: i just use their normal substrate in there, been using up the paper pellets i got with my Bog Myrtle girls too


----------



## feorag

Mine have always used litter trays. I just left my first 2 boys when I first set up their cage and left it a couple of days. Then found they were using the 2 back corners as latrines, so I put a tray in each corner and they just started to use them. I found they used the one on the right mainly for pooing in and the one on the right for peeing, eating and sleeping in! :gasp:

When I got the next 2, they followed suit, but when the first 2 eventually died I noticed one of the other boys had suddenly started to pee on the top corner shelf, so I moved one litter tray up there and put an igloo down in the bottom where they were 'nesting'.

So now they poo and very occasionally pee in the top litter tray and the original poo tray and nestbuild and pee in the igloo, so I just clean it out every few days.

I use my OkoPlus cat litter in the litter trays without any problems. It is a wood based cat litter but it's very small lightweight pieces and it clumps instantly into a solid clump, which can be lifted out if you want, when they wee it in, so it doesn't break down like other woodbased litters.


----------



## BMo1979

Just love the way rats snuggle up. Photos are a bit blurry and as soon as they notice me, "The bringer of treats", they came up to see whether I had anything for them.


















This is their new(ish) "hammock". It's apparently meant for birds, but I always find very useful things in the bird section (and it's cheaper, too). Treacle and Dusty love it though I can only see it lasting for a couple of months, cos they rip the fluff out and use it for bedding.


----------



## feorag

Lovely cuddly piccies! :flrt:


----------



## trogdorable

Amen to the bird section!
my lot love the little wicker basket nests :no1: love the hammock!


----------



## BMo1979

trogdorable said:


> Amen to the bird section!
> my lot love the little wicker basket nests :no1: love the hammock!


I bought their ladder from there as well and I used those wicker baskets for my first rats when they were small. I'm always tempted to buy the corner bath that you can attach to the cage as a litter tray as Dusty and I have an ongoing dispute about litter trays (her idea of them being upside down in the middle of the cage).

I also bought climbing branches for my snake from there. All it takes is a little more disinfecting at home and there you go. I don't see why I should pay double for the ones they sell in the reptile department.


----------



## ami_j

Happy Birthday to my little Atari :flrt: 2 today


----------



## Lover

Aww cute ratties, such shame i can't own rats any more just don't have all the time i had before i had my two kids, but maybe in the future i can own a pair again. There the most cutest funniest pets iv'e ever owned


----------



## ami_j

Lover said:


> Aww cute ratties, such shame i can't own rats any more just don't have all the time i had before i had my two kids, but maybe in the future i can own a pair again. There the most cutest funniest pets iv'e ever owned


Awww hopefully you can have some more soon


----------



## feorag

Lover said:


> Aww cute ratties, such shame i can't own rats any more just don't have all the time i had before i had my two kids, but maybe in the future i can own a pair again. There the most cutest funniest pets iv'e ever owned


I remember all the lovely photos you used to post! :2thumb:


----------



## trogdorable

has anyone ever encountered problems with keeping rats and landlords in private rent flats?


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> has anyone ever encountered problems with keeping rats and landlords in private rent flats?


I haven't private rented, is it a you are wanting to move to one or the current landlord is giving you issues


----------



## trogdorable

me and my bf wanting to move out our parents.
before we even started looking at houses the boyfriend was telling me to get rid off all my rats! just because he thought landlords wouldnt accept them before he even looked into it.

fat chance :whistling2:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> me and my bf wanting to move out our parents.
> before we even started looking at houses the boyfriend was telling me to get rid off all my rats! just because he thought landlords wouldnt accept them before he even looked into it.
> 
> fat chance :whistling2:


Right , here is what they recomend on the rat forum...ask if small caged pets are ok...then get it written into the contract that you can have say 2 cages and say 10 small pets


----------



## jonjon59

*rats query*

hi i have a black and white male rat chubby and his girlfriend black hooded female checker
they have had 8 babies 6 are black and white
but there is a blue and white boy and a siamese pattern female
BOTH COMPLETELY BALD not a hair, wisker on either of them
how wierd is that ?
anyone else had this experience
jon


----------



## Lover

feorag said:


> I remember all the lovely photos you used to post! :2thumb:


Aye i miss my babies but i know it wouldnt be fair on the rats if i owned a pair they wouldnt get the attention i given to my old ratties :3


----------



## feorag

I think you more than anyone else influenced me to get rats. I've always loved them and always fancied getting a couple, but it was never a priority and I never bothered.

After I handreared the 2 red squirrels and they left here for their release pen, I missed them so much, then you posted a picture of lots of your rats on top of the cage (either you or your mum was kissing them :lol and I thought to myself, a couple of those will fill that huge hole the 2 squirrels left. :2thumb:


----------



## Lover

feorag said:


> I think you more than anyone else influenced me to get rats. I've always loved them and always fancied getting a couple, but it was never a priority and I never bothered.
> 
> After I handreared the 2 red squirrels and they left here for their release pen, I missed them so much, then you posted a picture of lots of your rats on top of the cage (either you or your mum was kissing them :lol and I thought to myself, a couple of those will fill that huge hole the 2 squirrels left. :2thumb:



Hehe yes they used to love there kisses :3 My auntie has ratties still so i always make a fuss of them when i visit XD


----------



## beckoneon

I'm a new rat owner today. Bought 2 boys. 8 wks old. Love them already. So comical to watch. Can't wait for them to start recognising me etc and I can't believe u can train them? I'm going to give that a go  I did want 2 girls really but been told boys are probably better for my 6 yr old as they're more laid back..can't wait to enjoy them


----------



## BMo1979

Congratulations! Rats are awesome pets and often underestimated, IMHO.

Hope you'll put pictures up soon (though they will probably make me broody again).


----------



## beckoneon

I'll put a couple on now 

















Too cute. They've been out for a good nosey! Think wev named them Pat & Stan lol! But that could change as we get to know them!


----------



## feorag

Gorgeous! :flrt:


----------



## beckoneon

Thanks  
Hey does the amount of times they urinate and poo on u decrease as they get to know u? Lol! Was funny. Good job I had my scruffy top on. Guess they going to mark their territory quite abit until they're used to their surroundings?? Didn't smell tho which I was surprised about .


----------



## ami_j

beckoneon said:


> Thanks
> Hey does the amount of times they urinate and poo on u decrease as they get to know u? Lol! Was funny. Good job I had my scruffy top on. Guess they going to mark their territory quite abit until they're used to their surroundings?? Didn't smell tho which I was surprised about .


They should poo on you less with time, some male rats can still be quite scent markey still though lol


----------



## feorag

None of my boys have pood on me at all and a couple only peed when I first got them, so it may settle down once they get used to you. Either that or I've been very lucky.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> None of my boys have pood on me at all and a couple only peed when I first got them, so it may settle down once they get used to you. Either that or I've been very lucky.


I does depend on the boy...had boys who didnt and those who insisted on marking me.,..they were quite dominant boys that did that though. got a dominant girl who has done it too lol


----------



## BMo1979

Aww, they're gorgeous! Are they quite big for their 8 weeks old though (apologies, I only have female rats)?

Our youngest rat was 6 weeks when we got her and she used to poo on us or her free play area quite a lot, but eventually stopped and is now "potty-trained" like the rest.
Our Alpha female still occasionally marks though, but it doesn't smell.


----------



## Moony14

Do you guys have any suggestions on taming my rats? I've had them for 2 months now and they have barely tamed down since I got them. They come in the bathroom with me for floortime almost every night but they run away when I try to touch them and I feel like I'm failing as a rat owner because every says how great and handleable their rats are :blush: 

p.s 500th post woop woop!


----------



## BMo1979

it can take some time and you haven't failed. Some rats are not the "cuddly" type anyway and I find that girls are often too busy to explore and have no time for being held and stroked, lol. I think males tend to be lazier that way.

What I found is that the way to my rats' (3 girls) hearts were treats. At the beginning I would have to drop it in front of them as they wouldn't take them from my hands but as soon as they realised that hands mean goodies they were fine. The other thing I do is rather than grabbing and holding them I let them climb on my shoulders (or cleavage) to take them to their play area and carry them around. That way they don't feel restricted and can see where we're going. They now voluntarily run up my arm onto my shoulders when it's the end of playtime. 

Don't give up, you'll get there!


----------



## feorag

I never go to my rats' cage without a treat of some kind, it may be a slice of banana from my breakfast or a slice of eggy bread, jam on toast, marmite on toast, or a blueberry, hazelnut, shreddie, bite size shredded wheat, bite size weetabix, puppy biscuit, yoghurt drop - I try to vary it so it's a surprise! :blush: But they have to come to the door, step out of the cage onto the open door and take it from me.

At first the boldest would come out, take the treat and when he ran back in to enjoy it one of the others would pinch it from him, but they soon learned that they would always get their own treat and now they come out together, or one at a time - whatever - and take their treat.


----------



## beckoneon

Aw that's so cute. Iv got 2 8 wk yr old boys and don't seem to be interested in any treats. Too busy running around exploring. Only had them a few days though  they're currently snuggled down my top. They're so adorable!!


----------



## feorag

Hamish, one of my first pair of rats was obsessed with being down my t-shirt! :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

Guess who has acquired two new ratties yesterday lol? Yep me wasnt asked if I would take them as such but just told that my mate may have to rehome them as her mum's dog was sat at the cage constantly and kept trying to eat them through the bars.I asked the usual questions so that i could give details to anyone interested, then ysterday morning I got a text asking when she could bring them over which was a bit of a shock but told her after 1pm. THey are two little chocolate hooded girls 7 months old and quite tame they are currently in with my girls as the intros went so well but then my girls are very laid back thankfully and they are all curled up together in the hammock. Just need names to fit in with everyone else now


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Guess who has acquired two new ratties yesterday lol? Yep me wasnt asked if I would take them as such but just told that my mate may have to rehome them as her mum's dog was sat at the cage constantly and kept trying to eat them through the bars.I asked the usual questions so that i could give details to anyone interested, then ysterday morning I got a text asking when she could bring them over which was a bit of a shock but told her after 1pm. THey are two little chocolate hooded girls 7 months old and quite tame they are currently in with my girls as the intros went so well but then my girls are very laid back thankfully and they are all curled up together in the hammock. Just need names to fit in with everyone else now


See what I put on cat chat in regards to them being chocolate hun lol..and get some pics up :2thumb:


----------



## sammy1969

Have done and i will eventually lol as i have to put them on fb too


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Have done and i will eventually lol as i have to put them on fb too


:lol2k


----------



## ami_j

Meet Rorschach and ...well she is unnamed atm :lol2: they are the younger sisters of my girl Harker, the black berkshire is the spitting image of her! Shes the runt so shes teeny tiny:flrt:


----------



## feorag

I want that Dumbo!!! *stamps feet* I *really *want that dumbo!! :bash: She's gorgeous! :flrt:

Did anyone see those poor rats dressed up in frilly, beaded dresses on "super Tiny Animals" tonight! :bash:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I want that Dumbo!!! *stamps feet* I *really *want that dumbo!! :bash: She's gorgeous! :flrt:
> 
> Did anyone see those poor rats dressed up in frilly, beaded dresses on "super Tiny Animals" tonight! :bash:


Isnt she AMAZING :lol2: When my friend said she had two hoodeds and a black I was like hmmm I already have a black dumbo berkshire....but as soon as I saw her I was like NEED HER! If she ends up anything like Harker she will be such a licky friendly rat

I saw super tiny animals! Why were those rats in dresses, they were boys :lol2:


----------



## feorag

Don't think they cared to be honest. Poor rats! :sad:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Don't think they cared to be honest. Poor rats! :sad:


They seemed pretty calm tbf, not like when I tried to put a jumper on Atari:lol2:


----------



## feorag

:lol2: You should have seen my two when I tried to put a harness vest on them! they suddenly metamorphosed into octopuses (or pi :lol and I just couldn't get it on, there were legs everywhere! :roll2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> :lol2: You should have seen my two when I tried to put a harness vest on them! they suddenly metamorphosed into octopuses (or pi :lol and I just couldn't get it on, there were legs everywhere! :roll2:


:lol2: i bet! 
Are your guys still living in harmony?


----------



## feorag

Reasonably so, yes. There's the odd scuffle now and again, but it diffuses very quickly and never any blood, so I just leave them.

Dougal will be 2yrs 5 months in a couple of weeks time!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Reasonably so, yes. There's the odd scuffle now and again, but it diffuses very quickly and never any blood, so I just leave them.
> 
> Dougal will be 2yrs 5 months in a couple of weeks time!


I think every group of rats has the odd fall out. Awww hes doing well


----------



## feorag

I'm kinda chuffed with him! He's now the age that I lost both Hamish & Angus, so if I can get him past that I'll be mega chuffed! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I'm kinda chuffed with him! He's now the age that I lost both Hamish & Angus, so if I can get him past that I'll be mega chuffed! :2thumb:


How is he looking? Are his back legs still good?


----------



## sammy1969

Dont know if this will work but there is a link to pics of all my gil rattie. Enjoy
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10151142355187248.476022.785557247&type=3&l=91778724de


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Dont know if this will work but there is a link to pics of all my gil rattie. Enjoy
> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10151142355187248.476022.785557247&type=3&l=91778724de


Awww :flrt:

the newbies are black hoodies like my Rorschach  Star is black, Quasar is mink...topaz looks champagne  all gorgeous sam


----------



## sammy1969

Yeah they are arent they lol even if i am biased. Glad i now know the two new girls are black not chocolates and I have been saying Quasar is mink and Star a black for a while now lol I wish i could get a better pic of Topaz so oyu could see her properly to say for sure but she still doesnt like human contact although i can now pick her up if necessary.Quasar has just started to develop lighter patches on her back for some reason is that normal for a mink


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Yeah they are arent they lol even if i am biased. Glad i now know the two new girls are black not chocolates and I have been saying Quasar is mink and Star a black for a while now lol I wish i could get a better pic of Topaz so oyu could see her properly to say for sure but she still doesnt like human contact although i can now pick her up if necessary.Quasar has just started to develop lighter patches on her back for some reason is that normal for a mink


yup minks are notorious for being patchy :lol2: love mink its a great colour. 
Her eyes look pink not ruby and shes a light colour so i would say champagne looking at those pics


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> How is he looking? Are his back legs still good?


Yes, so far, he's still good and active and climbs around the cage without any difficulty. I'm hoping he'll go quickly like the other two, to be honest.

Sammy you're rats are gorgeous. :flrt:


----------



## sammy1969

I must admit after the huskies she is my favourite coloured rat JAimi as i do love her colour lol and yes Topaz's eyes are pink so she is champayne not the topaz i was told lol but then i have never really known the sublety of some of these colours lol but she is still sweet.
Thank you Eileen they have come on in leaps and bounds since they have been here coat and healhwise as they were so badly looked after except the new ones who as you can see have been very well looked after. Cant beleive the husky girls were so obese they could hardly walk when they first arrived, now they run me ragged lol . Now all i need is two blue dumbo girls to complete my collection lol.


----------



## trogdorable

yesterday someone dropped off some gorgeous baby ratties off at my shop.
all the girlies are gone so ive been playing with the boys. 
had one sit under my chin for a good hour n half while i walked about the shop and served at the till. he even fell asleep there :lol2:
everyone is telling me to take him home =[


----------



## feorag

Sounds like a good idea to me! :2thumb:


----------



## trogdorable

i wrote out a note saying he was sold without thinking what i was doing :whistling2:
i hate myself lol. i have no will power


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> i wrote out a note saying he was sold without thinking what i was doing :whistling2:
> i hate myself lol. i have no will power


:lol2:


----------



## feorag

trogdorable said:


> i wrote out a note saying he was sold without thinking what i was doing :whistling2:
> i hate myself lol. i have no will power


:lol2: I'd be exactly the same! I wouldn't *dare *work in a pet shop. :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

I was terrible when i used to work in a pet shop i am sure i bought more stock than the customers lol mainly small furries


----------



## Salazare Slytherin

sammy1969 said:


> I was terrible when i used to work in a pet shop i am sure i bought more stock than the customers lol mainly small furries



I am guilty of that too.:whistling2:


----------



## ami_j

Salazare Slytherin said:


> I am guilty of that too.:whistling2:


i cant even go in a petshop without wanting to steal everything :lol2:

LOVE the sig btw sal


----------



## trogdorable

bought the OH a computer game to shut him up and im picking up the wee boy tmrw XD:lol2:


----------



## Salazare Slytherin

ami_j said:


> i cant even go in a petshop without wanting to steal everything :lol2:
> 
> LOVE the sig btw sal


Thanks hun  bex made it for me  she is making them for people, drop her a message xx


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> bought the OH a computer game to shut him up and im picking up the wee boy tmrw XD:lol2:


:lol2:
what are you going to do, get him castrated to live with the girls?


Salazare Slytherin said:


> Thanks hun  bex made it for me  she is making them for people, drop her a message xx


oooh i may do , i need to update mine


----------



## trogdorable

yup yups, before i phone the vets for their answer to this, what do you guys think is an appropriate age?


----------



## feorag

I'm thinking it's maybe time to neuter my 2 latest boys, as this was about the age Dougal and Wee Jeemy were when they started to have mega domination spats with Angus & Hamish. So I want to nip it in the bud before they both start on Dougal.


----------



## trogdorable

feorag said:


> I'm thinking it's maybe time to neuter my 2 latest boys, as this was about the age Dougal and Wee Jeemy were when they started to have mega domination spats with Angus & Hamish. So I want to nip it in the bud before they both start on Dougal.


how old are they?


----------



## feorag

Just over 6 months I think.


----------



## sammy1969

Hi everyone just to let you know the two new girls now have names. They are called Cleo and Patra named by ppl on my fb lol.
I think 6 months is a good age to neuter the rats they are fully developed by then it s the age i usually neuter them


----------



## Moony14

Hi I posted a while back about taming my rats and I took the advice from Bmo and Feorag (big thanks to you guys for the help) so I thought I'd give a little update!

Since then, everytime I opened the cage door I held treats on the open door and eventually, one by one they soon realised that an open door meant treats from me!  So, things are better in the way they don't mind my presence anymore- my only problem is that they don't like me touching them! If I try and stroke them they dart off and sometimes make (a slighty upsetting) squeaking noise like I'm hurting them or something! Big boy Milo is being great though, he doesn't mind being handled and stroked atall although after a minute he's had enough! So, what I'm asking is there any way to get them to be okay with handling? OH! Another thing! Their claws are very sharp- should I try and cut/file them? Obviously when their a bit happier in my hands but it is causing me some concern. Thanks for the help!


----------



## ami_j

Yup if their nails are a bit sharp you can give them a clip with nail clippers


----------



## trogdorable

i have little squares of rough tiles i put in the cage to help keep their claws blunt. i put under the water bottle etc so i know they will need to walk on them, and it seems to work!


----------



## feorag

Quick question for you rat people with more experience than me. Can rats eat sun dried tomatoes.

My friend has given me a home made loaf of bread which has nuts, seeds and sun dried tomatoes in it. Her brother made it, but she doesn't trust him to wash his hand before he bakes so she won't eat anything he makes (honestly - :roll and gives me it for the rats. I usually dry it out in the oven for a while and then give them half at a time to munch their way through, but this is the first time he's put sun dried tomatoes in and I'm not sure whether to give them it!

So can I or can't I???


----------



## ami_j

I don't see why not hun, they can have tomatoes


----------



## feorag

I knew they could have tomatoes, just wasn't sure about sun dried as they are quite concentrated compared to a fresh tomato, if you know what I mean, although in the bread they are only tiny pieces, so they should even be able to avoid eating them if they don't like the taste.

Ah well, we'll throw the loaf in and see what they do with it! Ta! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I knew they could have tomatoes, just wasn't sure about sun dried as they are quite concentrated compared to a fresh tomato, if you know what I mean, although in the bread they are only tiny pieces, so they should even be able to avoid eating them if they don't like the taste.
> 
> Ah well, we'll throw the loaf in and see what they do with it! Ta! :2thumb:


Yeah i really dont see it being a problem...i bet they will enjoy it...it sounds very tasty


----------



## feorag

It certainly does! When he used to make it in his bread maker they would eat it, but not when he makes it himself! :lol:

I wonder whether the APDs might like a wee bit, cos they love normal tomatoes and they love a piece of brown bread, especially if I've left it in the oven to thoroughly dry out so it's crispy. I might cut a couple of slices off it and dry them out in the oven and give the rats the rest and the crumbs later.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> It certainly does! When he used to make it in his bread maker they would eat it, but not when he makes it himself! :lol:


:lol2:
i want homemade bread now


----------



## feorag

Well, the bread was a success. I took 3 slices off the full sized loaf to dry out in the oven and gave them the rest and they've absolutely stuffed themselves! :lol2:

A photographer asked my boss if she could come and take some photographs a while ago and my boss said it was OK. What do you think of this little ratty chappy peeping over the barn door. Apparently she spotted it collecting grub and running back into the barn with it, so she set up her camera and sat for best part of an hour to come up with this picture. Even our vermin is cute! :lol2:

eyyy rat fans! | Flickr - Photo Sharing!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Well, the bread was a success. I took 3 slices off the full sized loaf to dry out in the oven and gave them the rest and they've absolutely stuffed themselves! :lol2:
> 
> A photographer asked my boss if she could come and take some photographs a while ago and my boss said it was OK. What do you think of this little ratty chappy peeping over the barn door. Apparently she spotted it collecting grub and running back into the barn with it, so she set up her camera and sat for best part of an hour to come up with this picture. Even our vermin is cute! :lol2:
> 
> eyyy rat fans! | Flickr - Photo Sharing!


Beautiful picture :flrt: Makes me want an agouti doe :lol2:


----------



## Moony14

Have you got anymore advice for me on how to get them to like me handling them? They still freak out when I try and hold them.. Also, is cooked rice a nice treat for them? They could smell my dinner through the bars so I thought I'd give them some rice- they loved it!! So I may have filled up their bowl with some:whistling2:

I really do love these guys <3 , getting them to be more handleable would just be the icing on the cake for me. It's a shame they don't like me as much as I like them


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## ami_j

Just persevere...it takes a bit of time sometimes


----------



## feorag

Yes, perseverance. My rats still don't like me taking them out of their cage, they'll come out themselves, but don't like being _made _to come out.

Whenever we have a chinese tak eaway our rats get rice, but their favourite is cous cous - they love it! You don't even have to cook it, you just put a little bit in a bowl, cover it with boiling water and leave it. I microwave some frozen mixed vegetables, or some of ours when we have a 'dinner' meal and mix it in, sometimes I add hemp seeds, fruit whatever and they love it! And potatoes and gravy - I could go on! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Intro times again :lol2:


----------



## feorag

I've just seen this photograph on the Sanctuary's website taken last Saturday when me and the boys were out with the snakes at a local garden centre to raise money for the Sanctuary.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I've just seen this photograph on the Sanctuary's website taken last Saturday when me and the boys were out with the snakes at a local garden centre to raise money for the Sanctuary.
> 
> image


Awwww the "babies" are huge now :flrt:


----------



## feorag

They are, aren't they.

That reminds me, while I was there I popped down to the pet department to buy some mealworms and (as usual :roll had to go and look at the critters. There was a woman with 2 children looking at the rows of hamsters and I said "you should get them a rat, they make much better pets for children" and she turned and looked at me with a look of total disgust on her face and said rats were horrible things that bit!! So I replied that actually a well bred rat would never bite, whereas hamsters had a terrible reputation for being biters and she replied saying "rats always bite, hamsters don't!" At which point another lady standing looking at the critters said "No, you're wrong - I'm in the process of trying to rehome a hamster which has bitten my children quite a few times, whereas we've had rats for years and they've never bitten" :2thumb: Yey!!! :jump:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> They are, aren't they.
> 
> That reminds me, while I was there I popped down to the pet department to buy some mealworms and (as usual :roll had to go and look at the critters. There was a woman with 2 children looking at the rows of hamsters and I said "you should get them a rat, they make much better pets for children" and she turned and looked at me with a look of total disgust on her face and said rats were horrible things that bit!! So I replied that actually a well bred rat would never bite, whereas hamsters had a terrible reputation for being biters and she replied saying "rats always bite, hamsters don't!" At which point another lady standing looking at the critters said "No, you're wrong - I'm in the process of trying to rehome a hamster which has bitten my children quite a few times, whereas we've had rats for years and they've never bitten" :2thumb: Yey!!! :jump:


Dont know where she got rats are biters from, I have been bitten once by a rat and it wasnt one of mine, was a neglected one in a crappy pet shop. I dont think thats bad to say i have had about 50 of my own over the time i have kept them :lol2: i have had little nips and mouth grabs off cheeky babies or adults that are a bit food grabby but they didnt hurt. A hamster bite is very painful :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

some pics i took today 
Harker and Wednesday

















Wednesday

































Rorschach


----------



## ami_j

and the gingers..pics of them together


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> Dont know where she got rats are biters from, I have been bitten once by a rat and it wasnt one of mine, was a neglected one in a crappy pet shop. I dont think thats bad to say i have had about 50 of my own over the time i have kept them :lol2: i have had little nips and mouth grabs off cheeky babies or adults that are a bit food grabby but they didnt hurt. A hamster bite is very painful :lol2:


Exactly my point!

BTW what is that you are giving them - is a tangerine/satsuma??? I've avoided giving mine citrus fruits, cos I wasn't sure if it was good for them or not?


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Exactly my point!
> 
> BTW what is that you are giving them - is a tangerine/satsuma??? I've avoided giving mine citrus fruits, cos I wasn't sure if it was good for them or not?


its tangerine  
yeah yours are bucks so they shouldnt have it, its fine for does


----------



## feorag

A-ha - I thought so - glad I asked and didn't assume I was wrong! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> A-ha - I thought so - glad I asked and didn't assume I was wrong! :2thumb:


Yeah its something to do with a protein that only males can make when exposed to d-limonene...not sure if its random or they need a certain amount but I have never given citrus or mango to my bucks


----------



## feorag

My latest additions to my 'stock' - just been working on these.

This is my latest bed - a Snuggle Cup fully lined with polyester wadding for warmth with a fleece inside. The base wadding is 1" thick and the side wadding is half an inch thick. The base measures just about 11" in diameter and I reckon my 3 rats would snuggle in here no problem.

Inside "Hello Kitty" fleece



















Outside satinised cotton











And this is my latest 'design' hammock. I tried making corner hammocks, but they lay so flat and the rats didn't seem comfortable on them, like they were sliding out. So I made this 'bucket' corner hammock on Friday and put it in their cage when I cleaned it out yesterday, I think it's going to be popular, so I shall be adding that to my list of beds/hammocks etc for sale.










Archie discovers it first.










And then along comes Kenzie


----------



## Footie

Don't know if this is the right place but....

I am looking for 2 female rats as young as possible. I have a large cage and lots of toys waiting.

I would prefer rats that have come from 'pet' linage. I don't want 'wild' rats.

I live near in Wirral and can travel a small distance.

Thanks
Wendy


----------



## BMo1979

:devil: Arrgh, Treacle, my Black Berkshire has developed a new habit:

The girls get their free play on the couch. When they're done exploring and chasing each other they usually settle down on the back rest behind me.
All 3 have started including me in their grooming rituals and Nibbles and Dusty are usually licking my cheeks or "washing" my neck and hair.
Treacle, however, has started grooming me "rat style" and now includes sharp little nips into my neck into the process. :whip: Ouch!!! Little beggar!


----------



## Rach1

Feel ashamed to admit it, but I had one of 'those' moments today where I just couldn't be bothered to clean my ratties out!
I know I know!
BUT, cracked on anyways... And actually enjoyed it.

Do any of you guys, in all honesty, ever have those moments?
Dont get me wrong, my ratties would have gotten cleaned out... No way I'd have left them BUT, do you get off days where you think... NOOOOOO!

Plus. Any ideas for like really, really Cheap toys and bedding etc.
Joel and I have had some financial difficulties... And hopefully will be right by Xmas but in the meantime the animals must get fed and well cared for, ESP now the weathers a little colder!


----------



## feorag

Hi Rach, good to see you posting again, but sorry to hear you're still having some difficulties.

I often get moments where I can't find the energy to clean out my rats. When that happens I just clean and disinfect their litter trays and leave the cardboard substrate it, cos it's very rately dirty. I'm doing a big major clean today and the cardboard substrate hasn't been taken out for 3 weeks, because I've felt so lacking in energy. :blush:

I cut all my cereal boxes in half with scissors before I open them, transfer the inner bag into the newly empty box and then I have 2 boxes to put in the cage. My rats absolutely love them, they hide in them, eat in them, drag them all over the cage and chew great chunks out of them to put in their proper igloo bed - it keeps them entertained for hours. :2thumb:


----------



## Rach1

Thanks Eileen!
I only come sporadically now, just for a nosey and if I feel like seeing some cute animals!
Lol

We will be right hopefully by Xmas all being well and then the ratties shall have treats and prizes but until then it's scraps and rationed food!
Lol
(I'm joking)

I got some tea towels today from poundworld and made them into bedding for the rats...
Plus raided the kids rooms for boxes etc.

Ps... Leons a lot better now, still has moments but they're copable!

Just everything else that's going on...


----------



## Rach1

I also noticed today how 'tatty' some of my ladies are looking!
:-(

Then realised that most of them are nearing on 1 and a half now.
The Rex ratties look all threadbare and my nakeds look all scrawny!

Alas, the sad thing about ratties is they only have little life spans.
Plus they really show their age....

My males however, look all fat and old! Like little old men! All they do is mooch!


----------



## feorag

I noticed that wee Jeemy (my rex) started looking a bit threadbare when he got about that age too.

I've got my Dougal on Baytril at the minute cos he's got lump and a big hole in his groin and my vet and I aren't positive yet, whether it's a burst abscess or a tumour! :sad: Not looking too good at the minute though! :sad:

Good news about Leon! :2thumb:


----------



## Rach1

Ok, my other gripe about our little ratty friends...
Why do they insist on trashing their cages!
It's so bloody annoying.
Lovingly I cleaned their cage out and lo two days later it looks like a scene from an RSPCA horror video!
Lol
What makes it worse is they look proud of their little piles of mess!
Lol lol 

Clean out tomorrow I think....
To be trashed by erm.... Sunday!
Lol


----------



## trogdorable

Rach1 said:


> Ok, my other gripe about our little ratty friends...
> Why do they insist on trashing their cages!
> It's so bloody annoying.
> Lovingly I cleaned their cage out and lo two days later it looks like a scene from an RSPCA horror video!
> Lol
> What makes it worse is they look proud of their little piles of mess!
> Lol lol
> 
> Clean out tomorrow I think....
> To be trashed by erm.... Sunday!
> Lol


at least your lot would wait till sunday to trash it :devil:


----------



## Rach1

Oh it does my tree in!
I walked past this evening, having done a little spot tidy, you know straightening blankets, flattening bedding etc... An it was a shambles!
With several furry faces looking very pleased with themselves!


----------



## BMo1979

Sounds familiar, lol. They do love their own interior designs, don't they. If they could only agree on the theme:
Treacle and Dusty love lots of bedding in their house whereas Nibbles would sleep on the bare cage floor if she could, so they're constantly moving the bedding in and out with a lot of landing outside the cage or in their second food bowl. The other thing is litter trays. While Nibbles and Treacle couldn't care less about them, Dusty seems to hate them and keeps knocking it over or emptying it. 
Last night I replaced the girls nibble sticks. I placed the empty wooden sticks outside the cage and every time I tried to put a new one in, Nibbles would come out of the cage and drag the empty stick back into the cage. 

P.S.: Unrelated to the subject above, but I noticed another funny behaviour with Nibbles. She's a normal, healthy active young rat, but when she sleeps she's near enough comatose, lol. You can call her, tap on the cage, wave a treat in front of her and even nudge her and she doesn't wake up. The other day she was rolled up on their platform (out in the open as usual), I tried to get them out to clean out the cage. I called - no reaction - I tapped the platform - no reaction - I nudged her - she ended up falling to her side still sleeping soundly. Only when I gently grabbed her she woke up, yawned and looked at me as if to say "Oi, what you're waking me up for?".
Mind you, she's always been near enough fearless (probabyl wouldn't last a day out in the wild.), as opposed to Treacle, who I rarely see in a deep sleep (it seems she's always keeping an eye on her surroundings).


----------



## feorag

Remember the new blue corner hammock I designed and made for my boys just last week? Well literally a day later I couldn't find Archie anywhere in the cage and thought for a panicky minute that he'd been out all night, when I realised that the lining in the new hammock looked quite high up and, sure enough, they'd chewed through the lining and made a nice new bed in between the lining and the outer fabric. :roll:


----------



## ami_j

Rats just have no respect for the nice things we give them :lol2:


----------



## feorag

That is so true! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Half price finacard! Bargain :2thumb:
Repti-Card Maxibale


----------



## trogdorable

just finally finished introing a castrated boy into my group of girlies :2thumb:
poor sod having to live with all those hormonal women!


----------



## ami_j

Awww he will love it, living in his own little hareem :lol2:

Just had Atomic to the vets with a head tilt


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> Awww he will love it, living in his own little hareem :lol2:
> 
> Just had Atomic to the vets with a head tilt


Oh no, is she alright? Is it an ear infection?


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Awww he will love it, living in his own little hareem :lol2:
> 
> Just had Atomic to the vets with a head tilt


2 of the girls werent so keen on him too start with, his wee face was so confused as too why they were being so mean :lol2:
let us know how the vets went!


----------



## ami_j

Bless him


Well guys she had her ears looked down there is no sign of infection so the vet thinks it might be neurological. He said that if she gets no worse she should have a good quality of life as shes still active and happy just wonky. He did give her some baytril to see if there was improvement so just got to see how she does, obv if she gets worse got to think about pts


----------



## feorag

Sorry to hear that Jaime - I hope she responds to the Baytril.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Sorry to hear that Jaime - I hope she responds to the Baytril.


Thanks Eileen, I'm really hoping so too...shes only about 6 months


----------



## feorag

Oh dear, bless her - that's young!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Oh dear, bless her - that's young!


It sure is... I thought she might look a little tilted friday but couldnt be sure she wasnt just looking a certain way, when i fed them saturday she looked tilty though only to me, so i rang the vets this morning to get her in (they have a short sunday morning surgery) and took her up as she was very definately noticeably tilty


----------



## trogdorable

oh for gawds sake. just after me saying ive finished introducing my male to the girls he got a big ol swollen finger like someone bit it :bash: cant be kept on their own because they get depressed and when kept together you get this:lol2:

thats a bit gutting at only 6 months old =[


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> oh for gawds sake. just after me saying ive finished introducing my male to the girls he got a big ol swollen finger like someone bit it :bash: cant be kept on their own because they get depressed and when kept together you get this:lol2:
> 
> thats a bit gutting at only 6 months old =[


Ahhh poor lad...i'm sure they will settle, a swollen finger will be right as rain soon enough

It sure is, i havent written her off yet though


----------



## trogdorable

im thinking im going to trot him along to my vet. im awfull for going along when i dont need too, vets even sent me home without consultation charge because im always worrying over nothing :blush: but it just looks awfully uncomfortable for him


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> im thinking im going to trot him along to my vet. im awfull for going along when i dont need too, vets even sent me home without consultation charge because im always worrying over nothing :blush: but it just looks awfully uncomfortable for him


see what it looks like tomorrow hun...If at any point it looks infected pop him down but it will probably look back to normal in a day or so


----------



## feorag

trogdorable said:


> oh for gawds sake. just after me saying ive finished introducing my male to the girls he got a big ol swollen finger like someone bit it :bash: cant be kept on their own because they get depressed and when kept together you get this:lol2:
> 
> thats a bit gutting at only 6 months old =[


I know exactly how you feel. When Wee Jeemy died leaving Dougal on his own it took me a couple of months to get a couple of friends for him, because I took ill just after Wee Jeemy died.

Anyway I got 2 wee boys and although Archie got on OK, Dougal just didn't like Kenzie. While they were still in separate cages, he bit the end of his tail off, then one day Kenzie escaped and climbed up Dougal's cage and Dougal bit his foot really badly, so he now has a bent toe and when I finally introduced them all together and thought things were going well, within an hour, Dougal had all but torn Kenzie's nose off! :gasp:

Now Barry is convinced that rats needing company is crap and he always said Dougal was fine on his own and there is no way I'm ever going to introduce another 2 rats when these 2 get older - apparently this time I've got to wait until both are dead before I get another 2!

And that's me told in no uncertain terms. :roll:

Jaime, how's Atomic getting on?


----------



## ami_j

No improvment Eileen, but she is no worse which is a blessing I guess...managed to get a crappy pic of her to show the tilt, shes pretty tilty but she seems to be getting about quite happily so will leave her to it as long as she seems happy. I think i'm finding it more upsetting than she is, and apparently they do adapt pretty well


----------



## trogdorable

they really do carry on like little soldiers dont they.
i would be bowled over seeing one of mine like that =[ it looks so dramatic


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> they really do carry on like little soldiers dont they.
> i would be bowled over seeing one of mine like that =[ it looks so dramatic


it looks horrible watching her with her head really tilted over


----------



## trogdorable

unbelievable, once someone becomes ill/ injured, its like a competition they have to out do each other!!!!!
looks like one of my girls has dislocated her shoulder :whip:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> unbelievable, once someone becomes ill/ injured, its like a competition they have to out do each other!!!!!
> looks like one of my girls has dislocated her shoulder :whip:


Oh no! My rats always pick this time of year to get ill


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> Oh no! My rats always pick this time of year to get ill


of course they do, its the time of year you need to spend money on christmas :bash:


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> No improvment Eileen, but she is no worse which is a blessing I guess...managed to get a crappy pic of her to show the tilt, shes pretty tilty but she seems to be getting about quite happily so will leave her to it as long as she seems happy. I think i'm finding it more upsetting than she is, and apparently they do adapt pretty well
> image


Oh, dear - poor girly! :sad: It probably does look worse than it is, but prey critters compensate so quickly when they are ill that they appear to barely notice they are! I hope it improves, but I agree it must be awful for you to have to see her like that.



trogdorable said:


> unbelievable, once someone becomes ill/ injured, its like a competition they have to out do each other!!!!!
> looks like one of my girls has dislocated her shoulder :whip:


Gracious me, how has she done that?? :gasp:


----------



## trogdorable

i haven't got a clue!:bash:
im guessing it would be an opp to correct it, anyone any idea?


----------



## feorag

Sorry, no help at all to you there, I'm afraid I haven't a clue?


----------



## Disillusioned

ami_j your poor little rat! She looks so sweet. I feel for you having to just wait. Hope she starts to show improvement soon. 

Ah christmas! My fave! Although we realised the other day our animals literally take up all our space and my beautiful tree has no where to go anymore :gasp: enjoyed watching the rats trying to climb it last year as well!


----------



## Disillusioned

trogdorable said:


> i haven't got a clue!:bash:
> im guessing it would be an opp to correct it, anyone any idea?


If you think it's dislocated you should probably try not to touch or mess with it because I expect that would be really painful.
Maybe limit their climbing if it looks bad until it a vet had seen it? 
I have never had this problem either so am completely useless tbh, sorry!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Oh, dear - poor girly! :sad: It probably does look worse than it is, but prey critters compensate so quickly when they are ill that they appear to barely notice they are! I hope it improves, but I agree it must be awful for you to have to see her like that.
> 
> Gracious me, how has she done that?? :gasp:





Disillusioned said:


> ami_j your poor little rat! She looks so sweet. I feel for you having to just wait. Hope she starts to show improvement soon.
> 
> Ah christmas! My fave! Although we realised the other day our animals literally take up all our space and my beautiful tree has no where to go anymore :gasp: enjoyed watching the rats trying to climb it last year as well!


Thank you guys... I think she has improved a little, she is certainly moving about well  seems happy  and touch wood no worse so I think she will be ok. i do hope she improves more still though


----------



## trogdorable

Disillusioned said:


> If you think it's dislocated you should probably try not to touch or mess with it because I expect that would be really painful.
> Maybe limit their climbing if it looks bad until it a vet had seen it?
> I have never had this problem either so am completely useless tbh, sorry!


ive only touched it when i first noticed it because at first i actually thought it was maybe a lump developing. shes in a wee hamster cage at the mo with one of her sisters. ive tried to see if google could shed some light, but no luck. i hope its not an amputation =[


----------



## Disillusioned

trogdorable said:


> ive only touched it when i first noticed it because at first i actually thought it was maybe a lump developing. shes in a wee hamster cage at the mo with one of her sisters. ive tried to see if google could shed some light, but no luck. i hope its not an amputation =[


I actually had the same idea and googled it lol. Did you see the webpage with the lady who thought her rat had a dislocated shoulder? She took it to the vet and this is what she wrote after...
The bone looked like it was protruding out of its normal place, like a hard bumpy lump, but that paw is still load-bearing. The vet said it's not dislocated but it's a large blood clot and swelling and will take a long time to get re-absorbed.

I couldn't see anything else on the subject either but seeing as she also thought her rats shoulder was dislocated I thought I would post it.


----------



## trogdorable

yeah i saw that one, thats how i would describe it only my ones not putting any weight on her paw.


----------



## Disillusioned

I would see how she is in the morning and if it still looks bad then take her to the vet. You're right what you said before though, they must plan their illnesses and accidents for when we are all skint! Fingers crossed it's nothing serious.

ami_j if she seems happy then that a good sign  lots of love and cuddles work wonders!


----------



## ami_j

Disillusioned said:


> I would see how she is in the morning and if it still looks bad then take her to the vet. You're right what you said before though, they must plan their illnesses and accidents for when we are all skint! Fingers crossed it's nothing serious.
> 
> ami_j if she seems happy then that a good sign  lots of love and cuddles work wonders!


Thank you


----------



## feorag

Maybe she's twisted it at some stage by hanging on the bars by one leg and her body turning? So it could be a sprain, because fluid always rushes to a damaged joint and causes a swelling and of course a sprain hurts at lot.

I think a vet trip to find out one way or the other.


----------



## trogdorable

feorag said:


> Maybe she's twisted it at some stage by hanging on the bars by one leg and her body turning? So it could be a sprain, because fluid always rushes to a damaged joint and causes a swelling and of course a sprain hurts at lot.
> 
> I think a vet trip to find out one way or the other.



shes booked in for monday, but that depends on my college lecturer letting me out early =[
it doesnt just feel like swelling , it actually feels like bone =/

taking along another rat from my work to the appointment whos got an extremly swollen eyeball.


----------



## feorag

Ooh, a swollen eyeball sounds bad! :gasp:


----------



## trogdorable

i know =/ im hoping its something trivial thats easily treatable ( my manager isnt about to fork out money for an eyeball removal surgery ) because she is very sweet, and only 9 weeks old =[


----------



## feorag

Oh dear, poor wee thing! :sad:


----------



## trogdorable

tempted to pay for any treatment she needs myself , but the OH would kill me . . .
he's sick of me spending all my money on "charity cases"


----------



## feorag

Nothing wrong with a charity case now and then (or even now and now and now - *again*!!)

Is your vet reasonable in terms of fees??


----------



## Rach1

i gave my little ones a 'right good' clean out yesterday. the sort where you pull everything out, hoover right behind tha cage etc.
bath all bits of stuff...

all nice and clean for the whole of half an hour than it looked like a tip again!

:devil:


----------



## Disillusioned

Rach1 said:


> i gave my little ones a 'right good' clean out yesterday. the sort where you pull everything out, hoover right behind tha cage etc.
> bath all bits of stuff...
> 
> all nice and clean for the whole of half an hour than it looked like a tip again!
> 
> :devil:


Hmm I know that wonderful feeling, I always enjoy washing the throws on my sofa just to have them marked a hundred times within minutes of being put back on the sofa :bash:


----------



## trogdorable

well buffkins shoulder wasnt dislocated, it was an abscess pushing it out of place =[
shes had the abscess removed, but this is her 3 rd opp for her fourth abscess .

decided if she has anymore like this im not putting her through another operation, shes just not bouncing back like she used too.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> well buffkins shoulder wasnt dislocated, it was an abscess pushing it out of place =[
> shes had the abscess removed, but this is her 3 rd opp for her fourth abscess .
> 
> decided if she has anymore like this im not putting her through another operation, shes just not bouncing back like she used too.


poor Buffkin


----------



## trogdorable

and then theres the wee rat with the bulging eye. discovered she has glaucoma. perhaps seeing about having the eye removed. and too top it off the home i had lined up for her is no longer interested. so if anyone near me is looking for a very sweet little rat that will soon have 1 eye, give me a shout lol.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> and then theres the wee rat with the bulging eye. discovered she has glaucoma. perhaps seeing about having the eye removed. and too top it off the home i had lined up for her is no longer interested. so if anyone near me is looking for a very sweet little rat that will soon have 1 eye, give me a shout lol.


aww shame im not nearer, had a few one eyed rats lol

forgot to update you all on Atomic...the baytril made no difference, but shes still happy and great quantity of life


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> aww shame im not nearer, had a few one eyed rats lol
> 
> forgot to update you all on Atomic...the baytril made no difference, but shes still happy and great quantity of life


well, if shes happy then thats whats important :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> well, if shes happy then thats whats important :2thumb:


aye  shes eating, drinking and climbing about as normal


----------



## feorag

trogdorable said:


> and then theres the wee rat with the bulging eye. discovered she has glaucoma. perhaps seeing about having the eye removed. and too top it off the home i had lined up for her is no longer interested. so if anyone near me is looking for a very sweet little rat that will soon have 1 eye, give me a shout lol.


Scotland's a big place, whereabouts are you??

Sorry to hear about Buffkin's abscess - poor girl. I hope she doesn't develop any more.

Jai, good news about Atomic! :2thumb:


----------



## BMo1979

trogdorable said:


> and then theres the wee rat with the bulging eye. discovered she has glaucoma. perhaps seeing about having the eye removed. and too top it off the home i had lined up for her is no longer interested. so if anyone near me is looking for a very sweet little rat that will soon have 1 eye, give me a shout lol.


Aww, I wish I could help, but my OH is strictly against adding another rat (I asked him about it) and I can see his point (the girls will need a bigger cage first) :,-(. 
I hope you'll find a loving home for her soon though.


----------



## trogdorable

feorag said:


> Scotland's a big place, whereabouts are you??
> 
> Sorry to hear about Buffkin's abscess - poor girl. I hope she doesn't develop any more.
> 
> Jai, good news about Atomic! :2thumb:


kirkcaldy

i hope not too, but chances are she will. just need to make the most off her time shes got!


----------



## trogdorable

how do you guys "clean" your ratties? ive got an older albino girl and she really looks like a hobo in need of a bath!:gasp: youse find a damp cloth does the work?


----------



## feorag

I just bath mine.


----------



## ami_j

I would try a wipe with a damp cloth first, I only bath mine if they are really grotty


----------



## trogdorable

in just water? ive seen people that use soap/bubbles when bathing them, i would be too worried about them drinking it or going into their eyes


----------



## trogdorable

she is looking quite grotty tbh, too embaressed to show her off to visitors now!:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

You can get small animal shampoos, wouldnt use it on their head though... most rats arent fond of baths :lol2:


----------



## trogdorable

might pop her in with some plain water and peas to keep her occupied:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> might pop her in with some plain water and peas to keep her occupied:lol2:


Worth a try :lol2:


----------



## feorag

I used a small amount of baby shampoo when I bathed mine but still kept it off their head.


----------



## BMo1979

Good luck, you'll need it!

I bathed mine when they decided to roll around in honey. Things I learned from this experience: Do NOT wear short sleeved tops, as rats clawing their way up your arm is VERY painful. The average wild rat might have no quarrels to swim through dirty sewers to get to their destinations, but even the most docile fancy rat turns into a raging monster when being placed in the most shallow water. Rat poop and pee floats. Wet rats are even more slippery than wet cats. 
Bribery in form of tasty treats only work after the bath but may prevent my rats from hating me forever.


----------



## feorag

Mine have tried to jump out of the bath (and one succeeded), but in general I didn't find it that bad, to be honest. I put them in the bath, got a jug of water to which I'd added baby shampoo, splashed the bath water over them to wet them and then poured the jug of shampoo mix over them and rubbed it in, then rinsed. I wouldn't say they enjoyed it, but they didn't appear to aggressively hate it??


----------



## feorag

Just found this on You Tube and had to share!! :flrt:

loving pet rat - YouTube


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Just found this on You Tube and had to share!! :flrt:
> 
> loving pet rat - YouTube


Awwwwwww:flrt:
My Harker is very loving, grooms me and comes running if I call her


----------



## BMo1979

Aww, that's so sweet! Love the face expression.

Out of my 3 girlies Nibbles is the most affectionate. She like to groom my hands and likes to snuggle up inside my top and then keeps pushing her nose against my hands to remind me to stroke her, lol. Dusty has to bee in the mood but gets bored of it quickly (girls, ey?). Treacle is not too keen on being scratched, stroked etc, but has started grooming my neck. Problem is that she doesn't seem to know how to lick properly, but always uses her teeth. So I keep getting these sharp little scratches on the back of my neck or ears, ouch!
I'm always looking forward to that "me and my rats time" at night. Sitting on the couch watching tv with the 3 of them running around (after kids, dog, snakes). My mum was visiting the other week and she loved the fact that they would climb up on my shoulder when it was time to go back to the cage. She didn't expect rats to be that tame.


----------



## trogdorable

buffkin got put to sleep today. her shoulder re-abscessed before she'd even fully recovered from her last opp, so enough was enough.

she was such a sweet heart, always over enthusiasticly licking my hand. i brought her sister chancey along to the appointment. after buffkin had been gassed, chancey sat and licked me as the vet injected the needle.

she is now burried at the bottom of a tree with wild daises growing around it.


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> buffkin got put to sleep today. her shoulder re-abscessed before she'd even fully recovered from her last opp, so enough was enough.
> 
> she was such a sweet heart, always over enthusiasticly licking my hand. i brought her sister chancey along to the appointment. after buffkin had been gassed, chancey sat and licked me as the vet injected the needle.
> 
> she is now burried at the bottom of a tree with wild daises growing around it.
> 
> image


I'm so sorry to hear this *hug* RIP Buffkin


----------



## BMo1979

That's very sad. So sorry for you. RIP Buffkin!


----------



## feorag

Aw, so sorry to hear this, but I would have done the same to be honest. Quality always has to come before quantity imao.

RIP Buffkin, you truly were loved!


----------



## feorag

OK - so this is how you bath a rat. :flrt:

Rat Takes A Bath! - YouTube


----------



## ami_j

What a crappy week  Lost Pilot to a nasty resp infection, Aeon died with what looks like kidney failure, and I lost Atticus this morning...just gave up after his brother died :'(


----------



## Rach1

Well that is crap!
Big hugs....


----------



## trogdorable

ami_j said:


> What a crappy week  Lost Pilot to a nasty resp infection, Aeon died with what looks like kidney failure, and I lost Atticus this morning...just gave up after his brother died :'(


so much in just a week =[ cant imagine how heart breaking that is.


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> What a crappy week  Lost Pilot to a nasty resp infection, Aeon died with what looks like kidney failure, and I lost Atticus this morning...just gave up after his brother died :'(


 Oh Jaime, what a sh*t week! Atticus sounds like my Hamish, he just seemed to give up when Angus died! :sad:

So sad! :sad:

RIP Pilot, Aeon & Atticus!


----------



## BMo1979

Oh no. That is really sad.

RIP Ratties.


----------



## ami_j

Thank you all, hoping for no more nasty suprises tbh


----------



## feorag

Don't blame you!


----------



## trogdorable

does anyone do anything to remember their ratties by?
im going to get a wee photo album so i can always look back and rember everyone :blush:


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> does anyone do anything to remember their ratties by?
> im going to get a wee photo album so i can always look back and rember everyone :blush:


I should get round to printing some off, i have loads of pics though, was looking back through my old ones the other night...so many memories


----------



## feorag

I've got all my piccies, but for me there's nothing better than videos. 

Poor Angus has been dead for well over a year, but I still lol at my video of him trying to carry that big sheet of paper up the side of the cage when he was nestbuilding. Videos work brilliantly, because they capture their temperament as much as what they looked like.


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I've got all my piccies, but for me there's nothing better than videos.
> 
> Poor Angus has been dead for well over a year, but I still lol at my video of him trying to carry that big sheet of paper up the side of the cage when he was nestbuilding. Videos work brilliantly, because they capture their temperament as much as what they looked like.


They do indeed, I have a lovely video of my first heart rat Siouxie as a baby, playing


----------



## feorag

Sorry meant personality rather than temperament, but you obviously know what I was getting it.

That's one of my regrets for my earlier pets, the days before video cameras and digi cameras!


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Sorry meant personality rather than temperament, but you obviously know what I was getting it.
> 
> That's one of my regrets for my earlier pets, the days before video cameras and digi cameras!


Aye it is certainly my regret about Casey, I wish I had more pics of him when he was younger...but you couldnt take pics like you can now in the 90's :lol2: had to faff about paying a fortune getting them developed


----------



## BMo1979

feorag said:


> Sorry meant personality rather than temperament, but you obviously know what I was getting it.
> 
> That's one of my regrets for my earlier pets, the days before video cameras and digi cameras!


And even digi photos have their disadvantages:
I lost all my puppy and juvi pics of Trigger, cos I had them stored on my PCs data drive. My PC "died" suddenly and no-one I knew then could recover my photos :,-(. I also lost a whole bunch of photos from the Burger Zoo in Arnhem.

As for the pets: I take loads of pics normally but haven't for a while. Need to start again.

Different subject:
Had a bit of a setback with our "Scaredy-Rat" Treacle last night. I had them out on the settee and she slipped and fell between the chair and the nest of tables. She was physically fine but totally distraught afterwards and just wanted to hide and every noise and movement spooked her until she was back inside the cage. 
Funny how even so the rats grew up together (give or take 1-2 weeks) they react so differently. When Nibbles fell behind the computer table (I know it sounds bad, but she didn't get hurt, she more or less abseiled on the wires, lol) she just waited until I knelt down and climbed onto my hands and carried on normal after. Dusty would probably do the same, but for Treacle it was a great drama. She seems normal this morning but still a bit jumpy.


----------



## ami_j

Seeing as we were on about pictures I decided to take some more 

























































__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content


----------



## **louise**

OMG, how cute is this pic??










A few pics of my 2 new girls.

Still early days yet and the hand taming is going well, although cat did pee all over me!

Cat:



























Mouse (still very nervous so rubbish pics) :


----------



## ami_j

**louise** said:


> OMG, how cute is this pic??
> 
> image
> 
> A few pics of my 2 new girls.
> 
> Still early days yet and the hand taming is going well, although cat did pee all over me!
> 
> Cat:
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> Mouse (still very nervous so rubbish pics) :
> 
> image
> 
> image


That is Harker , she is the biggest sop ever! It is her licking me in earlier pics :flrt:
Persevere hun, lots of treats and they will get lovely and tame


----------



## BMo1979

What a lovely bunch you have, Ami_J. Gets me broody, lol.


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> What a lovely bunch you have, Ami_J. Gets me broody, lol.


Awww thanks...I have terrible rat kitten broodiness atm :lol2: but i'm waiting...its so hard though :lol2:


----------



## feorag

I like the first one of her peeping out the box! :flrt:

All lovely photos! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I like the first one of her peeping out the box! :flrt:
> 
> All lovely photos! :flrt:


Isn't she cheeky :flrt:


----------



## feorag

She sure is! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> She sure is! :flrt:


She is incredible Eileen, will come running over if I go near the cage, drowns me in licks :lol2:


----------



## BlackRose

When rats show up at the front of the cage with their mouth full of food are they showing it to you? The same rat does it every morning.

All my other rats used to do it in the past. I used to have a rat that liked to push food through the bars at me as if giving it to me.


----------



## BMo1979

I don't know the answer to the above question, I'm afraid. Rats can be funny characters. 

I now know who keeps leaving the mess on the floor in front of the cage (lots of bedding). I used to think it happened during play fights and chases or when things got wild, lol, but last night I noticed that it was actually Dusty doing it very deliberately: She picks up a mouthful of bedding (Repti-Card) carries it to the front door of their cage and pushes it through with her paws. Don't ask me why though? They get plenty of attention and enrichment, fresh food, nibble sticks, etc, so it shouldn't be boredom. 
Last night they also decided to build a "wall" around their house. They must have been cold.

I also had to bend the door back into shape as the rats had figured that if the pull the door towards them hard enough the lock springs open. It's not even like they'd open the door and climb out of their cage. No, they just stay inside with the door opened. Had to apologize to my kids though, as I blamed them for opening the cage and forgetting to shut it. Oops!


----------



## BlackRose

Lol what kind of cage you got?


----------



## BMo1979

BlackRose said:


> Lol what kind of cage you got?


Unfortunately at the moment I only got the "Liberta Haven". I was bought on budget but is getting too small for the three girls. I saving up on a bigger cage with coated bars and no wooden shelves for Christmas. [email protected] are selling one I like for 85 but hopefully I'll find something similar cheaper.


----------



## feorag

Have a look at the Luna 400. I saw that at our garden centre's pet department at £100+ and really liked it in terms of a reasonably cheap rat cage. It's on line at £71 now (just checked), although when I first saw it and checked it out it was only £50+

It has coated wire which is great, the mesh floor can be removed and you would have to cover the mesh shelves, but it's a good size and what I liked about it was that it also has a door in the 'roof' as well as the front, which helps with access. I'm still thinking about buying it.

If you google Luna 400 and click on images you can see lots of photos where people have covered shelves or replaced them with plastic shelves (which is what I would do, I'd just take the shelves out of my Tom Rat cage and put them in there.


----------



## BMo1979

Thank you, I had a look and will consider this.
The one I had my eye on is the Furet Plus Rat Cage (Ferplast). I had a look at it at [email protected] and it seems quite decent. They sell it for 85 pounds at both [email protected] and Amazon, but I'm going to see if it's on ebay, too.


----------



## trogdorable

going to be bathing some ratties tonight! after being on antibiotics for absecces ( yet again¬¬ ) 2 of my girls appear to have lice!


----------



## ami_j

trogdorable said:


> going to be bathing some ratties tonight! after being on antibiotics for absecces ( yet again¬¬ ) 2 of my girls appear to have lice!


oh dear! the bephar spot on is good


----------



## trogdorable

well, they definitely did not appreciate that!:lol2:
at least not until it came to towel drying them, i obviously rubbed their itchy bits.


----------



## BMo1979

Just showing some photos I took last night

Nibbles nibbling









Dusty









Treacle saying "Mine!"









Nibbles and Dusty (I think you can tell they're half sisters)









Treacle being spooked by her own shadow again


















Nibbles trying to find a way into the kitchen (my Oh was making Crimbo Cakes)









Don't know what happened with the camera but it looks like she's got an aura









To be continued...


----------



## BMo1979

Group photo the first...









Group photo the second









Treacle doesn't mind posing









Nibbles and my son conspiring on how to get the cakes









Group photo the third









If you gotta clean, you gotta clean









Nibbles and Dusty









Nibbles still thinking about cake


----------



## feorag

Lovely photos - beautiful rats! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

Awwww clearly havin fun :flrt: I wish mine woud be more still for pics, or i had a faster camera :lol2:


----------



## Rach1

Know its round here somewhere but...
Which sex if rat is it that are ok to have orange/citrus?


----------



## XOX

Rach1 said:


> Know its round here somewhere but...
> Which sex if rat is it that are ok to have orange/citrus?


 Female as it make males smell


----------



## ami_j

Rach1 said:


> Know its round here somewhere but...
> Which sex if rat is it that are ok to have orange/citrus?


females, the d-limonene (sp>) reacts with a hormone males make and can give them kidney cancers...never heard of it making them smell


----------



## BMo1979

I think my Dusty is going through a phantom pregnancy at the moment:
She's got a round belly (but squishy and painless, I checked for signs of womb infection), hogs the food (even attacks Nibbles over it) and is nesting like a mad squirrel (piling up the bedding in and around their house, incl. emptying the poo corner X-().
I don't think she's been in season for a while - normally the one in season gets humped and "molested".

Just to reassure: There is no way it could be a real pregnancy. I only have the three does!


----------



## ami_j

awww bless her, hope shes back to normal again soon






so guys I may have a secret *whistles*


----------



## sammy1969

Hello everyone, 
I thought i would let oyu knwo that after 3 years of waiting i finally have my two blue dumbo girls and not only that but one is a rex and the other a double rex which i never thought i would be saying. With them came another rex girl as well which is a black cappedand is so sweet i am already completely wiht them all


----------



## BMo1979

sammy1969 said:


> Hello everyone,
> I thought i would let oyu knwo that after 3 years of waiting i finally have my two blue dumbo girls and not only that but one is a rex and the other a double rex which i never thought i would be saying. With them came another rex girl as well which is a black cappedand is so sweet i am already completely wiht them all



You know the drill: Despite the danger of me getting even broodier (I would love a Siamese Rat) - Photos, asap!


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Hello everyone,
> I thought i would let oyu knwo that after 3 years of waiting i finally have my two blue dumbo girls and not only that but one is a rex and the other a double rex which i never thought i would be saying. With them came another rex girl as well which is a black cappedand is so sweet i am already completely wiht them all


awww congrats sam, what type of blues are they? it must be a week for blues will need to get pics of my newbies up at some point


----------



## BMo1979

God, I hope Dusty's phantom pregnancy is over soon. She's a right little C.o.w. at the moment.
This morning I gave them their daily cereal (a few rice crispies or corn flakes).
Dusty and Treacle were next to each other, Nibbles across from them.
Out of nowhere Dusty shoots forward and nips Nibbles in the belly. Poor Nibbles ended up squeezing herself against the side of the cage and just sat there for ages with a rice crispy stuck to her snout, too scared to eat it.
Every time Dusty or even Treacle would come near her she closed her eyes.

The weird thing is that Dusty only goes for Nibbles. Could that be because Nibbles normally is the Alpha, but now Dusty is "pregnant" (in her mind) she tries to take over?


----------



## feorag

ami_j said:


> so guys I may have a secret *whistles*


Now what are you getting! :roll: and how long are we going to have to wait to find out! :bash: :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

Sounds like a possible power struggle Bree, how old are they now? 

Haha Already got them Eileen, four of them will post piccys later


----------



## BMo1979

ami_j said:


> Sounds like a possible power struggle Bree, how old are they now?


You got me there: Have to calculate, lol.
Nibbles is about 10 1/2 months old.
Treacle will be about 12 months mid December.
Dusty is the youngest at ca. 9 1/2 months, but she's also the biggest.

Nibbles used to be the more dominant one. She's also the friendliest and most confident one, nothing scares her. Since Dusty has started having a go at her over food is the first time I've seen her submissive, nearly scared, but obviously it's nature's way and as long as none of them come to any harm, I won't intervene. 
Treacle had a phase a couple of weeks back where she would try to dominate Dusty, but obviously she has now settled back into her lowest position of the pack.


----------



## sammy1969

WIll get piccies of them soon but down with nasty cold and chest infection at moment so trying to keep my distance form them lol although couldnt resist a quick cuddle with each yesterday when they arrived. THey are russian blues i think Jai but will check to be sure i have had pics of them on my fb page hun. I hav enamed the hairless Saphira and the rex Azura, but so far havent found a name suitable for the blackcapped. She is the most confident and friendly and likes to sit on your shoulder, she was chuddering away on my shoulder yesterday for ages and even bruxed which amazed me as didnt expect it to happen that quickly. She is also very cheeky and tried to pinch a bit of my pear lol. I have a funny feeling she is going to e my second heart rat as we have just clicked even Glyn is smitten with her lol.


----------



## kato

*Born Yesterday*

Sausages:


----------



## feorag

Aw, gorgeous critters - more film stars??? :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> You got me there: Have to calculate, lol.
> Nibbles is about 10 1/2 months old.
> Treacle will be about 12 months mid December.
> Dusty is the youngest at ca. 9 1/2 months, but she's also the biggest.
> 
> Nibbles used to be the more dominant one. She's also the friendliest and most confident one, nothing scares her. Since Dusty has started having a go at her over food is the first time I've seen her submissive, nearly scared, but obviously it's nature's way and as long as none of them come to any harm, I won't intervene.
> Treacle had a phase a couple of weeks back where she would try to dominate Dusty, but obviously she has now settled back into her lowest position of the pack.


Issues often are caused by lesser females, The alpha needs to put them in their place haha


sammy1969 said:


> WIll get piccies of them soon but down with nasty cold and chest infection at moment so trying to keep my distance form them lol although couldnt resist a quick cuddle with each yesterday when they arrived. THey are russian blues i think Jai but will check to be sure i have had pics of them on my fb page hun. I hav enamed the hairless Saphira and the rex Azura, but so far havent found a name suitable for the blackcapped. She is the most confident and friendly and likes to sit on your shoulder, she was chuddering away on my shoulder yesterday for ages and even bruxed which amazed me as didnt expect it to happen that quickly. She is also very cheeky and tried to pinch a bit of my pear lol. I have a funny feeling she is going to e my second heart rat as we have just clicked even Glyn is smitten with her lol.


Awwwww :flrt: I like black capped, I had a gorgeous one a few years ago


kato said:


> Sausages:
> image


:flrt: Lil babies


ETA Sam, they look like British blue  pretty


----------



## sammy1969

Lol they are lol I got it wrong bu tthe agian my brain isnt working properly at moment I need a twist on the word Angel and not Angelica to call this little black capped girl lol. She is currently down my tshirt and keeps nibbling at my fingers and nose lol


----------



## kato

feorag said:


> Aw, gorgeous critters - more film stars??? :lol2:


Not these, I already have my Film Star picked out and ready for Kato's Glee Club.


----------



## ami_j

So I promised pics :lol2: These are a long story, tiny little things 
Meet Missy, Castellane (Cas) Taittinger (Tati) and Bellefon (Belle)


----------



## sammy1969

Awwww so cute I thought you werent going to be getting anymore lol. mind oyu they are just adorable


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> Awwww so cute I thought you werent going to be getting anymore lol. mind oyu they are just adorable


I wasn't :lol2:


----------



## sammy1969

JAi hun could you come onto a page called Paws,claws hands and feet on fb as a friend on there is in need of someone with serious rat experience and i know oyu ar good at this sort of thing and they are panicking.


----------



## ami_j

sammy1969 said:


> JAi hun could you come onto a page called Paws,claws hands and feet on fb as a friend on there is in need of someone with serious rat experience and i know oyu ar good at this sort of thing and they are panicking.


sure, link me please


----------



## sammy1969

Sure will put it in pm on fb hun


----------



## feorag

kato said:


> Not these, I already have my Film Star picked out and ready for Kato's Glee Club.


:lol2:



ami_j said:


> So I promised pics :lol2: These are a long story, tiny little things
> Meet Missy, Castellane (Cas) Taittinger (Tati) and Bellefon (Belle)
> image
> image
> image
> image
> image


They're very pretty! :flrt: So what's the story?


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> :lol2:
> 
> They're very pretty! :flrt: So what's the story?


PM coming your way : victory:


----------



## ChazzieJo

I'm bringing home two lovely old, fatty rats tonight and I'm so excited! I work part time for my local PaH and they were 2 rats brought in by a customer. They were in a terrible state, both had RI's, were riddled with mites/bad skin and obese (they're still big) due to being fed a sugary/fatty diet. After a lot of dedicated treatment from both the vet team, my colleagues and myself, they're in much better shape, although unfortunately due to their condition they're likely to get reoccuring RI's and infections so will most likely be on and off antibiotics for the rest of their lives which is sad. I fell in love with them from the moment they arrived in store, they're very tame and typical old males -- very lazy! They came with a 2.5ft cage (not aboreal) which I will taking home with them free of charge. I am going to purchase some hammocks and a hanging ladder to try to encourage them to climb/excercise, but it could possibly be a waste of time lol. I've now owned rats for a long time since I was a child.

Anyone got any hints and tips? Things that I can do to try and encourage them to be as active as possible? Foods like go crazy for? I would say they're about 18months-2yrs old so a bit over the hill..
:lol2:


----------



## ami_j

ChazzieJo said:


> I'm bringing home two lovely old, fatty rats tonight and I'm so excited! I work part time for my local PaH and they were 2 rats brought in by a customer. They were in a terrible state, both had RI's, were riddled with mites/bad skin and obese (they're still big) due to being fed a sugary/fatty diet. After a lot of dedicated treatment from both the vet team, my colleagues and myself, they're in much better shape, although unfortunately due to their condition they're likely to get reoccuring RI's and infections so will most likely be on and off antibiotics for the rest of their lives which is sad. I fell in love with them from the moment they arrived in store, they're very tame and typical old males -- very lazy! They came with a 2.5ft cage (not aboreal) which I will taking home with them free of charge. I am going to purchase some hammocks and a hanging ladder to try to encourage them to climb/excercise, but it could possibly be a waste of time lol. I've now owned rats for a long time since I was a child.
> 
> Anyone got any hints and tips? Things that I can do to try and encourage them to be as active as possible? Foods like go crazy for? I would say they're about 18months-2yrs old so a bit over the hill..
> :lol2:


I would do scatter feeding with them, scatter your mix around the base of the cage and mix it in the substrate. That way they are using energy to find it and can't just hog the good bits...what are you feeding them? and their age I would be looking at a kidney friendly diet, you can make your own or rat rations do a brilliant lot of mixes. 
No8 Complete - Elderly Kidney Friendly - £0.90 : ratRations.com

you have to supplement with those mixes, its easier to make your own with a rabbit food base, as they have added vitamins and stuff  

I would also get them on fresh food, curly kale, carrot, egg as their protein source (egg white is kidney friendly)

are they male or female? males by that age I would expect to have some kidney damage and watch them for Hind leg issues...they will need a layout that encourages exercise but doesnt strain their hind legs....
heard good things about this too, think its a tiny pinch per day they need
http://www.ratrations.com/ipakitine-p-1077.html


----------



## ChazzieJo

ami_j said:


> I would do scatter feeding with them, scatter your mix around the base of the cage and mix it in the substrate. That way they are using energy to find it and can't just hog the good bits...what are you feeding them? and their age I would be looking at a kidney friendly diet, you can make your own or rat rations do a brilliant lot of mixes.
> No8 Complete - Elderly Kidney Friendly - £0.90 : ratRations.com
> 
> you have to supplement with those mixes, its easier to make your own with a rabbit food base, as they have added vitamins and stuff
> 
> I would also get them on fresh food, curly kale, carrot, egg as their protein source (egg white is kidney friendly)
> 
> are they male or female? males by that age I would expect to have some kidney damage and watch them for Hind leg issues...they will need a layout that encourages exercise but doesnt strain their hind legs....
> heard good things about this too, think its a tiny pinch per day they need
> Ipakitine - £10.00 : ratRations.com


Thanks for the reply!

I've not brought them home yet, it'll be in a few hours!!!!

I plan on purchasing nuggets (do you think the museli is better?), but I'm well aware that rats need variety in their diet.. and plain old nuggets every day will get a bit boring for them! I've been reading some care sheets and it appears they can eat almost anything (with the obvious exceptions) so they'll most likely eat what I eat, when it comes to daily veg, etc.

Good idea on the food scattering! I'm going to be using Finacard as a substrate, I used it for my late hedgehog (and I'm getting another one soon) so it'll not only save on substrate costs, but I also think it'll be nice "nesting" material for them and it's dust free.

Thanks for the links, are there any vitamins that are beneficial for rats?


----------



## ami_j

ChazzieJo said:


> Thanks for the reply!
> 
> I've not brought them home yet, it'll be in a few hours!!!!
> 
> I plan on purchasing nuggets (do you think the museli is better?), but I'm well aware that rats need variety in their diet.. and plain old nuggets every day will get a bit boring for them! I've been reading some care sheets and it appears they can eat almost anything (with the obvious exceptions) so they'll most likely eat what I eat, when it comes to daily veg, etc.
> 
> Good idea on the food scattering! I'm going to be using Finacard as a substrate, I used it for my late hedgehog (and I'm getting another one soon) so it'll not only save on substrate costs, but I also think it'll be nice "nesting" material for them and it's dust free.
> 
> Thanks for the links, are there any vitamins that are beneficial for rats?


I wouldn't use nuggets, tbh I wouldnt use a commercial brand for rats, I would get from rat rations or make my own. 
These are all good reading 
Fancy Rats • View forum - Feeding
i also highly recommend this book 
The Scuttling Gourmet - £10.00 : ratRations.com
kale is a great vegetable for them, as it carrot and broccoli, obviously there is tonnes they can have and variety is the spice of life


----------



## feorag

I agree with Jaime, I wouldn't use rat nuggets either. I feed mine the Shunamite base with anything fresh in the house.

Mine get kale, carrots, broccs, mashed potatoe & gravy, spaghetti (cooked and raw) blueberries, bananas and an occasional grape, but just an occasional one, cos they aren't too good for them. They also get a few mealworms or waxworms 2 or 3 times a week, or some dried cat food or Applaws, but mine are still under a year old, at the age of yours you have to be careful to avoid too much protein. And of course they get a chicken carcass when we have chicken, or any bones like lamp chop bones when we have stuff like that. If we have a chinese they get some rice also buy whole small brown seeded loaves when they are reduced at Asda or any other supermarket and half it. Half goes in the cage and they nibble their way through that ad lib and the other half goes in the freezer.


----------



## ChazzieJo

Thanks for all the tips, very appreciated! They'll mostly be fed good quality fruit and veg anyway, so it's good to know what's ideal for them.
:2thumb:

They appear to have settled in well... still as lazy as ever! I shall be getting them out for cuddles tonight. I gave them a ladder and within-reach hammock to try to encourage them to get off their behinds but they'd much rather snuggle up in their tunnel and sleep... they are old, so I'll forgive them!
:flrt:


----------



## ami_j

Growing like weeds :flrt:


----------



## feorag

Do I detect a game of 'bum biting' in the 7th photo! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Do I detect a game of 'bum biting' in the 7th photo! :lol2:


Yes :lol2: They behave appallingly to each other :lol2:


----------



## feorag

My kittens used to play exactly the same way - bum biting was their favourite game! :lol:


----------



## ami_j

I do love watching them play. And it probably wont be long til they start going into their first seasons so will be like a benny hill sketch when that happens XD


----------



## ami_j

New pics! they haven't half grown :flrt:


----------



## feorag

Loving the fourth one down! :lol2:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> Loving the fourth one down! :lol2:


:lol2: me too I'm SO glad I got it


----------



## BMo1979

Aww, they're losing their "mousy" look now and starting to look more like rats. Lovely girls! 
Is one eating the other ones tail, lol?


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Aww, they're losing their "mousy" look now and starting to look more like rats. Lovely girls!
> Is one eating the other ones tail, lol?


Yup, chunky little rats now:lol2: and very naughty :lol2:
They like to grab and pull at each other, no manners


----------



## feorag

Santa came early for the ratty chappies.

We cleaned out all cages thoroughly today, so decided they could have their Chrissy pressies early. A big giant knotted rope and a corrugated cardboard tube for chewing and they'll get their fruit tart tomorrow!!















































That big pile of shredded paper and strips of fleece will just about all be gone tomorrow after they've finished their nest building.


----------



## ami_j

Awww Happy Christmas Rattys :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

Been doing intros, so took the time to get some new pics


----------



## BMo1979

Lovely pictures again. 

Have you got quite small hands or is your Berkshire (4th photo down) quite a big girl (my Berky Treacle is quite a runt, very skinny and small for her age)?


----------



## jaykickboxer

I think I'm gonna go for it and buy a Gambian pouched rat I see 1 in Gambia years ago been contemplating one for years but never actually gone for it think nows the time


----------



## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Lovely pictures again.
> 
> Have you got quite small hands or is your Berkshire (4th photo down) quite a big girl (my Berky Treacle is quite a runt, very skinny and small for her age)?


I have small hands haha but she is a nice size...my other black berkshire is a quite small girl


----------



## rattlets

How can I upload a pic??


----------



## jaykickboxer

jaykickboxer said:


> I think I'm gonna go for it and buy a Gambian pouched rat I see 1 in Gambia years ago been contemplating one for years but never actually gone for it think nows the time


Amy one no what would be a decent chew proof cage for a pouched rat ?


----------



## Zoo-Man

jaykickboxer said:


> Amy one no what would be a decent chew proof cage for a pouched rat ?


You'd be best posting in the Exotic Mammal section mate


----------



## jaykickboxer

Zoo-Man said:


> You'd be best posting in the Exotic Mammal section mate


Will do cheers


----------



## ami_j

I think an explorer with a metal tray made would be a good cage for a pouchie


----------



## jaykickboxer

ami_j said:


> I think an explorer with a metal tray made would be a good cage for a pouchie[/QUOTE
> 
> Cheers I think I'm gonna go for one of them


----------



## Emma10

I just gave away my last baby today :'(

I've kept rats for a few years, but have developed a really bad allergy to them (I take 5 antihistamines, 2 nasal sprays and an inhaler every day, not to mention creams fr the itching!). I decided not to get anymore and when I was down to 1, re home him. Unfortunately I didn't expect it to happen so quickly! He's gone to a good home with 6 lads for company, I'm sure he'll be spoilt rotten. Doesnt stop the tears though!

i came on here to learn about reptiles (I feel like im cheating on the rat forum, ha!) but I'm glad to see that there are some rat fanciers too!


----------



## Moony14

Hey guys I want to try and give my rats some more interesting treats and I was wondering if it was safe to feed livefood? I'm pretty sure people have fed mealworms in the past but how about locusts, GALS and roaches? Thanks! :2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

Moony14 said:


> Hey guys I want to try and give my rats some more interesting treats and I was wondering if it was safe to feed livefood? I'm pretty sure people have fed mealworms in the past but how about locusts, GALS and roaches? Thanks! :2thumb:


locusts an roaches yes, GALS would be a right mess


----------



## Moony14

ami_j said:


> locusts an roaches yes, GALS would be a right mess


Ahaha good point :lol2: But I think I'll buy some mealies on the weekend- see how that goes and branch out into other livefoods if they like it


----------



## Disillusioned

Mine love mealies and crickets occasionally : victory:


----------



## St185

Hi guys, stupid question, but this has been bugging me for some time now.
I've got two female dumbo rats (sisters) they're about 5 month old now.
There seems to be a power struggle between the two of them, or something. Cause they groom each other alot and the groomed rat squeaks alot.
They don't bite or draw blood, but the noise they make is horrible.
Is there anything I can do to stop this or is it a rat thing that has to be sorted out between the two of them?

Thanks for any help

Pics of the two horrors


----------



## Rach1

hi,
quick questions guys...
well questions and statements!

firstly, Skyla... skye was the little rsttie i took on off vermillion at the end of november.
she settled in ok, then got a little underweight and i had to remove her and fatten her up a bit.
I decided she perhaps needed to be in with just one other rat as her last home had kept her alone...
and i wasnt sure she was coping with new rattie friends.

she went in with one of my kinder naked rats who then passed away not long after...
I'm not sure if Skyla may have bullied her or if it was a case of natural passing?
i tried Skyla back in with the other ratties but she just doesnt get on with them...at all... ive tried everything... gradual introductions the whole thing etc.
so now shes on her own in a small nursing tank after a nasty fight.
so, where do we go from here...
I'm at a loss really....

I dont want to keep her on her own but i suspect this may have to be the case...also, she really struggles to keep any weight on... despite feeding her pasta, and fruit, veg etc.... rat food, cheese, ham and other scraps.


On the general rattie observation front, I have noticed all my ladies are getting rather weather worn! 
i hate that bit of rattie keeping... when you know they are still sound and happy but perhaps haven't got another year in them.
most of my ladies are similar in age...so i suspect this year will be a year of multiple passing...:devil:
sad part of keeoing rats... their short lives...


----------



## ami_j

St185 said:


> Hi guys, stupid question, but this has been bugging me for some time now.
> I've got two female dumbo rats (sisters) they're about 5 month old now.
> There seems to be a power struggle between the two of them, or something. Cause they groom each other alot and the groomed rat squeaks alot.
> They don't bite or draw blood, but the noise they make is horrible.
> Is there anything I can do to stop this or is it a rat thing that has to be sorted out between the two of them?
> 
> Thanks for any help
> 
> Pics of the two horrors
> imageimageimage


Cute :flrt: they look topeared to me rather than dumbo though
Probably just deciding who is boss, or playing, as long as there is no blood and neither is depressed i wouldnt worry 


Rach1 said:


> hi,
> quick questions guys...
> well questions and statements!
> 
> firstly, Skyla... skye was the little rsttie i took on off vermillion at the end of november.
> she settled in ok, then got a little underweight and i had to remove her and fatten her up a bit.
> I decided she perhaps needed to be in with just one other rat as her last home had kept her alone...
> and i wasnt sure she was coping with new rattie friends.
> 
> she went in with one of my kinder naked rats who then passed away not long after...
> I'm not sure if Skyla may have bullied her or if it was a case of natural passing?
> i tried Skyla back in with the other ratties but she just doesnt get on with them...at all... ive tried everything... gradual introductions the whole thing etc.
> so now shes on her own in a small nursing tank after a nasty fight.
> so, where do we go from here...
> I'm at a loss really....
> 
> I dont want to keep her on her own but i suspect this may have to be the case...also, she really struggles to keep any weight on... despite feeding her pasta, and fruit, veg etc.... rat food, cheese, ham and other scraps.
> 
> 
> On the general rattie observation front, I have noticed all my ladies are getting rather weather worn!
> i hate that bit of rattie keeping... when you know they are still sound and happy but perhaps haven't got another year in them.
> most of my ladies are similar in age...so i suspect this year will be a year of multiple passing...:devil:
> sad part of keeoing rats... their short lives...


it is  if shes a young rat she would do better with rats her own age tbh, whats the chance of you getting her a pair of babies to be with? sometimes after being alone for a while intros can be tricky but i wouldnt keep her alone


----------



## St185

Thank you for your reply.
Stupid question, how can you tell if a rat is depressed?
I don't think they are, but it's worth knowing just in case.

I was told they were dumbo, and tbh I thought top eared and dumbo was the same! Lol

Thanks again


----------



## Moony14

St185, is it me or are they in a mini duna?


----------



## ami_j

St185 said:


> Thank you for your reply.
> Stupid question, how can you tell if a rat is depressed?
> I don't think they are, but it's worth knowing just in case.
> 
> I was told they were dumbo, and tbh I thought top eared and dumbo was the same! Lol
> 
> Thanks again


eating less, withdrawn, playing less etc 
They are the same, just different ear placement


----------



## St185

Moony14 said:


> St185, is it me or are they in a mini duna?


Sorry moony14, I'm abit thick. Lol
Duna??


----------



## St185

Ahh no, they aren't depressed.
Thank god, it's nothing serious then.


----------



## Rach1

ami_j said:


> it is  if shes a young rat she would do better with rats her own age tbh, whats the chance of you getting her a pair of babies to be with? sometimes after being alone for a while intros can be tricky but i wouldnt keep her alone


 
thats the think Amij I wasnt intending to get anymore lady rats... once my current lot were gone i was hoping to just keep males.

I only took skyla on because she was due to be PTS if no one took her...and I really couldnt let that happen.
The weight thing worries me somewhat too... TBH.


----------



## feorag

Just needed to share this! :flrt: :flrt: :flrt: :flrt:

squirrelly splish splash rat - YouTube


----------



## BMo1979

Just a few current piccies of the rat faces.

Treacle looking a bit bog-eyed (but at least she holds still for photos)









Nibbles









Dusty, half rat - half hamster









Nibbles trying to jump on my shoulder









Treacle









Dusty with Nibbles photobombing









Dusty, looking slightly chubster










Me, the crazy rat lady (including wind swept hair)

























more to follow...


----------



## BMo1979

My son Andrew and Treacle, who's supposed to be his rat









Connor and Nibbles









My youngest, who "owns" Dusty was already in bed, but Dusty is a bit big to go on his shoulder anyway.


----------



## feorag

BMo1979 said:


> Me, the crazy rat lady (including wind swept hair)...


Great photos, but surely that should be "rat swept hair"? :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

feorag said:


> Great photos, but surely that should be "rat swept hair"? :lol2:


Thanks. A bit of both maybe. I had just come back from walking the dog, lol. Mind you, Treacle and Dusty have a habit of chewing my hair,


----------



## gecko_steve

Finally got myself some ratties 3 does I've called them smokey, bandit and dusty 









Cage is a little bare atm has anyone got any suggestions where I can buy decent toys etc online? 

I'm also paranoid they are going to smell is there anything I can do to prevent this happening? I have them on back2 nature pellet type substrate is this the best? Also I got a free bag of rat nuggets to feed them, they seem to love this just wondering if this is the best food to keep them on?


----------



## ami_j

gecko_steve said:


> Finally got myself some ratties 3 does I've called them smokey, bandit and dusty
> image
> 
> Cage is a little bare atm has anyone got any suggestions where I can buy decent toys etc online?
> 
> I'm also paranoid they are going to smell is there anything I can do to prevent this happening? I have them on back2 nature pellet type substrate is this the best? Also I got a free bag of rat nuggets to feed them, they seem to love this just wondering if this is the best food to keep them on?


Nuggets are well boring for them...they love variety...this is a great article on the shunamite principles on feeding
Shunamite Rats

or for ready made food (though you need to supplement) this site is brilliant. It is also good for sourcing bits for a shunamite style diet
ratRations.com, Rat food, base mixes and herbs

There are also loads of toys and enrichment on the site...and this site has a lot of stuff
The Rat Warehouse

Other good things for toys are dog ropes from the pound shop...can make bridges with them if you unravel them
hammocks are also well loved but some rats can chew them up. 
Eileen (feorag) makes them as well as other things that the rats will love and also this site is splendid 
Fuzzbutt Cage Comforts | Funkify your cage with the coolest furniture on the net! Rat hammocks, Chinchilla hammocks, Ferret hammocks, Hamster hammocks, Rat houses, Chinchilla houses, Rat cubes

don;t hesitate to ask if i have missed something :lol2:


----------



## feorag

Aw, gorgeous little babies.

What I would do is leave the substrate as it is for a few days and you'll find that they'll choose the areas that they want to do their toilet. My first 2 chose the back 2 corners of the cage. Then I would put corner litter trays in those corners with the substrate in and they should use them as their toilets, so you can then just clean out the litter trays every few days and that will keep any smell down. I love cardboard pieces as substrate, (Finacard) as the rats love to make nests with them. 

So my routine is that I have Oko Plus cat litter in the litter trays, which I clean out once a week and finacard on the floor and only clean that out every 2-3 weeks. My rats are in my living room and they don't smell.

And yes, I have hammocks and tubes ready made up or can make them to order.


----------



## gecko_steve

feorag said:


> Aw, gorgeous little babies.
> 
> What I would do is leave the substrate as it is for a few days and you'll find that they'll choose the areas that they want to do their toilet. My first 2 chose the back 2 corners of the cage. Then I would put corner litter trays in those corners with the substrate in and they should use them as their toilets, so you can then just clean out the litter trays every few days and that will keep any smell down. I love cardboard pieces as substrate, (Finacard) as the rats love to make nests with them.
> 
> So my routine is that I have Oko Plus cat litter in the litter trays, which I clean out once a week and finacard on the floor and only clean that out every 2-3 weeks. My rats are in my living room and they don't smell.
> 
> And yes, I have hammocks and tubes ready made up or can make them to order.


Thanks feorag will try that. Had a look on your site you've some great items on there but the ones I like all seem to be out of stock. Any ideas when you will have more in?


----------



## feorag

I'm not the person who has that website. I more or less just make up to order and always have some spares and I just do it for pocket money.

Here's my thread on here http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/foru...839600-hammocks-pouches-suit-rats-skinny.html - check through all the thread as there are different items, such as 3 tier honeycomb hammocks and tubes.


----------



## BMo1979

Having some minor issues with Treacle at the moment. 
She is being quite naughty during free play recently. What she does is she nips me for attention. She doesn't really bite, but it's a small sharp scratch and not very pleasant. Normally it's right in the neck when she's sitting on the back of the chair, but yesterday she was playing next to me and nipped me in the elbow :gasp: and my (chubby) sides.
I think she does it for a game, cos when I react she hops back and forth, seems really giddy and when I turn away she comes back to do it again. It's only me she does it with, too, cos she doesn't really trust the children and my husband. 
I've tried the "naughty puppy" method: Squeaking in a high pitched voice, but she doesn't care. Probably, cos I can't "speak rat" properly, lol. I don't want to "physically" correct her (how harsh does that sound?), cos she's quite fragile, both mentally and physically. 
Should I maybe remove her from the play zone and put her back in her cage? I don't want to stress her out too much by isolating her, but would that maybe be the right method?
When Trigger was a puppy and play bit we would stop the game and he's be sent to his bed, but would a rat make a connection like this, too?

This is the "culprit", btw. If that helps assessing from afar: She is the lowest ranking rat in the pack of 3 and seems to be going through phases like that (I had that nipping thing before but at that time it seemed more like grooming). She's a lot braver in her cage at the moment, too, and wants a lot more interaction (and treats, lol).


----------



## trogdorable

do any of you ratty people introduce your rats ( safely ) to any of your cats you feel would tolerate it?


----------



## feorag

My cats show no interest in the rats, even when they are running around, so I would trust them with them. I wouldn't trust the dog though!!!


----------



## gecko_steve

Does anyone have any recommendations for preventing tumours in rats, only just got my 3 but already want to plan for the seemingly inevitable


----------



## ami_j

gecko_steve said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for preventing tumours in rats, only just got my 3 but already want to plan for the seemingly inevitable


feed a good diet like the shunamite diet, keep them active, stay away from overly processed stuff and keep them lean. these things help but genetics has a part to play too


----------



## trogdorable

gecko_steve said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for preventing tumours in rats, only just got my 3 but already want to plan for the seemingly inevitable


edit : just realised youd already bought them so my point was mute lol. heres my girl nibbler introducing herself to a little kitti. the picture where they are face to face was taken just before kitti ran away from the big scary beast


----------



## gecko_steve

Bit late for the pet shop thing lol. I've done a bit of research on the shumanite diet but need stuff they sell in pets at home (my only petshop near enoguh) so does anybody have recommendations for which rabbit foods to use from them? Can I use rat nuggets instead of dog food?


----------



## feorag

trogdorable said:


> edit : just realised youd already bought them so my point was mute lol. heres my girl nibbler introducing herself to a little kitti. the picture where they are face to face was taken just before kitti ran away from the big scary beast
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image
> 
> image


Great photographs, but what's wrong with Kitty's nose??


----------



## ami_j

gecko_steve said:


> Bit late for the pet shop thing lol. I've done a bit of research on the shumanite diet but need stuff they sell in pets at home (my only petshop near enoguh) so does anybody have recommendations for which rabbit foods to use from them? Can I use rat nuggets instead of dog food?


I wouldnt use the nuggets, there have been links to lumps with them. for what you pay for a kg of rat nuggets you can get a good food from 
ratRations.com, Rat food, base mixes and herbs you will need to supplement though


----------



## trogdorable

feorag said:


> Great photographs, but what's wrong with Kitty's nose??


no idea, it was like that for a day or so and completely gone now. got the poor wee mite from a woman who bought him for her hellish children, who proceeded to throw him about the house by his tail and legs.
no damage was done thankfully.


----------



## feorag

If he was being treated like that it was probably stress making his nose run and he'd maybe been over-licking?

Poor we soul - glad you got her away from there!


----------



## trogdorable

feorag said:


> If he was being treated like that it was probably stress making his nose run and he'd maybe been over-licking?
> 
> Poor we soul - glad you got her away from there!


the woman had previously gotten rid of her 10 year old cat because once it scratched her oldest daughter , who is grabby and not very bright for her age.

the IQ level of some people really worry me sometimes.

now she talking about getting a puppy . . .


----------



## MRS MURPH

Got these three little darlings a couple of months ago and they are so much fun.

First up Oreo my husbands little girl

















Cookie my little girl


















Arrow my daughters pride and joy

















I cant believe how much i've become obsessed with them:2thumb:


----------



## ami_j

:flrt::flrt::flrt: cute


----------



## feorag

MRS MURPH said:


> Got these three little darlings a couple of months ago and they are so much fun.
> 
> First up Oreo my husbands little girl
> image
> image
> 
> Cookie my little girl
> image
> image
> 
> 
> Arrow my daughters pride and joy
> image
> image
> 
> I cant believe how much i've become obsessed with them:2thumb:


It's just too easily done! I love my little ratties

Yours are all gorgeous! :flrt: I love photos of ratties peeping out of the door of their cage like Oreo is doing. :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

Our rat Nibbles is just too chilled out, lol.
I cleaned the cage yesterday, so took the top bit off, no reaction from Nibbles. Then I lifted the house and there she was, asleep, not bothered the slightest. That rat could sleep next to a bomb explosion and not bat an eyelid, lol:









While Nibbles lazes around, Dusty helps by pushing the bedding around


----------



## feorag

:lol2: Bless her! :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

It was so funny watching the rats last night. 
My husband gave them all baked dog treats (Trigger doesn't like them, cos they're veggie pastry, he prefers meaty treats, the spoiled beggar). Nibbles took her's behind the house - this is her "it's all mine!" eating corner.
Dusty took her's into the house (she likes to line them up against the wall for some reason), while Treacle took her's and then came back to see if there's more (she's the skinniest runt, but also the greediest).
When she didn't get any more she decided to steal Dusty's treat. At the same time Dusty sniffed out Treacle's unattended biscuit. The ended up for ages like this:
Dusty running out of the house, stealing Treacle's sweet, at the same time Treacle running into the house stealing Dusty's, and vice a versa. No-one ate theirs for a couple of minutes (apart from the smarter Nibbles), cos they were too busy running by each other stealing and taking back. I thought rats were supposed to be clever... :lol2:


----------



## feorag

They're so funny aren't they? Whenever I give mine puppy biscuits, hazelnuts in shells or 'normal' stuff Kenzie takes his, rushes inside the big tube and eats it there. Archie on the other hand takes his to the poo litter tray :gasp: stores it and immediately comes back for another one and as long as I give him something, he'll come back for more! 

Unless of course the treat is something extra specially tasty like a little square of Manuka honey or Marmite on toast - that gets taken and eaten immediately!


----------



## BMo1979

I'm a bit worried and can see a trip to the vet coming up if it happens again:

Dusty had some kind of panic attack this morning. I was giving them their morning treats (cereal), she came out of her house followed by Treacle and suddenly did a half somersault. No-one's touched her and it literally came out of nowhere. She then sat with her body flat on the ground and her head up, breathing heavily.
I tried to get her to smell my hands, cos I assumed that she got spooked by me putting the treats in and she freaked again, jumping into the corner, clinging onto the cage bar, then dashing into their house on the top platform, where she just froze. I have never seen her move that fast.
I tried offering her a treat which she completely ignored (totally out of character), but didn't want to touch her in case she panicked again, so I just left the treat sitting there (Treacle eventually stole it) and told the kids to stay away from the cage for now.
When I came back from the school run/dog walk, Dusty was still there but Nibbles seems to have picked up on her distress and is lying cuddling with her (it's quite heartwarming how she looks after her). This seems to have a calming effect on her cos she ended up taking a treat from me and smelled my hand. 

It's so unlike her, cos she's normally quite laid back and I'm quite worried cos I remember FM Garlicpickle's (?) rat had the same symptoms and ended up having to be PTS, cos it gradually got worse.
I'll leave her completely alone and see what she's like when I change their food and water and clean out their toilet. I really hope it was only a fright she got.


----------



## MRS MURPH

Hi all.

Have any of you had any experience with rat shows, there is one in preston in a couple of months and my daughter fancies showing her pride and joy.
Can anyone tell me more about them?

Thanks
Kerry


----------



## Rackie

MRS MURPH said:


> Hi all.
> 
> Have any of you had any experience with rat shows, there is one in preston in a couple of months and my daughter fancies showing her pride and joy.
> Can anyone tell me more about them?
> 
> Thanks
> Kerry


I presume that's a NERS show. I've only been to one NERS show, but they're all a friendly bunch  
Have a look on their website, there should be a bit more info on there. But shows are fun, great chance to meet new people and get to know more about rats etc. As your first time showing, you probably want to show the rats in the pet section, where they're not judged on their variety, but on how friendly they are. I'm not brilliantly familiar with the NERS pet rules, as they're quite different from the NFRS rules. But normally you enter the rats before the show (usually by wednesday of the preceding week) and arrive before the judging time. The show sec on the day will let you know what you have to do when you're actually there  Any more questions about showing etc. feel free to PM me or ask more on here!


----------



## feorag

I've never shown at a rat show, but I went to a couple just to have a look around before I got my rats and I really enjoyed myself. At the NERS Christmas show I stood for awhile watching the girl who was judging the pet rats and found it really enjoyable. I would suggest you go because I'm sure your daughter will thoroughly enjoy it - even if she decides not to show her pride and joy, she should go along and get a 'feel' for what happens at shows and just goes to see all the other beautiful rats.


----------



## MRS MURPH

Thanks for the replies, Its only 20 minutes away from us so we're gonna go and have a nosey and of course arrow (rat) will be joining us. My daughter cant wait she already shows dogs but when i mentioned the rat show that was it, Apparantly she NEEDS to go :lol2:


----------



## feorag

*nods* I can understand that! :2thumb:


----------



## MRS MURPH

Hi all,

Thought i'ld show my new cage off. The wire shelf half way up has now been covered and litter trays are now in. My 3 darling girls love it :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

MRS MURPH said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Thought i'ld show my new cage off. The wire shelf half way up has now been covered and litter trays are now in. My 3 darling girls love it :flrt:
> 
> image


I bet they do  Lots of lovely space in there


----------



## feorag

Great set-up! :2thumb:


----------



## wohic

Some of my beautiful gang


----------



## feorag

Gorgeous! :flrt: Loving the tongue shot!


----------



## BMo1979

Definitely gorgeous ratties and nice set-up. I'm loving the "wild coloured" baby.

I have to let my rats run on the bed at the moment, as our new dog Storm is too prey orientated to be safe around them. I enjoy this, though, cos I get to read my book and Nibbles and Dusty just cuddle up under my arms. They have really calmed down over the months and have become really affectionate. Treacle still nips me at every occasion, she's a little madam, but it doesn't really hurt just gives me a fright every time she does it. She's not vicious, just cheeky and she just doesn't understand that all play, affection and treats stop as soon as she does it. Bless her, she's not the smartest.


----------



## BMo1979

Haven't bumped this thread for ages.

So how's everyone's rat faces doing? Any new additions to the pack? Any sad losses?

Mine are still the same, although Treacle looks more "threadbarer" every week. Dusty is getting quite fat, cos she's a lazy sod, lol and Nibbles is just Nibbles.
The rats and Storm still "hate" each other. Well, Storm actually loves them.... to eat, lol!
The girls know she's dangerous for them though and it shows in their behaviour. Nibbles has no quarrels about greeting Trigger when he's at the cage or even when I'm holding her (she gives him kisses), but with Storm she goes into attack mode straight away. I couldn't even attempt to hold her when Storm is next to me, she'd probably jump, she's crazily fearless, lol!


----------



## wohic

Mine are all doing well, have a couple of beautiful marten litters ,such pretty babies x also have another explorer cage coming , the boys are going to love me !


----------



## kato

wohic said:


> Mine are all doing well, have a couple of beautiful marten litters ,such pretty babies x also have another explorer cage coming , the boys are going to love me !


Wohic does have some lovely rats and "another explorer cage coming". Perhaps her tolerant husband might just have "another fishing rod or reel coming".:whistling2:

Simon.
Administrator and Tolerant Husband.


----------



## feorag

kato said:


> Wohic does have some lovely rats and "another explorer cage coming". Perhaps her tolerant husband might just have "another fishing rod or reel coming".:whistling2:
> 
> Simon.
> Administrator and *Tolerant Husband*.


I've got one of those too! :2thumb:

Pretty useful to have around!


----------



## Anna_x

Hi everyone, I'm wondering if you can help me....

I have two brothers, both 2 years and 4 months old, and one of them, Desmond, has just been diagnosed with a brain tumour. At the moment I am keeping him comfortable and spoiling him rotten in his final days as I know he doesn't have long left.

However I was wondering if anyone has any advice on what to expect from the other one, Clouse, when Des passes. He has always been different from the other two (Jerry, the third brother passed before Christmas unexpectedly). Clouse has always been the first to try everything, the most intelligent, the bravest and the friendliest. He's generally a very independent character, but how lonely is he going to be when Desmond isn't with him anymore? They used to fight like thunder but still curl up with each other every night. 

I'll definitely be spending a lot more time with Clouse when he's left on his own, getting him out all the time etc, but as I have no plans to keep anymore rats after these guys, does anyone have any advice on how to make Clouse as happy as possible without getting too lonely?

Thanks, 
Anna x


----------



## Disillusioned

Aww my mum had this happen recently and now her little female (Rolo) is on her own. The only thing you can really do is spend as much time as possible handling them and cuddling them. Rolo had 4 other rats for company and they all died within 2 months so quite a dramatic change but we let her sit on our shoulder more often now and keep her in the living room so she can always see us and don't get as lonely. 
Sorry about your little guy, I love rats so much but they do break your heart xx


----------



## feorag

I've always bought in a pair of babies when my 2 oldies get to almost 2 years old, so that a rat is never left alone and that's always worked well for me.


----------



## Laura_M

I have loved looking through this thread! Sadly i cant have any rats at the moment but love them idea of them for sure and its been interesting reading all of your posts and problems etc! My best friend has a pair of boys , one who is gorgeous and friendly and one who is more temperamental , i got to meet them the other day and took a few pics . Dobbie is the one that isnt as tame , but Dylan is a cutie! Heres some pics of him chilling on her lap , he let me style his hair!



And here with his funky do




I would love a pair or trio , but i keep snakes and have 10 plus 19 incubating , plus a dog and if i had them i would want to make sure i spent all the time they deserved! Keep the pics coming guys!


----------



## BMo1979

Laura_M said:


> I have loved looking through this thread! Sadly i cant have any rats at the moment but love them idea of them for sure and its been interesting reading all of your posts and problems etc! My best friend has a pair of boys , one who is gorgeous and friendly and one who is more temperamental , i got to meet them the other day and took a few pics . Dobbie is the one that isnt as tame , but Dylan is a cutie! Heres some pics of him chilling on her lap , he let me style his hair!
> 
> http://s1274.photobucket.com/user/Bashino/media/IMAG1098_zpsebea0165.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> And here with his funky do
> 
> http://s1274.photobucket.com/user/Bashino/media/IMAG1100_zps9e6c9598.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> 
> I would love a pair or trio , but i keep snakes and have 10 plus 19 incubating , plus a dog and if i had them i would want to make sure i spent all the time they deserved! Keep the pics coming guys!


He's a cracker! Too cute :flrt:.
If I'm "allowed" rats again, after the girls are gone (hopefully not anytime soon), I would' love to get a couple of males just to see what the difference is. I've always had does and although they have their snuggle moments, it never lasts any longer than 2 minutes and they're off exploring and playing again.


----------



## Anna_x

Laura_M said:


> I have loved looking through this thread! Sadly i cant have any rats at the moment but love them idea of them for sure and its been interesting reading all of your posts and problems etc! My best friend has a pair of boys , one who is gorgeous and friendly and one who is more temperamental , i got to meet them the other day and took a few pics . Dobbie is the one that isnt as tame , but Dylan is a cutie! Heres some pics of him chilling on her lap , he let me style his hair!
> 
> [URL=http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/Bashino/IMAG1098_zpsebea0165.jpg]image[/URL]
> 
> And here with his funky do
> 
> [URL=http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/Bashino/IMAG1100_zps9e6c9598.jpg]image[/URL]
> 
> 
> I would love a pair or trio , but i keep snakes and have 10 plus 19 incubating , plus a dog and if i had them i would want to make sure i spent all the time they deserved! Keep the pics coming guys!


He's gorgeous! :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

Finally bought the girls a new cage today. They seem to like it.


----------



## feorag

Looks good!


----------



## kato

Cute eh? The Hooded Martin isn't bad either.:whistling2:


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## feorag

Gorgeous! :flrt:

I mean the rat of course! :roll2:


----------



## Rach1

hello...
thought I'd pop on and update myself on what you're all doing...much the same as always it seems. :flrt:

I've lost a few of my ratties recently but that was to be expected as they are all getting on now- most of them (bar 2) are 2 years old or coming up two... 
not sure If i'll get anymore now after these have gone as I'm so busy with Leon and work... maybe a smaller collection! LOL


----------



## trogdorable

repost of my 2 fav photos of mew:flrt: i have 4 girls right now that are over 3 years, so expecting some loses this year. why cant they live longer =[


----------



## feorag

Pinched this from Facebook - how cute is that?? :flrt:


----------



## BMo1979

Aww! Is that real or photoshopped (just wondering about the size of the teddy, lol)?
Mine would rip the teddy apart...


----------



## feorag

Probably photoshopped, but it just made me melt a little inside! So Sweet! :flrt:


----------



## ami_j

Gave the rats some leftovers. they loved it :lol2:


----------



## BMo1979

They're clearly enjoying this, lol.
That's the great thing about rats: They eat just about anything you give them (within limits of course).


----------



## feorag

Mine love a portion of our pasta when we have it! :2thumb:


----------



## Middleton Mouse

My mum saw that photo of the rat with the teddy and then excitedly asked me "where can u get rat teddies" over facebook.

As for rats eating anything, my mum made some gluten free cake for my aunts birthday and they wouldn't eat that. To be fair to them when we threw their piece in the car it hit the dash and bounced. If I mind right they ate the nuts off the top but dragged the actual cake into their litter tray and left it there.


----------



## LizardFTI

Just upgraded my 4 girls into a big converted aviary cage. My mischief of rats enjoying new cage - YouTube

How many rats do you think this could comfortably house? I am thinking of adding a hairless female and/or a neutered boy (or a pair, dependant upon what my rescue has) if there is room?


----------



## Ping pong

Rats don't need a certain space per animal. There are calculators around but they are a waste of time. I just go on common sence so long as the rats can move freely, access food and fresh water at all times and have a place to sleep they will be fine. It's more up to how often do you want to be cleaning the cage and re filling waterers and feeders. You could offer 10 rats your entire living room to live in and I guarantee you will find them all piled up on each other once they are all settled in. Cage looks awsome.


----------



## feorag

I've been to the vets with Archie this afternoon and it's not looking good. :sad:

His breathing is dreadful. He's had a problem on and off for months now and Baytril hasn't done anything, neither has Doxycyline.

He was put back on Doxy the Monday before my holidays, so when he went to Alison (shunamite) for his holidays, she kept him on it and also gave him Baytril, but she agreed with me when we got back that there hadn't been any improvement. 

She suggested trying Draxxon, which a lot of vets don't carry, but her vet gets in for her, so I got an appointment with her vet - earliest we could go was tonight. She says he's got a very swollen tummy, but has no idea whether it's a tumour or not. She's going on holiday next week, so wasn't able to give me an appointment to investigate until the week after.

She pointed out that he was bright, alert and seemingly not affected by it and asked whether I wanted to try the Draxxon or wait, so I said I'd try the Draxxon, in case it helps his breathing and just observe to see if he goes downhill.

So me not a happy bunny tonight. :sad:


----------



## Middleton Mouse

feorag said:


> I've been to the vets with Archie this afternoon and it's not looking good. :sad:
> 
> His breathing is dreadful. He's had a problem on and off for months now and Baytril hasn't done anything, neither has Doxycyline.
> 
> He was put back on Doxy the Monday before my holidays, so when he went to Alison (shunamite) for his holidays, she kept him on it and also gave him Baytril, but she agreed with me when we got back that there hadn't been any improvement.
> 
> She suggested trying Draxxon, which a lot of vets don't carry, but her vet gets in for her, so I got an appointment with her vet - earliest we could go was tonight. She says he's got a very swollen tummy, but has no idea whether it's a tumour or not. She's going on holiday next week, so wasn't able to give me an appointment to investigate until the week after.
> 
> She pointed out that he was bright, alert and seemingly not affected by it and asked whether I wanted to try the Draxxon or wait, so I said I'd try the Draxxon, in case it helps his breathing and just observe to see if he goes downhill.
> 
> So me not a happy bunny tonight. :sad:


Sorry to hear your ratty isn't well. We've found that Zithromax (azithromycin) has worked very well with respy rats even completely curing one who had to be placed in a oxygen chamber for 24 hours twice due to her breathing difficulties.


----------



## feorag

I've used Zithromax on one of my cats who had a persistent urt problem, but never heard of it being used on rats.

I'll see how we get on with the Draxxon, but the swollen belly is causing more concern at the minute. 

Thanks for the heads up thought, I'll certainly consider if the problem isn't a tumour and the Draxxon doesn't help.


----------



## feorag

Well poor Archie now has a visibly big belly and when I looked at it tonight, I could actually see, never mind feel a lump. :sad:

At the minute he's still perky and eating, so I'm just gonna keep an eye on him. If he gets lethargic or doesn't welcome his supper, then I think that'll be the time! :sad:


----------



## ami_j

Bless him  So sorry to hear that Eileen


----------



## feorag

I know Jai. :sad:

What worries me is Kenzie. Barry made such a song and dance about me introducing the 2 of them to Dougal after Wee Jeemie died, because he was pretty aggressive with them at first, so he absolutely doesn't believe that they HAVE to have company and has told me in no uncertain terms that if something happens to one of these 2, then we aren't getting any more until it dies. So now I'm worried about kenzie, maybe being left on his own for what could be months. :sad:


----------



## ami_j

feorag said:


> I know Jai. :sad:
> 
> What worries me is Kenzie. Barry made such a song and dance about me introducing the 2 of them to Dougal after Wee Jeemie died, because he was pretty aggressive with them at first, so he absolutely doesn't believe that they HAVE to have company and has told me in no uncertain terms that if something happens to one of these 2, then we aren't getting any more until it dies. So now I'm worried about kenzie, maybe being left on his own for what could be months. :sad:


 is he not convincable?


----------



## feorag

:roll2: You don't know my Barry!! He's a typical Arian, stubborn as a goat! PMSL!!

He's really got an idea into his head that I was wrong to introduce these 2 boys to Dougal, because according to Barry he was quite happy on his own! You may remember Wee Jeemy died on the Sunday night and I took ill on the Tuesday and of course was basically bedridden and housebound for the best part of 6 weeks, after which I only went out if a friend came and collected me, so it meant that Dougal was on his own for about 2 months. I couldn't locate anyone with kittens and finally in desperation for Dougal resorted to buying these 2 from PaH! :gasp:

So now I'm trying to get my head around what to do.


----------



## Moony14

Hi guys I'm looking for some advice: is it time I rehomed my rats? The thing is I have very little interest in them as despite my best efforts they have never tamed down and as a result are pretty much cage-bound. I'm thinking it's best that I offer them to a new home but I only want someone who has experience with rats and understands that they won't be soppy, cuddly rats like you see online. Where should I advertise them? I don't think gumtree would be a good idea, please help!


----------



## LizardFTI

Moony14 said:


> Hi guys I'm looking for some advice: is it time I rehomed my rats? The thing is I have very little interest in them as despite my best efforts they have never tamed down and as a result are pretty much cage-bound. I'm thinking it's best that I offer them to a new home but I only want someone who has experience with rats and understands that they won't be soppy, cuddly rats like you see online. Where should I advertise them? I don't think gumtree would be a good idea, please help!



Hi Moony. A little background about your rats would help with offering advice. 

Are they male/female? How old are they? How long have you had them? What is their cage like? Where is it kept? Have they always been aggressive or did something happen to change them?

I am happy to chat via PM if you find it easier. Its a hard decision to rehome something, so I would hate for you to do it unless its the very last resort.


----------



## Moony14

ELZ1985 said:


> Hi Moony. A little background about your rats would help with offering advice.
> 
> Are they male/female? How old are they? How long have you had them? What is their cage like? Where is it kept? Have they always been aggressive or did something happen to change them?
> 
> I am happy to chat via PM if you find it easier. Its a hard decision to rehome something, so I would hate for you to do it unless its the very last resort.


Sorry ofcourse you need more details :blush: I have 4 male rats- all brothers I think but the two litters had been kept together. I think they were bred for snake food but I didn't realise that when I bought them. They hadn't had any socialisation from the breeder. I've owned them for about a year and a half and in that time I've made very little progress with them. They will only come on my hand for a couple of seconds before running back into the cage. Now they live in our utility room which is seperate from the house as my mum couldn't tolerate the smell as hard as we tried to keep them clean. Also my dog wouldn't leave the cage alone and I was worried he was going to bite their tails when they poke through the bars. Their cage is a Liberta Abode and is furnished with toys and hammocks. I just don't think I'm giving them the attention they deserve and have learnt that rats (well the ones I have at the moment atleast) are very different from what I was lead to believe from my research before buying them. I feel terrible for not giving them attention but no matter how much I've tried with the advice I've been given they aren't what I was expecting from my pet rats.


----------



## LizardFTI

Moony14 said:


> Sorry ofcourse you need more details :blush: I have 4 male rats- all brothers I think but the two litters had been kept together. I think they were bred for snake food but I didn't realise that when I bought them. They hadn't had any socialisation from the breeder. I've owned them for about a year and a half and in that time I've made very little progress with them. They will only come on my hand for a couple of seconds before running back into the cage. Now they live in our utility room which is seperate from the house as my mum couldn't tolerate the smell as hard as we tried to keep them clean. Also my dog wouldn't leave the cage alone and I was worried he was going to bite their tails when they poke through the bars. Their cage is a Liberta Abode and is furnished with toys and hammocks. I just don't think I'm giving them the attention they deserve and have learnt that rats (well the ones I have at the moment atleast) are very different from what I was lead to believe from my research before buying them. I feel terrible for not giving them attention but no matter how much I've tried with the advice I've been given they aren't what I was expecting from my pet rats.



Do they fight with eachother? Neutering may help they to calm down a bit if they are fighting.

In terms of taming them, its never too late to start, but you might find they never fully come round to the idea. You might find that handfeeding treats is beneficial for building trust. My first 2 girls were about a year old from a rescue and they couldnt be handled, but with daily attention (starting with simply sitting in the same room as their cage for an hour a day and over time opening the door/spot cleaning while they were in there but not attempting to touch them) a year later, 1 of the 2 will actually walk out of the cage up onto my shoulder unprompted.

What have you tried so far to win their trust?


----------



## Moony14

ELZ1985 said:


> Do they fight with eachother? Neutering may help they to calm down a bit if they are fighting.
> 
> In terms of taming them, its never too late to start, but you might find they never fully come round to the idea. You might find that handfeeding treats is beneficial for building trust. My first 2 girls were about a year old from a rescue and they couldnt be handled, but with daily attention (starting with simply sitting in the same room as their cage for an hour a day and over time opening the door/spot cleaning while they were in there but not attempting to touch them) a year later, 1 of the 2 will actually walk out of the cage up onto my shoulder unprompted.
> 
> What have you tried so far to win their trust?


Nope no fighting, they're too lazy aha

I honestly don't think they will ever tame down properly. I've been trying pretty much every technique under the sun for the past year (treats, forced taming, sitting in the same room for hours on end). They just don't enjoy human interaction in the way I imagined rats too- that's where my issue lies and why I think they need a better home where the owner appreciates them how they are. I honestly think my expectations were too high. I planned to teach them tricks and have them out on my shoulder a lot but it's just no feasible.


----------



## LizardFTI

Moony14 said:


> Nope no fighting, they're too lazy aha
> 
> I honestly don't think they will ever tame down properly. I've been trying pretty much every technique under the sun for the past year (treats, forced taming, sitting in the same room for hours on end). They just don't enjoy human interaction in the way I imagined rats too- that's where my issue lies and why I think they need a better home where the owner appreciates them how they are. I honestly think my expectations were too high. I planned to teach them tricks and have them out on my shoulder a lot but it's just no feasible.


Some rats are harder work than others- I had 2 when I was little 1 was lovely, they other was a bitey psycho. It took a *lot* of work to get him to stop biting. If you've had them this long, id personally be tempted to stick with it and start training from scratch. Is the utility room quiet? It might help them to calm down if they feel secure in their environment.


----------



## Moony14

ELZ1985 said:


> Some rats are harder work than others- I had 2 when I was little 1 was lovely, they other was a bitey psycho. It took a *lot* of work to get him to stop biting. If you've had them this long, id personally be tempted to stick with it and start training from scratch. Is the utility room quiet? It might help them to calm down if they feel secure in their environment.


I've all but given up I'm afraid and I don't want to keep them if there is a better home out there. I'd rather give them to someone who appreciates they don't really want to be handled. I got them to handle and play with but they just aren't what I wanted from my pet rats and so I think they should go to a new home- as hard as it is for me to admit.


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## Disillusioned

Hiya everyone

I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.
My mum hasn't been very well lately so I decided to pop in and help her clean out her animals and get things a bit tidy. 
When I checked on her rat he had a bad case of mites and I was fuming!
To cut a long story short, I've cleared his mites with Ivermec but where he has scratched himself silly he has a big sore on his side that I thought would heal once the mites were treated but it hasn't.
Is there anything I can put on it to help it heal?
I've been giving him ibuprofen to ease any pain but he keeps licking the sore and even though it's clean it's not healing up.


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## Middleton Mouse

You can get little cone collars for rats but you'd probably need to order online or buy from a vet. Dermisol cream if you can get that would be good but unsure if you can buy that from somewhere other than a vet. Purple spray would also keep it clean and you can buy that from equine supply shops.

Someone else may be able to suggest something. We don't tend to use anything other than what we get from the vet.


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## BuckingFrill

Hi, I posted a thread about my rats a while ago and I got loads of great suggestions on how to tame one of my rats. We have 2 rats, Nixie and Freyja and we've had them for about 3-4 months now. Freyja is lovely. She lets us handle her, pet her and she loves getting her tummy scratched. However, Nixie our white and grey fancy rat is a complete psycho! She bites and draws blood whenever you go near her, we need gardening gloves on to fill her food bowl. We thought that she was follow Frey's lead after a while and give in, but nothing has worked. We've tried sitting with them for hours, letting her sniff our fingers (she just chomped them), bribing her with treats (First yoghurt off a spoon, then we moved on to yoghurt on the finger, hoping that she would still take it... She bit me and ignored the yoghurt.), putting socks in with them that we wore so they knew our smell. Nothing has worked! We think she might be at least slightly blind, she moves by hearing and smell, not sight. If I drop a treat in for her she can't see it even if it's right in front of her. She'll sniff about until she finds it. Plus her eyes are a kinda dark red, if that's a clue?
I was wondering if her inability to see could be part of the problem? It's a shame because I'm petrified to go near her now, and she's almost bitten my very young daughter before too, just because she toddled near the cage, and we can't get her sister out because she attacks us when we try even though Frey wants out. When we change their water she launches herself at the improvised paper-clip holder we made too. It's whenever ANYTHING enters her cage she pounces. 
Does anyone know anything that could help? I don't want to give her away or have her put down if there is anything else I can try. Even if it's to help with stopping her being so territorial, it would help a little. I want to give them both the best care I can, but I can't look after her sister properly while she's there. Unless I can figure out a way to tame her, I might have to get rid of her and find a new friend for Frey. It would break my heart as I fell in love with Nix the second I seen her in the pet shop.


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## feorag

Disillusioned said:


> I've been giving him ibuprofen to ease any pain but he keeps licking the sore and even though it's clean it's not healing up.


You could try Manuka honey, it has brilliant healing and antiseptic qualities?

One of my rats had a hole in his groin where an abscess had burst and I put Manuka honey on it every day and it healed great!


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## feorag

And just for fun!!


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## Disillusioned

Ok thanks guys I'll try and get one of them collars I think and try the manuka honey. I know it will heal if the little sausage just leaves it alone!


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## Middleton Mouse

The main advantage of a cone collar is of course the fact that rats look hysterical when wearing one.


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## Disillusioned

Middleton Mouse said:


> The main advantage of a cone collar is of course the fact that rats look hysterical when wearing one.


Haha that's so mean :lol2:I was looking online for one earlier and can't find one! I also read that they aren't good because ratties can't eat properly wearing one...do you think that's true?
I ordered some of that cream that you mentioned middleton mouse, I'm also going to get some of that honey as well because the poor little fella needs all the help he can get!


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## Middleton Mouse

they can find it difficult to hold food when they're wearing a collar but they do learn to simply eat from the bowl. I also tend to give ill rats easily digestible food like baby food, potato and scrambled eggs. They can eat all of that stuff no problem wearing a collar.


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## lisadew24

Disillusioned said:


> Haha that's so mean :lol2:I was looking online for one earlier and can't find one! I also read that they aren't good because ratties can't eat properly wearing one...do you think that's true?
> I ordered some of that cream that you mentioned middleton mouse, I'm also going to get some of that honey as well because the poor little fella needs all the help he can get!


What about a child's sock cut the toe bit off and put on like a t-shit over the wound then use some of the vet tape to hold in place or you could leave of the tape if you think he will leave it then give him things like treat balls or kongs to keep his mind of the area


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## Disillusioned

lisadew24 said:


> What about a child's sock cut the toe bit off and put on like a t-shit over the wound then use some of the vet tape to hold in place or you could leave of the tape if you think he will leave it then give him things like treat balls or kongs to keep his mind of the area


Lol that's a good idea I'm so gonna go try that! Cream should turn up tomorrow so might wait til then. He is so cute though, I'll have to get a pic of him up x


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## bampoisongirl

I have ratty babies for the first time in years :flrt:

Also, can anyone advise me of best bulk substrate and food for rats? It's been ages since I've kept them and bred them and with moving scotland all my usual places are miles away. I've been buying carefresh from pets at home but its £6 a bag and that only does one change. I've also been using rat nuggets and bringing them other stuff up at night like bread, meat, fruit and veg, is there anything better for them?


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## feorag

I use cardboard pieces, similar to Finacard, which you can order on line for my substrate and cat litter in my litter trays. All my rats have always used their litter trays, so I clean out the litter trays every 5-7 days and only clean out the substrate every couple of weeks. A large bale lasts me absolutely months for about £10.

I'm lucky cos I live about 10 minutes away from Alison Campbell of the Shunamite Stud who wrote "The Scuttling Gourmet" book on rat nutrition, so I just go to her house and buy 4Kg of her ready made mix and I don't have to worry about balancing ingredients. Mine do get fresh food every day though, a bit of whatever we're eating, fruit, vegetables, they get kale every week and they love cous cous, which they get once a week. I soak it like the recipe says and then add mixed veg, or fruit and sometimes nothing, they love it!

This is a good link for what rats can and can't eat. It's an American site so not all the foods are available anyway, but it will give you ideas of what is safe for you to give them.

Good and Bad Food for Rats & Ratty Recipes


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## bampoisongirl

feorag said:


> I use cardboard pieces, similar to Finacard, which you can order on line for my substrate and cat litter in my litter trays. All my rats have always used their litter trays, so I clean out the litter trays every 5-7 days and only clean out the substrate every couple of weeks. A large bale lasts me absolutely months for about £10.
> 
> I'm lucky cos I live about 10 minutes away from Alison Campbell of the Shunamite Stud who wrote "The Scuttling Gourmet" book on rat nutrition, so I just go to her house and buy 4Kg of her ready made mix and I don't have to worry about balancing ingredients. Mine do get fresh food every day though, a bit of whatever we're eating, fruit, vegetables, they get kale every week and they love cous cous, which they get once a week. I soak it like the recipe says and then add mixed veg, or fruit and sometimes nothing, they love it!
> 
> This is a good link for what rats can and can't eat. It's an American site so not all the foods are available anyway, but it will give you ideas of what is safe for you to give them.
> 
> Good and Bad Food for Rats & Ratty Recipes


Does the cardboard soak up odors? They are at the bottom of our bed, I'm intending on litter training them as they only really go in one corner anyway, but even with picking poo out everyday it still gets a bit wiffy. Where can you get it from? I've been reading a lot of good stuff about kale and cous cous for them recently, I'll definitely pick some up for them next time I'm in the shop. Thank you!

EDIT have found the finacard site, looks pretty good!


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## feorag

Mine are in my living room, beside my settee, so pretty near me and they don't stink. I just put a litter tray in the corner where they did their business and that was it and every new pair of babies I've introduced have followed the older boys. At one stage one of the boys I have now started weeing on the top shelf of the cage, so I put a litter tray up and that stopped it. The use that one mainly for wees and the one on the floor of the cage mainly for poos. They do wee in their nest constantly, so I use a large igloo for that (being covered helps) and they just spend hours carrying the cardboard and shredded paper in their and building a nest, so I just empty that when I do the litter trays. 

I use Oko Plus cat litter because over years of cat ownership I've tried almost every cat litter on the market and this is the best and most economical I've found. It's highly absorbent and clumps instantly and just doesn't smell, cos I've got a litter tray for the cats in the living room too and it seriously doesn't smell.

The rats have all gone through a stage when they were about 4 months of their wee being stronger, but that passes after a couple of months, but overall the smell isn't very strong at all. No smellier than my snakes or APDs.


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## Herpard

I've had pet rats since before i could walk.

We've used all sorts of substrates, soil, eco earth, carboard, newspaper, shredded paper, wooden cat litter, wood shavings (not sawdust) old clothing and aubiose.

the best substrate ive found is aubiose hemp bedding, it really does help with the smell but then again i cleaned out our rats at least twice a week. Our rats were kept in either my bedroom, my sisters bedroom or in the hallway. They are always kept in a large cage, not these horrible small hamster or mouse cages.

We've not had rats for almost a year now (it's the longest we've not had rats since 1991) but hopefully getting some more next year.


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## bampoisongirl

Herpard said:


> I've had pet rats since before i could walk.
> 
> We've used all sorts of substrates, soil, eco earth, carboard, newspaper, shredded paper, wooden cat litter, wood shavings (not sawdust) old clothing and aubiose.
> 
> the best substrate ive found is aubiose hemp bedding, it really does help with the smell but then again i cleaned out our rats at least twice a week. Our rats were kept in either my bedroom, my sisters bedroom or in the hallway. They are always kept in a large cage, not these horrible small hamster or mouse cages.
> 
> We've not had rats for almost a year now (it's the longest we've not had rats since 1991) but hopefully getting some more next year.


Wouldn't touch auboise with a barge pole. Used to use it for snakes and it smelt foul and grew mouldy very quickly!


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## Herpard

bampoisongirl said:


> Wouldn't touch auboise with a barge pole. Used to use it for snakes and it smelt foul and grew mouldy very quickly!


I've never had a problem with it, been using it since 2007.


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## bampoisongirl

Herpard said:


> I've never had a problem with it, been using it since 2007.


Dunno if it was due to different living conditions or what then, but it was absolute rubbish.


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## Herpard

Here's some of our late guys and gals.

Some babies we bred (only bred 2 litters, 13 in one and 4 in the other)

















































Pearl (one of the 13 baby rats) a few days before she died. She was an old girl and would always snuggle up in her pouch on my bed whilst i watched TV or was on one of my consoles








Stinker, she was a naughty girl









Sorry for the photo bomb


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## Herpard

bampoisongirl said:


> Dunno if it was due to different living conditions or what then, but it was absolute rubbish.


could've been a dodgy batch?

i had a 20kg bag left over from the rats that i kept in a damp shed, it had no mould growth but did become a nest to a family of mice lol.


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## bampoisongirl

Herpard said:


> could've been a dodgy batch?
> 
> i had a 20kg bag left over from the rats that i kept in a damp shed, it had no mould growth but did become a nest to a family of mice lol.


Hahaha! May have been? Think I'll try the finacard stuff first and see how that goes.


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## feorag

bampoisongirl said:


> Wouldn't touch auboise with a barge pole. Used to use it for snakes and it smelt foul and grew mouldy very quickly!


I use Aubiose for my snakes and haven't had a problem with it, but to be honest it never crossed my mind to use it for my rats.

They absolutely love the cardboard pieces and it's great entertainment when their nest has been cleaned out, watching them industriously carrying the cardboard piece back to build a new nest. It's a great boredom buster as well as a substrate. :2thumb:

I did go out and buy a bale of Megazorb when I got my APDs and to be honest I hate that! I really don't like the smell of it at all. So once this bale is finished I'll be putting the APDs on cardboard pieces too.


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## Herpard

feorag said:


> I use Aubiose for my snakes and haven't had a problem with it, but to be honest it never crossed my mind to use it for my rats.
> 
> They absolutely love the cardboard pieces and it's great entertainment when their nest has been cleaned out, watching them industriously carrying the cardboard piece back to build a new nest. It's a great boredom buster as well as a substrate. :2thumb:
> 
> I did go out and buy a bale of Megazorb when I got my APDs and to be honest I hate that! I really don't like the smell of it at all. So once this bale is finished I'll be putting the APDs on cardboard pieces too.


I loved watching the baby rats with the cardboard squares, they would run about with random pieces lol.


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## feorag

I also give mine our home shredded paper, but I hang it through the bars at the top, so they have to climb up and collect it, then carry it down to their nest. Keeps them occupied and as I said 'boredom busting'


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## bampoisongirl

Quick question,

new mummy rat (1wk old babies) has been a bit unhappy with one of the other rats, she is in with another pregnant female and a non pregnant female. I wanted to seperate her into her own cage so she isn't as stressed, question is, do I:

1) Seperate her on her own with her babies
2) Seperate her and her babies with the pregnant soon-to-drop female
3) Seperate her and her babies with the non pregnant female

??


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## wohic

bampoisongirl said:


> Quick question,
> 
> new mummy rat (1wk old babies) has been a bit unhappy with one of the other rats, she is in with another pregnant female and a non pregnant female. I wanted to seperate her into her own cage so she isn't as stressed, question is, do I:
> 
> 1) Seperate her on her own with her babies
> 2) Seperate her and her babies with the pregnant soon-to-drop female
> 3) Seperate her and her babies with the non pregnant female
> 
> ??


I would put her on her own with the babies in a nursery cage , I do this with my does a couple of days before they are due so they have time to nest and settle . the trouble with keeping them all together is fights could well break out , and tug of wars over the babies resulting in dead or maimed kits .


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## bampoisongirl

wohic said:


> I would put her on her own with the babies in a nursery cage , I do this with my does a couple of days before they are due so they have time to nest and settle . the trouble with keeping them all together is fights could well break out , and tug of wars over the babies resulting in dead or maimed kits .


Great thanks, will seperate her when I get home, I've got a few spare enclosures just in case!


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## feorag

Well today is the day! :sad:

Archie tumour is now enormous his belly is on the ground and his side looks like theirs a golf ball in it, but up until now he's been acting perfectly normally. Always rushes to the door when I go to have a cuddle and eating perfectly normally.

However, last night before I went to bed he didn't come out of his nest to speak to me and wasn't interested in his supper, which was mixed veg and cous cous and he normally loves that. I took him out and he was very subdued. So I made the decision last night that if he was still with us this morning then he's going to the vet for his final journey, before he suffers.

My gut feeling is right because he didn't come out of his nest this morning and is very subdued. He did eat a bit of banana, but showed no interest in a piece of cooked potato - again a favourite, so I know the tumour is causing him problems now! 

At the minute he's sitting on my chest quite calmly and then I'm taking him up to my vet this afternoon before surgery so the vet can give him a peaceful sleep.


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## BMo1979

I'm very sorry to hear that.

Sleep well, Archie, and say hello to Nibbles.


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## BMo1979

Had to take Dusty to the vets this morning.
Last night I found her in her cage, lying flat out like a pancake. She's quite a chubster normally (lazy and greedy), but she looked humongous. When she moved I noticed small blood clots where she'd laid and it was coming from her bits. She was basically having a small hemorrhage. I cleaned her up, sat with her for a while to calm her and put her back in the cage when the bleeding had disappeared. After that she was bright as always going straight for the food bowl and water and begging for a treat. Because it was quite late at night I thought I'd just phone our usual vet first thing in the morning rather than taking her to the emergency 24 hr one (in the middle of Glasgow).

The vet is now putting her on treatment for a womb infection (because she's not bleeding constantly and the blood is not fresh), but she also said that due to her history of phantom pregnancies it could also be that she's suffering from something similar to polycystic ovaries and unless she finds an alternative hormonal treatment, spaying would be the only option to get rid of it (obviously weighing up the risk of anesthetics vs if her quality of life is lowered significantly). Good news is, that the vet could not feel any obvious tumors.


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## feorag

Fingers crossed that it is just an infection that anti-biotics can cure!


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## ami_j

Wow I have neglected this a bit! Sorry for all the losses since I last posted  
I recently lost Luna, My and Missy :'(

The reason I haven't been about is I was really thinking about whether I was carrying on in rats, for various reasons.

After much soul searching and thought I decided to get a pair of boys- slower and more likely to sit and cuddle. I do love my girls though. I am planning on slowly moving over to just keeping bucks for that reason, but we will see

anyway enough gabble meet my new boys


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## BMo1979

Gorgeous wee boys!

Sorry for your losses, too.

I'm in the same place as you were: Now Nibbles has passed away (prematurely) one part of me tells me never to get rats again when Dusty and Treacle are gone, because it only take a short time to get majorly attached to these little characters and before you know it, their lifetime is over :,(. Another part is not sure whether I can stick to this decision, because I have fallen in love with rats all over again (had 2 female when I was younger) and would probably like to see what it's like to have boys.
I don't think my husband would agree though.

I can tell my 2 remaining girls are getting on a bit (Treacle is about 21 months and Dusty 19). Although Treacle is still as fit as anything and climbs the whole height of the cage, she looks really "threadbare" and thin, like a frail looking old woman. She still is the first one at the cage door and loves being talked to. Dusty struggles with her weight, because she's sooo lazy. I've moved their food bowl up on the shelf and removed the ladder and occasionally scatter feed, but when they have free play, she just keeps coming up for cuddles or finds a hiding place and sleeps, I just can't get her to play with toys or anything. 
Her affectionate behaviour has only really increased since Nibbles died. She used to be quite indifferent to being picked up and stroked and now she actually seeks it out and "bruxes" away when you tickle her behind the ears.


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## feorag

Me three! :sad:

Sorry to hear about your losses Jaime and I know exactly where you're coming from. I'm not sure either about whether to carry on with my rats. Kenzie is 19 months too and has just had a blitz course of Baytril cos he was wheezing like mad. It's stopped it - for now, but likely it will come back and these were pet shop rats, so I didn't expect them to make such old bones as my previous ones from breeders who knew their lines etc.

If I could have located a pair of babies at the time Archie died I would have gone ahead, but as the weeks go by and no babies on the horizon, I'm also beginning to wonder about whether to get any more or whether to just enjoy Kenzie for a while. :sad:

Have thought about getting another little furry critter that has a longer lifespan, but just not sure at the moment which direction to go in.

Just really not sure at the moment.


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## ami_j

Aww guys *hugs* they just don't live long enough. And the health problems!


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## feorag

Yup! Although I think Ellie would be gutted if I didn't get any more, because her parents won't let her have a pet, so she loves coming to our house and playing with all mine. :sad:


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## bampoisongirl

Question: Do rats need mineral stones and additional supplements? I've been reading a lot on rodent diets recently (rabbits, rats, hamsters etc) and there is conflicting information on if they actually need mineral stones/cuttlefish/mineral drops whilst in captivity.

Opinions please?


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## wohic

I add multi vitamins to the water twice a week


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## feorag

I feed the Shunamite diet which I buy direct from Alison at the Shunamite Stud. She also gives me a vitamin mix which gives them what they don't get from the diet and I add that to their wet food (usually cous cous) every week.


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## ami_j

i don't give mine supplements, i use rabbit food as a base for my mix which has nutrients such as vitamins, copper etc added plus i give them nutrient rich fresh food so all bases are covered


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## RescueCat

I had my first go of pea fishing with my four baby boys yesterday!
Tingle and Puppy got the hang of it rather quickly, but Beemo and Bailey just drank the water! Puppy ended up stuffing two peas in his mouth and another in one hand to run in the tunnel and "stash them" only to have Beemo steal them!

Beemo and Bailey eventually got peas, though. When they tipped the water everywhere... :lol:


----------



## BMo1979

RescueCat said:


> I had my first go of pea fishing with my four baby boys yesterday!
> Tingle and Puppy got the hang of it rather quickly, but Beemo and Bailey just drank the water! Puppy ended up stuffing two peas in his mouth and another in one hand to run in the tunnel and "stash them" only to have Beemo steal them!
> 
> Beemo and Bailey eventually got peas, though. When they tipped the water everywhere... :lol:


It's hilarious to watch, isn't it?
Mine fish for the peas and then shake their paws super fast to get the water off. Treacle also peels them and only eats the inside of the peas.


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## Disillusioned

Aww I love watching mine go fishing! I normally let them do it a lot more in summer though 'cause they end up soaked!

Totally unrelated but my Auntie has just got two new female rats, unfortunately they are from a petshop but oh my god they are teeny!
They sold them to her at apparently 6-8 weeks old but they look no older than 4 weeks to me! Soooo small! adorable little things though.


----------



## feorag

BMo1979 said:


> It's hilarious to watch, isn't it?
> Mine fish for the peas and then shake their paws super fast to get the water off. Treacle also peels them and only eats the inside of the peas.


Mine peel their peas too! :lol2:


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## pippainnit

Hello! 

Firstly, it has been absolutely ages since I have been on this forum (possibly 2 years?!) Anyway, I have 3 rats at the moment - Enid, Olive and Beatrice. This is the smallest number of ratties I have had in nearly 15 years of being a rat mum, and unfortunately I have had to make the, albeit very hard, decision that this will be my last cohort of rodents. There's myriad reasons behind this (far too many to list, really) but it's come to the point where I've had to accept that I'm no longer able to take on any more rescues. 

My three very much live a life of luxury. They have a spare room to themselves with an open cage and pretty much are ladies of their own manor, however they're all coming up to 3 years of age now and I've noticed that Beatrice in particular is starting to slow down a fair bit. Beatrice and Olive are sisters, and Enid is a couple of months younger. 

This has no doubt been discussed on here before, but my question is this: has anyone had experience of being left with a lone rat come the time when they've decided that they're no longer able to take on any more as company? With the exception of introducing another rat as a companion, how else have people dealt with this situation? I have never, ever had a rat on its own, but also have to accept that it's highly unlikely that all 3 will potentially go at the same time. I have also never had to rehome a pet and this is not a path that I would consider lightly, certainly not at the girls' ages. This has been something that has terrified me for years. It's bad enough only having 3 at the moment as I'm used to at least 9 or 10 of the critters running round.

What do people think is the best way to deal with this hypothetical situation? 

Any advice, suggestions, experience, anecdotes greatly received! And a 'hello' to any of those that may remember me from a bygone age on here! 

Pippa x


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## BMo1979

I've got a suspicion that my girl Dusty is (going) blind. She's ruby eyed, so her vision would be terrible anyway, but I've noticed a change in her behaviour. She seems quite slow and a bit uncoordinated recently.
I've always suspected her hearing is not the best, being a mainly white Dumbo, so nowadays I have to make some serious noise to get her to come out of her house. When I wave a treat in front of her she moves up very slowly, whereas she used to grab it at lightning speed. Last night I put her on their platform where the food sits and she just sat there for ages, with her body quite low to the ground and moved her snout along the floor. She also seemed like she was trying to find her way back down, so I put the ladder back on and tapped it to help her, yet she still managed to miss the bottom and slipped (was under an inch, so she didn't hurt herself luckily).
I've now moved their food bowl back down and while it had hardly been touched for the past couple of days (Treacle is not a big eater, because she's quite small and skinny), this morning it was considerably emptier than usual.
To me it looks like she's insecure about being to far away from her house. She's still fine with being picked up by me, but I make sure she's aware of my hands approaching her.


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## RescueCat

Hey, anyone know how to stop rats tipping stuff over? Tingle has an obsession with it, and EVERYTHING goes over. The hides, food bowls, litter trays etc.

He's actually flipped bowls onto the other rats too, and I'm kind of getting annoyed at him now!
I'm gonna get a ceramic bowl as soon as I get money (I know, terrible rat owner for not having money right now, but I was meant to get my student loan two months ago!), but I dunno if that'll stop his obsession!


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## ami_j

for dry food try scatter feeding


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## BMo1979

I'm going to have to take Dusty back to the vet and I think it doesn't look good :,(.
If you remember I recently thought she'd gone blind. I think she's also showing signs of having a Pituitary (sp?) Tumor. She can't climb anymore, sleeps most of the time, can't hold anything in her front paws and has red stuff coming from her eye. She doesn't walk properly neither seems to drag herself around more or less. She's also lost some weight and when I pick her up she just seems very limp and weak.
I've given her a flat water bowl and scatter food in front of her house, because I'm worried she can't reach the water bottle and food inside the bowl. I also give her mushed veg and fruit, so she can just eat it from a plate and doesn't have to hold it. She still has an appetite and has not become aggressive as you often hear of rats with PTs, so that's a good sign, right?
She's not even 2 yet, so since Nibbles (died of heart disease) was her half sister it must be down to bad breeding.


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## feorag

I think you're probably right. I bought my first rats from a long time breeder of rats who knew her lines and they both lived well past their second birthday. My next two came from another breeder, not so long time breeding, one died young and the other died at 2. the next 2 I bought at a pet shop (against all my own advice to others) purely because I just couldn't locate anyone with kittens at that time anywhere near me and I was worried about Dougal being on his own. they both had problems with myco from about 8 months old, Archie had to be put down with a tumour when he was only 15 months, but if he hadn't had that tumour he wouldn't have lasted much longer anyway because his breathing was dreadful, and Kenzie is now breathing badly too. :sad:

It doesn't sound good though! :sad:


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## BuckingFrill

I think we have to find a new home for our girls... Nixie is just too aggressive for us! We've tried so many techniques to calm her down but nothing is helping. She almost bit my 18 month old daughter because she accidentally threw her dolly up there and went to get it. I just can't keep her if she's a threat to Lilly. She's bitten me several times and she draws blood every time. 
I think someone will be able to tame her, probably someone with more experience since Nixie and Freyja were our first rats. I'm devastated. I've never had to rehome/put animals up for adoption before. 

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


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## feorag

Yey!!!! Finally located a couple of gorgeous wee kittens who will be heading on their journey from Balloch, near Loch Lomond to South Shields on Wednesday and then I will be picking them up on Thursday.


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## BMo1979

Oh, I didn't know you were planning on getting more rats.

Very cute babies. They still need to grow into their ears.:flrt:


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## feorag

I've been debating it since I lost Archie, but couldn't find any babies straight away after he died, so kenzie's been on his own since June, cos I was determined I wasn't going to get any from the pet shop after the health of these last 2 which came from PaH. 

Barry is against me introducing new babies to him because of the problems we had when we introduced Archie & kenzie to Dougal, but he says it's my choice and now that Toyah has located these 2 boys, I've decided to go for it.


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## ami_j

I'm sure it will go wonderfully Eileen! Kenzie is neutered is he not, and not a nervy rat? I seem to remember Dougal being nervy, and screamy nervous rats are horrible to intro, as they get the other rats backs up with how they act. Atari was like that drove me bonkers. 

Gorgeous boys, I'm jealous :lol2:


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## BMo1979

feorag said:


> I've been debating it since I lost Archie, but couldn't find any babies straight away after he died, so kenzie's been on his own since June, cos I was determined I wasn't going to get any from the pet shop after the health of these last 2 which came from PaH.
> 
> Barry is against me introducing new babies to him because of the problems we had when we introduced Archie & kenzie to Dougal, but he says it's my choice and now that Toyah has located these 2 boys, I've decided to go for it.


I see. Good for you and I'm sure Kenzie be fine with the little ones. 
My husband Garry would be against bringing new rats in, too, if Dusty doesn't make it, because he (rightly) believes it would leave me stuck in a vicious circle, but I'm worried about Treacle being by herself. She's not the most confident rat to start with and has always clung to the others. I would probably not get babies, but maybe if I find 1-2 adult females I could convince him (don't really want to think about worst case scenario, but Dusty's just so weak, although earlier she's polished off nearly a whole plate of rice and mushy swede by herself).


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## feorag

All my boys have been neutered, but you're right, of all my rats Dougal was the most nervous, although not screamy nervous.

I think the problem with Kenzie was that he wouldn't leave Dougal alone when I first introduced them (after weeks of them living side by side and a bath and dry and run around the bathroom which went brilliantly) and tried them in the big cage and Dougal didn't want to know and nearly bit his nose off! :gasp:

Anyway we'll see how it goes.

Brigitte, I know you rescued the 3 girls, but do you not want to keep keeping rats?


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## BMo1979

feorag said:


> Brigitte, I know you rescued the 3 girls, but do you not want to keep keeping rats?


I didn't rescue them, they were bought. Nibbles and Dusty were from a small pet shop who were allegedly buying from a breeder and were half sisters.
Treacle is from [email protected], against better judgement, because Nibbles was the only female left from her litter and I was desperately looking for another baby girl asap (Dusty wasn't there yet).
As for keep keeping rats: I'm torn. On one hand, I love having them. They're great fun, smart and affectionate, but losing Nibbles so young and potentially Dusty, too, has gotten to me. I'm also worried that juggling between 2 dogs, 3 primary school kids and a husband who has some health issues, I might not be able to give them the time they deserve and for rats it wouldn't be fair. I've managed so far, but it has been hard at times and there have been days when they weren't out much for free play. 
I know myself though, I will probably end up getting rats again, but I know it'll be me who will do all the caring and cleaning.


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## feorag

Hmm.... don't know where I got the impression you'd rescued them - obviously someone else.

I know what you mean. I've been swinging back and forward about whether to stop now or get 2 more babies and keep them for another 2 years.

I think if Toyah hadn't found me these 2 and a couple of babies hadn't come up in the next few weeks, I might have stopped.


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## BMo1979

Dusty is still with us for now, although the outlook isn't good.
The vet is pretty sure that she has a "spread tumor" (can't remember the medical term now), i.e. you can't feel them at present, because it sits all over the body, incl. brain stem, which explains the neurological symptoms.

There is no cure, so when the time comes when she suffers too much, I will have to send her over the rainbow bridge.
The vet didn't want to do it today, though, because she still enjoys her mushed down food and treats and there is still a little fight in her left. When she shone the light into her eyes (Dusty's not completely blind, but has cataracts on both eyes), she kept kicking her quite strongly and tried to jump back into the carrier. 
She's given me more painkillers/anti-inflammatories which I can increase when I think she's uncomfortable, but she told me that Dusty will not get better. Rats' metabolic systems are fast, so we could be talking months at best or weeks at worst. All we can do now is keep her comfortable and make the right decision at the right time.
I'm very upset, especially since she's become more affectionate over the past weeks, but at least I can kind of mentally prepare myself and my kids for it now.

I was amazed how intuitive Treacle is though. When I checked on them this morning just before taking Dusty out, Treacle was lying across her body when she normally lies next to her. When I reached for Dusty after announcing that it was just me and letting them sniff, she actually bit me and it wasn't just a little "what have you got for me" nibble, but a proper defensive bite! She's never bitten me before and she knew it was me!
When I put her back after the appointment, Treacle straight away checked her face and when Dusty went into their house to go back to sleep, Treacle started building a bedding wall around her. Now she's lying in front of her trying to hide her, which is a bit impossible, because Treacle is a skinny little runt and Dusty is a lot bigger.


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## feorag

So sad, but as you say you have time to prepare and more importantly time to prepare your children. 

You'll know when it's time, the same as I did with Archie. Right up until the night before, he was loving his food. His last night he just didn't want to eat and I knew that was the time. :sad:

I just so wish they lived a bit longer.


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## BMo1979

feorag said:


> So sad, but as you say you have time to prepare and more importantly time to prepare your children.
> 
> You'll know when it's time, the same as I did with Archie. Right up until the night before, he was loving his food. His last night he just didn't want to eat and I knew that was the time. :sad:
> 
> I just so wish they lived a bit longer.


I know, it's not fair, as they really bond with their owners.

Well, the Metacam seems to make Dusty a bit more comfortable (and hungry). I gave her 2 doses yesterday and she wolfed down a plate of mixed veg and was out a bit more. Today she also seems more lively, but obviously the neurological damage is irreparable, as she's still not using her front paws and can't climb. Tonight they had leftover Spaghetti Bol. and she was very happy about that, too. Treacle is playing nurse and keeps her clean and brings bedding into the house. She looked after Nibbles, too, when she was sick.


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## feorag

Sounds good actually. Although it's not a permanent solution, it's obviously helping her to have a quality of life and that's great!


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## RhianB87

BMo1979 said:


> I know, it's not fair, as they really bond with their owners.
> 
> Well, the Metacam seems to make Dusty a bit more comfortable (and hungry). I gave her 2 doses yesterday and she wolfed down a plate of mixed veg and was out a bit more. Today she also seems more lively, but obviously the neurological damage is irreparable, as she's still not using her front paws and can't climb. Tonight they had leftover Spaghetti Bol. and she was very happy about that, too. Treacle is playing nurse and keeps her clean and brings bedding into the house. She looked after Nibbles, too, when she was sick.


Metacam helped mine when he had tumours. It just made him a bit more comfortable for his last few months. 

I really miss having rats  Only ever had 3 but they were brilliant and cant wait till I can get some again. Will be avoiding pets at home though!


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## BMo1979

FallenAngel said:


> Metacam helped mine when he had tumours. It just made him a bit more comfortable for his last few months.
> 
> I really miss having rats  Only ever had 3 but they were brilliant and cant wait till I can get some again. *Will be avoiding pets at home though!*


I would, too, but that said: My rat Treacle was bought from [email protected], because no-one had another female pup as company for Nibbles (who was from a small pet shop, that got their rats from a "breeder", and only ever had them for 1 week max, before either returning them to the breeder or having sold them). She's small, skinny, has scarred lungs from having been kept in a bare, drafty cage at [email protected], anxious, has scratches, because she's got a genetic skin condition, is starting to look threadbare. She's about 22 months old, yet, she's the most active, stills climbs all the way to the top of the cage and jumps over gaps, has a great appetite and is very smart (does everything for a treat, lol). We always thought, she'd be the first to "go", but so far she's outliving the 3 of them.
I wouldn't buy from them again though, because apart from her health issues, she was quite hard to "tame" and she still only fully trusts me and my youngest son (because they're in his room).


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## ami_j

Might have a confession to make :whistling2:

























































































One from today xD


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## Middleton Mouse

Love the photo of the wee one on its back.:lol2:

Not sure if anyon'es interested but I was directed to this video about rats. A group of lab rats were given access to a secure outdoor enclosure and their behaviour recorded. 

Welcome to RATLIFE.org


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## feorag

C'mon Jaime - spill!!!

Gorgeous ratties - that second one could be my Dougal reincarnated! :flrt:

Well I collected my wee Loch Lomond boys on Thursday afternoon and they are settling down really well. I took these photographs when I first got home with them and let them out to have a run around on the kitchen bench. They were both tentative, but not terrified considering they'd been picked up from their breeder, taken to Glasgow, brought down in a show tank on the train from Glasgow to South Shields, kept overnight in the garage, then picked up by me and brought home. So looking good!!!

I'll get better photographs later when they settle down more, but meet Ruadhi McDhui - Rui for short



And Wee Willie Wallace - Wallace for short

  

And both of them.


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## BMo1979

Can they get any cuter? :flrt:

Broody... not good, lol.


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## ami_j

I made the mistake of going near the adoption centre at petsathome. the black varigated is Captain Jack and the russian blue is Stitch. though pics make him look brown and minky. Been introing them to Loki and Casper, just moved them all into the big cage. they are lovely squishes. 
Your new boys are gorgeous Eileen hope your intros go as well as mine


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## feorag

So tell me, how long between bringing in the PaH rats did you introduce them??


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## ami_j

about 9-10 days. just to make sure they were well and to decide whether i thought my kittens were both big enough (casper is a runt so has hadcatching up to do


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## feorag

Ah, that makes me feel better! I was thinking around about that time, but in the meantime putting the cages together so they can interact in safety. That's the way I've always done it and it worked until Dougal. I did wonder thought whether that was because he'd been alone too long, cos he bit the end off both their tails when they were hanging out their cage and he could reach them and of course nearly de-nosed kenzie.

So I'm hoping Kenzie will be easier to integrate, because he's never been as nervous as Dougal, so may be more friendly towards the babies. If not, then I'll just keep them separate, as I seriously don't think kenzie will make old bones.

Which is why I didn't want to get another pair from PaH, unless they'd had some in their adoption centre, but they never have as I've always checked every time I'm in my local branch.


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## ami_j

some rats will just bite stuff that comes through the bars. i use the carrier method, i'm honestly not sure if having them side by side will have any benefits.


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## feorag

Not being funny, but I think if I'd used the carrier method with my last lot that Kenzie would have ended up with more than his nose hanging off.

After settling the babies in their cage on Thursday evening, I left them alone until today and today got them out onto the dining table (which doubles as my work table and so is full of interesting stuff to explore) and let them run about as I sorted out my face painting tool box and put all my clean brushes and sponges away after Thursday. They had a whale of a time and weren't fazed at all by being out in the open, although Rui took a little longer to find his bravery than Wallace.

They had a good explore and loved it when I put the big tool box on the table and they climbed in - little beggars wouldn't get out again! :gasp: Every time I lifted them out, then ran and climbed back in again! :lol2:

Rui in the jewellery toolbox



Wallace in the facepaint brush tray



Wallace having a bath in the brush tray and remembering to wash behind his ears - good boy! :2thumb:

 

Rui still in the jewellery toolbox



And in the big tool box among the paints and glitters

 
 


When I put them back in their cage, I moved it to the front of the living room between the Dormice and Kenzie, expecting them to be cream crackered after running around for nearly an hour and would go to sleep. No way, they were out in the cage running around looking at what was going on around them and having great fun.

And a little video

My new baby ratties - YouTube


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> Not being funny, but I think if I'd used the carrier method with my last lot that Kenzie would have ended up with more than his nose hanging off.
> 
> After settling the babies in their cage on Thursday evening, I left them alone until today and today got them out onto the dining table (which doubles as my work table and so is full of interesting stuff to explore) and let them run about as I sorted out my face painting tool box and put all my clean brushes and sponges away after Thursday. They had a whale of a time and weren't fazed at all by being out in the open, although Rui took a little longer to find his bravery than Wallace.
> 
> They had a good explore and loved it when I put the big tool box on the table and they climbed in - little beggars wouldn't get out again! :gasp: Every time I lifted them out, then ran and climbed back in again! :lol2:
> 
> Rui in the jewellery toolbox
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-3_zps0c3f6185.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> Wallace in the facepaint brush tray
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-1_zpsbb82de0f.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> Wallace having a bath in the brush tray and remembering to wash behind his ears - good boy! :2thumb:
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-4_zpsd63ccaec.jpg.htmlimage http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-5_zps67fe3296.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> Rui still in the jewellery toolbox
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-7_zps0e2ae9ba.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> And in the big tool box among the paints and glitters
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-10_zps509040fa.jpg.htmlimage
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-9_zps34448a50.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> 
> When I put them back in their cage, I moved it to the front of the living room between the Dormice and Kenzie, expecting them to be cream crackered after running around for nearly an hour and would go to sleep. No way, they were out in the cage running around looking at what was going on around them and having great fun.
> 
> And a little video
> 
> My new baby ratties - YouTube


Maybe, I honestly reckon it was because he was climbing on his cage. My girls will nip at each other if say one escapes the cage and is on the other side of the bars, when they live together very happily. It is in an adults nature to grab a baby and groom it, to have it submit. Plus Dougal was a nervy boy. When are you planning on starting intros with these boys?


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## feorag

ami_j said:


> Maybe, I honestly reckon it was because he was climbing on his cage. My girls will nip at each other if say one escapes the cage and is on the other side of the bars, when they live together very happily. It is in an adults nature to grab a baby and groom it, to have it submit. Plus Dougal was a nervy boy. When are you planning on starting intros with these boys?


I introduced them the same way as I did the two I got from Neil (OldTyme) on here to the 2 I got from Toyah.

Put them in cages side by side, then after a couple of weeks, took them upstairs in the bath, bathed them all, dried them and let them run around the bathroom floor observing - no problems whatsoever and then finally brought them downstairs and put them in the newly clean, domestosed cage. Dougal and Wee Jeemy were accepted readily by Angus and Hamish, so I used the same approach when I got Archie and Kenzie. They were fine for about 10 minutes and then I heard Kenzie squeak and saw that Dougal was chasing him away and had nipped him, then I heard a loud squeak and saw that Dougal had bitten his nose.

I thought I'd do the same with these two and see what happened. So living side by side for about 10-14 days and then an introduction in the bath and see how it goes.


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> I introduced them the same way as I did the two I got from Neil (OldTyme) on here to the 2 I got from Toyah.
> 
> Put them in cages side by side, then after a couple of weeks, took them upstairs in the bath, bathed them all, dried them and let them run around the bathroom floor observing - no problems whatsoever and then finally brought them downstairs and put them in the newly clean, domestosed cage. Dougal and Wee Jeemy were accepted readily by Angus and Hamish, so I used the same approach when I got Archie and Kenzie. They were fine for about 10 minutes and then I heard Kenzie squeak and saw that Dougal was chasing him away and had nipped him, then I heard a loud squeak and saw that Dougal had bitten his nose.
> 
> I thought I'd do the same with these two and see what happened. So living side by side for about 10-14 days and then an introduction in the bath and see how it goes.


The neutral space is good, but honestly Eileen, living side by side will do nothing for their intro, intros are for them to sort out hierachy and they can't do this until they meet. I don't say this to disagree with you, I want to help you do it as easily as possible, as I know that intros are stressful (i dont think there is one i have done where i havent been stressing) especially with babies (they dont half carry on about being put in their place)


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## BMo1979

feorag said:


> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-1_zpsbb82de0f.jpg.htmlimage
> 
> Wallace having a bath in the brush tray and remembering to wash behind his ears - good boy! :2thumb:
> 
> http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-4_zpsd63ccaec.jpg.htmlimage http://s171.photobucket.com/user/feorag/media/animal photos/rats/2013-Nov2-5_zps67fe3296.jpg.htmlimage


OMG, they are adorable. They seem really at home already.


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## ami_j

New pics, blurry though sadly as my kittens don't like sitting still- what glue do you use Eileen :lol2: I need a better camera
It wasn't my current rats that ruined the sofa back btw


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## feorag

No glue Jaime :lol: Not a brilliant camer, but it does have a focus lock, so it makes things easier, lock the focus and wait until they stop then click. 50% will probably be out of focus, but within reason they're fine.


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## ami_j

feorag said:


> No glue Jaime :lol: Not a brilliant camer, but it does have a focus lock, so it makes things easier, lock the focus and wait until they stop then click. 50% will probably be out of focus, but within reason they're fine.


Mine takes about a year to decide to take the pic, it was easier if they had food :lol2: and of course jack and stitch are easy to snap they are lazy :lol2:


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## feorag

that's the problem with an auto focus - when you press the button it has to focus first and by then they've moved. The risk with locking the focus is that if they move, then it's gonna be out of focus anyway, but I just take a lot of shots (the beauty of digi) and then throw out the blurred ones. :lol2:


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## BMo1979

Well, this is it: There's no point in prolonging Dusty's suffering. Since yesterday she can't walk, her eyes and nose are covered in red goo, she can't toilet properly and only takes a few licks of her food.
I've got an appointment at 4.30 today, hopefully she'll have peace then. I'm already in bits, don't know what I'm going to be like at the vets (suppose, they're used to people crying their eyes out).


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## BMo1979

That's Dusty gone now. The vet gave her anesthetic gas first (because the needle is too painful) and she was probably already dead when she gave the jab. Buried her next to Nibbles.


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## ami_j

so sorry x


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## feorag

BMo1979 said:


> That's Dusty gone now. The vet gave her anesthetic gas first (because the needle is too painful) and she was probably already dead when she gave the jab. Buried her next to Nibbles.


Oh, I'm so sorry! Know how you feel. :/ It's sh*te cos we get so attached to these wee critters, but you did the right thing for her!


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## BMo1979

Thanks, I keep telling myself it would have been cruel to let her suffer any longer. 
When Dusty first got the Metacam she actually perked up for a while, coming out of her house more, coming for cuddles, eating like a horse, etc, but the day before yesterday, she was just lying in her house. Her eyes were covered in porphyrin and she didn't have the strength to clean it. She was also quite "floppy" when I picked her up, cos she couldn't hold her upper body herself. I gave her her medicine and water through a syringe, and she ended up looking better at night.
Then yesterday about lunch time I found her sleeping in their toilet, assumingly because she didn't have the strength to crawl back to the house. Sweet Treacle was actually lying with her to keep her company, she's such a great carer. When I picked her up there was hardly a reaction.

P.S.: Not a good week for pets this is. My friends' rat was pts on Saturday with a brain tumor and their hamster is not looking well neither (mind he's a Methuselah at nearly 4), an old lady I know lost her dog to age and she's devastated (he was her fundraising partner).


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## feorag

That's the way it was with Archie. As long as he was eating and coming to greet me at the door of his cage, then I saw he had a quality of life.

The night he didn't come to greet me and didn't want to eat, I knew that was the time and I took him straight to the vets the following morning - it's so sad, but it's part of responsible pet ownership. :sad:


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## feorag

Well I'm thrilled and delighted to announce that introductions went really well and all 3 are living happily together without any aggro! :jump:

I decided to do my usual of bathing and running around the bathroom first, then I put them in a cat carrier and left them there for about 3 hours, then put them in the big cage, which had been cleaned out and furnished with nothing to hide in. Kenzie lives in an igloo and loves it, but I haven't put it in the cage yet, because I didn't want there to be any sort of territorial problems with a hidey space that he perceives as his. So apart from the sputnik and a couple of hammocks, they only have litter trays and a wooden tunnel at the moment.

They just snuggled up in the cat carrier, but when they went into the big cage, kenzie asserted his form of 'authority' by pinning Wallace upside down, but he just lay there, never even squeaked and kenzie seemed happy with that. At no time before I went to bed, did I even hear a squeak, so felt reasonably confident that they would be OK overnight, but you still worry, don't you.

Got up this morning and kenzie was in the sputnik, Wallace was behind the top shelf litter tray and Rui was behind one of the floor level litter trays, but no marks, scratches, nothing! And they've all been out mooching about today, so I think we're gonna be fine! Yeh! :jump:

So piccies.

In the bath after the water was let out.




In the drying towel

    


Settling down in the carrier



Wallace fast asleep and Kenzie snuggling into Rui



Finally in the big case and mum heaves a sigh of relief.


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## BMo1979

:2thumb:That's great! Just judging from the photos they seem to be happy together. How do you manage to bath them without getting covered in scratches and poo, lol?

Is Wallace the little grey and white one? He's gorgeous :flrt:.

I think I'm going against my intention and am slowly starting to guide my OH into letting me bring in 2 companions for Treacle after all. I might be reading my own ideas into her behaviour, but to me it seems as if she's lost most of her confidence. She spends most of her time inside her house, where she's built a wall with an old wash cloth and papertowels. She comes out for treats, but unless it's something she really likes, she only takes a few nibbles and then leaves it. When she's out she only wants to hide and she doesn't seem to want any cuddles from me :,(, as if she blames me for taking Nibbles and Dusty away. 
I keep checking on her, talking to her and even leave music on for her (I heard classical music is soothing). I even bought her a small soft dog toy without stuffing, but she doesn't like it. Obviously all this doesn't replace proper ratty company.


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## feorag

I understand your reticence about getting more, as I said I thought about whether to take advantage of Kenzie having been on his own for a couple of months to make the decision to stop keeping rats.

I suppose it depends on if you yourself are ready to stop. If you are, then maybe now is the time, but if you aren't then I would look for another 2.

Rhona, who I got my rats from is only in Balloch and that's not too far from you. I don't think she has any kittens at the moment as my two were the last of the litter to go, but she breeds for enjoyment and good pets and her rats are very outgoing. You could gang far and fair ware, to use a good old Scottish quote!


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## BMo1979

I'll keep that in mind, thank you, and might get back to you for Rhona's contact details. It would be matter of convincing myself (a little bit) and mostly my husband, because he's of course got a say about bringing in pets, lol. Usually, I'm able to convince him... (2 corn snakes and Storm are proof, lol).


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## feorag

I know what you mean. Barry keeps me well under control, because my heart would always rule my head and I would be forever bringing cute furry critters home. Barry doesn't have a problem with me having my pets - if he isn't interested (like he doesn't share my passion for snakes) he just says, that I get them and I look after them and he doesn't want to know! Whereas she shares the care for the dogs and cats.

To keep me under control not to fill the house, he just reminds me about what happens when we go on holiday, cos the cats and dogs go with us, but we have to find someone to look after the little critters. he knows the older I get the more I NEED my holiday and I will make sacrifices to get that! :lol2:


----------



## RescueCat

Okay advice needed ASAP! Went to clean out the rats whilst my girlfriend gave them a bath, and I found blood in the cage. Asked her to check the boys, and Bailey has blood all around one of his back claws. What should we do? We don't have any antiseptic or anything at the moment (kind of a struggling month as my student loan hasn't come through, and my girlfriend didn't get all of her pay this month!)


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## feorag

Can you see if he's pulled a claw out?? Or cut a toe??


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## RescueCat

He hasn't pulled a claw out, it just is very bloody! I dipped it in some flour, and kept him in a box with a towel for about half an hour. It seems to have stopped for now, but I'm still worried 

Didn't help that Tingle nearly fell off the second story of the cage and SCREAMED. I thought someone hurt poor Bailey!


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## ami_j

*Poor Captain Jack*

Noticed that Jack had a sore foot a few days ago. Had him in the carrier resting it, and it looked a bit better yesterday so I put him back in the cage as he was looking a bit sad with being on his own. So I put him back hoping he would have the sense to be careful on it. However today he wouldn't get out of the sputnik so I had to drag him out to find his foot was swollen and seemed to be a lot sorer. I was thinking about just resting him again for longer but wanted some metacam for him for the pain and inflammation. So I had him up to the vet and was barely in there 5 mins and he just said to rest him for a month and call back if he seems unwell. So I paid nearly 20 quid to be told what I already knew lol.


----------



## BMo1979

Hope Bailey and Jack feel better soon (()).

Arrgh, why do I have to look on the SSPCA's website? There are 42(!!!) rats needing a home at the moment and most of them are female. 
Head and Heart are fighting a battle at the moment.

Just to test the water: Has anyone ever rehomed form the SSPCA (or RSPCA) before? If so what are their processes, i.e. do they do home checks for small animals and do you need a landlord's permission letter (got one for the dogs but they couldn't care less about caged animals)?


----------



## Middleton Mouse

BMo1979 said:


> Hope Bailey and
> Just to test the water: Has anyone ever rehomed form the SSPCA (or RSPCA) before? If so what are their processes, i.e. do they do home checks for small animals and do you need a landlord's permission letter (got one for the dogs but they couldn't care less about caged animals)?


I'm not sure about the rental agreement as I own my flat but we've adopted two groups of 4 rats from the SSPCA since 2010. First time in 2010 it was a case of turning up with a carrier and myself and a friend took away 8 between us.
The second time was last summer and we were led a bit of a merry dance. Turned up to a centre complete with carrier again expecting procedure to be the same as before but this time we were told we'd need a home check due to the fact I'd declared we kept snakes (did so the first time as well but no homecheck given then). This was a bit irritating as we'd had a home check the month before for a milk snake we wished to adopt and the inspector had seen all of our animals then (including the 3 rats we had at the time living in a cage suitable for 12). When I pointed this out I was told that it was a different dept. 
A few days later the very same inspector came out saying she couldn't understand why she's been sent for a second time and we passed the homecheck and collected the rats the following week.

Have had quite a few animals from them and wouldn't hesitate to go again, wish they'd insert some common sense into procedures though.


----------



## Middleton Mouse

To add to the experience above...

Went through today to the Glasgow centre and on the phone were told they had loads of rats and if we came today we could just take some away. We have a lone old boy who has gotten on well with a friends young boys so we figured it wouldn't harm to adopt 2 very young boys to keep him company.

Got there, filled out the rehoming questionnaire only to be told once again theat we needed a home check (the one we passed last year is still on their system). Agreed to that but rather annoyed at making the trip for nothing and drove back home to find the inspector on our doorstep waiting on us. 

Our flat is currently a mess as I've been upgrading the snake vivs so there are cages scattered about that would normally be in one room. Also Thursday is the day I clean out the animals that need cleaned once a week such as the rats and hamsters so a few of the cages were quite messy (everything had fresh food and water though and the reptiles had all been cleaned out).

Fully expect to fail the homecheck now but feel the procedure was a bit unfair this time. Not sure when I'll hear back either.


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## BMo1979

That's a bit of a weird procedure. You would think they'd still have you on their records and be glad to have experienced homes lined up, considering I heard from a friend's daughter that they currently hold about 90 rats in the Glasgow centre alone.
I hate having unexpected visitors. My house can be a tip at times (well, I think it does), having 3 children and 2 large dogs, plus at the moment my washing machine is broken and I won't get my replacement until Tuesday, so I understand your frustration. Touch wood, the inspector saw that it was only a temporary mess with you.
My husband is still dead against bringing in more rats and unfortunately I can't just go over his head with this (where did they come from? Virgin birth? lol). I'll probably just end up treating Treacle like a queen until she passes and then maybe one day have 2 or 3 little rat boys move in. That said, I really have to stop myself from looking at the SSPCA's website and even stay away from [email protected] just not to cave into temptation and it breaks my heart seeing all those cuties in need of a home.


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## Middleton Mouse

BMo1979 said:


> That's a bit of a weird procedure. You would think they'd still have you on their records and be glad to have experienced homes lined up, considering I heard from a friend's daughter that they currently hold about 90 rats in the Glasgow centre alone.


That's the weird thing, they DID still have us on their records, in fact they had two homechecks flagged one for the rats we got in July and one for Noodle the milk snake we got the month before.

We seen the rats today, it seems that they did a large scale rescue and removed around 70 rats from one property. The Glasgow centre offered to take females but a number of them turned out to be pregnant. We saw around 10 cages today I think, some with smaller groups of adults and some with 10-15 babies so 90 is a figure I can believe given the lady said that she couldn't guarantee there weren't more in other rooms. 



> I hate having unexpected visitors. My house can be a tip at times (well, I think it does), having 3 children and 2 large dogs, plus at the moment my washing machine is broken and I won't get my replacement until Tuesday, so I understand your frustration. Touch wood, the inspector saw that it was only a temporary mess with you.


I really hope so but it must have looked awful. The small furries and birds receive their big clean out on a Thursday so none of them had been cleaned out since last Thursday. My syrian hamster decided to redecorate last night and piled all her substrate and toys in a corner of her cage. The toads have a tiny fish tank filter in their "water" area which packed in last night and one of our female rats must have been scrapping last night so had a lovely scab on her shoulder which was pointed out to us. I had some of the exotics at work yesterday so there were carry boxes scattered everywhere and I'm currently treating a goldfish from the pond I'm paid to maintain so she's in a 30" tank on the floor of my exotics room. 

In saying that the reptiles were all cleaned out and all of them live in vivariums larger than the minimum required and all the furry/feathery animals had access to food and water so I'm not sure how they'll view it. They did the same last year (turned up unannounced) but I never dreamed it would be as soon as we got home. I thought I had a day to tidy up at least. 



> My husband is still dead against bringing in more rats and unfortunately I can't just go over his head with this (where did they come from? Virgin birth? lol). I'll probably just end up treating Treacle like a queen until she passes and then maybe one day have 2 or 3 little rat boys move in. That said, I really have to stop myself from looking at the SSPCA's website and even stay away from [email protected] just not to cave into temptation and it breaks my heart seeing all those cuties in need of a home.


We were originally trying to cut back on ratty numbers but our old boy just doesn't look like he's going to drop dead anytime soon and we were going to move from girls to boys in any case. We just wanted to support an animal rescue (especially when a) We've adopted from them before and b) We know they have loads of rats).


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## feorag

I've had a hectic week this week, so lots of jobs have been done quickly when I'm in the house and then I'm out and when I get back I'm just too tired to do housework, so my house is a tip at the minute too.


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## feorag

Well crap end to a great day! Met my friend for lunch - had a great lunch, a mooch around a local garden centre and then came home. Was barely home half an hour when I heard mega sneezing from rat. On checking it was Kenzie with a noseful of dripping snot!

So I got him out and sat with him on my knee, but he seemed very distressed, struggling to take a breath, mouth wide open and he kept kind of wincing and dropping his head and ears.

In the end I phoned the vet (emergency vet on duty for my vet quoted £110 for me to take him in!! ) So off we went. After examination the vet and I both decided that euthanasia was the best option. His lungs and throat (upper respiratory tract) were very noisy and he was nearly 2 year old, so I decided to let him go feeling that he'd had a good life and I didn't want him to suffer.


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## BMo1979

Oh no, I'm so sorry, Eileen. 

R.I.P. Kenzie, run and say hello to the others...


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## Middleton Mouse

I've just bought this cage for my rats, does anyone else have it and is it easy to set up?

Great deals on small pet cages and accessories at zooplus: Royal Suite 95 Double

Having to wait til my fiance comes home as I can't get it up the stairs. We're hoping to have our 5 girls in one half and 3 boys in the other. Going to my mums house on Friday to do a massive hammock making sesh too. :whistling2:


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## BMo1979

Well, that's all my 3 girls together again.
Treacle died today. She was just over 2, which is amazing, considering she was a little runt and had quite a few health issues.
She'd been quite unwell for a couple of days and as with Nibbles the plan had been to have her relieved tomorrow. Guess, she couldn't wait to see the other 2 again. Just very upset now...


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## ami_j

BMo1979 said:


> Well, that's all my 3 girls together again.
> Treacle died today. She was just over 2, which is amazing, considering she was a little runt and had quite a few health issues.
> She'd been quite unwell for a couple of days and as with Nibbles the plan had been to have her relieved tomorrow. Guess, she couldn't wait to see the other 2 again. Just very upset now...


So sorry hun  *hug*


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## MRS MURPH

Hi all.
Ive just rescued a mum and 5 babies (agouti hooded and cream hooded) if anyone would like to give any of these little darlings a home please contact me for further details.
Obviously as pets not food.
Thanks
Kerry


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## Rach1

Hi.
So sorry to read about kenzie eileen.
I lost one of mine last week too. Just 4 ladies left now and a male. The ones that are left are getring on tho. two that are left are definitely two and ahalf now which is really getting on.


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## feorag

Thank you Rach! I kinda expected that neither of those 2 rats would make old bones, because they were pet shop rats. All my others have been bought from breeders and have lived much longer.

The 2 new boys, Ruadhi McDhui and Wee Willie Wallace and settling in great though and provided lots of entertainment.

My granddaughter, Ellie has just come down for Christmas and so the rats are getting lots of fun time.


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## BMo1979

Gosh, they're getting big! Lovely.:flrt:

Husband's stripped the cage last night (so I wouldn't have to do it today :,( ) to put into the loft. If I keep seeing those nice pictures, I can't see it staying up there for long. 
My youngest boy keeps trying to sneak the dogs into his room at night, cos he doesn't want to sleep on his own.


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## feorag

BMo1979 said:


> Gosh, they're getting big! Lovely.:flrt:
> 
> Husband's stripped the cage last night (so I wouldn't have to do it today :,( ) to put into the loft. If I keep seeing those nice pictures, I can't see it staying up there for long.
> My youngest boy keeps trying to sneak the dogs into his room at night, cos he doesn't want to sleep on his own.


I'm sure Rhona, who bred them and lives at Balloch, has just had another litter - not that I'm trying to persuade you or anything! :halo:


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## BMo1979

You? Never!!!

I'm going to wait till after new Year to make up my mind. It's still a bit raw at the moment.


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## feorag

:lol2:

Sensible idea - I was thinking about whether to get any more or stop keeping rats after I lost Archie, but Toyah found me these and it kinda snowballed. However, I don't regret it and that's what matters.


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## feorag

Santa came last night and brought us a new toy that we can chew and eat!


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## BMo1979

I had to look, didn't I, lol? *broody* <3 <3 <3

Anyway, the in first picture the little one looks a little bit like a Rex or is that just his fur being ruffled?


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## feorag

They're actually both rexes. Wallace, who is the first one (blue) was the runt of the litter and born properly bald! :flrt:


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## BMo1979

Well, he's certainly no runt anymore. How old are they now?


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## feorag

Well, they were 6 weeks old when I collected them on the 31st October, so that would make them about 14 weeks.


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## Rach1

Quick question if I may...my 4 surviving ladies are really getting on in age now as said above, they are all certainly over 2 with two of them definitely touching 2.5 years old.
They are currently in a large cage with levels etc but recently ive had a few falls and all four are getting unsteady on their feet.
When I got to feed them etc they are never on the higher levels anymore and the flooring up there is never marked with poo or wee. At what point do I move them to a single level cage?
I don't want them to feel cramped but I also don't want any nasty falls. 
They seem to be at the pottering about stage or sleeping. 
What do you guys think?


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## BMo1979

When Treacle's strength had started fading, I took her shelf out and lowered her hammock and rope to about 15 cms above ground, because I had previously found her a couple of times sitting stuck on top her climbing rope.
I still had my one level cage from when we first got Nibbles, but unfortunately Treacle went downhill so fast, I didn't use it :,(.

P.S.: She was very attached to me during her last weeks, so sometimes I wonder whether she purposely got herself stuck, so I'd take her out and carry her around for a while. When she was on her own after the other 2 died, I would check on her more than ever to keep her company, so I wouldn't put it past her.


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## feorag

Sorry Rach, can't help you on that one because I've never had that problem. Although I think Brigitte's advice is good.:2thumb:


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## Rach1

I did type a reply but it hasn't registered.
Anyways, in the end I did move them as I was just too worried about falls etc and when I looked at the floor space of the single level cage it was just about as big anyways.
I've set them up with a small corner shelf, and some things to climb about in/on.
They have sleeping pods and a low slung rope too so should have plenty to keep them entertained.
My single male (whom ends up being called Boy'o all the time) is in a smaller single cage too now as he is blind in one eye and I'm sure he's also deaf! He certainly jumps when you open his cage or touch him! LOL.
I've decided not to get anymore rats after these ones have gone- but I'm sure my head will be turned many times!
:blush:


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## MRS MURPH

Some gorgeous looking rats on this thread.

Had a bit of a photo shoot today so thought i would share.

First up my little angel Cookie





oreo





Arrow




And Badger one of my boys


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## feorag

Gorgeous rats!! :flrt:


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## MRS MURPH

Thank you. :2thumb:


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## Fargle

I have a random question to ask. 

I have got my first couple of rats. I got what I thought were two males but actually turned out to be a male and a female. The breeding area was dark and I wasn't that good at telling males and females at a young age. Anyway, the long and the short is that I now have a pair about 3 months old so it's pretty certain the female is pregnant. I'm going to keep them together until the female drops. I'm going to keep some of the young but the rest I'll need to get rid of. So, to the root of my question, how do you go about advertising and selling rats in a responsible way? I don't want them to go to idiots and definitely not to people looking for live food. Any vetting questions you guys use or places to avoid while advertising?


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## ami_j

Fargle said:


> I have a random question to ask.
> 
> I have got my first couple of rats. I got what I thought were two males but actually turned out to be a male and a female. The breeding area was dark and I wasn't that good at telling males and females at a young age. Anyway, the long and the short is that I now have a pair about 3 months old so it's pretty certain the female is pregnant. I'm going to keep them together until the female drops. I'm going to keep some of the young but the rest I'll need to get rid of. So, to the root of my question, how do you go about advertising and selling rats in a responsible way? I don't want them to go to idiots and definitely not to people looking for live food. Any vetting questions you guys use or places to avoid while advertising?


I would definately split them now, the male will mate the female soon after birth and back to back litters are no good for them. 

You will need to keep a pair of kittens to keep dad company, and a pair to keep mum company, unless you get dad neutered. 

As for selling , use your gut with people, ask lots of questions etc. The male kittens will need to be split from mum and their sisters at 4.5 weeks old, and should be ok for new homes from 6-8 weeks.There are guides for telling the sexes apart online but honestly I can;t see how anyone could get it wrong, males have noticeable testicles from a young age

you may find these helpful
Fancy Rats • View topic - Feeding rats for reproduction and growth
Fancy Rats • View topic - Sexing rats
Fancy Rats • View topic - Homing rats


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## Fargle

But i don't have any other rats to keep the male and female company while they're separated, isn't that going to stress them out and be a little cruel?


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## Middleton Mouse

Fargle said:


> But i don't have any other rats to keep the male and female company while they're separated, isn't that going to stress them out and be a little cruel?


I think some time alone is the lesser of the two evils, splitting them is what I'd do as well.


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## ami_j

It probably will stress the male out being alone, can you get another male? Him being alone for 2 or so months is far from ideal but putting the female through back to back litters wouldn't be fair on her at all


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## zebrageekgirl

They have a lovely home 
I had a critter nation but my boys broke it. Ive just had to get a new cage. I now only have 4 rattie boys, 2 died last month


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## trogdorable

haven't been on this thread for ages! nice to see theres still plenty of ratty love going about.

from 11, i am now down to 1 rat left, who ironically was also my first rat! she will be 4 Aprilish and i can't believe shes still going strong ( bar a few lumps and bumps ). i wont be getting anymore to give my OH a break with them as he is asthmatic and extremely allergic to them ( once put him in hospital ).

Has anyone else been in this situation where they had one elderly rat left with no means of getting more? i feel awful for her, and even considered re-homing her to a friend with rats, but unfortunately they have a few ill rats so it wouldn't obviously be fair to put my girl at risk.


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## BMo1979

trogdorable said:


> Has anyone else been in this situation where they had one elderly rat left with no means of getting more? i feel awful for her, and even considered re-homing her to a friend with rats, but unfortunately they have a few ill rats so it wouldn't obviously be fair to put my girl at risk.


Kind of... Treacle was just over 2 when she passed just before Christmas, but I too, made the tough decision not to get any more rats (for now). 
I ended up spending as much time as possible with her, so she wouldn't feel lonely and leaving the radio (classical music) on quietly, even bought her a small soft dog toy (which she hated, lol - kept throwing it out of her house and off the shelf). 
I still feel, that she wasn't very happy, but that was probably also due to not being well herself and she the fact that she never was a confident rat. It just somehow didn't feel right to introduce more rats.
My friends' have a lone male rat (his brother died a few days before my Dusty was pts) and he seems to be coping fine: eats well, plays and comes for cuddles, so they, too, are not bringing in another companion.

I do miss keeping rats a lot and I know I'll probably have some again one day.


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## feorag

You've done really well to get her to that age, but she's really old and even though you know she would be better with company, maybe asking her to adapt to a new pair of youngsters or a single older rat could upset her. Also there's no point really if you want to stop keeping rats for a while. It's a tough call.

I would just do what Brigitte has suggested above and try to spend more time with her to compensate for her not having a pal to snuggle up to.


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## feorag

Barry and I went to one of our local garden centres for lunch today and this one sells the most gigantic Florentines, made with gooey sticky Cornflakes, currants, cherries and almonds in their food department, so we always buy one to bring home.

Then the ratty chappies get a little treat of the cornflakes - nomnomnom.

This is Wee Willie Wallace himself enjoying his. Rui had sloped off and put himself back in his cage :lol2:

 

fortunately Purrdy doesn't care for sticky cornflakes, but just had to be in on the act.


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## Rach1

I lost one of my female ratties over the weekend.
She was 2 years 7 months! 
I knew it was coming as she had started to loose weight and was looking her age all of a sudden. Only 4 rats left now... I won't be getting anymore but the last one will be fine with our company.


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## feorag

Sorry to hear that Rach. I wish they lived longer! :sad:


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## Rach1

Thanks Eileen.
I thought 2 years 7 months was a grand old age. 
I have three ladies left now.. two rescues that came to me via Storm off here that must be getting on a bit... and a Berkshire off Oldtyme. I know for sure that she is at least 2 and a half.


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## feorag

It is indeed. My first 2 got to that age and I lost them within 2 days of each other. Of my next 2 one died at a year and a half, but the other went back 2 years. The next 2 I bought from PaH, cos I couldn't find a breeder with any for sale when the first of the last 2 died, so I didn't expect them to make old bones and they didn't. :sad:


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## Rach1

Interestingly, the rat who just died was from PatH.
so she did do well really to get that old.


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## feorag

She sure did!


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## feorag

My little ratty chappies are growing up fast. They're nearly 8 months old now and Wee Willie Wallace is definitely no longer the runt of the litter, cos he's as big as Rui and they are both doing great.

I've just had my granddaughter here for her easter holidays and she and the children I look after one day a week came to play with them.

This is Daniel with Wally



Eve with Rui in front and Wally behind



And Eve again with Wally




And a couple of videos of the girls playing with an 'adventure playground' of various cereal boxes they set up for them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_rlIW04H_I

And again when the rats got bored of cardboard boxes and wanted to climb all over them, so they dressed up in their 'rat proof' clothing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjOqjCORT8s


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## Middleton Mouse

2 years 7 months is a great age for a female rat from [email protected] Our eldest was 2 years 9 months, we got her from a rescue so not sure where she came from.

We went to the SSPCA last week hoping to adopt two males to go with our other boys that we got from them in December. Chose two from the same litter as they still have lots from a big rescue done in November. Told they'd consult the guy who did our homecheck and phone us back. Got a phone all at work the next day saying we had too many animals and they wouldn't rehome to us.

When we got the two boys in December we had 6 rats at home, at the moment we have 4. The only other animal we've added to the household has been a checkered garter snake. To say I'm a bit dissapointed would be an understatement especially given how over run with rats they are (125 listed across Scotland).


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## BMo1979

@ Eileen: They're huge! Will they still grow a bit? :flrt:

@MM: Have they got more males than the 2 listed on their rehoming page at Cardonald?
Mind you they'd probably not rehome to us neither, because of Storm having a lot of prey drive and they might be put off by us having 2 snakes.

Not rat related, but since you know a bit more about the SSPCA: Do they sometimes rehome dogs without reserving them first. I'm just asking because they had a young male dog, called "Drake" which looked very very similar to Storm (not colourwise, but stature and face expression), so just out of interest I kept an eye on his progress. He started out at their Glasgow (Cardonald) home and then suddenly appeared at Dumbarton. He "disappeared" from one day to another without ever having a reserved put on him. They wouldn't have done "an RSPCA" on him and just had him pts, would they?


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## Middleton Mouse

BMo1979 said:


> @ Eileen: They're huge! Will they still grow a bit? :flrt:
> 
> @MM: Have they got more males than the 2 listed on their rehoming page at Cardonald?
> Mind you they'd probably not rehome to us neither, because of Storm having a lot of prey drive and they might be put off by us having 2 snakes.
> 
> Not rat related, but since you know a bit more about the SSPCA: Do they sometimes rehome dogs without reserving them first. I'm just asking because they had a young male dog, called "Drake" which looked very very similar to Storm (not colourwise, but stature and face expression), so just out of interest I kept an eye on his progress. He started out at their Glasgow (Cardonald) home and then suddenly appeared at Dumbarton. He "disappeared" from one day to another without ever having a reserved put on him. They wouldn't have done "an RSPCA" on him and just had him pts, would they?


Sometimes they do just take them off the site without a "reserved" sticker going up. They will home to people without carrying out a home check at times so if someone were to turn up who they liked it's possible they'd have been able to take an animal away on the day.

They've rehomed to us knowing we have snakes, the inspector who came out to do our homecheck for the garter snake we got from them commented that our enclosures were all spacious and clean.


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## feorag

Middleton Mouse said:


> When we got the two boys in December we had 6 rats at home, at the moment we have 4. The only other animal we've added to the household has been a checkered garter snake. To say I'm a bit dissapointed would be an understatement especially given how over run with rats they are (125 listed across Scotland).


See I find this amazing. they have a committed family who obviously look after their pets correctly and care and they say 'no' and yet they'll give an animal to someone without a pet - who says they'll look after it better or care more for it?? It's so short sighted! 



BMo1979 said:


> @ Eileen: They're huge! Will they still grow a bit? :flrt:


I don't think so Brigitte - I certainly hope not - they're big enough!! 



Middleton Mouse said:


> Sometimes they do just take them off the site without a "reserved" sticker going up. They will home to people without carrying out a home check at times so if someone were to turn up who they liked it's possible they'd have been able to take an animal away on the day.


And again I find that gobsmacking. They won't rehome 2 rats to a family who they've already allowed to rehome animals and yet they'll let something that needs much more commitment to go to a family without a homecheck? That seems all wrong to me.


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## Middleton Mouse

There's major inconsistencies across the centres, I won't bore folk with my experiences. We went along with a friend of mine to one of the centres a few weeks ago with a view to adopting a dog. As she has a similar mini-zoo to myself I told her to expect them to insist on a homecheck. We arrived 30mins before closing time which gave her just enough time to fill out the homing questionnaire and arrange an intro between her dogs and the dog she wanted to adopt. The dogs got on fine so she told them she'd take the dog and was told it was too late in the day to book the dog out. If we'd arrived 10 or so minutes earlier she'd have been allowed to take the dog home. She arrived first thing the following day to collect the dog.

My friend has adopted a fair few animals from them before so to me it was reasonably sensible but it just seems crazy that this can be the experience of a person at one centre and I have the experience above at another.

Think this is it with the SSPCA for me though.


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## feorag

That's well odd isn't it? You'd think they'd have guidance rules for all their centres and they would all follow the same?

Obviously not though, so I would lose trust with them too.


----------



## jdh

ive been looking into getting some rats again. ive been looking around and the only place ive seen them are in pets at home which are all nigh on adults. 
dose anyone know where i could find a breeder or a shop that will have younger ones? i would idealy like to find a dumbo.
i had them years ago i still have the cage though i will look at something bigger as at the time i thought it was fine now i think its small for more than one

forgot to say im in the north east


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## SnakeBreeder

jdh I have a few rats in Stanley and Gateshead areas. PM'd you.


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## jdh

thanks can you resend the link? it dosent seem to work


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## MRS MURPH

Hi all. 
I'm thinking of changing my rats bedding so the question is what bedding do you use for your rats?


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## Fargle

I use the CareFresh bedding from [email protected] It still needs a little dust extracting so I have a hoover nozzle over the tray when I dole out the bedding and then stir it up a little. Since I've been doing that the rate of RI in my girls has fallen and they all sound better. Annoying to have to do this on a supposedly "ready to use" bedding but it does have benefits of being relatively cheap, easily available and it does a fairly good job of keeping the smell down.

Carefresh Animal Bedding 14L | Pets At Home


----------



## MRS MURPH

thanks for your reply i may give that a go. ive been using back 2 nature which is good for odours but ive noticed the rats dont like playing on it i think its a bit hard on their little feet so looking for something softer.


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## feorag

I use cardboard pieces, like Finacard, cos the rats love to nest build with it, so it provides enrichment as well as being useful. I use Oko Plus cat litter in their litter trays, which is great to keep the smell down and so there is only ever the odd dried up poop in the substrate. 

It's so efficient, that I clean out the litter trays once a week and the main substrate about every 3 weeks.


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