# The Frog room build



## frogfreak

Hi all,

First I'll show you the one we had on the 2nd floor. It's been 3 years in the making and we have a couple more to go I'm sure. 

*Take 1* The 2nd floor frog room. I built the rack out of unistrut. It worked out well except for one glaring problem I didn't think of. Can anyone guess what it was? The idea was to be able to take it apart when we get moved. 



Faced it out with some lumber.



And some tanks sitting on it. We were happy with it. 





Now, what was problem? Other than me freaking out everytime we left the house praying the AC didn't go out. :crazy:


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## Robert Manrique

Very nice setups and rack system there


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## frogfreak

*Take 2* Moving the frog room to the basement where temps are more stable. We started this past winter.

Framing in place





Cabinets going in






























And the tanks moved in place. I'm old an had my son and his friend move them. It's amazing what a box of beer do. :2thumb:










Here's a peek at the adjoining room. We call it the bug room, but it really houses all of our feeders, tads and froglets. The feeders are being moved to the second floor this winter to free up some more space. For what? More froggies! :mf_dribble:



Thanks for looking

Cheers


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## frogfreak

The Bug room. 

Tads. They're in individual plastic glasses with a lid on the container to contain humidity.










Grow outs for froglets. I'm in the process of switching out to 190oz containers. 










The Fly rack



Cricket breeding area



Some storage and a sink which isn't hooked up yet. I should really get around to that...:whistling2: All in good time. 



Cheers


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## bork da basher

wow thats one awesome setup, cant wait to see more


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## ronnyjodes

jesus christ, that is awesome. I love the "Girl With The Dragon Tattoo" murder basement vibe you've got going on. Only with more frogs. Very impressive. Are those acrylic tanks that you're rearing the froglets in. the type you'd use for tarantulas?


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## Terrarium Supplies

Glenn, that is very impressive mate!

That must take some upkeep going by all of the racks and cultures. Are all your frogs Darts?


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## Ron Magpie

ronnyjodes said:


> jesus christ, that is awesome. *I love the "Girl With The Dragon Tattoo" murder basement vibe you've got going on*. Only with more frogs. Very impressive. Are those acrylic tanks that you're rearing the froglets in. the type you'd use for tarantulas?


 :lol2::lol2::lol2:

Awesome indeed! One day...

So what was the glaring problem? I must be being dim today.


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## frogfreak

bork da basher said:


> wow thats one awesome setup, cant wait to see more





ronnyjodes said:


> jesus christ, that is awesome.* I love the "Girl With The Dragon Tattoo" murder basement vibe you've got going on.* Only with more frogs. Very impressive. Are those acrylic tanks that you're rearing the froglets in. the type you'd use for tarantulas?


Thanks guys,

I haven't seen that but I think I get the drift. :lol2: 
Those 20Ltanks are glass and I made a top for them with living hinge. They're great except for the weight. I sterilize all of the tanks between batches of froglets and they become quite a pain. It makes feeding time easy but I am switching out to the 190oz plastic tubs. I'll get a pic later on. :2thumb:



Terrarium Supplies said:


> Glenn, that is very impressive mate!
> 
> That must take some upkeep going by all of the racks and cultures. Are all your frogs Darts?


Thanks,

There is a ton of upkeep. I couldn't do it be myself. My wife Laura pitches in when she can and I have a helper that comes in 10 hours a week. We have 100+ adults or sub adults now. They're all darts frogs except for a group of Mantella Viridis. :mf_dribble:We had a white's tree frog for a few years but lost her recently. RIP Daisy 



Ron Magpie said:


> Awesome indeed! One day...
> 
> So what was the glaring problem? I must be being dim today.


Thanks, Ron.

Maybe glaring was the wrong word. We didn't think about it but then again we never had a frog room before. The unistrut was the PERFECT breeding ground for spiders. It was insane how many were in there and they were nesting in all the holes where we couldn't get at them with the shop vac. You could vacuum them up one day and there would be twice as many the next day. :bash:

We're having a blast with all these frogs and are learning something everyday. :flrt: Tank building is at a crawl right now. It's difficult to get anything done during breeding season and I try and shut my guys down in the late fall. We're very much looking to finishing this display rack off and can't wait to sit back and enjoy.


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Thanks, Ron.
> 
> Maybe glaring was the wrong word. We didn't think about it but then again we never had a frog room before. The unistrut was the PERFECT breeding ground for spiders. It was insane how many were in there and they were nesting in all the holes where we couldn't get at them with the shop vac. You could vacuum them up one day and there would be twice as many the next day. :bash:
> 
> We're having a blast with all these frogs and are learning something everyday. :flrt: Tank building is at a crawl right now. It's difficult to get anything done during breeding season and I try and shut my guys down in the late fall. We're very much looking to finishing this display rack off and can't wait to sit back and enjoy.


Ah, there you see the advantage of keeping bigger frogs- any spider stupid enough to crawl into my place is Instant Frogbait! :lol2:


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## frogfreak

I should add that this young man did the bulk of the work. :lol2:

My Grandson. Gotta get em started young! :2thumb:





Cheers,


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## soundstounite

Mate, thankyou for taking the time to show my mates here this:notworthy:
.i is a fabulous set up,wonderfully organised,its da bomb kiddo.

Its bloody great to have your wisdom here too Glenn,you HAVE been and continue to be such a great inspiration/ help to Shaz and i(ha and Laura too,i have a good idea how much she does),thanks kiddo. ha ha loved the pics of your Grandson

almost as good as the above though is the fact we share a similar mad sense of humour,
good stuff bro

i just behaved for a whole post. see.it can be done:Na_Na_Na_Na:
best
Stu


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## frogman955

A very impressive setup Glenn you should be proud of yourself.

Mike


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Mate, thankyou for taking the time to show my mates here this:notworthy:
> .i is a fabulous set up,wonderfully organised,its da bomb kiddo.
> 
> Its bloody great to have your wisdom here too Glenn,you HAVE been and continue to be such a great inspiration/ help to Shaz and i(ha and Laura too,i have a good idea how much she does),thanks kiddo. ha ha loved the pics of your Grandson
> 
> almost as good as the above though is the fact we share a similar mad sense of humour,
> good stuff bro
> 
> i just behaved for a whole post. see.it can be done:Na_Na_Na_Na:
> best
> Stu


LOL Stu, You always make me laugh. I'm very happy I found some UK froggers on this forum and am pleased to share my experiences. I'm looking forward to seeing how you guys and gals do things too. There's always more things to learn about in this hobby of ours.

I can behave too when needed. Nagh...:Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## soundstounite

Is Litchfield park in Canuk land or USA
thats just wrong

Stu


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Is Litchfield park in Canuk land or USA
> thats just wrong
> 
> Stu


Arizona, Stu. It makes me laugh. I'm in road construction. :lol2:


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## consettcorals

wow :2thumb::2thumb: how jelous can one person get lol amazing build 
cheers Warren.


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## frogfreak

Thank you , Warren! 

Cheers


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## frogfreak

Here's a few tank pics.  













Thanks for looking,

Cheers


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## frogfreak

Other shots :2thumb:









And just for fun. My wife's tat.



Cheers


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## Ron Magpie

Can't decide which I like best; the tanks, the frogs or the tatts! :lol2:


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## Terrarium Supplies

Glenn, awesome tanks! Following on from Ron, do you keep tree frogs or just darts? Looking for some tank ideas if you do mate?


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## soundstounite

Ron Magpie said:


> Can't decide which I like best; the tanks, the frogs or the tatts! :lol2:


valid point mate
i'm quite taken with the patricia beautiful Glenn thanks for all this mate do you know the plants the patricia are sat on?
Stu


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## frogfreak

Thanks guys!

We're currently only keeping Darts except for a group of M. Viridis. We had some WTF's but lost them. :sad: I miss them! They're great frogs! Here's a pic of Daisy in the tub. 



Cheers


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> valid point mate
> i'm quite taken with the patricia beautiful Glenn thanks for all this mate do you know the plants the patricia are sat on?
> Stu


My pleasure, Stu! :2thumb: Pats are stunning frogs. I really like the pastel colouring. It was some kind of Hoya, I think. I killed it...I'm not much of a plant guy yet. I've killed as many or more then I can get going! :bash:

Thanks all!


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## frogfreak

This ones for you, Ron! :Na_Na_Na_Na:

We make this many cultures every week and sometimes more. :lol2:










A few frog pics. 

New River.









Powder Blue.









Citronella.









Cheers!


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## frogman955

Welcome back Glenn.
Nice photo`s there.

Mike


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## fatlad69

Great looking frogs and cracking setup.

Adam


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## frogfreak

Thank you, Mike and Adam!


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> This ones for you, Ron! :Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> We make this many cultures every week and sometimes more. :lol2:
> 
> image
> 
> A few frog pics.
> 
> New River.
> image
> 
> Powder Blue.
> image
> 
> Citronella.
> image
> 
> Cheers!


Ok, dude, do I hate you because you are Canadian (no reason whatsoever for this, I'm just chucking it in), 'cos you have a frogroom I would seriously _maim_ for (*lots* of reason for this!), or because you showed me a pic of the Devils' Own Spawn (fruitflies)???

Annoyingly, I don't hate you at all. Deal with *that*! :lol2:


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## frogfreak

LOL! It's not possible to hate a Canadian. :gasp:

Everybody loves Canucks, Ron. Just ask around...:lol2: :Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2:


Next time I will post a video for you. _*Culturing FF's 101!!*_ :no1: :mf_dribble:


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> LOL! It's not possible to hate a Canadian. :gasp:
> 
> Everybody loves Canucks, Ron. Just ask around...:lol2: :Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2:
> 
> 
> Next time I will post a video for you. _*Culturing FF's 101!!*_ :no1: :mf_dribble:


Trouble about these Canuck's Ron is they don't miss nuffin :bash:

Glenn cool to see you posting up some more amazing picks of Da stunning Froshe,Shaz loves the New river. i'm just green with envy of anyone with a female Cit at the moment,but some mate's have me back so hopefully soon eh?
Maybe I should just ask nicely on Ron's behalf(he's kinda shy:whistling2 could you give us that 101 please on the devil's spawn

Ps Ron sorry mate the devil made me do it...what can I say:mf_dribble:
:lol2::lol2:

Stu


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> LOL! It's not possible to hate a Canadian. :gasp:
> 
> Everybody loves Canucks, Ron. Just ask around...:lol2: :Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2:
> 
> 
> Next time I will post a video for you. _*Culturing FF's 101!!*_ :no1: :mf_dribble:





soundstounite said:


> Trouble about these Canuck's Ron is they don't miss nuffin :bash:
> 
> Glenn cool to see you posting up some more amazing picks of Da stunning Froshe,Shaz loves the New river. i'm just green with envy of anyone with a female Cit at the moment,but some mate's have me back so hopefully soon eh?
> Maybe I should just ask nicely on Ron's behalf(he's kinda shy:whistling2 could you give us that 101 please on the devil's spawn
> 
> Ps Ron sorry mate the devil made me do it...what can I say:mf_dribble:
> :lol2::lol2:
> 
> Stu


Don't worry boys, there will be payback....


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## soundstounite

Ron Magpie said:


> Don't worry boys, there will be payback....


:mf_dribble::lol2:

Ha you already know i'm going to say bring it on mate. Ron thanks for making me smile buddy: victory:

We WIlL!!!!!!!! get them leucs to ya one day,Shaz,keeps saying to me..."Oh are these Leucs for Ron? ":whistling2::whistling2:
I'm a patient man my friend 

best

Stu


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## Ron Magpie

soundstounite said:


> :mf_dribble::lol2:
> 
> Ha you already know i'm going to say bring it on mate. Ron thanks for making me smile buddy: victory:
> 
> We WIlL!!!!!!!! get them leucs to ya one day,Shaz,keeps saying to me..."Oh are these Leucs for Ron? ":whistling2::whistling2:
> I'm a patient man my friend
> 
> best
> 
> Stu


Stu, if I ever get leucs, it will be from you. :lol2:


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## frogfreak

Okay Ron, we know you hate flies but what about springtails?! :whistling2: :lol2:


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## Meefloaf

Springtail army


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## derek83

The frog room looks amazing. Please keep the pictures coming.


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## Ron Magpie

Meefloaf said:


> Springtail army


Yeah, looks like something out of Docter Who: "Activating Cybersprings!" :lol2:


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Okay Ron, we know you hate flies but what about springtails?! :whistling2: :lol2:
> 
> image


I have them in practically all my tanks, and introduce them to new ones via leaves, moss, bark etc- but I have never cultured or bought them. The originals turned up many years ago on the surface of the water of my clawed frog tank- I'm guessing with plants or even tank water. They are incredibly useful, helping to balance the 'ecology' in my tanks, but none of my adult frogs are small enough to actually eat them.


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## frogfreak

Thanks Derek. 

Ron, I love to add a couple of cultures to each tank, crack a beer and watch my Tincs graze on them like cattle. :flrt:


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## soundstounite

Glenn for someone that is completely bonkers:whistling2:,you don't do things by half do ya.It's always inspiring seeing your pics and I'm now completely sure you have major issues with OCD. 
Thanks for sharing mate,I'm not completely convinced tincs grazing like cattle is the right analogy though,:mf_dribble:

Stu


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Glenn for someone that is completely bonkers:whistling2:,you don't do things by half do ya.It's always inspiring seeing your pics and I'm now completely sure you have major issues with OCD.
> Thanks for sharing mate,I'm not completely convinced tincs grazing like cattle is the right analogy though,:mf_dribble:
> 
> Stu


OCD? *O*bviously a *C*ool *D*ude. Ah , stop it, Stu. You're gonna make me :blush:

:Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:

The "bug room " is getting a revamp! :mf_dribble:

Here's the starting point,


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> OCD? *O*bviously a *C*ool *D*ude. Ah , stop it, Stu. You're gonna make me :blush:
> 
> :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:
> 
> The "bug room " is getting a revamp! :mf_dribble:
> 
> Here's the starting point,
> 
> image


The Cyber war is over- we lost.


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## MantellaMan

FrogFreak, 

This is about the most fantastic thing I have ever seen!! :O It is so beautiful, I am so jealous :notworthy:

I am planning on doing this on a much much smaller scale with Chocolate Oak Board and E.N.T tanks! 


Looks fantastic mate!


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## frogfreak

MantellaMan said:


> FrogFreak,
> 
> This is about the most fantastic thing I have ever seen!! :O It is so beautiful, I am so jealous :notworthy:
> 
> I am planning on doing this on a much much smaller scale with Chocolate Oak Board and E.N.T tanks!
> 
> 
> Looks fantastic mate!


Thank you very much, MantellaMan!! 

Doing it on a smaller scale is probably a VERY good idea, unless you're semi retired! I could have never done this 10 years ago. Not a chance in hell!

Cheers!


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## MantellaMan

frogfreak said:


> Thank you very much, MantellaMan!!
> 
> Doing it on a smaller scale is probably a VERY good idea, unless you're semi retired! I could have never done this 10 years ago. Not a chance in hell!
> 
> Cheers!


Haha you're very welcome!! I am glad that I have seen someone else who has actually done this in this way to be honest and on such a large scale! lol 

:lol2: I can see why to be honest, it must of taken you ages to get done (As well as costing loads of money lol) But this would be something I would totally be proud of having in my house!! (No doubt that you are!) 

I am doing it for about 9 tanks at the moment but I will have another 10 to do :/


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## frogfreak

MantellaMan said:


> Haha you're very welcome!! I am glad that I have seen someone else who has actually done this in this way to be honest and on such a large scale! lol
> 
> :lol2: I can see why to be honest, it must of taken you ages to get done (As well as costing loads of money lol) But this would be something I would totally be proud of having in my house!! (No doubt that you are!)
> 
> I am doing it for about 9 tanks at the moment but I will have another 10 to do :/


Thank you again! We've been at it for 4+ years. At the beginning it was expensive, but now I can trade froglets for tanks. I've acquired 25 - 18 x 18 x 18 Zoo Meds over the last two weeks and all traded for with froglets. :2thumb: It's a LOT less painful now. :lol2:

Now, I need to check out that link in your sig! :mf_dribble:


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## Cornish-J

we need more pics of your frog room...

One of the best i've seen!


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## frogfreak

Cornish-J said:


> we need more pics of your frog room...
> 
> One of the best i've seen!


Thanks, Cornish!

I'll take a bunch of pics of the "revamp"


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## soundstounite

Ron Magpie said:


> The Cyber war is over- we lost.


We're English Ron,we always loose,trouble is we never except it,so we'll just keep coming back,and the Obviously COOL Dude will keep doing this stuff:mf_dribble: What pain's me kiddo is the blighter really is really cool :bash: I'm glad I PM'd this mate or there would be no telling what would happen next.We might even get a picture of 25 vivs with buckets in them:whistling2::lol2: 


Oh an' Mr J,please put me out of my misery on the buckets,i've been pondering since you showed me that pic,still too dumb to come up with an answer. Glenn if you don't behave I'll start flaunting attachis at ya:Na_Na_Na_Na: 

Josh is right through bro,it really is one of the most incredible set ups out there:notworthy:,he said admitting defeat and slinking off quietly

Stu


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## frogfreak

Lol, Stu!

The buckets are half full of water, just to have the cork background sit flat. We just siliconed them in. :Na_Na_Na_Na:

Don't want any froggies getting in behind them! :gasp:

Cheers guys!


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Lol, Stu!
> 
> The buckets are half full of water, just to have the cork background sit flat. We just siliconed them in. :Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> Don't want any froggies getting in behind them! :gasp:
> 
> Cheers guys!


Just for once I don't feel quite as dumb as I might Glenn:2thumb:,our silicone will hold the cork I use in a few seconds,we use silirub AQ,it grabs like hell,but i concur I've read too many threads with frogs behind the background,so you can see why I was puzzled,it would never have occurred to me.I stick the cork on the vertical and hold for no time,job done.I've no idea if you can get this stuff over there,it's made by Soudal,it is made to build aquariums with.I can literally stick 3 sides of a viv to the base(only the edges of the glass having silicone applied) and walk away it will hold,I tend to use tape,because i'm paranoid,but this brand is fantastic to use. I would add that I cut most cork sheets and fit in smallish bits, to the sides and top,then background,foam/ poly/rocks etc the lower reaches,ie i frame the background almost in cork sheets.But every bit of cork I always bang a bead of silicone around the edges....does that make sense

Stu


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Just for once I don't feel quite as dumb as I might Glenn:2thumb:,our silicone will hold the cork I use in a few seconds,we use silirub AQ,it grabs like hell,but i concur I've read too many threads with frogs behind the background,so you can see why I was puzzled,it would never have occurred to me.I stick the cork on the vertical and hold for no time,job done.I've no idea if you can get this stuff over there,it's made by Soudal,it is made to build aquariums with.I can literally stick 3 sides of a viv to the base(only the edges of the glass having silicone applied) and walk away it will hold,I tend to use tape,because i'm paranoid,but this brand is fantastic to use. I would add that I cut most cork sheets and fit in smallish bits, to the sides and top,then background,foam/ poly/rocks etc the lower reaches,ie i frame the background almost in cork sheets.But every bit of cork I always bang a bead of silicone around the edges....does that make sense
> 
> Stu


I totally get what you're saying, Stu!

I'm using Zoo Med backgrounds and they're all warped to shit. There's more than one way to skin a cat! :no1: 

Canuck----Brit, translation: There's more than one way to get things done. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> I totally get what you're saying, Stu!
> 
> I'm using Zoo Med backgrounds and they're all warped to shit. There's more than one way to skin a cat! :no1:
> 
> Canuck----Brit, translation: There's more than one way to get things done. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


brit--- canuk translation tis the same kiddo,weird huh alot of the strange sayings that need explaining we all use but some words,leaflitter..chuffed are not so widely used...Bro we are the wrong people to talk about English language:whistling2::lol2: we seem to get by ok most of the time though:2thumb:

Ahh warped to shit,now totally understood:lol2:.... 

cheers buddy

Stu


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> brit--- canuk translation tis the same kiddo,weird huh alot of the strange sayings that need explaining we all use but some words,leaflitter..chuffed are not so widely used...Bro we are the wrong people to talk about English language:whistling2::lol2: we seem to get by ok most of the time though:2thumb:
> 
> Ahh warped to shit,now totally understood:lol2:....
> 
> cheers buddy
> 
> Stu


Chuffed? What, are you like puffed up or something? :lol2: :lol2:


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Chuffed? What, are you like puffed up or something? :lol2: :lol2:



Ha I told shaz she's:rotfl:
Really pleased...happy...stoked= chuffed It would oft be used in the phase "chuffed to bits",its probably not used by kids,tis an old saying. I guess our comunication leans alot on what the younger generation use as this is their media,hence I get caught by ROTL etc

Puffed up:no1::lol2:

Stu


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Chuffed? What, are you like puffed up or something? :lol2: :lol2:





soundstounite said:


> Ha I told shaz she's:rotfl:
> Really pleased...happy...stoked= chuffed It would oft be used in the phase "chuffed to bits",its probably not used by kids,tis an old saying. I guess our comunication leans alot on what the younger generation use as this is their media,hence I get caught by ROTL etc
> 
> Puffed up:no1::lol2:
> 
> 
> Stu


:lol2::lol2::lol2:

Stu, it's not so much about *age* gaps as *continental* gaps! It's an English (probably Northern originally) slang expression, Glenn, meaning very pleased indeed. 

:lol2::lol2::lol2:


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## Meefloaf

I went t'beck through ginnel and gave ducks a bread cake


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## DrNick

Meefloaf said:


> I went t'beck through ginnel and gave ducks a bread cake


Eh up... Now Fred Dibnah's show up from beyond the grave!

Glenn, I'd have thought there would be a '****-skinning equivalent by now?!

Nick


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## Meefloaf

nah fred's from wrong side pennines and would say balm cake :lol2:


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## frogfreak

Vous pouvez ainsi être russophone!! 

:lol2::lol2::lol2:


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## frogfreak

DrNick said:


> Glenn, I'd have thought there would be a '****-skinning equivalent by now?!


:gasp:


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## soundstounite

You're all b*st*rds,look what YOU'VE. done to that nice Canadian man's thread:gasp:

Didn 't I say we were the wrong people to talk about English language Glenn,I just knew this would happen, holds head in hands,fighting back the tears,heart broken I am

Ron what's the first rule about northern folk....We DON'T talk......

I'll see my self out

Stu


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## frogfreak

That's me on the left, Stu. :whistling2:

It's okay, no crying allowed! :Na_Na_Na_Na::Na_Na_Na_Na:


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> That's me on the left, Stu. :whistling2:
> 
> It's okay, no crying allowed! :Na_Na_Na_Na::Na_Na_Na_Na:


Yeah i'd recognise ya anywhere mate: victory:,with or without the beard, Glenn we have to mind our french here,it's against the law to print things like that ^^^ maybe something was lost in translation
:lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2::lol2roperly funny
Stu


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## DrNick

frogfreak said:


> :gasp:
> 
> image


All skinned in different ways?!!! :notworthy:


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## Ron Magpie

soundstounite said:


> You're all b*st*rds,look what YOU'VE. done to that nice Canadian man's thread:gasp:
> 
> Didn 't I say we were the wrong people to talk about English language Glenn,I just knew this would happen, holds head in hands,fighting back the tears,heart broken I am
> 
> *Ron what's the first rule about northern folk....We DON'T talk......
> *
> I'll see my self out
> 
> Stu



Frankly, Stu, I find North Americans a lot easier to understand than some Northeners...:whistling2:


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## Wolfenrook

Stu mate, seriously, we're NOT northeners, we're midlanders! Don't buy into the southern lots insistance that anybody from north of Watford gap is a northener.... lol They just don't get the concept of top, middle, bottom, and they live at the bottom...

lol

Ade


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## Meefloaf

my cornish friends think Lord Bath is King of Leeds/yorkshire and that Wakefield is in the midlands:lol2::censor::lol2:


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## Cornish-J

if you're past the tamar bridge you're a notherner...


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## frogfreak

Okay, now my heads starting to hurt. :lol2:


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## Meefloaf

how's the screech rum this time of year ?


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## frogfreak

Meefloaf said:


> how's the screech rum this time of year ?


LOL They only drink that on the rock. This works for me.


----------



## soundstounite

Ha mate sometimes I'm having 3 or 4 different conversations with you on the same evening....DUDE your head hurts?:Na_Na_Na_Na:

Glenn, the Tamar bridge,spans the river Tamar which separates Cornwall from the heathens,J is waiting for me to say FREE Kernow,he'll explain that... 

RFUK phibs where you can learn stuff about just about anything: strange drinking habits, county boundries in strange lands, what canadians do with the left overs from their supper ,(god dammit that is a novel form of ecofreindly house insulatation),and just occasionally something about phibs:lol2:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

Frog pics! Just cell phone shots, though. :blush:

BYH's










Regina










La Fumme. VERY excited about these guys. I imported them in 2011 and have their first tads in the water.


----------



## soundstounite

Glenn,
as always they look in fantastic condition,A credit to your tireless effort towards both your own frogs and the hobby in general. You have everything sorted and we both wish you luck with your La Fummee, I know they'll turn into fantastic stock...I just KNOW that. Mate your on the otherside of the globe,yet you spend time trying to help folks all over with your passion,it's so inspiring.

It's a bloody priviledge to call you friend and our thanks go to all the time you have given towards helping us,We have learnt so much from you,your always humble always helpful,a proper example of how to be an astoundingly good dart keeper.
Just thanks bro:no1:
best always

S&S

PS Don't expect me to stop having a crack with you though mate,just ain't gonna happen:Na_Na_Na_Na:


----------



## frogfreak

Thank you so much, Stu!! That means a lot!

Bicolors are in their permanent viv now! :mf_dribble::mf_dribble::mf_dribble:


----------



## soundstounite

Glenn the words are true and genuine,deserved they are!!:gasp: 

We best get back to normal now,they look a bit hungry mate:Na_Na_Na_Na:,don't you feed em Ahh forgive me today has been soooo hard:bash::bash:.naturally i'm joking they look in fine fettle:2thumb:.

Glenn when you have time could you grab some more pictures of these please,I haven't seen that many pictures or frogs, for that matter, in the flesh. I am particularly interested in their leg colour,your's seem almost metallic,is that the case?No rush kiddo,just interested,I'm very aware of how cameras can play tricks with dart colour

best

Stu


----------



## Ron Magpie

Despite the facts that he doesn't talk proppa English and he drinks gnats' piss beer, Glenn *so* knows his stuff with frogs and set-ups! :notworthy::notworthy::notworthy:


----------



## Meefloaf

i may have to use my friends in Ontario as a reason to find this mans frog room:lol2:


----------



## frogfreak

Meefloaf said:


> i may have to use my friends in Ontario as a reason to find this mans frog room:lol2:


Hey, if you have friends in Ontario, I'd love to meet them. :welcome:

Stu, the metallic colouring doesn't show up in pics. It's insane! I'll try and get some more pics after they settle in. They've been in QT for 1.5 years! :gasp:

Hey Ron, at least in spell colour with a *U*. I'm close to be a Brit... A direct decedent and proper mutt. :lol2:


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Hey, if you have friends in Ontario, I'd love to meet them. :welcome:
> 
> Stu, the metallic colouring doesn't show up in pics. It's insane! I'll try and get some more pics after they settle in. They've been in QT for 1.5 years! :gasp:
> 
> *Hey Ron, at least in spell colour with a U. I'm close to be a Brit... A direct decedent and proper mutt. :lol2:*


Just for the spelling, I forgive you everything! Welcome back to the fold, oh Rude Colonial! :welcome:

The beer is still gnats piss, though.


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> Just for the spelling, I forgive you everything! Welcome back to the fold, oh Rude Colonial! :welcome:
> 
> The beer is still gnats piss, though.


Well, what ever you do, don't leave your can of gnat piss down for to long in a dart frog room. That's called a FF trap! :lol2:

We have a fantastic selection of beers at the _liquor store_ here (Yeah, I know that sounds stupid...) Any recommendations, Ron? I'll try anything once, well almost anything...Please don't say Guinness...:censor:


----------



## frogfreak

Can you believe Laura and I could make 17 nozzles out of this pile of crap?!? Oh boy...I'd be screwed without her. :lol2:

OCD, Stu? :blush:


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Can you believe Laura and I could make 17 nozzles out of this pile of crap?!? Oh boy...I'd be screwed without her. :lol2:
> 
> OCD, Stu? :blush:
> 
> image


Serious question (for a change!) Glenn, I was having a discussion with a friend about nozzles vs the old 'pierced pipe method, for rain-making. He still swears by pipes, saying that they clog up less, while I thought that nozzles are easier to clean when they *do* clog up (we live in a hard water area). Any thoughts?


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> Serious question (for a change!) Glenn, I was having a discussion with a friend about nozzles vs the old 'pierced pipe method, for rain-making. He still swears by pipes, saying that they clog up less, while I thought that nozzles are easier to clean when they *do* clog up (we live in a hard water area). Any thoughts?


I only use RO, Ron. Our water here is very hard too and think it would clog the nozzles in no time. The mistkings do a small filter before the outlet, so that may help, but am unsure. Even with using RO I have had one nozzle clog, but it was easy to clean out.


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> I only use RO, Ron. Our water here is very hard too and think it would clog the nozzles in no time. The mistkings do a small filter before the outlet, so that may help, but am unsure. Even with using RO I have had one nozzle clog, but it was easy to clean out.


Worth knowing, thanks!


----------



## RhacodactyBoy

That my friend is a fricking awesome setup - huge props to you - looks really really good 

Slightly jealous not gunna lie haha


----------



## frogfreak

You're welcome, Ron! Now, howzabout that beer recommendation. Haha :2thumb:

Thank you, mroberts!


----------



## frogfreak

The 12 x 18" cubes have had the screen done, glass drilled and misting nozzles installed. Yep, they're dead simple, but still take forever to do. lol










Today, we do drainage, substrate and plant. :2thumb:


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> The 12 x 18" cubes have had the screen done, glass drilled and misting nozzles installed. Yep, they're dead simple, but still take forever to do. lol
> 
> image
> 
> Today, we do drainage, substrate and plant. :2thumb:


A couple of questions:mesh size please,ie holes inside mesh and how wide is that vent,about 5cm?

Keep pushing kiddo the end is in sight: victory:

Erm the earlier picture was taken pre OCD tidy wasn't it:gasp:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> A couple of questions:mesh size please,ie holes inside mesh and how wide is that vent,about 5cm?
> 
> Keep pushing kiddo the end is in sight: victory:
> 
> Erm the earlier picture was taken pre OCD tidy wasn't it:gasp:
> 
> Stu


The vent is made from insect screen that I can get locally. The smallest runt can't fit through. No matter though, they walk right out the front! :bash:

No end in sight dude and will be lucky to get the room half done anytime soon. I would LOVE to finish it though, Stu! We shall see how long it can hold my interest. It's getting nice out there. :mf_dribble:

That's a typical "Glenn mess" Out of sight out of mind. :lol2:


----------



## Ron Magpie

soundstounite said:


> A couple of questions:mesh size please,ie holes inside mesh and how wide is that vent,about 5cm?
> 
> Keep pushing kiddo the end is in sight: victory:
> 
> Erm the earlier picture was taken pre OCD tidy wasn't it:gasp:
> 
> Stu





frogfreak said:


> The vent is made from insect screen that I can get locally. The smallest runt can't fit through. No matter though, they walk right out the front! :bash:
> 
> No end in sight dude and will be lucky to get the room half done anytime soon. I would LOVE to finish it though, Stu! We shall see how long it can hold my interest. It's getting nice out there. :mf_dribble:
> 
> That's a typical "Glenn mess" Out of sight out of mind. :lol2:


That's what happens when you drink rubbish beer...:whistling2:

Been consulting with my Canadian friends on a decent one, BTW, but they have yet to get back to me.
.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> The vent is made from insect screen that I can get locally. The smallest runt can't fit through. No matter though, they walk right out the front! :bash:
> 
> No end in sight dude and will be lucky to get the room half done anytime soon. I would LOVE to finish it though, Stu! We shall see how long it can hold my interest. It's getting nice out there. :mf_dribble:
> 
> That's a typical "Glenn mess" Out of sight out of mind. :lol2:


A Glenn mess,oh mate you have no idea:Na_Na_Na_Na:,you're so methodical,I can only show Shaz some pics. To do this on the scale you do and with tincs,which demand excellence, your pulling my leg if you want to me to believe you are gonna loose interest.

Glenn you need these sliding doors we use,I guess it's not really feasible to make your own on the scale you are working,but they do prevent ff escapes.The only thing that exits our vivs,is baby DW iso,straight through the ruddy mesh,even the finer stuff I use which is somewhere abot 0 .4mm gap ,straight though the buggers go.

Ron if Glenn can get it I reckon a good dose of the "Bishop's finger" wouldn't hurt,I've no idea if they export to third world countries though? 

Stu


----------



## DrNick

Granville Island IPA - that's what I resorted to when I was over there... long days!!


----------



## frogfreak

Too friggin funny! I want the recommendations for an English beer, Ron. 

Nick, IPA, seriously! And Ron said Canadian was gnat piss! Blech! 

Anyways, here we go. 

We're done planting for now. It'll take a bit to grow in. Just Pothos, prayer plants and some ferns. The rack is temporary and they'll be moved into the bug room when the new racks are done. We needed to get some frogs paired up and separated.

Hard at it. Clean up on isle 5! 










Crappy pic of the rack...Too many lights going on and not enough room. lol










After settling down...These Matecho's are aggressive! 










She's takes notice. 










He submits. 










Next up, EGGS! 

Stu, I'm totally nuts! All of these will be replaced with sliders when we get moved.


----------



## ronnyjodes

Looking awesome Glenn! Are those pebbles you're using for substrate? I might come across as a bit daft here but I've never seen that done before with darts. At first I thought it was a pool area as I've got something similar myself but on the shot of the whole rack it looks like it makes up the majority of your substrate with leaves on top. Is that right? Does anybody else do it that way and what are the benefits over the usual soil mix?

Oh, and for a good English beer try Hobgoblin


----------



## frogfreak

ronnyjodes said:


> Looking awesome Glenn! Are those pebbles you're using for substrate? I might come across as a bit daft here but I've never seen that done before with darts. At first I thought it was a pool area as I've got something similar myself but on the shot of the whole rack it looks like it makes up the majority of your substrate with leaves on top. Is that right? Does anybody else do it that way and what are the benefits over the usual soil mix?
> 
> Oh, and for a good English beer try Hobgoblin


Thanks Ronny! 

It is just pebbles to make a pool area, but went a further south than I figured. :blush: I've noticed in my other tanks that our Tincs love to sit on rocks. Cooler? I'm not sure, but they're doing it again. Hmmm, there is an old time breeder in the US that recommends Tincs on gravel. For the life of me, I can't remember the name. I wouldn't think there would be any benefit to having all gravel myself. I can't see the microfauna doing well on it. 

Here's a pic of the pebbles and grow stone, before it went a little south. lol The gravel ended up over top of substrate at the front 1/4 - 1/3rd in the end.










Thanks for the beer recommendation. I'll check it out.


----------



## REDDEV1L

frogfreak said:


> Any recommendations, Ron? I'll try anything once, well almost anything...Please don't say Guinness...:censor:












:2thumb::lol2: 

Awesome Frog Room BTW :2thumb:
I want one (but for bigger and uglier stuff than darts!)


----------



## Meefloaf

So awesome!

The missus uncle lives in goodsoil Saskatchewan, but is from Cornwall and he misses his Cornish ale. She tells me you guys do good ales tho


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks guys!

It's coming along. Now, to build new racks. :2thumb: It'll be a bit before these get done. I have to get going on that "Hunny to do list" first. :lol2:

I'll see if we have those beers at the store. I've tried a few German beers. Not a fan...

Cheers!


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Thanks guys!
> 
> It's coming along. Now, to build new racks. :2thumb: It'll be a bit before these get done. I have to get going on that "Hunny to do list" first. :lol2:
> 
> I'll see if we have those beers at the store. I've tried a few German beers. Not a fan...
> 
> Cheers!


Erm that stuff isn't for drinking Glenn:gasp: Just in case you missed it with our cross Atlantic english variations,Bishop's finger is a beer mate:2thumb:

Machet's look good kiddo,well done mate,you've done a proper job on them that's for sure. I have no real input on the stones other than an interested ponder,with no clear conclusions.Granted most of our rocks/stones are fake,but somehow they still remain cold to touch,eventhough made of polystyrene,which has always messed with me:lol2:. They use them,but I can't say more than any other surface

Sliding doors:well,I know why you haven't gone there yet,mate just in case you haven't done it before,when setting up the runners pop a rectangle of something 4mm in the corner ,where the runners meet whilst the silicone drys.everything just lines up so well using this method,it makes life soooo easy.

Damn we give too many hard won tricks away in this hobby:lol2:


Stu


----------



## DrNick

soundstounite said:


> I have no real input on the stones other than an interested ponder:.


Never seen it before either! Very interesting Glenn. One benefit I can see is plenty of inaccessible (to frogs...) surface area for microfauna to flourish?

Nick


----------



## frogfreak

DrNick said:


> Never seen it before either! Very interesting Glenn. One benefit I can see is plenty of inaccessible (to frogs...) surface area for microfauna to flourish?
> 
> Nick


Hmmm, never thought of that, Nick. :2thumb:


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Sliding doors:well,I know why you haven't gone there yet,mate just in case you haven't done it before,when setting up the runners pop a rectangle of something 4mm in the corner ,where the runners meet whilst the silicone drys.everything just lines up so well using this method,it makes life soooo easy.


Can you draw me a picture? :blush: :lol2: Not computing, Stu...


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Can you draw me a picture? :blush: :lol2: Not computing, Stu...


I'm *guessing* (not being a tank builder myself) Stu means putting something in the right-angled corners (where the glass will go) to hold the tracks in perfect alighnment while the silicon is drying. That way, you know there will be no gaps when you put the glass in.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Can you draw me a picture? :blush: :lol2: Not computing, Stu...


Ron thanks mate you're bang on.

Glenn,'erm in my room thread mate:gasp::whistling2:,buddy bare with me i'll try and get pictures for you later in the day,i'm just doing exactly this,on those couple of vivs i'm cobbling together for a friend...not computingLMAO:no1:,yeah I could draw it...but i'll take too long.

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Ron thanks mate you're bang on.
> 
> Glenn,'erm in my room thread mate:gasp::whistling2:


Oh okay, that was page??? :Na_Na_Na_Na: :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Oh okay, that was page??? :Na_Na_Na_Na: :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


Yeah,yeah, I know:lol2: I would pop an index up,but it's comput..... dude your killing me:lol2:

Ok Glenn,some things of usefulness to do with these sliding doors,whilst i'm grabbing a tea break.No particular order.

cut a template for the doors,height is critical,so get this spot on.With all your vivs being the same size,you can check with your template if the same size door is needed for all.It it's not a given that this will work out.Thickness of silicone etc might just vary. The ent design,leaves more chance of this variation when building from scratch so this might not apply,but worth a mention.

Make sure you sand all edges of doors,pay particular attention to the corners round them off,your glass will slide much better. When offering up a door to check it fits,be really careful not to slide it about untill the sanding is done,the sharp glass will dig into the runner and it won't work quite as well as it should. Sand diagonally across the glass edges,gently at first,the diagonal motion will keep you away from scratching the door surface,being gentle at first helps prevent the glass from chipping

Use the credit card trick for the central bead on the rear doors,it will prevent ff escape(the bead) and the credit card will give you a nice finish,I'll pop a pic up on this later aswell. Bead the whole door top to bottom,let the bead cure properly.Once this is sorted fit door and remove excess silicone,you can mark the bead with a sharp stanley blade in exactly the right place while the door is fitted then take it out and cut off the excess silicone with said blade

Buddy gotta get back at it,but abit to ponder for now

Stu


----------



## soundstounite

To prevent this:


do this:


another shot to make it clearer....hopefully


set up for center bead,masking tape helps guide one's hand,card ready to use



detail of card,so you can see how I' ve cut it Glenn,drill first,then cut the right angle out



finally after one smooth pass of the card over the silicone one should end up with a bead like this



hope this helps bro

Stu


----------



## Ron Magpie

soundstounite said:


> To prevent this:
> image
> 
> do this:
> image
> 
> another shot to make it clearer....hopefully
> image
> 
> set up for center bead,masking tape helps guide one's hand,card ready to use
> 
> image
> 
> detail of card,so you can see how I' ve cut it Glenn,drill first,then cut the right angle out
> 
> image
> 
> finally after one smooth pass of the card over the silicone one should end up with a bead like this
> 
> image
> 
> hope this helps bro
> 
> Stu


Todays' Top Tip, boys and girls: *Don't *use daddies main credit card for this!


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> To prevent this:
> image
> 
> do this:
> image
> 
> another shot to make it clearer....hopefully
> image
> 
> set up for center bead,masking tape helps guide one's hand,card ready to use
> 
> image
> 
> detail of card,so you can see how I' ve cut it Glenn,drill first,then cut the right angle out
> 
> image
> 
> finally after one smooth pass of the card over the silicone one should end up with a bead like this
> 
> image
> 
> hope this helps bro
> 
> Stu


Thanks for the visual, Stu! That helps a lot since you guys don't speak English very well. Haha :lol2:


----------



## soundstounite

Ron:2thumb::lol2:

Glenn,oh shush,I can do everything else:Na_Na_Na_Na: 

Anyway it's only me that's crap at english everyone else is bloody eloquent. Haven't you noticed how many of them help me:2thumb:

It is funny though, quite often I just blather something down thinking,"Oh they're bright guys,they'll understand,I mustn't make it tooooo easy" then I get called out and pics are needed:blush:

It's all good mate:2thumb:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

A couple of froggy pics. :mf_dribble:

Look at the markings on this Leucs butt! :lol2:










A couple of female La Fumee courting with a calling male. 










And we finished the silicone/coco fiber on the Thumbnail vivs. They're going at the bottom of the stairs. The entrance to the frog room. 










Thanks for looking!


----------



## frogfreak

La Fumee on my hand.










Alanis on Laura's hand/wrist.


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> La Fumee on my hand.
> 
> image
> 
> Alanis on Laura's hand/wrist.
> 
> image


 Surprisingly big- unless you have *very* small hands! :lol2:


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> Surprisingly big- unless you have *very* small hands! :lol2:


:lol2: Yep, they're big and gravid. :2thumb:


----------



## jambo1984

Just spent the past half hour reading this ..got to say fantastic job you done there mate


----------



## frogfreak

jambo1984 said:


> Just spent the past half hour reading this ..got to say fantastic job you done there mate


Thanks!


----------



## frogfreak

A couple more frog pics. :flrt:

Orange Bicolor










Regina










Cheers!


----------



## soundstounite

Fab as usual Glenn ,your frogs always look fantastic:no1:.

Mate educate me,what morphs of bicolour are there,both in the wild and in captivity? 

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks,

Here's a couple of links to show what's available in the hobby, Stu.

Simply Natural Dart Frogs: Phyllobates Price List

Herpetologic.net

Now, I've been looking around and I've never seen more than a single wild population mentioned. It's possible they were split when imported, based on colour. If anyone has any other information about this I'd love to hear about it. 

AmphibiaWeb - Phyllobates bicolor

This ICUN link has an excellent map if you click on it. 

Phyllobates bicolor (Black-legged Poison Frog)

Another frog population in decline...

Cheers!


----------



## frogfreak

Oh and here's another link for you. Tell me your thoughts...:whistling2:

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-discussion/49450-how-many-types-morphs-p-terribilis.html


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Thanks,
> 
> Here's a couple of links to show what's available in the hobby, Stu.
> 
> Simply Natural Dart Frogs: Phyllobates Price List
> 
> Herpetologic.net
> 
> Now, I've been looking around and I've never seen more than a single wild population mentioned. It's possible they were split when imported, based on colour. If anyone has any other information about this I'd love to hear about it.
> 
> AmphibiaWeb - Phyllobates bicolor
> 
> This ICUN link has an excellent map if you click on it.
> 
> Phyllobates bicolor (Black-legged Poison Frog)
> 
> Another frog population in decline...
> 
> Cheers!


Really informative post Glenn,thanks bro:notworthy:.

Glenn,I picked up on your specifics regarding morph nomenclature,that's why i asked. I am not on any level clued up on bicolour (does that translate?),but I thought only one morph.I repeat I know very little of these frogs so that must be taken as meaning little,but that's why I asked.

The ICUN map you linked looks to me like two separate populations, I can't find a scale to aproximate how far apart,i'm intrigued kiddo,but it looks like maybe two popultaions,which could possibly give rise to two separate morphs? .Whether split at import on colour or not,I know not,but if they have been split on phenotype,i bet it ain't the first time eh?:whistling2:. But now i want to know more too:lol2:

Oh a side note,sorry slightly off topic,but did you notice the possible hybridisation betwixt bicolour and aurataneia...hypothisised by Myres(1978 amphibianweb link)...do you know whether this has ever been substantiated?

See what happens when you post two cracking pics mate...not good is it:lol2:
more bloody questions than answers....sorry kiddo:blush:

best

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

Stu!! I saw some pretty frogs and imported them! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:

Everything I've read says there's only been two imports of Bicolors into the US. Two into Canada from the same supplier. 

There very well could be more than one population and I'd love to read about it! And, you're right, the ICUN map could indicate that there is. 

*Oh a side note,sorry slightly off topic,but did you notice the possible hybridisation betwixt bicolour and aurataneia...hypothisised by Myres(1978 amphibianweb link)...do you know whether this has ever been substantiated?*

Never heard of this, Stu??


----------



## soundstounite

From the amphibiaweb link you just gave us Glenn

"Myers et al. (1978) have speculated that there might be either hybridization or a cline between P. bicolor and P. aurotaenia in the upper San Juan drainage, due to the intermediate size and coloration of the Phyllobates found there."



Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> From the amphibiaweb link you just gave us Glenn
> 
> "Myers et al. (1978) have speculated that there might be either hybridization or a cline between P. bicolor and P. aurotaenia in the upper San Juan drainage, due to the intermediate size and coloration of the Phyllobates found there."


Ha! I completely missed that. :blush: First I've heard about it Stu. It's never been brought up in the hobby that I know of.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Ha! I completely missed that. :blush: First I've heard about it Stu. It's never been brought up in the hobby that I know of.


New to me too buddy,never seen it mentioned before either,hence the Q. I might do some digging on this. 

This is what I adore about darts,we just have so so much to learn !!

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> This is what I adore about darts,we just have so so much to learn !!


VERY true, but sometimes I need to take a break from it all and just go play with my frogs. :2thumb:

At times, it makes my head hurt...:bash: :lol2:

This is another reason I'm focusing on a _tiny_ part of the hobby for the moment...Tincs.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> VERY true, but sometimes I need to take a break from it all and just go play with my frogs. :2thumb:
> 
> At times, it makes my head hurt...:bash: :lol2:
> 
> This is another reason I'm focusing on a _tiny_ part of the hobby for the moment...Tincs.


Glenn nothing takes precedent over playing with the frogs:gasp:,just been replacing a timer that had packed up,which involved lying on the floor scrabbling about between kids tubs,all the tinc kids and mysties kids had there faces pressed up against the sides watching me,bless:flrt:. You can't buy these things. I do love the learning and yeah it makes my head hurt,but we do this to play frogs:mf_dribble:.:lol2:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

A few more pics. 

Bakhuis










Leuc










Momma Powder with a coupe of kids.










Thanks for looking!


----------



## fatlad69

One word STUNNING!


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks!


----------



## soundstounite

fatlad69 said:


> One word STUNNING!


Got to agree Adam,damn these kiwis rear some fine tincs,or was it aussies I dunno:whistling2:


Laura fantastic pics:no1:

Glenn...what???:Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2:

'Ere buddy I so wish you were closer,I would probably pay to see these in the flesh Keep trucking mate,I think you're graft is paying off,it's wonderful to see!!

Stu 



Stu


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks, Stu!

Don't you wish you could travel the world at the click of a mouse!

Next step for the frog room "bash a hole in another wall" mg: :crazy::lol2:


----------



## terryTHEfrog

Yeah I was thinking of extending the conservatory/lean too well one end of it 5ftx5ft but then some serious burning eyes started to burn into me 😒 maybe next spring lol


----------



## frogfreak

terryTHEfrog said:


> Yeah I was thinking of extending the conservatory/lean too well one end of it 5ftx5ft but then some serious burning eyes started to burn into me 😒 maybe next spring lol


Sounds like someone might need a week away. :whistling2: :lol2:


----------



## grizzlymonkyboy

terryTHEfrog said:


> Yeah I was thinking of extending the conservatory/lean too well one end of it 5ftx5ft but then some serious burning eyes started to burn into me &#55357;&#56850; maybe next spring lol


its easier to obtian forgivness then get permission.....


----------



## Liam Yule

frogfreak said:


> Hi all,
> 
> First I'll show you the one we had on the 2nd floor. It's been 3 years in the making and we have a couple more to go I'm sure.
> 
> *Take 1* The 2nd floor frog room. I built the rack out of unistrut. It worked out well except for one glaring problem I didn't think of. Can anyone guess what it was? The idea was to be able to take it apart when we get moved.
> 
> [URL="http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/135/dscf0043u.jpg"]image[/URL]
> 
> Faced it out with some lumber.
> 
> [URL="http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/4795/dscf0088um.jpg"]image[/URL]
> 
> And some tanks sitting on it. We were happy with it.
> 
> [URL="http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/5574/dscf0196x.jpg"]image[/URL]
> 
> [URL="http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/1120/dscf0010b.jpg"]image[/URL]
> 
> Now, what was problem? Other than me freaking out everytime we left the house praying the AC didn't go out. :crazy:


Hi mate im a bit late following this thread. Its truely amazing though! Your frogs are something else!

What size are these vivs above mate? Just out of curiosity...
They look really nice


----------



## frogfreak

Liam Yule said:


> Hi mate im a bit late following this thread. Its truely amazing though! Your frogs are something else!
> 
> What size are these vivs above mate? Just out of curiosity...
> They look really nice


Thanks! We really appreciate all the nice comments. 

All the vivs in the last pic are 24" x 24" x 18" deep Exo's.


----------



## frogfreak

Some more frog pics. :mf_dribble:

Patricia









La Fumee









BYH









Oyapok









Thanks for looking!


----------



## frogman955

Your just showing off now Glenn :lol2:


Mike


----------



## frogfreak

frogman955 said:


> Your just showing off now Glenn :lol2:
> 
> 
> Mike


Hey, I'm just posting them. lol I didn't take them. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Hey, I'm just posting them. lol I didn't take them. :Na_Na_Na_Na: :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


You are killing me mate,that is so bloody funny:notworthy: umm ok the frogs and pics are very cool,I just don't know whom to praise now:gasp:

hope you are both good bro,give our regards to chief pic taker:Na_Na_Na_Na:

seeya

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> You are killing me mate,that is so bloody funny:notworthy: umm ok the frogs and pics are very cool,I just don't know whom to praise now:gasp:
> 
> hope you are both good bro,give our regards to chief pic taker:Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> seeya
> 
> Stu


Laura and a friend named Phil took them. :no1:

...And now you know the whole story...:Na_Na_Na_Na:


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Laura and a friend named Phil took them. :no1:
> 
> ...And now you know the whole story...:Na_Na_Na_Na:


Ha I'm pretty much up to speed,I spotted something regarding this on DD:whistling2:,just thought I'd be mischievous :lol2: they do look cracking though:bash:

Stu


----------



## Liam Yule

Truely jealous of you. The frog room is absolutely awesome!...
I hate that im in a flat!
Cant wait to get a bigger place so I can have more than 1 viv :lol2:

you are just a show off:Na_Na_Na_Na:

amazing pics.

Liam.


----------



## frogfreak

Liam Yule said:


> Truely jealous of you. The frog room is absolutely awesome!...
> I hate that im in a flat!
> Cant wait to get a bigger place so I can have more than 1 viv :lol2:
> 
> you are just a show off:Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> amazing pics.
> 
> Liam.


Hi Liam,

Believe it or not, we're in a townhouse (Row house) Not sure what the term is that you guys use. lol

Thanks!


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Hi Liam,
> 
> Believe it or not, we're in a townhouse (Row house) Not sure what the term is that you guys use. lol
> 
> Thanks!


Shanty Glenn opps sorry mate:Na_Na_Na_Na: we would probably call it a Terrace house me old mucker

Got some thing very cool and very special to me as you'll already know for later buddy:mf_dribble: 

Bro i'm rushing again i'll come back later on the mail:2thumb: having a good but manic week:lol2:

Stu


----------



## Ron Magpie

Ah, but 'terraces' in Colonialville cover acres, don't forget, Stu- this is the Big Country we are talking about, here...


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> Ah, but 'terraces' in Colonialville cover acres, don't forget, Stu- this is the Big Country we are talking about, here...


Okay guys, our home is 700 square feet x 3 levels. 

Basement = frog room = 700 square. :lol2:

That's considered smallish here, but very cozy for us. :2thumb:


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Okay guys, our home is 700 square feet x 3 levels.
> 
> Basement = frog room = 700 square. :lol2:
> 
> That's considered smallish here, but very cozy for us. :2thumb:


That would fetch about £3 million in London- per square foot! :lol2:
[Except of course, that in the UK we're modern and don't use square feet anyway... : victory:]


Glenn, there are times when I'm really glad you get my twisted sense of humour...


----------



## Jono2411

I love square feet... Don't be a hater! 

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> That would fetch about £3 million in London- per square foot! :lol2:
> [Except of course, that in the UK we're modern and don't use square feet anyway... : victory:]
> 
> 
> Glenn, there are times when I'm really glad you get my twisted sense of humour...


Oh, I get it alright. I'm much the same but am on my best behaviour here. :whistling2:

Check this out>>> Average Home Sizes Around the World | Apartment Therapy

Makes me happy to be a lowly Colonial! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


----------



## Meefloaf

put it this way, for the price of a 3bedroom house (two of those are only 11'x11', other smaller) where i live, i could buy a 7bedroom villa in spain with a pool


----------



## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Oh, I get it alright. I'm much the same but am on my best behaviour here. :whistling2:
> 
> Check this out>>> Average Home Sizes Around the World | Apartment Therapy
> 
> *Makes me happy to be a lowly Colonial!* :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


Oh, dude, I would never have said 'lowly'! I'd have said something like 'plucky' or 'keen' or maybe 'charming'! :whistling2:

'Quaint' is a bit over-used these days, though.


----------



## grizzlymonkyboy

frogfreak said:


> Oh, I get it alright. I'm much the same but am on my best behaviour here. :whistling2:
> 
> Check this out>>> Average Home Sizes Around the World | Apartment Therapy
> 
> Makes me happy to be a lowly Colonial! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


Based on this our uk houses are not much bigger then your frog room 

I'm sure my house is smaller




Can I live in your frog room.


----------



## frogfreak

grizzlymonkyboy said:


> Can I live in your frog room.


Yes! I could use a hand once and a while. :2thumb: :lol2:


----------



## soundstounite

Erm Ron shouldn't that be OUR sense of humour? Mate Canada is small they only have enough room for one bear in the back yard....honest! Ron, I like quaint,it still makes me smile:no1:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

I swear lil froggie...You do that *ONE* more time and *you'll* be cleaning the petri dishes! :devil:




















:lol2:


----------



## frogman955

:lol2::lol2::lol2: I love it Glenn :2thumb:.


Mike


----------



## soundstounite

Holy crap,you house train them:gasp:

Glenn your a complete ****** I just burst out laughing,not good bro,the way things are ouch that hurt.

Bloody brilliant,only in canuck land:notworthy::notworthy::notworthy:


A wise man once said,"He who don't drill the end out of honeymoon hut,don't get crap in petri dish"(best said in chinese accent)...always thought that to be an urban myth

Well that's a first,not exactly what I expected to learn about darts today,but it explains why your vivs are so clean,:no1:


awesome mate thanks

Stu


----------



## creg

:lol2:


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Glenn your a complete ****** *I just burst out laughing*,not good bro,the way things are ouch that hurt.


:2thumb: :no1: :2thumb:


----------



## ronnyjodes

frogfreak said:


> I swear lil froggie...You do that *ONE* more time and *you'll* be cleaning the petri dishes! :devil:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :lol2:


I think you need to enter this in photo of the month


----------



## frogfreak

ronnyjodes said:


> I think you need to enter this in photo of the month


There's a photo of the month gig? :blush:


----------



## ronnyjodes

frogfreak said:


> There's a photo of the month gig? :blush:


 There most certaionly is - RFUK's POTM 2013 - Reptile Forums

I think they do themed competitions now but I'm sure there must be something you can use that pic for, it's ace :2thumb:


----------



## Liam Yule

How do you potty train a PDF? :lol2:


----------



## ronnyjodes

Plenty of Labbats and fart jokes eh buddy .

Glenn, please take this as the standard Cannuck joke it's meant to be. Don't send any bears over to maul me...........


----------



## frogfreak

Soooo, I had a 4.1 group of Patricia's that wouldn't breed for 3 years. I got 5 eggs out of them in that time. I pulled the female for a few months and then added her and 2 other females to the viv, making a 4.3 group. WWIII broke out with the males for a couple of days and after they settled down the females went at it for a bit. All of them settled down within a few days and I got eggs inside of a week!

Tincs can do well in groups. :no1:


----------



## frogman955

Nice one Glenn


Mike


----------



## Liam Yule

Congrats all the best with them


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks guys!


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Soooo, I had a 4.1 group of Patricia's that wouldn't breed for 3 years. I got 5 eggs out of them in that time. I pulled the female for a few months and then added her and 2 other females to the viv, making a 4.3 group. WWIII broke out with the males for a couple of days and after they settled down the females went at it for a bit. All of them settled down within a few days and I got eggs inside of a week!
> 
> Tincs can do well in groups. :no1:


grat's bro,what's the viv size Glenn,hmm better ask for a FTS well I'm at it huh:whistling2:,but that wouldn't be complete without pics of the frogs would it?

I best go back to creating other mayhem here now:blush:
I'll see my self out:2thumb:
best

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> grat's bro,what's the viv size Glenn,hmm better ask for a FTS well I'm at it huh:whistling2:,but that wouldn't be complete without pics of the frogs would it?
> 
> I best go back to creating other mayhem here now:blush:
> I'll see my self out:2thumb:
> best
> 
> Stu


24 x 24 x 18 Exo Stu. They're a little crowded and I will separate if needed. Just another experiment. :whistling2:

Here's a pic of the tanks.










Frog pic.


----------



## Ron Magpie

I love that cobble shoreline effect you use! :2thumb:


----------



## creg

frogfreak said:


> 24 x 24 x 18 Exo Stu. They're a little crowded and I will separate if needed. Just another experiment. :whistling2:
> 
> Here's a pic of the tanks.
> 
> image
> 
> Frog pic.
> 
> image


:mf_dribble:


----------



## frogfreak

Thanks, Ron!

The frogs sure do appreciate the water source, as do the tads.


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> 24 x 24 x 18 Exo Stu. They're a little crowded and I will separate if needed. Just another experiment. :whistling2:
> 
> Here's a pic of the tanks.
> 
> image
> 
> Frog pic.
> 
> image


You experiment:gasp:...weird,lmao.

Tis a fine viv mate,really is,always admired your vivs from a far Glenn, I also concur with Ron, I'd love to know how this works out for you.

Mate, pat's colour is pale it's the camera lying, is it not? Wish you luck kiddo,it looks like you are already winning from the egg tally.Pats are one of our favourite tincs,such a beautiful combination of colour always had a hankering for them,maybe one day.

I really do hope this works Glenn I failed dismally with the azzies,I am leaning towards the make up(nature/demeanor) of individuals being more important than the species now with group vivs. I might be wrong but the more I slowly learn the more I get drawn towards this way of thinking. It's good to see this Glenn, I'm not a huge fan of being confined to the box,once a certain level of ability/experience is reached,i'd rather not follow the "rules",just look hard and work it out for one's self,the frogs show us,we just need to learn how to interpret

Cracking,thanks for the pics:notworthy:

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

Hey Stu,

This frog is very light in colour. I do have some with dark blue legs too, but really like the ones with the more pastel colouring. It's the only Dart frog I know of that has these pastel type markings. That said, I keep both together and always will, to avoid line breeding. 

I'll keep you guys posted on how this goes. So far, so good though. I'm a firm believer in competition between frogs and mate selection. I much prefer them to be able to choose their mates. Let the strong survive...

I wouldn't want anyone choosing my mate! :lol2:

Cheers!


----------



## Meefloaf

i can confirm i nicked Glenn's pebble idea lol my leucs LOVE it and wouldnt leave it for the first couple of days


----------



## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> Hey Stu,
> 
> This frog is very light in colour. I do have some with dark blue legs too, but really like the ones with the more pastel colouring. It's the only Dart frog I know of that has these pastel type markings. That said, I keep both together and always will, to avoid line breeding.
> 
> I'll keep you guys posted on how this goes. So far, so good though. I'm a firm believer in competition between frogs and mate selection. I much prefer them to be able to choose their mates. Let the strong survive...
> 
> I wouldn't want anyone choosing my mate! :lol2:
> 
> Cheers!


My bad,I stared quite hard at the other pic Glenn,light can play hell with these pale colours and cameras,frogs look darker colouration in viv. Good point to make though, about mixing up the patterns,not only to avoid line breeding but also to max the available gene pool:2thumb:

Yeah i'm sure your right about mate choice,space is the prerequisite that defeats most of us in this here I guess,or money,but yeah given the chance,I'm sure it is best practice.


Damn you got a choice:mf_dribble:,Shaz said i was her's or I'd get a beating,she was right though:whistling2: Small things with red hair are bloody scary to be fair:bash:


best

Stu


----------



## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Damn you got a choice:mf_dribble:,Shaz said i was her's or I'd get a beating,she was right though:whistling2: Small things with red hair are bloody scary to be fair:bash:


:lol2: :lol2: :lol2:


----------



## Meefloaf

Glenn, what 'method' do you use to make your backgrounds ?


----------



## frogfreak

Meefloaf said:


> Glenn, what 'method' do you use to make your backgrounds ?


It's just the standard GS/silicone/coco fiber method.


I like how you can make all kinds of shapes, vines, caves, etc. It's endless what you can do with the stuff. :flrt:

I very much dislike the fact that the surface never stays damp. You'd have to soak it 3 times a day to keep it moist. It :censor: SUCKS for growing mosses and most plants on and looks like :censor: crap when dry. 

Soooo, it's a love hate relationship, we have! :bash: :lol2:

I may try tree fern and GS next. :crazy:


----------



## soundstounite

Meefloaf said:


> Glenn, what 'method' do you use to make your backgrounds ?


Canadian dust scraped from the wings of angels,and spittle from small swifts,you can actually make one of Glenn's backgrounds into a nice soup best served with croutons and small bits of crispy bacon:whistling2:,all ingredients are frog safe by the way(bacon excepting) 

sorry Glenn:blush:
sorry Joe:blush:

Stu


----------



## Meefloaf

Stu ! :lol2:

they look great, i ponder, i've not tried the silicone method, i was going to give the titebond method a go but it's very hit and miss from reports

having lots of spare egg crate, i've been thinking about putting one sheet on the back wall and attaching wood to this and then using the foam and then sculpting it. lessening the "omfg how, what, err hold this and press that argh"


----------



## frogfreak

Meefloaf said:


> they look great, i ponder, i've not tried the silicone method, i was going to give the titebond method a go but it's very hit and miss from reports
> 
> having lots of spare egg crate, i've been thinking about putting one sheet on the back wall and attaching wood to this and then using the foam and then sculpting it. lessening the "omfg how, what, err hold this and press that argh"


:lol2: Thanks! I did the exact same thing but attached mine to rigid foam. I used the silicone because I figured if it could hold a fish tank together, it could hold coco fiber on. LMAO!


----------



## soundstounite

Joe I still use this epoxy/rockoflex method,i'm hoping it will last,but there shouldn't be any reason, for the silicone to be any shorter lived,to paraphrase Glenn silicone holds the tank together.I've never used the silicone method. I'd add in if my vivs turn out like me mate's do,well I would be happy enough,that isn't because we are friends, it is because I really do admire Glenn's vivs!! 

Joe i'm ponderously slow about building a viv,I want to throw all I have at that glass box.It's almost like I feel duty bound,to give them 110%,if I possibly can. It's not about my vivs being better than any one else's or the method being superior(although I have hopes that I am doing the best i can),what drives me is a permanent home for some hopefully long lived frogs and how the mechanics inherent in the design,not only provide conditions for happy frogs,but also make them work and keep fit ,as they move around it,the jungle gym:2thumb:. I've noted some frogs almost using specific routes around a viv,trying to forsee how a frog would use these routes,especially species that climb ,gives one chances to almost make them jump and scramble a bit,as they travel from one level to the next, getting them that bit fitter,than a more straight forward layout.I'm sure some one is laughing reading this,but it's worth throwing out there methinks,especially to a new guy like yourself whom is pondering all this. Joe when I've finished a viv,there will be little silly design quirks in it,like a calling perch,or a specific egg laying site/s,even depo sites,I'm a bit sad in that I take huge pleasure when I got near enough design wise,that the frogs behaviour is utilising these features,makes me feel I'm in the ballpark,with what I was trying to achieve. Ha and on a selfish note,one can almost manipulate some behaviour/s so visibility is more accessible,enhancing mine and Shaz's enjoyment in keeping these amazing animals. Maybe a tiny insight into why I'm so slow,why I just stand staring at habitat and why my bloody head hurts,during a build:lol2: 

I can't say after 2 years, if any method is better than another,if they are good in ten years,and we are fortunate enough to still be able to do this then,maybe I'll have more info. 

best

Stu


----------



## Ron Magpie

I've already commented on the patience and thought that you put into what you do, Stu- so I shan't this time! :Na_Na_Na_Na:

I do like the emphasis on the needs of the frogs over those of the owner; the trick of course is to make a set-up that suits both; something you consistantly seem to manage.

Glenn, is there anything you can add to your mix (chopped sphagnum? Just a thought) to help it hold water better?


----------



## Meefloaf

soundstounite said:


> Joe I still use this epoxy/rockoflex method,i'm hoping it will last,but there shouldn't be any reason, for the silicone to be any shorter lived,to paraphrase Glenn silicone holds the tank together.I've never used the silicone method. I'd add in if my vivs turn out like me mate's do,well I would be happy enough,that isn't because we are friends, it is because I really do admire Glenn's vivs!!
> 
> Joe i'm ponderously slow about building a viv,I want to throw all I have at that glass box.It's almost like I feel duty bound,to give them 110%,if I possibly can. It's not about my vivs being better than any one else's or the method being superior(although I have hopes that I am doing the best i can),what drives me is a permanent home for some hopefully long lived frogs and how the mechanics inherent in the design,not only provide conditions for happy frogs,but also make them work and keep fit ,as they move around it,the jungle gym:2thumb:. I've noted some frogs almost using specific routes around a viv,trying to forsee how a frog would use these routes,especially species that climb ,gives one chances to almost make them jump and scramble a bit,as they travel from one level to the next, getting them that bit fitter,than a more straight forward layout.I'm sure some one is laughing reading this,but it's worth throwing out there methinks,especially to a new guy like yourself whom is pondering all this. Joe when I've finished a viv,there will be little silly design quirks in it,like a calling perch,or a specific egg laying site/s,even depo sites,I'm a bit sad in that I take huge pleasure when I got near enough design wise,that the frogs behaviour is utilising these features,makes me feel I'm in the ballpark,with what I was trying to achieve. Ha and on a selfish note,one can almost manipulate some behaviour/s so visibility is more accessible,enhancing mine and Shaz's enjoyment in keeping these amazing animals. Maybe a tiny insight into why I'm so slow,why I just stand staring at habitat and why my bloody head hurts,during a build:lol2:
> 
> I can't say after 2 years, if any method is better than another,if they are good in ten years,and we are fortunate enough to still be able to do this then,maybe I'll have more info.
> 
> best
> 
> Stu


my mind runs circles around me, constantly thinking of new idea's. today for instance i've been out round cornwall for a sunday roast at some farm, on the drive back (luckily she drives lol i'd be all over the place) i began to think of using a wooden box as a mould, the back and sides being flat and the front having other piece of say wood and bits to create the rock wall effect. the wood would be coated in either g4 pond sealer or yacht varnish and screwed/bolted together. I've even managed to work in using film canisters with the drainage roots already in place. now i was thinking i could use the black expanding foam to fill this as it wouldn't be 'deep' as it's only an accent piece for the back. rockoflex and epoxy it to finish it after carving the 'finish' of the foam off, make a few up so i can use all the epoxy, hmmm. i may even be tempted to ship some zoopoxy over, as that stuff looks the nuts.

then again, i'm really loving the idea of using a nice big piece of cork round on the backgroun and cutting a hole out of it for the froggies to hide in, woulkd also be great for a brom and fern wall and provide a nice little 'umbrella' on the footfall below. Like when you are walking through the woods and you see that branch or root arcing across where a slither of a stream may once have flowed.

I can't stress how much i love this section btw, the help and inspiration is just amazing, we're an odd little bunch and thats just how i bloody like it:mf_dribble::lol2:


p.s i LOVE the moss (?) growth on the log on the left in this pic btw Glenn


----------



## frogfreak

Ron Magpie said:


> I've already commented on the patience and thought that you put into what you do, Stu- so I shan't this time! :Na_Na_Na_Na:
> 
> I do like the emphasis on the needs of the frogs over those of the owner; the trick of course is to make a set-up that suits both; something you consistantly seem to manage.
> 
> Glenn, is there anything you can add to your mix (chopped sphagnum? Just a thought) to help it hold water better?


I agree 100%, Ron. And, duh! Why didn't I think of that...Thanks bud! 

Joe, that's just some algae starting to grow. Pretty, eh! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


----------



## soundstounite

Hmm is the silicone repelling the water Glenn,coco sucks in the stuff.I agree Ron makes a great point:no1 thanks for that earlier too Ron:Na_Na_Na_Na::lol2 but I use similar covering over epoxy,ok with peat added,moss is ok I wouldn't say great though.

.Bloody shed load of variables here guys!!

best

Stu


----------



## fatlad69

Hi Glenn, I used to successfully keep a group of 5 green sips, 2 males and 3 females. They bred very well without any signs of aggression. I currently have a trio of Patricia's, two males and one female. I think the key to them breeding is competition between the males. The males do tend to wrestle when the female is about to lay and the smaller male appears to be more dominant. They are laying spawn about every 10 days but only 25% make it to the tadpole stage. They either mould straight away or deform after splitting. I have tried the alder tea as suggested by Stu ( cheers bud) and now about 50% are viable. The males are only 18 months old so it could be down to that. The female ( frogzilla due to her enormous size) is around 5 years old.
Here is one of the froglets.








And the adults









Adam


----------



## soundstounite

Stunning froglet Adam,just beautiful.I'm glad the alder seems to have helped a bit. Mate how oft does vit A feature in your rotation?Honestly I'm just digging,I think you quite possibly have it sussed with the age,but I would also love to hear what Glenn thinks as well.

Fair play mate,you have made my day with this,not my involvement,but your success,good for you mate:no1:

Stu


----------



## fatlad69

Cheers Stu. I have 7 froglets all just as stunning, and 22 tadpoles at the moment. I am using vit A every fortnight. I use to go monthly but increased it however there doesn't seem to be any difference in the eggs viability. It's strange because some I get all the eggs through to the tadpole stage and other clutches none. I have wondered if the bad clutches are from a different male. To be honest if all the eggs had survived I would have been over run with frogs! Lol


----------



## fatlad69

Here are the guys just hangin in their crib!








:lol2:


----------



## Liam Yule

Brilliant photo  they are a really nice frog. Congrats with them


----------



## frogfreak

fatlad69 said:


> Hi Glenn, I used to successfully keep a group of 5 green sips, 2 males and 3 females. They bred very well without any signs of aggression. I currently have a trio of Patricia's, two males and one female. I think the key to them breeding is competition between the males. The males do tend to wrestle when the female is about to lay and the smaller male appears to be more dominant. They are laying spawn about every 10 days but only 25% make it to the tadpole stage. They either mould straight away or deform after splitting. I have tried the alder tea as suggested by Stu ( cheers bud) and now about 50% are viable. The males are only 18 months old so it could be down to that. The female ( frogzilla due to her enormous size) is around 5 years old.
> Here is one of the froglets.
> image
> And the adults
> image
> 
> Adam


Hi Adam,

Very cool about the Sips and shows, once again, Tincs can be kept in groups successfully! 

I personally think it's an age thing, although tannins do help. 

_Every single time_ I have issues with eggs/tads/SLS it's frogs that are breeding for the first time(s). I don't have any issues whatsoever with frogs that are older. 

I had a lone female Regina that was 4+ years old and grew up 4 males to 2+ years old. I added her and 2 males to a new viv and they immediately started courting. Within 24hrs I had perfect eggs and later viable tads and froglets. I learned a ton with this one and am going to try and keep my juvies separate until 2+ years old from now on (Space providing) Still trying to figure that one out. lol I also have kept some other frogs isolated and they far outgrew the parents in size. Breeding them too early can lead to smaller frogs. The fat reserves in females will go to producing eggs and not to their growth. My observations only. 

I don't think it's a Vit A issue. How are the other frogs in your collection doing?

I had a terrible time, years ago, with my 4.1 group of Bakhuis. Bad clutch after batch clutch. When I did get some tads into the water the first 3 clutches came out with SLS. They were getting the same supps as all my other frogs, so IMHO it can't be a Vitamin deficiency. It has to be an age thing. Since then, they have been one of my best breeding groups. Go figure...

I also toss a lot of first, second and third clutches until I see, what I think, are good looking eggs. Some of the first ones are very small. Into the trash they go. I don't even attempt to raise them until I see big beautiful eggs. 

Cheers!


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## soundstounite

Adam,Glenn and I have talked a lot on this privately, as yet I can't back this 2 year "concept" with proof,as our first tincs are still too young,but the more i learn and talk to others,the more I lean towards Glenn's thoughts above. This is where i'm now heading tinc wise.but as Glenn mentions keeping them separate is tricky,also trying to get the sexes right,is not easy with some of them. All are now single or number two in a tub.Where I have got it wrong,ie put a boy and girl together,we have seen calling and courting from around 14 months,which seems quite early,those frogs are no where near full grown.I split almost instantly if we see this,but damn don't they take some space up!!!Hard getting this down it takes so long to rear a tinc and only recently,have I become aware of all this.It is one of those things I guess one almost stumbles on,or has to be told about,I've never read of this before on a brit site,that I can remember anyway.I had become aware that the tinc kids seem to need lower stocking densities though

As a side note i've split our pair of macheto,I suspect my lack of knowledge means I have done this too late,but,we have tried before,my own inability being our downfall.We are two months or so in now,it appears the female is happy this time,so,we will wait to the spring if possible and see what happens then. 

Mate i'm somewhat perplexed by your good clutch...bad clutch,maybe you have the answer in your thoughts on the males,I just don't know.

Glenn thanks mate,you probably have no idea how much help you have been with the tincs,what one learns and the speed it is assimilated by a guy with good eyes keeping a big collection(and fairly specialist) is a huge asset to our hobby

best 

Stu


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## frogfreak

soundstounite said:


> Mate i'm somewhat perplexed by your good clutch...bad clutch,maybe you have the answer in your thoughts on the males,I just don't know.


I believe it to be the males and sperm deposition and care of the eggs. I was able to witness a full courting, breeding, uptake of water and depositing sperm process outside the luv hut right at the front of the tank. It's a long process and looks quite complicated, to be sure. I have it on video too!  I keep meaning to get it to someone so they can edit it and so I can post it. It was fascinating!



soundstounite said:


> Glenn thanks mate,you probably have no idea how much help you have been with the tincs,what one learns and the speed it is assimilated by a guy with good eyes keeping a big collection(and fairly specialist) is a huge asset to our hobby


Dude, if I didn't pass along what I have learned, I would feel like I was cheating my fellow frogger! These are just all observations and like everyone else, I'm learning as I go. I am lucky that 90% of my work is done at home now, which allows me to spend a ton of time in the frog room. I'd miss so much if I wasn't able to do that! 

These forums are great for sharing info and learning from others. I dislike the drama some offer and tend to post less on those. This forum has a great group that can be serious and keep things light and humorous at the same time. :2thumb:


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## soundstounite

frogfreak said:


> I believe it to be the males and sperm deposition and care of the eggs. I was able to witness a full courting, breeding, uptake of water and depositing sperm process outside the luv hut right at the front of the tank. It's a long process and looks quite complicated, to be sure. I have it on video too!  I keep meaning to get it to someone so they can edit it and so I can post it. It was fascinating!
> 
> 
> 
> Dude, if I didn't pass along what I have learned, I would feel like I was cheating my fellow frogger! These are just all observations and like everyone else, I'm learning as I go. I am lucky that 90% of my work is done at home now, which allows me to spend a ton of time in the frog room. I'd miss so much if I wasn't able to do that!
> 
> These forums are great for sharing info and learning from others. I dislike the drama some offer and tend to post less on those. This forum has a great group that can be serious and keep things light and humorous at the same time. :2thumb:


Full on hard core XXX rated tinc porn,you'll be minted mate,hard to say ,but I'd like to see that:blush:.
We have watched a fair amount of breeding activity Glenn ,being serious now:gasp:,but in a hut or film can seeing all is always difficult,in fairness I/we do tend to back off at these times, as I don't want to get in the way of the frogs doing what they need to.

Same here on the drama:bash::bash::bash:does my bloody head in!! Helping others with the bit we learn is why we move forward,I know exactly what ya mean,tis cool, just to say "thanks dude", always important this to me. Mate or not it will always be important.

This 2 year tinc thing is a classic example of something that would be incredibly difficult for a new keeper to work out on their own,one can read stress react to that,read "too many" in a rearing enclosure,make amendments,all taught by the frogs and watching like a hawk,but assimilating why and when to put them together,almost has to come from someone else,with more experience. I think one can read ,watch and learn a huge amount on one's own,studying the frogs trying to work out the why's and wherefores of behaviour gives many insights,but sometimes we all need help.a quiet word to complete the picture.

Having written all that you expect this though bro:Na_Na_Na_Na:
Fun and frogs all as it should be!! 

Stu


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## frogfreak

Two words "anger management" :bash: 

Tapeworms - Page 2 - Dendroboard

Sigh....And you guys wonder why I put up with your Canuck beer and fart jokes, eh?! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


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## Meefloaf

i'll tell you a tale Glenn, I first started on my journey on Frog Forum and then found this place as a means to finding uk suppliers and products (i live in what you guys might think of as similar to Good Soil, Saskatchewan), however, i posted in the newb bit and got sod all help, so i left this place. came back after My Shed started helping out and i found this exact part of the forum, where everyone is lovely and i dont have to deal with people getting upset i dont want to cross breed seventeen frogs to make a day-glo pink one. I've signed up for dendroboard, doubt i'll ever post on it lol


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## Ron Magpie

frogfreak said:


> Two words "anger management" :bash:
> 
> Tapeworms - Page 2 - Dendroboard
> 
> Sigh....And you guys wonder why I put up with your Canuck beer and fart jokes, eh?! :Na_Na_Na_Na: :lol2:


Does it make me (even more of) a bad person that I laughed at the story of the fisherman and the tapeworms?

Fart jokes? Who makes fart jokes? A very low-class thing to do! :devil:

I'll give you the gnat's piss canuck beer, though...


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## frogfreak

That was pretty funny, Ron! 

That's why I don't eat Sushi. :lol2:


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## soundstounite

Ha Joe i'll answer the pm in a mo,I'm talking to someone important...you:Na_Na_Na_Na:LMFAO

Joe there is some great knowledge on the yanks sites,it is worth posting there to get some specific info,I have to say the guy whose thread we are hijacking answered a plea for help.that's how we know each other. Actually it's worth telling this one:I saw a lump on one of my tincs on the side half way down the belly,instantly thought the worse,tumor.so I asked, very little comeback,then this guy called frogfreak pop's up: Don't worry mate,it's something to do with their stomach or eating,,,they all have it,more visible in an underweight frog,but look hard and you'll see",I did, he was right,worth mentioning 'cause someone might see this and stop worrying. Big picture,was who is this guy that saw what i did and no one else has spotted that, and also was nic e to me.....hmmmm!! it turns out we have a bit in common so I guess we will always be mates.

It is always worth asking the americans for info to grab some detail to help you make your choices,i post a bit about our room,almost as a thanks for the help I have got,most of the new guys get good info,providing some one it's chewing on them for being so bloody stupid,so I don't feel we can help them much.
But Joe the cobblers drives me bloody nuts,same as you guys. threads start out,I think wow this will be interesting,next ya know is the klan is about to burn some poor sod 'cause he want's to know how deep the leaf litter should be FFS.
So do quizz folks mate across the pond,there are some good un's some of the hard core science isn't so available here,but hell wouldn't that hobby be up there if they would just throw the ruddy ego's away

I can't be dealing with it either guys,but sometimes they are a means to an end 
But how hard is it to just be nice to someone who is trying to find out about a frog

just my 2 cents eh?:whistling2:


Stu


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## frogfreak

Okay, I recently started culturing Been Beetles and they are *by far* my favorite feeder. Man, do they produce a lot of beetles! Dead simple too. Add beans, add beetles, keep warm. :mf_dribble:

The culture I had 4 years ago did nothing and I never tried them again. *BIG* mistake! :blush: This is going to save me a ton of time culturing flies. 

I've read that some people's frogs won't take them, but my frogs love em! :2thumb:


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## ronnyjodes

Glenn, are these bean weevils or something different? I've never given anything other than ff, springs, a few types of woods and some cockroaches a go as feeders but I might give this a crack if they've been a sucess.


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## frogfreak

ronnyjodes said:


> Glenn, are these bean weevils or something different? I've never given anything other than ff, springs, a few types of woods and some cockroaches a go as feeders but I might give this a crack if they've been a sucess.


I was told they are Bean Beetles, but it could be just a language thing. They look like this;


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## frogman955

Good old bean weevils.
As I`ve said before, they`re a handy thing to have lying around.
Especially if your fly cultures crash.

Mike


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## frogman955

frogfreak said:


> Okay, I recently started culturing Been Beetles and they are *by far* my favorite feeder. Man, do they produce a lot of beetles! Dead simple too. Add beans, add beetles, keep warm. :mf_dribble:
> 
> The culture I had 4 years ago did nothing and I never tried them again. *BIG* mistake! :blush: This is going to save me a ton of time culturing flies.
> 
> I've read that some people's frogs won't take them, but my frogs love em! :2thumb:


 
I have to laugh here Glenn, sorry.
Recently I posted that everyone should be feeding bean weevils and you asked me why.
You`ve just answered for me :2thumb:.

Mike


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## frogfreak

frogman955 said:


> I have to laugh here Glenn, sorry.
> Recently I posted that everyone should be feeding bean weevils and you asked me why.
> You`ve just answered for me :2thumb:.
> 
> Mike


lol! The ones I got were crap way back when. Could have even been on the wrong beans for all I know...These new ones rock! 

I 100% agree with you now. :blush: :Na_Na_Na_Na:

I should add, they're not easy to get here, until now.


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## Meefloaf

mine appear to have slowed right down, split it at boom time and two pots not seen owt and the other just the odd beetle


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## frogman955

They`re pretty much bomb proof Joe so I don`t know whats happened with yours.
Personally I try not to split cultures as such.
I normally add a load of weevils to a new tub of beans so that the cultures are always "fresh", ie no old beans in it.
Doing it like that will of course slow down the cycle as you`d have to wait the full 28 days or so for the first hatch.
The plus side of doing it that way is that when the hatch is finished you just throw the old beans out.
There are of course several ways of keeping them so it`s all down to what suits you best.

Mike


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## Meefloaf

frogman955 said:


> They`re pretty much bomb proof Joe so I don`t know whats happened with yours.
> Personally I try not to split cultures as such.
> I normally add a load of weevils to a new tub of beans so that the cultures are always "fresh", ie no old beans in it.
> Doing it like that will of course slow down the cycle as you`d have to wait the full 28 days or so for the first hatch.
> The plus side of doing it that way is that when the hatch is finished you just throw the old beans out.
> There are of course several ways of keeping them so it`s all down to what suits you best.
> 
> Mike


think i've got to wait for mine to hatch tbh Mike, the new beans do have the marks of being 'fertilised' lol.


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## soundstounite

I'm pretty sure bean weavils and bean beatles are 100% the same thing,you'll see eggs,little dots on the beans,plus holes where the maggots have entered or exited a bean. first time we used them,and we had cultured zillions by then frogs didn't care for them at all,I haven't a clue why though,next time months and months later the frogs loved 'em. Life cycle of adults is very short,so they seem to boom and bust,just don't throw away a bust to bloody quick!!

Glenn Judy S? has a method on DB for constitent supply. i'm sure you'll find it and know whom I'm talking about. She utilizes a lot for tincs I believe.
We use them occassionally in small quantities,my concern with them has always been that harder carapace and risk of prolapse,just gut feeling,really,considering how soft our other feeders are. more a thing about inadaqucies in our diet and getting the frogs used to something different ,internally,than anything else. I'd simply go carefully at first, a few at a feed and then build the number into the diet,a doddle to culture though.

Now you can educate me on nutritional differences,all nice an simple like,got enough headaches with technicalities at the mo :lol2: Your head is better at this than mine:Na_Na_Na_Na:

seeya

Stu


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## frogman955

Meefloaf said:


> think i've got to wait for mine to hatch tbh Mike, the new beans do have the marks of being 'fertilised' lol.


If you look closely at the beans Joe you`ll see dark shadows from the inside of the bean.
That would normally indicate a weevil growing inside so can be a way of knowing if the culture is still good.

Mike


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## Ron Magpie

My culture is definitely a 'boom and bust' type- for quite a while I thought they'd died off completely- now I have oodles- at a time when I've got nothing to feed them to- except, occasionally, the young clawed frogs. :devil:

I think you are right about regenerating the cultures, Mike, hopefully I can make sure I have a reasonable supply in the Spring, when I'm intending to raise some more FBTs.


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## frogman955

It`s getting that balance right Ron.
It`s often the case that you have loads when you don`t need them and none when you do.
I don`t actually keep a lot of weevils as I treat them as a backup for if the flies are in short supply or as an occasional change.
As Stu says they are a hard beast for the frogs to digest so I`m always wary in case they do cause problems.
So I feed small amounts and not too often, just in case.

Mike


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## Ron Magpie

frogman955 said:


> It`s getting that balance right Ron.
> It`s often the case that you have loads when you don`t need them and none when you do.
> I don`t actually keep a lot of weevils as I treat them as a backup for if the flies are in short supply or as an occasional change.
> As Stu says they are a hard beast for the frogs to digest so I`m always wary in case they do cause problems.
> So I feed small amounts and not too often, just in case.
> 
> Mike


I've found that toadlets have to get used to the taste- but take them readily once they have. I've mentioned elsewhere that Bufonoid toads happily eat beetles and small snails, and easily pass wingcases and bits of shell; my adult FBts are the same, so for my purposes, they are fine. The last brood was raised on them, microcrickets and even the dreaded fruitfly, although as with all my frogs I try to mix it up a bit rather than just use one or two feeders.


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## frogfreak

frogman955 said:


> I normally add a load of weevils to a new tub of beans so that the cultures are always "fresh", ie no old beans in it.
> Doing it like that will of course slow down the cycle as you`d have to wait the full 28 days or so for the first hatch.
> The plus side of doing it that way is that when the hatch is finished you just throw the old beans out.


This is what I've been doing, Mike. I've been making new cultures every week. I'm just adding it into my fly culturing routine. So far, I'm getting loads weekly! :2thumb: Hey, Stu. I'm not really interested in trying the "forever been beetle" thing. I can see problems arising with waste, dead beetles, mold, etc. Same as tossing flies at the 28 day mark. Gotta try and keep it all clean. OCD? Nagh! :blush:

I fed them out to a single group of frogs at first, just in case they had any issues. Pooping like normal. :lol2:


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## Meefloaf

Glenn, you done Waxworms ? mine bombed before i could see how it went


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## frogfreak

Meefloaf said:


> Glenn, you done Waxworms ? mine bombed before i could see how it went


Nope, haven't tried them yet, Mike. I was planning on attempting Mites next. :gasp:


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## frogman955

frogfreak said:


> Nope, haven't tried them yet, Mike. I was planning on attempting Mites next. :gasp:


Been there and got the T shirt Glenn lol.
About 18 months ago I had a few springtail cultures with mites in them.
Not wanting to waste the little shits I was looking for some revenge for them wiping out the cultures.
So I popped the lids and sat them in the vivs tilted up for easy access.
The frogs just sat there for the whole day picking off any mite that was stupid enough to show it`s face.
I did this for 2 days and the frogs loved it.

Mike


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## frogfreak

frogman955 said:


> Been there and got the T shirt Glenn lol.
> About 18 months ago I had a few springtail cultures with mites in them.
> Not wanting to waste the little shits I was looking for some revenge for them wiping out the cultures.
> So I popped the lids and sat them in the vivs tilted up for easy access.
> The frogs just sat there for the whole day picking off any mite that was stupid enough to show it`s face.
> I did this for 2 days and the frogs loved it.
> 
> Mike


Cool, Mike! I've tossed old cultures in the tanks and after a while the can explode with mites. The frogs love them. 

Sooooo, I'd thought I try my hand at culturing them :hmm::help:

I'm going to order some of these. They told me they can be raised on bee pollen. We shall see lol

Natural Insect Control, NIC specializes in Canadian Beneficial Nematodes, grub control, Beneficial Insects, good bugs to control bad bugs. Organic, environment friendly products for home, garden, orchard and farm.


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## frogman955

Hope they don`t get out of the vivs lol.
I`ve got visions of you being divorced if they do :whistling2:


Mike


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## frogfreak

frogman955 said:


> Hope they don`t get out of the vivs lol.
> I`ve got visions of you being divorced if they do :whistling2:
> 
> 
> Mike



:lol2: I know. Meh, just messin around.


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## frogfreak

Someone learned a new trick! :lol2:



Sorry for the crappy pic...:blush:


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