# Goodbye Novak



## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

Well long story short Novak our Leonberger, has always had issues with nerves and anxiety, was ashe matured turned more into agression. After investigation & working with the Leonberger club, several dog trainers, and behaviouriststo try and help him, the conclusion was that he was bred from a line where behavioural/mental issues had been seen before. I amnot going to name the breeder. We worked with his issues as muchas possible, but today it happened. He attacked my brother-in-law, cutting open his arm and chin. It was 'relatively' superficial a few stiches in the arm and a course of antibiotics, and he is fine, thankfuly.

However, Novak was too big a dog to take chances with, and so today I am afraid Novak was PTS. Me and the Mrs are in bits.

So goodbye my big cuddly bear we will always love you, sleep well.


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

:gasp: Gutted 

RIP Novak


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## white (May 16, 2009)

could you not of put a muzzle on him when he is around other people,that's what i do with my dog who has the same issues?


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## Skarlet (Nov 8, 2009)

So sorry to hear this. He was a beautiful dog, and I always loved your pics of him.

I guess with such a big dog, that it was just too much a risk, even with a muzzle.


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## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

white said:


> could you not of put a muzzle on him when he is around other people,that's what i do with my dog who has the same issues?


 
I have 4 kids, and Novak weighs 10 stone. So aside from have him permanently muzzled no not really.

Plus he was was only really getting mor anxious and nervous, which was never nice for him, he had mental issues, now he doesn't.


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## white (May 16, 2009)

so does my dog kane but when ever he is around anybody that is not a member of his pack he is either shut away or muzzled.People keep telling me to put him down because he is so nervous and anxious round other people and dogs.But when he is at home with me he is relaxed and enjoys life so i would never him PTS.


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## *H* (Jun 17, 2007)

I'm so sorry to hear this. I'm sure it can't have been an easy decission for you to make at all. So sorry. 
R.I.P Novak


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## Nic123100 (Jun 13, 2009)

white said:


> so does my dog kane but when ever he is around anybody that is not a member of his pack he is either shut away or muzzled.People keep telling me to put him down because he is so nervous and anxious round other people and dogs.But when he is at home with me he is relaxed and enjoys life so i would never him PTS.


Is this really the right time to be questioning his decision, this would never be a easy decision to make I know personally how hard it is. If the OP has children then keeping a dog with aggression and anxiety issues around is a bad idea, sometimes things have to be done for the best. 

To the OP I'm very sorry for your loss, I too have been in this place and I know just how awful it is.


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## white (May 16, 2009)

Nic123100 said:


> Is this really the right time to be questioning his decision, this would never be a easy decision to make I know personally how hard it is. If the OP has children then keeping a dog with aggression and anxiety issues around is a bad idea, sometimes things have to be done for the best.
> 
> To the OP I'm very sorry for your loss, I too have been in this place and I know just how awful it is.


just think it's a shame that's all.A lot of people take on dogs without researching the breed properly,then when they have issues they are either sent to rescue centres or killed.This is just my opinion,this is a public forum after all.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

I am so sorry to hear this and feel so sad for you, because I know how excited you were when you booked him.

I think his size really went against him in terms of his mental instability, but I have to agree that you didn't really have a choice.

RIP Novak.


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## Amalthea (Oct 2, 2007)

Poor Novak.... I can't even begin to understand what you and your family must be going through. What a heartbreaking decision to have to make. I always enjoyed seeing his pictures.  Sleep well, Big Boy.


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## corny girl (Aug 30, 2009)

I'm so sorry to hear this as i too loved seeing his pics as he grew up. In this situation i agree it was the best decision to make, so many people just dump the dog on rescue centres & pass the buck. If it had been me in this same situation i'm sure i would of done the same thing (you have done everything possible to try to resolve the issues so don't ever feel bad about it & ignore the stupid comments made by people who obviously have no idea of what you have been through). Hugs to you all xxx


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## saxon (Feb 26, 2007)

white said:


> just think it's a shame that's all.A lot of people take on dogs without researching the breed properly,then when they have issues they are either sent to rescue centres or killed.This is just my opinion,this is a public forum after all.


 
Leo's are not known for aggression and from previous posts/threads the OP did more thane nough 'research' before getting Novak....have some empathy for gods sake:devil:

OP,

I had to make a similar decision with a young dog, animal aggression though, it's not easy when you love them so much but in some situations it's in their own best interests.

You made the right decision and at least he had a good life while he was here. In other hands he may have been beaten for biting or caused more damage when he did bite!


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## rubberbiscuit (Jan 5, 2009)

Im very sorry you had to lose Novak. It sounds like you did all the right things but at his size he could have seriously injured your children, obviously not a risk any parent can take.


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

You made the right decision, even if it wasn't the nice decision or the decision anyone would want to have to make. I am sorry for your loss.


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## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

white said:


> so does my dog kane but when ever he is around anybody that is not a member of his pack he is either shut away or muzzled.People keep telling me to put him down because he is so nervous and anxious round other people and dogs.But when he is at home with me he is relaxed and enjoys life so i would never him PTS.





white said:


> just think it's a shame that's all.A lot of people take on dogs without researching the breed properly,then when they have issues they are either sent to rescue centres or killed.This is just my opinion,this is a public forum after all.


He wasn't always relaxed even at home just with us, he was on edge a lot. What you do with yours and how your dog behaves is a different situation to mine. We did everything we could for him. OUR decision was that this outcome was the best for everyone concerned, even Novak. We have worked very hard with him to try and avoid this situation. You may not agree with it, and thats fine, I don't expect evryone to, and your opinion is completely valid, it just differs from mine.

Thank you all for the kind words.


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## Shadowz (Aug 6, 2008)

So sorry that you had to make this decision. 
Living with 2 nervous aggressive dogs here I know all to well the struggle it can be - if one of mine were a 10 stone dog I would simply not be able to do it either. 
There is worse things then being pts in the arms of people who love you in my opinion - sometimes pts is a release from anxiety and other mental things haunting animals. 
Well done for all that you did for him and for trying to solve his problems - he is now free.


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## Kare (Mar 9, 2010)

Totally agree with above, you did everything you could have to help him and then what you had to do to prevent him causing injury to the rest of his family. Which knowing this breed of dog he would never in his heart have wished to do, they were not bred to have his problems

It is very hard for anyone else who has a dog that simply has bad coping reactions to understand what having a dog with true mental instability is like, and I wish you nothing but the best for any future dog you get, either of this breed or any others.

I hope the memories you have soon return to the pleasant thoughts on what you provided him in his time with you, and what he provided you, the love, affection, smiles and laughs and your time together.


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## pippainnit (Feb 20, 2009)

How awful. I'm so sorry for you having to make that choice, and for poor Novak for having been beset with such problems. 

I think it's very easy for people to have a knee-jerk reaction. I'd be lying if I didn't open this thread and have a bit of a 'wtf' moment, but noone apart from you and your family is personally involved in the situation and subsequently has a good idea of what is the best thing to do. 

I just hope that if some good is to come out of situations like this and the premature ending of a physically healthy animal is that people will acknowledge the importance of good (and indeed bad) breeding. Just because an animal is young and appears okay does not mean it's not carrying other, less visible problems, and mental issues are difficult enough to deal with in humans, let alone animals who cannot convey what they are thinking or feeling. 

My complete sympathy.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

pippainnit said:


> I think it's very easy for people to have a knee-jerk reaction. I'd be lying if I didn't open this thread and have a bit of a 'wtf' moment, but noone apart from you and your family is personally involved in the situation and subsequently has a good idea of what is the best thing to do.
> 
> I just hope that if some good is to come out of situations like this and the premature ending of a physically healthy animal is that people will acknowledge the importance of good (and indeed bad) breeding. Just because an animal is young and appears okay does not mean it's not carrying other, less visible problems, and mental issues are difficult enough to deal with in humans, let alone animals who cannot convey what they are thinking or feeling.


Well put Pippa. I too had a WTF moment because the OP hadn't mentioned any problems in previous posts, so I admit to thinking that everything was fine with him, so it was a shock to read the heading of his thread.

However I totally understood because, to be honest this is my worst nightmare with my own dog. There is no doubt that he too has "mental problems", loads of anxieties and anything different in his life turns him into a bit of a ticking timebomb. Consequently life is a constant situation of always being aware of when there is a moment that could become dangerous. So far his aggression is always directed towards other dogs, but if that day ever arrived when he showed that aggression to a human I would be doing exactly the same, because I know passing him onto anyone else, even someone with a lifetime of experience dealing with problem dogs, wouldn't honestly be the right answer for him.


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## pigglywiggly (Jul 19, 2008)

so sorry for your loss.

cant have been an easy decision, but with kids about and you trying behaviour therapsts/ breed expert advice/neutering to try and sort him, you really had no choice.


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## marthaMoo (May 4, 2007)

I am so very, very sorry for you all ((Hugs))

I know it must of been such a very hard decission.


I moved a Neo from my local pound once and contacted breed rescue, lovely lady. But she informed me of a line of dogs that had serious behavioural issues. She herself bought one as a pup. Then one day he turned and attacked her, very badly. If her son and husband hadnt of been there, well, she wouldnt of stood a chance.

Very sadly there are people out there who knowingly breed large breeds with behavioural issues in there lines. And unless its something you really look into before hand, you would never know untill its too late. And too late for the dog.

This type of behaviour is not fixable! its like waiting for a bomb to go off, its not if, its just when. 
And when they do, its like the dog is a different dog, one in torment. They would never choose to hurt the people who love them.

And no one is fit to judge the OP and what his family have been through unless you have been through the same, and if you had you would be doing nothing but offering support.


Sweet dreams big lad, no more pain, all mended and happy at the bridge.

Aly


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## miss_ferret (Feb 4, 2010)

RIP Novak  he was a beautiful boy and i loved seeing his pictures, my condolances to you and you mrs, i cant imagine how you must be feeling.


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## Stacey010884 (Mar 7, 2009)

What dreadful news. I'm so very sorry for your loss. He was a gorgeous boy but I never knew how much he was suffering. Truly awful and I'm sorry that you had to experience this.

It's frustrating that some people use unsuitable animals in breeding. They have no consideration for the people and animals they affect.

You should be proud that you tried so many different people/things in order to help him live a happier life, I'm just really sad that it didn't work out in your favour. Rest in peace Novak.

My deepest sympathies to you and your family. xxxx


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## selina20 (May 28, 2008)

I just want to say i wish all dogs had such loving owners that took their interests to heart.

I would of made the same decision and with being a mom of 2 i can understand where you are coming from in regards to the kids. He was a gorgeous dog who lived a happy healthy life with a family he loved. Its nice to see that you tried to help him in every way you could even towards the end. Its just unlucky that you got a dog with such issues when people who abuse dogs can have them with no issues at all.

My thoughts go out to you and your family at this hard time.


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## rach666 (Dec 12, 2006)

i really dont know what to say to you mate.like others had allways loved seeing his pictures,you really did make the best decision.RIP NOVAK what a beautiful dog you were.

my condolences to you and your famliy x x


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## harlequin (Oct 28, 2008)

Im so sorry to hear this terry, he was a big beautiful dog and I know he would have had the best care possible while with you. My heart goes out to you and your family having to make such a tough decision. Jess xxxx


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## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

feorag said:


> Well put Pippa. I too had a WTF moment because the OP hadn't mentioned any problems in previous posts, so I admit to thinking that everything was fine with him, so it was a shock to read the heading of his thread.
> 
> However I totally understood because, to be honest this is my worst nightmare with my own dog. There is no doubt that he too has "mental problems", loads of anxieties and anything different in his life turns him into a bit of a ticking timebomb. Consequently life is a constant situation of always being aware of when there is a moment that could become dangerous. So far his aggression is always directed towards other dogs, but if that day ever arrived when he showed that aggression to a human I would be doing exactly the same, because I know passing him onto anyone else, even someone with a lifetime of experience dealing with problem dogs, wouldn't honestly be the right answer for him.


Yes it,s not really something I brought to the forum, as we were already in contact with a lot of help in the Leonberger Club, through them trainers specialised in dealing with Leos, and a behaviourist.

I am not really one for bringing my woes to the forum, unless I genuinely needed help finding a trainer etc.

We looked at several leo breeders before we bought Novak and as far as we were aware, mostly by reccomendation, we were buying from a reputable breeder with a good line. It was only after we met members of the leonberger club that they informed us of other members who had bought from the same breeder and also had issues.

I wouldn't generally have posted this thread at all in all honesty, but I know that many of you were very fond of seeing pics of him so it seemed like the right ting to do to inform people.

It hasn't put us off having another dog, and definately hasn't put us off having another Leo, but it's not something we are going to rush into. We plan to move house within the next 2 years, so at the moment the plan is to wait and see how we feel, and what the situation is then.

Thank-you all for the kindness shown.


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## Tds79 (Nov 6, 2010)

Terry so so sorry to hear this, always loved seeing his pics and I think when children are involved you have to be so careful, and as hard as it is you did the right thing. 

RIP NOVAC have fun at the bridge xxxxxxxxx


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

Amalthea said:


> Poor Novak.... I can't even begin to understand what you and your family must be going through. What a heartbreaking decision to have to make. I always enjoyed seeing his pictures.  Sleep well, Big Boy.


This, this must of been SUCH a difficult decision. Poor you and poor boy!
I loved seeing your updates as did my OH, so much so we recommended your photos and the breed to a family friend, and after researching etc, they now have their own little bear. 

R.I.P Big fluffy Giant


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## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

freekygeeky said:


> This, this must of been SUCH a difficult decision. Poor you and poor boy!
> I loved seeing your updates as did my OH, so much so we recommended your photos and the breed to a family friend, and after researching etc, they now have their own little bear.
> 
> R.I.P Big fluffy Giant


 
Thats so nice to hear, thank-you.


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## freekygeeky (May 25, 2007)

bladeblaster said:


> Thats so nice to hear, thank-you.


I and my OH have loved every single one of your images! Loved them! Again im ever so sorry. Sleep well Novak xx


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## Nix (Jan 23, 2008)

RIP Novak. What a stunning dog and it is such a shame that he had to be PTS but given the circumstances I don't see that you really had any other option. Especially one which would have given Novak a good quality of life.


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## bosshogg (Nov 19, 2006)

so sorry to here this :sad:


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## Nicky1983 (Oct 25, 2010)

So sorry to hear about Novak and what you had to do. It must of been a very hard decision to make and I can't imagine what that must feel like. But like others I think you have made the best decision especially with children in the picture and if you had rehomed him and something else had happened that would be very hard to live with given his power. Thinking of you but at least Novak is at peace from his problems.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

bladeblaster said:


> We looked at several leo breeders before we bought Novak and as far as we were aware, mostly by reccomendation, we were buying from a reputable breeder with a good line. It was only after we met members of the leonberger club that they informed us of other members who had bought from the same breeder and also had issues.
> 
> I wouldn't generally have posted this thread at all in all honesty, but I know that many of you were very fond of seeing pics of him so it seemed like the right ting to do to inform people.


I know you did all your research and it's such a shame that you were misled a bit by his breeder. 

Sadly this happens in other breeds and in cats too. I've known of so many people who've told me they've done all their research on the breed, contacted various breeders and bought a pedigree kitten from a 'lovely breeder' and my heart sinks because I know who they're buying from and in some case I wouldn't touch anything that person bred with a bargepole, because of their practices when it comes to breeding, so it's a tough call.

I am pleased to did decide to put up this thread, because you know I thought he was a gorgeous puppy who grew into a stunning dog - such a shame it didn't work out for - or him! :sad:


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## Lenor (Jul 24, 2009)

He was a stunning dog, and obviously well loved from the photos. So sorry you ended up being put in such a terrible situation.
We had a cocker spaniel with severe anxiety/aggression issues a few years ago, he had been my stepfathers dog and moved in with us when he did. He was terrified of strangers and children, and also short-sighted, so would frequently growl at me and my sister until we managed to call to him through his growls and he realised who it was. He had to be shut away if we had guests. It wasn't a great life for him because despite it all he did actually love people, but you wouldn't have got that unless you knew him. Sadly he also had a heart condition so we only had him for 18months or so, but until you've lived with a problem dog you can't fully appreciate it. You can do things to manage them, but it's not really a great life being muzzled or excluded in a back room alone. And when the dog is bigger than you it is unfortunately too dangerous even to do that. Terrible though it is, you did all you could, and he's not scared anymore. RIP Novak.


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## Rach1 (May 18, 2010)

this made me feel very sad and i'm sure yyou and your children are missing him immensly but as they say, prevention is better then cure and you have made the right decision to protect your family!
i'm sending you and your family my thoughts and wish you all the best in getting over your loss!


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## Lozza.Bella (Apr 24, 2010)

*Ah Terry, our thoughts are with you and your family, you made a tough call not just only for yourselves as a family but for Novak too. *
*You did your best and no one can say you did anything other than, I remember seeing him in a picture with your OH and I thought about what a stunning animal he was. *
*Healing will take time but the anxiety is gone now, and Novak is now at peace, hopefully your family and you can draw on this and start to recover from your loss. *
*Peacefull vibes to you all at this sad time,*

*Laura.*


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## cloggers (Mar 13, 2010)

Some things need to be done, he was a big dog and you couldn't risk him with your children. You did the responsible thing. No one will ever know if the anxiety issues had other effects on him, he's in a better place. I'm sorry for your loss


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## RubyCurtis (May 26, 2009)

i am so sorry to hear this, i too had a similar expereince but with a horse. bought an untouched 8 year old stallion from a sale, turned out he was drugged to the eyeballs to keep him sane. i tried for 18 months to calm him enough even if he was just to stay a pet, but he was evil and almost killed me on a number of occasions. in the end i decided the est thing would be to have him pts, totally broke my heart but the way he was i couldnt risk rehioming him because i knew he would eventually kill someone. that was quite a few years ago and people still make nasty remarks about it xx


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## storm (Jul 23, 2007)

im so sorry for your loss terry x


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## EquineArcher (Feb 13, 2010)

I'm so so sorry to hear this Terry, what an awful thing to have to do.

Was he the one at your house when I picked up the carpet last year? If so, he was a stunner.

You definitely did the right thing- much better he be at peace now than deteriorate mentally even further and end up distressed. 

RIP xxx


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## JohnW (Mar 22, 2010)

So sorry to hear of your loss,he looked like a stunning dog.
We recently lost our male Akita to cancer after 10 years, I rescued/removed him as a year old pup from some scumbag attempting to train him for fighting and as a result of this he was a mentally scarred with nervous aggression problems.
It is an awful decision to have to make to put any animal to sleep which we came close to many timesbut I still wonder if it would have been fairer on our dog than a muzzled social life and the potential risk to humans or other animals if something had gone wrong.
I believe there is no clear route to take and you cannot judge people without walking in there shoes,it sounds to me that you made the only sensible decision for Novak & your family.
Good luck for the future!


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## BoaQueen (May 3, 2009)

Arr mate so sorry to hear this. Brought a tear to my eye reading your post.
Nothing I can say will make you make feel better, you did the right thing.
RIP Novak xxxxx


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

what an awful thing to have to do. we had to have our rescue dog pts a couple of years back as he nipped the face of my neighbours 3 year old. he caused only minor injuries, but it was totally unprovoked, we saw every second of it from him pottering in to jumping and biting and pottering out again. my neighbour said she didnt want him to be pts, but when i asked if she would feel the same had he been 4" higher and taken out her eye, she shook her head. we had to look at it in a sensible manner. he had issues from when we got him, and to risk him causing worse injury or passing him back to kennel life where he could end up anywhere, we had him pts. 

i praise you in your decision. although many rescue centers do carry out assessments, we have taken in a few rescues now deemed child safe etc, that last one being a 'gentle giant', yes, and he was, until he got a hold of a chew and i walked past him, it ended up with me holding him by his collar trying to keep him from attacking me as he snarled in my face. had this been my 6 or 7 year old, he would have torn them to pieces, luckily i shouted for my husband who grabbed his collar and pulled him off of me and to outside. he had managed to bite my wrist, and we took him straight back to the kennels and their answer 'why did you go near him when he was eating?' well lets see, i thought i could walk across my living room with him in there given you said he was a safe dog to house with us and my children. they totally blamed us for what happened, and within hours was listed back on their website as the 'gentle giant' who came back 'through no fault of his own'. luckily he went to a new home with a single man and another dog. i will never trust another rescue center because of this, and feel you did what was the right thing for everyone, the dog included in what you have done. 

RIP beautiful puppy, i hope your family come to terms with this awful decision.


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## MoreliaUK (Aug 16, 2010)

Sorry to hear about this Terry as it is a very tough call to make. Take it easy mate.


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

goldie1212 said:


> that last one being a 'gentle giant', yes, and he was, until he got a hold of a chew and i walked past him, it ended up with me holding him by his collar trying to keep him from attacking me as he snarled in my face. had this been my 6 or 7 year old, he would have torn them to pieces, luckily i shouted for my husband who grabbed his collar and pulled him off of me and to outside. he had managed to bite my wrist, and we took him straight back to the kennels and their answer 'why did you go near him when he was eating?' well lets see, i thought i could walk across my living room with him in there given you said he was a safe dog to house with us and my children. they totally blamed us for what happened, and within hours was listed back on their website as the 'gentle giant' who came back 'through no fault of his own'. luckily he went to a new home with a single man and another dog. i will never trust another rescue center because of this, and feel you did what was the right thing for everyone, the dog included in what you have done.


That absolutely appalled me!! How totally irresponsible - the first thing they should have done is test him for food aggression and then explained very clearly to his new owners that he had this problem, especially if they had children! :bash: In fact imao food aggressive dogs should never be homed into a household with children.

Some rescues will pts food aggressive dogs, because of the very problem you've just said- sometimes they will get hold of food they haven't been given and so ther owners is unaware of the situation and that could have been a child walking past! *shakes head in disbelief*


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## Lisa.T (May 8, 2010)

Sorry you had to make such a difficult decision :grouphug: Sleep tight Novak x


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## bladeblaster (Sep 30, 2008)

Thank-you all for such kind words, and for the stories of those who have been in similar situations. This thread really has helped me this week.:notworthy:


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## Big Red One (Oct 17, 2007)

Only just seen this....

All I can say is, think of his good days and the good times you did have with him.
It's clear from the photos Novak was a well loved part of your family, but unfortunately the situation seems to have become unmanageable.
Personally I would have taken the same course of action as the consequences of trying to 'manage' could have been catastrophic. I'm sure he's happier now, released from his frustration.

RIP Novak, run free big fella........


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## feorag (Jul 31, 2007)

bladeblaster said:


> Thank-you all for such kind words, and for the stories of those who have been in similar situations. This thread really has helped me this week.:notworthy:


I do think sharing grief or frustration with people who share a great love of animals can help, even if we don't actually know these people as 'personal friends'.

Also, just to get a different perspective on our situation from an outsider can help a great deal. We become so embroiled in our own problems and grief that sometimes our thinking becomes a little introverted and we can then see guilt where there is none, so hearing other like-minded people's thoughts on our own situation can make us realise that there should be no guilt, only sorrow that it had to happen.


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

feorag said:


> That absolutely appalled me!! How totally irresponsible - the first thing they should have done is test him for food aggression and then explained very clearly to his new owners that he had this problem, especially if they had children! :bash: In fact imao food aggressive dogs should never be homed into a household with children.
> 
> Some rescues will pts food aggressive dogs, because of the very problem you've just said- sometimes they will get hold of food they haven't been given and so ther owners is unaware of the situation and that could have been a child walking past! *shakes head in disbelief*


tell me about it. they simply said well when the kennel staff put his food bowl in his kennel he is perfectly fine with it. we did say it wasnt giving him the chew that was the issue, it was walking past him when he already had it. do your kennel staff go near him when hes eating at all? they said well no, no person should go near a dog when its eating, its common sense :gasp:

they knew we had 2 young daughters, who at the time were i think 4 and 5, we went to meet the dog twice, once on our own, once as a whole family with our other dog. we also have a cat, and i dread to think if it was him who wandered into the room instead of me. the dog had serious possession issues, i had never been so scared, he was a german shepherd cross what they thought to be rottweiler, extremely large and powerful, and when me with my short little arms has been pushed to the floor and the only thing stopping him from ripping my face off was my thumb through his collar holding him back while he snarled at me, well lets just say i didnt stop shaking for some time. i honestly have no idea what would have happened if my husband hadnt been at home. it was even more of a shock given he was 10 years old, a lumbering giant who would be so obedient with sit, stay, paw, rollover etc. they saw the cut on my wrist where he had caught me as i went to grab his collar as he came at me, but they more or less shrugged it off.


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## quizicalkat (Jul 7, 2007)

I really feel for you and your family x

I too am sure you made the right decision.

I had a lovely Rottie girl who had a fantastic temperament. Then she fell seriously ill with a muscle wasting disease and lost all the muscle on her head - I had to hand feed with a syringe as she couldn't open her jaw and after a few weeks she could feed again but after that she changed completely became nervy and aggressive, like you I explored lots of avenues, but the final straw was her flying for a young man who was walking past. I could only just hold her. I came to the conclusion that she was so unhappy and nervous in her life that it would be kinder and safer (I had a young child too) to put her to sleep. It was a very hard decision but I know that it was the right one for her. 

RIP Novak (and Poppy)


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## Shell195 (May 31, 2007)

goldie1212 said:


> tell me about it. they simply said well when the kennel staff put his food bowl in his kennel he is perfectly fine with it. we did say it wasnt giving him the chew that was the issue, it was walking past him when he already had it. do your kennel staff go near him when hes eating at all? they said well no, no person should go near a dog when its eating, its common sense :gasp:
> 
> they knew we had 2 young daughters, who at the time were i think 4 and 5, we went to meet the dog twice, once on our own, once as a whole family with our other dog. we also have a cat, and i dread to think if it was him who wandered into the room instead of me. the dog had serious possession issues, i had never been so scared, he was a german shepherd cross what they thought to be rottweiler, extremely large and powerful, and when me with my short little arms has been pushed to the floor and the only thing stopping him from ripping my face off was my thumb through his collar holding him back while he snarled at me, well lets just say i didnt stop shaking for some time. i honestly have no idea what would have happened if my husband hadnt been at home. it was even more of a shock given he was 10 years old, a lumbering giant who would be so obedient with sit, stay, paw, rollover etc. they saw the cut on my wrist where he had caught me as i went to grab his collar as he came at me, but they more or less shrugged it off.


 
My friends stepson and girlfriend adopted a dog from a rescue, he was a Sharpei x . They had the dog a couple of weeks and took him out in the car as they had done before, for no apparant reason the dog launched at Carls head and tore off half his ear. While Carl was in hospital his girlfriend rang and asked them for permission to PTS, she was denied. The rescue wanted the dog back and they sent 2 young girls to pick the dog up and it seems he had been brought back a few times for aggressive behaviour. A few weeks after the attack the dog was relisted on the rescues website:bash: Carl now has half an ear, what if it had been a child. These irresponsible rescues should be made to pay for their ways:devil:


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## ghostcornsnake (Jan 30, 2009)

when i whent to reserve luna he was such a nice friendly dog i cant beleve it im so sorry for your loss


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## ghostcornsnake (Jan 30, 2009)

white said:


> just think it's a shame that's all.A lot of people take on dogs without researching the breed properly,then when they have issues they are either sent to rescue centres or killed.This is just my opinion,this is a public forum after all.


 
what experiance do you have with the dog breed terry has 

oh and who whants to hear your opions anyway i beleve he did the right thing personaly and i think its the breeders fault and the dog was oviously sufering so much mentaly but thats the breeders fault.


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## medusa0373 (Mar 18, 2008)

Terry, so sorry to hear of your loss. 

I've seen the pictures of Novak you've posted though I've never commented on them, but he looked like a gorgeous dog and it was obvious that he was well-loved. At least you have been brave enough to make this final decision for him - as others have said, he is not scared now and doesn't have to worry. And you did all you could to try and help him, but at the end of the day you know there is only so much you can do, and to take a risk with a dog that big just isn't possible, especially when you have children.

RIP Novak x


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## Postcard (Aug 29, 2010)

I am so, so sorry for your loss and hope that your brother in law makes a speedy recovery but what I have to say is that from my relatively short time I've had my own dogs (all rescues) I just cannot begin to say how disappointed I am for you that this has happened to such an obviously caring and responsible owner who did the correct research and it's just reminded me of my own personal experiences.

You have made SUCH a responsible decision and I'm glad for you that you haven't passed him on to anyone else, and moreso that you haven't let it put you off. Huge respect and kudos for that. 



bladeblaster said:


> Yes it,s not really something I brought to the forum, as we were already in contact with a lot of help in the Leonberger Club, through them trainers specialised in dealing with Leos, and a behaviourist.
> 
> I am not really one for bringing my woes to the forum, unless I genuinely needed help finding a trainer etc.
> 
> ...


I hear this SO, so often and it breaks my heart. Unfortunately, you can't fix genetic predispositions no matter how well you socialise - it's not fair on anyone to produce temperamentally unsuitable dogs but if they win prizes, what's the incentive to change?



RubyCurtis said:


> i am so sorry to hear this, i too had a similar expereince but with a horse. bought an untouched 8 year old stallion from a sale, turned out he was drugged to the eyeballs to keep him sane. i tried for 18 months to calm him enough even if he was just to stay a pet, but he was evil and almost killed me on a number of occasions. in the end i decided the est thing would be to have him pts, totally broke my heart but the way he was i couldnt risk rehioming him because i knew he would eventually kill someone. that was quite a few years ago and people still make nasty remarks about it xx


I absolutely believe that you did the right thing here - the fact he was sane when drugged up suggests to me he was in pain (normally the cause of behavioural problems in horses) or perhaps even had abnormalities in the brain (think damage caused from a hard whack to the head when loading or against a stable lintel). A half ton animal on a mission to kill is :censor:ing scary, and I've met a barrel load of nutty horses in my time - if only there were people like you responsible enough to take on the heartache and expense of making that choice, rather than selling or rehoming for free where they inevitably end up with some dodgy dealer who'll start the cycle again... Well done you.



goldie1212 said:


> what an awful thing to have to do. we had to have our rescue dog pts a couple of years back as he nipped the face of my neighbours 3 year old. he caused only minor injuries, but it was totally unprovoked, we saw every second of it from him pottering in to jumping and biting and pottering out again. my neighbour said she didnt want him to be pts, but when i asked if she would feel the same had he been 4" higher and taken out her eye, she shook her head. we had to look at it in a sensible manner. he had issues from when we got him, and to risk him causing worse injury or passing him back to kennel life where he could end up anywhere, we had him pts.
> 
> i praise you in your decision. although many rescue centers do carry out assessments, we have taken in a few rescues now deemed child safe etc, that last one being a 'gentle giant', yes, and he was, until he got a hold of a chew and i walked past him, it ended up with me holding him by his collar trying to keep him from attacking me as he snarled in my face. had this been my 6 or 7 year old, he would have torn them to pieces, luckily i shouted for my husband who grabbed his collar and pulled him off of me and to outside. he had managed to bite my wrist, and we took him straight back to the kennels and their answer 'why did you go near him when he was eating?' well lets see, i thought i could walk across my living room with him in there given you said he was a safe dog to house with us and my children.* they totally blamed us for what happened, and within hours was listed back on their website as the 'gentle giant' who came back 'through no fault of his own'. luckily he went to a new home with a single man and another dog. i will never trust another rescue center because of this, and feel you did what was the right thing for everyone, the dog included in what you have done. *
> 
> RIP beautiful puppy, i hope your family come to terms with this awful decision.


Oh how I wish that this suprised me. 2 /3 rescue dogs we've taken on have had serious issues and the third is an absolute angel who's cost a fair whack in vets bills (2 ops in the past year we've paid for). I am an idealistic person and have been too trusting against my better judgement basically, and probably have expected too much aswell but when choosing the rescue we went to after we put the poundie to sleep I was struck by how many sodding self-righteous people there were lecturing me as I was completely honest and upfront. 

I've PTS one - who I truly believed was my doggy soulmate, incredibly clever and utterly brilliantly quick to learn, super bouncy and waggy with no manners to start with. He went for my face out of nowhere (he'd been sleeping at my feet) when I was alone in the house after I started crying after finding out a friend had died (he'd also shown other unprovoked aggression and bizzarre moments of air snapping / growling when waking up). Just like you, I was holding him by the collar (I'm very strong for a girl and almost 6') and he bit me on the forearm and I stayed absolutely still for what seemed like ages till he let go, looking completely confused and extremely worried. I've got a couple of bit of white scarring from his teeth still though he didn't break the skin. He was a poundie and I have to say that I'm not sure his weird symptoms would have shown up in their environment and when I contacted them they were very concerned and kind so I didn't let the bad experience put me off, also worth mentioning he was a "long legged staff" type (e.g. DIY pitbull / pitbull type) so potentially had brain damage from rough treatment / weed smoking or maybe just genetic. I'm crying just now writing this, I can't believe how much I miss him.

Second dog is one we've only recently returned to the rescue service. First time he met us he lunged at someone who approached in an overly-friendly manner, and both mum & myself forgave that when it's clear we should have trusted our initial instincts. Beautiful natured dog inside the house but utterly unable to cope with the lack of routine in our lives (mum's shift work, I'm away half the year) / busy existence and his fearfulness resulted in aggression towards other dogs, men, old people, people approaching in a "threatening" (e.g. friendly) fashion. We walked him everywhere muzzled, worked with behaviourists and trainers (I don't believe a class would have been suitable for him, nervous as he was) and didn't let it get us down. However, it was constantly a case of managing him so he wouldn't bite (as in I had no doubt in my mind he might if we didn't prevent it) and it was just so unfair on him AND us though he did make huge, huge progress and came with me on buses, trains, to lots of pub beer gardens, played with my toddler sister (muzzled), met lots of new people etc etc. He's gone to an absolutely wonderful new home with more routine in their lives and more experience of the breed, and they're aware of why he came back.

ETA - both of these dogs I am CERTAIN had these issues before they came to me as they showed up within literally days. We forgave and kept things stress free so they could settle in. I'm not sure why dogs who are obviously unsuitable continue to be rehomed when good-natured dogs are PTS in overflowing kennels. The world is insane.


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