# Goldfish care



## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

Ok so i thought i may attempt to write up what i know about keeping goldfish. Here goes...

Goldfish are one of the most widely abused pets owned, due to the common misconception that they are easy to keep, grow to the size of the tank/bowl and cheap to replace if they die. Infact, goldfish are a large fish, capable of reaching 20" given proper care and space,and have been known to live up to 40years, although 15-20 is much more likely. They have great personalities, and a good memory. Some have even been taught to do simple tricks for food!

Aquariums for goldfish need to be large to allow the fish to grow to the full potential its genetics will allow. Tank size is very important,it must be carefully thought out as it greatly influences the potential of the fish to reach its adult size. A stunted fish will die much earlier than a fish kept in a large tank allowing them room to grow.

Goldfish can become prone to several health issues as a result of the poor water conditions in a small tank/bowl. Unfortunately, they produce a large amount of waste especially when their metabolic rate is increased due to elevated temperature. As a result, the water quality deteriorates rather rapidly especially when the tank is less than ideal in size, even in a large tank, water changes and gravel vacs will be your best friend in keeping your fish fit and healthy.

Considering goldfish are not designed to stay small (which is why fishbowls are considered cruel) and at full grown can be in the 8-10 up to 18-20 inches range depending on type, a general guideline for fancy fat body types should be at least 15 gallons for the 1st fish plus an extra 10 gallons per fish in the tank after that, and double that for common/comet/shubunkin types.

This does not mean that the spare 15 gallon tank you have can be used for a goldfish, they are very social creatures and you should not keep goldfish in isolation as they are more unlikely to live a long life if deprived of company. Minimum tank sizes for goldfish IMO would be 25 gallons for fancies, and 50 gallons for commons as you will need at least a pair. Bigger is always better, and just because a fish will fit in your tank, doesnt mean it will be able to swim properly, and have the space to move and use its muscles. Rectangular tanks are always better as they provide the largest air to water surface for oxygenation. Goldfish have high oxygen requirements, yet another reason bowls are completely unsuitable. All in all, the bigger the tank you can get, the happier, healthier and longer your fish will live.

Here is a list of some types of goldfish.

Fancy goldfish-can be slower than commons-
Black Moor/Telescope
Fantail
Oranda
Pompoms

Very fancy goldfish-can be much slower swimmers-
Lionhead
Ranchu
Eggfish
Celestial
Bubble Eyes

Common or pond type goldfish-fast strong swimmers-
Comet
Common Goldfish
Shubunkin

It is advised not to mix commons with fancies, and especially not very fancy goldfish. 2 main reasons are-

Competition for food, the commons will in general be faster stronger swimmers than the fancies, and definately faster and stronger than the very fancy fish. The fish with eye growth such as bubble eyes, celestials, moors wont be able to see the food aswell as the commons either,aswell as some orandas and lionheads with large wen growth. 

Spawning, male common shaped goldfish will easily out swim a female fancy goldfish, and will push her to exhaustion if they are together when she starts to spawn. The males can be very hard on the females, shoving them around and into plants etc, having a large strong male goldfish pushing a smaller female goldfish around is never going to end well. 

Males can be sexed from females by means of the breeding dots on their gill covers (not always visible out of spawning mode, although my 3 males have always shown them at all times) and also by venting. Venting is looking at the fishes vent (where they poop from and also where females expel eggs from) the males should be flat and the females can have a tiny little bump, im still learning this method, but its becoming quite easy for me now. 

Fancy goldfish are far more suited to aquariums than common goldfish, mainly due to their adult size. Ponds, either indoor or outside, should be considered for commons/comets/shubunkins.

Stunting is one of the most talked about subjects when it comes to keeping fish. It remains a debate with different theories as to what causes stunting in fish growth. There are different things that influence the growth rate of a fish.

Genetics obviously will play some part in this, if you have a small mother and father, the off-spring will not be as large at adult size as that of larger parents. Any tank should allow for the maximum adult size of the particular type of goldfish, and not be taken as you can go smaller as the parent fish were smaller, it could just be that the adults spawned before becoming fully grown.

Stress is another factor that is sometimes missed when it comes to stunting. When a fish is stressed, it releases the hormones in response to the stress, which reduce the growth hormones. Once the stress has been removed, the fish may have a growth spurt due to the fish releasing more growth hormones again. A fish may stunt through stress while in a smaller tank, but then when placed into a larger tank could make up some growth, although will never be as large as it could have been had the stunting not taken place,and no doubt the life span will also be reduced.

Overcrowding can also cause stress.Many people tend to buy a lot of small fish and forget that their fish are still sub-adult. The lack of space can prevent the fish from developing normally as they should do as all the fish will release the stunting hormones, so the more fish there are in the tank, the stronger the hormones, doing very regular partial water changes will help dilute the hormones but in the long run stocking will need to be reduced. 

Water changes are a must, in all tanks, to dilute the nitrates that build up and also the hormones released by the fish. Gravel vacs are a very good idea too as the debris (food/poop) that drops down into the gravel will break down and further pollute the water. Goldfish poop a lot, so a gravel vac i would say is pretty much compulsary!

The nitrogen cycle is explained already in different threads so i wont go into that, but its a very important process in every aquarium.

Test kits are a fantastic product, fairly cheap to buy (dont buy test strips as they can be inaccurate) API do a good liquid drop test kit which is easy to come by and is a good price. 

Most people tend to forget the nitrate will remain in the water elevating dangerously if not for the regular partial water changes. I carry out around 60% every weekend in my goldfish tank, with a gravel vac. Nitrate should not be allowed to climb higher than 40ppm. Try to set-up a scedule for your water changes so your levels are always <40ppm before a water change, preferably, nitrates should be kept at less than 20ppm, and in heavily planted tanks the nitrates can be at zero even in a cycled fully stocked tank. Heavily planted tanks very rarely have goldfish in them though, as the goldies will simply snack away until theres not much left,good for the fish, not so good to look at. Water changes will still be needed but not so regularly if your tank is heavily planted. In high nitrate tanks, fish can become more susceptable to health issues, and can also become stunted. Even in a planted tank, you will need to water change to remove some of the fish poop etc from the gravel and keep your water in top condition. 

Filtration is extremely important. Goldfish have a reputation for being very messy compared to tropical fish but this is not always true,plecos and large cichlids for example are also very messy. 

Aim for a turnover rate of around 4-5 times the water volume of your aquarium. My aquarium has a turnover rate of around 7x the tanks volume per hour by means of 4 separate filters.There is no such thing as too much filtration, unless the out-lets are too powerful and the goldfish are swept around and get stressed in the process, this can be avoided by adding spray bars to the out-lets to disperse the flow more gently. Keeping goldfish is certainly not a cheap hobby. If you cannot afford the proper set-up, maybe try smaller cold water species such as white cloud mountain minnows for example, or maybe even a smaller tropical tank with rosy barbs as these can look quite similar to goldfish but remain much smaller. 

When it comes to cleaning the filter media,what you should do is use your old tank water or clean dechlorinated tap water in a clean bucket to rinse out the filter media. It does not have to be spotlessly cleaned as most of the dirt in it is still beneficial for the tank and will hold bacteria, the majority of your beneficial bacteria will live in your filter media. You should not replace the old filter media with new ones unless the old media is literally falling apart, and even so, try to retain a small portion of the old media to put in alongside the new so that the bacteria can more quickly colonise the new surfaces.

Diet, very important, especially for fancy goldfish. Fancy goldfish are prone to bouyancy problems due to their internal organs being cramped up in their deformed bodies. Floating foods should be avoided at all costs. Quality sinking pellets are by far the best option of shop bought foods. I use saki hikari food for mine and im happy with the results. Flake foods lose their goodness very quickly on contact with the water, so even if you put the flakes under water to stop them from floating, they have very little nutritional value compared to a pellet food. Another option you can look into is gel foods. Some people use these for their fish as they can control what goes into them and they have zero gas content in fish which do have floating issues.

Goldfish also need a lot of greens in their diet, either by means of live plants, or by adding foods to the tank a couple of times a week. My goldfish adore cooked shelled peas, and cooked broccoli. They get peas at least twice a week as they are thought to push out any trapped gases in the intestinal tract which can create floaty problems, i know when i feed them peas, the bright green poops the next day do occasionally have gas bubbles trapped in them. 

Variety in their diet will always do fish good. Mine get saki hikari pellets as their staple diet, then they have peas, broccoli, live or frozen daphnia/brineshrimp/bloodworm once or twice a week too. They also have live plants in the tank which they enjoy snacking on too.

With fancy goldfish especially, tank decor is something to seriously put a lot of thought into. Any ornaments which they can swim into and get trapped, should be removed. Any ornaments or plants which are sharp can easily injure these fish, and fish with eye bubbles can get caught and the eye bubble then pop, usually the fish will heal up but wont look as nice, and can become infected with the open wound, fish with protruding eyes such as moors can be blinded by rough edges too. Silk plants are best if you use fake plants, and also driftwood needs to be rounded off, so the sharp edges are all gone. 

Tankmates for goldfish, well theres other goldfish, dojo loaches, and some people keep bristlenose plecos but i always worried their sharp spines on their faces could harm my goldfish so i have never tried it. Apple snails are good with goldfish though may get nipped at, and nerite snails with smooth shells have also been kept successfully with goldfish. You can also house white cloud mountain minnows with goldfish, but 1 day chances are they will become a goldfish snack.

Do not add common plecos to a goldfish tank, they have been known to latch onto the side of a slow moving goldfish and eat away at its slime coat. I have seen this myself and i will never add one to a goldfish tank for this reason. It may be ok if you have a tank of just common goldfish and they can all move quickly. Personally i wouldnt try it.

I hope this helps anyone wanting to know a bit more about their fish, and ive made any mistakes or missed anything, feel free to point them out :2thumb:


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

:lol2: ^^^^^^^ thats an essay and a half! i wonder if anyone will bother reading it :lol2:


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## cnella (Feb 24, 2010)

nice one goldie, very imformative. i'm sure this would be fantastic help to a lot of goldfish keepers, old and new.:no1:


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## daftlassieEmma (Oct 23, 2008)

sticky!


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

:2thumb: thank you. i hope it can help some owners out, or at least point them in the right direction.


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## Raych (Mar 1, 2010)

Thank you sweetie, that was very informative. :2thumb: :no1:

My pet shop is getting me in a Large fish tank (for cheap  ) for me to use whilst we're waiting for our ideal home to rent. Then we'll be building a raised pond so if we move we can take the pond with us. 

I'm just wondering if this should be a general rule for the filter made for twice the volume of the water? Just something I've read.

I'm so pleased we can give them different foods, I'm going to cook them some peas tonight.


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## Luca Brasi (Feb 7, 2010)

Raych said:


> Thank you sweetie, that was very informative. :2thumb: :no1:
> 
> My pet shop is getting me in a Large fish tank (for cheap  ) for me to use whilst we're waiting for our ideal home to rent. Then we'll be building a raised pond so if we move we can take the pond with us.
> 
> ...


 
Goldfish are very messy feeders. I'd go for a filter that turns the water over at least four times per hour. Remember that the quoted "litres per hour" is the maximum it can do with minimal tubing etc. In reality the throughput is nowhere near what you'd think. Especially if it's been in use for a while and needs th pre filter cleaning.


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## Raych (Mar 1, 2010)

I'm a bit of a noob when it comes to filters :bash:
Was just wondering if what I heard was right as I'll be buying a filter soon. Hoping to just go all out and buy an external filter that I can use in the tank, and in the pond... though I don't know if the less water volume will make the current stronger?


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## _jake_ (Jul 3, 2008)

Sticky!


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## Lee2211 (Jan 28, 2010)

Very helpful thank you Goldie!
Peas and Broccoli you say. Can these be boiled frozen peas and broccolie or does it have to be fresh?
Where can I get brine shrimp from and blood worm?
I heard that ^ brine shrimp, blood worm etc had to be frozen to stop bad bacteria and stuff entering the water?


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## cnella (Feb 24, 2010)

Alot of good fish shops sell small packets of live bloodworm, daphnia, artemia (brine shrimp) and often larger river shrimp. however it isn't adviseable to pour the water they come in straight into your tank just in case . pour it into a net to catch whatever it is your feeding your fish then introduce it that way.


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## cnella (Feb 24, 2010)

most good frozen food is gamma irradiated to kill diseases and microorganisms which can introduce disease into your tank. i'd definately advise buying gamma irradiated frozen food if your gonna by frozen stuff, especially stuff like tubifex worms and the like which live in feed in polluted regions.


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

yes frozen is fine, i use frozen peas and let them sit in a cup of boiling water fo 5 mins, then shell them and crush them up a bit before dropping them in. 

i use fresh broccoli but only because we dont eat frozen veg other than peas, i daresay that frozen broccoli will be fine if thawed out beforehand.

i tend to use live brineshrimp and live daphnia, i pour the contents out into a fine net and rinse quickly under the tap. then tip them into the tank.

i use frozen tubifex and bloodworm, mainly due to hubby being squeemish about the bloodworms and the parasite/disease issue with tubifex worms. i just drop a couple of worm-cubes still frozen into my tank, they love them.


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## Lee2211 (Jan 28, 2010)

Thanks 
I'm sure they'll enjoy it very much. I'll try some Brine Shrimps and Blood Worms and see how they get on.


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

bump up for someone looking for goldfish info


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

how do you go about having a post made into a sticky?


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## Lee2211 (Jan 28, 2010)

I don't know.
Ask the one of the mods very nicely if they can sticky it for you. 
This guide is very good so I can't see them saying no


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

how do you find the mods? ive not noticed any yet.


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## Lee2211 (Jan 28, 2010)

There's quite a few actually. I don't know how, sometimes they post on stuff. I'll find out who is and you can ask them


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## Lee2211 (Jan 28, 2010)

OK, when you are on the forum home (so you can see all the different sections, reptile, classified ect.) if you go down to the bottom of the page there's a list of all the people that are online, if a moderator is online then their name is in green when every one else's in blue.
Hope that helps. I don't know any of their names but you should find someone that way hopefuly. Either that or ask someone for some names of some mods


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

thanks everyone :2thumb:


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

thought id bump this up as theres at least 1 person asking if fancy goldfish can be housed in a bi-orb


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

brill thread, i didn't know i could feed my greedy goldies peas!


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

mine at the moment cant get enough sweetcorn, i pop the mushy center out of the shell straight into the tank and they love it. i just use unsweetened sweetcorn in a can, cheap and easy to use :2thumb:


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## miss_mystra (Jun 24, 2010)

goldie1212 said:


> mine at the moment cant get enough sweetcorn, i pop the mushy center out of the shell straight into the tank and they love it. i just use unsweetened sweetcorn in a can, cheap and easy to use :2thumb:



That's ace, gonna try it... my boyfriend loves tinned sweetcorn but opens a tin and wastes half of it so at least i can try and put some of that to good use!

I tried slices of orange once because I'd seen it in loads of goldfish tanks at various shops but mine weren't in the least bit interested...which is daft because my goldies tend to look like they might have your fingers off at dinner time!


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

mine are a bit hit and miss with orange, i slice the inner edge off if a segment, then turn it inside out so the small bits are all poking out and they pick them off one by one, ive not done it in ages though as my other half hates the smell of oranges lol. 

mine also like cooked prawns broken into small pieces, but i dont give this to them too often.


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

Found it again :2thumb: just a few pages to trawl through!


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## animalmad69 (Nov 2, 2010)

anyone know much about koi carp, all i know is the pond have to big and the same with the filters ( which im having problems with at the min)


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

sorry, not really into koi, they require far too larger set-ups for what i have. one day il have a pon dbig enough for them but for now il have to put up with my goldfish in my 6ft tank. good luck finding out about them though.


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## Slackey (Dec 8, 2009)

Excellent care sheet, and you are right it should be a sticky.

One thing I did notice and I may be wrong as it is a number of years since I have bred fancy goldfish. When it comes to sexing if the white dots were not visible on the operculum of the male I would rely on the thickness of the first ray of the pectoral fin. In the male the first ray is generally more pronounced and thicker than that in the female.


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## goldie1212 (Mar 5, 2010)

yes you can also sex via that, and also by venting too. i find it quite easy to sex even young fish now :2thumb:


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## Slackey (Dec 8, 2009)

Yes it is only reliable in larger fish. I also use the vent method to sex Discus.


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