# Hoard Animal Keeping



## TSKA Rory Matier (May 27, 2007)

Hi, 

Apparently hoard animal keeping is on the increase in the United Kingdom, what are your views on this please?

Do you think it is an issue?

Perhaps random, but l am writing an article on this subject and would like to see the views and opinions of keepers of exotics, be this reptile or mammal please.

How many animals is too many before it becomes a problem and as such husbandry is affected?

Cheers 

Rory


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## reptile_man_08 (Jan 14, 2008)

Well, all animals requirements are different.I don't know any statisitics on the matter so I cannot comment on the increase.
Some reptiles, such as royals, need their water changed only a couple of times a week and cleaned out once a week.
Other need daily misting sessions, daily water changes/cleaning, even more than daily feeding etc.
Large collections of the easier to keep reptiles such as leos and royals can be managed in a routine, however with large collections of reptiles needing more experience and attention I would imagine it would be extremely hard to maintain, especially if you had an a full time occupation as well.
Certain tricks such as light timers, auto misters etc would all come in handy I would imagine.
In short, with most cases where many uneducated people look at the number of reptiles people keep, and think that's way too many, I think is actually a result of miss-understanding...1 dog is much more upkeep than many a reptile (once again this does come back to the requirements of each reptile, though).
No doubt with the increase in reptile popularity this is happening more, but also neglect from those who are uneducated, and the common animal stores such as pets at home stocking them...


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## TSKA Rory Matier (May 27, 2007)

Hi Reptile_Man_08, 

Thanks for your input on this subject.

R


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## madaboutreptiles (Jun 5, 2007)

I guess it is a litlle esier to keep lots of reptiles more so than dogs or cats. It does get to the point where it becomes hard work even with reptiles.

We spend at least a couple hours a day and 1 full day a week on our reptiles

But I do have a few.......


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## Lizard Loft (Mar 1, 2008)

i have a fair sized collection, which does take a fair amount of my time to upkeep to a good standard, this is mainly due to the fact that my and collection is very vaired, consisting of 7 different species and most are trios or pairs so this means i have lots of babies of different species, so at some points i have over 70 reps to care for.

we also have 3 adults cats 3 kittens, a huge dalmation, a terrier cross, rabbit guinea pig, and a newt, so in away i guess i have a hoard of animals lol, 

but luckily im young so live at home and have a large family so a very lrge house, which means i only have to care for my reps, and everything else is shared between the family, 

i think people take on too much, and you have to knw your limits, otherwise the animals will suffer, and that is when having too many or even just one animal can become a problem


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## purpleskyes (Oct 15, 2007)

We have 44 animals but 99% are reptiles and they dont take up a huge amount of our time, the rabbit is the only thing that actually takes up time as he needs to be running around and having interaction time on a daily basis. 

I personally wouldnt have more than 2 dogs max as they can up alot of time they need feeding 3 times a day and then 2/3 walks per day. I dont feel I would have time for more than 2 but we arent planning on having any dogs until we get a mortgage.


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## sophs87 (Jan 25, 2009)

I think hoarding is when you find yourself lying about your animals and lying when obtaining the animals, you know its a problem deep down but dont want to admit it.
Also when the work load gets to much and again you refuse to admit it and get more animals, nothing good will come from this , its sad


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## annarism (Aug 9, 2007)

i have 12 pets in total plus a child to care for i must say we have a dog and 2 cats amongst that collection as well we share the responsibillity between us i think the moment a collaction becomes a hoard is when it is no longer maintained to a high a standard. the word hoard is to collect and hide or keep private all herp keepers i know arent private they are proud of their reps and like to show them off. i think sometimes the majority of hoarders are those armed with little or no knowledge and went to the pet store to get a "cool" pet and ended up with several these kinds of people are a product of the bad pet shops that want to make the sale


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## Rum_Kitty (Jun 14, 2009)

I think it depends on the individual situations to be honest. 40 snakes is a hell of a lot less work than say, 40 mammals including dogs, cats, rabbits, ferrets, skunks etc. Also, it depends on how much work you do and your individual situations...for example I only work part time and my ferrets have the run of my kitchen for most of the day, and I spend an hour with them morning and evening on the days when I am working. This frees up time for my partner and me to spend time with our birds, rats, suggies, hedgies and two reps. My sugar gliders and hedgehogs dont bother each other so they can get out at the same time. My other half is totally devoted to the 2 cockatiels and 5 ferrets so he spends a ton of time with them, which gives me a little more times for the rest of the beasties.

Once you have too many to keep clean, afford to care for (including emergency vet bills) and have time to handle and play with each day, thats when you are taking on more than you can handle. I've got experience of this because I went mad when I finally moved to a place that allowed pets, and for a while I was completely snowed under until I figured out ways to allow everyone the time and company they needed...the ferrets. bird and sugar gliders were a real challenge at first. Also, sometimes more of some types of animal is less work...if I had one ferret, one rat, one cockatiel, one sugar glider I'd be screwed because they would all need so much company, but because I keep the social animals in pairs or small groups they keep each other company a lot of the time. You also have to be careful not to keep predator/prey together...my ferrets live downstairs and the rest of the guys upstairs, but I do wonder how people cope when they have tonnes of pets that would naturally eat each other!

Its all about considering your budget, the time and space you have available. Its important not to judge someone for the amount they have until you know the ins and outs of their situation.


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## this-is-love (Aug 14, 2009)

we have ten here and the childeren do help with the little bits like changing the water for the dogs or helping holding (under supervision) and have done a great deal of help with the babies when they need socializing as i dont work i have the time to spend with them


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## LauraandLee (Nov 11, 2008)

I think as long as they have correct housing, feed, clean, played with and provide treatment when needed, and they are properly are looked after!!!! :2thumb:

Its programmes on TV that are real hoards when the house is full of :censor: animals running everywhere or sick, dying et!!!









Mine animals are in my sig -


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## Natrix (Dec 9, 2006)

TSKA Rory Matier said:


> Hi,
> 
> Apparently hoard animal keeping is on the increase in the United Kingdom, what are your views on this please?
> 
> ...


I think there is a big difference between some one that is working correctly with a large number of animals as part of a breeding project and the slightly nutty woman/man that wanders the streets collecting up stray cats to fill her two room council bungalow with. 
I also think there is a huge difference between some one with 20 neon tetras in a tank and some one with 20 dogs in a bed sit. 

I would say that the quantity that is needed to make a hoard varies depending on two simple factors. 
1)The animals involved and the space and time each individual requires. 
2) The amount of time and space the owner has to offer the species involved.

I also think we have to be very, very careful not to get pulled into the RSPCA hype on this one and like them start tarring sensible keepers and fruit cake eccentrics with the same brush. I saw one RSPCA inspector interviewed who suggested that any more than three animals of the same species should be considered hoarding. 

As for it being on the increase, If you give something a name (as the RSPCA have) then go looking for cases of it whilst constantly refining what the definition of a hoard is, you will quickly provide the statistics to prove it is on the increase even if it isn’t.

Natrix 
98% of all statistics are made up.
H Simpson
DOH!!!!


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## Rum_Kitty (Jun 14, 2009)

Natrix said:


> I also think we have to be very, very careful not to get pulled into the RSPCA hype on this one and like them start tarring sensible keepers and fruit cake eccentrics with the same brush. I saw one RSPCA inspector interviewed who suggested that any more than three animals of the same species should be considered hoarding.
> 
> !


What nonsense!!! If you ask me a bunch of single animals of different species is more likely to be hoarding. What about animals that naturally live in groups...load of rubbish! *wanders off muttering angrily*


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## stubeanz (Mar 28, 2007)

i think animal hoarding is when someone is at the point where the animals health and enviroment is compromised by the fact that they have sooo many they cannot physicaly get around them all to feed and clean them all.
when an animal isnt being kept correctly due to someone keeping too many then thats when it needs questioning wether they should have soo many.
there cannot be a number put on how many animals to keep as people have different lifestyles say someone that works from dawn till dusk and only has a few hrs a day to sort out their animals then they would be best to have a small amount of animals but someone that has many hrs a day to clean and look after animals could then possibly keep more, but oviously there are exceptions.
stu


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## midori (Aug 27, 2006)

I keep a fairly large amount of animals, I suppose. Currently 3 dogs, 2 cats, a hamster, 11 rats (plus feeders/babies) and five multi-mammates, plus 33 snakes, most of which are royals, but some corns. 

Am I a hoarder? I don't think so, because I appreciate the time and space all my animals need, and more importantly, when to stop.

There are lots of animals I would like, but don't have the time or space for, so I don't get them. I would say that a 'hoarder' would get them regardless and adjust how they are kept. That said, I think a lot of people who aren't hoarders do that aswell. 

I would just like to add that I am lucky enough not to have to work, which means have the time to spend on my animals. I wouldn't be able to take a job and give all my animals the time and attention they need.


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## mattm (Jul 18, 2008)

> How many animals is too many before it becomes a problem and as such husbandry is affected?


In my honest opinion, it is not about a number. It is about the amount of animals you can manage. Every single animal should receive the correct care, a good standard of welfare and if applicable, enough socialization (where not applicable perhaps monitoring) time from the owner(s) or handler(s). Where it comes a point that the animals start losing out because the "attention" is being devided between them - is when somebody becomes a hoarder. Of course this will be specific to the person and you can't impose a blanket rule, because that just won't work. People live in different sized houses, people have different work hours, and people have different mentalities to name just a view variables. lol.


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