# calci worms staple?



## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

ok every where ive read on them calci worms are ok as a staple for bearded dragons. ive been reading all day , all saying yes there a fine staple because of the calcium then........

just 1 write up saying there a no for staple,its like 99% yes 1 no but that 1 is enough to cast a little tiny dout.


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## Rthompson (Feb 19, 2011)

Calcium worms as you state are naturally high in calcium, however I believe (Don't quote me on this) they are also quite high in fat, should someone confirm this.. then no they would not be a suitable staple diet.

Regardless of that I wouldn't anyway, beardies need a variation but by all means do feed them the Calci worms, other feeder insects you don't have to suppliment are Dubia Roaches which have a far better Meat to Chitin ratio and supply a decent level of what your dragon needs. Plus they love them!


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Rthompson said:


> Calcium worms as you state are naturally high in calcium, however I believe (Don't quote me on this) they are also quite high in fat, should someone confirm this.. then no they would not be a suitable staple diet.
> 
> Regardless of that I wouldn't anyway, beardies need a variation but by all means do feed them the Calci worms, other feeder insects you don't have to suppliment are Dubia Roaches which have a far better Meat to Chitin ratio and supply a decent level of what your dragon needs. Plus they love them!


you know what the problem with roaches are, they are way way extreamly expensive for what they are costing about twice as much as other insects, for a adult the budget might balance out since adults eat 70 veg and sometimes feed every other day, but....baby beardies who eat mostly insects like at least up to 1 year old are gonna eat insects like candy and the roaches at like maybe a 25 pack costing about £7 for medium, hes prolly going to eat those in a day and about £50 is not something i could aford, at least if it was adult it might only eat 2 boxes with its prodominate veg in a week is alot easier.

i tell ya, its gets me expreally confused, because some have likened calci worms to phonix worms and there fore fine as a staple, theres only 1 ive found that says there not


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Rthompson said:


> Calcium worms as you state are naturally high in calcium, however I believe (Don't quote me on this) they are also quite high in fat, should someone confirm this.. then no they would not be a suitable staple diet.
> 
> Regardless of that I wouldn't anyway, beardies need a variation but by all means do feed them the Calci worms, other feeder insects you don't have to suppliment are Dubia Roaches which have a far better Meat to Chitin ratio and supply a decent level of what your dragon needs. Plus they love them!


heres a example of some of the things that ive read about calci worms

Bearded Dragon . org • View topic - Calci Worms???...
this link reads
*Re: Calci Worms???...*

by *catUK* » Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:13 am 
They're excellent worms. They are full of calcium so don't need dusted and have low fat content. Feed as many as she can eat daily- they can be used as a staple but when i used them i still fed the crickets too. I used to put mine in a small glass jar, about 1 inch high so they couldn't escape and she could pick at them through the day. The calci worms are very soft and ok to feed small beardies as they are small (the large ones are only about 1.5cm). Hope this helps


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## angelgirls29 (Jul 10, 2010)

The main problem I have with calci-worms is the smell of their substrate!!!!
One good thing, as you've probably read, is that they move more so non-worm eaters can still find them and will recognise them as food (after a while anyway :lol2: )

Don't know how much this helps :blush:


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## Rthompson (Feb 19, 2011)

Chrisuk33 said:


> you know what the problem with roaches are, they are way way extreamly expensive for what they are costing about twice as much as other insects, for a adult the budget might balance out since adults eat 70 veg and sometimes feed every other day, but....baby beardies who eat mostly insects like at least up to 1 year old are gonna eat insects like candy and the roaches at like maybe a 25 pack costing about £7 for medium, hes prolly going to eat those in a day and about £50 is not something i could aford, at least if it was adult it might only eat 2 boxes with its prodominate veg in a week is alot easier.
> 
> i tell ya, its gets me expreally confused, because some have likened calci worms to phonix worms and there fore fine as a staple, theres only 1 ive found that says there not


Calci Worms Are Phoenix Worms 
Ahh see, I manage to get Dubia's at £2.20 a tub, so isn't really more expensive than other feeders personally, I didn't realise they commercially cost so much more!



@ChrisUK33 - I see, I was mistaken by the fat content, if they are as low in fat as stated there, then they will provide a decent staple diet.


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

angelgirls29 said:


> The main problem I have with calci-worms is the smell of their substrate!!!!
> One good thing, as you've probably read, is that they move more so non-worm eaters can still find them and will recognise them as food (after a while anyway :lol2: )
> 
> Don't know how much this helps :blush:


it says on the description of ebay sellers that the caci worms dont smell unlike crickets.

but ether way if they smel it aint going to be a problem


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## KurtH (Sep 24, 2010)

I purchased some Calci Worms and binned them....

People go on and on and on and on about impaction....

These things were covered in soil.....

Can't be good.....


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

KurtH said:


> I purchased some Calci Worms and binned them....
> 
> People go on and on and on and on about impaction....
> 
> ...


well maybe you got a bad batch?

if the worm had a bit of soil on it id give ia little clean before i feed it to him.

all the reports point to them being good, ive just ordered a batch so ill let you know, because from what ive been reading on a whole,"usually they dont cause impaction, they have good calcium in them, they are low fat and they dont have a hard shell like meal worms


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## jools (Apr 4, 2009)

Calci worms are fine - but they are tiny and many would be needed for a beardie. They have a high calcium content but they can't easily be gut loaded with other goodies. Variety is best. Dubia roaches are great but, yes, expensive if you are buying in. A colony, correctly set up, will after a few months provide all the feeders you need - often plus some you can sell on - but this does take time - they are not fast breeders / growers.


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

jools said:


> Calci worms are fine - but they are tiny and many would be needed for a beardie. They have a high calcium content but they can't easily be gut loaded with other goodies. Variety is best. Dubia roaches are great but, yes, expensive if you are buying in. A colony, correctly set up, will after a few months provide all the feeders you need - often plus some you can sell on - but this does take time - they are not fast breeders / growers.


yeah i think these dubia rouaches are not a viable option, i think all the talk among breeders of these rouches is what has put the price up, i mean, rouaches have vitamin and stuff but there not the most nutritious in the lot, from what ive read there like 3rd next to locust and black cricket so why people go on about them i dont know, i certainly dont think there worth like £6 for 30 roach tub.

roaches as i said in my opinion serve one age of beardied dragon thats the adults because they might eat every other day and when they do its 70% veg cos mass amount of insects at adult ive read can cause damage to him, where as a baby or juvanile would eat them like candy a 30 tub in a day would be nothing, my 4 month old beardie the other week ate about 50 locust in 2 days (size 3 and one size 4).

also what also i notice generally berdies have there own personality and characteristics, if the young berdie is being fussy for example one day i dont think theres anything wrong in feeding him the treat feeds like butterworm and then back to the staple the day after.

if it works out for me, my beardies staples before adult will be locust,cricket,calci worm,veg and any mixture of the treat feeds


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## yellrat (Jun 13, 2008)

tried calci worms with Leos recently going to give them another go in a couple of weeks they really didn't seem interested first time round they didn't seem to move much at all may have got a bad batch is why I'm gonna try them again soon.


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

yellrat said:


> tried calci worms with Leos recently going to give them another go in a couple of weeks they really didn't seem interested first time round they didn't seem to move much at all may have got a bad batch is why I'm gonna try them again soon.


im beginning to see the problem with calci worms, its not the calci wormss them selfs its that there so dam hard to get a hold of online.

3 shops online have let me down so far, i ordered some last night, this morning they call me up and tell me thre out of stock untill late next week
so the big problem is, fining a steady supplyer, and no in not going to breed my own


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

I think you will find calci worms are a little on the small side for a beardie, even the largest size is very small. Roaches are very good but yes a little pricey to buy commercially. However if you buy a tub of roaches, a plastic tub and an old heatmat you can after a few months have a constant supply of them (plus more) for next to nothing. They are far less smelly than crickets if kept properly and other than feeding them, they need very little in the way of maintenance. From that initial tub you can produce the same amount of roaches in it a hundred times over so they *are* very good value. From a commercial point of view the people selling the roaches know that for the majority of customers these are used for starting colonies. It means that the suppliers only have a limited opportunity for future sales so they need to cover their costs in the initial sales.


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Mal said:


> I think you will find calci worms are a little on the small side for a beardie, even the largest size is very small. Roaches are very good but yes a little pricey to buy commercially. However if you buy a tub of roaches, a plastic tub and an old heatmat you can after a few months have a constant supply of them (plus more) for next to nothing. They are far less smelly than crickets if kept properly and other than feeding them, they need very little in the way of maintenance. From that initial tub you can produce the same amount of roaches in it a hundred times over so they *are* very good value. From a commercial point of view the people selling the roaches know that for the majority of customers these are used for starting colonies. It means that the suppliers only have a limited opportunity for future sales so they need to cover their costs in the initial sales.


roaches not just a little pricey there way over the top pricey, 25 tub or a 30 tub of mediums£7 and like i said juvaniles would go though em like candy, now thats all well and good but £7 every day is like £50 a week that rediculous to me, there like the caviare of the lizard food world

there is no way i want to breed them, i just want a financially viable steady supply and crickets, mayve locust seems to be the only 2 at the moment


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

i hear eathworms are ok as a staple but.... i dont think so for a beardie under 12 months cos the worms are like 7cm long.


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Chrisuk33 said:


> roaches not just a little pricey there way over the top pricey, 25 tub or a 30 tub of mediums£7 and like i said juvaniles would go though em like candy, now thats all well and good but £7 every day is like £50 a week that rediculous to me, there like the caviare of the lizard food world
> 
> there is no way i want to breed them, i just want a financially viable steady supply and crickets, mayve locust seems to be the only 2 at the moment


Ive never seen them as pricey as that. Are you sure thats not for a starter colony. Give Ricks Livefoods a try.


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## mooshu (Mar 24, 2010)

To fill a beardie your going to need a lot of cali-worms! they are tiny! If you dont wanto to breed then silkwormstore.co.uk do supply silkworms as and when you need them, You can setup a constant order with them and they are an awesome staple! they contain a enzyme that help calcium absorption :2thumb:
I building up a colony of dubia roaches for my staple though, After the initial cost you have a consant supply of feeders on any size FOR FREE!!!!!!!
Then I get a few treats like locust and different types of worms. Roaches are definitely the cheapest in the long run!


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Mal said:


> Ive never seen them as pricey as that. Are you sure thats not for a starter colony. Give Ricks Livefoods a try.


ricks live food is one of the most expensive, the point being missed is, a 30 tub of roaches at 5 or £7 is stupid money especially when a young one will eat them all in one day.

Medium Dubia Roaches 10mm - 15mm Pack of 30
£6.20 before postage for only 30 medium at about 1cm long

http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/food-classifieds/659096-dubia-roaches-sale.html
£15 for 100 medium so thats like 3 normal size tubs

100 DUBIA ROACHES -Small,Medium,Large,Adult on eBay (end time 04-May-11 04:36:04 BST)
100 medium £14.99

i tell you its getting frustrating trying to fine one decent place


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

mooshu said:


> To fill a beardie your going to need a lot of cali-worms! they are tiny! If you dont wanto to breed then silkwormstore.co.uk do supply silkworms as and when you need them, You can setup a constant order with them and they are an awesome staple! they contain a enzyme that help calcium absorption :2thumb:
> I building up a colony of dubia roaches for my staple though, After the initial cost you have a consant supply of feeders on any size FOR FREE!!!!!!!
> Then I get a few treats like locust and different types of worms. Roaches are definitely the cheapest in the long run!


if you have the time to breed them or want to which i dont


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Silkworms - *
medium tub of 20??? id be suprised if it didnt eat them in 1 day or half a day, these silk worms in money are almost as bad as roaches.

so far staple food im stuch with crickets and locusts


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## Nigel_wales (Mar 24, 2009)

Silkworms are probaly the best feeder to give to your Beardie.


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## mooshu (Mar 24, 2010)

Oh well each to their own!
Im going to stick to breeding roaches! Its really easy (Rub, lid with mesh, egg crates and food) Plus I hate crickets! They always escape and they make that stupid noise! One got behind my fridge 2 months ago and its still making that damn noise! :lol2:


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## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Chrisuk33 said:


> if you have the time to breed them or want to which i dont


Eh, it doesn't actually take that much time to breed 'em - we have three species of roaches and they don't take a lot of maintaining at all. It's not like you've got to individually wine and dine every single one of 'em 



Chrisuk33 said:


> so far staple food im stuch with crickets and locusts


If you don't want to breed your own feeders and you want a regular cheap supply, yes.


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Unfortunately moaning on here wont get prices lowered. Sadly people sometimes dont realise how expensive it can be to feed a beardie a good quality diet.


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## greyslady (Feb 7, 2011)

mooshu said:


> Oh well each to their own!
> Im going to stick to breeding roaches! Its really easy (Rub, lid with mesh, egg crates and food) Plus I hate crickets! They always escape and they make that stupid noise! One got behind my fridge 2 months ago and its still making that damn noise! :lol2:



I agree...nothing more annoying than a chirping cricket! My roach colony was expensive to set up but totally worth the money! Now I have more than enough to feed 4 reptiles on and extras to sell to my friends. Havent spent a penny on crickets for over a year...just a couple of quid a month for some morios and wax worms for treats. The saving meant I could afford a chameleon


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

Mal said:


> Unfortunately moaning on here wont get prices lowered. Sadly people sometimes dont realise how expensive it can be to feed a beardie a good quality diet.


i didnt realsie discussing a situation suddenley becomes moaning.

right i guess i wont talk about it futher in this thread of forum


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## Mal (Jul 22, 2007)

Ssthisto said:


> Eh, it doesn't actually take that much time to breed 'em - we have three species of roaches and they don't takeu a lot of maintaining at all. It's not like you've got to individually wine and dine every single one of 'em
> 
> 
> If you don't want to breed your own feeders and you want a regular cheap supply, yes.


Would that be a table for a thousand and do you require the gypsy violinist?


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## KurtH (Sep 24, 2010)

I purchased some online for my Yemen and they were that tiny,I gave them to my Pygmy Chameleons......I dare say, 1 fart and the lizard would be hungry again :lol2:


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## Chrisuk33 (Oct 10, 2010)

KurtH said:


> I purchased some online for my Yemen and they were that tiny,I gave them to my Pygmy Chameleons......I dare say, 1 fart and the lizard would be hungry again :lol2:


usually expesive foods would be ok when its adult cos they dont eat even half the mount of insects they do before 1 year old.


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