# Giving goldfish away as prizes STILL not banned...



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

In the UK, the Animal Welfare Act was revised in April 07. In it, it says:

The pet owner must:
1. provide a suitable environment (place to live) 
2. provide a suitable diet 
3. allow the animal to exhibit normal behaviour patterns 
4. make sure its housed with, or apart from, other animals (if applicable) 
5. make sure its protected from pain, injury, suffering and disease 

Giving away fish in bags at fairs, as prizes, will almost certainly break all of these, no?

The law also increases to 16 the minimum age at which a person can buy an animal and prohibits giving animals as prizes to unaccompanied children under this age. 

But its rubbish... it doesn't _actually_ stop them giving them away as prizes. I signed a petition online, and just got this email back, saying:



> We reconsidered the proposal for a total ban in light of the Government's better regulation agenda. Our conclusion was that the possible welfare benefits of a total ban were minimal and did not justify ending the great pleasure felt by children and their families when they win a pet as a prize. Finally the provision on pets as prizes in the Act is in line with the provision that raises from 12 to 16 the age at which children can buy a pet.


WHAT RUBBISH!! Arrghh :censor: Gets me mad it does. 

Anywho, anger vented, ta.


----------



## Gecko_Sean (Aug 15, 2007)

What bastards, im glad i havnt ever seen them as prizes or i would have to say something. I also hate that they are only like 99p each from the shop


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

Well, thats to do with them breeding so easily I guess... seems fair enough the price does. but yes, ba:censor:rds.


----------



## Salamanda (May 28, 2008)

every year there is a summer fair in one of the local primary schools and they always give away fish. You see little children carrying fish around in bags for hours the heat Its disgusting.


----------



## Lofty85 (Jun 16, 2008)

When we have a fair come to us they always have fish that you can win, but if you win you have to purchase a tank and food for £5 its so tiny though it disgusting and another way to make money out of people.


----------



## bullet tooth t0ny (Apr 24, 2008)

AshMashMash said:


> In the UK, the Animal Welfare Act was revised in April 07. In it, it says:
> 
> The pet owner must:
> 1. provide a suitable environment (place to live)
> ...


its a shame that this still goes on,when you talk to people away from the hobby you will see that people have very little understanding about fish.you get remarks like ''well its only a fish'' and that remark justs :censor: me off.when you do sit down with someone and give them a bit of understanding they say ''well i didnt know that about a fish''.

i have to be honest when i was young my first fish was from a fair ground,but i dont agree with this now and have far more understanding on the needs of a fish.: victory:


----------



## luke123 (Apr 13, 2008)

hmm, last year, i was at a carnival, and i won a gold fish, i was with my friends of the same age as me, (11 at the time) and there was no adults with us, so was this breaking the law?? and they are never in good condition anyway the ones you win, they are full of diseases.


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

People treat goldfish like :censor:.. I was in a nice fish tropics shop last year and I saw a boy and his parents looking in on the fish and the boy came out with, ' I don't want a Goldfish they last for a bloody week! ' And then his parents took him over to the salt water fish!! Many people think that fish are low maitenance and a good beginners animal, but they aren't with the correct care they can live longer than a dog! It should really be banned for them to be prizes.. 

Curty.


----------



## cooltom28 (Mar 9, 2006)

24p each trade :whistling2:

from singapore!


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

bullet tooth t0ny said:


> ''well its only a fish''


Yes, thats what p*sses me off most as well! :censor: Tbh, its the only reason there are so many laws about animals that dont apply to fish... becuase of the "its only a fish thing", when it has been PROVEN they do feel pain and suffer (no sh*t sherlock)... *sigh*, gets me wound up it does.


----------



## weelad (Jul 25, 2006)

i won like 6 when i was a kid they lived about 5 years


----------



## cooltom28 (Mar 9, 2006)

i was impressed last time i went to the fayre they had oxygenators in the water didnt keep them bagged up and handed out care sheets


----------



## Snakes r grreat (Aug 21, 2006)

cooltom28 said:


> 24p each trade :whistling2:
> 
> from singapore!


Thats expensive for singapore.


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

cooltom28 said:


> i was impressed last time i went to the fayre they had oxygenators in the water didnt keep them bagged up and handed out care sheets


Really?! Well, the other poster on the first page said that some gave away tanks too for £5. Thats at least a start... still dont think it would happen with puppies though :whistling2:


----------



## Pliskens_Chains (Jun 8, 2008)

it really is a disgusting trade, another example of giving people "fun" at a living creatures expense


----------



## cooltom28 (Mar 9, 2006)

24p is via a uk stock holder, but 24p its nothing really, 


its a crappy goldfish bowl thats ok? thats what they sell you for £5!


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

cooltom28 said:


> its a crappy goldfish bowl thats ok? thats what they sell you for £5!


Alright, alright... . No, didn't know it was that, I thought the post said "tank"... no, thats not ok.


----------



## JamesJ (Apr 12, 2008)

Its unfair on the fish! They also do this in america/canada they often have betta fish (siamese fighting fish) as prizes, people want them because they are pretty.


----------



## Snakes r grreat (Aug 21, 2006)

cooltom28 said:


> 24p is via a uk stock holder, but 24p its nothing really


I used to buy my small goldfish from a UK farm for less than that, i must have been getting a good deal. :2thumb:


----------



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

24p from a uk stock holder is still expensive. Though a lot of the uk wholesalers just buy in from the far east anyway.

I don't understand why shops don't go direct. cut out the middle man. Yes you pay more for shipping. But so much less for the fish. It works out cheaper overall if you do a sensible order (not 5 goldfish, but a fair few fish). I know its not possible for a lot of shops, but any half decent shop should do it really.


----------



## cooltom28 (Mar 9, 2006)

because half the people havent got the nuts to do it:blush: my local marine one does with the corals think its like egyt with reptiles and the close seasons, (i have a large shipment due about 1800 heads)

same in all trades i suppose snakes from the usa etc

birds i import direct from portugal about 300/400 time everyone else goes to holland to buy the same birds, i can sell for £95pr they are selling above £120 and i do deals by 10pairs


----------



## Jake89 (May 30, 2007)

It was banned for a short while but was lifted, please let me know if im wrong.
Jake : victory:


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

Jake89 said:


> It was banned for a short while but was lifted, please let me know if im wrong.
> Jake : victory:


What I thought had happened was that it wasn't banned. Then, in the Animal Act in April 07, they were deciding whether to ban it. They decided not too. And so it never has been illegal. 

Then, I (and others) did an online petition to try and ban it, and it was not put through. 

So as far as I know, its never been illegal.


----------



## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

i once refused to sell a women goldfish and a tank on the same day as thats company rules to say she wasnt happy was an understatment she caught my boss on way out and he backed me up she then went on to tell garden centre people i was scary lol turnt out she was a tv host but i didnt care the welfare of the fish should come firsti dont think we are ever going to stop fairs giving them as prizes but its worth a go


----------



## fatratsandcheesekk (May 18, 2008)

with winning a fish at a fair where is it going to live when they get it home if it survives the heat of the day and however long its been in the bag


----------



## Jadeypop (Apr 4, 2008)

my pet goldfish are about 4, so that proves that they dont 'live for a week'!


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

Jadeypop said:


> my pet goldfish are about 4, so that proves that they dont 'live for a week'!


Please read my post again before making assumptions.

Curty.


----------



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

Jadeypop said:


> my pet goldfish are about 4, so that proves that they dont 'live for a week'!


4 is nothing for a goldfish. Tank goldfish average at around 5-6 because they are kept in very small tanks. Goldfish can hit 18" so a 6 footer is a very bare minimum size tank for ONE. Well that's my opinion anyway.

But pond goldfish can live well into their 20's if not 30's. The record is 43


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

B&WTegu&Beardies said:


> People treat goldfish like :censor:.. *I was in a nice fish tropics shop last year and I saw a boy and his parents looking in on the fish and the boy came out with, ' I don't want a Goldfish they last for a bloody week! '* And then his parents took him over to the salt water fish!! *Many people think that fish are low maitenance and a good beginners animal, but they aren't with the correct care they can live longer than a dog!* It should really be banned for them to be prizes..
> 
> Curty.


Jade please read my post again and pay attention to the bold, underlined writting.

Curty.


----------



## klair328 (Nov 15, 2006)

i see where your comming from... BUT if yous are going to go on about cruelty to fish.. what about fishing.. or bait nets or polution in the sea... when u catch a fish u either smack it on the head with a priest or throw it back with a lump of its mouth missing after you rip the hook out..blood of fish attracts predators.. fish gets eaten anyway..
im gonna go away from agreeing with you just to be diffent.. yes its kinda cruel to give them away at carvnivals BUT the ones ive seen get kept in tanks behind the stall in the shade and only go in bags when you win.
I dont see the diffrence from carryin the fish around in teh bag for a little while.. and if you have lizards or garter snakes im sure you will know where this is going... and puting the goldfish into a well i used a deep cat littertray for my lizards to keep the fish in n they cud dive for them.. and they adored it... eating the fish was good but catching them was the best part for them.. my beardies, monitors, even my baby iguana loved it.. yes argue with me all yous like on this one... im just saying.. AND for those tht keep oscars or any kinda of canabalistic fish then yous will more than likely be feeding it the odd goldfish..
i Loved gettin fish from the shows.. still actually got 2 tht i got almost 8 years ago.. HUGE now lol.. i forget my point... but i sure you can work it out


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

klair328 said:


> i see where your comming from... BUT if yous are going to go on about cruelty to fish.. what about fishing.. or bait nets or polution in the sea... when u catch a fish u either smack it on the head with a priest or throw it back with a lump of its mouth missing after you rip the hook out..blood of fish attracts predators.. fish gets eaten anyway..
> im gonna go away from agreeing with you just to be diffent.. yes its kinda cruel to give them away at carvnivals BUT the ones ive seen get kept in tanks behind the stall in the shade and only go in bags when you win.
> I dont see the diffrence from carryin the fish around in teh bag for a little while.. and if you have lizards or garter snakes im sure you will know where this is going... and puting the goldfish into a well i used a deep cat littertray for my lizards to keep the fish in n they cud dive for them.. and they adored it... eating the fish was good but catching them was the best part for them.. my beardies, monitors, even my baby iguana loved it.. yes argue with me all yous like on this one... im just saying.. AND for those tht keep oscars or any kinda of canabalistic fish then yous will more than likely be feeding it the odd goldfish..
> i Loved gettin fish from the shows.. still actually got 2 tht i got almost 8 years ago.. HUGE now lol.. i forget my point... but i sure you can work it out


I know where you are coming from but when some people win them they don't have a clue about their care or requirements etc. I know a lot people who feed their large lizards or snakes goldfish (I have a tegu so I know about rodents etc) buts that just natural and winning a goldfish isn't. I know* 'some' *people will win them and set up a perfect enclosure and care for them well but the majority wont.

By the way I think fishing is wrong unless it is done sustainably.

Curty.


----------



## klair328 (Nov 15, 2006)

lol dead chuffed i dont sound like a bumpty n u see where i was comming from
9 times out of ten up here... the only stalls tht sell the fish are the ones where u hook a duck.. AND i have seen for myself children under the age of 12 need to have an adult with them.. my nephew ran up to hook a duck once, i was watching from just beside him but wasnt really taking him on he was only 5 at the time n wanted a goldfish as a prize and the guy wouldnt give him it until i told him i was his guardian... he ended up getting a toy of sum sort,.. farting putty or something that time...


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

The ones that you have experienced or observed in the past seem nice, the last time I seen one was at May day a couple of years ago, they were in bags left exposed to the sun and if someone won he lifted the bag quite violently and gave it to the winner.

Curty.


----------



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

klair328 said:


> i see where your comming from... BUT if yous are going to go on about cruelty to fish.. what about fishing.. or bait nets or polution in the sea... when u catch a fish u either smack it on the head with a priest or throw it back with a lump of its mouth missing after you rip the hook out..blood of fish attracts predators.. fish gets eaten anyway..
> im gonna go away from agreeing with you just to be diffent.. yes its kinda cruel to give them away at carvnivals BUT the ones ive seen get kept in tanks behind the stall in the shade and only go in bags when you win.
> I dont see the diffrence from carryin the fish around in teh bag for a little while.. and if you have lizards or garter snakes im sure you will know where this is going... and puting the goldfish into a well i used a deep cat littertray for my lizards to keep the fish in n they cud dive for them.. and they adored it... eating the fish was good but catching them was the best part for them.. my beardies, monitors, even my baby iguana loved it.. yes argue with me all yous like on this one... im just saying.. AND for those tht keep oscars or any kinda of canabalistic fish then yous will more than likely be feeding it the odd goldfish..
> i Loved gettin fish from the shows.. still actually got 2 tht i got almost 8 years ago.. HUGE now lol.. i forget my point... but i sure you can work it out


Just to clarify. Feeding a goldfish to an oscar is not cannabalism as they are different species.

But anyway, I keep many large and predatory fish and yes I do feed other fish to them. Not live where possible but many wild caught fish will not eat prekilled or prepared foods. As many snake owners will know this is not through choice but purely to keep the animal alive.

As to say it is more than likely to feed live food. No it isn't. Any responsible owner knows that feeding live fish can be very risky. All fish carry pathogens that can cause disease. Stress causes a poor imune system response, therefore raising the risk of disease. Live fish that are stressed either because they remain in the tank without being eaten and scared by the big predator. This can cause a disease and then obviously you risk the disease passing to your prize predator. Also many commonly used live feeder fish are mass bred in the far east, often being shipped in large numbers in small bags. Therefor being at bigger exposure to stress.

Only complete idiots will feed live fish for the hell of it. They are either unaware of the risk or don't care. You can't argue that it's natural. Because if you were so concerned about keeping it natural for your fish you wouldn't have them. Tank life ain't natural. A decent predatory fish keeper will put the time into transferring any fish onto prekilled or prepared foods (pellet, flake etc).

I'm not saying that feeding live is wrong. I know it can be a neccessity but with a bit of work any fish can be brought round to feed on dead stuff.

Anyway, live fish feeding has nothing to do with fish at the fair. Very few prize fish are kept correctly. I know of a few people who just put them into the sink for a while. It's appalling.

Yes you may have been to a fair where they sell tanks as well or keep aerators in the holding tanks. That's still not acceptable.

Im not getting into any argument at all. Fish at fairs are wrong. Always have been and most likely always will be. Fish keeping is not easy. Yes it's not hard either but if you do it wrong you will kill fish. Lots of people say, it's only a fish, but how is that right? Oh ok it cost you 60p from the petshop but it's still a life


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

I don't feed live it's too risky when I was posting I was talking about feeding pre-killed... (Rodents)

Curty.


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

Oops, sorry I thought you quoted my post, I apologize for my assumption.

Curty.


----------



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

No worries mate lol

But yeah you see where I'm coming from though? Live feeding isn't worth the risk. If your animal will feed on prekilled why feed live? Any risk isn't worth it if it's not needed.

Like I play cricket and I wear a helmet. I don't have to. But I do because I quite like my teeth in my mouth. I could risk it, but why it's no extra hassle. stupid example but i think it shows my point.

Owners feeding live food to animals that don't have to be fed live food are irresponsible. Fair enough if the live food poses no risk, but basically anything a live could pose some risk however small to another living thing.


----------



## B&WTegu&Beardies (Mar 28, 2008)

Yeah I know what you mean, I read something on the internet before about the troubles of live-feeding I just need to find it :blush:

Curty.


----------



## AshMashMash (Oct 28, 2007)

Oooh! Big posts  Too long for me to read right now though  lol


----------



## Dexter (Jun 24, 2005)

My wife and son just came back from a fun fair and they were given a goldfish, a small aquarium and food.

I was a bit shocked when they got home carrying the plastic bag with the fish in, but now they convinced me they wanna keep the fish, and it's already placed in my son's room shelf :roll:

Questions:

1) Do I need to buy a air pump, or will it survive in that bowl provided we change the water regularly ?
2) If it's fine like that, how often should I change the water ?
3) Should I worry about temps, or the fish will be fine at room temperature ?

Sorry, I never had a fish before, and would never buy one, hence the stupid questions.

I almost felt like taking it straight to Pets at home and give to them since they've got hundreds there, but I'd get beaten up my son and wife who calling the fish Goldy Lox :roll:


----------



## mike515 (Sep 12, 2006)

room temp will be fine. You NEED a filter.

Don't listen to people who say, oh water changes will be fine er no it won't. How would you like to live in your own piss and occasionally have some taken out with water thrown in after.

But yeah 10% water change every week and a decent filter and you'll be doing better than most people with goldfish


----------



## Dexter (Jun 24, 2005)

Cheers Mike, they will be going to the shop tomorrow to buy the filter and some decor for the tank : victory:


----------



## blue-saphire (Oct 22, 2007)

tbh, i havnt seen any stalls giving away goldfish as prizes since i was a kid. i thought it had been banned


----------



## Stoke Lad (Jan 26, 2007)

I havent seen them for sale for the last 5+ years,

But i hope they do get baned


----------



## Grumpymouth (Jun 28, 2007)

I was at an urban carnival-type last summer organised by a development company (which more or less staged the event to 'compensate' for the community neighbourhood they had just razed in north Manchester) and they had some tea-cup rides, little stalls, a Mr Scruff tea shack (very cool) and the obligatory goldfish-prize stall. What made me really upset about it wasn't that small children were playing to win the fish, but grown up 'trendies' from the nearby northern quarter were doing it too! These are probably the same people who say, 'I'm vegetarian - I only eat fish'. Grrr!! These people really chap my ass! 

This is however where I got my Lieutenent Shinysides. I felt so bad for those fish in the bags, I wanted to bring one home. A year on, he's doubled in size and needs a bigger tank! He's a beautiful fish. I abhor these goldfish stalls, but what is even worse was those games I remember when I was a kid (this was the mid-eighties) where they let a rat loose on a coloured wheel and people bet on which hole he'd climb into. I was too little to understand the poor creature's distress, but looking back, that was one of the cruellest things I've ever witnessed


----------



## Metal_face (Oct 2, 2008)

as kurt cobain said “It's okay to eat fish because they don't have any feelings.” so surely it doesnt matter :whistling2: and kurt cobain being the demi god that he is/was it must be true :2thumb:


----------



## Pinkytoes (Jun 25, 2009)

fish given as prizes are like "buying on impulse" with no thought on what to do with it once you get it home.

My son came home last year with a fish he won at a fair, 1stly i was outraged that this still went on and the poor fish was gaping at the top of the bag gasping for oxygen and 2ndly we had no where to house it.

But being a responsible pet owner and animal lover i went out and bought a little tank with pump and filter etc, for it to die 2 days later.
What happens if these "prizes" are won by the child of Mrs Who Givesadamn?
There should be stricter rules for live animals being "won" like this


----------



## Joe1507 (Aug 11, 2008)

well its only a fish :whistling2:


----------



## mariekni (Apr 8, 2009)

i think goldfish as a prize is absolutely evil. at the end of the day its still a living creature and if it was puppys or kittens things would be different and animal rights would jump in straight away why is it not the same for fish? do they not deserve a better life than this too? it makes my blood boil!!:devil:


----------



## Spider Call (Mar 23, 2007)

I have never actually come across gold fish as prizes, and weirdly I have always wanted to so i could take some of them home and give them a pond life 
I heard of a fair that had them, but my friends literally dragged me past it 

However I bought two now and they are happily growing away and being all fishy in the pond C:


----------



## Lego (Jun 22, 2009)

My daughter and I were at a fair this evening and guess what... Hook a Duck and you can win a goldfish :whip: :bash: :devil:

Half of me was tempted to win one so I could save it but at the same time I knew that by taking one home I was only fueling the whole goldfish as prizes thing 

Admittedly there were significantly less there as prizes compared to previous years but it was still horrible to see


----------



## Colosseum (Aug 8, 2008)

I worked on a travelling Fair for a long while and these Goldfish were very popular with the kids, this is why they use them as prizes as they prove ever popular, also the fish are tanked up properly if they dont go.


----------

