# Hi all, I'm a newbie



## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

*Newbie (Californian Kings) Please advise*

Hi everyone,

I'm new to this forum and I'm also a first time snake owner. 
I bought a Californian King on Saturday (2 days ago) after tones of research. 

It's a male baby and I've named him Charmer. He's black and white just like my Staffordshire bull terrier.

I have a few questions. I was hoping someone here can answers them for me: (Are these normal)

1 - I read that baby Cali's are know to be nippy when young. My one on the other hand is too calm. (When I put my hand in the cage he comfortable come to me).

2 - He moves around in my hand's then all of a sudden he stops and he becomes absolutely still. I keep thinking he's going to pounce.

3 - I fed him today at 1.50pm (in a separate container) and he was fine when I picked him up to put him back in his cage, but when I tried to pick him up later he was being aggressive (not striking but shaking the tip of his tail violently). 

4 - He has a cool and a warm hide. Since I put him back after feeding he was alternating between the cool and warm hide and eventually I nearly had a heart attack when he wasn't in either of the hide. I found him 10min later under the aspen shaving. 

5 - Now at present it's nearly 10pm (8 hours since his feed) and he's all over the cage. It's odd because he's never been this active.( Since the past three days) and he keeps climbing to the top of the cage to the door of the cage, and falls off.

Please tell me there is nothing to be freaked out about. He's doing everything opposite to what I have read.:werd: (I'm sorry if I have freaked new snake owners).


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## Dexter612 (Apr 2, 2009)

Babies are often nippy but that's true for most species, not just kings. I got lucky with my corn, no biting, rattling or striking. Rattled once because of my mum, was teaching her to feed him before I went to America for 3 weeks and she was ignoring my advice and she pissed him off with her ignorance, being wreckless.
You should not handle it for 24-48 hours after feeding though, there is a chance that you will make it regurgitate in attempt to make its self more mobile to escape.

You should also have left it for a good week or so, only feeding it, and give it time to settle in.


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

tbase said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I'm new to this forum and I'm also a first time snake owner.
> I bought a Californian King on Saturday (2 days ago) after tones of research.
> ...


what are the temps?


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## sazzle (Jun 3, 2008)

I'd try not to handle after feeding Hun... I leave my royal a good few days after eating x


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Thanks Dexter, the pet shop person told me to feed him on Monday. I want be touching until Wednesday 2pm. 

Is it normal for him to move around so much after eating?


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

It's about 80f or 26c. I was told to maintain 70f to 85f.


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## Dexter612 (Apr 2, 2009)

Don't worry about it, he'll settle eventually. Sometimes, still moving around is a sign that they're looking for more food, but as it's just a baby I'm not sure. Depends how big/long it is I guess. What did you feed it, one pinkie?


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

tbase said:


> It's about 80f or 26c. I was told to maintain 70f to 85f.


whats your stat set at and hot and cold end temps


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Dexter he's about 15 inches and I feed him one pinky.

Cooljules, he's currently in the cool hide. I only took the external temp as I'm not sure how he will react if I put my hand in the cage. (I use a thermometer and don't have a temp adjustable heat mat). I was told I don't need a temp adjuster and was told to wait untill I get a bigger cage when he grows.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Cool site Sazzle


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

tbase said:


> Dexter he's about 15 inches and I feed him one pinky.
> 
> Cooljules, he's currently in the cool hide. I only took the external temp as I'm not sure how he will react if I put my hand in the cage. (I use a thermometer and don't have a temp adjustable heat mat). I was told I don't need a temp adjuster and was told to wait untill I get a bigger cage when he grows.


but a thermostat tomorrow!

do you have a digital temp gauge or a dial?


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## boromale2008 (Feb 6, 2008)

yeh its recommended to use a thermostat on your heat mat to regulate the temperatures. also roughly by sound of his size i think he might be able to take a fuzzie.


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## rantasam (Nov 28, 2006)

tbase said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I'm new to this forum and I'm also a first time snake owner.
> I bought a Californian King on Saturday (2 days ago) after tones of research.
> ...


I have read that you haven't got a thermostat. Many shop keepers will tell potential customers that they do not need a thermostat. They say this because they are scared that adding £30 to the cost of a setup will put people of buying a snake completely and they will lose the business. There is no more straightforward way of saying this - they are wrong! Not having a thermostat means that you are not in proper control of the environment you are keeping your snake in. It is negligent. You are unable to reduce the temperatures in the warmer months, when room temperature can increase by several degrees. You are not able to increase temperatures in a controlled manner if your snake develops respitatory infection. There are many examples of heat mats producing dangerously high levels of heat, see the thread below.
*
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/snakes/174166-do-i-really-need-thermostat.html

*


















Cheap and functional on/off thermostats will do the job fine and can be picked up cheaply.. such as:

Triple 8 Reptiles - Microclimate On/Off Thermostat MINI STAT 100

... for £17.50

As a final note, you should feed mice that are roughly the same size as the girth of your snake, or slightly larger and feed every 5 - 7 days.

Hope that has been of some help.


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## sazzle (Jun 3, 2008)

yup stats get extremely hot... if you look in the knowledge part on the site in my sig there is some info on the stats... i'd recommend microclimate as it fails OFF rather than ON so you end up with a cold rep rather than a fried one x


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## reptile_care (Mar 28, 2009)

Sazzle, can I ask where you got the information on the habistat mat stats failing in the on position? 

I currently have two habistat heat mats on habistat mat stats, because I was advised by many people they where the best and most reliable brand.

I am just curious because if there are better options, I would like to learn about them so I can make better decisions about the equipment I buy for my snakes in the future.


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## boromale2008 (Feb 6, 2008)

being active 8 hours after a feed could also mean the prey is not big enough and that your snake is still hungry thats why i suggested it may take a fuzzie.


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## rantasam (Nov 28, 2006)

For a long time I heard that micoclimate always fail off too, and then someone on here posted that theirs failed on! I'd try and find the thread, but it was yonks ago.

I'd be interested to hear from the two manufacturers about it.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

cooljules said:


> but a thermostat tomorrow!
> 
> do you have a digital temp gauge or a dial?


You all are great thx:jump:....

I have a dial at the moment. My heat mat is one of those which you plug in and it warms up.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

thanks Rantasam, that's really got me worried. 
I am about to order a microclimate. I currently use a Habistat heat mat and I was wondering will the microclimate work with that or do I need to buy a different heat mat?


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## grazzzz (Feb 2, 2009)

welcome to the forum


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## cooljules (May 20, 2008)

tbase said:


> You all are great thx:jump:....
> 
> I have a dial at the moment. My heat mat is one of those which you plug in and it warms up.


dials are way out..a digi gauge can be bought for 6 quid, even cheaper i hear on ebay

i cant offer you advice on heat mats, i dont have enough experience but do need a stat...as your talking about a device (the mat) giving out constant heat, that will radiate through other materials...and i have seen, melt plastic, burn wood and cook reptiles....not nice.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

I really want to play with him... but it's only been 32 hours. I wish he would stop tempting me so much.




























:flrt:


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

I have more info, my mat is a 12watt mat.


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## boromale2008 (Feb 6, 2008)

yeh a micro climate mat stat will work with a habistat heat mat mate.


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## Keitarock (Apr 10, 2009)

lovely snake you got there bud

Im looking into either a striped king, or a desert king, gonna pop into the pet shop on Friday and see if they have any. I also wasnt told about the stat when I bought my corn.. it wouldnt have put me off the sale, but I would have appreciated it rather than me then ordering one online when I could have picked one up then and there


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Thx boromale for that info. 

Good news all, I have found a microclimate ministat 100 on ebay for £23.49 inc. P&P with cables and heat sensor. I should have myself a even happier King soon.

Keitarock my Californian king is a definite charmer, hence I named him that.
He's been great, not fussy with his food at all. 
I am going to bath him in very shallow luke warm water today. (After hearing how dirty they can be)

What gives me the heartach is when senarios arise where your little fella's health is not in you hands but his own. This little man eats, poops and runs around like these no tomorrow. lol..


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Hello everyone, I just had an idea and would love your input on this.

Just so I understand my King Cali better, I want to see how he reacts to being outdoors.

My garden is very small with pavement and grass (very basic - can't afford anything more at the moment lol..)

Anyway I was going to go around the sides of my garden to find any potential holes and block it and keeping a hide in the centre of the garden with nothing else around.

He will be under constant watch.

This will only be for about 10 - 30 min as he may not react well to outdoor temp.

The purpose of this is to see if he is jumpy when he is in an open environment and see how fast he moves if in case I need to catch him in an unforeseen incident.


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## boromale2008 (Feb 6, 2008)

i used to let my adult corn have a wander around the garden when it was sunny and he quite liked it but he was easier to catch cause he was adult.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Cool... is there a way to train them to recognise things e.g safe zone or boundaries. Maybe a smell they don't like.

My dog will annoyingly roll in other dogs faeces sometimes, but there have been times where he has been scared to walk past another dog's faeces; almost like he knows it's from a big dog.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Hi all, 

I have some strange news. My Californian King seems to have grown an inch or more over three days (last feeding). Is it even possible? He now seems to extend slightly beyond the length of his vivarium. 

Boromale mention I might be able to feed him a fuzzie. I still have few pinkies left so I was wondering can I feed him two pinkies for his next meal. 

One other thing is I read that power feeding can shorten their lifespan, therefore would this be power feeding.


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

Sorry, I forgot to ask. Is it time for me to change my vivarium as well. 

It's plastic and dimensions are: 460mm x 300mm x 170mm or 18" x 12" x 6 1/2".

The base is actually 16" in length the top is 18".

Thanks again


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## erewegoagain (Mar 25, 2009)

It sounds to me as if you are doing well with your first snake, so don't get too anxious, as long as the temps are right he will thrive. I've kept a lot of king snakes over the years and they are very active robust snakes that always feed extremely well, and I wouldnt worry about overfeeding a hatchling as they just convert it all to growth I also wouldnt worry about keeping him in a small enclosure: hatchlings tend to do better with this. In my experience they always rattle their tails like mad at first when being handled until they start growing. The fact that he stops occasionally is a good thing as it shows he is settling in to being handled. One thing I wouldnt do is to let him out in the garden, believe me, it'll only take a second for you to lose him. And if he does get out in the house, check your drawers with socks in: i quite often used to find that hatchlings had somehow got out of what i thought were escape proof boxes only to find them looking back at me when i went to get a pair of socks!


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## erewegoagain (Mar 25, 2009)

IN fact keep him in the 18 by 12" box until hes about 2ft long


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## erewegoagain (Mar 25, 2009)

...again another afterthought, in my experience, kingsnakes dont usually bite deliberately but can sometimes mistake fingers for mice once they know theres food around and bite only to realise its connected to something much bigger and let go...luckily it doesnt hurt!


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## tbase (Apr 11, 2009)

That very reassuring, thank you so much. I was feeling a little uncomfortable at times. 

I found out today that he was born between the 1st and 2nd of August 2008 (8 months old). I was under the impression that he was only a few months old. I guess that's why he's about 16 or 17 inches long.

He's a very good climber now. Like you said I do think he's used to the environment. e.g today he lying against the exposed side of the cage stretched out and not moving so I was worried. Normally when I put my palms against the side he crawls back to his hide, but today he did not flinch so tapped the side gently and he still did not move. I then put my hand in to see if he was aright and guess what.... he did the s shape posture and the tail shaker. 

I was scared but at the same time happy that he was fine. (I did handle him later)

I also think he might be getting ready to shed because he burrows himself against the exposed side of the cage and rubs himself against the bottom and the side of the cage.

Would that be him preparing to shed?


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## rantasam (Nov 28, 2006)

The best signs are a dull coloured skin and cloudy blue eyes.


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