# DWA list question



## Rybe (Jul 15, 2008)

I have heard a rumor a couple of times that large snakes (Burmese pythons, reticulated pythons etc...) are going on dwa. 
didn't bother me till i got a burm. so now id like to know if there is a website that has all the animals pending to go on these lists?


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## stacy (May 9, 2009)

try asking defra or looking on their website, , i recieved a email the other day from international zoo vets and their was no mention about large snakes being put on dwa or planning to


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

No, they aren't.


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## Rybe (Jul 15, 2008)

ian14 said:


> No, they aren't.


 Like i said its a rumor i hear from time to time, i just want to see some official info saying one thing or the other.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

The review in 2007 was the first review of the schedule of species for a long time. If you go onto the DEFRA site, you will find a link to the review report, http://randd.defra.gov.uk/Document.aspx?Document=WP01013_3997_FRP.pdf which makes it very clear that although consideration was given to including certain boids, the decision was taken not to. 
The current review relates purely to the administration of the Act and granting of licences, not the list of species which are restricted.


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## exoticpetshop (Oct 26, 2009)

this is handy i will have a look on there


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## stuartdouglas (Mar 5, 2008)

stacy said:


> try asking defra or looking on their website, , i recieved a email the other day from international zoo vets and their was no mention about large snakes being put on dwa or planning to


Why would a vet, zoo or otherwise, have any vested interest or "inside" knowledge of the workings of the DWA Act?

The last review was in 2007, there are no planned reviews of the act with regard to species to be taken off or included.


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

*Large Constricters*



Rybe said:


> I have heard a rumor a couple of times that large snakes (Burmese pythons, reticulated pythons etc...) are going on dwa.
> didn't bother me till i got a burm. so now id like to know if there is a website that has all the animals pending to go on these lists?


 
Here's my opinion on large constricters...

Large Constricters such as Burmese Pythons, Reticulated Pythons and African Rock Pythons SHOULD be classified as DWA. Why?

Well here's why.

There have been many fatalities with people getting "Hugged" a little too tightly by these animals. And because of their stregnth and jaw pressure, they can inflict serious injury. These animals are MORE then capable of breaking free of a cage....And should only belong to specialist keepers or Zoos (DWA Lisence holders and Zoo Exibits)

In Florida, Roughly 3 months ago - A 2 year old child was killed by a large constricter....Not very nice. You don't generally have a problem untill the animal is large enough to see you as food..Or something it can quite easily overpower (Around the 10 foot mark)

Thats my opinion.....Sorry to sound a dick....But ALL Large Constricters should be classified as DWA as along with Venomous animals and Crocodillians.


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## xxstaggyxx (Oct 22, 2008)

This one should be fun to see how this thread turns out


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

ViperLover said:


> Here's my opinion on large constricters...
> 
> Large Constricters such as Burmese Pythons, Reticulated Pythons and African Rock Pythons SHOULD be classified as DWA. Why?
> 
> ...


And where would you house the thousands of giants which cannot be legalley kept because the owners simply cannot afford to get the licence??
Giants were considered for inclusion in the 2007 review, and turned down, The reason is that inclusion on Schedule 1 is very specific - to protect the public. It is not to do with protecting the owner, but to ensure they are kept in a way that minimises any threat/risk/danger to members of the public ie they can't escape. Hence the need, in the case of DWA snakes, that the room is also made secure, so that if they did escape from the viv, they cannot get any further.
How likely is it in the UK that a 15 foot python could sneak up unseen if it escaped?
For this reason, it was decided that their inclusion was unwarranted.


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

ian14 said:


> And where would you house the thousands of giants which cannot be legalley kept because the owners simply cannot afford to get the licence??
> Giants were considered for inclusion in the 2007 review, and turned down, The reason is that inclusion on Schedule 1 is very specific - to protect the public. It is not to do with protecting the owner, but to ensure they are kept in a way that minimises any threat/risk/danger to members of the public ie they can't escape. Hence the need, in the case of DWA snakes, that the room is also made secure, so that if they did escape from the viv, they cannot get any further.
> How likely is it in the UK that a 15 foot python could sneak up unseen if it escaped?
> For this reason, it was decided that their inclusion was unwarranted.


 
It is possible. These animals are very dangerous and deserve more then a pat on the back to keepers keeping them.

They are specialist animals....As along with Venomous snakes and can be a danger.

This needs to be re-viewed instead of waiting for an accident to happen before taking action.


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## kelboy (Feb 10, 2009)

ViperLover said:


> It is possible. These animals are very dangerous and deserve more then a pat on the back to keepers keeping them.
> 
> They are specialist animals....As along with Venomous snakes and can be a danger.
> 
> This needs to be re-viewed instead of waiting for an accident to happen before taking action.


It has been reviewed. They weren't added. Find how many incidents there have been of people in the UK being injured and post them here. It'll be interesting to see what you can come back with.


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## ian14 (Jan 2, 2008)

ViperLover said:


> It is possible. These animals are very dangerous and deserve more then a pat on the back to keepers keeping them.
> 
> They are specialist animals....As along with Venomous snakes and can be a danger.
> 
> This needs to be re-viewed instead of waiting for an accident to happen before taking action.


Sorry, it is not possible to house them all - they would all be destroyed. Licenced keepers would not take them, zoos would have no space and you can hardly hide a fully grown conda or burm!

There have also, to my knowledge, been no deaths in the UK caused by these animals.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

VIPERLOVER
By your own admission on a previous thread you admit you dont own any reptiles let alone snakes and that you are 16 with no experience. I agree you have a right to freedom of speech and i defend your rights, but also you must think about this. your opinion has no relevence due to the fact you have never owened or experience of these animals that you want to ban. If you were a respected keeper with years of experience you may have more of a point, but there are many people on this and other forums including myself that have kept large Boids and non have ever declared there support for placing these animals on the DWA schedual.

There are many hobbies that are far more dangerouse than keeping herps for instance iuntill about a year ago raced dragsters people get seriose injuries and sometimes may die like many other motor sports but that is a legal pursuit with noone calling to ban it.
if we were to ban everything that has the slightest possibility people could get hurt or killed it would be a sad world

May i suggest that if you are as you say intereted in keeping herps keep your opinions to yourself untill you can qualify and back up your statements with hard facts gained through experience.
P.S. are you Stacy by any chance.


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## ViperLover (Jun 7, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> VIPERLOVER
> By your own admission on a previous thread you admit you dont own any reptiles let alone snakes and that you are 16 with no experience. I agree you have a right to freedom of speech and i defend your rights, but also you must think about this. your opinion has no relevence due to the fact you have never owened or experience of these animals that you want to ban. If you were a respected keeper with years of experience you may have more of a point, but there are many people on this and other forums including myself that have kept large Boids and non have ever declared there support for placing these animals on the DWA schedual.
> 
> There are many hobbies that are far more dangerouse than keeping herps for instance iuntill about a year ago raced dragsters people get seriose injuries and sometimes may die like many other motor sports but that is a legal pursuit with noone calling to ban it.
> ...


 
Who the hell is Stacey?

I just feel that these animals should be more respected and only kept by experienced keepers.

Beecause in most cases....a "Newbie" keeper will often "get rid" of these animals when they get too large to handle.


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## Genseric (Oct 7, 2007)

You do understand where people are coming from however, right?

I wouldn't tell a F1 driver how to race, or a champion jockey how to ride... not unless I had been a F1 driver or jockey myself.

Your enthusiasm is great, but you are narrowing your mind already... at least get your hands dirty and have something concrete to reflect upon, and so pass experience on.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

ViperLover said:


> Who the hell is Stacey?
> 
> I just feel that these animals should be more respected and only kept by experienced keepers.
> 
> Beecause in most cases....a "Newbie" keeper will often "get rid" of these animals when they get too large to handle.


I think you will find that most people who keep large pythons etc *ARE* experienced keepers.
I ran a reptile rescue some years ago when there were only a couple in the country and yes we did take in a few boids from "inexperienced " keepers usually cos they were getting to big rather than aggressive, although there were a couple i fondly remember. but not that many, and they were usually purchased as fairly large specimens on a whim or given wrong advice on how big they get buy the shop they got it from.
but to be fair if you buy a hatchling by the time its 10 foot they have owned it for aprox 3 years they then have 3 years experience with burmese pythons. And considering you were looking to get Venomous in 2 years time and you dont own a snake yet then i think you blow your own argument to pieces abit there.

now going off the subject a little in another post you ask Mark about Hognose snakes well why not try this website for starters www.thehognosesnake.co.uk all the info you need to keep this animal will be on here. The Internet is a wonderfull tool and i wish it was around when i was your age. also this forum has a whole wealth of people who will be only to glad to help you, just keep your opinions quite for now ask questions by all means but remember 90% or more people on this forum have more working knowledge than you and will soon loose patience with people spouting unqualifiable opinions.
i wish you the best with finding a suitable first snake and hope you continue within the hobby


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## Rybe (Jul 15, 2008)

leecb0 said:


> VIPERLOVER
> By your own admission on a previous thread you admit you dont own any reptiles let alone snakes and that you are 16 with no experience. I agree you have a right to freedom of speech and i defend your rights, but also you must think about this. your opinion has no relevence due to the fact you have never owened or experience of these animals that you want to ban. If you were a respected keeper with years of experience you may have more of a point, but there are many people on this and other forums including myself that have kept large Boids and non have ever declared there support for placing these animals on the DWA schedual.
> 
> There are many hobbies that are far more dangerouse than keeping herps for instance iuntill about a year ago raced dragsters people get seriose injuries and sometimes may die like many other motor sports but that is a legal pursuit with noone calling to ban it.
> ...


 Round of applause for the most elegant argumentative post! Well done! :notworthy:

Well my question was answered, so I'm with xxstaggyxx, should be interesting to see how this thread stops...


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## Owzy (Jan 19, 2009)

leecb0 said:


> VIPERLOVER
> By your own admission on a previous thread you admit you dont own any reptiles let alone snakes and that you are 16 with no experience. I agree you have a right to freedom of speech and i defend your rights, but also you must think about this. your opinion has no relevence due to the fact you have never owened or experience of these animals that you want to ban. If you were a respected keeper with years of experience you may have more of a point, but there are many people on this and other forums including myself that have kept large Boids and non have ever declared there support for placing these animals on the DWA schedual.
> 
> There are many hobbies that are far more dangerouse than keeping herps for instance iuntill about a year ago raced dragsters people get seriose injuries and sometimes may die like many other motor sports but that is a legal pursuit with noone calling to ban it.
> ...


Firm but fair.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

Large constrictors should not be covered by the DWA act, no one has ever been seriously hurt by a large constrictor in the UK, and they have been around for a long time, for decades people have been keeping them here, there are alot more commonly kept animals that are far more dangerous. In truth theres obviously not that many people that think they should be either, because the list of people and organisations who were consulted about the DWA act changes was vast.

Also the child that was killed in the US a little while ago was by a snake that was being kept illegally anyway I believe, so a licensing system didnt really help them.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

SiUK said:


> Large constrictors should not be covered by the DWA act, no one has ever been seriously hurt by a large constrictor in the UK, and they have been around for a long time, for decades people have been keeping them here, there are alot more commonly kept animals that are far more dangerous. In truth theres obviously not that many people that think they should be either, because the list of people and organisations who were consulted about the DWA act changes was vast.
> 
> Also the child that was killed in the US a little while ago was by a snake that was being kept illegally anyway I believe, so a licensing system didnt really help them.


Enough said i think thats the end of the subject dont you Si, you simply can not argue with the facts.


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## leecb0 (Apr 14, 2009)

Rybe said:


> Round of applause for the most elegant argumentative post! Well done! :notworthy:
> 
> Well my question was answered, so I'm with xxstaggyxx, should be interesting to see how this thread stops...


Thank you, i think.


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## SiUK (Feb 15, 2007)

leecb0 said:


> Enough said i think thats the end of the subject dont you Si, you simply can not argue with the facts.


yeah your right Lee, we could just go around in circles all day


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## Rybe (Jul 15, 2008)

leecb0 said:


> Thank you, i think.


 No sarcasm implied was well handled. A lot more subtle than i ever manage!


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