# help urgent



## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

Right had more deaths yet again today:bash:
Three I have found dead. Water temps were up a little (28 degrees)so have tweeked the heater. Water tests all ok, slightly raised ammonia. Filter ok, air pump ok. Whats going on?
One fish which TwoDogs and Alistu saw had shredded fins which indicated bullying. He's gone now, had to put him out of his misery.
One neon tetra only has half a tail fin. Could it be fin rot? If so what are the signs?
Have no idea what else to do now.


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## njp (Mar 4, 2007)

How high is your ammonia?
Ammonia in tiny amounts is lethal.

What fish do you have in the tank?


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## sami (Oct 23, 2006)

what were the fish that died? How long has the tank been up and running?

Mason


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

A guppy, a neon and a scissortail fish died.
Tank up and running for over a year now.
Have a siamese fighter fish, columbian red fin tetras,
neons, a plec, corydoras catfish, arasborais/scissor-tail.

ammonia was 0.25
the only other thing was a really high pH.


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## fridayman (Jun 19, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> A guppy, a neon and a scissortail fish died.
> Tank up and running for over a year now.
> Have a siamese fighter fish, columbian red fin tetras,
> neons, a plec, corydoras catfish, arasborais/scissor-tail.
> ...


How many of the colombian tetra's do you have in the tank?


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

four of those: victory:


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## fridayman (Jun 19, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> four of those: victory:


The high ph could be killing your fish... but if the fins are shredded in a relatively short space of time i.e. overnight, it is usually bullying. The colombians are the only ones on your list that sound like they could be the culprits. I've read that they can get a bit aggro if kept in smaller quantities. Maybe if you got 4 more it might help, but get the ph sorted first - there is a product called Ph Down that you can use, but don't raise the ph too quickly.


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## njp (Mar 4, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> ammonia was 0.25


What is it now? It is more likely to be ammonia killing them than PH.


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## zirliz (Nov 15, 2006)

njp said:


> How high is your ammonia?
> Ammonia in tiny amounts is lethal.
> 
> What fish do you have in the tank?


Not if the tank has a high Ph I've found with my tropical tank at ph of 7.5 isn't as bad as acidic one of 6 my goldfish inhabitant, Nitrite is the one to watch for in more alkaline waters, what's the ph?


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## zirliz (Nov 15, 2006)

Also stress can play a big factor in the health of fish if fish are stressed I've found even small changes to water can be lethal for them.


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## njp (Mar 4, 2007)

Does the PH of the water affect the toxicity of ammonia?


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## zirliz (Nov 15, 2006)

ways to reduce the toxic ammonia content, make a water change but be sure to add a dechlorinator, decrease feeding amount, add zeolite (never combine with salt additions), reduce fish load, add more filtration area, add a commercially prepared ammonia remover or one that locks or converts it into a less toxic form


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## Esfa (Apr 15, 2007)

The fact that you even have ammonia in your tank shows there is a problem. All ammonia should be being dealt with by your filter. Did you cycle the ank before adding fish?

I suppose the amonia could have been from the dead fish.


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## ern79 (Jul 26, 2007)

zirliz said:


> Not if the tank has a high Ph I've found with my tropical tank at ph of 7.5 isn't as bad as acidic one of 6 my goldfish inhabitant, Nitrite is the one to watch for in more alkaline waters, what's the ph?


incorrect, scientifically, at low pH i.e below 7, ammonia is converted into ammonium and this is not harmful to fish, above that level, the ammonia increases in toxicity. A level of 0.25 ammonia is actually 10 times the level that oata suggest is toxic to fish, the trouble is, people read a colour test card and see that their ammonia is only the second colour on the chart, the think this is "only slightly up" whereas it is at a level that can kill especially newly introduced fish.
Both ammonia and nitrite should be zero at all times in an established tank, if they are not, something is wrong, saying your levels are "o.k" if they are any thing above this is unacceptable.


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## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

hiya did you sort the filter out and reduce feeding like i said sounds to me as you still got problems that maybe the filter is not running right if its clogged up this can kill off the bacteria needed to break down the fish waste ....did you manage to get any new media for it as foams are a year old i think you told me ...have kids been putting in any food whilst your not around


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

Replacement sponges on way hun, have reduced feeding and kids can't get them: victory:
It must be the filter.

*Answers to your q's=*

Yes it was cycled before fish were added but that was ages 
ago.
One of the columbians is quite a bully with his own kind but seen no other evidence of it.
Right here are the latest tests....
_Ammonia is 0.6, pH is 9.0, Nitrite is 0.0 and lastly Nitrate is 5 (our tap water is that also)_


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## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

anna ...get a water change done do at least 30% tonight then do 10% a day for next 7 days ....when was the filter last cleaned ......dont feed for 3 days then go to every other day only feed tiny bit of flake fd nothing else .......if you can go and buy some live bacteria also maybe get some waste controll that will help filter cope with the waste .....your ph is very high maybe get some ph down ( i hate using it ) or some media that will help bring it down ....pm me if you need to lets try and sort this out


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

ok will do hun-thanks btw!x: victory:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

let me see what your levels are....you have a couple of sensitive fish there...any number of things will stress them...it's all chatter until i can see what both the tank and tap water looks like......keep those dirty, filter pads there but just rinse them in the waste water.

P.S...drop the temp to around 76-77f


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

HABU said:


> let me see what your levels are....you have a couple of sensitive fish there...any number of things will stress them...it's all chatter until i can see what both the tank and tap water looks like......keep those dirty, filter pads there but just rinse them in the waste water.
> 
> P.S...drop the temp to around 76-77f


Right here are the latest tests....
_Ammonia is 0.6, pH is 9.0, Nitrite is 0.0 and lastly Nitrate is 5 (our tap water is that also)_

Also why to drop temps?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

is it a planted tank?...that is the only way to go IMO.... many fish need structure and a place to chill out


always completely describe what setup and fish you keep for good help...:no1:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> Right here are the latest tests....
> _Ammonia is 0.6, pH is 9.0, Nitrite is 0.0 and lastly Nitrate is 5 (our tap water is that also)_
> 
> Also why to drop temps?
> ...


 

that is an insanely high Ph!!!


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

yes why is it so high?
why to lower temps?
have pond weed in there, but mr plec ate all plants


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

how big is the tank?...put some distilled water in there to soften the water...that Ph will kill malawi cichlids...any ammonia in that water is deadly.


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> yes why is it so high?
> why to lower temps?
> have pond weed in there, but mr plec ate all plants


 
you have massively buffered water...test the tap water...do you have any calcium-based rock or shells in there that may be buffering the water?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

cooler water holds more O2 than warmer water...it helps with growing the bacteria..


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

its a 4 foot tank by 1 foot

no shells or anything
live in a hard water area


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

HABU said:


> cooler water holds more O2 than warmer water...it helps with growing the bacteria..


ah ok thanks for that
would these results explain why my plec is not active like he was, he spends all his time in his log.


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

Habu, pH of tap water is 8.0


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> ah ok thanks for that
> would these results explain why my plec is not active like he was, he spends all his time in his log.


they are very noctural...get rid of him if you want plants...tetras like a soft water, planted tank...i have beaucoup tetras....


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> Habu, pH of tap water is 8.0


 
that is nearly sea water ph!...very buffered...you can buy a chemical to soften it or do what i do...blend in some distilled water to lower the Ph....they love it....except for the mollies....


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

rift valley cichlids would love your water!!:no1:


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

:lol2:
how come the mollies won't like?


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> :lol2:
> how come the mollies won't like?


 
mollies like hard, salty water....some can be kept as saltwater fish...they don't rebound very well from stress though....they can be fickle despite their rep.


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

ok thanks for that: victory:


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

asm1006 said:


> ok thanks for that: victory:


 
i always like helping people in aquatics.....i can give the straight scoop rather than the dogma....it sounds complex but if you do a few things properly, then the biology takes care of its self...i was keeping fish way back in the late '60's early '70's...i grew up with all of the changes....i take a natural appraoch and stress water chemistry....it's the one thing i am good at.:crazy::blush:


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## treeboa (May 4, 2005)

that ph is higher than a marine tank runs at, one thing that can raise ph is a high co2


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

HABU said:


> i always like helping people in aquatics.....i can give the straight scoop rather than the dogma....it sounds complex but if you do a few things properly, then the biology takes care of its self...i was keeping fish way back in the late '60's early '70's...i grew up with all of the changes....i take a natural appraoch and stress water chemistry....it's the one thing i am good at.:crazy::blush:


well I appreciate it!! Night,night!: victory:xx


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## HABU (Mar 21, 2007)

treeboa said:


> that ph is higher than a marine tank runs at, one thing that can raise ph is a high co2


carbonic acid.....but having tap water from a sedimentary source will do it too....i have rock-hard water here in cincinnati ohio... i just dillute it with distilled.


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## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

hi anna whilst habu mentioned buffering i thought of something ...whats your substrate in the tank is it just silca sand or coral sand


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

Hubby said he cannot remember but he knows its ok for fresh water fish as he asked at the time when he bought it.: victory:


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## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

ok no problem if i remember rightly the sand is white ? i gonna presume that its coral sand if it is this will raise the hardness in your tank maybe worth changing it to something else


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## asm1006 (May 5, 2007)

ok will have a look around to see whats better for them: victory:
we have put 2 additional small filters in there until sponges replaced.


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## mask-of-sanity (Dec 27, 2006)

thats great but remember do not change all the foams at once as you will loose to much bacteria and when you do change them add some bacteria at same time something like cycle by hagen or the one by tetra (cant remember the name )


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