# Great Plains Rat Questions



## wayward_son (Jul 19, 2008)

Just looking for some guidance really. I have a male believed to be great plains rat (Based on markings etc) He was originally sold to a friend of mine as corn as part of a breeding pair. The female has consequently died (egg bound) I am interested in potentially breeding from him. I have been doing some research and recommended breeding weights appear to be 150-200g. Is this correct? Also does the great plains rat need a full hibernation or would burmating suffice? Also I'm thinking of putting him across a normal corn female. Does anybody have any advice/an opinion on this paring?

Would be interested in any advice really. I've been doing some research but getting conflicting information.

Thanks

Pete


----------



## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

Can you post a picture of him?.

If he is Great plains rat snake and you breed him to a Red rat snake that would result in Copper corn's.

Somthing to consider pure albino Great plains rat snake.NOT Amel copper corn-AKA-Creamsicle corn a*HYBRID*.
http://www.crystalpalacereptiles.com/proddetail.php?prod=eAlbinomoryi


----------



## wayward_son (Jul 19, 2008)

These are some I took about a year ago after collecting him. I don't have any more recent ones to hand.

Thanks


----------



## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

Deffo NOT a Great plains Rat snake.It's Copper corn a Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.Best mate for him IMO would be a Creamsicle corn a Amel Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.


----------



## wayward_son (Jul 19, 2008)

gazz said:


> Deffo NOT a Great plains Rat snake.It's Copper corn a Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.Best mate for him IMO would be a Creamsicle corn a Amel Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.


Cheers mate. 
The identification was suggested by my brother. I agreed cos I couldn't come up with anything more plausible, I'm not exactly an expert on corn variants. That should help to point me in the right direction.

Am I right with 150-200g breeding weights?

Thanks again for the help.


----------



## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

wayward_son said:


> Am I right with 150-200g breeding weights?
> 
> Thanks again for the help.


 
SIZE FOR BREEDING

Minimum weight for a female should be approximately 200 grams. Males can be smaller at 150 grams or more. Attempting to breed corns smaller than these sizes may lead to egg-binding and other problems.


----------



## wayward_son (Jul 19, 2008)

Thanks again

Forgot to say earlier I love your sig. Very true.


----------



## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Ideally if you are breeding to a corn or creamsicle, the female should weigh a healthy (not fat) *300 *grams and be in her third year.


----------



## Natrix (Dec 9, 2006)

In the main rootbeers are produced as the first step towards breeding creamsicles (Great plains rat X AMEL CORN snake hybrid). This means that rootbeers are very likely to be het for amel. If you cross fellow with either an amel corn or a creamsicle you will hopefully get some nice creamsicles among the hatchlings. 

As Ssthisto says, If your breeding to another creamsicle make sure she is over 300 grms and over 3 years of age. This is because the rat snake gene causes them to lay very big eggs.

Natrix


----------



## Natrix (Dec 9, 2006)

gazz said:


> Deffo NOT a Great plains Rat snake.It's Copper corn a Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.Best mate for him IMO would be a Creamsicle corn a Amel Red rat X Great plains a HYBRID.


Just for the record, as I understand it, the name Red Rat snake is a localised American name for corn snakes that has never really gained popularity with the rest of America or indeed abroad. With the other English speaking countries.
_Corn snake is the popular or common name currently being used for elaphe guttata guttata (which is still the correct Latin name as the new Pantherophis name has yet to be officially recognised).
__The Great plains rat snake along with a similar animal called a Dwarf Corn (elaphe guttata intermontana) has had a bit of a varied past in nomenclature terms. For a while it was called elaphe guttata emoryi and was considered a localised sub species of the corn snake but a few years back it was reclassified and given full species status becoming elaphe emoryi with the dwarf corn becoming a sub species and renamed elaphe emoryi intermontana.
__Prior to the reclassification of elaphe emoryi, any cross between a Corn and GPR would of been considered a cross between to variants of the corn snake elaphe guttata making them intergrades and not hybrids. Therefore up till the GPR's reclassification it was totally appropriate to call the babies from a GPR X Corn pairing Corns.
__Since the reclassification of GPR's to full species status any babies produced from the result of a pairing between a GPR and a Corn must now be considered a hybrid and can no longer carry the corn status as part of their name. 
__So if we want to be totally accurate when naming these animals_
_ 
__elaphe guttata guttata = Corn snake, 
__elaphe guttata emoryi = Great plains rat snake and 
__elaphe guttata guttata X elaphe guttata emoryi = Root beer (normal) creamsicle (amel).
__elaphe emoryi intermontana = Dwarf great plains rat snake _
_ 
__Personally I dislike using common names as it is very easy for mistakes to be made as many species have more than one common name, many localised variations in pronunciation and an endless list of foreign common names._
_ 
__Hope this helps_
_ 
__Natrix
_


----------



## Ssthisto (Aug 31, 2006)

Which is why I would rather say "Rootbeer Ratsnake" than "Rootbeer Corn" - and "Creamsicle Ratsnake" instead of "Creamsicle Corn".


----------



## gazz (Dec 9, 2006)

Natrix said:


> Just for the record, as I understand it, the name Red Rat snake is a localised American name for corn snakes that has never really gained popularity with the rest of America or indeed abroad. With the other English speaking countries.


 
As far as i'm aware.What came first Red rat snake or Corn snake ?.I beleave it was Red rat snake.Corn snake most likly came from the Farming communitys due to Red rat snake being commonly found in corn fields/corn stores.And due to the belly patterning resembles Indian corn.

At the end of the day they're rat snakes.And still to day there are people that don't consider a Red rat snake as a Rat snake due the the word CORN.


----------

